OJ SIMPSON SPINNING IN HELL: FORCED TO PAY $58M TO MURDER VICTIMS

Summary

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Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

Episode: OJ SIMPSON SPINNING IN HELL: FORCED TO PAY $58M TO MURDER VICTIMS
Date: November 24, 2025
Host: Nancy Grace
Guests: John Bueller (Former Detective), Chris Melcher (Celebrity Lawyer), Alexis Torreschuk (Crime Stories Investigative Reporter), Shannon Henry (Surviving Assault Founder), Dr. Cheryl Ehrrett (Clinical Forensic Psychologist), Dave Mack (Investigative Reporter)

Episode Overview

Nancy Grace takes a deep dive into the long and infamous saga of O.J. Simpson, focusing on the recent forced payout of $58 million from his estate to the families of Nicole Brown Simpson and Ron Goldman — decades after being found liable in civil court. The episode combines renewed fury over the original crimes, chronicling Simpson’s abuses, legal maneuvering to avoid payment, and the struggles the families endured to achieve some financial justice nearly 30 years after the murders.

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Main Themes and Purpose

• Justice Delayed, Not Denied? Nancy highlights the contrast between O.J. Simpson's decades of evasion and the families’ persistence, culminating in the eventual court-mandated payout after Simpson’s death.
• Domestic Violence and the Simpson-Brown Relationship: The episode details the evidence of a long pattern of abuse leading up to the murders.
• Legal System Critique: The episode critiques how legal loopholes and protections for assets allowed Simpson to live comfortably post-verdict while largely avoiding financial consequences.
• A Media Case: The notorious media coverage, low-speed chase, and courtroom theatrics are revisited, along with the infamous “if it doesn’t fit, you must acquit” glove moment.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

The 911 Calls and Domestic Abuse Background

• Early Warning Signs: Nancy plays chilling 911 tapes from Nicole Brown, calling for help as O.J. attempts to break in to her home ([03:10]-[05:53]).

  • “He tried every move he could to avoid paying them, and he swore he would never pay them. This as he lived the whole life.” — Nancy Grace [03:24]

• Domestic Violence Cycle:
  John Bueller explains that O.J.’s controlling, violent behaviors began as soon as he and Nicole started dating.

  • "This falls into the tail end of the domestic violence cycle that people go through, whether they're famous or not famous... The devil walks amongst us, usually disguised in a pretty good looking frame." — John Bueller [07:14]

• Victim Perspective:
  Shannon Henry stresses how abusers use events (like being left out of a family dinner) as excuses, but the pattern is fundamentally about ongoing control and a cage of abuse invisible from the outside.

  • “We have to start thinking of these victims as people inside of cages. We can't see the bars from the outside, but the bars are very much control.” — Shannon Henry [10:35]

The Murders: Timeline and Crime Scene

• Timeline Highlights: Dave Mack reconstructs the night:
  • Nicole, the children, and family go to dinner without Simpson.
  • Ron Goldman is killed while returning Nicole’s mother’s glasses ([08:32]-[08:52]).
• Discovery: Nicole’s dog, found with bloody paws, leads a neighbor to discover the bodies ([11:35]).
• Dog’s Cry: Attorney Chris Melcher highlights the haunting detail of Nicole’s Akita’s “woeful cry” starting the chain of discovery ([12:40]).

Evidence, Investigation, and The LAPD’s Role

• Immediate Evidence: Blood on the Ford Bronco, discovered by Detective Mark Fuhrman, is discussed as crucial early evidence—contradicting claims of a conspiracy ([13:06]-[14:27]).

  • “There's no exculpatory evidence in this case whatsoever…Every arrow and dagger of circumstantial evidence pointed right back to O.J.” — John Bueller [14:27]

• LAPD’s Treatment of Simpson:
  Special treatment was given due to celebrity status, in the wake of the Rodney King era.

  • “He got special treatment throughout because of his fame, because of the football link, and because he is very charming…If OJ happened to commit suicide… the whole world is going to line up against them.” — John Bueller [18:25]

The Low-Speed Chase and Aftermath

• Infamous Bronco Chase: Audio and analysis of Al Cowlings’ 911 call during the chase.
  • “He just wants to see his mother. Let me get him to the house… He got a gun.” — Al Cowlings via 911 [16:14]
• Nancy’s Observation: The episode highlights the absurdity of authorities letting Simpson "hold himself hostage," a privilege rarely afforded to others ([17:58]).

The Civil Trial Verdict and Decades of Evasion

• Civil Judgment and Compensation Dodging:

  • Simpson was ordered to pay $33 million to the families — with the value ballooning due to interest and unpaid sums to nearly $58 million ([20:27]-[20:58]).
  • “Simpson paid just $133,000 on the 33.5 million he owed the families… He skirted payments by moving to Nevada and Florida, where state law prevented the seizure of his NFL pension and residences.” — Dave Mack [21:18]

• Cash-Only Schemes:

  • Simpson operated a covert cash economy—signings, golf games, speaking gigs—all paid in cash to avoid record-keeping and garnishment.
  • “He would sign autographs, he'd sign pictures…people would have to pay cash. They would literally give him stacks of cash...to thwart the settlement that the court ordered him to pay.” — Alexis Torreschuk [27:02]

• Asset Protection:
  Chris Melcher explains how state "homestead" laws in Florida and Nevada, alongside protected pensions, enabled Simpson to shield his luxury homes and most income from creditors ([29:32]-[31:32]).

  • “OJ was aware of this, that’s why undoubtedly he purchased this expensive home there: the Goldmans could not use that home as a source of collecting.” — Chris Melcher [31:32]

• IRS Involvement:

  • Nancy asks how Simpson evaded not just debt but taxes. Melcher reveals that the IRS and California Franchise Tax Board are now creditors to Simpson's estate ([29:55]).

