Loading summary
Transcript79 lines
- [00:00]
Amazon Music Advertiser
For everyone who solves crime from their couch, knows more about forensics than their own job, and has trust issues with small town sheriffs. Amazon Music's millions of podcast episodes are calling. Just download the Amazon Music app and start listening to your favorite true crime podcasts ad free included with Prime.
- [00:19]
Instacart Advertiser
We all prefer things a certain way, like groceries. If you want groceries just how you like them, you gotta try Instacart. They have a new preference picker that lets you pick how ripe or unripe you want your bananas. Shoppers can see your preferences up front, helping guide their choices. Because when it comes to groceries, the details matter. Instacart get groceries just how you like.
- [00:40]
Mike Ferguson
Criminology is a true crime podcast that may contain discussion about violent or disturbing topics. Listener discretion is advised.
- [00:58]
Mike Morford
Foreign. Hello everyone and welcome to episode 398 of the Chronology podcast.
- [01:22]
Mike Ferguson
I'm Mike Ferguson and this is Mike Morford.
- [01:26]
Mike Morford
Mr. Morford, how you doing, buddy?
- [01:28]
Mike Ferguson
I'm doing pretty good. How you doing this week?
- [01:30]
Mike Morford
I'm having a good week. Busy, but really good.
- [01:34]
Mike Ferguson
What's, what's keeping you busy?
- [01:36]
Mike Morford
Well, I, I don't know if I've talked about it on this podcast, but Gibby and I decided to put a second episode out on True Crime all the time. So we got a little bit more work and we're doing some video too. So that's what I've been up to.
- [01:51]
Mike Ferguson
I had a little bit of a down week actually and but my wife was away doing some work stuff, so I had the kids here and trying to get everything done by myself and realize how hard a job that is. So, you know, I'm always thankful for my wife, for the job she does. I really appreciate it.
- [02:07]
Mike Morford
Yeah, tough being a single parent. Let's go ahead and give our Patreon shout outs. We had Madison Cox and Karen Gilly. So great new support. We really appreciate it.
- [02:17]
Mike Ferguson
Yeah, that's awesome. Thank you so much for that support. It really helps out the show. For anyone else that wants to help out, go to patreon.com criminology to get started.
- [02:26]
Mike Morford
All right, Morph, let's go ahead and jump into this week's case, or should I say cases? You know, Valentine's Day just passed and hopefully everyone listening enjoyed their day. Maybe they spent time with their significant other, had a romantic evening. You know, Valentine's Day is traditionally a special day. You know, it's filled with love and happy memories, but not all of the time. And in this episode we're talking about the murders of Jody Sarin and Carolyn Eaton. Their murders are unrelated, but there's a common theme and that is Valentine's Day. One was killed on Valentine's Day and the other person's body was found on Valentine's Day. And you know, their deaths left their families heartbroken. And so for them, Valentine's Day will never be the same again. And you know, we do unfortunately have to discuss murders that occur around the holidays. And one thing that I can't help but think about is, you know, what happens then to that holiday. You know, how does it change? Because obviously, you know, it does. And it doesn't have to be a murder. Some people have a person who unfortunately passes away around a specific holiday and, and even something like that can change that holiday forever.
- [03:53]
Mike Ferguson
In 2007, 39 year old Jodine Elizabeth Sarin, or Jody as she was known to most people, was living in Carlsbad, which is just north of San Diego, California. Jody's been described as mentally disabled but still high functioning. Only one article noted that she suffered from schizophrenia. According to her mother Lois, in an interview with NBC 7 San Diego, she did really well. But life could be a struggle for her. At times, though, Jody needed support. She was able to live independently in a ground floor condo unit that her parents helped her get. It wasn't too far from their own home, so it was nice for them to have that peace of mind that even though Jodi was on her own, she was still close.
- [04:35]
Mike Morford
On Valentine's Day 2007, Jody's parents, Arthur and Lois couldn't get in touch with her. They spoke on the phone often to make sure she was okay to help her with things since she couldn't drive. But that day she wasn't answering and she hadn't called them back. Around 10pm, Arthur and Lois got back from their Valentine's Day date, which was dinner and a movie. Jody still hadn't returned their calls. It had been almost 24 hours since they had heard from their daughter. They couldn't go to sleep until they knew she was okay. So they went over to her condo to check on her. They knocked, but she didn't come to the door. So they used their key to unlock it. A chain latch was engaged though, so they still couldn't get in. They could see that the lights were on. Nothing looked out of the ordinary, but it was very concerning that they hadn't heard from Jody, even if she was asleep or taking a shower at the moment and just didn't hear them at the door. They just couldn't take the chance that something was wrong. So Arthur actually forced his way in and broke the latch. The commotion from this still didn't make Jody come to the door to see what was going on.
