SAVANNAH GUTHRIE MOM MISSING: DAY 13

Summary

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Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

Episode: Savannah Guthrie Mom Missing: Day 13
Date: February 13, 2026
Host: Nancy Grace

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Overview

Main Theme:
Nancy Grace and an expert panel analyze the investigation into the disappearance of Nancy Guthrie (Savannah Guthrie’s mother), missing for 13 days. The episode covers newly discovered surveillance videos, a composite sketch, crucial forensic evidence, and controversy over investigative procedures—including jurisdictional tensions between local police and the FBI. Updates include the release of sketches, DNA evidence recovery, and appeals for public assistance.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. New Surveillance Video Emerges & Crowdsourcing Evidence

[00:50-03:57]

• Doorbell, yard, and wildlife camera footage is flooding in from the public. The FBI and local police are combing through thousands of tips and videos.
• Nancy stresses the importance of not jumping to conclusions based on these videos, as innocent people could be mistakenly implicated.

Quote:

“It's really important that we don't have a wild goose chase for the wrong guy, right? But please, everybody, keep sending your videos, your door cams, your everything, because you never know when you're gonna hit.” – Nancy Grace [02:10]

Expert Input (Tammy Ballard):

“Excluding somebody is as important as including somebody. So whatever information…to include or exclude somebody is very, very critical at this time.” [03:40]

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2. The Digital Forensics Push: How the FBI Is Handling Data

[03:57-09:35]

• Scott Eicher (digital forensics, ex-FBI CAST) explains there are likely over 100 analysts reviewing submissions.
• Despite initial limitations (Guthrie’s lack of a paid Nest subscription), the FBI, with Google’s help, managed to retrieve critical porch cam video before its deletion from the cloud.

Quote:

“It’s not easy…You got to hand it to…the CAST people…providing that to Google based on the camera itself—it has a specific identifier that Google can track.” – Scott Eicher [08:26]

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3. The Role (and Limits) of Video & Audio Evidence

[09:58-13:26]

• Discussion of whether additional camera footage from inside Guthrie’s home (so-called ‘granny cams’) could be recovered, plus the possibility of audio evidence.
• Not all Nest cameras have microphones; whether any relevant audio was captured remains uncertain.

Quote:

“Some cameras, Nest cameras, have microphones, some do not. So it really just depends on the type of camera that was being used at that point.” – Scott Eicher [13:14]

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4. Composite Sketches – Official & Unofficial

[13:26-19:18]

• Review of a widely shared sketch (by retired Houston forensic artist Lois Gibson, not officially released by authorities).
• Debate over accuracy: the ski mask might obscure or distort features such as eyebrows.
• AI’s role in enhancing composite sketches is considered, but experts generally favor a human touch for now.

Quote:

“You don’t want to interject stuff into this investigation that's not approved…You're going to send people down the wrong road if that sketch is off.” – Scott Eicher [18:45]

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5. Physical Evidence Bombshell: Gloves & DNA

[19:55-27:47]

• Several gloves found inside Guthrie’s home, sent to a private Florida lab for DNA analysis—a decision questioned by Nancy and experts, given FBI involvement.
• Tammy Ballard explains private labs may be faster and are trusted by local authorities, but only official labs can access CODIS (the national DNA database).

Quote:

“A private lab can't just get into CODIS. ...States can. State crime labs can access CODIS. The FBI can access CODIS. ...It's a national database of DNA.” – Nancy Grace [23:54]

Details on DNA Analysis:

• Gloves likely hold mixed DNA; insider and outsider profiles must be separated for investigation.
• DNA from the gloves could originate from the victim, perpetrator, or even accidental sources (e.g., law enforcement officers, house workers).

Quote:

“Every time you touch an item, you're going to potentially have that transfer of another person's DNA... If those gloves have touched Nancy, then they are going to have Nancy's DNA potentially on them. You need to take her out of the equation so that you're only looking for that perpetrator.” – Tammy Ballard [26:53]

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6. Potential Evidence Inside the Home

[33:03-36:27]

• Panelists suggest other evidence to look for: fingerprints, bloodstain pattern analysis (to determine if Guthrie fought back), fiber evidence from clothing or vehicles, hair.
• A shift in investigative focus: from a missing persons case to possible kidnapping as more evidence appears.

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7. Vehicle Evidence Focus: The Gray Truck

[37:14-44:11]

• Law enforcement is pushing for video footage of a possible gray truck seen in the neighborhood during two specific windows:
  • January 11th, after 9pm
  • January 31st, 9:30–11:00am
• Tracking a vehicle is critical; car experts can deduce make and model from footage, as in famous recent cases (e.g., Brian Kohberger in Idaho, Mollie Tibbetts).