Civil Justice, Polygraph, and Iconic Missed Evidence

• Civil vs. Criminal Standards:
  • The infamous verdict revisit: Simpson found not guilty in criminal court, but liable in civil court ([35:10]-[37:59]).
• Polygraph Test Fiasco:
  • Simpson took (and catastrophically failed) a defense-arranged polygraph, scoring a “negative 24”; this was disclosed at the civil trial and further damaged his credibility.
    • “He didn’t make a zero. He made a negative 24...even with the defense making up the questions and administering softball questions to Simpson, he failed. He did worse than failing.” — Nancy Grace [41:55]-[44:21]
• Bruno Magli Shoes:
  • Simpson denied owning the distinctive, rare Italian shoes tied to bloody prints at the scene; the civil trial produced photographic proof of Simpson wearing them, completely undermining his testimony ([47:33]-[49:22]).

Justice Delivered...At Last?

• Why Now?
  • What finally triggered the payment? Malcolm Laverne, Simpson’s estate executor, relented after years of vowing never to pay. “[It’s] unclear what spurred the change of heart. Executor Malcolm Laverne, previously swearing to never pay Goldman a dollar…” — Dave Mack [34:05]
• Victims’ Families:
  • Nancy and panelists underscore the cold comfort this brings after decades of loss, but acknowledge it’s a form of justice, albeit “too little, too late.” ([51:11])

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “You know, just looking at him makes me sick. But one thing that makes me feel a little bit better is I know he is spinning out right now in hell with Satan having to be forced to pay out $58 million to his murder victims families.”
  — Nancy Grace [03:24]

• “The devil walks amongst us, usually disguised in a pretty good looking frame.”
  — John Bueller [07:14]

• “He wanted to beat her, he wanted to kill her. It has nothing to do with the family get together.”
  — Nancy Grace [09:42]

• “There’s no exculpatory evidence in this case whatsoever. When you have a premeditated murder carried out, rarely will you have an eyewitness or video. But, every arrow and dagger of circumstantial evidence pointed right back to O.J.”
  — John Bueller [14:27]

• “He has had his life continue over all these years if he’s had opportunities to do things Ron didn’t.”
  — Chris Melcher [21:45]

• “The joke was on the golf course — O.J. no.”
  — Alexis Torreschuk, on O.J.'s claim that he was “searching for the real killers” while playing golf [27:02]

• “What guy who didn’t kill his wife is going to be doing these kinds of antics?”
  — John Bueller [18:25]

• “He didn’t make a zero. He made a negative 24.”
  — Nancy Grace, on Simpson’s polygraph [41:55]

• “That's like knowing the questions on the test...and still failing.”
  — Nancy Grace [44:21]

• “There was so much evidence pointing towards his guilt, that being one of them. What are the chances that some homicidal person...is wearing these expensive Italian loafers...?”
  — Chris Melcher, on the Bruno Magli shoes [49:22]

• “Never ever should a defendant be allowed to perform an experiment in front of the jury that has not been tried before. Why would the state hand over the evidence and have a demonstration?”
  — Nancy Grace, on the glove incident [35:48]

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Timeline & Timestamps for Major Segments

| Timestamp | Segment Summary | |-------------|----------------------------------------------------| | 03:10-06:47 | Nicole’s 911 calls played and discussed | | 07:14-10:35 | The cycle of domestic violence; victim psychology | | 11:12-11:35 | Timeline: Ron Goldman’s fatal errand | | 13:06-14:27 | Initial evidence at Simpson’s home—blood on Bronco | | 16:13-19:29 | O.J. Simpson’s low-speed police chase | | 20:27-21:06 | Post-civil verdict, chronic non-payment | | 21:18-23:32 | Simpson’s cash businesses and evasion schemes | | 27:02-29:55 | Cash rings, asset protection, IRS involvement | | 31:06-32:43 | Florida and Nevada homes; legal protections | | 34:05-34:45 | The estate finally pays—what changed? | | 35:10-37:59 | Criminal not guilty, civil guilty verdict | | 41:27-44:52 | Civil trial allows polygraph; Simpson fails | | 47:33-49:22 | The Bruno Magli shoe evidence |

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Conclusion

Nancy Grace delivers a characteristically impassioned, forensic, and sometimes acerbic analysis of the O.J. Simpson saga, focusing on the denial of financial justice until after Simpson’s death. The episode is both a refresher on notorious details and a call to remember the real impact on victims’ families. Guests provide legal, investigative, and psychological context, laying bare both the systemic failures and the ultimate (if delayed) accountability via Simpson’s estate. It’s a searing reminder, in Nancy’s words, “too little, too late” can still mean victory — even if cold comfort — for those who never stopped fighting for justice.

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Transcript

[Nancy Grace]

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[911 Dispatcher/Caller]

911 emergency. Yeah, can you send someone to my house? Well, my ex husband or my husband just broke into my house and he's ranting and raving now he's just walked out in the front yard. Has he been drinking? No, but he's crazy.

[Nancy Grace]

You know, just looking at him makes me sick. But one thing that makes me feel a little bit better is I know he is spinning out right now in hell with Satan having to be forced to pay out $58 million to his murder victims families. This after he stonewalled over 30 years, engaging in all sorts of nefarious activity to avoid paying the families of the two people. He don't look at me and smile to take that down. I don't even want to see that. He tried every move he could to avoid paying them and he swore he would never pay them. This as he lived the whole life. A mansion in Florida, another home, I guess a vacation home. Playing golf on beautiful golf courses every day. Being guests in expensive restaurants, hotels all across the world. Let's see a shot from our friends at TMZ of Orenthal James Simpson partying hardy. This as he knows. Oh yeah, there you go. He would find one Nicole Brown look alike after the next. We've got clips of him partying all over the world. Clips out the yin yang. Why didn't he have a job to pay off his debts Again, that's from our buddy Harvey Levin over at tmz, so let's get down right to it. This is where it all starts.

