Joe Scott Morgan (3:06)

do some Vocal warm ups.

Nancy Grace (3:08)

That is from the D4VD tour video. Okay, let me get the dates right. Joining me, Susan Hendricks, investigative reporter, journalist, author of A Down the My Descent into the Double Murder in Delphi. Susan Hendricks, he was going on tour. Remember, Celeste was murdered just before his Withered tour. He was getting ready for the tour and he was putting out all types of promotional videos. She was murdered just before he dropped the album and went on the tour. And after intense public outcry after Celeste's body is found in his Tesla, let's just refresh everyone's recollection and show the Tesla in the impound parking lot where it smelled so badly they opened the trunk and found the dead body. Why, Susan Hendricks, is he wrapping what appears to be a human finger?

Susan Hendricks (4:13)

I think everything with this guy is symbolic. He's shoving it in our faces. So let's say it's a human figure or plastic finger. I think he knows what he's doing because as you know, Celeste fingers were not found when her body was discovered. Two of her fingers. So I think he was enabled. He did what he wanted to do. We had merch that had blood all over white shirts. He pulled that once cops started searching his house months later. But I think he did what he wanted to do and he had the support of an entourage that.

Nancy Grace (4:45)

Guys, you're seeing video from D4BD's tour on TikTok. Is this part of the promotional video he's pushing out there that looks to be in his home, where we believe. Isn't this right? DAVE Mack, Crime Stories Investigative Reporter According to the court documents, prosecutors are saying she, Celeste was killed in that home where we believe that finger wrapping video was recorded. He's like, what, a few feet away from where she was murdered and disarticulated.

Dave Mack (5:15)

As disgusting as it Sounds, absolutely right, Nancy. April 23rd, 10 o' clock at night, just after. That's when investigators say D4VD killed Celeste Rivas right after she arrived at his home. And then as you see in this video, do you really think somebody who has his biggest hit, romantic homicide and all of the blood and imagery that he has in his work is not

Nancy Grace (5:41)

rapping a trophy, jumping off what Susan Hendricks and Dave Mack have just told us. Joseph Scott Morgan joining us. Professor, Forensics, Jacksonville State University he is the author of a bestseller, Blood Beneath My Feet, on Amazon. He is the star of a hit podcast, Body Bags with Joseph Scott Morgan. But for our purposes tonight, and typically, he is a death investigator who I met through his role as a death investigator when I was prosecuting. I think it was a double homicide. I know it was a homicide. I know that much. Joe Scott Morgan has handled over 10,000 death scenes. Just let that sink in for one moment. Joe Scott Morgan, I know you've been watching on your monitor D4VD, aka David Anthony Burke, the multimillionaire singer, Celeste, his little girlfriend was his muse. Joe Scott, look at your monitor. Look at Celeste's finger in life. Do you notice it's got an engagement ring on it? And the tattoo, the word. David. Isn't it true, Joe Scott, that that ring finger was gone? It had been amputated from her when her remains were found? How hard was it for the ME to make sense of that gelatinous goo that was found in Deforbidity's trunk?

Joe Scott Morgan (7:14)

Very difficult. It's one of the most difficult things that a forensic pathologist can do when you have a body that is in this advanced state of decomposition. To add to this, you know, we're always trying to pick up on clues, Nancy, with, you know, what is the body telling us, you know, with all that remains, if you will. And when you come across this, and they definitively said this, Nancy, they said that those. Those elements of her hand were in fact, missing. Well, what does that mean? Well, it's. It's not connected to decomposition. Okay, Just so that everybody understands that up front, because there's been a lot of speculation about this, they have physical evidence that gives you an indication that this was something that was probably facilitated by the use of a tool. And in forensics, one of the things that we do, we rely heavily upon our friends in the tool mark section of any crime lab. So they've got evidence, I think, probably on the remnant, the skeletal remnant that is left behind, and it's going to be very definitive. Now, what. What does this tell us about him? I can't really say that because I'm not a profiler, but when I see elements that are missing, I've had cases where individuals have.

Nancy Grace (8:30)

Look, there it is in life. Jo Scott.

Joe Scott Morgan (8:32)

Look, right, right there.

