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- [00:00]
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- [00:30]
Mike Morford
I am from the future and all of this goes horribly wrong. Critics are calling good luck. Have fun, don't die. Absolute chaotic perfection.
- [00:40]
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AI Isn't that a thing already?
- [00:42]
Mike Ferguson
It gets a lot worse, honey.
- [00:43]
Mike Morford
Sam Rockwell is electric. Who's joining me? Who's ready to save the future?
- [00:49]
Mike Ferguson
Five stars. This is real.
- [00:51]
Mike Morford
Pretty much, yeah. It's gonna be okay.
- [00:53]
Mike Ferguson
Or it's not.
- [00:54]
Mike Morford
Not.
- [00:54]
Mike Ferguson
I don't know.
- [00:57]
Mike Morford
Only in theaters February 13th. Tickets on sale now.
- [01:01]
Mike Ferguson
Criminology is a true crime podcast that may contain discussion about violent or disturbing topics. Listener discretion is advised.
- [01:25]
Mike Morford
Foreign. Hello, everyone, and welcome to episode 396 of the Criminology podcast.
- [01:43]
Mike Ferguson
I'm Mike Ferguson, and this is Mike Morford.
- [01:46]
Mike Morford
Mr. Morford, how you doing, buddy?
- [01:47]
Mike Ferguson
I'm doing pretty good. How you doing?
- [01:49]
Mike Morford
Doing great. Having a good week. You know, just enjoying life and family and coffee and all that good stuff.
- [01:59]
Mike Ferguson
Yeah, you gotta enjoy the little moments when you can and enjoy the time when you don't have stress going on.
- [02:05]
Mike Morford
Yeah, absolutely. Let's go ahead and give our Patreon shout outs. We had Jessica Wolf and Logan Wright. So great new support. We really appreciate it.
- [02:15]
Mike Ferguson
Yeah. Thank you so much, Jessica and Logan. And for everyone else that helps the show out. For anyone else that would like to sign up, head over to patreon.com criminology.
- [02:24]
Mike Morford
All right, let's go ahead and dive into this episode. And, you know, we started off this show chronology talking about serial killers specifically. I mean, season one was Zodiac, season two was the Golden State Killer, and season three was Ted Bundy. I think for a lot of us in the true crime space, we just simply find serial killers fascinating. Of course, most of us despise them, what they do, but many of us are curious about what drives them to do what they do and how they got started. And I know for me, morph, that's where, you know, my fascination of true crime really started. It was with serial killers. Yes, there's the what did they do? Aspect of it, but for me, the most fascinating part of it is trying to figure out the Reasons behind what they did, what happened in their life, what experiences did they have. Obviously you have the whole nature versus nurture debate. We've gone through the childhoods of many serial killers, head injuries. There's just so much to unpack.
- [03:42]
Mike Ferguson
Yeah. When you try and put yourself in the shoes of the people that commit these crimes, do these horrible things, you know, it's allows you to try and you know, get into the their thinking. But a lot of times it's hard to do that because it's just so unfathomable what they do that you can't even get into that space.
- [04:04]
Mike Morford
And I think that's part of the reason why, the fascination, you know, it doesn't go away because you can't answer a lot of the questions. Now you can make judgments about one person. Well, they might have done it because of this or it's a number of factors. But I think for many it's really hard to get down, to nail it down.
- [04:30]
Mike Ferguson
Right.
- [04:30]
Mike Morford
To exactly what it was. And you know, a lot of times we talk about serial killers who were long established, infamous, but sometimes there are lesser known cases of people who are serial killers. But there's also cases of people who are serial killers in the making. And in today's episode we're going to talk about one of them, a guy named Cain Fairbank.
- [04:58]
Mike Ferguson
The number of known serial killers that were active in the 60s, 70s and 80s is truly terrifying. As we get further from the 80s though, there are fewer serial killers. There are multiple theories as to why this is happening, why there are not more modern day serial killers. There seem to be a couple main ideas that are prevalent more than others. The first was removing of lead from gasoline and paint. And another theory was the advancement of forensic technology, specifically DNA. And we could all debate about what's played the biggest role. But collectively the environment to be a successful serial killer is not as conducive as it used to be. Add to that things like electronics apps, social media monitoring and tracking, surveillance cameras. It's just harder and harder to get away with a murder now, let alone multiple murders. And that's a good thing. But despite all that, it's clear that the potential for multiple murders is still very real. In fact, Judge Michael Direta would go on to call Cain Fairbank a serial killer in the making. Luckily he didn't manage to kill anyone, though it wasn't for lack of trying.
- [06:04]
Mike Morford
On May 12, 2022, 18 year olds Hadley Monroe and Kane Fairbank went on their second date. The two met on Tinder and After texting and talking, they decided to take the next step and meet in person. Their first date went off without a hitch. They spent nine hours together and nothing seemed off the so they went on another date. This time they went to Mueller park in Bountiful, Utah, about a 30 minute drive north of downtown Salt Lake City. When the area was suggested, it didn't set off any alarm bells for Hadley. She told KSLTV.com it just felt like a really pretty area to have a picnic. This is an area that when you see photos of it, you, it does look pretty remote, but it's literally a public picnic area. It could be a good place to be able to really talk since a lot of other places can be loud and neither of them were old enough to go to a bar.
