TEXAS MOM NIKKI WINDER, CAR FOUND BURNING

Summary

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Crime Stories with Nancy Grace

"TEXAS MOM NIKKI WINDER, CAR FOUND BURNING"

Air Date: March 20, 2026
Host: Nancy Grace
Panelists: Dave Mack (Crime Stories investigative reporter), Brian Fitzgibbons (Director, USPA Nationwide Security), Karen Stark (forensic psychologist), Dave Moyer (canine tracker and law enforcement expert)

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Overview

This episode zeros in on the baffling case of Nikki (Nicole) Winder, a young mother from Bryan, Texas, whose truck was found burned on a rural oil pad just an hour after she left work. With little evidence and no witnesses so far, Nancy Grace and her expert guests dissect the case, debating possible motives and scenarios while pointing out investigative leads and areas of concern. The discussion spans crime scene details, domestic violence risk, evidence destruction, search strategies, and possible involvement of an unidentified ATV.

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Major Discussion Points

Case Timeline and Initial Facts

• Nikki Winder vanishes: Nikki is reported missing after her brand-new 2025 Chevy pickup is found fully engulfed in flames, only two miles from her workplace in Bryan, Texas ([03:13]-[04:30]).
• Key Timeline: She left her caregiving job at 3:00 PM; by approximately 4:00 PM, her truck was ablaze. Law enforcement only realized she was missing after finding the vehicle ([03:30]-[04:30]).
• Area Description: The region is rural, with wild, open land and few dwellings or businesses around ([05:27]-[05:52]).

Quote:
"The last time she was seen was an hour earlier leaving her place of work. So we have a one hour window from her leaving work and her truck on fire." — Dave Mack ([03:30])

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Investigative Challenges in Rural Settings

• Surveillance scarcity: Compared to urban settings, rural environments offer fewer witnesses or cameras, complicating search and investigation efforts ([05:52]-[06:44]).
• Pattern awareness: Panelists discuss how a perpetrator familiar with Nikki's daily routines ("traffic patterns") could exploit this, just as seen in documented domestic violence tragedies ([07:27]-[08:41]).

Quote:
"This person either found her in a target, she was a target of opportunity, or the person knew Nikki's travel pattern, where she would be that day." — Brian Fitzgibbons ([06:44])

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Motive: Domestic Violence or Organized Crime?

• Domestic violence suspicion: Nancy Grace and Karen Stark immediately focus on the likelihood of someone close to Nikki being involved, especially given parallels with other femicide cases and the lack of robbery/sexual assault ([09:31]-[10:40]).
• Arson as evidence destruction: The truck's destruction points to efforts to conceal crime scene evidence, potentially linking to someone with knowledge of what Nikki’s vehicle might reveal ([09:31]-[11:11], [22:46]-[24:08]).

Quote:
"It just screams domestic violence." — Nancy Grace ([10:40])

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Possibility of Voluntary Disappearance

• Panel skepticism: Dave Moyer raises, then largely dismisses, possible self-orchestrated disappearance, pointing out the unlikelihood a devoted mother would torch a prized new truck and abandon her kids ([11:48]-[12:42]).
• Reference to other cases: Nancy Grace draws a devastating comparison to the Drew Peterson and Stacy Peterson case to highlight how suspect narratives are sometimes used to explain away foul play ([15:57]-[16:47]).

Quote:
"She wanted to disappear, so she leaves her children and sets her truck on fire?" — Nancy Grace ([12:31])

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Crime Scene and Evidence Details

• Arson specifics:

  • Truck was ignited on an oil pad, possibly to intensify fire and hinder evidence collection ([20:03]-[20:37]).
  • Investigators quickly determined it was arson, searching for accelerants or incendiary devices ([21:06]-[21:17]).
  • Panel disagrees that a woman would torch her own car:
    "That's a man thing." — Nancy Grace ([22:46]),
    "Without a doubt, that's a man thing. … Women are not that aggressive." — Karen Stark ([22:46])

• Vehicle as crime scene: Cars frequently become focal points for evidence, DNA, and sometimes the actual abduction/attack ([23:12]-[24:08]).