- [05:50]
Mike Ferguson
Arthur made his way into the bedroom, but stopped immediately. He was caught off guard by a man who was in Jody's room standing over her, and it looked like he and Jody were having sex. Understandably, this was awkward for Arthur, and he quickly backed out and went into the living room to wait with Lois. They figured that Jody and the man who they assumed must be her boyfriend or at least romantic interest, would be out when they were dressed. But they waited and waited. Finally, Arthur decided to go back into the room and check on Jodi, since so much time had passed. And in that instant, the situation changed from awkward to dire. When Arthur went back in, the man was gone and Jody was lying on the bed and she was clearly dead. Her parents frantically called 911 and were instructed by the dispatcher to move Jodi to the floor so they could perform cpr. Her father did move her to the floor, but it was no use. It was clear that Jodi had been dead for some time. She was cold to the touch and more.
- [06:49]
Mike Morford
If you and I cover a lot of situations that are hard to imagine putting yourself into this one man, I don't know if we've ever talked about anything like this. We've talked many times about strangers, even loved ones, you know, finding someone in their family dead. But, you know, here's a situation where a mother and father are understandably concerned about their daughter. She has special needs, and they haven't heard from her. They most likely talk to her very often, probably every day, but she's not getting back to them. Okay. Many parents can probably put themselves in that situation, maybe even the situation of having to bust in because they think something's wrong. Now, oftentimes it turns out that it. It's nothing. Right. But not here.
- [07:52]
Mike Ferguson
Yeah. Walking in on your daughter in what you think is her having sex, you know, that's got to be one set of emotions. Very awkward, embarrassing, but only for it to escalate into a situation where, no, she's not having sex, she's dead, and the man that you just saw in there with her is now missing. So I can't imagine the range of emotions that happened over that short span for these. These poor parents.
- [08:24]
Mike Morford
And I think that's the thing that really jumped out at me is, you know, Arthur, as the father, is very close to this individual. Right. As he walks into the room. It couldn't have been that far. You know, bedrooms aren't that big. So to look at it or think about it after the fact, after you know that your daughter's dead, most likely you were standing right next to her killer or very close to Arthur and Lois, in shock over what happened, tried to console each other. And the realization quickly set in of what really happened. As we just talked about. Right. Art hadn't interrupted his daughter in an intimate moment. He had walked in on his daughter being sexually assaulted long after she was dead. Although Arthur could not have saved Jody, he was no doubt upset that he could have stopped the man who had murdered her. He told CBS 8, I would have liked to do it all over again and grab this turkey. He just had no way of knowing at that moment that Jodi was dead. He. He thought this was an interaction with a boyfriend, and he had stepped back to give them some privacy and not try to stop what was going on. Arthur said Jody was 39. It's her life.
- [09:46]
Mike Ferguson
Police believe that the killer likely walked right out the front door. The way Jody's condo was set up, you couldn't see the front door or Jody's bedroom door from the living room where both of her parents were waiting for her. But in his haste to leave, the man did leave behind a pair of shoes. Jody insisted that anyone who came inside took their shoes off at the door. In his rush to leave without her parents noticing him, he didn't grab them. This seemed like an indication that perhaps Jody did know her killer and had invited him in.
- [10:17]
Mike Morford
Jodi had been visibly beaten by her killer. An autopsy would reveal that she had been strangled and suffered blunt force trauma to her head. There were defensive wounds on her body, indicating that she had been fighting back during the attack. Her neck had been cut, but not deep enough to be fatal. And detectives believe that wound could have been inflicted on Jodi after she was already dead or at the very least, unconscious. The medical examiner estimated that Jodi had died around noon that day, about 10 hours before her parents found her. Unidentified male. DNA was recovered from Jody's body and later entered into CODIS, but it didn't match any sample in the database.