Quote:

"The vehicle, I can't stress the importance of it... They can look at a car and go, oh yeah, that's a 1984 Chevy Malibu, black in color with blah blah, blah, and all of the details." – Nancy Grace [39:27]

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8. The Power—and Peril—of Cell Phone Data

[44:11-46:15]

• Cell tower data is used to track devices that lingered or moved in/out of the crime scene. That’s how a delivery driver was cleared as a suspect after being connected to the area by phone records (he’d made legitimate deliveries).

Quote:

“We do tower dumps for the area around the crime scene…Then we start going through all that data and figure out, okay, which ones are stationary during all this time. That's probably a neighbor or Nancy's phone. Now let's look at the ones that are moving in and out…” – Scott Eicher [45:08]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the rush of public tips:
  “Whatever items of evidence you can get to include or exclude somebody is very, very critical at this time.” – Tammy Ballard [03:40]
• On unofficial sketches and media attention:
  “You don't want to interject stuff into this investigation that's not approved by law enforcement. You're going to send people down the wrong road…” – Scott Eicher [18:45]
• On DNA mixtures in glove evidence:
  “Take a glove, for example. You're going to have the inside of the glove and the outside of the glove. They best be processing those separately…” – Tammy Ballard [26:53]
• On vehicle evidence and expertise:
  “They know it like heart, just like I know the Constitution. That's their business. You can determine the year, the make, the model, because every year, generally there are subtle changes to the body of a car.” – Nancy Grace [39:27]
• On cell phone data’s investigative power:
  “They pulled him over, I believe, because of his cell phone data.” – Nancy Grace [44:50]

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Important Timestamps

• [00:50] – Introduction of new surveillance video; panel assembled
• [03:35] – Importance of excluding wrong suspects (Ballard)
• [06:13] – How the FBI handles digital data (Eicher)
• [13:26] – Discussion of the composite sketch and analysis
• [19:55] – Revelation: Gloves & DNA sent to private lab
• [26:53] – DNA mixtures and glove evidence (Ballard)
• [33:03] – Other possible forensic evidence in the house
• [37:14] – Focus on the suspicious gray truck
• [44:11] – Vehicle tracking and cell phone data role

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Public Appeals & Closing

[46:15]

• $100,000 reward for tips leading to Nancy Guthrie’s recovery.
• Contact numbers for sourcing information: 1-800-225-5324 and 520-882-7463 for anonymous tips.

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Tone & Atmosphere

Nancy Grace’s tone is urgent, focused, and at times incredulous—especially when questioning law enforcement decisions. The panel provides expert, grounded insights; discussion is both technical and geared toward lay listeners. Real-time appeals to the public are emotional, striving to maintain attention on the urgency and human stakes of the case.

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Transcript

[A]

This is an iHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human. This February, Aldous Hodge returns as Alex Cross, your favorite detective on television for season two of the hit show Cross, now streaming exclusively on Prime Video. Fresh off his capture of the infamous serial killer, the fanboy Cross teams up with the FBI to hunt down a vigilante serial killer targeting corrupt billionaires. As the case unfolds, Cross navigates a moral crossroads where the lines between justice and vengeance are blurred. Catch season two of Cross, with a new episode dropping weekly, now streaming only on Prime Video. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Breaking news, Savannah Guthrie's mother, Nancy guthrie missing. Day 13 this as new video emerges, a composite sketch goes out and DNA has been sent to a private crime lab in Florida. This as word of a turf war between the FBI and local authorities emerges. The last thing we need tonight. Good evening, I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. I want to thank you for being with us. Good evening, everyone. Again, I'm Nancy Grace. I want to thank you for being with us here at Crime Stories. I want to show you video that has emerged online on Social. Let's see it, guys. At the top, which I'd like to zoom in on, we see yet another video that has been posted. It appears to be a white or Hispanic male on the front porch, reportedly from a home in the vicinity of Nancy Guthrie's home where she was kidnapped. This is an example of one of the many, many videos reportedly caught on door cam. Surveillance cam posted this as a composite has been released. Joining me, an all star panel to make sense of what we know tonight. This guy featured in this video has not been named as a suspect, a person of interest in anything in relation to Nancy Guthrie's case. Tammy Ballard. Joining us, DNA crime scene consultant, crime scene investigation and reconstruction expert, law enforcement liaison at Othram Labs and former DNA criminalist in the San Diego Police Department crime lab. Tammy, it's really important that we don't have a wild goose chase for the wrong guy, right? But please, everybody, keep sending your videos, your door cams, your everything, because you never know when you're gonna hit. All right, no one is naming him as a defendant or a perp or a co defendant in this case. Timmy Ballard. Why is it so important that the wrong person is not named?

