Nancy Grace (2:31)

You know what? Let me see. Batista. Batista. You can only get just so far on charm and good looks, but you do have that going for you. So you say, this doesn't mean anything. I'm going to hear that again. And listen for this. Now you got the hot nanny. Their words, not mine. I did not call this a hot nanny love triangle. Oh, and look at that. Mouth full of red lipstick. That's a showstopper. Oh, and in every quote, candid picture. But wait for it. I want you to hear them. Do you. Do you think they're going instead of saying, she's breathing, she's breathing. Translation. Oh, my stars. She's still breathing. Why won't she die? Okay, listen, sir.

911 Operator (3:14)

Hello, ma', am, can you hear me? Okay, are you the one that was injured?

Nancy Grace (3:23)

She's not responding.

911 Operator (3:28)

Okay, can you tell me how. Can you tell me how her breathing is? She's still. She's heart's still beating.

Nancy Grace (3:37)

She's quite breathing.

911 Operator (3:39)

Okay, just keep applying pressure to where she's bleeding from and just put her on her side, okay?

Nancy Grace (3:43)

On your side?

911 Operator (3:44)

Yeah, on her side. You said she's breathing normally. She's just not responding to you.

Nancy Grace (3:52)

She's got a very big hole in her neck.

911 Operator (3:57)

Okay, just keep applying pressure. Okay, Just keep adding more pulses. Already there.

Nancy Grace (4:03)

Okay. I have to act this out. I hope, Dr. De la Torre, that you can see this. They're like, she's not responding. She's still breathing. That's a pretty big hole in her neck. That's what it sounds like to me, De la Torre.

Dr. John de la Torre (4:19)

It does. It sounds very stilted. Yeah, it sounds stilted. It sounds rehearsed. It sounds like this was always meant to be kind of a teleplay that they were always meant to say when. As soon as they got on the computer. As soon as they got on the phone. I think that the expectation is that if you really did stumble upon this scene and everything unfolded accurately, you'd be way more emotional than just kind of the robotic nature in which you're describing what you're seeing.

Nancy Grace (4:47)

I mean, you know, you heard Paul Batista, and I guess he's going to argue that to a jury with a straight face. And he's won a lot of cases. It apparently works. Let's listen to more of the 911 call.

911 Operator (4:58)

Who's the person? Where's the person that's bleeding? Are they. Where are they in the house?

Nancy Grace (5:03)

They're upstairs.

911 Operator (5:04)

Okay.

Nancy Grace (5:05)

In the bedroom.

911 Operator (5:08)

Okay. And where is the person that was shot? Are they also in the house? Downstairs?

Paul Batista (5:12)

Yes.

Dr. John de la Torre (5:12)

Yeah.

911 Operator (5:13)

This is the bed in the bedroom, too.

Nancy Grace (5:16)

Okay.

911 Operator (5:19)

Yeah, they're on the way. They're coming to you now. Lights and sirens.

Nancy Grace (5:21)

Okay.

911 Operator (5:22)

And any weapon is secured, Correct? Any weapon is secured. I have. I have. Okay, can you just leave it where it is?

Nancy Grace (5:31)

Yeah. Okay.

911 Operator (5:33)

You said you don't know the individual that that was shot.

Nancy Grace (5:41)

I'm not buying it. Okay, we're showing you interspersed shots of the hot nanny, My Glees. And we're showing you the wife, the debt. There's. There's the wife. She's so cute. Oh, my goodness, those lips. What is that? They just take over the whole picture. This is the nanny that without doubt. No question. Is having an affair with the IRS agent. That certainly hurts the IRS credibility. She is having an affair with the husband, the IRS agent. That's been proven. And Dr. De la Torre, before I go back to my observations of the 911. Oh, there you go. I'm glad she got that cleavage in. Can I see that shot again? Because I don't want to miss that. Oh, yeah. Okay. That is perfectly positioned. Okay. Not judging. Don't care. All I care about are the two dead bodies. But to Dr. De la Torre. Delatorre.

Dr. John de la Torre (6:43)

You know what?

Nancy Grace (6:44)

I'm going to let Gigi McKelvey tell you this. Joining me, Gigi McKelvey, investigative journalist, host, podcast, pretty Lies and Alibis. Gigi, could you tell Delatorre and Batista. Batista, listen, about the photos that were found. As soon as the wife is dead, when police go back, the hot nanny has already moved photos of her and her and the husband. Yeah, they went back on the side of the bed into the master bedroom. And her clothes are hanging in there.

