NOLAN WELLS BOMBSHELL: DEATH-THREAT "BLOOD, SO MUCH BLOOD"

Summary

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Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

Episode: NOLAN WELLS BOMBSHELL: DEATH-THREAT "BLOOD, SO MUCH BLOOD"
Date: August 4, 2026
Podcast: iHeartPodcasts and CrimeOnline

Overview

In this gripping episode, Nancy Grace tackles emerging bombshells in the suspicious death of Nolan Wells—a young man who died under questionable circumstances during a boating trip near Horn Island on July 4th. The episode centers on the explosive new evidence in the form of enhanced 911 audio, the secrecy surrounding Nolan’s autopsy, and the wave of violent death threats directed at witnesses, law enforcement, and families involved in the case. Grace is joined by expert panelists including an audio engineer who enhanced the tapes, veteran lawyers, forensic experts, and investigators. The discussion is intense, emotional, and packed with forensic and legal insight as the panel evaluates whether Nolan’s death was an accident, a cover-up, or something more sinister.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. New Evidence: The Enhanced 911 Audio

• Critical Audio: The investigation hinges on newly enhanced 911 boat call audio. The recording appears to capture not only distress about a sinking boat, but alarming background statements suggesting possible foul play—including the line, "damn it, Bart, no no's really dead" ([12:57]).
• Audio Enhancement:
  • Janetta Brantley, audio engineer, explains her process:
    • Downloaded source from WLOX News YouTube; origin is the Mississippi Department of Marine Resources ([06:06], [06:47]).
    • Used Logic Pro X to isolate dual-mono channels, separate voices, and apply EQ and gain for clarity.
    • Surprised by the clarity of damning phrases (“dammit, Bart, Nolan’s really dead...”).
    • Quote: “I could not believe it. I could not believe it.” — Janetta Brantley ([12:38]).
  • Nancy Grace frames the audio as potentially “seismic” and game-changing ([10:43]).
  • Multiple enhancements, including a version by producer Sydney, reveal phrases like “want me to cover him up?” ([29:25]).

2. Credibility of the Enhanced Audio

• Nancy Grace fiercely interrogates the chain of custody and credibility:
  • Emphasizes Janetta’s independence and the chain back to official sources ([07:39], [18:23]).
  • Franz Borghardt (trial lawyer) raises the need for expert testimony to exclude AI-doctoring ([16:46]).
  • Consensus: The authenticity seems strong, but juror-level skepticism remains due to viral, high-profile nature.

3. Autopsy Secrecy and Forensic Uncertainty

• Secrecy: The complete autopsy by the state has not been made public, unusually being held for grand jury review ([02:07], [31:19]).
• Physical Findings:
  • Joseph Scott Morgan, forensic expert, highlights:
    • Issues due to decomposition.
    • Deceased’s neck organs and part of the throat missing—a possible red flag ([32:17], [36:22]).
    • Toxicology is done (likely included), but secrecy prevents community or independent expert review.
  • Debate over whether visible injuries (like marks on the occipital skull) are signs of trauma, drowning, or accidental falls ([35:43]).
  • Joe Scott Morgan: “It's very problematic when you’re trying to make an assessment, you’re already absent...the organs of the neck, you’re absent intact lungs…” ([36:22]).

4. Death Threats & Hostility Around the Case

• Multiple Threats:
  • Against Warren’s stepmother, a judge: detailed threats including “so much blood everywhere…hard to clean, especially from a boat” and bomb threats ([53:33]–[54:27]).
  • Multiple threats to Mississippi law enforcement (e.g., “don’t go outside”—bomb hoax) and to the Wells family ([55:21], [56:13]).
  • Arrests have been made in both cases; threats have heightened the stress and complexity for all parties.
  • Teslin Figaro stresses that Nolan’s family faces threats too, not just officials, highlighting the way public anger is distributed ([56:13]).

5. Factual Questions: Accident or Crime?

• Family’s Belief: The Wells family does not believe Nolan drowned by accident—he was a strong swimmer, left his phone/keys, reportedly “did not just go off with some random stranger” ([27:02]).
• Teslin Figaro: “If he was drunk, why was he the only drunk one that ended up dead?” ([42:02]).
• Susan Hendricks points out the crowd at the scene—hundreds of partygoers on Horn Island, yet supposedly nobody saw or recorded what happened ([23:00], [30:01]).
• Nancy Grace: “There are a lot of questions. These boys...could be completely innocent. But when I listen to this sound, there are a lot of questions.” ([40:37]).

6. Lie Detection and Law Enforcement Interviews

• Polygraph Controversy:
  • Confusion over whether the “boys” took real polygraph tests or inferior voice stress analyses.
  • Officer Tatum claims all but one took a polygraph “or equivalent,” but clarifies it was likely a voice stress analyzer ([44:09]).
  • George Olivo (FBI polygraph specialist): “There’s really no comparison—a polygraph is going to be way more preferable…Voice stress test, my rear end. That ain't coming into court” ([49:20], [52:11]).
  • Nancy Grace and panel: Voice stress tests are insufficient, not accepted by courts as evidence; only a proper polygraph with vetted questions would be meaningful.

7. Public and Media Sentiment: Demands for Transparency and Truth

• Community Reaction: The high-profile case stirs strong public suspicion. Grand jury secrecy and suppressed autopsy reports erode trust.
• Nancy Grace closes with a call for justice, thoroughness, and transparency for all parties—victims and suspects alike ([57:33]):
  • “We want justice in this case. We don’t want secret grand jury proceedings. We don’t want secret medical examiner reports. We want all threats investigated. We want the truth behind that audio. I want to know. And I want everybody on that boat polygraphed. We want answers.”