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Search Efforts and Law Enforcement Actions

• Search operation:

  • Two primary areas searched: the workplace and area around the burned truck ([24:33]-[25:22]).
  • Methods include drones, canines (for live scent and human remains), air surveillance, and multiple agencies ([24:38]-[25:22], [25:27]-[26:26]).
  • Challenges: If the crime didn’t happen at the dump site, canines may not find scent evidence ([26:26]-[26:30]).

• Community involvement: Authorities ask residents and landowners near FM 974 to check security and game camera footage on or around Feb 25, the date of Nikki’s disappearance ([30:02]-[31:08]).

Quote:
"It sounds like they really covered their bases getting all the K9 teams out there and covered those areas." — Dave Moyer ([25:27])

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The Mysterious ATV

• Unidentified ATV: Around the time Nikki’s truck was found burning, a video captured an ATV near the scene ([31:08]-[31:52]).
• Police plea: Authorities ask the driver to come forward. Panelists debate if the ATV was a witness, a coincidental bystander, a service vehicle, or even a pre-staged escape for the perpetrator ([32:32]-[35:36]).
• Possible scenario:
  • Escape theory: Perpetrator stages ATV to flee after torching vehicle, making it hard for search dogs to track ([33:34]-[35:36]).

Quote:
"That vehicle would have been pre-staged… They got there, they burned the vehicle, and then they had that ATV pre-staged so they could drive away from the scene. … That is an option." — Dave Moyer ([35:36])

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Forensics: Fire and Human Remains

• Improbable to destroy a body: Fire from burning a vehicle is insufficient to fully eliminate a corpse. Examples offered (Steven Avery case, etc.) remind listeners that "her body is not in this truck" ([35:59]-[38:06]).
• Destruction intent: Panel consensus is that burning the car was about destroying evidence, not disposing of a body ([37:31]-[38:06]).

Quote:
"This fire was clearly started as either A, a diversion or B, to destroy evidence." — Brian Fitzgibbons ([37:31])

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Law Enforcement Updates and Appeals

• Current status: Nikki was last seen leaving work; her family is worried; a "Clear Alert" is issued, akin to an Amber Alert for adults ([38:16]-[38:53]).
• Investigation secrecy: Experts underscore that authorities are keeping case details private as they vet leads ([39:16]-[40:39]).
• Reward offered: $5,000 for credible information ([40:39]).

Quote:
"If you know or think you know anything regarding her disappearance, call the Brazos County Sheriff's [Dept]." — Nancy Grace ([40:39])

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Notable Quotes and Moments

• “It just screams domestic violence.” — Nancy Grace ([10:40])
• “She wanted to disappear, so she leaves her children and sets her truck on fire?” — Nancy Grace ([12:31])
• “When suspects…are destroying a body, human remains, they’re not going to do that publicly, viewable from the side of the road. It’s going to take time. …You need an incinerator that can generate temperatures high enough to destroy the body....This was clearly in an effort to destroy evidence.” — Brian Fitzgibbons ([37:31])
• “That vehicle would have been pre-staged…so they could drive away from the scene. So that is an option. That is something the investigators are going to have to rule out.” — Dave Moyer ([35:36])
• “Women are not that aggressive. …I can’t even begin to imagine…that somebody would want to set their own car on fire when they’re so proud of this new car, this new truck. And it seems improbable to me.” — Karen Stark ([22:46])

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Key Timestamps

• 03:13-04:30 — Discovery that Nikki Winder is missing; truck found on fire
• 05:27-06:44 — Geography and search complications in rural regions
• 09:31-10:40 — Focus on domestic violence as a likely motive
• 11:48-12:42 — Possibility of voluntary disappearance discussed/discounted
• 20:03-21:17 — Arson details and the scene on the oil pad
• 23:12-24:08 — Vehicle as primary crime scene, method of evidence destruction
• 24:38-25:27 — Search efforts: drones, dogs, air units
• 31:08-31:52 — The unidentified ATV near the fire
• 33:34-35:36 — Speculation about ATV as an escape vehicle
• 35:59-38:06 — Discussion: Vehicle fire can't destroy human remains fully
• 40:39 — Reward and crime tipline info

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Conclusions & Takeaways

• The panel strongly suspects foul play, likely by someone familiar with Nikki’s movements and possibly someone from her immediate circle.
• The act of burning the truck is unanimously interpreted as evidence destruction, not a half-hearted attempt to make someone vanish voluntarily.
• The unidentified ATV at the scene is considered a pivotal lead, either as an escape vehicle or a possible witness.
• Ongoing challenges include the rural landscape, lack of surveillance, and community unawareness.
• Authorities urge anyone with information, especially about the ATV or any surveillance from Feb 25, to come forward (Crime Stoppers: 979-361-4900).