[B]

You do not want to follow a pathway and lose valuable time. So at this point, excluding somebody is as important as including somebody. So whatever information that you can get, whatever items of evidence you can get to include or exclude somebody is very, very critical at this time.

[A]

Door cams, surveillance Cams, yard cams, hunting cams, wildlife cams are being combed at this hour. Much of that video is being posted online. Much of it is being sent to the FBI. They want it. We keep hearing about the tens of thousands of tips that are pouring in. That's their job. They have an entire and elite crew set up. Joining me, Scott Eicher, digital forensics expert, founding member of the cellular analysis survey team, cast with the FBI. They are the people, the women and men you can thank for pulling up that front door video. Let's see it because it's amazing. Remember Sheriff Nano said at the beginning, oh shucks, everybody, it's just, it's just such a terrible co. Inky dink that Nancy Guthrie did not have a subscription to her nest because if she had paid that extra 8 99amonth, then we'd have the videos of the perp. Darnie. Darn, darn. The FBI was finally invited in. They cannot just come in unrequested. And they used their cast team to comb all of the data points, literally trillions of data points of information through Google, who owns Nest. Guthrie had a Nest cam, a Nest system. And out of all of those trillions of points of data they find Nancy Guthrie's little itty bitty dark ham and they resurrect this. It's amazing. So Scott Eicher, I want you to weigh in on explain. Oh, by the way, he is now@pca experts as precision cellular analysis experts.com Scott, who is waiting through all of these videos like the one. We're just saying guy, not a suspect. That's an example of some of the videos that are being sent in. Who is doing it?

[C]

Well, you've got probably 100 analysts in, in the command post and some being working remotely going through all these tips and, and ring camera and Nest camera video to try to collate and figure out which is important, which is not important and kind of matching up movement of people through different cameras just like this Nest camera that cast was able to get. We had a good relationship with Google over the years dealing with their location information. So, so when we heard that the Nest camera was being used, we were able to contact those, those partners and they were able to pull that video. So this is fantastic that we got this. There's going to be tons of people going through all the videos and tips that people are providing from their cameras in the neighborhood for that whole month. As we've heard that the police department and FBI are asking for video from almost a month back. So it's going to be a ton of work.

[A]

Yeah, it's something like. And remind me to circle back with Dave Mack on that. It's something like January 2nd through February 1st or January 1st through February. They want the whole month, which tells me, Scott Eichor, that they believe the perp had been in the neighborhood, either casing Guthrie's home or casing everybody's home in daytime and nighttime hours, because one of the two dates specifically they are honing in on, one is daytime hours and one is nighttime hours. But, you know, Iker, you make it sound so simple. They were able to pull up this video. It's really not that simple, especially to a layperson like myself. I'm just trial lawyer. I'm not on cast. What do they have to do? Somebody puts the directive on your desk as hey way through Google and find Nancy Guthrie's home cam, her porch cam. She doesn't have a subscription, but good luck. What do you actually do to pull up to resurrect that video? It's not easy.

[C]

It's not easy. And you got to hand it to one the cast, people that know what their what looking for and providing that to Google based on the camera itself. It has a specific identifier that Google can track. Then they have to give them the time frame, and then Google has to do a lot of work to provide that. And you got to remember, we're only seeing what the law enforcement, FBI, and the sheriff's department want us to see. There might be more video that they're not releasing at this point point in time, but it is very difficult to get that data. In this case, I think this data was video was sent to the cloud by the NEST camera that recorded it. But, you know, it just did not because they didn't have a subscription, didn't come to their phones or their, you know, their login to the NEST camera. So it was kind of being held in the cloud. We just needed to make sure we got it before it was deleted. And thank God we did.

[A]

You know, Iker, who is it? Where are they? Are they in D.C. are they in Quantico? Where are the people combing through all this data?

[C]

Well, it's a combination. We always send people to that area where the event is occurring because you need real time people looking at it. But because there's so much to do, we can do remotely work and have a lot of people helping and providing that to the command.

[A]