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Memorable Quotes & Moments (with Timestamps)

• Audio Bombshell:
  • “Dammit, Bart, Nolan’s really dead. Now that I couldn’t believe it. I could not believe it.”
    — Janetta Brantley ([12:38])
  • “If this is real, it changes everything. It’s seismic.”
    — Nancy Grace ([10:43])
• On Chain of Custody:
  • “You just throw that out there like a stink bomb at the Circle…To suggest this was doctored before Janetta got it means it had to have been doctored by…Mississippi Department of Marine Resources. No, no, no.” — Nancy Grace ([18:22])
• On Autopsy Secrecy:
  • “I’ve never known an autopsy report not to be a public record unless they’re claiming ongoing investigation.” — Nancy Grace ([31:40])
  • “If this is going to be a grand jury thing…when is the medical examiner going to be called and summoned to speak to this? That’s what everybody’s going to be hanging on in my opinion.” — Joe Scott Morgan ([33:08])
• On Death Threats and Public Reaction:
  • “So much blood everywhere, hard to clean, especially from a boat.” — Nancy Grace quoting threat ([54:27])
  • “Why isn’t anybody arresting the people who are actually harassing the victims? It’s online. So I just find it very interesting that there’s so much sympathy for a police officer…Nobody gives a damn about the death threats that [Nolan’s family is] receiving.” — Teslin Figaro ([56:13])
  • “I care. I care about the death threats on Nolan’s mother and his family and his team. I also care about death threats on one of these boys’ mother and on law enforcement.” — Nancy Grace ([57:33])
• On Lie Tests:
  • “Voice stress test, my rear end. That ain’t coming into court. In fact, I wouldn’t even pay any attention to it.” — Nancy Grace ([52:11])
• On Polygraph Questions:
  • “You can’t leave anything open to interpretation, just like you and I are describing.” — Nancy Grace ([51:15])
• Final Reflections:
  • “We want justice in this case…We want answers. If you know or you think you know anything about this case, dial 228-769-3063.” — Nancy Grace ([57:33])

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Key Timestamps by Segment

| Timestamp | Segment/Topic | |-----------|---------------------------------------------------| | 02:07 | Episode opening: case summary, main questions | | 06:06 | Audio engineer Janetta Brantley explains process | | 08:09 | 911 boat call audio (critical segment) | | 10:25 | Audio enhancement explained, core evidence | | 12:38 | Janetta Brantley’s shock at evidence found | | 16:46 | Legal critique: audio chain and authenticity | | 20:22 | Forensic review: Joseph Scott Morgan | | 23:00 | Crowd at scene: possibility of unnoticed accident | | 24:43 | Family’s theory and suspicions | | 29:25 | Additional audio enhanced by producer Sydney | | 31:19 | Autopsy secrecy, grand jury implications | | 36:22 | Forensic limitations due to decomposition | | 42:02 | “Drunk” theory: logic, alternate doubts | | 44:09 | Polygraph/vs. voice stress analyzer controversy | | 49:13 | Polygraph validity explained by expert | | 54:12 | Detailed threats against involved parties | | 57:33 | Grace’s closing: demand for answers and justice |

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Panel & Guest Highlights

• Nancy Grace (Host): Former prosecutor, relentless in seeking clarity and accountability.
• Janetta Brantley (Audio Engineer): Delivered and explained the enhanced 911 audio evidence.
• Franz Borghardt (Veteran Lawyer): Legal skepticism, urges airtight chain of evidence and credible testing.
• Joseph Scott Morgan (Forensics Prof., Death Investigator): Breaks down autopsy process, decomposition issues, and toxicology.
• Teslin Figaro (Commentator, Podcast Host): Speaks for social justice concerns, covers family angle.
• Susan Hendricks (Investigative Journalist): Assesses public information, weighs in on media/official coverage.
• George Olivo (Ex-FBI Polygrapher): Technically dissects the reliability of lie detection in this case.

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Final Thoughts

This episode is a microcosm of contemporary true crime—where physical evidence, digital forensics, legal wrangling, and social media outrage collide. Nancy Grace and her expert guests lay out a series of unresolved facts and open questions: Is the pivotal 911 tape authentic and what does it truly reveal? Why the secrecy on autopsy findings? Why such hostile intimidation of parties on all sides? Was this a tragic accident or is there a deeper cover-up?
The public, the panel, and most urgently, Nolan Wells’ family, all demand one thing: transparency and truth.

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Transcript

[Nancy Grace]

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[Nancy Grace]

stories with Nancy Grace. Bombshell tonight in the investigation of the death of a young man, Nolan Wells. Death threats are flying. One actually says there's going to be blood. So much blood. Another death threat says don't go outside. How can anybody do their jobs when they're getting death threats? Not only that, we understand this case is headed to a grand jury. We also learned tonight that the state's autopsy is complete but is being kept secret. Isn't an autopsy a public document? Why is it being kept hidden from us, the public? What is in that autopsy? The first autopsy of Nolan Wells. Good evening, I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. I want to thank you for being with us.

[Investigator / Interviewee]

The young lady Katie that he was hanging out with. I saw a text message from her alluding to the fact that she never saw him get on that boat at all. They could have been saying don't die, or is it dead? Referring to the bilge pump. Somebody would have seen something if there was a dramatic commotion like this occurring on that boat.

[Nancy Grace]

I hope Nolan Wells died by accident. I'm not shutting down our crime stories investigation until I know.

[911 Caller / Audio Recording]

Hey, we're at the west tip of Horn and our bilge pump stopped working. We're going, we're sinking. Can you all please come? We have a membership. What'd you say?