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This thorough panel discussion spotlights investigative frustrations, the darkest possibilities around a mother’s sudden vanishing, and underscores the need for community vigilance and detailed evidence work in rural America’s missing persons cases.

Transcript

[Nancy Grace]

This is an iHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human.

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[Nancy Grace]

CRIME STORIES with Nancy Grace. A gorgeous young Texas mom, Nikki Winder missing. This after her truck is found on fire tonight. Where is Nikki Winder? I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. I want to thank you for being with us.

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Nicole Winder, a mother from Brazos, Texas is reported missing after leaving her caregiving job abruptly.

[Nancy Grace]

Tonight the search is on for a gorgeous young Texas mom, her truck found on fire. Straight out to Dave Mack, crime Stories investigative reporter. What can you tell me? Did nobody know she was missing until her truck was spotted on fire?

[Dave Mack]

That's exactly it, Nancy. That was when they determined that we don't know where Nikki is because the call came in to fire and deputies about a truck possibly on fire when they arrived. When investigators arrived on the scene, truck fully engulfed in flames. And of course they start looking for the driver. Well, there's no driver nowhere around. So they find out the car is registered, it's a 2025 white Chevy pickup truck. And they that's the truck there. They find out it is registered Nicole Winder and they immediately start tracking back and find out nobody knows where she is. The last time she was seen was an hour earlier leaving her place of work. So we have a one hour window from her leaving work and her truck on fire.

[Nancy Grace]

Dave Mack, tell me the fundamentals, the who, what, where, why, when, as much as you know them. We know she's got two sons. We know. Tell me about the location. Where is she missing?

[Dave Mack]

We know that Nikki left her work at 3 o'. Clock. Her truck is found two miles away one hour later on fire. Now those are the basics of what we know because the information, Nancy, is very, very limited. We only have a couple of pictures. One of the truck that you can see. She was very proud of this brand new 2025 Chevy pickup truck. So for the enforcement people to find this vehicle on fire is shocking.

[Nancy Grace]

Nicole Nikki Winder, a young mom, is missing out of Bryan, Texas, the county seat of Brazos county that is in the heart of the Texas Brazos Valley. Now last census, small town, 83,000 people. Now it's right there on the border of College Station. That's another city in Texas, Dave. Mac, what more can you tell me?

[Dave Mack]

Talking about A road called FM974 stands for Farm Road. It's just north of Highway 21. This is in, as you mentioned, Bryan, Texas, which is in Brazos County, a very rural area where there's Not a lot going on in the area where she went missing in that two miles from the place of work to where her truck was found, it's just wild rural area, not a lot of building.

[Nancy Grace]

Joining us, an all star panel. To make sense of what we're learning tonight, I want to go straight out to Brian Fitzgibbons, director Operations, USPA Nationwide Security, leading a team of investigators in finding missing people around the world. Former Marine, Iraqi war vet. It's a lot different fits when you are looking in a very remote area. For instance, with Nancy Guthrie, we are looking out in the desert. Huge swaths of land haven't made it to Mexico yet. Still looking there in Arizona as opposed to in Manhattan. There are traffic lights with traffic cams everywhere. It's very concentrated with a lot of video surveillance, a lot of witnesses. It's a whole nother ball game. When you're in a rural area like Bryan, Texas, how do you even start, Brian?

[Brian Fitzgibbons]

Yeah, absolutely. And it's important to understand that where Nikki was last seen and where her vehicle was a couple miles north of any real population. So you are, you're spot on. This is a very, very remote rural area, farmland, country roads. And what does this tell? Within a couple of miles of where Nikki was last seen and within 60min her vehicle was found burning. Okay, so that tells us that this crime took place in haste. This person either found her in a target, she was a target of opportunity, or the person knew Nikki's travel pattern, where she would be that day.