Nancy Grace (8:34)

There is Celeste. Yeah, with her little engagement ring. And wait, wait till you hear the text. I'm going to read them out by her little brother about how D4VD promised her they were getting married as soon as she turned 18. Okay, go ahead.

Joe Scott Morgan (8:50)

What I'm saying is, is that I've had cases in the past where individuals just like my friend Dave mentioned just a second ago, taking trophies. You know. Now, whether or not. Whether or not that that bit that he had in his hands there where he's. He's wrapping it up, just the fact that he's referencing a human finger is significant to me because as an investigator, I'm looking at this. Wouldn't it be really interesting if we could get our hands or the investigative authorities could get their hands on that? Because this goes to a pattern, doesn't it?

Nancy Grace (9:27)

Nancy just got. Just wait till I show you the anime video he created. It dropped on her birthday of slicing a girl's arm off. Okay, just wait for that. With bated breath. But I was headed straight out to Randolph Rice. But hold Karen Stark. Jo Scott is right. We definitely need a shrink and we need it now. Karen Stark is with us, a renowned TV and radio trauma expert. She is a forensic psychologist. You can find her@karen stark.com. that's not all she does even into the night. She has private patients, private clients. And I want to thank you for making time to be with us tonight. Karen Stark. Okay, Karen. I really don't know how to verbalize all the thoughts colliding in my head. This little girl is found without her ring finger and with that engagement ring on it. And then here he is on video wrapping up what appears to be a human ring finger.

Karen Stark (10:30)

Nancy, everything that's been said is so true. And I want to just put it all together because think about this as a trophy. And it definitely seems to me that that's what's happening. This is a trophy. And he wants people to know that he is wrapping up a finger. He thinks it's funny. He's able to turn it into an object as Joe was saying, that it is not a person, it's just a finger. And it's as though his unconscious is speaking to us and telling us, I did something terrible. I want to do something terrible. And I'm going to treat it like it doesn't mean anything. So I won't worry about the fact that I'm revealing what happened. So he's speaking to us through this video and it's just heartless, cold. It's so much an indication of an antisocial personality. What we know happens to be true about a psychopath.

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Nancy Grace (12:30)

Want to be a star? No problem. Anyone can shine on TikTok. Post your first video today. Real life, real story. Real you. Download TikTok and get started. Crime stories with Nancy Grace. You know, when I look at D4VD, John Bueller, renowned investigator, former detective with Modesto PD. Now, he was 31 years in robbery and homicide, but shot to fame as one of the lead detectives in the Scott Peterson investigation. Peterson murdered his pregnant wife Lacey and killed their unborn child, Connor Bueller. How am I going to compare D4VD to Scott Peterson? This is how I know you're in your vehicle out on the street. But John, look at your phone video, because I'm showing him wrapping that finger again and again and again. And I want you to think back on Scott Peterson. Okay? Scott Peterson, even though he knows he murdered Lacey and Connor and disposed of their bodies, putting them attached to cement blocks and dropping them to the bottom of the San Francisco Bay, he continued with his arrogant behavior. He ordered the porn channel. He knew she wasn't coming back home. You know what kind of H double I'd raise if I came in and my husband had ordered the porn channel?

Dave Mack (14:03)

Oh,

Nancy Grace (14:06)

he put the house up for sale. He tried to sell her vehicle. And he continued his sex affair with a completely unassuming, unsuspecting young lady, Amber Fry. And lying, lying, lying, trying to blame other people. The arrogance. Even returning to the scene, repeating to gaze out onto the bay. What was he looking for? Her body to pop up? Well, it did. The arrogance of Scott Peterson and D4VD. David Anthony Burke putting out a video, wrapping up a human finger when Celeste's finger was Amputated.

Scott Eicher (14:49)

Yeah.