[Nancy Grace]

You know, if that sound is real, there's no getting away from that. And all this business about there's no connection. Well, I listened to a good 40 seconds of SEATO S E a second word to W on hold. Listen to their music. There was plenty good connection. But before I can even get to the death threats of blood. So much blood. Blood everywhere. And don't step outside. And more before I can even get to the grand jury, before I can get to the autopsy that's being kept hidden from us. I want you to meet someone very important, critical to this investigation. Her Name? Janetta Brantley. Ms. Brantley is the audio engineer who enhanced the 911 call the C to call in the Nolan Wells case. So everybody claiming some ding dong on YouTube did it. Or somebody on Insta or TikTok didn't know she did. I've spoken to her. I've read her statement. I want you to judge her credibility. Credibility is normally the sole province of a jury. And tonight you serve in that function. Ms. Brantley, I'm sure that you're getting all sorts of abuse threats and so forth. It's a cacophony that seemingly won't cease. That said, thank you for being with us tonight. Explain to me where you got the audio, how you got the audio, and what, if anything, you did to enhance the audio.

[Janetta Brantley]

First and foremost, I basically downloaded it off of YouTube from WLOX News YouTube site. And when I downloaded it, I ripped it off of YouTube. That's the terminology that we use when we take something off of YouTube. But when I ripped it off of YouTube and I pulled it.

[Nancy Grace]

Pause, please. Objection. Ms. Brantley, isn't it true that the audio you got was taken directly by XLO from mdm are correct? The Mississippi Department of Marine Resources. Isn't that true?

[Janetta Brantley]

Yes.

[Nancy Grace]

Okay. Please continue, Ms. Brantley.

[Janetta Brantley]

So when I downloaded it from YouTube, I pulled it into my DAW which is Logic Pro X. That's my DAW of choice. And when I first listened to it, I realized that it was like a dual mono recording, which most. What is it like, most phone services or operators use utilize when they're recording conversations. And so it was already split between the. The caller, the dispatch, and the callers in the. In the background. And so that's. That's what made it easy for me to isolate it without having to do much to it. So that isolation, when I separated the left channel from the right channel, that just made me be able to really focus on everything that was on the call. And then what I was hearing was like. Like I couldn't. I honestly could not believe what I was hearing.

[Nancy Grace]

Ms. Janetta Brantley, isn't it true this is the same audio that was released by the Mississippi Department of Marine Resources?

[Janetta Brantley]

Yes, that is absolutely correct.

[Nancy Grace]

Let's listen to it one more.

[911 Caller / Audio Recording]

Hey, we're at the west tip of Horn, and our village pump stopped working. We're going, we're sinking. Can y' all please come? We have a membership. What'd you say? It's coming up. It's.

[George Olivo]

It's.

[911 Caller / Audio Recording]

We're just thinking. I don't know. Like, we're just. We're going down. I don't know the phone number. It's. It's either. I think it's. Try that. I know we have a membership, like, guaranteed. I don't have the tag on here. It got ripped off. Wyatt Hyatt. No, we do not need that. Let me go look. Gonna jump in and pull the plug while you're going. Hello? Okay, what's going on? What's up? We're at the west tip of Horn, and our Doge pump stopped working. We're going, we're sinking. Can y' all please come? We have a membership. Hey, we're at the west tip of Horn and our bilge pump stopped working. We're going, we're sinking. Can y' all please come? We have a membership.

[Nancy Grace]

Back to Janetta Brantley joining us tonight. And she shows herself in that video showing what she is doing. What does adding EQ mean, Ms. Brantley?

[Janetta Brantley]

Adding EQ is basically selecting a certain frequency of the actual sound and either deleting or removing a certain noise, something that's problematic to the ear. Deleting that or boosting that, that's literally all Eqing is.

[Nancy Grace]

What was your process, Janetta? Because I was sitting. Researching. It was early, early, early in the morning, like 5:45am several days ago. And I was researching The Nolan Wells case. And I saw the transcript as it was being played and my husband was also up. He said, what's wrong? I'm like, if this is real, this changes everything. It changes everything. Because up until that point, it seemed as if no one's death could very well have been an accident. If this is real, it changes everything. It's seismic. What was your reaction when you heard these words, Janetta Brantley?

[Janetta Brantley]

I think at my core I was in disbelief. I wasn't cleaning it or enhancing it to specifically look for or identify a crime or even point the fingers at anybody. I believe I wanted it to be an accident. I think a lot of us wanted it to be an accident. So when I heard those things, when I heard Dammit Bart, that name stood out to me because I hadn't even heard that name before. As I was listening to certain things that stood out to me, I was in disbelief because again, I'm just an audio engineer. I'm not an investigator, a detective, or anything like that. So when I heard a name that I wasn't familiar with, it stood out to me. And that alone made me want to hear what was immediately said after Dammit Bart. And so that's why in that process where Dammit Bart came in loud and clear to me, I decided to go over to the next part to hear what the rest of that statement was, which is where you saw me actually create a loop over that part, split that part, and then add a gain, which the gain is boosting the volume overall. And that's pretty much what you saw me do in that actual video. And so to hear, you know, dammit, Bart, Nolan's really dead. Now that I couldn't believe it. I could not believe it.

[Nancy Grace]

My reaction to Janetta, because when I first heard it, I thought, this has got to be doctor this can't be real.

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[Nancy Grace]

Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Straight out to veteran trial lawyer Franz Borghardt, a veteran trial lawyer joining us out of the Baton Rouge jurisdiction at Borghardt's law firm. Franz, take off your defense hat. Just one moment. I have introduced wiretaps many times at trials, which are very hard to get, by the way, And I've never had one that I believed was doctored at the time because they were taken by law enforcement. This is from a completely independent source with no dog in the fight, no skin in the game. It's from dispatch at Seato, and if this is real, this blows the case wide up. Now you saw Janetta Brantley. You've Heard her. I have no reason to disbelieve anything she's saying.

[Franz Borghardt]

So if I'm prosecuting this, I need. I'm worried that I need a witness in 2026 to exclude the possibility that it's either AI generated or doctored, just like you suggested. And I think that she's very credible, But I think we need to go one step further. The other concern I have, Nancy, is if the independent autopsy is showing inconclusive death results. Now, I really want to see the other autopsy to see, is there trauma to the body? Is there something that happened? These are the concerns I would have as a prosecutor, but we've now opened the doors to these. These guys may, in fact, have committed obstruction of justice.

