← Crime Stories with Nancy Grace
Crime Stories with Nancy Grace
BLOODY BODYCAM: JEALOUS DR. FORCES ENGINEER WIFE TO DEADLY CLIFF
00:38:39
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- [00:00]
Nancy Grace
This is an iHeart podcast.
- [00:03]
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- [00:36]
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support for the show comes from Public, the investing platform for those who take it seriously. On Public you can build a multi asset portfolio of stocks, bonds, options, crypto and now generated assets which allow you to turn any idea into an investable index with AI. It all starts with your prompt. From renewable energy companies with high free cash flow to semiconductor suppliers growing revenue over 20% year over year, you can literally type any prompt and put the AI to work. It screens thousands of stocks, builds a one of a kind index and lets you back test it against the S&P 500. Then you can invest in a few clicks. Generated assets are like ETFs with infinite possibilities, completely customizable and based on your thesis, not someone else's. Go to public.com podcast and earn an uncapped 1% bonus when you transfer your portfolio. That's public.com podcast paid for by Public Investing Brokerage Services by Open to the Public Investing Inc. Member FINRA and SIPC Advisory Services by Public Advisors llc. SEC Registered Advisor Generated Assets is an interactive analysis tool. Output is for informational purposes only and is not an investment recommendation or advice. Complete disclosures available at public.com disclosure
- [01:38]
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- [02:38]
Nancy Grace
Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Shock, bloody body cam emerges after a jealous anesthesiologist, a medical doctor, forces his nuclear engineer wife to a deadly cliff. When you see this body cam, you're gonna do a backflip. I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. I want to thank you for being with us.
- [03:09]
911 Dispatcher/Caller
We heard her screaming, help. Help. Help me. Help me. She was covered in blood and she was crawling. She's covered in blood. She's near us, though. Does he have a weapon? Did he have a weapon? He didn't have a weapon. Okay. Okay. Hi. Someone's currently being attacked on the top of Polykuka where there's a man trying to kill her. She has blood all over her face. Where is his dad? Polypooka, the hike at the lookout. Okay, so Polly, look out. She's on the Polypooka hike and he's. He's currently attacking her. Okay, where, where, how far is the hike? Or is it in the entrance where we're probably like five minutes into the hike, really quick.
- [03:54]
Nancy Grace
It's in fact the hikers that call 911. They see the anesthesiologist, jealous husband, they look in his eyes and they're so afraid that he might try to kill them that they take off to call 911. They run away from him. Take a look at this photo. Straight out to veteran trial lawyer Eric Faddis, founder of law offices of Eric Faddis, former felony prosecutor. You think there's any coming back from that? Let me see that photo again, please.
- [04:29]
Eric Faddis
Now that when you look at it, your stomach kind of turns, right? That's a grotesque sight. You have this bright red blood coming off of her face. Certainly the jury is going to have a visceral reaction when they see that. It just shows how harrowing and physical and violent this altercation was. I think defense is going to try to argue that this was self defense, but that's a bit of a tall order when you look at that photo.
- [04:55]
Nancy Grace
Okay, Fadis, correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't you the veteran defense attorney and that's what you're going to say? Yeah, that's really bad. That is not helping the client.
- [05:07]
Eric Faddis
Well, yeah, that wouldn't be my argument. It would be something along the lines of, you know, hey, there was this acrimonious relationship. And things had been escalating. There was a scuffle that ensued, as defenses characterized it. Ariel started that she was the initial aggressor. This thing got a bit out of hand, but the client was protecting himself because he. He's going to claim that he was struck with a rock. And so that's essentially how the defense is going to style it. You know, it'll be up to the jury whether they accept that version or Ariel's version.
- [05:38]
Nancy Grace
Let me see. Faddis, I'm going to ask you a question that many people may think is rhetorical, but, I mean, how do you live with yourself?
- [05:48]
Eric Faddis
It depends on the day. But. But keep in mind that that wouldn't be necessarily the argument I would make in this case, but they kind of have to own the facts that they can't deny. Clearly, this person, Ariel, has been bludgeoned. And so what sort of legal avenues do you explore on the defense side? It seems like the horse they're going to ride is self defense. And although this has been certainly a lot of trauma introduced into this trial, it's not over yet. And defense still has their case to put on.