[Nancy Grace]

When you said traffic pattern, Brian, it reminds me very much of another young mother, Kiara Hudson. She had taken out restraining order after restraining order after restraining order against her husband and ex husband. And she even presented video to the judge of her husband beating her and dragging her around by her hair. As you can see, Brian, the attacks were brutal, notwithstanding a judge in his wisdom, let her ex out. He knew her traffic pattern just like you're saying Brian Fitzgibbons. She took her children to school in the morning in her suv. She was so afraid, Brian. She had taken to wearing a bulletproof vest when her car came to a stop with the children in the car, Brian. He comes up with a gun and shoots her in the head to circumvent her body arm. He knew her traffic pattern. He knew exactly where she was going and where she would be and at what time down to the minute, dropping off their children. Is that what you mean by knowing her traffic pattern?

[Brian Fitzgibbons]

Yeah, exactly. So, you know, we have to understand that in this extremely rural area, there's only going to be so many people who live there or frequent that area who would also have the chance to encounter Nikki in her travels. So that limits the size and scope of the investigation right away. And that's certainly one front that investigators will be looking at. Who was there, who knew she was there, who's there every day. The second group is certainly a bigger group that could potentially have known about Nikki's pattern of life, where she goes to work, when she's going to be there, and that this opportunity was geographic in nature. Given that, you know, there's not many prying eyes, not many people walking around bystanders.

[Nancy Grace]

You're seeing shots that we're showing now relating back to Kiera Hut, murdered by estranged husband Adam Benefield in front of her three children. He had been released less than 24 hours before on an assault that occurred inside their home. This is the assault. I'm showing you the video. He was walked free on that. And even with a bulletproof vest, she could not escape. Straight out to Karen Stark. Joining us, renowned forensic psychologist, TV radio trauma expert and consultant. You can find [e-mail] and that's Karen with a C. Karen, thank you for joining us tonight. My mind leaps immediately to domestic violence because we're not hearing anything about a rape, a sex assault, a theft. It's not even a carjacking because her truck wasn't taken, it was set on fire, seemingly as if someone wanted to get rid of some sort of evidence. But that said, it just screams domestic violence.

[Karen Stark]

That's a very strong. It does seem like even though it took an hour, they were able to set fire to that truck. And this is because this is. There's a good chance they knew that nobody would be there, that no one would be able to identify what was happening. And as your previous guest said, someone seemed to be aware because there she was and she was attacked that quickly, so perhaps there was was looking to get revenge.

[Nancy Grace]

Joining us now, Dave Moyer, you know him well. Canine tracker, master trainer, canine tracker, program manager for military contracts, former Navy bomb disposal master technician. It goes on and on and on with San Bernardino Sheriff's Department. Dave, this could go so many different ways and I'm very curious why no one seems to be covering her case or demanding her return. That really intrigues me. So when you looked at this case first blush, what was your thought?

[Dave Moyer]

My initial impression on this was that there was some planning and some logistical planning that went into her disappearance here. Whether or not this is a plan on her part to disappear and start a new life or whether or not this is somebody that she knew.

[Nancy Grace]

Wait, did you just say whether she disappeared to start a new life? Is that what you just said?

[Dave Moyer]

Yes, ma'. Am. It's always a possibility that when you see something with so little evidence to go on that it may be somebody trying to disappear from from society in general. I mean, again, it is a possibility. It doesn't sound very likely in this case.

[Nancy Grace]

Put him up, please. Dave Moyer. Dave yes, ma'.

[Dave Moyer]

Am.

[Nancy Grace]

She wanted to disappear, so she leaves her children and sets her truck on fire. Fire.

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[Brian Fitzgibbons]

on day one for me and my kids.

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[Nancy Grace]

Crime Stories with Nancy Grace you know, another time I heard she's off to start a new life. I don't know if the name Drew Peterson rings a bell to you. Drew Peterson, a former cop, had one dead wife that drowned in a bone dry bathtub. Then his fourth wife, Stacy Peterson goes missing and that's exactly what he told police. He told police she probably left with her new boyfriend. What new boyfriend? She left all of her clothes, her vehicle, everything behind. So how did that work? I just want to explore with you, Dave Moyer, the possibility that this mom left to start a new life. What?

[Dave Moyer]

The only thing that really makes that even a remotest of possibilities is the utter lack of evidence at this point for any foul play that may have occurred. Again, we don't have access to all of the investigation that the local police have conducted, but it is something to consider and rule out as the investigation is ongoing.