[Nancy Grace]

Hold on, hold on. You put in the cart before the horse. Before we talk about obstructions such as allegedly lying or covering something up, you've already mentioned two distinct lines of inquiry. One is that the audio that Janetta Brantley enhanced innocently, I believe had been already AI or doctored. Okay, let's follow that through to its logical conclusion. You just throw that out there like a stink bomb at the Circle. You know what a Circle meeting is, right? In the United Methodist Church, all the ladies have circle meetings. Okay? To suggest this was doctored before Janetta got it means it had to have been doctored or AI Created by who? The Mississippi Department of Marine Resources. No, no, no.

[George Olivo]

Don't just go.

[Nancy Grace]

That doesn't work in court. Borkhardt says you can't just throw. Oh, that's like the sod defense. Some other dude did it. What dude?

[Janetta Brantley]

What.

[Nancy Grace]

What are you talking about? So you're saying AI doctored by who? If it's not Janetta, then who? She got it. The same sound that was released by the Mississippi Department of Marine Resources. What, you think they doctored it?

[Franz Borghardt]

There is nothing normal about this case. And if.

[911 Caller / Audio Recording]

If.

[Nancy Grace]

That's not what I asked you. I'm asking you to explain your premise, and you're not doing it.

[Franz Borghardt]

I said if I were a prosecutor, I would want to be able to establish with expert testimony that what we are listening to is real, and I would want a witness. Because I'm telling you, with this case, with as viral as it's been, I'm not disagreeing that it's real. I'm saying I would want to be able to bolster that very credible woman's testimony, and she is very credible. I have no doubt that what we're listening to and what she did is credible. The issue is, I don't Know if she can go, where did it come from?

[Nancy Grace]

Okay, got it, got it, got it, got it. She cannot testify as to whether MDMR had enhanced it or doctored it before it was released. But see, the problem is you would have to ask someone to believe a clerk or an official at the Mississippi Department of Marine Resources doctored this before they released it to the extent that nobody could understand it until they enhanced it. That's a hell of a doctor job. Okay, so you did that, then you got into the medical examiner findings. Okay, what was your theory on that?

[Franz Borghardt]

Very quickly, very quickly, if he's dead on the boat, how did he die? It should be conclusive. It shouldn't be inconclusive.

[Nancy Grace]

Joining us right now, Joseph Scott Morgan, renowned death investigator, professor, forensics, Jacksonville State University, with a premier criminal pro department and building, author of Blood Beneath My Feet, star of a hit series Body Bags with Joseph Scott Morgan. And it goes on. Significant. Over 10,000 death scenes under his belt. Joe Scott, follow up. I'm not arguing in Burkharts. Let's learn if we can, from what he's saying.

[Teslin Figaro]

Jump.

[Joe Scott Morgan]

Yeah. So whatever has been the causal factors here has got to marry up with what they were seeing at the scene. And perhaps the audio does fall into this, you know, these statements. And I think that probably from a medical, legal perspective, that is, the coroner and the medical examiner are going to want to be able to fully appreciate what is being said here from a timeline. This is absent the police's investigation. They're going to try to rule in or rule out what they're seeing presenting on Nolan's remains when they finally did receive them at the state medical examiner's office and that examination began. And this is going to be critical and key, you know, because the causal effects here are going to be critical. You know, we go back to. To these changes that the second autopsy referred to on the back of the head. Now, the doctor was not able to at that point in time, even though he did do a thorough, what's referred to as a layered dissection here. He could not establish the causal effects here because the. The injury or the insult that you see there, this presentation is compromised by decomposition. So what did the state medical exam see? My problem is here, Nancy. How was the body treated before or after the first autopsy and the body is Transported up to D.C. i have questions about this because they're talking about to the degree with which the body was decomposed. The doctor up in D.C. is seeing significant decomposition. We don't know what they Saw in Mississippi. But I do know that you're only talking about what, and I'm ballparking here. Please give me some grace. Maybe 48 hours tops before the medical legal authorities have seen the body. So how far degraded is the body to compromise any of this? And this evidence is going to have to be borne out not just with the physical findings that you see with the unaided eye, but also whatever's going on toxicologically.

[Nancy Grace]

I want you to take a careful look at this video we have obtained. Let's see it. Look how tightly everyone is packed in. There were hundreds of people out on horn island on July 4th.

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What?

[Nancy Grace]

Nobody saw what happened to Nolan Wells. They all just left with him standing there stranded, waving his arms like Gilligan. That did not happen. Now that you're seeing this, what is an innocent explanation? I'm trying to figure that out. Joining me, and I'll circle back to you, Joe Scott, because I got a lot of questions regarding the way he could have died innocently and been left behind. And that sound being true, the sound that Janetta Brantley enhanced, is there any innocent explanation? Is there a way? As my favorite judge often said, Luther Alverson, it is your duty to make all witnesses speak the truth and impugn perjury to no one. Is there a way that can be done? I don't know that it can. It seems to me that someone is lying. But who? Joining me now, Teslin Figaro, social justice political commentator, host of the teslin Figaro podcast. Ms. Figo, thank you for being with us. I'd like to hear your thoughts.

[Teslin Figaro]

Yeah, well, that's what the family is saying. They don't believe he died by accident. That's the point. That's the reason why Nolan Wells mom is saying, I don't believe this. I don't believe he died by accident before we had the audio. The audio simply confirms that there are additional questions that needs to be asked. It wasn't just one thing they said in the audio. They said Nolan repeatedly in the audio. They said, check his chest. In the audio they said, is he dead? In the audio. And also notice this, Nancy, did you notice that the operator also said, is anybody breathing? Who says that? What? What operator says, who all is breathing on the boat. So is this all the audio, Nancy? Is there more audio? That's my question.