Aldous Hodge returns as Alex Cross, your favorite detective on television for season two of the Hit show Cross, now streaming exclusively on Prime Video. Critics call season one one of the year's best shows with over 40 million viewers worldwide. And now the story continues with a new season from creator Ben Watkins. And based on characters created by James Patterson, cross is Washington, D.C. 's most brilliant homicide detective and forensic psychologist. Fresh off his capture of the infamous serial killer, the fanboy Cross teams up with the FBI to hunt down a vigilante serial killer targeting corrupt billionaires. As the case unfolds, Cross navigates a moral crossroads where the lines between justice and vengeance are blurred. Cross is back and better than ever this season. Get ready for a new case. Higher stakes, but the same Cross. Watch season two of Cross, now streaming only on Prime Video. Crime stories with Nancy Grace. I want to move now off of the video of possibly an unrelated guy on a porch that somebody sent in, reportedly from Nancy Guthrie's neighborhood. There he is on top. Not a suspect, not a person of interest. But whoever sent it is well intentioned. This is from USA News HQ on X. That's where it was posted. At this hour, we have a composite. Composite sketches are not easy. Hey, you. You just mentioned something that Eicher had said. Dave, I'm going to circle back to you on the composite, but I want to just button this up. Eicher, you stated that we are seeing only what le law enforcement wants us to see. And I agree. Is it possible that there was audio connected to the porch cam number one? Number two, we know there are cameras inside too. Inside Nancy Guthrie's home as well. How do we know that? Because Sheriff Nanos came out and made a point of saying there were none of the cameras inside were smashed. Okay. We didn't know at that juncture there were definitely cameras inside, but when he said none of the cameras inside were smashed, then we knew there were cameras inside. Is do you believe if cast and Google could mine the front porch cam, they could mine the cams inside, as I call them the granny cams, for not only video but sound.

[C]

It's a possibility we got lucky in getting this front porch camera here, but that doesn't mean they're not still working on some trying to get that data that might have been stuck in the cloud. I wouldn't say that it's impossible, but if they haven't released something by now regarding that other stuff, I think it's gone or not able to be.

[A]

What about audio?

[C]

Audio is a possibility. Some cameras nest. Cameras have microphones, some do not. So it really just depends on the type of camera that was being used at that point.

[A]

Let me see the composite sketch really quickly, please. Composite sketch. Because it seems to me that the perp on the front porch eyebrows are thinner than they are in the composite sketch. Let's see the front sketch, the perp again. But what about this? To Brian Fitzgibbons joining us. He is the director of operations, USPA Nationwide Security. He leads a team of investigators around the world finding missing people such as nancy [e-mail] Brian, when you put on the ski mask and you adjust the eyes after you pull it on, I wonder if it didn't pull his eyebrows up a little bit. Because if you look at it, he has no hooding whatsoever on his eye. His eyelids. See what I mean? It's almost like they're pulled back. And I think that's what gave me the impression, while I know it's a man, that he had effeminate features. And because his eyebrows look so thin and his. What do you make of that? Is that possible? Because the composite shows much heavier eyebrows.

[D]

Yeah. And in that composite, right. They're taking the distance of the eyes, the shape of the eyes, the distance from the eyes to the mouth. And that sketch artist is doing the best that they can to render what they're able to see from the facial structure of this individual. Now, with regards to the eyebrows and what we're seeing underneath that mask, you know, it's unclear. You know, that could be the bottom of an eyebrow. It could be being pulled up, and that could just be a shadow on that thick, stitched lining around the eyes. So it's very unclear what we're seeing there.

[A]

Oh, okay, wait, I hadn't thought of that stitching. What I am looking at and thinking it's thin, thin, even tweezed eyebrows. Could just be stitching or the underside of the ski mask. Underside of ski mask. Because I'm looking to see if it's on the bottom, too. Not really. Well, right there. Right there. Actually, Fitzgibbons, look on his left, our right.

[D]

Yeah, you can see that.

[A]

You kind of see the same lining. Mm, that's very, very astute. Especially on his left eye. Yes. Darn it. I thought I was onto something. Hey, what about this? Everybody jump in. I've got Tammy Ballard, a DNA crime scene consultant formerly with San Diego pd DNA criminalist Scott Eicher, formerly of cast now at PCA Experts, and Brian Fitzgibbons. What about AI? Can they help with the composite? They can it help with the composite thoughts, Iker?

[C]

You know, I think it can. You've seen some of the things that it's done. When you take that information and put it all in different angles, different heights, different views, and the light and dark parts, I think it can help. But, you know, the sketch artist I think would probably be better at this point in time.

[A]

A retired Houston forensic artist, Lois Gibson, created an unofficial sketch of the masked figure, hoping it would help find Nancy Guthrie. And she is legendary. She came out of retirement to create the sketch. Investigators focusing on doorbell video and from that this sketch is made. Now can AI enhance it? Let me understand this, Dave Mack. This is not an official sketch.

[E]

No, ma'.

[A]

Am. This is not released by the FBI and this is not released by nanos.

[E]

No, it is a retired crime sketch artist out of Houston named Lois Gibson. And she did this unofficially, not asked or invited, just did it out of her own background and knowledge and wrote this and drew the sketch. The FBI has given us the basic parameters of the height of a male who is 5 foot 9 to 5 foot 10, average build and wearing the black 25 liter Ozark Trail hiker pack backpack. That's what the FBI released. The description that we're looking at, the actual sketch was done by the sketch artist, Lois Gibson, retired in Houston. She was not asked to do it. She did it. And it was released through her and through local television stations who have put it out there as an unofficial sketch.