- [06:17]
Nancy Grace
Well, Eric Faddis, this is usually the moment that any good defense attorney goes, the Constitution demands that I give my client a full and fair defense. Something along those lines, and the Constitution, blah, blah, blah, blah. Or what about this? Dr. Kendall Crowns is joining us. You know him well, the chief medical examiner of Tarrant County. That's Fort Worth. He is a star of a hit podcast, Mayhem in the Morgue, and he is an esteemed lecturer at the Bernie Burnett School of Medicine at TCU. Dr. Kendall Crowns, I guarantee you this is where they're going. They're going to claim that. Have you ever had a nosebleed or been hit in the face, maybe by a soccer ball or baseball? The veins in the face, the nose, the mouth, the eyes surrounding the eyes are very sensitive, and you're heavily veined in those areas. So you bleed more profusely from your face than you would from, say, for instance, your arm or your leg somehow trying to explain away all that blood. Can't you just see them arguing that?
- [07:33]
Dr. Kendall Crowns
Yes, they can. I mean, the facial skin, the scalp skin, is very vasculature, a lot of arteries, a lot of veins. And when you're looking at those pictures, you can see deep lacerations right at the edge of the scalp and one kind of more. More in this, in the hair itself. So there's going to be a tremendous amount of bleeding associated with that. Which you're seeing in these pictures kind of streaming down her face. And of course, people are going to say, oh, well, you know, those, those injuries aren't all that significant. It's just that's how you bleed when you get hit there. But the problem is, is that is a significant amount of blood on her face, and those are very deep injuries created by a rock that also cause lacerating injuries. So it's kind of has a sharp edge and potentially she could have had skull fractures if he had continued to pound on her.
- [08:21]
Nancy Grace
Dr. Kendall crowns. I've had many occasions in front of a jury to. And you know from having testified so many, many times that typically autopsy photos are not allowed in front of a jury due to their inflammatory nature. But there are ways a skilled prosecutor can get them in. For instance, if the photo before autopsy does not reveal the true extent of the injury, for instance, you see a cut, you see blood, but you don't know, are there bruises, subdural, under the skin, is there a fracture? Did this cause brain swelling? Was it that bad? And that point, once you convince a judge that a simple photo of the injury outside the body does not sufficiently show the scope of the internal injuries, the jury can then see for probative value, of course, autopsy photos where the skin is cut and actually they're scalped. The victim is scalped at autopsy and the hair and the scalp is pulled back and you actually see the subdural or underlying bruising. Isn't that true?
- [09:53]
Dr. Kendall Crowns
Yes, that is accurate. Often photographs in the courtroom situations are deemed inflammatory, so we can't use them unless they are cleaned up. Photographs that just show the wound on the external surface of the body, even the example you're using of the facial skin being peeled forward, showing the underlying subgallial hemorrhages, are often deemed too inflammatory because it's said that it's upsetting for the jury to see the skull in that nature. So really, what we usually are able to use is very clean, sanitized photographs of the wounds themselves. Although occasionally a judge will allow more internal photographs to be shown or more of the injury photographs to be shown because they feel that the nature of the crime merits the showing of these pictures.
- [10:42]
Nancy Grace
In this case, Dr. Kendall crowns. She barely escaped with her life. So in this case, since just the photos that we're showing will not sufficiently show her internal injuries, any fracture to the skull, any swelling of the brain, any subdural bruising under the skin, how do you then, since we're obviously not going to pull her scalp Back like you would in an autopsy. Autopsy. How do you prove this? How do you prove what happened? Dr. Kendall, crowns.
- [11:18]
Dr. Kendall Crowns
How do you prove it when you don't. You can't show the pictures or you don't have an actual autopsy is you have to go through what was seen. She has those deep lacerations. You can describe those. And then you can also talk about the potential for being beaten with the rock, creating fractures of the skull and even internal injuries like subarachnoid hemorrhage of the brain. It is kind of in this situation, you have to just discuss what you have, but you can talk about the severity of the injuries by giving a description.