- [11:05]
Mike Ferguson
Investigators were tasked with trying to figure out who killed Jody. There were no signs of forced entry other than Arthur breaking the latch to get in. And that's not very surprising, since it seemed that Jody may have known her killer and invited him into the condo. If he had forced his way inside, it's not very likely that he would have also taken off his shoes. This seems to indicate that Jodi was at least comfortable with letting the man inside. We don't know when she invited him in or under what circumstances. It was clear to police that the killer had moved around the apartment freely after Jodi was dead. Based on the estimated time of death, he could have been there for up to 10 hours after the murder. There was blood in multiple spots, One of which was in the bathroom. At least one bloody footprint was left on her carpet. Things had been moved around the condo, too. Her bedding had been used to cover up all of the windows in the room. A full length mirror had been placed in front of the dresser next to the bed, Blocking access to any of the drawers. Investigators believed that her killer had put it there specifically so he could see himself as he assaulted her and morph.
- [12:07]
Mike Morford
We just talked about how shocking this whole thing was. I think it becomes even more so after you find out that Jody had been dead for approximately 10 hours by the time her parents got there and encountered this man. Meaning he was there doing all sorts of nasty things for what seems to be a very long period of time.
- [12:38]
Mike Ferguson
Here he is doing this in the first place to anyone, let alone someone with special needs. But now we have this added ick factor of long after she's dead, he's there, apparently engaging in necrophilia with her. Now you have this mirror that he's got in front of the bed, and police think that he was watching himself doing this. It's. It's almost out of, like a scene out of American Psycho. There's a. A memorable scene like that in that movie that reminds me a little bit of this. It's really disturbing, and I can't imagine how terrified Jody was at the end of her life with this guy doing this to her.
- [13:20]
Mike Morford
Arthur gave a description of the man he had seen in Jody's room, which was used to create a composite sketch. Arthur described the man as chubby and at least 5 foot 8 to 6ft tall.
- [13:33]
Instacart Advertiser
About.
- [13:33]
Mike Morford
Unfortunately, Arthur, in his haste to back out of the room quickly, didn't get a real good look at the man. And he had only caught a glimpse since the bedroom light was off and the windows had been covered by blankets. Arthur didn't just give a description of the man he saw. He also told investigators the name of a man he believed it could have been. Art believed it could have been a man named Robert Burns. Robert was an acquaintance of Jody's and was also developmentally disabled. They had multiple appointments and activities together and would often run into each other at the Bus stop.
- [14:12]
Mike Ferguson
Police quickly zeroed in on Robert Burns, and almost immediately, he was arrested and questioned. Unfortunately, Arthur and the police were wrong. They had a DNA profile from the killer and Robert Burns DNA did not match the killer's. Surveillance footage from a bus in the Escondido area also proved that Robert wasn't even in the area when Jodi's father walked in on the killer. It just couldn't have been him. It was a letdown for both police and Jodi's parents, who were hoping for a quick resolution in the case. Unfortunately, despite having an eyewitness who saw the killer as well as that person's DNA, there wouldn't be a quick resolution, and the case went cold. Years later, Jodi's parents were still hoping for answers and praying that the man who murdered Jody wouldn't strike again. In 2011, Jody's father, Arthur, told the San Diego Union Tribune that their number one concern was to get the monster off the streets.
- [15:05]
Mike Morford
Obviously, Jody's murder forever changed the holiday for Arthur and Lois Serrin. Each Valentine's Day following her murder, Art and Lois would take a trip together, trying to escape their memories of that day. In 2007, they wanted to be anywhere but in Carlsbad, where their daughter was brutally murdered. And who can blame them? The last time they celebrated that holiday in Carlsbad, the night ended with finding Jody dead. It would understandably be hard to feel romantic on that day, especially in the same area, and add to that the fact that they still didn't know who was responsible. That person could be anywhere.
- [15:47]
Mike Ferguson
There were no strong leads in Jody's case for years, and fingerprints and DNA continued to be a dead end because there were no matches in the system. By 2015, investigators were running the DNA from the scene through the database every week, hoping that one day there would be a match. Her parents began to wonder if an answer would ever come. Lois Serrin told the San Diego Union Tribune. This monster could be dead, and we will never know. It seemed hopeless to Jody's parents at times, but police never gave up trying to solve Jodi's case. On the 10th anniversary of her murder, there was a renewed effort to bring the case to the public's attention in the media.
- [16:25]
Mike Morford
Parabon Nanolabs released a composite image of what the suspect could look like based on his DNA profile. Then forensic genealogist Barbara Ray Venter worked with the YSTR from the DNA sample to find the suspect's male lineage, and her efforts paid off. She ended up finding the killer's family tree and came up with the last name Mabrido, which led investigators to a suspect with that last name. In 2018, an evidence swab from the crime scene was retested against samples from family members of that new suspect, and this time, there was a definitive match to the suspect, and his name was David Aaron Mabrido.
