← Crime Stories with Nancy Grace
Crime Stories with Nancy Grace
HORRIBLE HOWIE: MONEY MANAGER LURES VICTIMS INTO SOUNDPROOF DUNGEON, COPS
00:53:22
Loading summary
Transcript108 lines
- [00:00]
A
This is an iHeart podcast, crime stories with Nancy Grace. Horrible. Howie, that's Howard Rubin, millionaire money manager accused of luring, then attacking women in his specially made soundproof dungeon in his multimillion dollar penthouse. According to. Wow. Luring women into a soundproof dungeon, even tying them up, cuffing them to a cross. A cross, the holy cross. That cross. Torturing them with an electric cattle prod. What can I get on that jury? Can I get on that ju. I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. I want to thank you for being with us.
- [01:08]
B
Former financier Howard Rubin, once a powerful figure in the world of finance, is now facing explosive charges for allegedly running a sex trafficking operation spanning more than a decade.
- [01:21]
A
Howard Rubin, multimillionaire financier. A money manager. That's what he's called, a money manager. He manages other people's money. Much like Epstein, Jeffrey Epstein, who apparently brought in, you know, a couple of million dollars, but somehow was transferring out $500 million to overseas accounts, including Russian banks that were on the US watch list. What is it with these money managers? And how does this guy, not Epstein, but Rubin, allegedly lure women, educated women, into his sex dungeon that he personally had soundproofed. Okay, right there, right there. I need a shrink right now. Let's go straight out to Dr. Bethany Marshall, psychoanalyst joining us out of LA. She's the author of Deal Breaker. You can see her now on Peacock and find her at Dr.bethany marshall.com right there. A soundproof dungeon. I mean, when an artisan, a worker, gets to call from a dude that wants a soundproof dungeon and you go in there and you see it's a torture chamber, doesn't that like wave a red flag of alarm? What freak wants a soundproof torture dungeon?
- [02:50]
C
A freak who has sexual sadism disorder. In other words, somebody who can only get sexually aroused when the victim is humiliated, frightened or terrified. And Nancy, maybe this is why he's a financial planner. Maybe he needed to make a lot of money so he could build that dungeon and buy all of that equipment.
- [03:10]
A
Okay, let's just take it from the top. Listen to this.
- [03:13]
B
Wall street money manager Howard Rubin busted by feds at his Fairfield, Connecticut home for decade long sex trafficking with the help of assistant Jennifer Powers. Howie Rubin, accused of luring women into BDSM sex sessions, then torturing and raping them. 10 Jane does listed as victims in the indictment, but prosecutors say there are dozens more and are calling for tips.
- [03:34]
A
Joining me, an all star panel to make sense of what we know right now. Straight out to Megan Palin, senior journalist from the New York Post, who has been all over this. I mean, really now everybody here in the studio is piping up that it only costs $5,000 to soundproof a dungeon. I don't know where they have that knowledge. But that said, this guy, I wouldn't call just a money manager, would you? Because he's. He's worth millions and millions of dollars. I don't mean one or two million dollars. I mean multi millions of dollars. And this has been going on for a long time. Why has it just been uncovered? But let's just start at the beginning. Who is this guy?
- [04:22]
D
Howard Rubin. He grew up in Massachusetts. He's got a chemical engineering degree. He was very successful on Wall street once. He moved in originally as trader and then kind of climbed his way up through the ranks from there and ended up becoming so successful, at least financially. And he moved around in philanthropic circles. He was well known for donating hundreds of.
- [04:48]
A
Wait, put her up. Put her up. Megan Palin. You just said he, quote, moved around in philanthropic circles. You mean he was a benefactor. He gave a lot of money away. And everybody thinks, oh, Howard Rubens is great guy that cares about the needy. Bs. According to police, Megan, he is strapping women to the holy cross. You know, I don't know how you feel about that. And other apparatus. And then electrocuting them in their genitals with an electric cattle prod. Now, see, that's what gets my attention. Not his fake philanthropy, of course.
- [05:35]
D
And absolutely it's what he was known for prior to. While he was obviously hiding or it was a well kept secret in terms of publicly this extremely sadistic, dark, horrid side of himself, which is now. I mean, the claims first came out about 10 years ago, so he has been known for these things for some time now. But this is sort of.
- [05:58]
A
Wait, wait, wait, wait again, I'm sorry to interrupt, but Megan, did you say that this was. This was like an open secret? Everyone knew what was happening years ago.
- [06:08]
D
When the first civil suit was filed in 2017. Yes, that's when it all first sort of coming. He started coming undone.
- [06:15]
A
Okay. First civil suit was over was about 10 years ago. Okay. Joining me right now is a renowned criminal defense attorney, a veteran trial lawyer, founder of Rubin Law. No, religious. I assume Danny Rubin is joining us out of la. Danny, before you put on your defense hat and start arguing with me, can I just talk about the duality here? The duality of going to these, you know, $10,000 a plate, philanthropic events, dinners where rich people walk around sniffing of each other. And it's a scene. It's a scene like a nightclub scene. Or, you know, just any scene. The same people go over and over and over. And I'm glad they do because they do wonderful things for the needy. But the facade that he has created of this benefactor. While all the time the word is he's torturing women in a sex dungeon after luring them there. Just that duality, you know, you tell that to a jury, it's like putting a nun up for the defense. Of course they're going to believe her.