[911 Dispatcher/Caller]

Listen, I want emergency. Yeah, can you send someone to my house? What's the problem there? Well, my ex husband or my husband just broke into my house and he's ranting and raving. Now he's just walked out in the front yard. Have you been drinking or anything? No, but he's crazy. Is he Blackwater husband? Black. What's he wearing right now? Black pants and a golf shirt.

[Nancy Grace]

Okay, I've heard so many 911 calls from Nicole Brown. Some of them have him beating the door down, screaming at her, trying to just get through a locked door so he could attack her. And let's take a listen.

[911 Dispatcher/Caller]

Someone over here now to 325Gretna Green. He's back. Please. Okay, what does he look like?

[Nancy Grace]

O.J.

[911 Dispatcher/Caller]

Simpson? I think you know his record. Hey, what is he doing there? He's got all my figures. Wait a minute. What kind of car is he in? He's in a White Bronco. But first of all, he broke the back door down to get in. Wait a minute. What's your name? Nicole Simpson. Okay, is he the sports caster or whatever? Yeah. Okay, wait a minute. We're sending the police. What is he doing? Is he threatening you? He's still yelling at you. Just stand right. Okay.

[Nancy Grace]

To John Bueller joining us, former detective Modesto pd. You know him well. He is one of the elite detectives that put Scott Peterson behind bars. Peterson behind bars tonight having a glass of pruno and plotting his next appeal. Do you hear Simpson in the background screaming and beating on the door? Do you hear that? I hear it, yeah.

[John Bueller (Former Detective)]

And it's this falls into the tail end of the domestic violence cycle that people go through whether they're famous or not famous. And of course, in this one there was a lot of fame involved in it. But if you back up the clock and you take a look at the relationship between Nicole and O.J. he even started pushing her a little bit when they were dating when she was 18 and he was 30. There would be little things that he would do that that she apparently didn't think much of and she let it go. And this is the problem that we run into with a charming person. The devil walks amongst us, usually disguised in a pretty good looking frame. But they push every time. And when they get away with it, they'll push a little bit further and eventually it ends up like this. And it's not the only one.

[Nancy Grace]

We've had many of them from the beginning of that evening before Nicole and Ron were slaughtered in the front yard. Simpson was angry. Now you hear my old co anchor Johnny Cochran trying to smooth it all over in front of the jury.

[Chris Melcher (Celebrity Lawyer)]

Listen, there's Mr. Simpson kissing Denise Brown, kissing Ms. Juditha Brown, Mr. Lewis Brown.

[John Bueller (Former Detective)]

Talking to a friend. That's his son Justin, when he kisses.

[Dave Mack (Investigative Reporter)]

After Sydney's dance recital, Nicole, the children and her family leave Simpson behind at the school and go to dinner with friends at Metzaluna in Brentwood. Nicole's mother accidentally leaves her glasses behind. And Ron Goldman, a friend of Nicole who works at the restaurant, volunteers to drop the glasses off at Nicole's house. Goldman leaves Mezzaluna at 9:45pm that closing.

[Nancy Grace]

Arguments from our friends at Court TV. So to you, Alexis Toreschuk joining us, Crime Stories investigative reporter Alexis. He was already stewing because he did not get invited to the family dinner after Sidney's recital. That started the whole thing.

[Alexis Torreschuk (Crime Stories Investigative Reporter) / Shannon Henry (Surviving Assault Founder) / Dr. Cheryl Ehrrett (Clinical Forensic Psychologist)]

That was right. He wanted to go to dinner with them. Nicole at this point was Done with him. She had been calling 911 over 10 times. She keeps calling, she keeps saying, you've got to come and help me. This man is going to kill me. He's here, he's breaking down the door, he's hitting me. You can hear in one of the calls, she's screaming, you can actually hear him hitting her. So he, she says, no, you're not coming to dinner. I'm going with my friends and my family. She goes to dinner. Two hours later, Nicole Brown is dead.

[Nancy Grace]

Shannon Henry joining U.S. president, founder Sass surviving assault standing Shannon I misspoke. I said this is what started it. But in domestic abuse, nothing that the woman, typically a woman does is the reason for the abuse. Him not getting invited to dinner that night after the recital was an excuse because the beatings, the torture, the verbal abuse, the beatings to near death actually are not triggered because he didn't get invited to go out with his mother in law. He wanted to beat her, he wanted to kill her. It has nothing to do with the family get together.

[Alexis Torreschuk (Crime Stories Investigative Reporter) / Shannon Henry (Surviving Assault Founder) / Dr. Cheryl Ehrrett (Clinical Forensic Psychologist)]

It has nothing to do with the family get together and it has everything to do with the fact that this man was in control of her. We have to start thinking of these victims as people that are inside of cages. We can't see the bars from the outside, but the bars are very much control. They are control over finances, children, your every move, your mind, your body. They're stalking, they're intimidating and any opportunity to be violent and execute more power and control over the victim is exactly what they'll do. And this was a perfect opportunity for him.

[Nancy Grace]

The evening progresses.

[Alexis Torreschuk (Crime Stories Investigative Reporter) / Shannon Henry (Surviving Assault Founder) / Dr. Cheryl Ehrrett (Clinical Forensic Psychologist)]

Not invited to family dinner at Mezzaluna, Simpson grabs McDonald's with his house guest Kaylin Kato. The pair return to Simpson's home around 9:40pm Around 10:40pm Kaylin hears several thumps outside his room and goes to investigate, but gets distracted by the limo waiting outside Simpson's gate. Hired to take him to the airport.

[Dave Mack (Investigative Reporter)]

A neighbor sees Nicole's white Akita Kato wandering the neighborhood alone, barking, agitated. And on closer inspection, they notice he has bloody paws. The neighbor follows Cato to investigate, discovering Nicole and ron's bodies at 12:10am Joining.