- [11:49]
Nancy Grace
Hold on.
- [11:49]
Dr. Kendall Crowns
Don't need.
- [11:50]
Nancy Grace
What about the possibility of an mri? Mri or an X ray? I mean, I'm just a lawyer, but if I wanted to show a skull fracture, I would get an X ray. And I don't know what, in addition, an MRI could prove in this situation. But wouldn't that help?
- [12:07]
Dr. Kendall Crowns
It would. X rays, CT scans, MRIs, all those findings can actually be just as good as an autopsy because they can show you skull fractures, hemorrhages of the brain, all this information that even is not even actually all that inflammatory to a jury because you're just looking at an X ray or a CT or an mri, and it's less jarring than the actual photograph. So those medical records can be extremely helpful when you're testifying, especially when there's no autopsy performed.
- [12:37]
Nancy Grace
Okay, this is what happened. This is what always happens at trial with me, when I have a medical examiner on the stand. You may not realize it, but everything you say is fascinating to us laypeople. And I would go down the garden path on how do you prove a certain injury? But I want to get off of that and go to the facts. Alexis, Theres chuk. This body cam is damning. I mean, to me, it's open and shut. What is? And I can't believe this guy's an anesthesiologist and he gave a confession to his son and written hid in the woods. Just take it from the top. Alexis Toreschuk. What do we know happened to the victim?
- [13:26]
Alexis Toreschuk
So they were on a hike. It was actually her birthday. They were on Oahu. They're going up a very steep hike. Very narrow, very steep. She didn't want to go up anym. She says, no, it's too steep. I don't want to go. He goes up by himself. He comes back, he says to her, let's take a selfie. He kind of positions her towards the cliff. She's very, very nervous about taking a picture with him. She's very nervous about being on the edge of the cliff. She's something. She can tell that something's up. And then he attacks her. He grabs her. She says he tries. He pulls out a syringe. He's got a backpack with him. Pulls out a syringe with a substance in it, tries to stab her with it. She is fighting back as much as she can. She's rolling on the ground. She's hitting him. She actually says that she grabbed him in the testicles to try to stop him from doing this somehow. She knocks a syringe out of his hand. He's holding her down with his right arm. He's reaching in his backpack with his left hand, trying to get something else out. She continues fighting. He then picks up a rock and smashes her in the head with the rock. And her head starts profusely bleeding. He's hitting her and she is screaming and help me, Help me. Help me. Somebody help me.
- [14:33]
911 Dispatcher/Caller
Hi. Someone's currently being attacked on the top of Polycuka where there's a man trying to kill her. She has blood all over her face. Where is his dad? Polly Puka, the hike at the poly lookout. Okay, so Polly, look out. She's on the Polypooka hike and he's. He's currently attacking her. Okay, where, where, how far is the hike are in the entrance where we're probably like five minutes into the hike. Really quickish. Okay, what are you seeing? We heard her screaming, help, help, help me, help me. And then we saw a man over her. And then she crawled out with over her face, saying that he tried to kill her. Did she know him?
- [15:18]
Nancy Grace
I don't know.
- [15:19]
911 Dispatcher/Caller
Okay, where is he at? What is he wearing? He was in a T shirt, white. He had brownish sort of curly hair. Asian, Caucasian, Hawaiian, White guy?
- [15:33]
Dave Mack
Yeah.
- [15:33]
911 Dispatcher/Caller
Okay, and then what kind of shirt? T shirt maybe. I'm sorry, shorts. Pardon?
- [15:41]
Nancy Grace
What kind of shorts?
- [15:43]
911 Dispatcher/Caller
I didn't see. She's wearing shorts though.
- [15:46]
Nancy Grace
As far as I'm concerned, there's no coming back for the defense. Once the jury sees the bloody photo from the body cam and seeing her trying to. She. She could barely walk. In the video to Dan Murphy, former NYPD detective sergeant has conducted literally hundreds of interrogations. He is a star co host of Gold Shields podcast and the author of workplace safety. Dan Murphy. Thanks for being with us. He keeps saying self defense, self defense, self defense. But I guarantee you if they do a DNA analysis on that Rock. It's only going to be her blood, not his.