Gigi McKelvey (7:19)

Including lingerie that they just showed, you know, to the jury. Yeah, I mean, there were loved up photos of them. Several of them placed in the master bedrooms where these murders occurred. Initially, they started out staying in her bedroom after the murders, but moved into what was Christine and Brendan's room. And not only slept in the same bed where she was killed. Put their photos everywhere. It's just. It blows my mind. Nancy, how could you lay your head down in that room knowing what you did in there?

Nancy Grace (7:52)

Okay, did you just say she moves in the loved up photos? Puts them aside the bed, moves in her lingerie, which has been shown to the jury. I couldn't be happier. But wait a minute. Sleeping in the same bed. Question, Paul Bautista. Were the sheets still warm from the dead wife?

Paul Batista (8:10)

Were the sheets still warm? At what point? There's no issue here. He was having an affair with his au pair. That does not constitute evidence that he murdered.

Nancy Grace (8:20)

It's not his au pair. She's not changing his diapers. It's the baby's au pair. Maybe she is changing his diapers. They did manage to commit the murder through a fetish website. So I don't know who's wearing diapers and who's dressed up like a cat and a dog. But I do know that these two. Hey, listen to this. Batista to you, Dr. De la Torre. And that second portion of the 911 call we just played. You know what? Let's hear that again. I want to see if the same Thing jumps out at you, let's hear it.

911 Operator (8:51)

Okay, who's the person? Where's the person that's bleeding? Are they, where are they in the house?

Nancy Grace (8:56)

They're upstairs in the bedroom.

911 Operator (9:01)

Okay, and where is the person that was shot? Are they also in the house? Downstairs? Yes, the bed in the bedroom. Okay, yeah, they're on the way. They're coming to you now. Lights and sirens.

Nancy Grace (9:15)

Okay.

911 Operator (9:15)

And any weapon is secured, Correct? Any weapon is secured. I have, I have, I have the weapon. Okay, can you just leave it where it is?

Nancy Grace (9:25)

Yeah.

Dr. Kendall Krans (9:26)

Okay.

911 Operator (9:27)

And you said you don't know the individual that, that was shot?

Nancy Grace (9:41)

Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.

911 Operator (9:46)

Where's the person that's bleeding? Are they, where are they in the house? They're upstairs. Okay.

Nancy Grace (9:53)

In the bedroom.

911 Operator (9:55)

Okay, and where is the person that was shot? Are they also in the house? Downstairs? Yes, in the bedroom too. Okay, yeah, they're on the way. They're coming to you now. Lights and sirens. Okay. And any weapon is secured. Correct again, any weapon is secured. I have, I have, I have the weapon. Okay, can you just leave it where it is?

Nancy Grace (10:19)

Yeah.

911 Operator (10:20)

Okay. And you said you don't know the individual that, that was shot?

Nancy Grace (10:24)

No, no.

911 Operator (10:25)

When I was thinking about.

Gigi McKelvey (10:28)

You know.

Nancy Grace (10:29)

How many times I would play this in front of the jury, I'd have this thing on loop. Dr. De la Torre, I'll kick it off. One thing that strikes me, number one, I would be screaming, my husband has a hole in his neck.

Sidney Sumner (10:46)

Hurry.

Nancy Grace (10:47)

I'm not hearing that. In fact, what I notice is the husband refers to his wife as they, they're upstairs. It makes me wonder, are he and the nanny, the so called hot nanny downstairs, and they've left the wife upstairs with a complete stranger that they lure to the home off a fetish website? According to the state, they, they, it's like, oh, yeah, they're upstairs. And then they go, have you secured the weapon? He doesn't say, yes, my gun is like, yeah, I've secured the weapon. And then they go, do you know the individual shot? And they say, no, it's his wife.

Dr. John de la Torre (11:30)

Yeah, listen again, it, it sounds like this was all something that they had been working on previously. This looked, this sounds like statements where they were rehearsing. And I think that goes to premeditation. I. These people weren't just, they, this wasn't something that just happened on a whim. This didn't happen because of crime of passion or whatever it is that we want to say. These two individual have been plotting for a very long time. And had already created this scenario in their minds and how it was going to be played out. The reason why they could move into the bedroom and have the lingerie and everything and all the pictures, the reason why that could happen was because the wife in their mind was already a non human obstacle. Right? The person that was going to come in who thought he was there for a specific reason, then ends up getting shot. That person was a non human obstacle that they needed to get in the way to get to this call, to set up their alibi.