[Nancy Grace]

I want to look specifically, Teslin, at what was said. At one point we hear, we think you killed him. He's already dead. He's already dead. Is he dead? Yeah. No one omg Wake up. And as Janetta stated, then she hears a completely different name. Bart. Now, we also hear, and I'm very curious, the phrase, no, no. Tesla, Figaro, was that a nickname of Nolan Wells?

[Teslin Figaro]

I cannot confirm if that's a nickname of his or not, but what I do know is we heard Nolan. What I do know is we heard. Check his chest. What I do know is that we said, is he dead? What we do know is we heard screams. There's folks out there suggesting that perhaps they were talking to a seagull or perhaps talking to somewhat random bird that was flying around that's called. No, no. There were folks out there to suggest that. Well, maybe they were talking about the boat. Come. We got to knock this off, Nancy. We heard what we heard. And so if we were to put

[Nancy Grace]

this before a jury, also we hear, damn it, Bart, no no's really dead. Damn. Damn it, Bart, no no's really dead. Repeating it over and over and over. According to reports, his nickname. One of them is no, no. Back to Tesla and Figaro. What is Nolan's mother's theory about what happened in light of these tapes before

[Teslin Figaro]

we even had the tapes? Her theory is, I told my son, I've raised my son just like I've raised my 19 year old the same. The same way, Nancy, like I'm sure you raise your children, come back with the people you went with. Her theory has always been that he is a fantastic swimmer, that he is an athlete. Her theory has always been that he did not drown. Her theory has always been that there's something wrong with. With this picture. Her theory has always been that the fact that, you know, he left his phone and left and left his keys. Her theory has also always been that he did not just go off with some random stranger and say, guys, don't worry about it. Just leave me on an island. Her theory is the same thing before this audio. This audio only confirms what this mother already knew.

[Nancy Grace]

Joining me now, Susan Hendricks, investigative journalist, author of down the Hill, My Descent into the Double Murder in Delphi, who has been on this case from the beginning. Susan Hendricks, we all know that everyone in our country is innocent until proven guilty. And regardless of how you or I or anybody else feels, that includes the young men on the boat with Nolan Wells, we have a lot of questions that have to be answered. Is this sound real? Has it been enhanced? Who enhanced it? Was it AI or doctored before Janetta Brantley pumped it up? So we can hear it. I want you to hear another version.

[Podcast Advertiser / Sponsor Voice]

You can see that I have the C to channel completely muted, so we're only listening to the callers. Then I go through and simply raise the volume of all of the chatter

[Susan Hendricks]

we hear at the beginning of the call.

[911 Caller / Audio Recording]

Hey, we're at the west tip of horn, and our bilge pump stopped working. We're going. We're sinking. Can you all please come? We have a membership,

[Nancy Grace]

Susan, that was enhanced by my producer, Sydney. I know her like that. I asked her. Enhance it the best you can. She, again, has no interest in the outcome of this case. She pulls up, quote, want me to cover him up? I mean, Susan, weigh in.

[Susan Hendricks]

I was listening to the enhanced version. Both of them now. Not doctored, by the way. There's a big difference there. Have you ever heard, Nancy, on Instagram, where you listen to two things and your mind goes to what you're thinking of, like green car or moon boat? What are we really hearing? I believe that something nefarious did happen where I think the answers will be. Again, this is my opinion, but I believe something happened there, and we're not hearing the full story. And you pointing out, Nancy, how crowded that area was. So let's say what people are claiming, that it was an accidental drowning. No one saw. Look here at the crowd. Nobody saw what happened. And all of us have our phones on us all the time. No one recorded this. I think the answers are in the timeline and also the autopsy, when we will hear answers there.

[Nancy Grace]

You're seeing video from the Officer Tatum show, and I don't know what they were trying to show with it, but how can someone be dead and floating in the water and nobody notice? Which leads me to Susan Hendricks. The fact that we have learned tonight that the state's autopsy is complete, but it's being kept secret.

[Susan Hendricks]

Mm, yeah, absolutely. Being held for the grand jury to look into that. And the fact, as you brought up Nancy earlier, that part of his throat was missing. Will that be key? There's so many questions around this, but. Right. It's a public record, but we're not hearing about it. I guess they're waiting for the grand jury to show them that first.

[Nancy Grace]

Joe Scott Morgan, death investigator. I've never known an autopsy report not to be a public record unless they're claiming ongoing investigation.

[Joe Scott Morgan]

No.

[Nancy Grace]

Now, in the D4VD David Anthony Burke case, the LAPD demanded the medical examiner keep it secret because the medical examiner's office allegedly was leaking information, possibly from money. I don't know that yet, but I will. How common is that? That the medical examiners ordered not to release the autopsy. Why is the autopsy being kept secret?

[Joe Scott Morgan]

Because it's continued investigation. They're going to go to grand jury with this, I can tell you that. I'll bet you dollars to donuts if that's the case. We see it with, we saw it with Idaho 4, right. We didn't have it there. We don't have it with Charlie Kirk. You know, that's an ongoing event. This is, this is being investigated. And you know, the, the point of contact here is an interesting situation here because you have the state medical examiner, but you also have a county coroner. The state medical examiner provides a service to the county coroner. The coroner is an elected official. He does not do these autopsies. And so the coroner is going to be the gatekeeper relative to any kind of document. But with that said, under state, I think under state statute, the da, the prosecutor, they can say, look, you're going to hold off on releasing this report. So it's being, it's being held at this point in time. Now the reports that we're hearing are saying that it is complete. Now what does that mean? Well, if you have a complete autopsy report, that means they've got tox, they've probably got histology, which is going to be the tissue studies, and they actually have the anatomical autopsy report that has been completed. That's what I think it was ABC that was reporting that. I can't validate that, but that's what is being leaked out at this point in time. So they have this report. I think the question is, and this goes back to you, my friend, is that if this is going to be a grand jury thing, when is it going and when is the medical examiner going to be called and summoned to speak to this? That's what everybody's going to be hanging on in my opinion.