John Bueller (14:49)

Nancy, there's, you know, a lot of similarities to both of these guys. Incredible arrogance on both of their parts. And that's a good thing for detectives and investigators and especially for the prosecutors because that arrogance helps build the case when they think they're above being caught. And Scott certainly had that. He, he didn't think that anybody would be able to get him on this. He thought he had a good alibi and it wasn't. And same thing with D4VD. He's, he's just so arrogant about all these things. Creating an alibi with the Uber, I believe Celeste passport card was found up there in Santa Barbara. So he's doing all sorts of things after the murder to cover it up and make look like she was out on her own. She did have a little bit of a history of running away to join up with him. And with that, it's easily dissected and broken up when she doesn't come back. And that's what we have with this incredible arrogance. I'm not going to get caught. I'm above this. I'm famous. I'm a singer, I'm a rapper or whatever and I've got my entourage is going to cover for me.

Nancy Grace (15:50)

Speaking of arrogance, Susan Hendricks joining us, investigative journalist, is it true and if so, why does D4VD believe he, out of all the thousands of people in lockup, should get a glow up a glam squad? What is happening?

Susan Hendricks (16:11)

Yes, Joe Scott mentioned disassociation to the 100th degree. I think it's very telling that he asked for it. But also who asked for it? His quote unquote team asked the judge saying, hey, he needs new clothes, haircut. Los Angeles Superior Court judge did tell the sheriff's department, kind of compromising on the last one, give him a haircut. Not close to the haircuts I'm sure he's used to, but still has that close knit team stepping in for him asking the court get him new clothes.

Nancy Grace (16:40)

To Dave Mack joining us from Crime Stories. Dave, what exactly is he asking for?

Dave Mack (16:46)

He is asking to be allowed to wear his kind of clothing in court, like you know, button down shirt and not jail clothes. Also asking for a very specific hairstyle to be done, as you mentioned earlier, a glow up to make him look like he looks when he's not in jail. It looks like they are going to approve a haircut, but nothing more than that, Nancy. But the guts of the just asking to have this incredible glow up to have an appearance in front of the Jury or potential jury or court. It's just ridiculous.

Nancy Grace (17:27)

No, no, no. Dave, Matt, you got it about 95% right. Randolph Rice joining us, high profile lawyer out of Baltimore, former prosecutor, now veteran criminal defense and civil lawyer at Rice, Mertha and Soros. Randolph Rice. First of all, it's not time for the jury trial. Dave, Meg had it right. He wants to glow up. He wants to glam squad his team. I guarantee you his lawyers didn't know this was happening. Demand a new hairstyle and fresh clothes, designer clothes for his appearance. There's not a jury. It's a preliminary hearing. H E double L. Let me clarify. H E L L. Hell no. Why is he not getting his designer threads?

Randolph Rice (18:16)

Well, he's not getting his designer threads because just as you said, Nancy, the judge does not care about how he looks because there's no jury there. But I will say from a defense standpoint and from his standpoint and his team standpoint, this might be one of the first smart moves they are making here. Because not only is this case going to be tried in the courtroom, but I think this case is going to be tried in the public. And remember, down the road as his defense attorney are going to have to pick a jury. It may help to have a good light on him moving forward.

Nancy Grace (18:43)

Put him up a good light. What you know and I know you know, I know your career very well. He is not entitled to street clothes, as we call them, unless there's a jury. No. Didn't you see Brian Coburger asking for the same thing? No was the answer. No. D4VD is not getting it either. But that didn't stop his team from trying. Did.

Randolph Rice (19:14)

Didn't. And as my mother always said, if you don't ask, you don't get. So why not ask? It doesn't hurt. Look, the defense team and his team are going to ask every single question, every single thing that they can try to get over on the state. And I would do the same thing. They need to try to take advantage of every single opportunity, every single appearance. And he needs to come out there looking the best he possibly can to have that favorable light on him as he moves forward with this trial.

Nancy Grace (19:38)

Favorable light. Instead of getting a glow up with his glam squad behind bars, he should probably be worried about the evidence, such as putting out a video of him wrapping up what appears to be a human finger. Of course it's not a human finger. Well, I hope it's not a human finger. I don't think it's a human finger. I Think it's a toy or a replica, but that said, he's putting out the bad vibes. That's him. Yeah. Oh, thank you. There he is again. That's him wrapping up what appears to be a withered human finger, but is likely a toy replica. The point is, he is shooting himself in the foot. And another thing, while I've got you, Randolph Rice, he's not asking for his regular clothes. See some photos of what D4BD usually wears. He's not asking for that. No, he wants designer clothes. He wants. Oh, yeah. That is not how he wants to appear in court. He wants to wear a pair of dress slacks and a button down. Right. I've never seen him in a button down. He wants to present a false facade to spectators. What about it, Randolph?