[A]

Well, I know it was not released by law enforcement or the FBI, but this woman created composite sketches for over 39 years. 5,089 sketches in all. Over 100. Over 1,266 people identified. And that is a world record for identifications based on composite sketches. Now Eicher is furiously shaking his head. No, no, no. Why Eicher?

[C]

Well, you know, I not taking any of the away from Ms. Gibson, who might be an excellent sketch artist and, and had success in the past. But you don't want to interject stuff into this investigation that's not approved by law enforcement. You're going to send people down the wrong road if that sketch is off. So we got to just make sure that it goes to law enforcement and let them release it if it's relevant to the case. We don't want to screw mess things up even more messier than it is with all the tips and all the videos that we have.

[A]

Okay, point well taken, guys. In addition to this composite sketch being put out on social and on the media, an official. Official from law enforcement description of the alleged perp has been released. Dave Mack. What do we have. What are they saying?

[E]

5 foot 9 to 5 foot 10, average build. And they did identify the backpack that he was seen with wearing that black 25 liter Ozark Trail hiker pack backpack. But 5 foot 9 to 5 foot 10, average build. That's what we're being told by the FBI.

[A]

Also at this hour, a turf war reportedly nano says, oh, that's not true. But we do know that the gloves found. And late last night we learned that a glove and DNA has been found in inside Nancy Guthrie's home. To Tammy. Well, to finish that thought, that the glove and the DNA has been sent to a private lab in Florida. Okay, let me just absorb that for a moment because you've got the FBI at your beck and call. I don't believe there's a single private lab that's got anything over on the FBI crime lab. I know that there are crime labs, private crime labs that specialize in degraded DNA mixtures of DNA where you have multiple people's DNA mixed together, old DNA minuscule or practically no DNA. That DNA has to be regenerated and tested. Why nanos chose to send the DNA out of a Tucson case to a Florida lab instead of the FBI lab at Quantico. It's actually making my head hurt. Tammy Ballard. I'm going to get to the bombshell that there is DNA in the home, which I'm not surprised about. Right. Are you? I mean, a hair, a fiber. Hey, speaking of fibers, Wayne Williams case. Remember that? Tammy Ballard, the multiple boy and teen victims, many of them had carpet fiber on their bodies that matched the carpet fiber in Wayne Williams vehicle and his parents home. As a matter of fact, a guy I worked with very closely in the Fulton District Attorney's office, Joseph Drollet, brilliant, ultimately ran our appellate division, worked on that case and worked on getting that carpet analysis into evidence. So there could be carpet fibers in there from the perp's vehicle. There could be hair, there could be fiber from that ski mask. All of that has been taken and sent to a private lab. Why, Tammy? Why?

[B]

Well, I did read somewhere that they that Pima county does have a prior arrangement with this laboratory. I am going to venture a guess that I know which private laboratory is taking on this responsibility. And I will say they won't take this on without having a rush status and having the capabilities to do what's best by the evidence. That's not saying that the FBI laboratory isn't going to prioritize this as well and again, have the best intentions with the evidence. But Both the FBI and the Florida lab potentially are going to have the limitations of getting that data, that they get those DNA profiles into the best databases possible to search for that suspect. If they don't have a suspect, the goal is going to be to get them into these databases, the CODIS databases, at every level possible, local, state and national, and they want to be able to find that perpetrator. So hopefully this private laboratory has an agreement with the state lab in Arizona that they can get these profiles once they obtain them from the glove, which I'm sure they're going to get some DNA off of those gloves. Get those into the databases is the big, big priority, so we can see if they can identify a perpetrator.

[A]

Tammy, I heard and digested everything that you just said. However, even if Arizona and I believe they spent over $200,000 with this private lab, you know, leading up to right now, even if that private lab does have an agreement with either Arizona or Florida, they're based in Florida to use codis, a private lab can't just get into codis. That's a national database of DNA. That would be like me saying, oh, I've got a private lab up in my kitchen. Can I now access codis? No, you can't. States can. State crime labs can access codis. The FBI can access codis. What is codis? It's a national database of DNA. It's created mostly of perps that have given their DNA and fingerprints when they're arrested. DNA found at crime scenes, either solved or unsolved, and more. But that said, I still don't hear an answer. Just because they have a relationship with this private lab, that private lab can't do anything the FBI can't do. And the FBI is already on the case. So why?

[B]

Well, I will say that some of these private laboratories, I mean, they will this. If it's the lab that I think it, it is, it has pretty much everything in its wheelhouse to be able to work on this case. So I would say that.

[A]

What lab do you think it is, Tammy?