- [07:32]
E
I mean, I think that the duality is important. I agree with you. On the one hand, it might be a mask to what's going on elsewhere. On the other, he might actually care about certain things that he's donating to. But I do want to say that these things are alleged right now. They're not a given. They're not proven. And he's innocent until proven guilty. I think we have a lot more to get into. Before we can start casting judgment on whether or not Reuben did or didn't.
- [08:02]
A
Reuben, anybody watching crime stories knows about the presumption of innocence. And as predicted, you only gave the first portion of that charge to the jury on presumption of innocence. And I believe you will agree with me that the actual charge is that the defendant is presumed innocent. I would like to see him, please. That's not him. The charge is to the jury that the defendant is presumed innocent. Unless and until the state pierces and overcomes that presumption. With evidence proving guilt beyond a reasonable doubt. You always seem to kind of like leave off the last half of that sentence. Regarding presumption of innocence. Reuben is presumed innocent. He is innocent tonight. Unless and until the state pierces the presumption of innocence. With evidence beyond a reasonable doubt. Would you agree that that is the judicial charge?
- [09:11]
E
I agree that that's the charge. But all we have right now, as the public, is the indictment and whatever's in the civil suit. I personally am looking forward to what. What transpires in this case. I want to see what the alleged witnesses have to say. A grand jury's heard it. I would like to hear it. I think the public should hear it. And I think as we get closer to trial date in this. If it does ever go to trial, we'll start to hear more and more about the evidence.
- [09:36]
A
Danny Rubin, another question to you. And again, this is neither defense or state or. It's like a horrible deja vu. It's Happening all over again. We just saw this with Sean Combs. We saw it with R. Kelly. We saw it with Epstein over and over and over. Where, as you just heard, Megan Palin with the New York Post state that there was a civil suit alleging the same things in 2017. Where's the government? Where are they? Why has it taken them seven years to bring this case to a criminal trial? I have a problem with that. What have they been doing?
- [10:21]
E
I think what they were waiting for was the trial that took place, I believe in 2022 or 2023. They wanted to see what testimony came out. I think that Howard testified in that case both at his deposition and then at trial. They want to make sure that they have a slam dunk case, considering they have an egg on their face from the Diddy case. I know that. I mean, we all know that didn't go the way that the AUSA's office wanted it to go. Getting, you know, four years and change is not the. Was not the goal of the office. So I think now they're bringing this case and they want to make sure they have it ironclad. I can't promise you they do. No one really knows that yet, but again, as more evidence comes out, we'll see how well cooked this case is.
- [11:06]
A
Guys, this guy with every advantage still charged with major major offenses, sex offenses and more. Who is this guy? Listen.
- [11:18]
B
Reuben is accused of luring victims first in luxury Manhattan hotels and later his $18,000 per month penthouse apartment equipped with a soundproof sex dungeon. Women were bound on a bed or a cross, then bed beaten and electrocuted while they were provided with a safe word. The pleas of those who weren't gagged went ignored, and the torture often continued, even when a woman fell unconscious. Reuben allegedly paid the women several thousand dollars afterwards, including for injuries that required medical attention like a flipped breast implant.
- [11:51]
A
Okay, that sounds really painful. A flipped breast implant. It goes so much further than that. Lynn Shaw, joining me, founder and director of Lynn's Warriors Network, dedicated to the eradication of sexploitation of women and sex trafficking. And let me remind you, it is a nonprofit. She's certainly not doing it for the money. How is it that these multimillionaires mingle at, for instance, charity functions for 10, $20,000 a plate, for Pete's sake, And nobody will call them on their bad behavior? And we see it over and over again. There's Diddy, we pointed out. There's Rainier with nxvim. There is Epstein. There is R. Kelly, There's Jared Fogle. I mean, I could just list them off the top of my head on and on and on. Rich or famous people that get away with this, and it's in your backyard. Lynn Shaw. What? You may have brushed elbows with this guy.
- [12:56]
F
I am living in the devil's playground. This building is around the corner for me, and it has tighter security than Fort Knox. Diddy was arrested directly across the street. Epstein was a neighbor. I ask you, where has everybody been? What is going on? Who was complicit with this? This Jennifer Powers and this Howard Rubin. And I'm not giving him a cute nickname, because I am disgusted in the name of all of the victims. How was this allowed to go on for so long? How did, for instance, doormen and medical professionals and other people? Wasn't just these two doing all this, not 10, you know, not see things with these women? And yes, in New York, they just seem to float because, you know, what happens in New York happens in other places, too. Money talks. That's all people care about. Money. Or taking a picture with somebody of wealth and floating around town and showing up at events. But you know what? People knew. People knew because we started hearing a lot of whispers two to three years ago about this. And we also heard that women were warning other women, do not, no matter how much money is thrown at you, do not go and visit with this guy. As they put it to me, do not get near this guy. So I ask everybody, again, we're on repeat. Let's talk about the victims. Let's talk about who's helping them, and let's talk about why the justice system is taking so long to do anything about all of these cases. I mean, who's next? I expect tomorrow another case to pop up in my neighborhood.