Randolph Rice (20:56)

Genius. Genius. I think it's a good move on his defense part and his team's part. And let me just say one thing about this finger everybody's talking about. This is. This is something that's going to hurt his case. I can tell you, his attorneys, and if I was attorney, too, I would be going to the mat, filing a motion. Lemonade, which did you know, Nancy, is just a motion to exclude evidence. That video never sees the light of day in a courtroom because it is irrelevant. Unless the prosecutors can prove that, that. That has something to do with Celeste, with the victim in this case, it is not coming into court.

Nancy Grace (21:27)

You know what, Randolph Rice, I recall a serial killer I prosecuted. He always picked on. He always selected very similar, physically similar women. And when I had a reconstructionist draw a photo, well, a sketch of my dead victim. She was a Jane Doe, but they could make out what she would have looked like in life. And I brought in another woman he attacked and strangled, but she lived. He strangled, the victim dead. Another woman he strangled and nearly killed. And then grand finale brought in his living girlfriend, the mother of his baby. I held a sketch up to the jury of the deceased and compared her two sketches of the girlfriend and the other victim. They all look just alike. They proved something. It proved something. Just like him wrapping up what appears to be a human finger. Like Jo, Scott Morgan says to me, it proves something. Have you wrapped up what appears to be a human finger, Randolph Rice, and videoed it?

Lingokids Advertiser 2 (22:45)

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Nancy Grace (22:45)

Please tell me the answer is no.

Randolph Rice (22:47)

I have not wrapped up a human finger and wrapped it, fortunately yet. So I. I cannot relate to this, but again, this is an artist. We don't live in this world that they live in where they're trying to have these Images and these references that they're trying to put out there to the public. So this may have something to do with something with. With unrelated topic that has nothing to do with this alleged murder.

Nancy Grace (23:09)

Okay, okay. Just disarticulated or rendered human ring fingers have nothing to do with this case. Is that right, Joe Scott?

Joe Scott Morgan (23:19)

You know who did live in this artist world in his universe? This child, Celeste Rivas. So was she a prop? You know, was she objectified to the point where someone would feel comfortable enough to as maybe their form of art to do what they did to her? Because I got to tell you, as this case goes on, Nancy, it gets more and more bizarre all the way along because people knew, people knew for a fact that she occupied a space within his day to day life. This child bore witness to everything that he was doing. All of his creative urges, if you will. But I guess we'll never know that because Celeste was found in the trunk of a car, disarticulated.

Nancy Grace (24:11)

I hope that you're sitting down. You may need to lay down for this. It wasn't just the wrapping of the fake finger. There's video released poetically, poignantly, and I believe probatively. In other words, it proves something on her birthday. Watch this. This is released by D4VD. And oh, there's a severed arm with a sharp knife. And look at the woman covered in blood, stabbed, bleeding at the Torso. And there's D4VD. You can't mistake who that is covered in blood, much like the blood of the merchandise that he sells. Crime stories with. Nancy Grace. To you, Dave Mack. Where did this come from, Nancy?

Dave Mack (25:13)

It comes from the anime, Japanese anime, you know, cartoon stuff that D4VD and his ilk are into. And when we get into the stories of how the manga, the anime, it really matches up what deep RVD is watching and is really into. Nancy actually ends up playing itself out with Celeste, apparently. Allegedly. When you look at a very, very specific manga, there is an anime that has a girlfriend who is murdered just like Celeste was allegedly murdered. There's a disarticulation in this anime, but in that, in this anime she was kept alive. The victim there was kept alive. And her left pinky, left ring finger as well as left eye. We're all cut out and chopped up.