[Nancy Grace]

Us, high profile defense attorney, celebrity lawyer Chris Melter is a partner at Walzer, Metcher and Yode. Chris, thank you for being with us. You know, I've started timelines, criminal timelines in a lot of odd ways. It can be from a photograph, it can be from a nav system. When a car is turned and we know that moment, it can be from a watch that's broken at the time of a murder or attack. There are many ways to start a criminal timeline. This timeline was actually started with the dog out wailing, and the witness at trial referred to the dog as emitting a woeful cry unlike anything the neighbor had heard before. A plaintiff cry.

[Chris Melcher (Celebrity Lawyer)]

Yeah, I mean, that really speaks to the horrific nature of that crime scene, but also Nicole's nature and having this pet that obviously loved her and was experiencing this crime scene and what happened to Nicole and really calling for help. So there's a lot of richness there in the prosecution, you know, kind of relating that story in the timeline.

[Dave Mack (Investigative Reporter)]

And.

[Chris Melcher (Celebrity Lawyer)]

And it is confounding, you know, to think that after all of this evidence, these 911 tapes, that he was acquitted in the criminal trial. It's just absolutely amazing looking back at this from so many years.

[Alexis Torreschuk (Crime Stories Investigative Reporter) / Shannon Henry (Surviving Assault Founder) / Dr. Cheryl Ehrrett (Clinical Forensic Psychologist)]

Detectives Fuhrman and Fanatter go to Simpson's nearby home to notify him of his wife's death. Fuhrman sees what appears to be blood stains on Simpson's Ford Bronco and decides to jump the fence to gain access to Simpson's property. Fannatter declares Simpson's home a crime scene and goes to secure a search warrant.

[Nancy Grace]

For the house around 7am Simpson leaves.

[Dave Mack (Investigative Reporter)]

Home at 11:10pm to catch an 11:45 flight to Chicago, lands 5:30am checking into the O' Hare Plaza Hotel at 6:15. At 7am detectives inform Simpson of the murders over the phone and ask him to return to LA. Simpson flies back June 13 and is handcuffed on arrival. Simpson is questioned for hours, and investigators photograph a cut on his finger.

[Nancy Grace]

You know, it's amazing to me, John Bueller, that Furman, if this is part of some conspiracy to convict a beloved sports legend. Furman sees at the beginning blood stains on Simpson's Ford Bronco at the very beginning. There's not time to create a conspiracy of any sort.

[John Bueller (Former Detective)]

Well, not even remotely, because Simpson or correction, Furman, he didn't even work at Downtown at Robbery Homage, he was a divisional detective in that area. So he didn't even really know Lang and Van Atter very much at the time. But also his hopping the fence, you can take a look at that, his exigent circumstances. He might have thought that OJ could also be a victim. Nothing really wrong with what he did there. But when you take a look at the whole case and you go to the conclusion of it, excluding the jury's verdict, there's no exculpatory evidence in this case. Whatsoever. And when you have a premeditated murder that's carried out, it's going to be rare that you'll have an eyewitness or you'll have a videotape. But when, when it comes to this case, there's nobody else that they could ever determine would have any animosity towards the either Nicole or Mr. Goldman because there was just nothing there. Everything, every arrow and dagger of circumstantial evidence pointed right back to O.J.

[Nancy Grace]

I'M trying to figure out how O.J. simpson for all these decades managed to avoid paying the Goldmans and the Browns any money on the multi million dollar civil verdict against him. Let's forge forward. Listen.

[911 Dispatcher/Caller]

Nine one one, what are you reporting? This is, this is A.C. i have O.J. in the car. Okay, where are you, please? I'm coming up the 5 Freeway. Okay, right now we all, we are okay, but you gotta tell the police to just back off. He's still alive, that he got a gun to his head. Okay, hold on. Man it, Monica. He just want to see his mother. Let me get him to the house. Okay, hold on a moment. Is everything else okay? Everything right now is okay, officer. Everything is okay. All about. He wants me to get it to his mom, he wants me to get.

[Nancy Grace]

It to his house.

[911 Dispatcher/Caller]

Okay, so that's all I, that's all we ask. He got a gun. Okay, what, what's your name? My name is A.C. you know who I am? God. Okay. All righty, sir, hold on just a moment.

[Nancy Grace]

I mean, let's get right down to it. He wants to go to his mother's house. Dr. Cheryl Ehrrett joining us, clinical forensic psychologist specializing in cases just like this. Every defendant I have ever had, without fail, the vast majority, when they skip bond, they run home to mommy and hide under the bed or in the closet. Never fails. Where do you go when you're in trouble? To mommy. And here you have A.C. cowlings, his wingman, telling the police to back off and let Simpson go home to mommy. Really? And he's holding himself hostage.

[Alexis Torreschuk (Crime Stories Investigative Reporter) / Shannon Henry (Surviving Assault Founder) / Dr. Cheryl Ehrrett (Clinical Forensic Psychologist)]

Yes. And we also see that this is another example of a defendant making demands while he's being arrested. And we have seen this over and over again, power and control. He's going to call the shots, he's going to say what's going to happen next. And Cowling was helping him. I mean we, we remember well, this low speed chase, it went on and on and on. And you know, there was a lot of special treatment for this man. There was a lot of privilege for this man, and you know it. These events were so devastating for the Browns and the Goldman family. They've been put through such hel all of these years. And it is really something to see this finally come to a head and.

[Nancy Grace]

To see some sort of retribution from ktvu. Let me understand something, John Bueller. I have never seen someone hold themselves hostage and the police actually go along with it. And this is during the low speed chase with people hanging off bridges with signs that go, go juice free OJ blah blah, blah. What was that and why did the police allow it?