- [07:07]
Mike Ferguson
This second date for Hadley and Kane went just as well as their first date had. Once they got up to the picnic area in the park, it was so remote that there was no phone signal. It was just the two of them in nature, no interruptions or distractions. They spent more than three hours together talking and laughing. It was just before 6:30pm when the date turned into a nightmare. It's unclear whether they arrived at the park together or if they were in separate cars, but either way, they ended up in Cain's car. After their date, they were still sitting in his car when suddenly he was on top of her with a knife to her throat. He began to stab and slice at her with it. She was stabbed multiple times in the face and neck before trying to wrestle the knife away from him. Hadley told ksl, I grabbed the blade of the knife with my left hand to keep it from killing me. And I remember Cain saying, your blood is making this knife really slippery. Despite being caught off guard, Hadley managed to get out of the car and start running away from Kane. He followed, stabbing her in the back until she got close to a group of campers who banded together to shield Hadley from Kane. And rather than face this group, he decided to flee the area.
- [08:15]
Mike Morford
So no doubt more if this would be a terrifying ordeal. You know, it is a little scary when you think about it. You meet someone online. In this case it was Tinder. You know, you get to know a person through messages. Well, how much do you really know them? And that holds true, you know, before Tinder, right? You meet somebody at a bar. How much do you really know them?
- [08:41]
Mike Ferguson
You.
- [08:41]
Mike Morford
You decide to go on a date, okay. I mean, there is an inherent danger there. In this case, they're kind of in a remote area. Even Though it's kind of a picnic spot. But what really stood out to me here was, number one, the brutality of the attack. Stabbing and slicing and kind of just all of a sudden, you know, he's on top of Hadley with this knife. But him saying, your blood is making this knife really slippery, I mean, that just jumped out at me as though she was doing something wrong as he was trying to kill her.
- [09:26]
Mike Ferguson
Yeah. It's a very strange sequence or something to imagine going on during the scene. And she's got to recount this going back, talking about it. It's probably not easy for her to talk about what happened.
- [09:41]
Mike Morford
No, I can't imagine it would be. And this is the type of ordeal and thankfully she lived, but this is the type of thing that it's going to affect you for the rest of your life. I mean, how can you trust people the same way that maybe you did before? I think it would be really hard. But in an amazing twist of fate, this attack happened near multiple medical professionals. There just happened to be an entire group of them camping together nearby. So nurses and an EMT were on scene immediately. They were part of the group that helped shield her from Kane Fairbank. So as Hadley ran from Fairbank's car, she ran right to the very people who would be best able to help her. And she didn't even know it at the time. She was just heading away from Kane and chose to run toward a group of random people she could see. It was just about safety in numbers. But that instinct and will to live by. Hadley saved her life.
- [10:46]
Mike Ferguson
Yeah, she's really fortunate that there were people around, because out in that area, it sounds like it could be secluded or, you know, maybe if that day, if people hadn't gone there, she could have been all alone out there with him and this might not have been the same outcome.
- [11:00]
Mike Morford
Yeah, but not only people, people with actual medical experience. I mean, what better situation could you ask for after a brutal attack? Right, to run into a bunch of nurses, EMTs.
- [11:18]
Mike Ferguson
Cain knew at this point that even if Hadley didn't survive, he had been seen by witnesses, and police would likely be coming after him sooner rather than later. But rather than turn himself in or go on the run, Kane sought out another victim. He drove to a gas station in Bantiful after fleeing Mueller Park. Once at the gas station, he broke his phone and threw it away. He had also stolen Hadley's phone at some point during the attack, likely so that she couldn't call for help. And he threw her phone away, too. Then he walked from his vehicle and kept walking into a random neighborhood where he spotted his next intended victim, a 64 year old woman. Without warning, he pounced on her. This woman fought back valiantly and continued to fight him off even after she fell to the ground during the attack. The commotion attracted others nearby who came running to help her. Once again, Kane Fairbank fled on foot after being thwarted by a group of Good Samaritans. Before leaving the area, Kane coldly stopped and stared emotionless at his victim. She was lying on the ground and bleeding.
- [12:19]
Mike Morford
Now, in the second attack, Morph, you just mentioned it, right? There was another group of Good Samaritans that saw something bad happening and took action. But one of them clearly went above and beyond because that person chased after Kane Fairbank on foot and caught up to him at the nearby Fifth Amendment Bar and subdued him until authorities arrived. Meanwhile, the unnamed victim was rushed to the hospital where she was determined to be in critical condition. Now, I think we just have to pause for a second and talk about what we know about Cain Fairbank up to this point. He violently and without warning, attacked two different women who fought back and lived. Now, the Good Samaritan, who happened to be a male, chased him to the bar and subdued him. And during that interaction, Cain didn't fight back. So I think it's pretty clear, right, he's a coward who blitz attacks women and then when confronted by a male, he cowers. I mean, I think it's clear to me he's a weak, cowardly person.