Nancy Grace (26:18)

Okay, wait a minute, wait a minute. Keep looking. Her legs are missing. Her legs are missing in that last frame. This is released on Celeste's birthday. We are told. Keep going to the end, to the end, to the. I'm not sure if her Legs are missing or if those are the trousers she's wearing. This is released on her birthday. I want to switch quickly to a special guest joining us, Scott Eicher. Scott Eicher, digital forensic expert, founding member of the FBI Cellular Analysis survey team Cast he is now at Precision Cellular Analysis. He was with the FBI as a special agent 22 years. Also Norfolk PD and Homicide. Scott Eicher, many people are now suggesting that the feds are getting involved or will get involved in this case. There are many grounds under which they could jump in, but there was a very long delay until D4VD David Anthony Burke was arrested. And I'm wondering if the feds or locals used a wiretap because look at all we've shown and, and the last 20 minutes of evidence he's throwing out there, albeit demonstrative. Do you think he was so arrogant he would discuss Celeste murder and the COVID up on the phone? How do the feds get a wire wiretap?

Scott Eicher (27:57)

SCOTT IKER Wiretaps are based on probable cause, so they had to have probable cause to submit to the judge to get this wiretap. And wiretap covers a lot of different things. It can cover cell phone conversations, text messages. It can cover email addresses and communications via applications like Snapchat or whatever he was using. So once they get to that point that they can convince a judge that they would think there's evidence there that they should glean, the judge will approve that. And then obviously we're seeing what he's doing with his videos that seem to be related to Celeste's murder. There's a lot of information that can be gleaned from his communications. We were, you talked earlier about a brother or the, his attorney talking to him about, you know, still living with the minor. Those are things that would help the detectives find the probable cause to be able to be this intrusive into his life. I mean, we know that they were looking at phone records of his and Celeste before she even was murdered, back when she was a runaway. So they had phone records back then that they started looking through and now they, they built that. I believe they definitely found a lot of information through the wiretaps.

Nancy Grace (29:26)

So Randolph Rice joining us, jumping off what Scott Eicher just revealed. Scott Eicher, founding member of the FBI Cellular Analysis Survey Team, knows a lot about wiretaps. RANDOLPH Wiretaps are very difficult to get from a judge because they're so intrusive, but they're pay dirt based on, as Joe Scott just said, when you don't know a horse. Look at his track record. Truer words were never spoken. He is putting it all out there. He left his vehicle in plain view with Celeste's body in it. He had, apparently friends move it from place to place. He made up a lie about why his home had a stench of a dead body in it and blamed it on a clogged toilet. But there's no telling what a wiretap of his phone's would reveal. How have you ever gotten a wiretap? And isn't it true that cell phones can also be tapped, not just landlines?

Randolph Rice (30:29)

Back in my prosecutor days, yes, we use cell phone wiretaps all the time, as I'm sure you can remember the series the Wire in Baltimore, which is a very popular TV show. And it's very much like that. It's easy to get wiretaps if you can present to a judge that you've exhausted almost all other avenues and that you presented probable cause. But as a defense attorney, there are challenges to that. You can go back to the judge. And I certainly believe that if there are things on that wiretap that, that that are incriminating to Mr. Burke. His attorneys will challenge, was there probable cause? Was there enough information to that judge to issue that wiretap. All these things can be challenged down the road in court.

Nancy Grace (31:09)

Joining us, John Bueller, former homicide detective who led the investigation into the murders of Lacey and Connor Peterson. John Bueller, you have seen the arrogance firsthand of Scott Peterson. Do you remember what he ordered? His Whataburger or In N Out burger order that he made within minutes of finding out that the bodies that washed up at San Francisco Bay were DNA matched to Lacey and Conner. Do you remember what he said within minutes?

John Bueller (31:42)

Yeah, he sent it right to my face. He was in the back of my car as I was putting gas in it. And we asked him if he wanted something to eat because we were hungry. We'd been driving for a while. We had a little bit of a drive in front of us, and I mentioned In N Out Burger, pretty popular out in the West Coast. And he just kind of reflected for a moment and he cavalierly asked, yeah, I'll have a double double with cheese, a fry and a small vanilla shake. Almost like he was ordering it at the takeout window himself.

Dave Mack (32:09)

And.