Nancy Grace (12:28)

I'm, I'm looking at the transcript of this and I want to be clear because it's not really clear. Sidney Sudman joining me, Crime Stories, investigative reporter. It's not really clear what they're telling the 911 operator, but one victim, the stranger that according to police, they, the nanny and the IRS agent husband, they lured him to the home through a fetish website. There he is, he thinks he's just going for some gratuitous sex off a fetish website and he ends up dead. Okay? He's shot. The wife is stabbed. The wife is stabbed. It's not really clear on the 911 call. Sydney.

Sidney Sumner (13:11)

Right, so Christine is stabbed and they claim on this 911 call that the stranger that was shot, who is actually Joseph Ryan, is the one who stabbed Christine. She says they came into this room and Joseph Ryan is on top of Christine. She sees Brendan, screams for help and Brendan shoots Joseph Ryan who then falls off of Christine and she thinks she's been saved. This is an unimaginable situation. Your house has been broken into, someone is attacking you, they're wielding a knife, you're terrified and you think no one's home. And it's this miracle that your husband comes home and is managing to save you. But as Joseph Ryan falls off of Christine Banfield, Brendan climbs on top of her, uses the knife that he was holding and stabs her.

Nancy Grace (14:06)

It's so far fetched, the story that she's telling, but the grain of truth is that they colluded together to kill the wife so they could be together. I don't get why they just didn't get a divorce. He remains innocent until proven guilty in a court of law. Listen to more of the 911 call.

911 Operator (14:31)

And sir, where are you? Are you, are you taking care of the person upstairs? Okay, I have officers that are pulling up outside. Okay? So just make sure the weapon is put place where it is and it's secure and just keep applying pressure and make sure your door is Unlocked. Can we make sure that's done? All right.

Sidney Sumner (14:56)

All right.

911 Operator (14:57)

Okay.

Dr. Kendall Krans (15:01)

Okay.

Nancy Grace (15:11)

Okay.

911 Operator (15:12)

So make sure your weapon is down, sir. And now you're coming to the door with your hands up so the officers can see you. Okay?

Nancy Grace (15:22)

So, Gigi McKelvey joining us, investigative journalist and star. Pretty lies and alibis, we hear the nanny state. Yeah, I'm trying to help, but it's just, quote, so long. What is so long, Gigi?

Gigi McKelvey (15:39)

I think she's referring to the response time by first responders is all I can figure out with that. You know, it's a good thing they didn't go into acting, because they both stunk trying to convince this 911 operator this was a true emergency. But she did say a couple of times in that 911 call, what's taking so long? Or where are they? Or something to that effect. You know, probably just to give the impression that she is scared and really wants help there.

Nancy Grace (16:06)

You know, I took it a completely different way. I thought she meant that the knife wound to the neck was so long. But I think, Gigi, you're probably right. So I need to understand her story. Okay. And, of course, isn't this the way Paul Bautista. They're like two wet cats in a barrel. They both are under suspicion, and they're both now doing that, pointing the finger at each other. We see it at trial all the time. That's why I like to try people together. The only way to do that is, of course, don't use interlocking statements against the other. Right. There are ways to try them together. Constitutionally, that did not happen here, and I'm sure they have a reason why. But, Paul Bautista, this is just sop, Standard operating procedure. Blame the other one. So much for true love. Paul.

Paul Batista (17:04)

Nancy, this is one of the most preposterous stories of a cooperating witness I have ever heard in 40 years of doing this. It's intricate, it's bizarre, and it sounds like the concoction of a lady, meaning the au pair, who's been sitting in jail for a year, living a delusional life, and suddenly she wants to cooperate with the prosecutors, and she conveys this utterly, bizarrely intricate story. Not a credible witness.

Nancy Grace (17:42)

You stated that she's been sitting in jail for a year. Oh, my stars. What a difference 12 months can make. You've got to see the before. The. There's the before shot. There's the before. Take a look at her now. What about it, Batista?

Paul Batista (18:02)

You know, the prosecutors obviously dressed up this lady for her testimony to look Like a household servant. The picture of her entering the courtroom and speaking to the jury, of course, is entirely different from the sex pot picture taken God knows when. But before she went to jail, they're dressing her up to sound convincing, calm, remorseful. She's a puppet. She's making up a story.