[Nancy Grace]

Well, with that I agree with you. I agree with you that it's something to consider and rule out. But Fitzgibbons, while Moyer is right, you have to rule out all possibilities, otherwise you're going to have it thrown in your face at trial. I don't see anything that smacks of a voluntary abandoning of your home, all your possessions, and setting your truck on fire.

[Brian Fitzgibbons]

Well, that would be a pretty straightforward way hypothesis to rule out, right? We would check financial information, things in her romantic life if there were issues there and investigators have Undoubtedly done that. Right. What we do know is that within 60 minutes of Nikki being last seen at her place of employment, her vehicle was found on fire. Right. So that speaks to us that whatever went down went down in that location for a reason and quick.

[Nancy Grace]

What do you mean by that Brian?

[Brian Fitzgibbons]

What I'm speaking to is the, the, the, the motive behind this, right that the, the perpetrator, if, if Nikki was indeed taken, knew her location, chose that location and executed it very.

[Nancy Grace]

Guys, we are bringing you all the latest in the search for a wonderful young mom out of Bryan, Texas who seemingly has vanished without a trace. Karen Stark joining us, renowned TV radio trauma expert. I don't see it, I don't see anything suggesting that this was vulnerable.

[Karen Stark]

That doesn't make sense to me either because I can't imagine that she would take this brand new car, put it on fire and she has children so that seems implied. What is most interesting is that somebody was able to think this out enough to burn the car and that isn't someone who haphazardly just comes across her quickly does whatever captures the search for

[Nancy Grace]

missing mom Nicole Winder is entering the third we her truck found on fire at an oil pad. An oil pad off FM Farm Road 974 north of Highway 21. There are crews out searching day to day. The sheriff's office begging for information. When sheriff's deputies and investigators identified the truck they realized only then that Winder had not been seen or heard from for some time. What does that mean Dave Mack Some time. She hadn't been seen or heard from for some time and the truck was

[Dave Mack]

found two miles away from where she was last seen. Two miles, 60 minutes. A very, very small window to take a look at.

[Nancy Grace]

What does that mean Dave Mack that her truck was found on fire near

[Dave Mack]

an oil pad, actually sitting on an oil pad which is an area designed to capture oil petroleum type products to prevent them from getting into the groundwater. That's it's just an area where her vehicle was parked and is specific for this for an oil pad and trying to understand what the oil pad is doing in that particular area and why her car would be parked there. Was it taken there to be burned or was she parked there?

[Nancy Grace]

I'm wondering if the perp thought that the oil pad would somehow increase the make the fire burn faster, make it burn more, get rid of the car more quickly because of the oil being contributed to the fire. It was also definitely ruled an arson. To Dave Moyer joining us San Bernardino Sheriff's Department. How would you determine right off the bat that this was an arson.

[Dave Moyer]

What you're looking for is any kind of incendiary devices, any kind of initiation devices, or the presence of any accelerants or chemicals that would precipitate the fire.

[Nancy Grace]

You know, having prosecuted many arsons, Dave Moyer, you're absolutely correct. This is what I learned investigating and prosecuting arsons. Very often when an accelerant is used, which is a very common MO Modus operandi method of operation, you can actually see with the naked eye. You don't need a magnifying glass. You can see where the accelerant. Let's just go with gasoline was poured, you can see where the fire started. The burning damage will be much, much more intense and extensive at the location where the fire started. Think of a home. Think of a fire started in a kitchen. The damage done there, as opposed to one of the back bedrooms, will be much more intense because that is where the fire originated. For example, sometimes, let's just go with the Molotov cocktail. You will actually find evidence of the incendiary device, of the accelerant device, such as a glass jar here. Since it's a vehicle, there's any number of ways to set it on fire, but they knew at the get go it was arson. So to Karen Starr, I find it very difficult to believe because of statistics. It's very rare that a female on her own, without any urging, without a co conspirator, starts an arson fire of a vehicle. Very rare. That's a man thing.

[Karen Stark]

Without a doubt, that's a man thing. And I think we're all aware of that because. Because women are not that aggressive. It's not the kind of thing that a woman would do. They're much more passive. And I can't even begin to imagine, can you, that somebody would want to set their own car on fire when they're so proud of this new car, this new truck. And it seems improbable to me. I can't see that at all.