John Bueller (32:10)

And that's the kind of arrogance that you have with D4VD. He just doesn't believe he's going to get caught. It seems like when he keeps doing these things and again, it makes it easier to Put a case together when you have this, because they're almost pounding nails into their own coffin when they do these things. In addition, on Peterson, of course, we had a wire intercept going on him fairly quickly, and we were able to get an enormous amount of information and intelligence on what he was doing behind the scenes. You may remember, Nancy, there was that one time when an anchor was located in San Francisco Bay. There was a big hubbub about it, and they thought it was a body or could have been because of the dimensions. And when Sharon Rocha called Scott, leaving a message on his voicemail because he seldom ever answered, he'd always let it roll to voicemail, screen his calls, and she said it was an anchor. We knew that. We just wanted to let you know. And there was a suppressed whistle on the feed when we had the wire intercept, where he whistled, like, in relief that, you know, he didn't get caught on that. And anyway, it was just. It was one of those things. A lot of similarities in both cases. Randolph Rice brings up some great points. I gotta agree with him on a lot of these things. You know, those are the kind of challenges that we're gonna see when this goes to court.

Nancy Grace (33:27)

I can just hear Peterson just saying, yeah, they got that wrong. They're never gonna catch me. I'll just go ahead and order the porn channel. Okay? The arrogance translates to feeling like you're above everybody else. You're the smartest one in the room. That's something that helped me a lot at trial, knowing I was not the smartest one in the room when I would be trying cases, translating to what would he say on the phone with the wiretap? Because he's so arrogant. Can't imagine anybody's ever going to catch him. But we have evidence that he knew he was dating a minor, and everybody else around him knew. But arrogance, he didn't stop. Where is he from? We need to be investing in this. Which one is it? Whitaker.

Dave Mack (34:19)

Freak out.

Nancy Grace (34:22)

Right there at the end. We hear who we believe is D4VD. David Anthony Burks, agent saying, are you still dating that minor? Everybody knew. Everybody knew. They were quoting dating. No secret. That's from Josh Hallamback on Insta. Thank you. Josh Allenback. The arrogance. The arrogance. Bueller.

John Bueller (34:48)

Yeah, it's. It's pretty stark. And I don't know if it fits in with the whole culture that he was immersed in or anything like that, but he. When. When you have so many people that are behind you and he's got all these people in his entourage, that are bowing in his altar on a daily basis. He probably gets this invincibility demeanor where he thinks he's above this stuff. And then the really disturbing thing is, you know, as you've shown several times, this wrapping in a finger. Maybe it's her finger, maybe it's not. Maybe it's a prop. Who knows? But just the fact that she's missing and he's wrapping that shows a complete disregard for her. He looked at Celeste as a recreational item, like a jet ski or, you know, a motorcycle or something, but not as anything human. And that. That really kind of sets them apart from a lot of the murderers that we dealt with over the years that just did something foolish or they were angry, but just the depravity of this guy, pretty stark. Jury should love this case.

Nancy Grace (35:45)

Joe Scott Morgan, you have sadly been a death investigator on many, many child homicides. Okay, so I want you to look at this photo we managed to dig up, which in my mind shows that D4VD's family knew very well he was dating a minor. There you see a shot at one of D4VD's performances. There are his parents, his sister, seated right beside teen girl celeste, and his D4VDS brother. Look at that. They all knew Joe Scott. Now, what do you think they were wondering about when it went out that Celeste was missing and her body had been found?

Joe Scott Morgan (36:33)

Yeah, precisely. And also thinking, you know, where. Where had been this child? I don't know. One. One word comes to mind. Facilitation. Because I'm thinking about this. You know, that he is involved with a child, and let's firmly say that. Right? Child. Right. But yet, here we are. And maybe for whatever reason, you don't feel compelled to offer some kind of mercy, some kind of caring to people that truly loved her. I'm talking about her family. Those individuals, maybe at her school, whatever the case might be, those individuals that truly knew her as a child. And again, I'll say she was a child when she was murdered, but yet you show no compassion on any level relative to this. Your idea is to, I don't know, save somebody's skin. It doesn't make any sense to me, Nancy. It goes back to the point that this thing comes down. It keeps getting more and more bizarre. And again, everybody. Everybody that is in this circle seems to be completely, completely absent compassion when it comes to her. Because at the end of the day, this is not about him. This is about this child. It's about an absence that can never be replaced. Her life Whatever her background was, I don't care. It has to do with she is absent. She did not have a choice in anything that was happening to her because by law she is a child and she was being manipulated. She was being used. And I submit to you, everybody within this circle knew about it. I think that they probably helped facilitate it.