Nancy Grace (18:37)

Paul Batista, you said that the state dressed her up. Oh, no, no, no, no, no. She hasn't been sentenced. Her own lawyers dressed her up like that for maximum dowdy effect. And I this trick. Let's see. Jodi Arias before and after, before she went to trial and her on the stand. Yeah, there you go. Okay, so to you, Dr. John de la Torre. You see with Jodi Arias, she's a blonde bombshell before she sees the jury. And then when she goes in front of the jury, she looks like Grandma Spinster. What, what message are these women trying to convey? Well, actually, they're defense lawyers.

Dr. John de la Torre (19:20)

Well, I think that change is exactly what you're trying to describe, which is to either mitigate their overall culpability and whatever it is that they have alleged to have done, or it's about making them seem like someone who is not capable of engaging in a problematic behavior. The more homely you look, the more matronly you look, the less likely a jury is to say that you engaged in murder, no matter what it is that you've been accused of doing. But the prior, those are all the things that you do as your own free, willing spirit, as the only, as the person that is trying to attract attention. But in the court photos, you're trying to look like someone who wouldn't be drawing that kind of attention or engaging in those kinds of behaviors.

Police Officer (20:03)

Fox county police officers responded to a 911 call from within the home. In an upstairs bedroom, we found Joseph Ryan deceased as a result of gunshot wounds and found Christine Banfield suffering from stab wounds. Christine was transported to a local hospital and pronounced dead. We recovered rather two firearms and a knife. This morning at 7:49am we received a cell phone 911 call that was an open line.

Dr. John de la Torre (20:35)

Hang up.

Police Officer (20:36)

That call was captured and noted. And 13 minutes later, at 8:02am, we received a cell phone 911 call from the very same cell phone. And two persons communicated with our 911 call taker. At that 802911 cell phone call, the husband and the au pair communicate with the 911 call taker. The husband tells the 911 call taker that he just shot a man inside of his home. And the husband tells the 911 call taker that the man who he had just shot had stabbed his wife.

Nancy Grace (21:13)

How did this loving, faithful wife end up stabbed dead in the family home? And then a complete stranger who happens to be a bondage and disciplined fetishist. What's he doing in the home? And he's dead.

Police Officer (21:29)

The first 911 call came from the what we now know to be the au pair cell phone. That 911 call call was an open mic. Nothing discernible on that call. It was a quick hang up. We noted that call 13 minutes later from the same 911. From the same cell phone. A 911 call was made. And on the phone was first the au pair communicating with us and then she apparently handed the phone to the husband. The husband communicated with us. And that's when the husband told us that he shot and killed a man inside of his home. And that's when the husband told us that the man who he shot and killed was stabbing his wife.

Nancy Grace (22:06)

Gigi McKelvey. Joining us, investigative journalist and star of Pretty Lies and Alibis. Gigi, in a nutshell, because this is very convoluted what happened, because I've got a hard time believing that a stranger comes over for fetish sex and murders the wife. He may have come over for sex, but I don't think he came over to commit a murder.

Gigi McKelvey (22:33)

He didn't. He was catfished. They. They used Christine's computer to set up an account on this FetLife website where like minded people meet up and do these kind of things. They only did it with Christine.

Nancy Grace (22:45)

Wait a minute, wait a minute. Look around, look around. Are you in a monastery? No, you're not. You're on Crime Stories. When you say people go to this website to do these kind of things. What kind of things? Bondage. That's what we're talking about. People like to tie each other up and torture each other when they have sex. They like it. Or people that dress up like dogs and cats or other animals, they're called furries. You're not in. You're not in a confessional. You're not in a monastery. Just tell it like it is. What happened?

Gigi McKelvey (23:19)

Brendan and Juliana set up a fake profile on FetLife, which is a website where people go who are into bondage, being tied up, more violent acts that are consensual, and pretended to be Christine looking for somebody who was willing to come to her house to do this. What's interesting is they only worked on this website when Christine was home as part of the alibi to say she was here, she was the one doing it, and eventually they found Joe Ryan.