[Nancy Grace]

Hold on, Joe Scott, you mentioned the talks report. That's a blood panel done. Was he drinking? Was he using drugs? A lot has been mad or had

[Joe Scott Morgan]

he been given something?

[Nancy Grace]

Witnesses stating Nolan was drunk. Okay, does that really change anything? Does that change anything? Unless he died of acute alcohol poisoning. Because I guarantee you ain't anybody on that boat that's afraid of a cocktail. Okay, so if he was drinking, what difference does that make? And whether he was killed or whether he died of an accident? Joe Scott.

[Joe Scott Morgan]

Well, listen, Nancy, I know you're a teetotaler, but let me tell you something. The drunker you get, the more alcohol you take on board. The it lessens your ability to defend yourself. It lessens your ability to make good decisions. And so we see this played out all the time in the medical legal world. And that's going to be the measure here, I think, relative to tox. Everybody wants to see the toxicology because that's going to give us an idea chemically what is in this young man's system was he able to do for himself at that point in time? And that's another problem that arises.

[Nancy Grace]

It's a double edged sword. Joe Scott, you can argue, right,

[Janetta Brantley]

he

[Nancy Grace]

was drunk and could not defend himself against an attack. You could also argue he was drunk and hit his head. And then they go, oh my stars, he's dead. But wouldn't that have shown up in the autopsy if he did, if he died by a blow to the head, be it accidental or nefarious, wouldn't that have shown up?

[Joe Scott Morgan]

Yeah, and keep in mind the second physician that did the autopsy, who by the way is highly respected former chief medical examiner for DC that was retained by the family, he didn't see any evidence of fractures. All right, now that doesn't mean that there wasn't a concussive event. I'm talking about being hit in the head. And you can have stuff that's, that's contained within the cranial vault that might not be presenting. But again, back to what I said earlier, I find it very interesting that this doctor is commenting on the state of the decomposition when he sees the body. And that's problematic.

[George Olivo]

Neck.

[Joe Scott Morgan]

It's very problematic when you're trying to make an assessment you're already absent. You're already absent the organs of the neck. You're absent intact lungs and you know, because the specter of drowning is on the table as well. So if you want to make a thorough scientific assessment. He's kind of handcuffed, isn't he, at this point? And again, going back to this idea, how long did it take them get his body to D.C. and why was it in such a state of decomposition when it arrived?

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[Nancy Grace]

Crime stories with Nancy Grace, Franz Burkhardt joining us, veteran trial lawyer out of the Baton Rouge jurisdiction. Speaking of tox toxicology results, number one, they don't take that long unless you want them to. Number two, there is doubt if he died by accident having consumed a lot of alcohol. Was there a cover up or did he die from a nefarious act so the alcohol intake could cut either way? Franz,

[Franz Borghardt]

I think you're spot on. I think that the reasonable doubt if someone gets arrested and accused of this crime is going to be. If the toxicology shows a high bac. In the absence of anything else, what you yourself said, could it have been foul play where he couldn't defend himself or foul play in so much as he got injured because he was quote unquote drunk? That, that remains to be seen. But I don't discount the fact.

[Nancy Grace]

Let me see, workhard.

[Franz Borghardt]

I don't.

[Nancy Grace]

You're saying foul play, but it could have been something as simple as horsing around on the boat and him hitting his head. It could be somebody whacking him in the head. It could be finding him in the water face down. And this mark on the back of his head is some type of fluid disbursement, which I don't believe because it was nowhere else on the body except right there. And if your blood is going to sink to the lowest level upon death, it would be all over the body, but we're not seeing that. So why is the just the occipital have the deep red markings? So many, many questions. And let me stress before you bother sending me another death threat, we don't know the answers. These boys, these young men on that boat could be completely innocent. But when I listen to this sound, there are a lot of questions. Back to Teslin Figaro who is joining us. She's the host of the Teslin Figaro Podcast. She is a social justice and political commentator. Have you noticed that people are making a lot of the fact that Nolan was, quote, drunk? A, how do they know that? And B, does it make a difference?

[Teslin Figaro]

Yeah, well, I've absolutely noticed it. That, that he was allegedly. They're saying he was drunk and it doesn't make a difference. And let me ask you this, Nancy. If he was drunk with other teenage kids, he certainly wasn't drunk by himself. So if he was drunk, why was he the only drunk one that, that ended up dead? Secondly, if this was an accident, let's say he just got so drunk and just passed out, why didn't anybody report it? So even if it was an accident, even if he got drunk, which I don't believe by the way, even if all those things happen, why did his so called friends not reported? That's the part that we're missing.

[Nancy Grace]

So if.

[Teslin Figaro]

Where's the answer to that, Nancy? He just went and just said I'm just gonna be drunk and just go in the middle of the ocean and just die with hundreds and hundreds of people who are around, who are watching. Nobody saw anything happen. His friends didn't see anything happen. And again, I go back to this tape. I will not sit up here and pretend that I did not hear what was on that tape. And I ask again, even the operator said, who is breathing on the boat? Don't you think that's strange, Nancy?

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Who's breathing?

[Nancy Grace]

Yes. When I first heard that Tesla, I thought, I've never heard a dispatch say who's breathing.

[Janetta Brantley]

What?

[Nancy Grace]

What she. Did she hear all that in the background and do nothing? Or did she hear it and say something and release it? We don't know, man. We gotta paper everybody with subpoenas to get to the bottom of this. But I want to go to George Olivo and everybody on the panel, your extra experts in your own right. Please tell me if you have, if you want to jump in, please. I'm not clairvoyant to George Olivo joining us. He's a former FBI special agent and polygraph examiner at George Olivo dot com. Okay, George, listen to what Officer Tatum told me. Back to Officer Tatum, star of the Officer Tatum on YouTube. Have the friends taken polygraphs?

