Criminal – “Sister Helen”

Release Date: December 26, 2025
Host: Phoebe Judge
Guest: Sister Helen Prejean

Main Theme and Purpose

This episode features a deeply personal and illuminating conversation with Sister Helen Prejean, the renowned anti-death penalty advocate, Catholic nun, and author of Dead Man Walking. Through candid discussion, Sister Helen reflects on mortality—both personal and institutional—the profound responsibility of accompanying people on death row, and her evolution as an activist. The episode explores themes of faith, justice, forgiveness, and the persistent urgency of advocating for human dignity, especially within a flawed justice system.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Grappling With Personal and Public Death ([01:15]–[05:24])

• Sister Helen opens the conversation by sharing the recent loss of her brother to COVID-19, highlighting death as both a personal and universal mystery.

  • “There was this little kid... in the St Thomas housing projects... The kid said, ‘I'm too young to understand this.’ Well, I'm 81, and I'm too young to understand this… Everybody dies but me. You know that feeling. So it's just a big old mystery." – Sister Helen [02:38]

• She reflects on how personal bereavement informs her work with death row inmates, recognizing the distinction between private and public encounters with mortality.

• Emphasizes the imperative to “live and love fully” in response to the presence of death in both life and work.

  • “What I do with death is I’m alive. I want to live my life to the full as authentically as I can… because death can just punch you in the stomach.” [04:30]

2. Sister Helen’s Early Life, Awakening, and Vocation ([05:42]–[11:54])

• Childhood in Baton Rouge, upbringing in a devout Catholic family, and quick path to joining the convent after high school.

  • “I joined the convent right after high school. I had great nuns that taught me. They taught me to use my mind. They had a great sense of humor. They had a great sense of faith. And so I was, that's what I'm going to do.” [07:52]

• Describes the transformative influence of Vatican II, sparking debate among nuns about engagement with societal suffering and systemic injustice.

  • “How could you stand present to the suffering of people that came out of systemic racism and injustice and just be kind to individuals without tackling the system of injustice that was causing people to suffer?” [08:39]

• Moment of awakening to white privilege and systemic racism upon moving into the St. Thomas housing projects.

  • “It was like another country... All the rules were different. The way the police treated people. What happened if your child got sick and you don’t have health care… Everything was different. And so that was a huge moment of awakening. I had never even heard the word white privilege before.” [09:33]

• First invitation to write a death row inmate—originally intended as simple correspondence, which escalated into accompanying the condemned to execution.

3. First Encounters With Death Row and Executions ([15:04]–[21:04])

• Describes the beginning of correspondence with Elmo Patrick Sonnier after being asked to be a pen pal:

  • “It was just to correspond. What was under it was that I sensed that person was a human being who had been condemned to death. And it must be very lonely to sit in that cell.” [15:29]

• Her gradual transformation from letter-writer to essential, present companion and eventual spiritual advisor, witnessing executions firsthand:

  • “Lo and behold, two years later, when he's executed, the only one who can stay in the death house with him, the only one who can walk with him to his death and be there for him to look at your face, is the spiritual advisor.” [16:24]

4. The Ethics and Torture of State Executions ([17:09]–[24:56])

• Details the surreal and torturous experience of waiting to die by execution, both for the condemned and for those present:

  • “A human being who's alive. Not in a hospital, not fading, not dying—alive... looking at his watch. You now have three hours to live, two hours to live, one hour to live. And in the midst of that experience... you are not going to die. In fact, you've gotten a stay of execution and they bring you back to your cell. Then you're brought back a week later and you get another stay of execution. Then... they kill you. It's actually the experience of torture…” [17:39]

• Recounts the psychological agony suffered by those subjected to death row, emphasizing the system’s cruelty and likelihood of error.

  • “The definition of torture is an extreme mental or physical assault on someone rendered defenseless. What greater mental assault... than to be told, We're going to kill you in two weeks, we're going to kill you in three hours.” [19:27]

5. Guilt, Innocence, and Advocacy ([21:04]–[25:15])

• Bedrock belief in human dignity:

  • “Every human being is worth more than the worst thing they've ever done.” [21:04]

• When the condemned are innocent (as in the case of Manuel Ortiz), Sister Helen becomes both companion and advocate—coordinating legal efforts, investigating cases, and leveraging resources:

  • “When somebody's innocent, you got to fight for them. Do they need a good lawyer? ...And you do whatever it takes for justice to be done and for the truth to come out.” [22:18]
  • On the ever-present threat of death: “It's always this threat of death and knowing how the system can work and people have been executed, you know, so it's always over him, it's always that cloud over him.” [23:19]

• She sees her role as witness as essential, since executions are hidden from public view:

  • “When I came out of that execution chamber, I was so traumatized, I threw up. I never watched a human being deliberately, step by step, put to death. And that's when I realized, you know, the people are never going to see this. I've been a witness to a secret ritual... I got to tell the story.” [24:23]