- [13:30]
Mike Ferguson
And in so many episodes, we talk about how frustrating it is when witnesses don't help someone in need or they see or hear something happening and don't even call police. But in both of these attacks, the bystanders got involved and went really above and beyond, which is commendable. You hear all sorts of things about the so called bystander effect. But that was not the case in either of these attacks. Without hesitation, these witnesses jumped into action to help. Stephanie Dinsmore, a public information officer with the Davis County Sheriff's office, later said, we were very grateful that we had such amazing witnesses and bystanders that were able to assist at both crime scenes.
- [14:09]
Mike Morford
So these bystanders had done their part to help save both victims from Kaine. But neither of them were out of the woods. The second woman Kane attacked suffered a collapsed lung and severe internal bleeding. Eventually, she had to have part of her lung removed after it became infected. The medication she required from those injuries and surgeries caused damage to her kidneys. As for Hadley she was taken to the hospital in critical condition. If not for the quick help she received from trained medical care providers, she may not have pulled through. She needed staples on her head and 60 stitches just for the injuries to her face.
- [14:53]
Mike Ferguson
Kane Fairbank was arrested and charged with two counts of first degree attempted aggravated murder and one county to first degree kidnapping and second degree obstruction of justice. When he was handcuffed, he was covered in blood. It was all over his clothes and his shoes and he was actually smiling. Police were tasked with trying to figure out why Cain did what he did. They also praised the victims who fought back against him. According to Davis County Sheriff's Office Captain Teller west, both victims in this case were active defenders of their own lives. They took active steps to prevent the assault from furthering. And Davis County Sheriff's Office Public Information officer Stephanie Dinsmore added, we would stress that to anyone, always fight.
- [15:36]
Mike Morford
And there are a lot of stories, right, of people being attacked and really putting up a fight. And, you know, it's admirable. Nobody knows what they would do in that situation. I think there is a, probably for many a fight or flight reaction, right. You don't want to die. You're trying to get away, you're trying to fend off this attack. I mean, what's the best way to do that? Fight back? I guess now not everybody can. Some people are taken by surprise. I mean, there are all types of different scenarios. But luckily, you know, these two women were able to fight back and did. Yeah.
- [16:24]
Mike Ferguson
And I guess you never really know what you're going to do in that situation. And, you know, sometimes you'll hear the police advised to just cooperate with somebody if they're trying to rob you or something like that. And the best course of action is to, you know, cooperate, get them away from you as fast as possible by doing what they want. But there are other times when, you know, according to the police, that's not the way to go. And one of them is if somebody's stabbing you in the process of physically attacking you, you and you can't get away, you can't run, then you should fight back because you never know if you're gonna hurt them, incapacitate them for a couple seconds to buy yourself some time to get away. You know, at that point, you've got nothing to lose, so you might as well fight.
- [17:07]
Mike Morford
Yeah, there's really no cooperation. Right. In an attack like this. I get it. If somebody has a gun and they're telling you they want to rob you, well, the best idea might not be to fight back, because that might provoke them, cause them to shoot you. But this is a very different situation that we're talking about. When police interviewed Kane Fairbanks, he told the detectives that the fighting back by the victims is what stopped his attack. As soon as Hadley started fighting back, it changed the entire course of her future, taking what was supposed to be her murder and turning it into a shocking assault. She may not have survived to tell her story if she hadn't reacted the way she did. According to ksltv, Fairbank said to the police, I was like, all right, you're too strong. It was too hard for him to overpower her, and she was able to escape. Now, looking at Kane Fairbank, he's a pretty skinny guy. He's certainly not, you know, like a. A large, strong guy. If he was, maybe he would have gotten the upper hand on his victims. Kane Fairbank also told detectives that he chose his second victim simply because she was elderly, alone, and vulnerable. He likely thought that the older woman would fight back less than Hadley did or would at least be a lot weaker and easier to overpower. There were multiple people at the gas station that he could have attacked, but he chose her. Thankfully, he was wrong about the woman and overconfident in his own strength, and she was able to get away from him, even though she had been stabbed multiple times. I think all of this goes back to reinforce what we said earlier, right, that this guy is a coward. He targeted people he thought would be the most vulnerable and not pose a risk to him.
- [19:14]
Mike Ferguson
When speaking to People magazine about the attack on her, Hadley said, in a way, I'm happy it was me, because according to him, me fighting back deterred him. She understands that she saved her own life that day and that others may not have been so lucky or strong or willing to fight. We have to remember, none of us knows what we'd really do if in that situation. And it's not always just fight or flight. There are actually other responses, including freeze and Vaughn. If her instinct had been to freeze up, or if she tried to somehow win Kane over mid attack, she might have been killed. Thankfully, that didn't happen. At the time she was attacked, Hadley decided to download a dating app, which in this case was Tinder, and she was already going through a dark period in her life. She told ksltv, my mental health was so bad. She explained that when it gets as bad as it was, you're not thinking straight, and you have to really feel for Hadley here and wonder, how does this affect her mental health going forward, and hopefully she can get any help and guidance that she may need.