[Investigator / Interviewee]

Well, from my understanding, all but I believe one took a polygraph and from what was told to me that they all passed and all of the ones that took a polygraph took one without a lawyer. And so. And they cooperated with law enforcement. So from my understanding, everybody took a polygraph.

[Nancy Grace]

Understand? Did they tell you they took a poly and passed?

[Investigator / Interviewee]

They told they. Yes, ma'. Am. When they told me that they did it, I wasn't there. So that's what I'm saying. From my understanding, they told me that all the boys, except one, which is Warren, I believe took a polygraph test. All of them did not have lawyers and did it and cooperated with police. Warren also cooperated police. I just believe he didn't take a lie detective test. But Warren is the young man that I interviewed. So according to what they told me, they all took a lie detector test and passed. And it's an equivalent of a lot of tech tests. It's not a traditional lie detector test, but it's the same theology of trying to get to if a person is lying. I don't know the name of it. It's the equivalent of a lot of technologies. It's a different methodology. Yeah, I don't believe it was a polygraph test. I believe they, they took other stressors in order to analyze.

[Nancy Grace]

Did they take a polygraph? Would be no. He's charming, he's well spoken. But that was no. That was a no. They did not Take a polygraph test. And not all of them took the, as he is calling it, the equivalent. Okay, Georgia Levo, in my experience as a trial lawyer, there is no equivalent for a polygraph. Tell me the various bodily indicators a polygraph measures.

[George Olivo]

The polygraph does have very specific markers, and we're looking for physiological changes in baseline or true signature. So we're looking at things like respiration, heart rate, electrodermal activity, which most people interpret a sweat gland activity, or looking at peripheral movements to try and determine if someone's trying to cheat on the test. So it's quite, it's quite extensive. And I think what the Officer Tatum was probably referring to, whether he realized it or not, was the voice stress analyzer. Seems, I think he used that word one time. Some kind of stressor test. It's probably that they might have taken.

[Nancy Grace]

Okay, I'm going to have to ask you about what that is, but to my layperson understanding and guys, I'm speaking to an expert, former FBI special agent polygrapher George Olivo. As I recall, just off the top of my head, a polygraph measures things you really cannot control unless you have studied and practiced beating a polygon. Involuntary physical stress responses, blood pressure, heart rate, breathing rate, whether you're sweating. Tubes around your chest and abdomen tract your breathing, and even not just how fast you're breathing, but the depth of your breathing. Does your breathing become shallow? Do you have to pause and take deep breaths to calm yourself down? A poly, a traditional poly measures cardiovascular activity. There's a blood pressure cuff on your arm and it measures your pulse and your blood pressure fluctuation. It also measures what's called electrodermal activity. What is that? I've had to explain it a million times to jurors. Sensors attached to the fingers measure your sweat gland activity and even your skin electrical conductivity. The examiner then asks neutral questions like is your name Georgia Levo? Are you from Cincinnati, Ohio? Are you from la, California? Are you a polygrapher? Were you with the FBI? Were you there when Nolan Wells died? That's how that would work. You would lay a foundation of non disturbing questions, baseline questions. They're called to get the person that's being subjected to a poly to get their baseline heart rate, their blood pressure and so forth. Then when you hit them with a question regarding the case, you see if there's any change in that, that. Okay, I know I'm speaking as a layperson, Georgia Levo, but those are some of the things a polygraph measures.

[George Olivo]

You nailed it. Yeah, that's right. Nancy. And, and let me just add that the correlation between deception and physiology is nothing new. It goes back 4,000 years, back in China when the emperor was questioning one of his subjects, he would have a doctor standing by to listen to the heart rate to determine if the person was telling the truth or not. And we've been studying it ever since.

[Nancy Grace]

What is the test that Officer Tatum is talking about? To what is he referring?

[George Olivo]

I think, and he was kind of cryptid, maybe intentionally or unintentionally maybe he didn't really know, but it sounded like he was referring to a voice stress analyzer. Those are these machines that detect micro stressors electronically in the voice. The research is very weak on that and that type of technology, I guess it's better than nothing. But the bottom line is, I mean, and I'm speaking as a polygraph examiner and I'm saying this, no diagnostic tool and you know, this obviously should ever be used as a final verdict. I mean it is one, just one piece of the truth puzzle. But obviously if you had a choice between a voice stress analyzer and a polygraph, there's really no comparison of polygraph is going to be way more preferable.

[Nancy Grace]

Well, I mean even polygraphs are not allowed in a criminal trial unless both parties stipulate they will be allowed to up front before the poly's even taken. They are allowed in civil trials. And isn't it true, Georgia Levo, you're the former FBI calligrapher. Isn't it true the questions matter. They're critical because if you throw opening questions like did you do anything wrong or were you what happened that day? You can't ask questions like that. You really have to ask yes, no questions, then they can expound upon it. Your questions must be very specific. Isn't that true?

[George Olivo]

100%. Yeah. Test question construction is something that is going to. Well, a lot of things are going to make or break a test. But test question construction is key. And if something is, let's say, you know, there's a missing child, a missing person, and you ask someone of interest, are you responsible for their disappearance? Well, that's a terrible question because you know, they may feel morally responsible. If only I had been more careful. My, you know, they feel guilty. But, and so you're asking the wrong question there. So you really have to give or

[Nancy Grace]

you could have asked the perp that grabs the kid off the street, are you responsible for the disappearance? They go no, because in their mind it's the parents fault because the child was out on the street hadn't have anything to do with me. I just gave him a ride before I killed him. That said, you can't leave anything open to interpretation, just like you and I are describing. So when I would agree to a polygraph, I never stipulated it would come into court, ever. But when I would agree to a polygraph as an investigative tool, I would take part in selecting the questions and creating the questions. Because, frankly. Let's just be honest, George, a voice stress test where the prosecutor or the investigator is not in charge of the questions ain't worth a hill of beans. Technical legal jargon, that means nothing to me.