- [17:13]
Mike Ferguson
Sadly, David Mabrido would never be held accountable for killing Jody because he had died in January 2011. That year, he was caught up in a traffic stop and matched the description of the suspect in a bank robbery and was compelled to give his DNA for comparison or be arrested because of how suspicious saying no would look. Just a week after this traffic stop, Roberto died of a drug overdose that police believed was a suicide. He had lived with the secret of murdering Jody for almost four years, but an encounter with law enforcement just before his suicide required that he give up a sample of his DNA. He likely knew that once his DNA was in the system, he could be linked to Jody's murder and held accountable for it. Luckily, police held on to that DNA sample he had given, and it was later used to confirm he was Jody's killer.
- [18:03]
Mike Morford
And more. If you and I did a whole season on cases that were solved using forensic genealogy, I mean, I continue to be amazed at what some of this technology can do. Obviously, we've talked about parabon nanolabs a lot over the years. They've kind of been at the forefront for a lot of this stuff. You know, amazing to me that we can now get an image of what a person might look like simply based on a DNA profile. And then obviously, the forensic genealogy side of things is being used to great effect. Right. To solve cases, running down family trees, finding the killer through that family tree. I mean, it's. It's really compelling stuff.
- [19:01]
Mike Ferguson
Yeah. It seems sometimes we take it for granted now because it's just so commonplace that we see so many cases being solved weekly. And I remember when this first came out, when this first started happening, these. These solves, it was, like, so revolutionary and new and exciting. And even before that, when they were just able to do these parabon snapshots of, you know, what the person looked like, you know, sketch based on their genetic makeup. That was groundbreaking at the time, but now we don't even need that. We can just use the genealogy to catch these bad guys. So it's. It's great to see this is all advancing. And who knows, if they can do all this now, five, ten years down the road, they might be able to do even more groundbreaking stuff.
- [19:50]
Mike Morford
Well, I'M sure they're going to, right? Technology always advances. We don't know what the next big thing will be, but I'm sure it's going to lead to even more cold cases being solved, and to me, that's just exciting stuff. Now the downside is that a lot of the time, once they figure out who the killer is, that person is already dead and cannot be held accountable. And there is some sadness in that for me. But the good news is that the family at least gets answers after, you know, a number of years.
- [20:35]
Instacart Advertiser
Whether you're solving murders during breakfast, cracking cold cases on your commute, or playing amateur detective at bedtime, Amazon Music's got millions of podcast episodes waiting. Just download the Amazon Music app and start listening to your favorite true crime podcasts ad free included with Prime Confronting
- [20:54]
National Debt Relief Advertiser
high credit card debt can feel scary. But the good news is if you owe $10,000 or more in credit card debt, financial relief options are now available. National Debt Relief is currently offering debt relief designed to reduce what you owe and put you on the fast track to becoming debt free. If you qualify for debt relief, you may be able to pay back less than what you owe and save thousands of dollars. Just visit nationaldebtrelief.com Imagine only paying one low monthly program payment you can afford and saving money as you become debt free. National Debt Relief has already helped bring debt relief to over 550,000 US consumers, earning thousands of five star reviews and an A rating with the Better Business Bureau. You're stronger than your credit card debt. Let today be the day you start turning things around. Take the first step and visit nationaldebtrelief.com to see what debt relief you may qualify for. That's nationaldebtrelief.com this podcast is sponsored by IQ Bar.
- [21:48]
Will from IQ Bar
I've got good news and bad news. Here's the bad news. Most protein bars are packed with sugar and unpronounceable ingredients. The good news? There's a better option. I'm Will and I created IQ Bar Plant protein bars to empower doers like you with clean, delicious, low sugar, brain and body fuel. IQ bars are packed with 12 grams of protein, brain nutrients like magnesium and Lion's Mane and Zero Weird Stuff. And right now you can get 20% off all IQ Bar products plus free shipping. Try our delicious IQ Bar Sampler Pack with seven plant protein bars, four hydration mixes and four enhanced coffee sticks. Clean ingredients, amazing taste and you'll love how you feel. Refuel smarter, hydrate harder, caffeinate larger with IQ Bar. Go to eatiqbar.com and enter code BAR20.
- [22:37]
Mike Morford
To get 20% off all IQ Bar
- [22:39]
Mike Ferguson
products plus free shipping.
- [22:41]
Will from IQ Bar
Again, go to eatiqbar.com and Enter code BAR20.