- [14:26]
A
Okay? This has been going on for years. Speaking of the perfect facade and this guy's philanthropic work, his charity work, and how many dollars he gave away to the needy, how many fancy galas he went to. What were the feds and the local authorities, L.A. law enforcement, my people blinded by his money and his local fame. I'm not blinded. Here is part of his facade.
- [14:57]
B
Rubin becomes a Wall street commodity while he trades bonds at Salomon Brothers. Rubin profiled in Michael Lewis Book Liars Poker for his contributions to the collateralized mortgage obligation market. Rubin goes on to hold senior positions at Merrill Lynch, Bear Stearns and Soros Fund Management. Mary's fellow financier Mary Henry. And the couple is very active in the NYC philanthropy scene. After three children and 36 years of marriage. Henry divorces her husband when he is of sexual violence. Howard Rubin and his former assistant, Jennifer Powers have allegedly been trafficking and transporting at least half a dozen women across state lines for a decade. Most of these women were former Playboy models.
- [15:40]
A
These women, educated, beautiful, many of them models. And he would act like he's taking them out on a date. We've spoken to restaurant employees, employees that stayed. Oh, here comes Ruben. Here comes horrible Howie, who had always had these beautiful, statuesque women with him. They would charge like hundreds and hundreds, even thousands of dollars. Dinners. And then he would take them up to his penthouse. I don't know where his wife was during all of this. And we're showing you this because many of them were models after this. It ruined their careers. That is when they would be lured into his soundproof sex dungeon. One thing that is perplexing me is a woman named Jennifer Powers. Jennifer Powers, his personal. Yes, her personal assistant. How does she fit into this? Listen.
- [16:37]
B
Reuben tasked Jennifer Powers, his personal assistant, with recruiting victims. Powers is arrested at her home in a Dallas Fort Worth suburb, accused of running the day to day operations of Rubin's sex trafficking scheme and being paid handsomely. Powers arranged the victim's travel and coerced them into signing NDAs that were later used to threaten legal consequences and public shame. Powers oversaw the victim's payments, distributing funds from Rubin in amounts up to $10,000 per session.
- [17:04]
A
An NDA non disclosure agreement. You've heard of those? That's where you get someone to sign away, usually in exchange for something. The ability to ever discuss what they have witnessed. Okay, who is Jennifer Powers? The devil's minion, according to prosecutors. Megan Palin joining us from the New York Post. Megan, who is Powers?
- [17:30]
D
Powers started out as Reuben's personal assistant in 2011 and according to the indictment, quickly became basically his aide for this alleged sex trafficking scheme.
- [17:43]
A
This guy, Howard Rubin. It's just amazing to me too. Danny Rubin. No relation, I hope. He had everything going for him. He graduates with a degree in engineering. That's not easy. From Lafayette College, then goes on and gets his MBA at Harvard. I'm sure Harvard is so proud Tonight, yet another one of their MBA grads has gone on, gone on to greatness. He had everything going for him. How did he degenerate into this? You know, very often we see criminal defendants that, let's just say, are dope dealers. No education, rap sheet as long as your arm, starting in juvenile court. This guy was pristine. He had a choice not to do this. Reuben.
- [18:36]
E
Yeah, I mean, Honestly, everyone's actions are their own. But first and foremost, let me just say.
- [18:42]
A
Wait, that's what you've got to say? Everyone's actions are their own? Please, Reuben, tell me something I don't know. I'm talking about someone with so much advantage. A silver spoon stuck down their mouth at birth. They've got it all, yet they resort to a life of crime. Horrible crime. This isn't a t. Bit f. By taking. This is not a $5 crack kit. This is violent crime on women where he would beat them in their face and their breasts. That's how that breast implant got flipped. That didn't just happen. I mean, how do you go from having it all to this?
- [19:25]
E
Well, there are two ways I look at this. The first, is he doing this of his own volition? Is it actually his own conduct? Or is it the product of mental health issue as Megan talked about earlier?
- [19:38]
A
Please let me see him say this. Okay, you are. You do have a straight face. This is a Harvard MBA worth millions and millions of dollars. Near $40 million. He had the sense to call and say, hey, can you soundproof my sex dungeon so I can torture flight attendants? Really? And you're saying there's a minimum. What are you saying?
- [20:03]
E
Saying it's possible, I think, that we can't rule that out until someone takes a look at them and says, okay, well, what's the issue? There's certainly a divide and certainly something antisocial. If what's said in the complaint is true, if someone is actually responding, that's.
- [20:15]
A
Not a mental illness. To hurt that antisocial. Okay, What? That's not a mental illness. Antisocial is. But you're saying mental illness and you're throwing in antisocial like that's misleading people to think that is a mental illness. Ruben, it's not.