- [20:16]
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- [21:18]
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- [21:48]
Lately, car buying has become a pretty dull experience. But on ebay, behind every car and part is a story waiting to be shared. There was a guy who bought a 2020 Porsche Cayman GT4 on eBay. It was well loved. There are plenty of Caymans in great condition on ebay, but this one needed some work. That's just the start of the story. So after this guy gets a great deal on his dream car, he rebuilds the whole thing with all these parts he found on ebay. Performance brakes, suspension, body panels, the works. Guaranteed to fit. Next thing you know, this nearly scrapped Cayman was out there on the track as a full blown race car. You're ready to go daily driver. Your next Resta model. Hello Lotus Salon and the parts to finish it. Ebay has thousands of cars and is the largest online selection of vehicle parts and accessories.
- [22:35]
Mike Morford
Ebay things people love Dr. Julie Valentine has conducted research out of Brigham Young University about the use of dating apps and violent crime over just the three year period from 2017 to 2020 in Utah alone, there were 274 sexual assaults in which the victim and the perpetrator met online. And these are just the incidents that were reported. Dr. Valentine also found that many of the young women and girls who were attacked after meeting someone online, more than half of them actually were struggling with depression at the time. And those are scary stats. King Fairbank actually admitted that the whole reason he was using dating apps in the first place was just to find potential victims. According to ksltv, he said to police, that's why I got Tinder. When it came to deciding that Hadley would be his first victim. He explained, I could tell that she liked me and it would be easy to trick her. Seeing that he spoke about his choices so matter of factly is really chilling.
- [23:48]
Mike Ferguson
Now, you and I, Mike, have been married for a long time and out of the dating world, so we never really had to deal with apps because I don't even think they were around back when we were dating. But, you know, it's a good way for people to meet each other, you know, especially when they're busy with careers and everything else life throws at them. Sometimes you can't go out and meet people, so these apps really help them out. But there's a downside that it's so easy to just randomly meet someone you know nothing about and could be a great person, could be a very friendly person, could be someone you hit it off with, and it's the start of a great relationship. But there's also the possibility that you meet someone like Cain Fairbank.
- [24:34]
Mike Morford
Yeah, I think the thought of someone out looking for a victim, that's just so scary to me. Whether it's these people who just drive around in their car searching for victims, or in this case, Cain actually telling police, hey, I downloaded Tinder. I got Tinder just to try and find a victim. Now, you mentioned that you and I have been married a long time. I think for both of us, it's going on almost 30 years now, I believe. Not to date myself, but when I first started dating my wife, I think I had aol. Like, AOL had just come out, if that tells anybody anything. For people who are even old enough to remember when that was the big Internet.
- [25:28]
Mike Ferguson
Right.
- [25:28]
Mike Morford
They used to send you those CDs in the mail, and you would put that in your computer, download aol and fire up the modem.
- [25:39]
Mike Ferguson
Yeah, it's definitely. The dating world has come a long way since then. The interaction between Hadley and Cain wasn't brief. It wasn't an attack on her immediately after Meeting her as we talked about. They had been on another date that was uneventful. They had many late night calls and would spend hours talking on the phone. Hadley told ksltv, I'd stay up until one in the morning just talking to him. Their first date had been on May 10, just two days before the attack. It obviously went great. They hit it off so well that they immediately planned that second fateful date at Mueller Park. They spent hours together that day. Hadley said, I think that's what terrifies me. It's because he was so good at fooling me. I've tried and tried to comb through every single interaction that I've had with him to see if there's just something that I missed. I think that's what's really sad here is that it looks like Hadley seems to blame herself a bit, as if she missed some kind of warning sign that she should have spotted.
- [26:37]
Mike Morford
And I get that. I think that would probably be natural for anyone, you know, as you're going back through the interactions that you had with this person because it wasn't technically a stranger attack. Right. She thought that she knew this person. She'd already been on a date. They had talked for many, many hours on the phone. I mean, how could you not morf go back through all the interactions and try to figure out whether you missed something. But to me, it doesn't sound like she did. It seems as though Kane Fairbank was putting on a show and it was good. It probably would have fooled anyone. All the while it seems as though he was just biding his time though, waiting to strike.
- [27:29]
Mike Ferguson
And it's. She could have been attacked by him immediately upon meeting him, but he, you know, sort of, it seems like wanted to get his hooks into her a little bit, feel her out, maybe sense if she was the right person that he could victimize. And maybe that's why he spread it out over two dates.