[John Bueller (Former Detective)]

Well, you got to remember there was a pretty big microscope on LAPD at the time. We've just come out of Rodney King a few years earlier than that. And their actions are going to be scrutinized. If OJ Happened to commit suicide because they didn't do everything that they possibly could to keep that from happening, the whole world is going to line up against them. So it's one of those things where he got special treatment throughout the time that he was dealt with because of his fame, because of the football link and because he is very charming, just like so many of these guys are. And when it comes to this, they, they were kind of put in a, in a bad position because no matter what the dispatch complaint taker did, whatever the dispatchers did, LA County Sheriff's Department and you throw in CHP in there along with lapd, anything they did that would push OJ to go over the edge would be put right back on top of them big time. But also, if you really look at it, what guy who didn't kill his wife is going to be doing these kinds of antics? So all of the things that he did after the killing just line up with the fact that he did the.

[Nancy Grace]

Killings in the last days. O.J. simpson Absolutely spinning in hell as his state forced to pay nearly $60 million on a civil verdict that happened about 30 years ago. That through all of his conniving and scheming he managed to, to avoid his entire life.

[911 Dispatcher/Caller]

91 1, what are you reporting? This is, this is AC. I have OJ in the car, but you gotta tell the police that this is. Back off. He's still alive, that he got a gun to his head. He just want to see his mother. Let me get him to the house. Okay, hold on a moment.

[Nancy Grace]

Finally, after stonewalling for decades, Simpson's estate forced to pay the families revenge. Revenge for his murder victim. Straight out to Alexis Torres, Chuck, crime stories investigative reporter.

[Alexis Torreschuk (Crime Stories Investigative Reporter) / Shannon Henry (Surviving Assault Founder) / Dr. Cheryl Ehrrett (Clinical Forensic Psychologist)]

What happened after the civil trial? O.J. simpson was ordered to pay $33 million to Fred Goldman. He spent over three decades not paying it. O.J. simpson dies. And finally, Malcolm Laverne, his executor of his estate, said, we are going to pay it. The Goldman family submitted an amount. They submitted $100 million to the judge. The judge said, I think this isn't maliciously, but I don't think these are the right numbers. And the judge has ordered him to pay $57 million to the Goldman family.

[Nancy Grace]

Well, I believe that the Goldman family was including the interest on what Simpson didn't pay for all those years.

[Chris Melcher (Celebrity Lawyer)]

Listen, the judgment for both families was 33 and a half million dollars split. Has he willingly paid anything? No.

[Dave Mack (Investigative Reporter)]

Before his death, Simpson paid just $133,000 on the 33.5 million he owed the families of Ron and Nicole, while Simpson was forced to auction his Heisman trophy for about $250,000 and turn over the rights to video game royalties and the unpublished book if I Did It. The former hall of Famer skirted payments by moving out to Nevada and Florida where state law prevented the seizure of his NFL pension and residences.

[Chris Melcher (Celebrity Lawyer)]

He has had his life continue over all these years if he's had opportunities to do things Ron didn't.

[Nancy Grace]

From our friends at abc. And there were reports, Alexis Tereschuk, that Ron Goleman's father was so incensed over what Simpson was doing that he tried to get payment from Simpson because Simpson had a whole ring of cash only businesses. So there was no record of him making money. He was making money hand over fist. That Ron's dad, we were told, showed up at a couple of these signing events where Simpson would only sign photos for stacks of money. He would not sign anything related to the murders or his civil conviction. None of that. He would sign things, basically anything but that, for cash. He would charge people to go play golf with them. He would charge people money to have lunch with him or to have dinner with him. They were all paid events and it had to be in cash. He could make $10,000, $15,000 in a day. And apparently, as the reports go, Goldman tried to go and collect the cash and it was given like a bag of pennies and laughed out. This after Ron was butchered. Then the space hamster flew his hot.

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[Nancy Grace]

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[Podcast Advertiser/Host]

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[Nancy Grace]

Explore everywhere Grand Canyon University, an affordable, private Christian university based in beautiful Phoenix, Arizona, is one of the largest universities in the country. Praised for its culture of community and impact, GCU integrates the free market system, a welcoming Christian worldview, and free and open discourse into 369 academic programs, with over 300 of them online. Join a nationwide community of learners redefining what online education looks like through academically rigorous, industry driven programs that can spark bold ideas and prepare you for a future that matters. In addition to federal grants and aid, GCU's online students receive nearly $161 million in institutional scholarships in 2024 alone. Find your purpose at Grand Canyon University Private Christian affordable. Visit gcu.edu myoffer to see the scholarships for which you could qualify. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace so let's start at the beginning. How did let's talk about the cash only ring of businesses Simpson ran. What happened?

[Alexis Torreschuk (Crime Stories Investigative Reporter) / Shannon Henry (Surviving Assault Founder) / Dr. Cheryl Ehrrett (Clinical Forensic Psychologist)]

Simpson figured out very early on that if he didn't have a record of any money, then he wouldn't have to pay it because Fred Goldman was relentless in getting justice for his son. So Simpson would have people organize a signing in a hotel room, in a private club, in a private place, and he would sign autographs, he'd sign pictures from his football days, from his broadcasting days, and people would have to pay cash. And they would literally give him stacks of cash. This wasn't like $100. It was thousands of dollars. He would get that first signings. If he played golf, you see, he played golf a lot in Nevada. He was constantly on the golf course. He at one point said he was searching for the killers. And the joke was on the golf course, O.J. no. So the people that played with him, they would have to pay him cash as well. It was never just, let's hang out with OJ As a fun time. It was constantly running this cash ring to keep him in a lifestyle that he enjoyed and to make sure that Fred Goldman could never take it. And if he would appear on podcasts, they would pay him cash. Any appearance that OJ Made, any luncheon that he did anything with, what you would think were friends was just a business transaction, totally in cash in order to thwart the settlement that the, that the court ordered him to pay.

[Nancy Grace]

Chris Melcher joining us, high profile celebrity lawyer and partner at a very prestigious law firm. Chris, how did he get away with that? I mean, we're thousands of miles away from where this was happening, but we all know it was happening. Even the Goldman's knew it was happening. Cash only, to the tune of 15, $20,000 a day.

