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- [00:00]
A
Hey, everyone. I'm Ann Emerson, and this is Crimly Obsessed. Are there more Gilgo beach serial killer victims? That question is still on the table for prosecutors. Even with Rex Heuermann behind bars, DNA protocol will.
- [00:16]
B
Will go to the FBI, and then they'll upload it in codis, and then, you know, it'll be in the CODIS system, and it'll be searchable throughout the country, so that'll happen imminently.
- [00:27]
A
Right now, authorities are running Hman's DNA through codis. That's a massive digital database of DNA profiles from convicted offenders, unsolved crime scene evidence, and missing persons. Did this man leave evidence somewhere else that nobody had connected to him before?
- [00:46]
C
Is this over? Is this case done?
- [00:48]
B
Well, this. This particular case, this indictment's done. Work is never over. You know, we mentioned some other, you know, some other victims.
- [00:56]
A
Ruth Baszinski and Rachel Sharp are both senior news and crime reporters for the Daily Mail. They've been covering this monster since day one, and they share my suspicions.
- [01:06]
D
I feel like there's probably a lot more victims out there, and, you know, it's going to be really interesting to see what unfolds.
- [01:14]
A
I've been making my own calls. I've reached out to authorities in Nevada, where Heuerman and his wife own timeshare properties in the Las Vegas area, and in South Carolina, where he owned a sprawling piece of rural property. In fact, a key piece of evidence, Heuerman's green Chevy Avalanche, was towed away from that South Carolina property. Were any unsolved cases ever examined in connection to those locations? And did investigators take a closer look after Heuerman's arrest? I'll tell you what the authorities told me later in the show, but be sure to like and subscribe so you don't miss any updates to this story. Now, let's get into it. Can you tell me what it's been like coming here time and time again in these hearings to come here and. And basically realize that they're building a case we didn't even know? I mean, it started off with four, right? Started off with a four, and now we're at eight.
- [02:17]
C
Yeah, I know. I think that's the thing. It's really grown over the years, as you say. There was, you know, the. The charges have mounted, and, I mean, it was only the day before the plea hearing when we learned that he was going to admit to the eighth victim, Karen Vergata. Up to that point, it was still seven. And, you know, I think for us as well, and I think for a Lot of people. It's still the question as to, is that where it ends or is there going to be more? You know, there's obviously some victims who are still, you know, still haven't got justice, who were found along Gilgo Beach. And there's also victims further afield who, you know, there's some similarities to, or he has ties to the locations that they went missing in. So, you know, I think it remains to be seen whether there's going to be more to come as well. You know, as you say, it started as four, and now it's eight. Is this gonna. Is there gonna be more to come?
- [03:17]
D
Once it goes into the CODIS system, there's a chance that more victims can be found. And we'll be right here, Rachel and I, waiting to report on that once that happens.
- [03:29]
A
I'm specifically interested in this just because it's literally up the road from me. Chester County, South Carolina, Las Vegas. I was in Las Vegas last week for a crime con. It made me think about that. What, like, are we. We're not done with this investigation, you guys. Yeah, I mean, there's other places that have. Are y' all looking at these other places?
- [03:53]
C
Yeah, that's something we are, you know, very interested in. And, you know, apparently a lot of these case. A lot of these jurisdictions have already contacted and, you know, you know, we've asked. We've asked the district attorney, and, you know, he said, you know, if they contacted us, we've kind of shared things. So, you know, even before the DNA was entered into codis, I think there has been some of that sharing. So whether, you know, whether or not he has been eliminated from some things, we're not, you know, we're not kind of privy to. To that at the moment, but that is certainly something that we're kind of looking to explore further, as you say. Yeah, because as you say, he had, you know, he had land in Chester county, and that's where his brother lived. That's where they obviously picked up the. The Chevy Avalanche, which was used in the commissioners or crimes. And, you know, he had a timeshare in Vegas, so there's all of these different locations. He also had ties to Atlantic City as well. And, you know, there's also just Featherfield here. There's obviously this Asian Doe who's yet to be identified. We don't know what, you know, whether. Whether he's another possible victim as well. And there's also, you know, so many unsolved cases across Supper County, New York State. This is a man who worked in Manhattan, he worked in Brooklyn. You know, think how dense these places are. I mean, I think there's so many more cases to at least eliminate him from, you know, and I think, you know, so some people, you know, some people we've spoken to say, you know, we think there isn't anymore. He would have said. But my personal opinion is, I don't know why he would have said because, you know, what we know about Karen Vergata is that they were. There was evidence connecting him to her that it might not have been enough to yet bring charges, but that it looked like that was where it was going. So personally I think that was enough of incentive for him to plead guilty to admit to the eighth murder. So, you know, are there more victims out there? I mean, I'm not an expert, but I think it's definitely something worth exploring.