- [27:50]
Mike Morford
Cain Fairbank didn't show any remorse or even regret over his actions. In fact, according to abc4.com, he seemed to have thoroughly enjoyed attacking Hadley specifically with a knife. He said that stabbing her in the back was such a nice noise and that it felt so good. The only thing he said he would change is the fact that his intended victim had survived. He even pointed to what he felt was his main choosing an inferior weapon. So, you know, here's a guy who isn't questioning his decision to attack two people. He was just questioning his choice in weaponry. He told police he should have used a much sharper knife the knife he used was nearly a foot long and had a fixed blade. And while discussing all of this, Cain laughed during the interrogation multiple times. He told detectives that he had fun during the attack, even if he didn't accomplish his original goal of murder. And according to ksltv, he admitted that for him, killing was kind of a sexual thing. And, you know, we mentioned it more of Kane Fairbank. He wasn't a big guy, right. He was a skinny dude. So he probably just looking at him was not imposing. He wouldn't be scary. But you know what is scary? Some of these things that he is saying to police. That he thoroughly enjoyed attacking Hadley, that stabbing her in the back was such a nice noise and that it felt so good.
- [29:35]
Mike Ferguson
Yeah, that's very disturbing stuff. And it's also scary that that knife being almost a foot long, didn't wind up being fatal for either of these women. That's a pretty big knife. Not that being stabbed with a pocket knife would be any less painful or might not take your life, but a foot long knife seems like it can do a lot more damage, you know, penetrating deeper in your body into organs and stuff. So just thankfully, maybe he didn't strike the right spots and both of these women survived.
- [30:08]
Mike Morford
But, you know, the other thing that jumped out at me was him admitting that the attack, the idea of killing, the thrusting of the blade was kind of a sexual thing. And that's something that we hear, you know, in a lot of cases with killers who specifically use knives, you know, a lot of times there is a sexual component somehow to killing. I think also with strangulation, sometimes, you know, it doesn't make sense to, to most of us, but that's what separates us from them, I guess, or one of the things. I think there's a lot that separates us from them, but that's one of them.
- [30:57]
Mike Ferguson
Investigators found multiple pictures that Kane Fairbank drew which depicted Hadley with her eyes gouged out. He fantasized about keeping her eyes as a trophy and storing them in a tackle box. And Hadley was just the beginning. Kane was planning to kill others after he killed Hadley. He was planning to perform sex acts on her corpse and then hide it so that it would look like she simply had vanished. With no evidence that she was dead, no one could really investigate him for a murder and could always claim she stood him up on that date. Obviously their cell phone records would have showed that they were together, but it would have bought him time to carry out more attacks.
- [31:33]
Mike Morford
So this is sounding like some Ted Bundy type stuff.
- [31:36]
Mike Ferguson
Here.
- [31:37]
Mike Morford
And Cain was basically going to treat Hadley's murder as a warm up. And he had other victims picked out, including members of his own family, his parents and sister. Maybe this is why he felt fine letting Hadley meet his parents before he killed her. After she was dead, they would be too. He wanted to kill them and his sister using a pickaxe. They wouldn't be able to tell investigators about meeting Hadley or about her relationship with Fairbank. They wouldn't be able to turn him in if they saw news about her murder and got suspicious of him. He also apparently made some kind of mask he planned to wear when he went out at night, prowling for his next victim. So, I mean, I think when you take all of this morph, it's just all so very disturbing.
- [32:29]
Mike Ferguson
Yeah, this is some stuff that sounds like it's out of a horror movie, but this is real life. After moving on from his family, Kane planned to keep using dating apps to find unsuspecting victims, all while moving around and living out of his car. According to kutv.com, his only real criteria for picking a victim is that they were vulnerable to him. It must have seemed like a foolproof plan, except that Hadley didn't die. She didn't kick off his killing spree like he had wanted her to. He even told police that if they let him go home that day, he intended to go right back to his plan of murdering people. He had even stocked up on food he would take on the road with him during the spree, so he didn't have to stop or shop or buy meals. Obviously, after admitting to all this, all of the evidence and the witnesses, Kane Fairbank was held without bail. There was just no way they could risk allowing him to be out on the street.
- [33:22]
Mike Morford
Deputy Davis County Attorney Richard Larson told KSL News Radio, this is a serial killer who fortunately got caught before he got good at killing. This is without question the scariest defendant I have ever encountered based on his willingness and desire to kill. And I've been doing this for 20 years. Kane Fairbank had no adult criminal record, but he was only 18 years old. And any juvenile record he may have had was sealed by state law. So you have this guy, right, saying, this is the scariest defendant I've ever encountered. I get that. I mean, when you think about all of the things that Kane Fairbank admitted to police, it goes back to what we said at the beginning of this episode, right? This guy was a serial killer in the making. He had this grand plan, but fortunately, it never Materialized. He did viciously attack two women, but his plans went well beyond that. I mean, he intended to kill both of those people. Luckily, he didn't, but he also was going to kill members of his family. And then he was essentially just going to keep finding people on the dating app and killing them. And this idea of kind of being mobile during his spree, that's a scary thought as well. If he's in his car, if he's moving from state to state. Okay. You can use that dating app essentially, wherever you are. He could have been a killer in a lot of different states.
- [35:13]
Mike Ferguson
And I think these officials that called him the scariest defendant they ever encountered and a serial killer, you know, in the making, basically. I don't think they're. That's a stretch by any count, because had he been alone with Hadley that day, instead of those people being out there, he may very well have killed her and probably would have been out setting up his next victim. And, you know, I think serial killers, over time, with more victims and more experience, just like any other thing you do more than once, you start to get better at it and maybe more efficient, maybe figure out ways to not be detected. And it seems like he would have been someone that would have really tried to hone his craft and do that kind of stuff.