- [16:30]
Dan Murphy
I can't see any situation where she posed a threat to him. It just doesn't make any sense. All the facts of this case are so heavily in favor of her statement and the statement of the son who he confessed to. This is not a career criminal. This is a guy who in a moment of emotion or a, in many moments of emotion, very well, premeditated acts, prepared himself to kill her that day. In this hike, she is alive and alert on the body cam, giving statements after the fact, which is something you don't always get with somebody who's injured as badly as she is. She's saying, it was my husband, he tried to kill me. He's out there, he's on the run. Now, if you were innocent, where are you going? Everything about this situation to me marks him as one of the more guilty people you'll ever see in the history of criminal justice. This is, like you said, open and shut. This is a no brainer for cops. The investigation is closed. That's it. One perpetrator, he's on the scene. Done.
- [17:30]
Dave Mack
Honolulu prosecutors claim Gerhardt Koenig carefully plans to kill wife Ariel due to resentment over alleged infidelity. The state says Koenig spends time on infidelity forums, looks into his wife's financial situation and researches the cost of divorce before planning the hike in a closed area where he would send Ariel over the edge, bringing along sedation, drugs as a backup plan. When Koenig's caught in the act of attempted murder, prosecutors say Koenig tries to evade authorities and confesses on a call with his adult son, contemplating which is worse, prison or suicide.
- [18:05]
Nancy Grace
Alexis Toreschuk, joining us, Crime Stories investigative reporter Alexis, this is for Dr. Bethany. Could you describe for Bethany verbatim what the doctor, Dr. Koenig wrote to his wife on the birthday card that morning?
- [18:24]
Alexis Toreschuk
He wrote, happy birthday, angel face. There isn't an obstacle in this world too hard for me to fight through for you.
- [18:32]
Nancy Grace
Okay, Dr. Bethany Marshall, you're the renowned psychoanalyst joining us out of Beverly Hills, author of Deal Breaker. You can see her now on Bravo and Peacock and find her@Dr.bethany marshall.com. okay, hit me, Bethany. I guess you see the dichotomy in angel face and then bashing in her face with a rock.
- [18:58]
Dr. Bethany Marshall
Yes, I do, Nancy. You know what I'm seeing in this is that he's buttering her up before taking her on this potentially murderous hike. Also that he's feeling a sense of relief because he Knows he's going to get rid of her. Similar to what we see with domestic homicide, that often the perpetrator goes. Goes out drinking, hangs out with friends. They just. They're just going about their life so happy because they got rid of the loved one. But I think what's most important is what came before this card. This card for her birthday where he is luring her onto this trail so that he can try to murder her. He finds out that she's texting with another guy and he just assumes she's having an affair. No evidence. I've seen in court all the texts. There's no evidence. There's no sexting. There is nothing. It is a friendship. What does he do? He doesn't confront her. He confronts. He's. He talks to her best friends, another couple, her family members. He tries to degrade and expose her to everyone. Then he gets them to go to marital counseling, buy a book about infidelity where she's told to give up all of her passwords to him. So now he's infiltrating her social media. He's cutting her off from family and friends. Then he insists that he's going to have to have sex with her twice a week. So to me, that is, he's dominating her through sex.
- [20:27]
Nancy Grace
Okay, White Bethany, so they had a contract. She had to have sex with him twice a week, even if he's odious.
- [20:42]
Dr. Bethany Marshall
This is what came out in testimony, Nancy, which I found.
- [20:45]
Nancy Grace
Oh, dear Lord in heaven. Okay, I'm sorry.