- [20:31]
E
My point is that maybe I misspoke by saying antisocial. What I mean is that it's not normal. Normal people aren't making sex dungeons. Normal people aren't torturing other people. Just not done. So the question is, like you said before, why? Is it because he had the privilege or because there's something else that's a little bit deeper? Maybe it's both. But I think that.
- [20:51]
A
Are you suggesting the state has to prove motive? You said that's why. It's really not. State doesn't have to prove that. You do know I'm a trial lawyer, right? You can't just throw that out there and pretend and think I'm not going to hear it.
- [21:04]
E
Oh, I just think it's going to be mitigative. I think that if there is an issue of mental health, of mental health, it may come up later at sentencing. But I think the question is, I would owe it to a client is to figure out why this actually happened and at least get them assessed. And like I said before, this is entirely abnormal behavior. If what's in the complaint is True.
- [21:30]
A
Crime Stories with Nancy Grace, my place. I want to look at those law books he's got behind him. See all those law books behind you, Ruben? I bet you can't find one law book, one case that was actually affirmed on Peel that says antisocial behavior equals mental defect or not normal, as you put it, equals a mental illness. That's not going to happen. Can you point to one of those books behind you and show me one case that was affirmed where that actually worked? Yes, I know we've got the Twinkie defense, we've got the premenstrual defense, we've got the temporary insanity defense. All of those are legit. They've actually worked in court. But not normal or antisocial behavior has not worked as a mental defect.
- [22:24]
E
No, I completely agree with you. What I meant, what I'm trying to say is that it's mitigated. I think that if there is, let's say, a conviction down the line, certainly that's going to factor into sentencing. And I think that if you do have some sort of mental health issue, the question is going to be does it actually. Is it sufficient enough that he didn't understand what he was doing was wrong at the time? I don't necessarily think you'd get there without sufficient evidence.
- [22:52]
A
Why do you think it was a sex chamber? It's a secret. Because he knew he had to hide it. Because he knows that beating women in their breasts is wrong. Okay, you know what? I have mined this film.
- [23:09]
G
It starts like any other night. The glass of red, the cozy blanket. Then the drop. The stain so dark, so stubborn, it might as well have been a crime scene. But this isn't your average couch. This is Anna Bay. Fully washable, unspeakably comfortable and ready for whatever your life, your kids or your ex throws ahead it. And here's the kicker. Starting at just 699, you can make sure your sofa isn't part of the problem. Fully washable, stain resistant, and built to hide even the darkest defenses. Right now get up to 60% off because no one should have to live with a stain that won't quit. Annabe, the only Mystery. You won't be losing sleep over shop washablesofas.com today. That's washablesofas.com I've exhausted it.
- [24:10]
A
I'm going to let Danny Rubin think about what he just said. Dr. Bethany Marshall, help me out. This guy did so much to conceal his behavior. And as I don't know, Reuben might come up with a case that actually says differently. But I don't think so. Evidence before, during and after. And an event, a crime can be shown to a jury. Why? What matters before and after the crime? Intent, course of conduct, frame of mind, motive. That shows. For instance, if you flee the scene, it shows, hey, I gotta get out of here. I know I just killed somebody or I just committed a crime. Keeping his sex dungeon secretive to me would be evidence of knowledge of guilt. But could you. You gotta hand it to Reuben, all right? He wins a lot of cases. And he said all that with a straight face. And I would say a good 50% of it was true.
- [25:12]
C
Well, he said that Reuben had a site like a mental health defect.
- [25:15]
F
He didn't.
- [25:16]
C
That would be schizophrenia, Bipolar, something like that. He wouldn't have got through Harvard with a psychiatric disorder.
- [25:25]
A
He.
- [25:25]
C
Now, Ruben did say antisocial, which is a fancy word for sociopath. So we could hold that in the back of our minds. Sociopaths relate to others through cruelty and.
- [25:35]
A
Power and all that's still not a mental illness.
- [25:37]
C
It is not a mental illness. It's just a personality disorder. Nancy, let's be clear. Ruben could only get an erection by beating women up. That's it. Torturing them. In reality, in the real world, he's a little man with a huge compulsion. He goes to these philanthropic events so he can mine for victims. People who are sociopathic. And I'm not sure, I've never seen him. But they want to associate with high network individuals. Because they can get something from them. It makes them feel powerful. It makes them feel big. And this is what he wanted to feel with his victims. Now, Nancy, he was very manipulative, okay? He offered them money. He would take them to these fancy dinners. And he used the term bd, psm. As if this was like a consensual relationship with somebody tying another person up and then giving them a safe word. And when that person says the safe word, you know, you release the ropes. This was not that. This was a torture chamber dressed up as something different. And one final thought, Nancy. Sociopaths wear something that we call the mask of sanity. Meaning they know that they're different. From other people in society. So they learn to move and act in a way that appears normal so they can compensate for their defects when in fact, this guy had a compulsion that was organizing his entire life.