[George Olivo]

I agree with you there.

[Nancy Grace]

Let me put it more clearly. Voice stress test, my rear end. That ain't coming into court. In fact, I wouldn't even pay any attention to it. Now, you give me a polygraph where I help fabricate the questions. Maybe I want to know who is the polygrapher. Is he somebody the defense hires all the time so they're beholden to the defense? No, I want somebody like Olivo that did it with the FBI. So telling me these boys, as they call them, they're young men, took. First it was a poly. Then I find out it's a voice stress test. Took a test and they passed. Oh, except one of them didn't take it. That means nothing. Put them on a poly with questions approved by the state, then I'll pay attention. Right now, it's really not worth the salt that goes in my bread. You know what? If I wanted someone to pass one of these lie detector tests, I go with a voice test like these young men took. I wouldn't let them take a polygraph. Susan Hendricks joining us. Investigative journalist and reporter. Death threats, including one that says blood will be everywhere. What was that?

[Susan Hendricks]

That was from a man out of Sacramento, now arrested and threatening the judge, who is the stepmother of Warren. And talk about frightening. Saying a lot of blood. There'll be a lot of blood like there was on the boat, but yours will be much faster.

[Nancy Grace]

The perp is Joseph Alfredo Vasquez demars, arrested Thursday on charges of interstate transmission of threatening communication. Now, these are federal documents. What did he threaten one of the young men's mom with? Susan?

[Susan Hendricks]

The threats were against Warren, one of the boys on the boat, his stepmother, who is a judge. And it was graphic. It was brutal. Saying there will be blood everywhere, threatening her life, talking about on the boat,

[Nancy Grace]

saying it really does. It says that he is sending a bomb to her office that will, quote, blow you away when you see it. Once that package Is open. The timer will start. Then you have 10 seconds or less to ask God for forgiveness. So much blood everywhere. Hard to clean, especially from a boat. That was in that letter. And there is another death threat. Susan Hendricks to Mississippi law enforcement saying, don't go outside. What happened with that?

[Susan Hendricks]

Yes, Cincinnati, Ohio. Woman calling two officials out of Mississippi several times, more than 25 times. Here is her mug shot. And you're right. Don't go outside saying there's a bomb. So the threats are. They're taking them seriously, as they should. And two arrests so far.

[Nancy Grace]

That's right. A woman now accused of bomb threats to government offices related to the Nolan Wells investigation. This is an Ohio woman facing facing federal charges. Michelle Francine Edwards, just charged in the US District Court, Southern District, Mississippi. One count, transmitting threatening communications to interstate commerce. Okay. Nobody can do their job appropriately when they're under a death threat. That's against Mississippi law enforcement. Trust me, there are people within law enforcement that are trying to do the right thing. Threats on one of the young men's mothers. That's not all. Tesla, Figaro. No one's family has gotten threats to.

[Teslin Figaro]

Absolutely. And you know, I don't condone violence on anybody, but I do want to put some context behind this, Nancy, as well. I was a police officer in the Air Force. You're talking about government officials. Meaning. I'm sure the judge has received threats. I'm sure the police officer has received threats, although they are not. They should not happen. But these are individuals that have taken. Just like you and I have taken on positions that. It comes with the territory. You have received death threats. I have received death threats. So the people that's not being talked about, that's receiving the death threats is Nolan Wells, mother and father. Why is nobody talking about the death threats with them? They reported it. Why isn't anybody arresting the people who are actually harassing the victims? It's online. It's available for people to see. So I just find it very interesting that there's so much sympathy for a police officer who not only do they receive death threats, they put their life on the line. They signed up and raised their hand to say, hey, pick me for the death threats and pick me to give my very life as I did in the Air Force. So it is not right what is happening, but we also have to shine a light on the actual victims, the actual people who are grieving the loss of their son, and nobody gives a damn about the death threats that they're receiving.

[Nancy Grace]

I want to be very clear, Ms. Figaro, you say nobody cares. That's not true. I care. I care. I care about the death threats on Nolan's mother and his family and his team. I also care about death threats on one of these boys mother and on law enforcement. And yes, my first death threat. Oh my goodness, came back in the 80s. But guess what? They faxed it to me from the Fulton County Jail. So that wasn't much of a mystery. But with every time you take a position, you make people angry. The thing is, if these threats, including the ones on no one's mother, the mother. You know what I'm doing all night long till 2 o', clock, Ms. Figaro? I'm packing my my children to go away to college. That's what no one's mother should be doing tonight. She should be getting him ready to go back to school. Instead, she's visiting his remains. And now death threats. We want justice in this case. We don't want secret grand jury proceedings. We don't want secret medical examiner reports. We want all threats investigated. We want the truth behind that audio. I want to know. And I want everybody on that boat polygraphed. We want answers. If you know or you think you know anything about this case, dial 228-769-3063. Tonight we honor canine echo protected while serving the Sartel pd, Minnesota because a group called Vested Interest in Canines created a bullet and stab proof protected vest and protected Echo. These things aren't standard. They're over a thousand dollars each. And I've seen many canines die on crime scenes. Protect those canines who protect us. We remember an American hero, Officer Brian Huff, Detroit PD Shot in the line of duty after 12 years. Leaving behind his wife Melissa and their son Blair. American hero Officer Brian Huff. Thank you to our guests for being with us tonight, but especially to you for joining us in our search for the truth. However it may pan out, if it brings down the courthouse walls, so be it. We want the truth about Nolan Wells. Nancy Gray signing off. I'll see you tomorrow night. And until then, good night for brand.

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