- [36:04]
Mike Morford
But I do think there are some things he didn't think all the way through. Right. He said that they wouldn't connect him because they wouldn't find her body. Right. Hadley's body. But there would be quite a bit of an electronic trail, the dating app, phone records. There would have been no doubt that he had talked to her, had met her, had gone on a date or multiple dates with her. You know, I think he would have been a suspect even if he had been able to carry out his plan. So I, again, I don't want to say he didn't think it all the way through, because I don't know how many of these individuals do or if they. If they do think it through, their thinking is flawed. Right, we know that.
- [36:55]
Mike Ferguson
Yeah. And I think that's where we go back to talking about these kind of crimes back in the 70s or 80s versus now. There wouldn't have been a digital trail for somebody like Ted Bundy back then. You know, if he encountered a woman and killed her someplace out in a secluded area, you're not going to have, you know, apps tracking cell phones, tracking that kind of stuff, which is why it would be hard for someone like Ted Bunny to have as many victims today, because they just wouldn't be able to get away with it.
- [37:27]
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Lately, car buying has become a pretty dull experience. But on ebay, behind every car and part is a story waiting to be shared. There was a guy who bought a 2020 Porsche Cayman GT4 on eBay. It was well loved. There are plenty of Caymans in great condition on ebay, but this one needed some work. That's just the start of the story. So after this guy gets a great deal on his dream car, he rebuilds the whole thing with all these parts he found on ebay. Performance brakes, suspension, body panels, the works guaranteed to fit. Next thing you know, this nearly scrapped Cayman was out there on the track as a full blown race car. Your ready to go daily driver, your next rest, Amade, hello Lotus Salon and the parts to finish it. Ebay has thousands of cars and is the largest online selection of vehicle parts and accessories. Ebay things people love the legal process.
- [39:52]
Mike Ferguson
In this case seemed to move very slowly, but it could have taken even longer. Ultimately there was no trial in this case because Kane Fairbank decided to plead guilty to two Counts of first degree attempted aggravated murder. In return for the plea, the kidnapping and obstruction charges were dropped by the state, but it was also specified that sentencing in the cases would run consecutively. As part of his plea, Kane Fairbank chose the guilty but mentally ill option and claimed that he had schizoaffective disorder, which is characterized by symptoms of both schizophrenia like hallucinations or delusions, as well as a mood disorder like depression or bipolar disorder.
- [40:32]
Mike Morford
At his sentencing hearing, Kane Fairbank addressed the judge saying, I know what I did can never be undone, but every day I wish it could. I am sincerely sorry. Whether that was just what he was expected to say, or whether he truly made progress thanks to mental health treatment behind bars, we may never know. But it seems like a stark contrast to the bragging, gleeful would be serial killer that he seemed to be in his police interrogation. We can only hope that the slight hint of remorse he finally expressed was real and, and that he lives with guilt or shame over his actions so that he wants to strive to do better in the future, which would include continuing his treatment even if he were to be paroled in 2024. Kane Thomas Fairbank, who was then 20 years old, was sentenced to a total of 18 years to life in prison for the two attempted murders. Officially, it's 15 years to life for attacking Hadley and another three years to life for attacking the second woman. So there is a possibility that he could be out by the time he's 40 years old.
- [41:49]
Mike Ferguson
And hopefully, if Cain Fairbank truly suffers from mental illness, as he indicated, he'll receive the treatment he needs while in prison. If he happens to receive parole or any kind of early release, hopefully court ordered treatment would be mandated as part of that release. Jonathan Nish Kane, Fairbank's defense attorney, told KSL.com, we don't know the person we're going to be dealing with in 10 to 15 years. And the judge in this case warned it's an absolute reality that he will be released at some point and the victims need to prepare themselves.
- [42:20]
Mike Morford
And to me, morph, that's a scary statement. You know, looking at it from the point of view of the victim, Hadley and this other woman, and also you have to put his parents and his sister in there as well, if his parents are still alive down the road. The judge saying it's an absolute reality that he will be released at some point. Now 18 to life, is it possible that he's paroled at 40 years old? Yes, that possibility exists, but there's no guarantee if he comes up before the parole board. There's a lot of factors to take into account. What were his actions in prison? Did he go through treatment? Do they believe that he's a changed person? And I want to talk about what he said at his sentencing hearing. He said he wished he could take it back. He was sincerely sorry. I don't know. I don't know, man. I always wonder, are these people really sorry? Because he sure as hell didn't sound sorry when he was bragging to police, or are they just saying that because they know that's what the court wants to hear and that will help them potentially get a lesser sentence? And I tend to lean towards the latter most of the time.
- [43:54]
Mike Ferguson
Yeah. And I really feel sorry for Hadley and this other victim because, you know, they're having to recover from the physical attack, then they're dealing with the PTSD or whatever trauma that's going to bring, and who knows how long that's going to last. And if it's something that's ongoing, and then at some point down the road, then they have to relive this all with the possibility he's getting out on parole, and, you know, maybe they have to go to court and, you know, fight it, you know, give statements to try and keep him behind bars. But at some point down the road, they may have to face the fact that he's out there and is this going to feel like another attack on them, or are they going to be worried that he's going to come back?