- [20:48]
Dr. Bethany Marshall
Keep going that to me. That's what we call in my field, triumphing over the love object. In other words, using sex, penetration, overpowering the other person to show them who's in charge. He's dominating her sexually because he believes. Believes she's having an affair. And you know what, Nancy? The defense attorney dominates her in court as well. He humiliates her by making her read all of the text. Between her and this other guy, there is not one iota of anything sexual. It's all pretty benign. But I see her on this, on the witness stand, like she's the girl with a scarlet letter. Like he's the one who tried to bash in her face with the rock. And you know what, Nancy? When testimony came out that it was only her DNA on the rock, do you know what Gerhardt did in court? He smirked. He thought it was funny. I hope the jury saw that.
- [21:43]
Nancy Grace
Let me understand something, Alexis Tereschuk. Isn't it true that Ariel, the victim in this case, the one with the blood streaming down her face. She was cross examined extensively on whether she had an affair. What happened?
- [22:02]
Alexis Toreschuk
She did not have a physical affair. She never had sex with this guy. She never even sent him any naked photos. There was never anything like that. He was a co worker that she was texting. You could perhaps describe it as an emotional affair, but she was talking with a guy she worked remotely, he worked remotely. They were chatting, they were texting, but it was nothing inappropriate in terms of going. There were no pictures. There was nothing like let's meet up in a hotel or, or having a, you know, workplace affair at their office. It was all on text and just she sang. It was an emotional affair because it was friendly because he knew about my life. But it wasn't anything sexual.
- [22:48]
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- [23:18]
Public Investing Sponsor
Support for the show comes from Public, the investing platform for those who take it seriously. On Public you can build a multi asset portfolio of stocks, bonds, options, crypto and now generated assets which allow you to turn any idea into an investable index with AI. It all starts with your prompt. From renewable energy companies with high free cash flow to semiconductor suppliers growing revenue over 20% year over year, you can literally type any prompt and put the AI to work. It screens thousands of stocks, builds a one of a kind index and lets you back test it against the S&P 500. Then you can invest in a few clicks. Generated assets are like ETFs with infinite possibilities, completely customizable and based on your thesis, not someone else's. Go to public.com podcast and earn an uncapped 1% bonus when you transfer your portfolio. That's public.com podcast paid for by Public Investing Brokerage Services by Open to the Public Investing Inc. Member FINRA and SIPC Advisory Services by Public Advisors llc. SEC Registered Advisor. Generated Assets is an interactive analysis tool. Output is for informational purposes only and is not an investment recommendation or advice. Complete Disclosures available at public.comdisclosures kids, pets, life.
- [24:20]
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- [24:49]
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- [25:50]
Nancy Grace
Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. So on the stand, she is grilled. You heard Dr. Bethany Marshall refer to the Scarlet Letter. She's referring of course to the classic literature, the book the Scarlet Letter by Nathaniel Hawthorne, as I recall, where in that case, in that story the victim gave birth to a child out of wedlock and she was ostracized and mistreated and shunned much worse. And it turned out the revered pastor that everyone loved and looked up to was the biological father. What a turn of events. It's playing out in a courtroom all over again. Does nobody read their English literature?
- [26:44]
Dr. Bethany Marshall
Bethany it's playing out in a courtroom and what I think is particularly noxious to me, it very much upset me was that he made her read aloud some texts in which she referred with Gearhart to her husband about this emotional affair. And because I deal with abuse victims, what I could see immediately what I read through was probably he was calling it an emotional affair. He forced her to call it an emotional affair, which it was not. And then those text messages were read aloud in court with the defense attorney saying, didn't you say you were having an emotional affair? Of course an abuse victim is going to use whatever language the perpetrator wants her to use. So in some ways, you know, she's been bashed in the face with a rock. Now she's being bashed psychologically by the defense attorney. And she sits there. She's so dignified. She answers every question. She calls the defense attorney, sir. I'm thinking, like, that's so respectful. He. He is just like one more person in the system who's trying to blame the victim. It is so disturbing. I think everybody needs to watch that testimony and sort of see what's really playing out in that courtroom.
- [28:01]
911 Dispatcher/Caller
Hi. Someone's currently being attacked on the top of Polycar where there's a man trying to kill her.
- [28:08]
Eric Faddis
She's.