Nancy Grace (23:48)

Hold on. Gigi. Gigi, that's really significant, what you just said. Well, everything that you've said is A, correct and B, significant. But do you remember? Let me think of a good example. Okay? Top mom, that's always an example for so many things. Remember when top mom Casey Anthony's mother, Cindy Anthony, takes a stand, goes under oath, and I believe perjured herself out of mother's love to try and save that no good daughter, top mom Casey Anthony. And she got up on the stand and she said that she is the one that performed those damning computer searches about how to make homemade chloroform. And it's believed that little Kelly was chloroformed with homemade chloroform and passed out and that somehow she OD'd on something and died in top mom's trunk. Cindy Anthony gets up there and says, it spell checked me. I was writing about chlorophyll because we had bamboo growing up in our backyard. And I'm like, that doesn't even make sense. She was willing to risk perjury charges to try and save her daughter. That is a mother's love right there. But the point is, they were creating this creepy fetish website while Christine, the murder victim, the mom, was home. So it could be argued she was home. This is her computer. We didn't do it while she was out at work or out playing or out shopping. Is that what you're telling me?

Gigi McKelvey (25:23)

Yes. And actually fooled some of the investigators who thought it was Christine. And they were reassigned to different units because they disagreed with the theories of the other investigators that Joe Ryan was catfished by Juliana and Brendan.

Nancy Grace (25:37)

Was he coming over Gigi to tie her up and have sex or to come over and brandish a weapon? What. What was the communication on that fetish website?

Gigi McKelvey (25:46)

The communication was that he was going to come over and bring ropes and a knife and chains, and it would be consensual. And there may be some resistance from Christine, but it's all part of the act and to keep going.

Nancy Grace (26:01)

Okay. Dr. John de la Torre, you are the licensed psychologist specializing in forensic psychology. You can be found on TikTok at Dr. John Delatorre. Explain what's happening here.

Dr. John de la Torre (26:17)

Exactly. And I think that's. That's a key element here, because when individuals are engaging in this non consensual, consensual sex act, you're not going to really involve weapons because that's Too far of a kink to. To do on a very first time. There's a level of trust that has to go into the two partners that are participating in this. So it's not like you're just going to show up out of nowhere. So he had to be convinced, Ryan needed to be convinced that this was an element of the. Of the act, that Christine absolutely wanted to never have met with him before. And that's a. That's. That's not something that is fairly consistent within the kink community. So there must have been more communications going on than what we really know that Christine would have been involved in had she just been doing this by herself. Other people had to be participating.

Nancy Grace (27:14)

You know, Paul Bautista, a defense attorney, I find it really hard to believe that this young mom, who is exhausted from raising a child and keeping all the plates in the air, has time and energy to go on a fetish website and arrange for someone to come tie her up on the one morning she can sleep in.

Paul Batista (27:40)

Well, you may find that hard to believe, Nancy, but that doesn't do anything to prove the guilt of the defendant.

Dr. Kendall Krans (27:50)

People.

Paul Batista (27:50)

She may. She may well have desired this. She may well have arranged it after all.

Nancy Grace (27:56)

Put him back up. I gotta see his face. Okay, let me ask you a couple of lightning round questions. Paul Bautista, have you ever given birth?

Paul Batista (28:07)

Have I ever been what?

Nancy Grace (28:10)

Given birth. Had a baby come out of your stomach through your vagina, then raise it. That's giving birth?

Paul Batista (28:19)

No, I have not.

Nancy Grace (28:20)

Okay. It's exhausting. Exhausting. So this mom has one day she can sleep in, and she plans a fun day for her daughter, her baby girl, to go to the zoo with the nanny. And she goes to sleep, and what do you know? Here comes Ryan with a rope. Okay, Gigi McKelvey, take it from right there. What do police believe happens right there?

Gigi McKelvey (28:51)

Well, Brendan had. Brendan and Juliana had given Joe Ryan the instruction that the door would be unlocked and for him to let himself in. He goes up to the bedroom, follows the instructions that were given by Brendan and Juliana one time through a voice call with Juliana, actually. And then when Juliana is placed in the cul de sac, sees Joe Ryan come in, Brendan comes home. When he goes upstairs, he sees Joe Ryan going according to plan. And Christine looks at her husband and says, he has a knife. Then. Then Brendan shoots Joe Ryan. Christina tells the au pair Juliana to call 91 1. And this is when Brendan begins stabbing his wife.