[Chris Melcher (Celebrity Lawyer)]

Well, Nancy, this is the problem in court. When you get a judgment, it's a piece of paper, and then it's up to you to collect it. And Fred Goldman did pursue O.J. and made him kind of live in this underground economy where he was getting cash, and it just was very difficult to collect anything. But he was under a microscope. The NFL pensions, those are protected under federal law called erisa.

[Nancy Grace]

Well, Chris, wouldn't the IRS be interested in a cash only ring of businesses? This goes from memorabilia to lunches and dinners to speaking events, to podcasts. This guy's making hundreds of thousands of dollars a year. Nobody can take his mansions. So wouldn't the IRS be 3 inches up his tailpipe on this?

[Chris Melcher (Celebrity Lawyer)]

Well, that's absolutely right. He was not only failing to pay the judgment, but he was also failing to pay taxes. And we're seeing that in the probate case that's being administered here after his death, that the IRS and the California Franchise Tax Board are creditors of O.J. simpson. So they're saying they want to get paid and because for these taxes on undeclared income.

[Nancy Grace]

And it wasn't just the cash for golf. ALEXIS TORESCHUK he had other schemes to avoid paying the Browns and the Goldmans, a lot of schemes. And he got away with it and everything else his whole life until now. What about his mansion in Florida and a second home in Nevada? Seriously?

[Alexis Torreschuk (Crime Stories Investigative Reporter) / Shannon Henry (Surviving Assault Founder) / Dr. Cheryl Ehrrett (Clinical Forensic Psychologist)]

So O.J. simpson, after Nicole and Ron were killed, had got home in Florida? Florida and Nevada both have laws that you cannot take the home away from somebody in order to pay for civil trials, punishments and things like that. It's a homestead law and he was very smart about this. He did it specifically in Florida and Nevada knowing that neither of these two states would allow the Goldmans to take the money from him. So that's what he did. He planned ahead and he also lived off. He has a SAG pension, the Screen Actors Guild because he was in a lot of movies after his football career and he has a pension from the NFL. Neither of those pensions can be touched for payments for trials and verdicts and things like that. He cannot be forced to pay that out. That is his money, no matter what.

[Nancy Grace]

Alexis have you seen his Florida home? I'm looking at it right now. It's beautifully manicured, palm trees everywhere. It has a private basketball court. It has a huge pool with a palm tree overlooking it. It's high tech, kitchen, fireplaces all around the home. It's really expensive. How come he didn't have to sell that Chris Melcher and pay the murder victims families?

[Chris Melcher (Celebrity Lawyer)]

So unfortunately there are protections in Florida for a home and it's called the Homestead act. And OJ Was aware of this, that's why undoubtedly he purchased this expensive home there because the Goldman's could not use that home as a source of collecting. It's just protected under law.

[Nancy Grace]

You're seeing in the background there is Simpson, we believe, at his pool, at his home. And am I right? Is there a Nevada home as well?

[Alexis Torreschuk (Crime Stories Investigative Reporter) / Shannon Henry (Surviving Assault Founder) / Dr. Cheryl Ehrrett (Clinical Forensic Psychologist)]

ALEXIS torres Chuck There is a home in Nevada. You know, when he got out of prison, he was actually struggling to find a place to live. No state wanted to take him. He was allowed to stay in Nevada and he bought a home in a private gated community. Very expensive, very fancy as well. And Nevada has the same law as Florida. And so the Goldman's could not touch this home either. He lived there, he did his daily, he got a Twitter account and he would post daily videos from his yard, from his home, talked about his lifestyle with his fantasy football Picks. He talked about golf. There, you see, this is the Nevada home, and that's where he spent the last of his years.

[Nancy Grace]

I'm looking at his Nevada home right now. It is directly on a golf course. Simpson's living in a massive home, a Vegas home on a golf course. It's palatial, 5,000 square foot, and a private Vegas gated community right next to a golf course. Now, in one of the homes where he was living, it was the home of a longtime friend. Five bedrooms, five and a half bath, pool, hot tub, putting green, 20 minutes from the Vegas strip. It goes on and on. What I don't understand to you, John Bueller, is how a double killer can live like this when he should be behind bars and never paid the victims.

[John Bueller (Former Detective)]

Well, pretty obvious flaw in the system when it comes to stuff like that. I understand the laws set up to protect people's property when they're, you know, living there the rest of their life, but at the same time, it would seem that something should be changed on that. Where he should be forced to give up one of those two homes to the victim's families on this. I mean, I live in one house. I wouldn't want to. But he's pretty shrewd character when he's coming up with this stuff. I'm sure he had a team of pretty good lawyers that were advising him on how to get away with this stuff, not only to get away with the murder, but he got away with not paying for many, many years.

[Dave Mack (Investigative Reporter)]

More than 31 years after Simpson is found liable for the deaths of Nicole and Ron, Simpson's estate finally agrees to pay damages to Goldman's family. Simpson's estate has agreed to pay ron's father, Fred, $58 million plus interest. It's unclear what spurred the change of heart. Executor Malcolm Laverne, previously swearing to never pay Goldman a dollar, saying right now is okay, officer.

[911 Dispatcher/Caller]

Everything is okay. All about. He wants the community gave to his mom. He wants me to give to his house. Okay, so that's all I. That's all we have. He got a gun in his head.

[Dave Mack (Investigative Reporter)]

Okay.

[911 Dispatcher/Caller]

What's your name? My name is A.C. you know who I am? God. Okay. All righty, sir. Hold on just a moment.

[Nancy Grace]

In the last days, an incredible turn of events. Simpson must be spinning out as his estate forced to pay $58 million to his murder victim's family. Now, he skated at the criminal trial, as we all recall. Remember this? This is O.J. simpson's One Day in court.