- [27:08]
A
Bethany, please don't say defect anymore as it relates to Howard Rubin, because Dan, Danny Rubin will hear that and he will run with it claiming there's some kind of mental defect. Yeah, I forgot, Ruben. I forgot to throw in about him graduating from Harvard. Good luck trying to claim mental defect. You know, you're bringing to mind Brian Kohberger. I hate to even say his name. And his attempt to claim he had some kind of mental defect because he. Let's see. There were so many things he tried. He tried that he was under the same spectrum. Ocd. Oh, at the end, it was sad. He was even claiming Danny. He was even claiming that he had an eating disorder, as if that somehow justified what he did, or it should be a mitigating factor in sentencing. In the end, it worked out pretty well for him because he had a really weak prosecutor that kind of let him off the hook. But, Bethany, please don't say defect again, because Reuben of the Danny variety will run with it like a dog in a bone. Dan Murphy, former NYPD Detective sergeant, Joint Terrorism Task Force, former chief security officer, US Bancorp and star of Gold Shields podcast. Also author. Dan, usually I agree with you, but I'd like to point out that this is right down the street. Street from you and everybody else knew what was going on since there was a civil suit back in 2017, but nobody in Le Law Enforcement did anything. Why? Was he giving too much to the police fund?
- [28:52]
H
I wish I knew. I wish I knew why no one did anything. Maybe. Maybe no one had come forward and filed a formal complaint other than the civil one. And as oddly as that sounds, there's a bureaucratic process to filing police reports, to getting investigation. Perhaps that was the case. Perhaps someone looked into it and they decided they needed more. Sometimes these investigations take a long time to tie this up. 1. This one up, right? You're going to want to make sure you have credible witnesses. You're going to want to make sure that you have corroborative evidence. And you're going to want to make sure you have somebody. Somebody flipping and giving this person up. I would look to have tape recorded conversations with him where he discusses this sort of thing. I'd look to collect texts and emails and anything else I could that can corroborate the stories being told by these victims. And maybe that was going on I don't know. But I can tell you that the people I worked with in law enforcement, if we had learned about this, there would have been a case assistant.
- [29:45]
B
Jennifer Powers would handle the operations, logistics, recruiting and booking the women's flights, managing payments, restocking his dungeon, and getting the women to sign NDAs. Rubin apparently spending over $1 million to fund the enterprise.
- [30:01]
A
At what point do you look up and say, why am I restocking a torture chamber? I really didn't imagine as a little girl that I would grow up restocking a torture chamber. Who is this woman you just heard Dan Murphy from Gold Shields podcast. Former NYPD Detective sergeant that Dan Murphy talking about. When was the first police report filed? Because cops can't just go forward when nobody has made a complaint. Even though there was a 2017 civil lawsuit laying all of this out, right now, the Fed's actually asking for victims to come forward, much as they did in the Sean Combs case. But I want to get to Jennifer Powers because I find it very odd that she went along lockstep with all of these crimes. According to police. Listen.
- [30:55]
B
For more than 10 years, Powers entire life funded by financier your boss, Howard Rubin, down to her itunes account. Reuben's funding kicks in in 2012, allowing Powers to afford a 1966 convertible Lincoln Continental as a wedding gift to her husband. The couple takes lavish vacations in following years. When their children are old enough to attend school. Reuben bankrolls private educations and even a mortgage for a home in the wealthy South Lake suburb for Powers.
- [31:21]
A
Holy moly. Okay, wait. He paid for 11 wedding convertible Lincoln Continental vintage, pays for a children's private school and the mortgage for their home in a ritzy suburb in South Lake. Okay, you know what? It took criminal investigators a long time to finally try and and bring this guy down. But guess who is about 3 inches up their tailpipe when criminal prosecutions fail, the taxman does the cleanup. Listen.
- [32:07]
B
Despite Powers working part time as a substitute teacher in Carroll ISD and her DJ husband reporting just $40,000 in income since 2018, the family pays off $500,000 in credit card bills, lives in a home valued at $1.7 million. The children attend private school, and they take luxurious family vacations. The IRS finds the powers failed to report nearly $9 million in income received from Howard Rubin, Jennifer Powers, former boss. The couple is charged with tax fraud for which neither have made a first appearance.
- [32:40]
A
Ruh Roh. What happened? Megan Palin. I mean, if the local authorities, L.A. law enforcement won't lift a finger, the taxman will. Right, okay, what is this all about?
- [32:53]
D
Look, they've been living a life of luxury, by all accounts, for many years. Social media posts have emerged from Jennifer Powers that show them on all of these sort of luxury holidays all around the world. And they had, I think it was nearly $9 million in total given to them by Reuben. So for her, she's obviously benefited greatly from this partnership.
- [33:18]
A
Guys, this would not be the first time the tax man did the dirty work for law enforcement. I'm sorry to say that. Right to your face. Dan Murphy, former NYPD Detective Sergeant, Joint Terrorism Task Force. It goes on and on and on. I mean, you've heard of Al Capone, right, Murphy? Al Capone, the head of the mob. Him. Right. And you've probably heard of Wesley Snipes, the famous actor. MC Hammer, Remember the Hammer? It goes on. Willie Nelson, Pete Rose, Martha Stewart, all of them. All of them got into a tangle with the taxman. Danny Rubin was. When Ellie won't lift a finger and won't go forward, the IRS will. And you better run like you see the Grim Reaper outside your living room window just staring at you. Oh, yeah, and I'm not talking about, hey, you have to pay us back. They will put you in jail and you will rot in there.