Nancy Grace (29:37)

Sydney Sumner, Crime Stories. Is that your understanding of what police are alleging? Let me get this straight. So the hot nanny Margulise leaves with the baby to go the zoo. Then Ryan shows up with all his accoutrements for fetish sex. Next thing you know, the hot nanny Margulies forgets the sandwich lunches she made, comes back to the house and goes, oh, there's a strange car. And instead of just walking in, why would that. She calls the husband, her lover right there. Why not just walk in? Just because you see an odd car in the driveway. The two of them, he quickly shows up. The two of them come in, the wife now dead, Christine screams, he's got a knife. They, the hot nanny and the IRS agent husband shoot Ryan dead. Then they go upstairs and then she is stabbed in the neck. Who else could have done it? Ryan was already shot dead. Is that the sequence of events that you understand, Sidney, does Gigi have it right?

Sidney Sumner (30:57)

Well, Nancy, this all happened in just a matter of moments. So yes, she sees this car and Banfield never went into work that day. He was waiting nearby to be able to come to the house and catch this man in the act, right? And so this all happens in just a matter of moments and all in that master bedroom. So Christine is already under what she believes to be an attack, while Joseph Ryan believes he's acting out a rape role play in a consensual manner. And her fighting him is all part of this role play situation. So Ryan is literally on top of Christine when Banfield and Juliana bust into the master bedroom and she cries out for help. She's looking to her husband and this nanny call 911, he has a knife. And Banfield shoots Joseph Ryan, who believes her husband just walked in on this affair. And then Christine thinks she's been saved. She thinks by some miracle her husband came home and saved her from this attacker. And then he climbs on top of her, Brendan Banfield, and stabs her to death. Moments after she thought he had just saved her life.

Narrator (32:12)

Christine Banfield plans a fun day for her four year old daughter with a trip to the National Zoo with her Brazilian au pair, Juliana Perez Magolies. They leave their Fairfax County, Virginia home, but turn around when Perez Magolies realizes she forgot their bagged lunges. Arriving at the house, the au pair sees a car she doesn't recognize and a man she doesn't know entering the house. Confused, she calls her employer, Brendan Banfield, who tells her to stay in the car, he will get there right away. Banfield is at the house in minutes and they enter the house together. The au pair takes the four year old girl to the basement. While Brendan Banfield goes upstairs to the master suite.

Nancy Grace (32:49)

What am I hearing? How did did an innocent day at the National Zoo with a Brazilian au pair end up with a double homicide? Why does she have to have a mouthful of red lipstick to take care of a baby? Yes, the mom should have just sent her straight back to her room to wipe that mouth off. What is that? That said, that's the first red flag when the nanny, the au pair, is taking cleavage shots in the bathroom and wearing skimpy lingerie at home. As a matter of fact. Let's take a look at the lingerie. Paul Bautista. This was found not just in her room, but it's in the master bedroom. She has moved all of her bustiers, her corsets, her thongs, AKA anal floss, into his bedroom. What do you. I can't wait to hear you explain that away. Have you looked at this picture?

Paul Batista (33:50)

No, I have.

Narrator (33:51)

No.

Paul Batista (33:52)

So are you.

Nancy Grace (33:53)

Are you married?

Paul Batista (33:55)

Am I married? Yes, Nancy, I am.

Nancy Grace (33:57)

Okay, so she's still there. What if the maid, the babysitter, the girl Friday, moved all of her anal floss into your closet? What do you think your wife would say? Say? Or should I just go hand her the gun right now?

Paul Batista (34:19)

Look, there is no issue here. Brendan was having an affair with the au pair. No issue about that. Are these normal people? Probably not. And it is not normal for the au pair to then move into the same bedroom where the husband's wife has been murdered. That's not normal. But that is not an indication of the guilt of Mr. Banfield.

Nancy Grace (34:46)

Do you just ever get exhausted with making these claims just because they're having an affair? No, that's not evidence of guilt. But as you know, evidence from before, during and after the incident may be brought in front of the jury. The sheets were still warm where mommy had been sleeping. When the hot nanny moves her anal floss into mommy's closet and props up a picture of the nanny with her husband beside the bed. Okay, Just imagine all that scintillating talk they had that pillow talk about his IRS investigations. No offense. Irs. That said to me, that's evidence after the fact. They had no remorse. They couldn't wait. And the baby girl, this is happening down the hallway from her nursery. Oh, there's a babysitter going to sleep with daddy. Okay, she's gonna remember that. Okay, I want to get back to the facts. To Gigi McKelvey, joining us, Star of Pretty Lies and Alibis. What exactly were the injuries to the bodies?