[B]

I'm going to venture a guess that it's DNA Labs International, and they have a very good reputation. They have a very fast turnaround time. So I would say it would be equal to the FBI laboratory, if not potentially even more in their wheelhouse. So I don't think they would have taken this case on if they didn't have the time, the energy dedicated to it, the analysts and the promise that they're going to get this out in the best way possible. The fastest way possible. Now, the same issue is either the FBI or the Florida lab. They're still going to have to have somebody in Arizona take ownership and vet that data. So I can almost guarantee these are mixtures of DNA, and you want to get every single contributor to be able to be searched in those databases. So that's the hope that everything was explained, understood by the sheriff at that time, so that everybody knows if this is all about what's best by the evidence. No egos, no shutting people out.

[A]

Wait, wait, wait. I know what we all hope and what we all think and what we all dream is going to happen. You stated you believe there's more than one mix. What did you say? You think there's more than one DNA? Are you saying it's mixed DNA? What are you saying?

[B]

Take a glove, for example. You're going to have the inside of the glove and the outside of the glove. They best be processing those separately, because every time you touch an item, you're going to potentially have that transfer of another person's DNA. So I've done a lot of gloves in my career. Every kind from cloth to leather to the latex gloves. You're almost inherently going to have a mixture of DNA because you're touching other items, you're touching the doorknobs. So handling other people. So there's going to be. They need to be able to extract that DNA and decide how many contributors are going to be there and search effectively for all of those contributors. If those gloves have touched Nancy, then they are going to have Nancy's DNA potentially on them. You need to take her out of the equation so that you're only looking for that perpetrator.

[A]

And that is why Tammy Ballard is so renowned. She just explained why there is very likely a DNA mixture on the gloves, if in fact, the gloves are related. Hi there, everybody.

[B]

On behalf of our family, we want to thank all of you for the prayers for our beloved mom, Nancy. We feel them, and we continue to.

[A]

Believe that she feels them, too.

[B]

Our mom is a kind, faithful, loyal, fiercely loving woman of goodness and light. She is funny, spunky and clever. She has grandchildren that adore her and.

[A]

Crowd around her and cover her with kisses. She loves fun. Aldous Hodge returned as Alex Cross, your favorite detective on television for season two of the hit show Cross, now streaming exclusively on Prime Video. Critics call season one one of the year's best shows with over 40 million viewers worldwide. The story continues with with a new season from creator Ben Watkins and based on characters created by James Patterson, cross is Washington D.C. 's most brilliant homicide detective and forensic psychologist. Fresh off his capture of the infamous serial killer, the fanboy, Cross teams up with the FBI to hunt down a vigilante serial killer targeting corrupt billionaires. As the case unfolds, Cross navigates a moral crossroads as where the lines between justice and vengeance are blurred. Cross is back and better than ever this season. Get ready for a new case. Higher stakes, but the same Cross Watch season two of Cross now streaming only on Prime Video. Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. At the sour the the reward for information leading to the recovery of Nancy Guthrie has been doubled to $100,000. $100,000. Last night we learned that there is DNA that has been recovered inside Nancy Guthrie's home. And seemingly it said that there's another glove in there. Dave Mack, what did we learn inside the home?

[E]

Nancy Multiple gloves, plural, gloves were found inside the home. You know, we've been talking about the glove that was found outside during the search about a mile and a half from Nancy's home. But last night we're finding out that gloves plural were found inside the home and were apparently shipped to Florida for analysis. Did the lab as we were talking about a few minutes ago. So yeah, multiplied the home.

[A]

Tell me what everybody let's put our heads together what type of DNA could be in the home. And I really do not like something again that nano said and I don't like spending a lot of time saying what the cops or the sheriff did wrong in the middle of an investigation because it's time waster. But he did say that there is no turf war and this is what concerned me. He said these gloves may not even be related. Okay, so what they get second class treatment because they might not be related? Every fingerprint at a print at a crime scene may not be related. That threw me for a loop that he said that Brian Fitzgibbons they may not be even related.

[D]

Yeah.

[A]

What does that have to do with anything? They may be related.

[D]

That was a little bit of a head scratcher. I mean any article or piece of evidence found at the crime scene may not be related. Right. So everything needs to be processed and treated the same. So that that comment was a little bit of a head scratcher. Now I think what he was probably referring to is hey, was this discarded? Were these gloves discarded by a deputy on early on the scene where they dropped. Were they dropped by a worker at the house? And it's unrelated to the kidnapping. But hey, we're going to find out pretty soon here.

[A]

Bombshell A glove found inside Nancy Guthrie's home could be a major, major discovery. So Temi Ballard was just explaining some of the obstacles that the lab will face when trying to separate, differentiate, and examine DNA, we hope, found on the glove. You stated Tammy Ballard, potential DNA inside the glove and. And on the outside of the glove. What other DNA or evidence, fiber evidence, could be found in the home of Nancy Guthrie?