[911 Dispatcher/Caller]

By your.

[Nancy Grace]

Decision to Control his very life in your hands.

[911 Dispatcher/Caller]

Treat it carefully, treat it fairly, be.

[Nancy Grace]

Fair, don't be part of this continuing cover up.

[Alexis Torreschuk (Crime Stories Investigative Reporter) / Shannon Henry (Surviving Assault Founder) / Dr. Cheryl Ehrrett (Clinical Forensic Psychologist)]

Do the right thing.

[911 Dispatcher/Caller]

Remembering that if it doesn't fit, you must acquit.

[Podcast Advertiser/Host]

In the matter of the people of the State of California vs. Orenthal James Simpson, case number BA097211, we the jury in the above and title action find the defendant Orenthal James Simpson not guilty of the crime of murder in violation of penal code section 187A, a felony upon Nicole Brown Simpson.

[Nancy Grace]

That's referencing Court TV. FYI they already knew what the verdict was because the jurors had been told to gather up their belongings and leave. Long story short, that was no surprise. But I guarantee you Chris Melcher, never ever should a defendant be allowed to perform an experiment in front of the jury that has not been tried before. Why would the state hand over the evidence and have a demonstration? Why would they allow that to happen? And I guarantee you Melcher, if I had been in that courtroom, I think I could have made that glove fit on Simpson's Virginia ham of a hand. The thing was drenched in blood and dried out. This was a moment, a turning, a pivotal moment. And I got to hand it to Cochran, it worked. This is from our friends at cnn. It worked Melcher.

[Chris Melcher (Celebrity Lawyer)]

Well it absolutely did Nancy. And that was just a huge tactical error by the prosecutor and by the trial judge because you know this trial is a search for the truth. And this courtroom experiment was designed to yield this result where the glove doesn't fit because he's not making it fit, he's also wearing a surgical glove underneath it. And then it gives us great line for Johnny Cochran to say if he doesn't fit you must acquit. So that that was a pivotal moment in the case for the prosecution to.

[Nancy Grace]

Lose it man, big time. But just one year later, a very different scenario.

[Dave Mack (Investigative Reporter)]

One year after a civil trial begins, the families of Nicole and Ron sue Simpson for wrongful deaths. The Civil trial lasts five months. 12 person jury finding O.J. simpson responsible for the murders and awards $8.5 million to Ron Goldman's parents and determines Simpson should pay 25 million in punitive damages to both victims families.

[Nancy Grace]

Then the space hamster flew his hot air balloon all the way to the.

[Alexis Torreschuk (Crime Stories Investigative Reporter) / Shannon Henry (Surviving Assault Founder) / Dr. Cheryl Ehrrett (Clinical Forensic Psychologist)]

Bottom of the ocean.

[Podcast Advertiser/Host]

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[Commercial Narrator]

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[Nancy Grace]

University, an affordable private Christian university based in beautiful Phoenix, Arizona, is one of the largest universities in the country. Praised for its culture of community and impact, GCU integrates the free market system, a welcoming Christian worldview, and free and open discourse into 369 academic programs, with over 300 of them online. Join a nationwide community of learners redefining what online education looks like through academically rigorous, industry driven programs that can spark bold ideas and prepare you for a future that matters. In addition to federal grants and aid, GCU's online students receive nearly $161 million in institutional scholarships in 2024 alone. Find your purpose at Grand Canyon University Private Christian Affordable. Visit gcu Edu myoffer to see the scholarships for which you could qualify. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace Dave can we talk about Simpson's failed polygraph? The polygraph that was admitted at the civil trial?

[Dave Mack (Investigative Reporter)]

You know, it's amazing, Nancy, how at a civil trial you have a different a different level of what can be Used and what cannot be used in that actual trial. So O.J. simpson's polygraph test, which of course never would be in a criminal trial, it gets led into the civil trial and OJ Simpson flat out flunks the test. And, you know, it becomes a big deal because it said he definitely.

[Nancy Grace]

Wait a minute. Wait a minute. Huh? Stop, stop, stop. Dave Mac, did you say he flunks? That would bring to mind a zero at worst. Dave Mack, you are certainly airbrushing the truth. You're putting perfume on the pig. He didn't make a zero. He made a negative 24. Please, you're the investigative reporter. Why am I feeding you the facts? A negative 24. That's how badly he lied.

[Dave Mack (Investigative Reporter)]

It was considered definitively deceptive. And it was a secret lie detector test that he took two days after the murders took place. As you mentioned, on a scale where a -6 score indicates borderline deception, his was way beyond that and into definite deception in his answers to questions surrounding the killings of Nicole and Ron.

[Nancy Grace]

Chris Melcher, Civil and criminal CELEBRITY lawyer Of course, unless both parties stipulate to a polygraph ahead of time before the poly is taken. Polys are not allowed. Lie detectors are not allowed in criminal trials. For the most part, across our country, civil cases are a far different matter. Now, did you hear what Dave Mack said? He mentioned a subtle but important distinction. He stated that this poly on which Simpson made a negative 24 worse than a zero. It was a private polygraph. What does that mean? That means it was a defense polygraph. The state would have sent him to a state recognized polygrapher, one that they use all the time. I think you would agree with that. So this is a private polygraph. And even with the defense making up the questions and administering softball questions to Simpson, he failed. He did worse than failing. He went into negative double digits. That's how badly he lied. And, you know, I know Johnnie Cochran, God rest his soul, he had Simpson ready, the defense had him ready to take that poly, and he still failed. That's like knowing the questions on the test. Melcher and still failing.

[Chris Melcher (Celebrity Lawyer)]

That's right. I mean, because he was guilty. And also, I'm just really surprised that they even allowed him or even thought about taking a polygraph test because they didn't bear any burden at the criminal trial and to expose him to any statements or any testing. I'm just, again, really surprised that any attorney would think that he would pass this thing. But obviously he didn't. And the civil jury got it right. The criminal jury got it wrong.