6. Comfort and Presence at the End ([25:41]–[29:55])

• The focus is on sheer presence, dignity, and love in the face of state-sanctioned death:

  • “You are not going to die without seeing one face in that witness room that loves you and believes in your dignity... look at me. I will be there for you. I'll be the face of Christ for you.” [26:25]

• Discusses her correspondence with the Vatican contributing to changes in the Catholic Church’s teaching on the death penalty:

  • “Your Holiness, does the Catholic Church only believe in the dignity of innocent life?... What about the guilty?” [28:40]

7. On Good and Evil, and Systemic Wrong ([29:55]–[31:18])

• Sister Helen is asked about good and evil, focusing on condemning acts and systems, not people:
  • “You can never say that about a human being because you come to this mystery of the human person. So good and evil things happen, but the cause of them, or if you can put it in the person, no, you can't. It's evil when you have a systemic killing of your citizens... Those acts are evil. That system is wrong. It’s morally wrong.” [30:09]

8. Victims' Families, Forgiveness, and Complicated Healing ([33:04]–[39:26])

• Sister Helen candidly discusses her early avoidance of victims' families and her painful realization that healing requires embracing both sides:

  • “All this time you didn’t come to see us... I haven’t had anybody to talk to. Why didn’t you come see us? Oh, God, I was so wrong. It was a terrible mistake.” [34:41, Lloyd LeBlanc quote relayed by Sister Helen]

• Forgiveness is recast as a means of recovering one’s own wholeness, not condoning crime:

  • “People think forgiveness is weak... All I knew was that I was going to lose my own life and who I was... if I let that hatred overtake me.” [36:03, Lloyd LeBlanc quoted]

• Sister Helen describes the rare, profound relationships built with victims’ families:

  • “He’s the hero of Dead Man Walking. How you could go through that kind of suffering and not be broken by it or not so shaped by it that you... want that same kind of hurt to be visited on another human being...” [37:37]

9. The Spiritual, Moral Calling of the Work ([39:53]–[42:46])

• Sister Helen articulates the meaning of devoting one’s life to “soul-sized” work, regardless of visible reward:

  • “Spend it on essential stuff and hang out in the company of people... where things are soul sized. You’re working on big stuff, even though it may take years and you may never personally see the success of it... Do your work for the authentic reason of the work itself and not because you seek the fruits of it.” [39:54]

• On judgment and wisdom with age, and the role of privilege:

  • “I think it's if we get wise as we get older, we are less judgmental... It depends if we can achieve some kind of wisdom... I can afford to be a good person and not to be judgmental against people... because I was so cushioned." [41:07 & 42:24]

Notable Quotes and Memorable Moments

• “I'm 81, and I'm too young to understand this… Everybody dies but me.” — Sister Helen [02:38]
• “Every human being is worth more than the worst thing they've ever done.” — Sister Helen [21:04]
• “When I came out of that execution chamber, I was so traumatized, I threw up. I never watched a human being deliberately, step by step, put to death.” — Sister Helen [24:23]
• “You are not going to die without seeing one face in that witness room that loves you and believes in your dignity. And when they do this, you look at me. I will be there for you.” — Sister Helen [26:25]
• "It's evil when you have a systemic killing of your citizens like this in a very broken system filled with ignorance and bias and prejudice and political ambition. Those acts are evil. That system is wrong. It's morally wrong." — Sister Helen [30:09]
• “Spend [your life] on essential stuff and hang out in the company of people...where things are soul sized.” — Sister Helen [39:53]
• “The only way I know what I really believe is by keeping watch over what I do.” — Phoebe quoting Sister Helen [42:46]

Timestamps for Key Segments

• [01:02] – Introduction: Sister Helen discusses recent loss, death as mystery
• [05:42] – Sister Helen introduces herself
• [07:02] – Childhood, vocation, and awakening to social injustice
• [15:04] – First death row correspondence; transformation to spiritual advisor
• [17:39] – The experience and cruelty of executions
• [21:04] – Guilt, innocence, and human dignity
• [26:00] – Spiritual advising and providing comfort at executions
• [29:55] – Philosophical reflections: good, evil, and systemic wrong
• [34:02] – Interactions with victims’ families; forgiveness
• [39:53] – The lasting impact of this work and wisdom achieved with age

Language and Tone

• Candid, empathetic, and reflective. Sister Helen speaks with warmth, humility, and unwavering moral clarity; Phoebe Judge listens intently, asking thoughtful and probing questions that create openness and depth.
• The narrative moves easily from philosophical/spiritual musings to personal anecdotes and systemic critique, embodying both gravity and hope.

This episode offers rare insight into Sister Helen’s life and mission—the heartbreak, the challenge, and the unflagging call to stand up for the dignity of every person, no matter their crime, in a system fraught with error and suffering. Listeners are invited to grapple with the mystery of death, the complexities of forgiveness, and the everyday demands of justice through the lens of a woman who has witnessed both the worst and the best of humanity.