[Nancy Grace]

Another case that's coming to mind, Brian Fitzgibbons, and you and I worked on this one together, is of Nikki Chang, another young mom that seemingly vanished off the face of the earth. Suspicion was heightened when a fire erupted at her estranged husband's home. Was he trying to get rid of evidence? And it all goes back to Nikki Chang's truck. Her truck was full of evidence, including biological evidence that was traced back to Nikki Chang. You know, there's some kind of a connection, Karen Stark, between a person in their vehicle so often we see women snatched out of their car and that car bears evidence. It can be blood, it can be some other type of DNA. And we see the car set on fire to get rid of the evidence. And I'm wondering if that's not what happened in the case of Nicky Watts.

[Karen Stark]

Sounds like that's what happened there, Nancy I can see that because they often find like pieces of carrier that can trace back to whoever committed a crime. And so that was very thought out to actually take that truck and put it on fire because they didn't want their they didn't want anybody to be able to trace it to whoever did this day.

[Nancy Grace]

Mac, what can you tell me about the search so far for Nikki?

[Dave Mack]

Nancy the search has taken place in two very specific areas. They started at her place of work at that residence, and they and they did the search around where her truck was found on fire. These searches are large scale, involving drones overhead, canine teams on the ground, and they had air support, helicopters and aircraft, the main search area along FM974. But they have had to expand it as leads have come in. Multiple agencies involved in this, as well as the Texas Department of Public Safety, Texas Search and Rescue and the Search Dog Network, all involved in this very large search of two different areas.

[Nancy Grace]

So, Dave Moyer joining us, what do you make of the use of canines? This is your specialty?

[Dave Moyer]

Yes, ma'. Am. This definitely has an application for area search dogs, which are dogs that will cover broad swatches of territory and searching for any live or deceased humans in that area. And they're using their nose and the environment to their advantage with the wind direction and whatnot. Also here, I don't know what dogs were used, but cadaver dogs or human or main dogs, HRD for short, would also have an application here because they don't just find anybody that may be deceased in the area. They also find any blood that might be left over for an evidentiary standpoint. So it sounds like they really covered their bases getting all the K9 teams out there and covered those areas. But to touch on a subject somebody else brought up earlier, if that vehicle was moved after the crime and was simply there to be disposed of, there wouldn't be any evidence there. So the dogs are not going to be able to detect anything if it doesn't exist in that area.

[Nancy Grace]

Dave Moyer, what do you believe authorities should be doing now to find it?

[Dave Moyer]

Sounds like they're still going down the path that I would recommend with using their area dogs and their HRD dogs and searching some large areas. As this continues to progress, hopefully some more evidence will point them in the right direction and get them into an area where the dogs can do some kind of detection. Again, a dog is it's not an area effect weapon. You've got to use the dog in the area where it can be most effective. So that's going to be the difficulty in this investigation is finding where best to employ dogs.

[Martha Stewart]

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[Nancy Grace]

Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. Erin Stark, weigh in.

[Karen Stark]

You know, I'm not sure if this is correct, Nancy, but she left her workplace in haste that she couldn't wait to get out of there for some reason. And if that's true, that's really relevant because there was something that was happening that made her leave that quickly and that she was aware of, perhaps afraid.

[Nancy Grace]

Karen Stark, you're absolutely correct. Nicole Winder was last seen leaving work over two weeks ago. It was after that her truck was discovered on fire near an oil well Brazos County. Now what we're trying to find out is if anyone has seen her, heard of her, gotten a text, gotten a call, anything. We also know that local authorities are asking residents along FM 974 between Highway 21 and Macy Road to review security and game camera footage from February 25th. February 25th. They've isolated that date or if you saw Nikki's white 2025 Chevy truck with black rims before it was discovered, set on fire. They are begging for this surveillance video. I want to go back to you regarding Dave Mack regarding an atv. What can you tell me about that, Nancy?

[Dave Mack]

At the pretty much same time that the picture of Nicole's 2025 Chevy truck was captured, this ATV was also captured on video. Investigators have asked the person driving this ATV to come forward, but they haven't. Now, all we know, Nancy, is that this story is big around Brian, Texas. And if that was you driving an ATV that police wanted to talk to you, if there's an innocent answer, you would call them and say, hey, that was me. I was out riding around for fun. I mean, who wouldn't come forward with that? But this person has not come forward. They're still trying to. Investigators still trying to identify the type of ATV and who owns.