- [44:43]
Mike Morford
And I don't think we can forget his family here. Right. They have to live with the knowledge, his parents do, that their son planned to kill them, and his sister has to live with the fact that her brother planned to kill her. I don't know how you deal with that. Hadley suffered from severe nightmares after the attack on her, which I think is to be expected right after going through something like that. But it just goes to show how, even after the attack itself is over, it never really ends for the victims. They survived, but they still live with the reality. The injuries, the fear, the pain. Cain's second victim, who is asked not to be named publicly, told KSL.com life is just so hard. Harder than it used to be. I'm afraid to walk alone anywhere. I know how exposed and vulnerable I am. Hadley also admitted that it was so hard, she sometimes almost wondered if she should have just given up. That day, she asked the question, how much easier would it have been to let him kill me? And that is sad, right? Both of those Statements are extremely sad because neither of these women did anything wrong. They didn't deserve any of this. But their lives have been changed, altered, and there's no way to get back to the individuals they were before. Kane Fairbank did what he did.
- [46:23]
Mike Ferguson
And then Hadley, she should be celebrating being alive, moving on with her future. And here she's dwelling on, maybe I would have been better if he had just killed me. And that's, you know, really sad. I feel really bad for her. It's pretty well known that to stay safe when you meet strangers from the Internet, you need to meet in a public area. You need to make sure you give a trusted friend or two the person you're meeting's name, phone number, license plate number, social media handles, anything that you can give to help identify the person if anything were to go wrong. And as we mentioned, Hadley spent a lot of time interacting with Cain. And this wasn't a blind date or a meetup. Right after swiping on each other on the app, after connecting on Tinder, Hadley and Kane began talking online and on the phone. They knew each other for months before they even met in person. She had even met multiple members of his family. And as far as she could tell, during all that interaction, there was nothing there. That was a glaring warning sign.
- [47:25]
Mike Morford
Hadley does have a little bit of advice. After looking back on everything he in her People magazine interview, she warned other young women out there in the dating scene to take him out with a couple of friends. Since she didn't see any signs of what Cain's true intentions were, maybe he wouldn't have been able to keep the act up around multiple people, especially skeptical best friends. And maybe her friends would have been in a better headspace where she was going through what she described as a depressive period in her life. Maybe having feedback from someone on the outside looking at is wise. At the same time, many friends of Ted Bundy's girlfriend were initially charmed by him. It's not exactly guaranteed that other people will spot the red flags you miss, but I think it's safe to say it could give you a better chance.
- [48:25]
Mike Ferguson
So some closing advice for anyone out there that may be using a dating app. As Hadley said, make sure you let your friends vet any potential dating partners and make sure you do it in the most public area possible. Not just somewhere that isn't behind closed doors, but somewhere with people who can act as witnesses or help in the worst case scenario. And possibly somewhere with surveillance cameras. I think most people meeting on these apps are legitimate people looking for a relationship, and they're safe. But as we know, not all of them are.
- [48:57]
Mike Morford
As for the second woman Kane stabbed, I mean, what are we supposed to do, morph, to prevent being attacked like she was. She was just out going about her daily business when she was attacked. She was attacked at a gas station while filling up her car. I mean, how was she supposed to not have this encounter, just not get gas? And it was broad daylight during the attack. What hours are reasonable to get gas alone? At what point does it become dangerous to do your own errands because you might be attacked by a stranger with a knife? Thankfully, most people are never going to be the victim of a deranged, wannabe serial killer. But we can all take steps to be in the best and safest positions possible. Sadly, unfortunately for Cain's second victim, she was just in the wrong place at the wrong time.
- [49:51]
Mike Ferguson
Hadley designed a tattoo based on her story and her experience and as a monument to her strength. It's a hand. Her hand gripping the blade of a knife. It looks like it's just a really cool design, but it's something that will always remind her of what happened to her. She told KSL tv, I put it on my body forever to understand. That's something I overcame. When she grabbed the blade of Cain's knife, trying to keep it from stabbing her, it sliced her hand so deeply, she suffered permanent nerve and tendon damage. Yeah, I don't think there's any doubt that she's going to have physical and emotional scars forever.
- [50:27]
Mike Morford
Yeah, I'm with you. I don't know how anyone could go through, you know, something like this, fight, survive, and end up not having both physical and emotional scars. But this tattoo really stood out to me because I do have a thought, morph, that her making the decision, Hadley making the decision to grab this knife could have been what helped save her life. Also must have been extremely painful because it sliced her hand, causing her permanent nerve and tendon damage. But it could have not allowed Kane Fairbank to thrust the knife into her the way that he had intended to. And so when you talk about strength, there's a strength there. Now, it might have been out of desperation. It might have been out of a lot of different things, but I don't care. It's. It's strength. It's amazing that she was able to do what she did at 18 years old. I mean, it kind of gives me goosebumps, to be honest with you.