- [34:30]
E
That is 100% right. And let me tell you, it is very clear that I am that anyone should respect and fear the irs. Everyone should report their taxes as they should. In fact, make sure you do it right. Make sure you do it often. They are merciless. And many times, as you said before, they brought down Al Capone. When Eliot Ness couldn't bring down Al Capone, when they couldn't find anything on him, the IRS did, and they got him for tax evasion and put him in Alcatraz. So it is a very stupid person who does not respect the irs.
- [35:03]
A
Man, I'm telling you, like I said, Grim Reaper looking in your kitchen window. You try to make some coffee, there they are staring at you. Don't do it. You know, I want to get to the phenomena. And I've seen it before, Danny Rubin, and I'm sure you have, too, where you have a thug in this case, Reuben Howard Rubin, AKA Horrible Howie. But then why would someone go along with his crimes? I'm talking about Powers. Why would she go along with it? I mean, she has everything. She's got this husband, this home, these children, for Pete's sake, what, risk all of that just for money? Hell, no. Why?
- [35:50]
E
I mean, it's it's probably a number of things. Again, assuming everything in the complaint is true, we're talking about an access to not just money, but a lot of money. $9 million is a lot of money. And you're hobnobbing with people who are of very high social status and very high wealth individuals. I mean, you don't just get that access from anyone. And being part of that world can change you. Being part of that world gets you access to things you wouldn't normally get. And sometimes if you're asked to do something distasteful, maybe it's that access which keeps you coming back. And eventually you become dependent on it. You start going on, let's say vacations or private school or whatever, and you start to get those golden handcuffs where now you're roped in. And as you do things over time, potentially it doesn't seem as bad as it was yesterday or the day before. And tomorrow's going to be a little better. As you get more and more accustomed to can be warping to your personality.
- [36:51]
A
Dr. Bethany Marshall is living high on the hog, having all the luxury trips, the beautiful home, vintage convertible car, the private schools, all that. Is it like an addiction?
- [37:04]
C
No, I think the money is only a small part of it. I think in every organization, usually these kinds of criminal enterprises, there is a woman somewhere who is willing to abuse other women. Look, we saw it with Galen Maxwell, with the Jeffrey Epstein case. What about the FLDS cult where there were women within that organization's support oppressing other women. So I would believe that, I would guess that Jennifer Powers has in her very personality or her character the capacity for great cruelty towards other people. Otherwise she wouldn't do this. She seems very bright and like she could have made money other ways, get a job, you know, for God's sake. But she must feel and take some secret satisfaction in women being punished, tortured, electrocuted, and then texting this guy Ruben back and forth about it. So when women act in concert with a man to abuse other people, it is always Nancy, because they are taking some pleasure and satisfaction from it. Beyond the monetary gain, that's just the icing on the cake. But they are sadists themselves, guys.
- [38:21]
A
It's not just doing his bidding. When you see their text messages back and forth between each other, it's sick.
- [38:32]
B
Listen, in text messages, Ruben shares horrifying details of his exploits with Powers. In casual conversation, Powers asks for details. When Reuben says he used the cross in his last session. I can only imagine what you did to her on that cross. Did you shock her? Reuben responds with a complaint that his cattle prod isn't as strong as it used to be.
- [38:53]
A
Lynn Shaw. This is the type of conversation that I would expect from a pimp talking to another pimp about how some of the Johns torture the women or the girls. This is a guy in your neighborhood that attends all of these glitzy galas raising money. Yeah, him for the needy. A multimillionaire Harvard grad and his hench person, the Beelzebub to his Satan. They're laughing about shocking ladies genitals with a shock device after forcing her, binding her to a cross.
- [39:38]
F
Listen to what we're talking about. Jennifer Powers. Do you know how disappointing and horrific she is? A woman doing this to other women? All of the cases I can think of, I'm sitting here trying to think in my mind there's now a woman involved. They're doing all the dirty work and this woman is laughing about all of this and taking joy. And I agree 1000% with Dr. Bethany. She really nailed it. There's something wrong with this woman. And my goodness, couldn't she even think of her children and clean it up and get out of this or not do it at all? But here's the thing. This is why we have women who don't want to come forward, girls who don't want to come forward. They see another woman does this and they're seeing again that dynamic of power, wealth, and they're seeing it wasted on this. And this is why we can't get them to come into court to testify. It's falling apart. This is another case, another example. And again, a woman doing this to another woman, I can't imagine. This is just not exploitation. This is morally corrupt. This is evil. Evil happening. And you know what? I'm just going to throw this in. A friend of mine in real estate said there's a big demand lately. She told me this about three months ago for these sex dungeons in people's apartments here in New York. How horrific is this that people are normalizing and becoming habituated to these terrorist acts?