[Nancy Grace]

I'm very curious what the connection is to Nikki Winder in the continued search for a missing Brazos county mom, Nicole Winder. The sheriff's office begging for the public's help to ID an all terrain vehicle. It was captured on on camera near the area where her truck was found on fire. That is significant. Brian fitzgibbons video surveillance catches the ATV near where her truck is set on fire. That's why they want it. What is that ATV doing out by on an oil Oil field at an oil pad at the same time her truck's on fire.

[Brian Fitzgibbons]

Yes. So I don't think it's uncommon in a rural area like this that people will have ATVs like this and use them around their properties. So that ATV is probably located, you know, garage close by this location. So the fact that it's there is not surprising. The fact that it was caught on camera at and around the time of Nikki's disappearance certainly makes us a potential witness in the case.

[Nancy Grace]

Dave Moyer. I could not disagree with Brian Fitzgibbons more. Out in the middle of a rural and desolate area, her truck is set on fire and then out of the blue, same location. What a coinky Dink Is this ATV? Why is it there between 3 and 4pm February 25, the day she goes missing, near Jack Creek Road. And if it's not involved, why didn't they call in the fire? Think about it. What about it Moyer?

[Dave Moyer]

I would speculate to say that option A, this is somehow related to the crime and it was already pre staged for our suspect to be able to leave the area without leaving any ability for K9s to track him to another vehicle. And if that is the case then then yeah, obviously he's not going to come forward. B, I've lived in a lot of rural areas and I do agree with the prior gentleman that I mean guys use these out on their property all the time. It could be a service vehicle for the oil pad itself or it could just be driven by an older gentleman that doesn't watch television very much. Again, these are possibilities to rule out. That is all I'm saying.

[Nancy Grace]

Did you actually say this could be what A service vehicle for the oil industry. Did you say that?

[Dave Moyer]

Yes ma', am. It could be. I don't know what company services that.

[Nancy Grace]

So a service vehicle would totally ignore, hey, there's a fire at an oil field.

[Dave Moyer]

Again, if they departed the area prior to the fire or prior to someone being parked there, it sounds like it was there at the same time. So absolutely I'd be looking to this guy for a witness. And again, it leans back to the option A I brought up. It could lend that there was a lot of logistics that went into this crime. Having an escape vehicle already pre staged at that location.

[Nancy Grace]

Okay, wait a minute. Nobody has said anything about an escape vehicle. You just drop that off me. An escape vehicle? What? Wait, you're not going back to Nikki Winder wanted to start a new life. You're not going there, are you?

[Dave Moyer]

Oh no, no, Ma', am, I'm. I'm simply exploring all the speculation that could involve it. We have so little information that I'm looking at all the different possibilities if this.

[Nancy Grace]

Okay, tell me your theory about an escape vehicle. Hold on, hold on. I got to get comfortable for this. What about an escape vehicle? I'm not saying you're wrong. I just don't know where you're going. Explain to me that this whole thing being planned out and they needed like they drove the truck there and they needed an ATV as an escape vehicle. I'm just guessing here.

[Dave Moyer]

Yes, ma'. Am. That vehicle would have been pre staged that the actual abduction may have taken place in a different location. That was just the area they planned on dumping the vehicle. So it was already pre staged. They got there, they burned the vehicle, and then they had a. That ATV pre staged so they could drive away from the scene. So that. That is an option. That is something the investigators are going to have to rule out.

[Nancy Grace]

Okay. I'm very, very close to forgiving you, Dave Moyer, for suggesting she just left work in a hurry, ran off, disappeared and set her chuck on fire to start a new life. I'm this close to forgiving you for that because that's a pretty good theory you just came up with. One thing I did do know, Fitzgibbon. Her body wasn't in that truck. Because to get rid of a human body, you have to have much higher, a much higher degree of heat than that truck fire would have created. I mean, you need an incinerator grade fire to totally get rid of a body. Hey, I don't know if you recall the cable darling. Steven Avery. He was wrongfully convicted of a felony. Did some jail time. As soon as he got out, he murdered someone. A young photographer, Teresa Halbach. The reason I'm bringing him up is because he started a fire pit in his, the back of his auto salvage lot. And according to his own relatives and friends, he stirred that fire pit all night trying to get rid of her body. It didn't work. There were tiny, tiny bone fragments. Her teeth were still there. And the studs off the back of her Daisy Fuentes jeans were in that fire. And that fire burned all night long. He suggested that he was having a bonfire that said her body is not in this truck. So where is she? Or her body?