- [51:44]
Mike Ferguson
And that tattoo is really cool for a couple reasons. One, it looks pretty cool. But also because it's something for her to look at. Maybe when she's doubting herself or maybe feels she's in a bad situation that she's doubting she can get out of. Maybe looking at that tattoo is always going to remind her that she can accomplish anything and that she can overcome anything. So maybe that's something that will help her long term.
- [52:12]
Mike Morford
But I think the biggest question that seems to be unanswered here at the end of the day is why? Why did Cain Fairbank decide to do this? We just don't know. There's not a lot of information out there about his family, so school, upbringing. Sometimes it's comforting to be able to find something and point to it to explain why someone does something like this. But frighteningly, sometimes there's just no explanation. And unless Kane Fairbank opens up more, we may never find out why he did what he did. Because if you think about it, the only thing he's really said is that it felt good to stab Hadley. He also talked about there being a sexual component to it. But I don't think any of that helps really explain why he decided or why he felt as though he wanted or needed to go down this route.
- [53:20]
Mike Ferguson
Yeah, I think sometimes it just helps you maybe to find something to where you can say, oh, that that's what caused this, or that's why he went down this path. And not that it makes it right or defends what he did, but it may be, for a lot of people, it just helps him to say, okay, I can point to something, but sometimes you can't point to anything. Sometimes there's. The information's just not there, or, you know, we don't always have access to it. And then you always have those lingering questions. How does somebody get to this point and do this kind of thing?
- [53:55]
Mike Morford
Well, we want to put things in boxes, right? We want to be able to make everything nice and orderly. And for a lot of people, that. That helps them. And when I say put it in a box, what I mean is category, okay, Kane Fairbank did this because X. So we're putting him in this box, right? He's a sexual sadist, or he is a whatever you want to say. So he goes in this box. And for a lot of people, that helps to kind of categorize killers. It helps explain, right, maybe who they are, why they did what they did. And like you said, morph. Without that, it can be a little frustrating for some because, you know, who likes unanswered questions? Not. Not many people at the end of the day, that's kind of what we're trying to do. Right. In a way, is answer some of the questions around why these people do what they do and when you can't answer them, all that can be frustrating. But I will say this. I don't think there's any doubt, as some of the authorities have said, Cain Fairbank, if he was able to get away with it, was going to go on and become a serial killer. I mean, there's just no doubt in my mind about that. He had grand plans, and they all centered around essentially killing as many people as he could, including members of his family. That's scary. But then the thought that he was just going to essentially travel from place to place, kind of either living out of his car or whatever he was going to do, and kill people he met on a dating app. Okay. How many people could he have potentially killed? Don't know. But it's a scary thing to think about.
- [56:12]
Mike Ferguson
Yeah. Thankfully, there's a lot of brave people in this story. You know, both the victims, their bravery, their will to fight back, and then all the people that came to their defense. Because we talk about in so many episodes how people want to get involved. They see something, they don't say anything, they don't try and stop it. They don't call police. Here, everybody came to the rescue, including the victims themselves. They rescued themselves. So, you know, kudos to everybody all around for that bravery.
- [56:42]
Mike Morford
Yeah. We had people who helped Hadley, possibly saved her life before she could get further medical attention. And. And then you have the people after the second victim was attacked who actually kind of chased this guy down. Right. And held him for police. You can't really say enough about them either, because without that, would he have gotten away? I don't know. Maybe. But that's it for our episode on Kane Fairbank. It's an interesting one for me, Morf, just because technically he didn't kill anybody. But it's real easy to see how his mind was kind of working at that point. Obviously, he did try to kill two people he had a grand plan to kill. Probably many, many more. He just never got to that point, thankfully.
- [57:42]
Mike Ferguson
And thankfully, we don't have Fiesta. We don't have to ask the question, how many victims does he have? Because he's in prison now and can't hurt anyone else. Hopefully, if he does get out, he's rehabilitated.
- [57:56]
Mike Morford
Yeah. Because if not, this could be one of those stories where, let's say if he were to get out at the age of 40 that's still relatively young. And if he's still got these thoughts going on, could he kill people? And I think the answer is possibly, yeah. If he doesn't get help, if he doesn't change his way of thinking, that's what we could be looking at here. But if you love the show, go out, take a minute. If you haven't, leave us a review, give us a rating. Also, keep telling your friends. That word of mouth about the podcast really helps us out.
- [58:36]
Mike Ferguson
If you want to find us on social media, we're on every major platform. Just search for Criminology Podcast on your favorites. And for news about the show, old episodes and more, head over to our website, criminologypodcast.com and if you want to join a discussion group about the cases we discuss or the podcast, go over to Facebook and check out Criminology Podcast Discussion and fans.
- [58:59]
Mike Morford
So that's it for another episode of Criminology. But Morph and I will be back with all of you next Saturday night with a brand new episode. So until then for Mike and Morph, we'll talk to you next week.
- [59:11]
Mike Ferguson
Take care everyone.
- [59:29]
Mike Morford
Sam.