[Nancy Grace]

Hey, you know what, Dave Mack? I'm thinking about it. And Cochran didn't join the defense team until later. So I guarantee you, if Cochran had been there at that moment, there is no way in h e double he would have let Simpson take a polly. Now, granted, under Brady v. Maryland. Let's put it in a nutshell. Melcher Brady v. Maryland. The state must hand over all exculpatory evidence to the defense. A Brady violation is when the state fails to do that for whatever reason. However, if the defense has something damning against their own client, they do not have to hand it over to the state.

[Chris Melcher (Celebrity Lawyer)]

Well, that's right, because the criminal defendant, O.J. in this case bears no burden. He has a right to remain silent. He doesn't have to produce evidence against himself unless it's physical evidence of a crime that's in his possession. So they can do these tests, like a polygraph test, just to see internally, like how he might fare. But it's the prosecution that has the burden to turn over exculpatory or evidence that potentially could lead to him being not guilty. Because that's just fair. Otherwise we could end up convicting someone who's factually innocent.

[Nancy Grace]

And I tell you what I think happened, Chris. I think that for the civil trial, the plaintiffs, who would be the Goldmans and the Browns, you know, filed their motion for discovery and they got the results of the poly that he failed. That's how they got it. Because this was a defense poly. It was not a plaintiff's or a state poly. So they had to get it through discovery or they found out about it and subpoenaed it. But however they got it, they got it. And that had a lot to do with the civil verdict, which we're talking about today. Because tonight, while O.J. simpson is having supper with Satan and Beelzebub, you know, he is PO'd technical legal term, that his estate is paying out $58 million. When he swore, he swore, dare I say, on the Bible, he would never pay the victim's family. Never. Regarding the poly, that's not all. Dave Mack, do you remember the quote? His words, not mine. Dave Mack, the ugly ass Bruno Molly shoes that were believed to have been worn the night of the murders based on a distinctive shoe pattern found in blood. Remember the Bruno Molly he swore he didn't own? Remember that? What happened, Dave?

[Dave Mack (Investigative Reporter)]

Nancy, These are size 12 Bruno Molly shoes. They're actually the Lorenzo model shoe that was found in the blood at the crime scene. O.J. swore up and down under Oath, he didn't own them. I don't have those shoes. I don't know what you're talking about. However, during the trial, civil trial, there's photographs of Simpson wearing the same type of Bruno Molly shoes that was found the footprint of in the blood. Now here's the key on these Bruno Molly's, they're a rare shoe. There were only 299 pairs of size 12 Bruno Mollies even sold in the United States at the time. And him claiming that these are ugly ass shoes, doesn't own them and wouldn't wear them. And then they bought the pictures up there and they actually showed him on the sidelines of a Buffalo Bills game where he's standing out there as a celebrity and there he is wearing the Bruno Molly shoes that he swears he doesn't own and doesn't wear.

[Nancy Grace]

Like every good lawyer, attorney Petrocelli, if you remember that name, Chris Melcher laid a trap and Simpson walked right into it. He asked again under oath about the Bruno Molly shoes and of course Simpson lied. Then he produced a photo, I believe it came from the Enquirer magazine that photoed Simpson walking along the sidelines, hands in his pockets, happy as anything, wearing the shoes. And they are Italian luxury footwear. Who could afford those? O.J. simpson. And there he was, busted. The civil jury was sitting there listening to this and fell out.

[Chris Melcher (Celebrity Lawyer)]

There was so much evidence pointing towards his guilt, that being one of them. What are the chances that some homicidal person here in the west side of Los Angeles is wearing these expensive Italian loafers and then connecting it the way that it happened here in the civil case? Again, we're seeing different evidence, a different jury, a different standard of proof, but this civil jury understanding it and the criminal jury, and again, we were all there, we saw this outcome and it's just so unbelievable that the criminal jury just was led astray in thinking that he was not guilty.

[Nancy Grace]

A photo of Simpson in the murder shoes. Now what I don't understand, Chris, is why that was not introduced at the criminal trial.

[Chris Melcher (Celebrity Lawyer)]

Yeah, I, I'm assuming that, that the prosecution did not have the evidence of the photograph showing. I, I don't know. And, and we also have to remember that 30 years ago is a lot different than today. If there were a prosecution happening today, there is an overwhelming amount of evidence on social media and we have citizen journalists or people who are concerned, your listeners would be scouring somebody, OJ's social media page, if this case was happening right now, and finding that evidence and sending it to detectives or the prosecution team. And this is an extension, a community extension of the prosecution by getting that evidence and showing it. But 30 years ago we didn't have that money.

[Nancy Grace]

I'm sure the family of the murder victims appreciate it, even though it's decades late and is cold comfort. In exchange for a lifetime without Ron and Nicole, we remember an American hero Officer Mark Brock Vivian, PD, LA, 25, shot in the line of duty, leaving behind a grieving fiance. American hero Officer Mark Brock Nancy Grace signing off. Goodbye friend. Then the space hamster flew his hot.

[Podcast Advertiser/Host]

Air balloon all the way to the.

[Nancy Grace]

Bottom of the ocean.

[Podcast Advertiser/Host]

Where did that story come from? Book Dream? Nope. It came from a conversation. Meet Meco Mini plus, the AI companion that co creates personalized story adventures with your child in real time. What color was the hamster's cape and what did he pack for lunch? Unlock your child child's imagination. Discover Miko Mini plus and the Magic of AI Exclusively at Costco.

[Commercial Narrator]

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[Alexis Torreschuk (Crime Stories Investigative Reporter) / Shannon Henry (Surviving Assault Founder) / Dr. Cheryl Ehrrett (Clinical Forensic Psychologist)]

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[Nancy Grace]

What do they talk about?

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[Chris Melcher (Celebrity Lawyer)]

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[Nancy Grace]

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