- [28:08]
911 Dispatcher/Caller
Blood all over her face. Where is this? At Polypooka. The height at the lookout. Okay, so poly on the topic. Look out. She's on the Polypooka hike. And he's. He's currently attacking her. Okay, where, Where. How far is it? Hike? Or is it the entrance where we're probably like five minutes into the hike. Really quick.
- [28:30]
Nancy Grace
The Koenigs had gone to couples counseling, working to put their marriage back together. And after she gets a Love Field birthday card, she believes Ariel. Things were on the upswing. In fact, she just testified. I teared up when I read it. I felt hopeful. This was a turning point for us, and this was going to be a nice trip and the start of the next chapter for us. You know, Dr. Bethany, I'm trying to put the right words to something. I'm trying to verbalize it. It's bad enough when you're in an abusive relationship and you get emotionally and verbally abused and physically abused, which she said she was and was sexually abused by Dr. Gearhart Koenig. But it's, to me, worse when you feel hopeful, when you feel that everything's going to work out and you have that glimmer of hope that you're going to get that happily ever after, that whole Hallmark, happy family image. You know, the Christmas card, the Christmas tree up, the family gathered together around the table, that whole thing. It's worse to me when you have hope and then the worst happens. In this case, physically bashed as opposed to no hope. You're just enduring it. It just. It's. You verbalize it much better than me.
- [30:07]
Dr. Bethany Marshall
The shock that everything turned on a Dime. But what I think you're talking about is ideal of the other person is necessary for staying in love. We think our spouses, our wives, our husbands, we see the best in them. We see the best in our family members. We want them to inhabit our idealized view of them. And so when she received this card, she thought, wow, the Gearhart that I married, that I knew, that I loved, that I was bonded with, he's back. And she was hopeful. And then when it turned on a dime, Nancy. And you know what's interesting? It was only five minutes into the hike, and I think that's fascinating because it. It tells me that he was impulsive, aggressive, and he could hardly wait. If this was more thought out, he would have hiked a full hour. But no, it was five minutes in. That is so arrogant. That he manipulates her with the card instigates hope. I think that summarizes probably the entire relationship.
- [31:08]
Nancy Grace
I'm just wondering. To Dave Mack, crime stories, investigative reporter. The Hawaii anesthesiologist who in my mind, tried to murder his nuclear engineer wife. When are all of his secrets going to come out? They forced Ariel on the stand and then cross examined her on flirty text messages. Who cares? She didn't have sex with a guy. Next. Moving on. What about him? He was married to a prostitute. Is nobody mentioning that in court?
- [31:39]
Dave Mack
I don't know why it hasn't already come up, but you know, Koenig's first wife is still a sex worker. Her. Her name is Jessica Patella, but she now goes by the stage name Jesse Sage. Still lives in Pittsburgh, where she lives.
- [31:55]
Nancy Grace
Excuse me. Hold on. What? I'm sorry, did you just say stage name? She's a sex worker.
- [32:03]
Dave Mack
Yeah.
- [32:03]
Nancy Grace
What stage are you talking about? Is she on Broadway? I missed that.
- [32:08]
Dave Mack
Oh, I'm. I'm so. I apologize. She works in the sex industry. She does, I'm guessing, shows for locals because she is not working Broadway. Nancy. But she does use what is referred to as. Her stage name is Jesse Sage.
- [32:26]
Nancy Grace
Okay. Nothing could make me happier at this moment other than a guilty verdict. So hold on. The first wife is a sex worker? They say married, as I recall, off the top of my head, about 15 years. Have two children. They split.
- [32:43]
Dave Mack
Yes.
- [32:44]
Nancy Grace
Gee, I wonder why. Actually, I don't blame her for being a sex worker. I blame him. I mean, when you don't know a horse, look at the track record. So tell me more about this first marriage. I'm stunned this has not come out in court yet.
- [33:00]
Dave Mack
Well, you know, they did have Two children, as you mentioned, they married fairly young at about 20 years old. Each married for 15 years. In that 15 years of marriage, there was a lot of fighting going on. And it is written about by one of their children to a degree of writing in third person publicly. I mentioned that the first wife is a current sex worker. She's based in Pittsburgh. She writes about a sexual column for the Pittsburgh City Paper. She has been on a number of podcasts as being a sex worker and mother. By the way, when they, when. When they were divorced, Patella, not Koenig, got custody of their two children.