- [40:57]
A
Horrific on women. The majority of the victims are women. To Sydney Sumner, joining me, Crime Stories, investigative reporter. In other text messages, Sidney Sumner. Isn't it true that this hench person, Powers, Jennifer Powers, speaks freely even in writing, in text messages and recorded conversations. Conversations. For instance, I don't care if she screams next to a laughing face emoji words like this will be fun. Exclamation, exclamation. Another. She hates the myth. She's so desperate, we've got to make her cry. Stating that they will give the victim, quote, plenty of Valium so she can endure more pain. Repeat, we've got to make her cry. That's part of the state's evidence, is it not, Sidney Sumner? Absolutely. And not only were these conversations over text message, but on Ruben's work email, discussing what was happening in that sex dungeon. So these text messages, evidence that Reuben was just so brutal, he enjoyed the women's pain.
- [42:17]
C
It was a horrible situation. And Rubin and Powers are just talking.
- [42:23]
A
About it casually over text, laughing about the victim's pain. Danny Rubin, the defense has a big problem when these text messages come out with the laughing face emoji beside their plans. Have you read this indictment? According to the state, the defendant, Howard Rubin, would conduct sex sessions. I say felonies, multiple times a week, sometimes on consecutive days, one after the next, after the next. Where was the wife? Did she not notice anything weird was happening? It goes on and on and on. But when you have your client, Danny, using work email to plan a crime, they're basically up, let me just say, creek without a paddle. They wrote it down, Danny, on the work email.
- [43:20]
E
Yeah, that's, that's not a great fact. I think what they're going to want to focus on is whether or not the acts were consented to. And I know, I know how the. The complaint reads. I know that there's a civil case, but just because some. And part of it is they're going to want to introduce the NDAs, they're going to want to introduce the fact that there's a presumption of consent. Of course you can revoke consent at any time. Many of the women in the complaint said that they did. But they're going to want to show that there was consent and that it was not revoked, the consent was properly obtained, and that this, this after discussion about what had occurred is going to be tangential to that consent.
- [44:01]
A
Consent.
- [44:09]
G
It starts like any other night. The glass of red, the cozy blanket. Then the drop. The stain so dark, so stubborn, it might as well have been a crime scene. But this isn't your average couch. This is Anna Bay. Fully washable, unspeakably comfortable, and ready for whatever your life, your kids or your ex throws at it. And here's the kicker. Starting at just 699, you can make sure your sofa isn't part of the problem. Fully washable, stain resistant, and built to hide even the darkest defenses. Right now, get up to 60% off, because no one should have to live with a stain that won't quit. Anna Bay. The only mystery you won't be losing sleep over shop. Washablesofas.com today, that's washablesofas.com.
- [45:09]
A
Crime stories with Nancy Grace, Dan Murphy. These women, many of them consented to a date. They did not know that they were were going to be handcuffed to a cross in a dungeon and be shocked with a cattle prod all over their body to where they were screaming if they could, because many of them were gagged, according to court documents. They couldn't even scream. They would be passed out. They would be drugged. It's just. How can you consent to that? How can you consent to a crime?
- [45:49]
H
You can't in a case like this. These people were absolutely sold a bill of goods that turned out to be completely and sadly incorrect. He's a manipulator. He's a liar. He knows how to get people to do what he wants them to do. He knows how to keep it secret. He knows how to pay people off. He knows how to do all the things we've seen now in the Diddy case, the Epstein case, and who knows how many more cases like this out there. Money talks as well as persuasion. Manipulating people is something these people do very, very well. And in this case they did that. But it fell apart, as they all do at some point. It falls apart. Now in this case, these poor women, they went up there thinking it was going to be a date, maybe they were going to make a few bucks, whatever. They had no idea what they were going getting themselves into. And that is a very, very scary thing. And I can imagine that the wealth and power of this individual and his world scared them into silence for a long time.
- [46:45]
B
If you embarrass me in this photo.
- [46:47]
A
I'm not embarrassing you. It's just that I don't. I don't feel comfortable.
- [46:50]
E
Honey, don't have a fight with me, please. I'm not gonna do anything, I swear.
- [46:55]
B
My children, please come in on everything. I'm a famous guy.
- [46:58]
A
I'm feeling very uncomfortable right now.
- [47:00]
B
Please come in now and one minute. And if you want to leave when the guy comes with my jacket.
- [47:05]
A
Yesterday you touched my waist. Oh, please. I'm sorry. Just come on.
- [47:08]
B
I'm used to that.
- [47:10]
A
You're used to that? Yes, come in. That was another all time a hole. That was Harvey Weinstein and he was threatening and coercing Ambra Battaliona into sex acts, unwanted sex acts. And the same techniques were used to Megan Palin joining us from the incredible New York Post. Megan, the defense there and the defense here is that these women agreed to what was happening and then had second thoughts when it was over or it went too far. Bottom line, that they essentially consented to the acts. Apparently finally L A law enforcement wake up, came out of their trance and started investigating this case and its file charges. They apparently disagree with that theory of consent.
- [48:15]
D
Well, I mean it's, it's pretty obvious that things changed once they got there because even after the case, once they left the sex dungeon, there's text messages that have come out that show that these women were texting Jennifer Powers and explaining that their injuries were so severe to various degrees and she was responding, telling them to ice them, to deal with them in other such ways. These were all sort of like it appears to be part of the management at the aftermath of things that they certainly weren't expecting to get out of it when they entered this apartment, which by the way, I know you mentioned earlier that you'd wondered where his wife had been. This penthouse was not his residential property. It was leased for $18,000 a month specifically for these sexual escapades that he was having there.