- [05:58]
D
And I'm not an expert either. But when you're a serial killer, how do you just stop killing? I mean, that's like, you know, a loaded question like how do you just all of a sudden stop? So I feel like there's probably a lot more victims out there and, you know, it's going to be really interesting to see what unfolds and I just
- [06:20]
C
wanted to, can I just add to that? I think it'll be very, you hope that in the gap between 2010 when the victims were found along Gilgo beach and 2023 when he was finally arrested, I think we just, you know, we have to hope that there wasn't more victims during that time because obviously we do know that the investigation was very botched in those early days and you know, the consequences of if there are victims during that time when he could have been caught, you know, that pick the tip about the pickup truck was out out there from 2010, that was something that Costello's roommate had shared back in the back, back in the early days. So yeah, as I say, we just have to hope that there wasn't more victims during that time. But that was a 13 year window where apparently there was no more victims
- [07:17]
A
so that they found yet. I heard a lot about burner phones. What do we know about the burner phones? Why, why did he have 40 burner phones? Like, is this something you were learning along the way?
- [07:29]
C
Yeah, so I mean, obviously the, so the burner phones, you know, was one of the key things that actually helped them capture him, that, you know, he had all these burner phones and that they were in the same location as his cell phone. And you know, these burner Phones were being used to contact the victims and, you know, then what was stop being used. But yeah, we actually asked Ray about that today, and the burner phones for. He actually had. He had multiple burner phones, some of them dating back to the 90s. And he was using them up until 2023. So up until his arrest, he still had burner phones that he was contacting sex workers on. And he had many of these several numbers going back years and years and years. But then once he. What he did with the Gilgo four, which is the four most recent victims, is he was. Once he, it seems he'd selected them as his next victim, he would then buy a burner phone specifically to use, to contact them, use them for those benefones to contact, to contact them, to arrange a meeting with them, murder them, and then dispose of that benefone, and that benefone would never be used again. And he did that with the 4, with the Gilgo 4. And those benefones have never been found, but they obviously have the cell phone records for those. But again, it just all plays into how planned out it was. But I actually asked Ray, Tina, today, I said, you know, you mentioned that it was up until 2023, was he contacting more women? Had he already found other women who were on his radar? And he said, no, that didn't seem to be the case because he hadn't gone to that next step of obviously buying that burner phone for that single use for that victim. But, you know, we do know that, you know, he was still using them. And, you know, I guess, who knows? It's. I guess we'll never know. If it was only a matter of time before he did follow that awful
- [09:32]
A
pattern again and find another victim. Take me back a little bit to. To how you. You two got involved in this case in the first place.
- [09:40]
C
Yeah. So I think. I don't. Can't say I've worked on it as long as Ruth has. I know she's a, as a Long island resident. She's obviously been on being on this and being aware of this for. For a lot longer. But, yeah, I say. I would say I have been working on this probably since around 2020. So that was at a time when, you know, it kind of seemed like this was just a case that was never going to be solved. And, you know, it was just every now and then there'd be a new snippet of information coming out from Suffolk County. You know, whether that was a new victim identified or a new piece of evidence or A new kind of push to, you know, identify the serial killer, but really things didn't, you know, didn't really take off. And, you know, I really started working on the case in 2023, July 2023, when Rex Hillman was finally arrested. And, yeah, since then, we've obviously been at the courthouse for a lot of the court hearings, attended all the fry hearings, where the DNA evidence was obviously, you know, on the table.
- [10:49]
D
I've lived here a good part of my adult life, and, you know, I remember when there was, you know, the girls were getting killed, these sex workers, you know, they were being called at that time, and they still, you know, are called sex workers. And there was a serial killer on the loose, and. And people were just scared to go to the beach. And it was a. It was a really. A scary time. This case has been going on for decades, and, you know, I lived it.
- [11:19]
A
What has that been like as. As a journalist? I mean, we. We do compartmentalize things as. As people that cover crime. Right. But I would imagine you've had to kind of go there in your head as far as what Rex Heuerman was doing to his victims when. When these bodies were being discovered, and we were just starting to learn about this case. How has that. How has that impacted you as journalists?