Nancy Grace (38:26)

She never had a chance, did she? Jo Scott, Susan Hendricks, what can you tell me about Celeste's passport being thrown in a heavily wooded area in Santa Barbara?

Susan Hendricks (38:37)

Yeah, it was found in Santa Barbara county near a lake, which was suspicious to me. That stood out. He traveled there three times and it was found by a worker who then authorities went to interview about how he found it. He's the one that discovered her passport. But I wonder if there's more than what we just heard in that court document, the nine page document, if there's more that they have that they're holding close to the vest. We do know, as you mentioned, Nancy, phone surveillance. But I wonder what else was found there and where was she killed? Was it the garage? That last time I was on your show we heard it was part game room, part garage. It'll be interesting to hear during the trial all of the details involved in this. What was there? What was he getting rid of?

Nancy Grace (39:23)

Well, I think I know Susan Hendricks. I think I know why he discarded the passport to. Dave Mack, joining us, crime stories investigative reporter. What can you tell me about alleged trips? And this brings in the federal jurisdiction issue that we started with with Randolph Rice. What can you tell me about alleged trips for D4VD reportedly took Celeste overseas?

Dave Mack (39:45)

Yeah, Nancy, what's interesting about this entire investigation is that these trips to London, Las Vegas, Houston are mentioned in the investigation paperwork filed with the court that said D4VD took Celeste to these very specific places to meet his family. Now, Nancy, to travel overseas as a minor, you have to have your passport, but you also have to have permission from an adult family member or guardian. And there's a lot that goes into a minor traveling like that. But more than just the fact that we have all this from the investigators, he, David Burke did an interview in the days following the death murder of Celeste was when Burke's first full length album was dropped called Withered and the world tour that followed. And so there was a lot of activity right after she died. That's the motivation for the death. On April 25, two days after David Anthony Burke allegedly murdered Celeste Rivas, Burke does an interview published by Songwriter Universe where he actually says, and he describes the process of how he writes and things like that and then mentions the trips that he took to London and Houston. And again, these are places mentioned in the. From the investigators. David says in the interview, I went to London with three of my friends and we just made a song every day for two weeks in London. I love London because of the gloomy aesthetic and the gloomy, well, just like vibe and environment that London has.

Nancy Grace (41:36)

Right. So, Karen Stark joining us. TV radio trauma expert, forensic psychologist. Why in the world would De Forvidee need to cart a little teen girl to London, to Houston, to Vegas?

Karen Stark (41:52)

Well, think about it, Nancy. This is what keeps going through my mind. She was 11 years old supposedly when she met him. We're talking about a child who didn't know any different, except this is a celebrity. So she could even see that video and not understand the violence behind it and that it might have something to do with her. I keep thinking about her because she didn't know any better. And he took somebody so vulnerable who actually didn't know better and traveled with her and used her and then objectified her. She didn't matter. She got tossed. And I feel so much pity and regret and sadness for her because her life was cut short and she had no idea about what was happening to her.

Nancy Grace (42:42)

In that video we're showing right now, she's still wearing her little engagement ring. Randolph Rice, high profile lawyer, defense attorney out of Baltimore. Randolph, taking her across state lines for illicit reasons, including out of the country to London to Vegas, to Houston, wouldn't that spark federal jurisdiction?

Randolph Rice (43:06)

You're right, Nancy. That's where you get in trouble with the feds. When you start crossing state lines is when the feds can step in and say, look, you violated interstate commerce rules and therefore you've gotten yourself into a position where your key could be charged federally. Now, I will say this, that would be fine, charge them for those things. But again, going back to this, there are a lot of missing facts. There are a lot of missing elements here that I think the prosecution still has to get to to prove that he is the one that killed Celeste.