- [49:07]
A
Megan, I'm curious. You were describing how Powers, the hench person, the secretary, as you said, managed the victims. What were their injuries that we know of?
- [49:21]
D
Well, I mean the most severe one that we've heard of so far was the breast implant that was flipped upside down because she'd been beaten so hard by Reuben with a closed fist that it had physically switched sides within her body and then later required surgery. Others were talking about bruising and pain to their bodies and whatnot to the full extent of the injuries we haven't heard yet. I guess that's all going to come out at some stage, but they were severe from the details that we have heard so far, particularly the breast implant.
- [49:54]
A
One to Dr. Bethany Marshall, I know you just heard our friend Megan Palin from the New York Post. To beat a lady in her breasts so violently it flips the implant. How does anyone derive pleasure out of that?
- [50:16]
C
Nancy, this is what we call a of piece perversion. And in specifically this is sexual sadism where watching the humiliation, the suffering and the fear of the victim causes the perpetrator to become sexually aroused. Now what's interesting is that men with sexual sadism, they have a very hard time becoming aroused in normal ways with normal women out in the world. So if they were having lunch date or in a business meeting or something where they're, where it's an equal playing field with other women. This guy would have lost interest in those women. He can't deal with real people with thoughts, feelings and emotions of their own. But there is some theory that when the, that aggression and sexuality is processed through the same part of the brain. And in brain scans with these kinds of perpetrators, the amygdala lights up the aggression center of the brain, the part of the brain that's responsible for sexual pleasure also lights up. So these two things are kind of fused and confused. Aggression, arousal, those two things go together in this disorder. And also it's a compulsion. People with compulsions, as I said earlier, they organize their entire life around the compulsion. So everything you look at that he did, even getting married and having children, that might have just been a way to cover up his sexual deviancy so he could pass as normal in society.
- [51:48]
A
Danny Rubin, veteran trial lawyer out of la. I got a question for you. It's a personal question. When you're representing people such as Howard Rubin and you're sitting there beside them, do you ever get totally disgusted, totally skeeved out, and just want to. Like right now, even talking about this, I just want to get up and run out of the studio screaming as if I'd seen a monster. It's just, how do you do it? How do you quell those thoughts, that aversion and keep a straight face and keep doing it? Because that's your duty as a defense lawyer to the utmost of your ability to save your client. How do you deal with that?
- [52:36]
E
I look at all the facts. First and foremost. I don't judge clients as to what happened. That's, that's obviously, if you, if you have to do that and you do that, you're. You have no business being a defense attorney. The fact is, I look at the facts, I look at the documents, I look at what they say, and I look at what the testimony shows. And I. And I want to determine what, if anything, our defenses are and then what the prosecution has to prove. It's the prosecution's job to get in there and make their case. And if they can make their case, my job is exceedingly difficult. That's true. And again, it's up to them. When I sit next to a client and a client is accused of this, I look at it just like that. He is accused, he is not guilty. He has not done these things until a jury of our peers says that he has. And it is my job to take a look at that evidence, to present the evidence to the jury and the jury can make the decision based on the evidence that they have.
- [53:34]
A
Okay, Reuben, I'm convinced. Whenever I'm accused of torturing people in my sex dungeon, I will definitely hire you. All right. I don't know what that says about you, but okay, I'm sold. Guys. If you know or think you know anything regarding this case, the Ellie attached to this case are asking for victims to come forward. Now, how they can do that after the Diddy debacle in court, I don't know. But I do know that Reuben will never be put away. He will never be convicted if victims do not come forward. That is Lynn Shaw's problem right now with Lynn's Warriors. After the Sean Combs verdict, women are afraid to speak out. And do you blame them? For those brave enough, the tip line is 212-384-3800. Repeat, 212-384-3800. If he is not stopped, according to police, it will happen again. We stop to remember an American hero. Senior Trooper Craig Gaines, Florida Highway Patrol, killed in the line of duty at after 27 years in leaving behind his grieving wife Rebecca and three children. American hero Senior trooper Craig Gaines. Nancy Grace, signing off. Goodbye, friend.
- [55:27]
E
When you're a pro, you got to.
- [55:28]
B
Do a little bit of everything.
- [55:30]
A
A little.
- [55:32]
E
A little, and even a little.
- [55:37]
B
And it helps to have something that.
- [55:38]
E
Works as hard as you. You do.
- [55:39]
B
That's why Valspar has durable, high coverage.
- [55:42]
E
Paint for every job, every time made.
- [55:45]
A
For more Valspar pros, head to Lowe's.
- [55:48]
B
Today and talk to a pro rep about saving time and money on your.
- [55:51]
E
Next job with Valspar.
- [55:53]
B
Signature paint exclusions apply.
- [55:54]
E
See valsparpro.com for details.
- [55:57]
A
This is an iHeart podcast.