- [33:44]
Nancy Grace
Okay, wait, what? Wait, wait, wait. You're like, you got me drinking out of the fire hydrant. You're giving me so much information. Let me be clear. I don't give a flying fig if she's a sex worker. Go be happy. Go be a sex worker. I'm not the church lady. What I care about is did he abuse her as well? Because that's going to be State's witness number 11 once I finish the case in chief. I'm going to start with similar transactions and that being her by whatever name she's choosing. Because it's my understanding that their child, now adult, writes about being admitted to psychiatric hospitals and seeing his mother losing blood like trees lose leaves in the fall. The child, now adult, goes on to state he doesn't remember much of his childhood. On one Christmas morning, the brother came into their room and the then child hid under the covers waiting for the parents to stop fighting. And in the end of that marriage, the children were given to the sex worker mom. Which speaks volumes about Dr. Koenig, now charged with attempted murder. That the court would give the children to a sex worker with a questionable lifestyle and questionable stability over a medical doctor father. I think the judge did the right thing. No question about it. Could you clarify those issues for me?
- [35:32]
Dave Mack
Dave Mack, you are 100% accurate, Nancy. After 15 years of marriage and two children, when they went through their divorce, the judge sided with Koenig's now ex wife, Jessica Patella, and awarded her custody of their children.
- [35:55]
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- [36:25]
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- [37:26]
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- [37:57]
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Dr. Bethany Marshall
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- [38:32]
Nancy Grace
Crime stories with nancy grace.
- [38:38]
911 Dispatcher/Caller
Okay, where is he at? What is he wearing? A T shirt. White? He had brownish sort of curly hair. Asian, Caucasian, Hawaiian? White guy? Yeah. White face and then what kind of shirt? T shirt maybe? I'm sorry, Shorts? Pardon?
- [39:00]
Nancy Grace
What kind of shorts?
- [39:02]
911 Dispatcher/Caller
I didn't see she's wearing shorts, though.
- [39:04]
Nancy Grace
To crime stories, investigative reporter Alexis Tureschuk. Alexis, have we heard one whisper in court about the previous marriage?
- [39:13]
Alexis Toreschuk
Not yet, we have not. Well, the only thing we've we're expecting is the child from the first marriage. That is who he called. He left was after he got in the fight. He ran into the woods or to the jungle of this Hawaiian island and he called his child, and that's where he said, I just tried to kill Ariel. I and fully confessed to his child on the phone. That child is expected to testify, but may or may not.
- [39:42]
Nancy Grace
Back to Dr. Bethany Marshall, renowned psychoanalyst joining us out of LA. Dr. Bethany, again, I really could not care less than I do that his other wife is a sex worker. But let me ask you, how does that fit in with your analysis? Does he want women that he can control and when he doesn't get that control, he explodes? I mean, I don't get the dichotomy. He's with one woman that gets paid to have sex with other men, and he's fine with that. But then he has Ariel, a nuclear engineer, for Pete's sake, and she doesn't have an affair and he bashes her head in with rotten Nancy.
- [40:29]
Dr. Bethany Marshall
It's like the Madonna whore complex where one person, usually these men have affairs where they have somebody who's a sex worker who is highly salacious, sexualized, sexually aggressive, and that woman is allowed to be very sexual. And then they have their wives that they keep at home. And then the white the wife is expected to be virginal. If she even smiles at another man, he thinks, oh, my God, she's cheating on me. So it's kind of like the Madonna horror complex carried out in time. And I want to guess that Gerhardt is maybe like a highly sexually aggressive person. So he married somebody who's a sex worker because he was probably out in those environments and this is what was familiar to him. But can you imagine if Ariel, having a friend, destabilized him so much that he wanted to kill her? Imagine what he subjected the sex worker to. I mean, I'm sure life was horrible for her. And then calling his teenage son Nancy, she he was a teenager saying, I tried to kill Ari, but she got away. How many times did Gerhard burden his children with secrets, with abuse, with things that he said about their mothers? I mean, there I'm sure what's going to come out is it was a pretty terrifying childhood for these kids.