Gigi McKelvey (36:04)

Joseph Ryan was shot in the head and the chest, because the last shot actually came from Juliana when they realized Joe Ryan was still making noises. So she had a gun in her possession that was given by Brendan, and she fired the fatal shot to Joe Ryan. For Christine, she had mostly stab injuries to her neck. Some of them went as deep as two and a half inches and. And caused a defect at the base of her skull. So very violent injuries and rapidly fatal for both.

Nancy Grace (36:37)

I need a translation in medical jargon, and joining me to do that is a renowned medical examiner, the chief medical examiner, Tarrant County. That's Fort Worth. Star of a hit podcast, Mayhem in the Morgue, and he is the esteemed lecturer at the Burnett School of Medicine at TCU. Dr. Kendall Crowns, join us. What did she just say?

Dr. Kendall Krans (37:05)

So, basically, a knife was shoved into the neck, shoved into the neck at such an angle that it. It struck the base of the skull. And with that striking the base of the skull, the force of that can cause cracking the bone, etc. Depending on how hard it is. When you do that, you're hitting all the vasculature and musculature in this area. It's the crota, the jugular vein. You're going to get massive hemorrhaging from that kind of spurting out all over the place. So stab wounds to the neck usually are very vascular, very hemorrhagic, and depending on how they're angled, if they come more to midline, they can also involve your trachea or your windpipe, where the air comes through. And then you're basically now breathing through that new hole in your windpipe and the blood is flooding in there. So you're gagging on your blood as you're bleeding out. It's pretty bad to be stabbed in the neck.

Nancy Grace (38:05)

Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Gigi, you stated that the stab wound was so violent, did it do something to the back of her neck? This is reminding me of Nicole Brown Simpson, who was sliced so violently across her neck that she was practically decapitated. Her head held onto her body through a thin slice of flesh in the back. That's all that held her head onto her body. What did you say about the wound to Christine?

Gigi McKelvey (38:39)

It went deep enough that it caused a defect at the very base of her skull or a little notch where that knife struck bone. And that was visible during autopsy. So a lot of force used to when he was stabbing her in the neck. At least with that stab wound. That was one of the ones that was two and a half inches deep.

Nancy Grace (38:56)

Dr. KendallKrans, what does that mean? That there is actually a nick on her, on the bone, her neck bone, all the way back here.

Dr. Kendall Krans (39:05)

So it means that the knife was driven in quite deeply, probably almost all the way up to the hilt of the knife and that striking the base of the bone and breaking it means there's a lot of force being put into it as they're stabbing the individual in the neck. So it isn't a, it's a forceful stab wound fracturing the base of the skull and what you were talking about earlier or fracturing the cervical bone and what you were talking about earlier. If you go more centrally, you can decapitate someone easily cutting through the bone and soft tissue. The neck isn't all that structurally hard so you can take someone's head off, stabbing through their neck.

Nancy Grace (39:49)

This young mom did not want to leave her daughter, her four year old little girl. She wanted to live to hay with the sex affair. She wanted to live to see her daughter grow up. And as a matter of fact, with all of these wounds, she was still alive. Did you hear the 911 call where the nanny and the husband are saying she's still alive? Listen.

Police Officer (40:19)

Fairfax county police officers responded to a 911 call from within the home. In an upstairs bedroom we found Joseph Ryan deceased as a result of gunshot wounds and found Christine Banfield suffering from stab wounds. Christine was transported to a local hospital and pronounced dead.

Nancy Grace (40:38)

This is so crazy. So the auver comes back, she finds this scene. Where did hubby come from? The wife, the mother of a then four year old little girl, multiple stab wounds she suffered. This case has a lot of twists and turns. Very confusing and complicated. Cindy Sumner joining us, Crime stories investigative reporter. We are learning through the hot nanny that the two had been target practicing just before the killings. What do we know?

Sidney Sumner (41:12)

Well, we know that Banfield purchased an extra gun on January 23rd. So just a month before the murders. And yeah, they actually went to a shooting range to practice shooting so that when Joseph Ryan was in the house attacking Christine, they could come in and save the day.

Nancy Grace (41:33)

And what about buying new phones as well?

Sidney Sumner (41:36)

So they believed for some reason that buying a new phone just before the murders would prevent investigators from finding their previous communications. Wasn't the most well thought out plan.

Nancy Grace (41:49)

And then also apparently the nanny's mother injects herself into this scenario. And Sidney Sumner police describe in some of the documents the nanny magalies as the husband's quote, live in lover. Does that mean the affair was happening right under Christine's nose?