[Brian Fitzgibbons]

Yeah, and this fire was clearly started as either A, a diversion or B, to destroy evidence. You know, that's what we typically see. And when suspects are perpetrators are destroying a body, human remains, they're not going to do that publicly, viewable from the side of the road. It's going to take time. It's going to require an incinerator that can generate temperatures high enough to destroy the body. So you know, this was clearly in an effort to destroy evidence.

[Nancy Grace]

As a matter of fact, Dave Mack, what is the temp needed to destroy a human body entirely?

[Dave Mack]

1400-1800 degrees.

[Nancy Grace]

In a recent report, the facts have been updated. It's been determined she was last seen at 3pm the same day, the day that Karen Stark is describing hastily leaving a residence where she was employed. Now the sheriff's office spoke with family members and they were concerned about her safety. An alert has been issued. It's a partner with the Amber Alert. It's called a clear alert. So at this juncture, Brian Fitzgibbons, what should local authorities be doing to find Nikki?

[Brian Fitzgibbons]

Yeah, first and foremost getting the word out there to find, find that person as a potential witness is a good first step. And investigators are going to be keeping all of the information around their investigation pretty close to the chest right now because you know, we have to believe that Nikki was targeted here. If this is indeed a okay to you.

[Nancy Grace]

Dave Moyer K9 Tracker Master Trainer Canine tracker Program manager for military contracts Former Navy bag Bomb disposal Master Technician I mean I could keep going on and on, but with San Bernardino Sheriff's Department, do you agree or disagree with what Ms. Gibbons just said? What else can they be doing? Because I'm hearing nothing about this investigation or her disappearance. Where is her family? Where is her boyfriend? I mean, where's the sheriff? Why are we hearing nothing about Nicole Winder?

[Dave Moyer]

And I'm going to back him up on his comment. The investigators are clearly going to keep any information that they have very close to the chest as they continue to develop evidence in this case. It does sound like there was a significant amount of planning involved that there's no evidence in the scene of where the vehicle was recovered. And just to touch on what the other lady had said earlier, that it was, it was burned up to destroy any evidence which would absolutely do that if there was any evidence in there and even the dogs aren't going to detect it. For the human remains recovery dogs, if there was an entire body there, that's a different story. They just, they got to put the dogs in the locations as they develop this information where they're going to be able to detect any scent if she is still alive or if she is deceased and she's been hidden somewhere.

[Nancy Grace]

There is a five thousand dollar reward for information leading to the whereabouts of Nicole Winder, 5 7, about 130 pounds, blonde hair, blue eyes. Again, tips can be submitted to Crime Stoppers, who is offering a $5,000 reward in the search for Nicole. Again, if you know or think you know anything regarding her decision, appearance called The Brazos County Sheriff's 979-361-4900 repeat 979-361-4900 we remember American hero Tech Sergeant Ashley Pruitt, US Air Force just 34, killed in the line of duty in Iraq, leaving behind her husband turned widow Gregory and two children without a mother. American Hero Tech sergeant Ashley Pruitt. Thank you to our guest, but especially to you for being with us tonight. Nancy Gray signing off for tonight, but I'll see you tomorrow night and until then, good night friend.

[Martha Stewart]

This is Martha Stewart from the Martha Stewart Podcast. Ever wonder how to make hosting look effortless? Here's a secret. When prepping for cooking and baking, get ahead of the mess with new Reynolds Kitchens countertop prep paper. Just lightly wet the counter so the paper grips. Lay it down and drips and spills stay on the paper, not on your counter. Cleanup is as simple as lifting it away to reveal clean counters. Effortless it is thanks to Reynolds Kitchen's countertop prep paper. Wet it, set it, prep it, done. Available in the Reynolds wrap aisle at Walmart.

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[Dave Mack]

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[Dave Moyer]

I don't know if you knew this,

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but anyone can get the same Premium Wireless for $15 a month plan that I've been enjoying.

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[Dave Moyer]

So do like I did and have

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[Dave Moyer]

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[Dave Mack]

I'm told it's super easy to [e-mail]

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[Nancy Grace]

Hi, I'm Jess from Bonner, Montana.

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