- [41:53]
Nancy Grace
To Eric Faddis joining us, veteran trial lawyer, former Felony prosecutor Eric how do you keep out the first wife if she has evidence of prior similar transactions? For instance, he had beaten her before, too.
- [42:10]
Eric Faddis
Sure. So I think there are several ways you go about it. One is that the fact that she exists and was a sex worker, that has nothing to do with this case. The fact that there may have been some prior allegations, you look at how attacked, attenuated those are. You try to see, hey, how much time has gone by. You look at distinctions between those allegations and the allegation at this trial, which is that he used a rock to bash her head. My apprehension is that there are going to be some dissimilarities between both of those accounts. And when you have those distinctions, when you have that attenuation, sometimes a judge is going to say, hey, that's too removed, that's too remote. And we are not going to let it in this trial because it could prejudice the jury to convict this dude because they think he's a bad dude or they think he has a bad character. They think he's been violent before, but he's not being charged with being violent before.
- [43:02]
Nancy Grace
Straight out to Dan Murphy. Joining us, former NYPD detective sergeant, co host of hit podcast Gold Shields and author of Workplace Safety Establishing Effective Violence Prevention Programs. Dan, again, I have to agree with Fatis that the fact the first. Why is a sex worker irrelevant except for I wonder. And it could be argued at court that he wanted women he could control financially, emotionally, physically. And then when Ariel Koenig would not submit to his demands and his control, he bashed her head in. And this was well planned. She says he brought syringes and tried to stab her with them. So this had been in the works for some time. But what would you bring up with the first wife, the one that's a sex worker?
- [44:01]
Dan Murphy
Well, first of all, I would want to talk to her if I was one of the investigating detectives. I want to talk to her. I want to get a picture of this person if I can, to see if it helps the prosecution of the case. This is post arrest, of course. Let's find out what we can find out about. Was he ever violent with her before? Are there court records that indicate orders of protection back where they used to live? Were there police reports that show that there had been fights that did not result in arrest, or maybe that did and the cases were dismissed? What can I learn about him and his behavior toward women in general that might help prosecution paint a picture of him, that this was not an isolated moment where she came at him that this guy has a pattern and a history during his life of controlling behavior, of violent behavior, of escalations. And in this case I think we have so much material that shows us that he was intent on harming if not killing her there. But in his previous life before this wife, what were his patterns? That is very compelling evidence in a courtroom. It's compelling to anyone to learn that the person has a pattern and a history of handling frustrations through violence.
- [45:07]
Nancy Grace
In the last days, Girard shown shock body cam of the anesthesiologist doctor's bloody wife. They see the rock he allegedly used to bash her in a cliffside attack while they were to be celebrating her birthday. The graphic body camera video and bloodstained rocked used in court and allegedly in a brutal cliffside attack. The jury sees it. To Alexis Toreschuk, what was the jury's response?
- [45:48]
Alexis Toreschuk
I think everybody in the jury is just watching this seriously. But the one thing that's really interesting that is that he has been seen smiling so much during all of this testimony. When all of this evidence has been presented, he's been seen smiling and people that are watching the court think it's a little odd that maybe he'd be smiling through something that's so terrible that he's been accused of something really terrible. His wife is clearly very upset. These women that found him are upset. People that are presenting the evidence are very matter of fact showing there's blood on the rock. This is the DNA evidence we have and he's sitting there smiling in court.
- [46:23]
Nancy Grace
We wait as justice unfolds. Now we remember an American hero Master trooper Stephen Perry, North Carolina Highway Patrol. Just 30 killed in the line of duty, leaving behind a nine month old baby girl and her mom. American hero Master trooper Stephen Perry. Nancy Gray signing off. Goodbye friend.
- [46:56]
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- [48:27]
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- [48:27]
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- [49:29]
Nancy Grace
This is an I Heart podcast. Guaranteed human.