Nancy Grace (43:33)

And the significance that they mentioned the passport being found in Santa Barbara is because it was likely stamped with London. I mean, what more, I mean, you're handing the jury a case on a silver platter, Randolph.

Randolph Rice (43:52)

You are. But again, I keep going back to everybody keeps saying arrogance. I think the word might be ignorance. And everybody in this panel and that tell this is an all star panel, keep saying the entourage, the people around him, if I'm his defense team, Right now I've got investigators looking at every member of that entourage because they are potential suspects in this murder. They could be the ones that have done these things.

Nancy Grace (44:15)

In other words, they're the sod. They're the dude and some other dude. Or at least that's what you would argue.

Randolph Rice (44:23)

Nancy. That's a real possibility because he has this group around him. It's evident by this glam up evidence. There's people out there that are trying to still protect him. How do we know that those are the same people that were trying to protect him from Celeste? It had something to do with.

Nancy Grace (44:36)

I want you to see this, Randolph. Before you dig that. That grave too deeply, let's take a look at messages allegedly from Celeste brother. They start off from a friend. Hey, why does David follow you? D4VD? All respect to your sister. I hate how people are being. Was it really him? Yes, it was him. Because he found my account out of nowhere and followed me. Well, he has it coming. That's wild. Randomly. Did you ever talk to him? I met him once in person. Do you and your family know your sister being with him? Like, was she living with him? All this is so confusing and disgusting. I knew and went to police about it, but they said lack of evidence. I can't wait to investigate that. So he, the brother, was waved off. It's crazy how people suffer for it. How long has she been gone? You mean dead? Two weeks. Damn, that soon? People have been saying like a month. The dude's a weirdo with his songs. All have. Then it goes on. Was your sister, like, in love with him and choosing to stay? I'm guessing it was all him just manipulating her. The brother says, yeah, she was always saying that he was waiting till she was 18 to get married. The friend says, sick. That's what's crazy is all those people in a circle who knew and didn't say anything. I saw one guy did. Got sued by him. I'm sure you would have too, if you kept pushing. Dog. What? I never knew that my sister wouldn't say anything ever. And then there are more pictures sent back and forth of Celeste. The significant part to me, Susan Hendricks, is that he D4VD kept telling her they were going to get married, this little girl. And she has her little engagement ring. And reportedly, when she said, you keep seeing other girls, reportedly other minors. I'm going to blow this wide and tell everybody. And then she ends up dead.

Susan Hendricks (46:57)

Yeah. And remember Nancy? As you know, they met when she was just 11 years old. A Little girl with braces meeting up for the first time at age 13. She believed him. Her heart was set on getting married when she was 18. You showed us the engagement ring. It broke my heart when I read that from the brother because I feel like he felt like there was nothing he could do, that she wouldn't talk to them, that she would never tell. He had her. David had Celeste under his control as he wanted. She became a problem and in my opinion, disposed of her.

Nancy Grace (47:29)

Scott Eicher, isn't it true you were a fed for years on the cellular analysis survey team? Don't you imagine they have D4VD's cell movements? They've got him red handed. If he went to London, Vegas, Houston with Celeste, they know about it.

Scott Eicher (47:49)

I totally agree. I mean, from way back when she was the first runaway. They were probably getting his records and her records to try to figure out where she was, if she was actually staying with him. And then as things progressed, though, definitely they preserve that historical data. Getting the towers and the timing, advance information, that location, information from his phone and probably a lot of his entourage, and then Celeste's phone, too, to try to locate where they were at specific times, to even include where the passport was found, stuff like that, that's all going to be part of the case.

Nancy Grace (48:28)

If you know or think you know anything about the death of this young girl, Celeste Rivas, please dial 213-486-6890. Repeat, 213-486-6890. We remember American hero, Special Agent Aaron Garcia, Union Pacific Rail pd. Killed in the line of duty after just two years, leaving behind a grieving wife, Juana, and sons, Aaron and Andrew. Sentenced to life without dad. American hero, Special Agent Aaron Garcia, Nancy Grace signing off. Goodbye, friend. This is an I Heart podcast. Guaranteed human.