[B]

Yes, fiber evidence, that's different. A little tougher to come by, but hopefully something is very well processed. But also fingerprint evidence is a big one. Hopefully they did a lot of fingerprint evidence, potentially. I know there are gloves involved. The big one I would be looking for as well is the blood source that's on the front porch. Does that start and begin in the household? And if so, was Nancy able to fight back? Do we have two bleeders? So you can't take any of that blood for granted. You've got to look at blood stain patterns and see if there's some outlier that actually could be from the perpetrator. Maybe she was able to fight back pretty well. You just don't know. And you can't take anything for granted. So it's basically process everything and collect everything. That could be a potential.

[A]

To Scott Eicher joining us, digital forensics expert formally with the FBI. What do you make of it? You were also a homicide detective. What else do you believe they found in the home? Touch DNA, maybe fiber a hair? All it takes is one hair. One.

[C]

I agree. Hopefully they process that, that house very well. But you got to remember, when they first went there, it's a missing person. And then later on, it turned out to be okay, this could be a kidnapping with ransom. And now the video. So initially, the police department's in there walking through the house, you know, look, looking in, you know, the basement, in the attic, in the every room, and making sure she's just not there again with the property, doing the same thing. So you got to remember, I think we were talking about this DNA. The FBI was called in a little bit later, a day or two later, to try to help, or the FBI came to ask if they could help. So at that time, maybe the sheriff's department was on their own, saying, hey, we should probably take this glove that we found in the house and send it to the lab. So I don't think there's any rift between the two agencies. You know, I've worked the Jessica Ridgeway case back in 2012 with Westminster PD, and we are a force multiplier. We come into the Situation at the permission of the local authorities, even though there's cross jurisdiction, especially in a kidnapping case. But in the Jessica Ridgeway case, Westminster was thankful we were there. We brought in, you know, 50 different agents and analysts to do work at their request. That turned out to be a really good case. There was DNA found on her backpack that was left in the neighborhood. Several days later, that DNA was sent into codis. It was actually processed by the Colorado State of Colorado lab and it went into CODIS and they found a hit. But that hit was an unknown person from a prior attack. So even if we do get some DNA and it's put into codis, we're not sure if it's going to match anybody that's known. In the Jessica Ridgeway case, it was an unknown person.

[A]

Well, there's always genetic genealogy that was used, for instance, in the Golden Gate Killer case. Joseph DiAngelo, first of its kind, familial DNA, genetic genealogy DNA. Hey, that video we were just showing you is from 12 News, so that's a possibility. If the perp doesn't have a record, he may not show up in codis. But if he has a brother, a cousin, a father, a son with a record, we're going to get a match. It won't be a full match, but then we'll be onto something that doesn't work. We'll go to genetic genealogy, familial DNA, which has been approved in practically every jurisdiction. Hey, another thing, Dave Mack, it seems as if vehicles are taking center stage as well as DNA at this juncture. And that would be specifically a gray truck. What can you tell me?

[E]

We've been told now that the FBI and the sheriff's department are asking people in the neighborhood to share their nest. Ring doorbell cameras, Any surveillance video they have you mentioned it earlier, January 1st to February 2nd. However, there are two very specific times that they are actually, they being law enforcement are focused in on saying they're looking for January 11th from 9pm and they're also looking for 9:30am to 11am on January 31st in the neighborhood. Ring doorbell nest cameras. They're looking for a specific, specific, possible gray truck. But they're also noting every neighbor, what they've got, what they drive, what they use on a daily basis. You know, Nancy, the neighbor who actually pointed out to law enforcement that Nancy's roof looked too clean, Laura Gargano, she confirmed that a request for the dates in question here were sent by ring doorbell app. In that request, police noted that a suspicious vehicle had been spotted in the vicinity. And they want every piece of video they can get from the neighborhood during.

[A]

Those specific Times to Brian vs. Gibbons. What do you make of the search for a gray truck?

[D]

Yeah, so we've been talking about this for days now, that they obviously had a vehicle to take Nancy away from that site. And that as law enforcement is going to go around with all these ring camera videos and thousands of tips that are coming in, they're going to try to identify a vehicle because the vehicle at the end of the day is going to be easier to locate necessarily than a person. So, you know, this gray truck could be central. You know, it could be one of hundreds of vehicle leads that they're following down.