Sidney Sumner (42:11)

Absolutely. It was going on for months without Christine Banfield having any idea that her husband was sleeping with their Nanny.

Nancy Grace (42:20)

To Gigi McKelvey joining us to our pretty lies and alibis. I understand that Margulise, the so called hot nanny has been whining from behind bars, quote, untired of this. Wah. She's tired of being in jail. Christine is dead.

Gigi McKelvey (42:39)

Yeah, she's tired of being in jail. She said she was sad and depressed and she has trauma, you know, a lot of poor me and as we saw on the stand, zero remorse. So I wouldn't expect her describing jail life to be anything but, you know all about her. Yeah. So she, she went on some antidepressants, didn't like the way they make her, made her feel and so she went off of them and we heard all of this when she was on the stand. It was all poor me. No remorse shown for Joe Ryan or Christine Banfield.

Nancy Grace (43:09)

Paul Bautista, defense attorney and novelist. Listen to this. This is direct quote from the nanny, AKA co defendant in a murder case, a double murder case. Quote, I'm unhappy. Wah. Nothing makes me happy, Mommy, I'm miserable. I just want to get out of here and come back home and be with you guys. I'm tired of this place. Paul, really. She's tired of jail. I wonder if Christine is tired of that casket she's in.

Paul Batista (43:44)

Of course she's unhappy. She's in jail. She's still writing love letters to Banfield. She doesn't know what she's doing. She is a perfect candidate for the creation of a story that will give her the sweetest deal imaginable. She will not go to jail any longer. She'll leave the country and she's home free.

Nancy Grace (44:12)

She's a doctor De la Torre, I need a shrink. Everything he is saying right there anyway is valid. The jury may not believe her because she's getting a sweetheart deal to rat him out. But that said, I think the evidence is going to be so strong it's going to support what she's saying whether they believe her credibility or not. Dr. De la Torre, why is she whining about being in jail? Christine and Ryan are dead. He's shot in the chest and the head. Remember on the 911 they said he's making noises, he's like gurgling, trying to live. Why is she whining about jail?

Dr. John de la Torre (44:58)

Well, I think we have to remember is that in their mind they think that once all of this unfolds they're going to live a happy life with this four year old. But when reality sets and the realities of being in, you know, in custody, to being detained, that messes with your head, that. That. That gets under your skin. You don't realize how small the walls are until you're actually put in them. So whatever it was that they thought that they were going to be doing as a couple, post this murder, she didn't realize the reality of, you're not going to get away with this. And so now she's put in a place where the reality is setting in. And she did not think that all of this was actually going to be unfolding for someone like her.

Nancy Grace (45:42)

Dr. De la Torre, do you hear yourself? Do I need to do a playback? An instant playback? Because you just said, you know, you don't realize how small the cell is. I bet it's a lot bigger than that casket Christine's in.

Dr. John de la Torre (45:57)

Absolutely. And it's not like Juliana cares.

Nancy Grace (46:00)

She is apparently writing love letters. Is it true, Gigi? She says that the IRS agent husband, Christine's husband, told her he wanted to marry her and have children.

Gigi McKelvey (46:16)

That is true. And not only was she sending messages to Brendan, she was also sending messages to Brendan's mother, who was putting money on her commissary and funding her defense. Up until she flipped on Brendan. But yeah, she would say that she would take the blame for both of them. She loved him more than anything. It was a lot of back and forth with this lovey dovey stuff.

Nancy Grace (46:39)

Wait a minute. So her future mother in law is sending her money to the commissary? As long as she says, I'll take all the blame and I will clear him. But as soon as she flips, no more Doritos, no more nacho chips, no more candy bars, no more special soaps and lotions from the commissary. It's over.

Gigi McKelvey (47:05)

That's exactly right. They were funding her and making her life as cushy as they could while she was in jail because she wasn't talking. But that all changed when she started talking to the commonwealth and made that deal.

Nancy Grace (47:17)

We wait as justice unfolds. It's not too late. I put up many a newly discovered witness on the stand. If you know or think you know anything about this case, please dial 703-246-7800. Repeat, 703-246-7800. You know who we haven't heard about? The little girl. The four year old little girl whose mother was stabbed dead. And now she knows the nanny moved right down the hall and hopped in the bed with Daddy. That's the legacy. Nancy Grace, signing off. Goodbye, friend. This is an I Heart podcast. Guaranteed human.