- [11:47]
D
I mean, you feel so much empathy for these young women who are just trying to, you know, most of them are coming to New York to live their. Their best life. They had so many dreams, and they had such promising futures. And, you know, it's just a lot of these girls are the same age as my daughters. So, you know, of course, you know, I felt this. A lot of sadness, and, you know, it shows the evil out there. But also, as a mother, I just want to add that a lot of these, you know, the daughters were saying that they were robbed of a mother. They'll never see them. You know, a girl needs her mom. And it was just really emotional to hear that. Like, they weren't. You know, they missed. They missed them growing up. They missed them going to the high school graduation to, you know, the prom, to, you know, get married one day have children. I mean, it's. It just never goes away. And it was just very compelling. We've been covering this case since he was arrested. We've been coming to the courthouse every few months for hearing after hearing, and there was so much to unpack. Like, your head just is spinning. We're still unpacking the information that was found. I mean, just so much discovery, and we've Done so much interviews and there's still so many unanswered questions. Even know what really was his motive. They're trying to, you know, like the district attorney said, there were two sides of Rex Uerman. He had, like, two personalities. He's being researched by the behavioral analysis unit. Apparently he doesn't know, you know, what prompted him to, you know, become so evil.
- [13:39]
A
Tell me, what's the weirdest things that you've heard over the years? Is there any stories that just pop out that you're like, oh, my gosh, I'm never going to forget that day when we came and whatever happened?
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C
I mean, I think possibly not a bizarre thing, but I think it has been interesting to see the kind of, perhaps evolution might be too strong of a word, but the kind of progression of seeing Rex's own family in the court, you know, for the Fry hearings, so the DNA hearings, there was a point where Asa and so his ex wife Asa are low up, and the daughter, Victoria Heumann, were coming all the time.
- [14:18]
D
And, you know, honestly, there was no one in the courtroom for him today. His ex wife was not there. His children weren't there. He was a lone soldier there by himself.
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C
You know, we do know that Asa is still visiting him in prison and still speaking to him, but it seems, you know, whether it's a bit of a gray area as to whether Victoria still is or not, and, you know, we know obviously from their comments in the Pico show that they've done that Victoria, you know, came to the conclusion long before he confessed that he was the serial killer. I think it's an interesting one as well, to see them as well as a family involved in this and, you know, what's kind of next for them as well, I think is also kind of an interesting one.
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D
And Anne, I wanted to just, you know, I know we're ending, we're wrapping up, but just. Melissa can is Maureen Brainard Barnes sister. And she was speaking, she's so articulate, like all the other families, and she basically summed it up and she said, for years we lived in the shadow of what you did. We carry the fear, the unanswered questions. You are no longer in control of the story. This is about more than justice. It's about reclaiming what you tried to break and honoring what you could never destroy.
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C
Love.
- [15:39]
D
And it was just so powerful. Just. I know you have goosebumps, right? And just like at the end of today's sentencing, the families cheered and some of them yelled, ogre. Ogre. And justice. And they were. It was just really, I was so happy to witness that.
- [16:04]
A
Well, it's incredible that you, too, have been able to see this through right now. And as we just said, this is to be continued there. There obviously are some loose ends that we need to wrap up. But Rachel and Ruth, thank you so much for your time today. It's just fascinating to hear your perspective, your. Your details. You really, really brought us straight to what it's been like to cover this for so long. So thank you. I've reached out to several law enforcement agencies in Nevada and in South Carolina, as well as the FBI. As I mentioned at the start of the show, Heuerman owned properties in both states. And after his initial arrest, the Las Vegas Metropolitan Police Department released a statement saying they were currently reviewing its unsolved cases to see if he had any involvement. That was three years ago. I just spoke with a law enforcement source out there today, and right now they don't have any new leads, but I still have a call in to the homicide department just to check on a few things. In South Carolina, I spoke with the Sumter County Sheriff's Office who were looking into any possible connections between a woman who was missing named Julia Ann Bean and Heuerman after a tipster came forward with information. Bean's been missing since May of 2017. And the sheriff's office interviewed the tipster and the information was given to the FBI. So far, no connection has been made public. So be sure to like and subscribe. Turn on your notifications here at Cricket Obsessed. I will be updating this story with all of my other stories as new information comes in.