[A]

Now, the vehicle, I can't stress the importance of it. They're saying gray. But remember, if Dave Mack's correct, I saw a door cam. It could be gray, it could be white, it could be beige. But think back on Brian Kohberger. The first thing that happened was somebody at a gas station. Quick Mart says, hey, this car came by around 3 o', clock, 4 o' clock in the morning. This was a clerk that took it upon themselves to review hours and hours and hours of video and called. Authorities saw a white Elantra. They started looking for a white Elantra. It was sent to wsu, Washington State University in Pullman. The campus security went through the registration at Pullman. Who's got a white Elantra? Brian Kohberger. That's where his name first came from. And then the white Elantra was viewed circling the home. 11 visits leading up to the murders or more. Then let's see the Molly Tibbetts person, that perpetrator that murdered this young co ed, he was caught by distinctive markings on his black Chevy Malibu caught on cam. So isn't it true, Iker, that local police, especially in a metropolis as big as Tucson, and I'm basing this on what I know of Atlanta and New York, they have entire divisions. Like there's homicide, there's sex crimes, there's missing, there's car theft. There is a whole division of people working car thefts because there's so many. And they can look at a car and go, oh yeah, that's a 1984 Chevy Malibu, black in color with blah blah, blah, and all of the details. They know it like Hart, just like I know the Constitution. That's their business. You can determine the year, the make, the model, because every year, generally there are subtle changes to the body of a car. Let's just pretend we're talking about a Toyota Camry. They may slant the headlights, they may raise up the rear end. They may just some subtle change every year to make it different to the consumer. But specialists in the car theft division know all about those subtle changes. And they can identify make, model and year.

[C]

That is so true. And we actually have that in the FBI, too. We have experts in that field at the lab. But a lot of the people that work stolen cars are just car experts. I'm a cell phone and cellular network expert. We have those people that we can reach out to. And they could see, oh, that trim that's on that car was from this year when Toyota, for example, made that trim, that, that car. So they're, they're good at it and they, they definitely can help you out in those situations.

[A]

Really, really good. Iker. And remind me, I want to circle back one last time to Iker regarding the cell phone data that's being amassed in Nancy Guthrie's neighborhood. Fitzgibbons. The make, the model, the year. So, so important in a case like this. And then once you get that, you go, oh, okay, here is a 2024. Let's just go with a Ford F150. It's white. It's got this feature on the back. Now we decide make, model and year. And you look through registration. Remember, every traffic stop, license, registration, that vehicle is registered to somebody, 90% guarantee. Then they get everybody in the area that has that vehicle and they start canvassing. That's how it goes down.

[D]

Spot on. And I think, you know, one, one thing. This was reported yesterday by Matt Finn from Fox News who tracked down Arizona Department of Transportation, spoke with officials at the city of Tucson and in Pima county about traffic cam locations and do they record? So when you see this big push for ring cameras, and I think that this is going to start to hit the media cycle pretty quickly. AZ DOT is saying that they have cameras in the area, but they do not record. City of Tucson says it has traffic cameras that do not record. In Pima county says that they have some that do and some that don't. So, you know, we're in a scenario here where you see this reward go up and law enforcement asking for all of these videos for that span of time. And I'm going to say that it very likely has to do with trying to find a vehicle.

[A]

Absolutely. Well put. Brian Fitzgibbons Eicher. We know that Palazzo's was apprehended. That video, guys, was Fox 10 and that was Nancy Guthrie's vehicle. Being towed for evidence. That vehicle is going to be so important because if Nancy Guthrie was bleeding, and we know she was, there's no way they can get rid of that blood in that car. I don't care how hard they try. That said Palazzo, Carlos Palazzo was pulled over, detained, question release. He had nothing to do with it. I believe he was identified from cell phone data that his phone was in and out of her neighborhood at various hours because he's a delivery person in that neighborhood, probably to her house. And that's why they zeroed in on him. They did not pull him over because he forgot to turn on his blinker. They pulled him over, I believe, because of his cell phone data.

[C]

I believe that's correct, too. I mean, I don't have first hand knowledge, but that's the things we do in these type situations. We do tower dumps for the area around the crime scene, and then we look for all the phones and vehicles. You know, we got to remember vehicles have cell phones in them. Now to the newer ones. Then we start going through all that data and figure out, okay, which ones are stationary during all this time. That's probably a neighbor or Nancy's phone. Now let's look at the ones that are moving in and out of that area and narrow down on those. So I believe he was stopped and questioned because he was in the area and he is a delivery driver. I don't think he said it. He remembered to be in that area, but, you know, he's. He's delivering all over the place. So they stopped him, talked to him, questioned him. I. They might even done a search at his residence. I know there was a search around the same time, but they've cleared him. But that's what they're doing. They're going through all this data trying to figure out who came in and who left around the time Nancy disappeared.

[A]

If you know or think you know anything about Nancy Guthrie's disappearance, please call 1800-225532-41800-225-53240. Or if you wish to remain anonymous, 5208-8274-6358-0882, 7463. There is a $100,000 reward. Good night, friend.