- [22:46]
Mike Morford
So finally, after 11 years, Jody's parents had answers. And the monster that they worried about striking again had been off the street for years. Carlsbad Police Chief Neil Gallucci told NBC 7 San Diego, we never forgot Jody, and we're grateful to have identified the person responsible for her tragic murder. Marissa and Dylan Mabrido, David Mabrido's ex wife and their son were actually honored with a Citizens of Courage award from the San Diego District Attorney's office for their help in the investigation by voluntarily giving up their own DNA samples and to compare against the sample from Jody's murder. At the time, Dylan was just 14 years old and, you know, more of this had to have really shaken him up and left him with a lot of questions. He told NBC 7. You can't really explain how it feels when you realize it's your dad. Lois and Arthur Sarin were actually concerned about how Dylan took the news and how he was doing after learning about what his father had done. The two families met and wanted to keep in touch despite the difficult circumstances that brought them together. Art Sarin passed away in April of 2024. It appears that Lois is still alive. And sometimes, you know, you have very heartwarming moments in what to this point has been a really horrific case. I think this just shows you what kind of people we're dealing with here. Art and Lois being worried about Dylan. I mean, imagine what type of compassion people have to have to be worried about the son of their daughter's killer. I mean, that, it just gives me chills a little bit to think about it. And then I think you also have to really give props to, you know, Marissa and Dylan for voluntarily cooperating with police.
- [24:58]
Mike Ferguson
Yeah, I think all around, as you just mentioned, these, these are some good people. You know, you've got two people connected to the killer that are willing to help by giving their, their DNA. And then you have Jody's parents accepting of this other family that's hurting because they found out their husband, father is a murderer, but yet they, they still sort of welcome them and care about what happens to them. I, you know, it's just a good story all around this part of it that these people were through these awful circumstances, connected and, you know, seem to care about what happens to one another. It's still unclear how David Mobritto and Jody knew each Other, if they even did, though there are a few guesses. Morbritta was a transient and Jodi was an active volunteer at multiple local non profit organizations, at the San Diego Humane Society and at her church. It's possible that they somehow crossed paths while she was volunteering and he was receiving services somewhere. It's also possible that they met on the beach. Jodi was described as someone who loved long walks on the beach, and Mabrido and his ex wife Marissa met each other on the beach. Lt. Corin told the San Diego Union Tribune. The nature of their relationship and how they cross paths is unfortunately gone with the people that are involved.
- [26:22]
Mike Morford
For Jody's parents, Arthur and Lois, the long wait was painful, but they finally got answers thanks to the DNA. It came while they were both still alive and not years or decades after Jody's family was long gone. And as we sometimes see, and I think, you know, for me there's some solace in that, right, that Jody's parents got to find out while they were both still alive. Because, you know, let's face it, some of these cold cases that are solved, you know, they go on 20, 30, 40, 50, even 60 years. And key family members by the time the case is solved, often have passed away, which means they died without ever knowing what happened to their loved one.
- [27:18]
Mike Ferguson
Yeah, we talked about how they initially were skeptical of the case ever being solved and maybe lost a little bit of hope along the way. But thankfully the police kept plugging away and use those advancements in DNA science to, to have a resolution in this case. So her family did get those, those answers, even if the person that did it was already dead and, and couldn't face justice.
- [27:45]
Mike Morford
And earlier we talked about a man named Robert Burns. You know, it seemed to me, at least from the standpoint of Arthur, that, you know, he gave out this guy Robert Burns as a possible suspect. And you always wonder what that does to somebody who we now know wasn't responsible for Jody's death. But how long did they have to live with this kind of cloud of suspicion, right, hanging over them? That's got to be really tough.
- [28:23]
Mike Ferguson
And just as tough, you know, wanting the answer, giving a person's name like that. You know, Arthur was probably hoping that that would be the guy, and it wasn't. But I imagine that he had some, some guilt, even though he shouldn't have. He probably felt some guilt over the years after not stopping that guy when he saw him. And he couldn't have saved his daughter, but I still think that he probably had wrestled for years. With what if I had stopped him, would it have made a difference? Could the police have arrested him right away and then we would have, you know, had an answer right away. So, you know, I wonder how that affected him the rest of his life.
- [29:05]
Mike Morford
Yeah, well, unfortunately, I think a lot of people are forced to live in the wake of this type of situation with guilt. Whether it's survivors guilt because someone lived but somebody else died. In this case the parents. You know, so often I imagine there's guilt when there really shouldn't be, but it's inevitable. Right. You can tell yourself there's really, there's no way I could have known. But it's not going to stop the guilt from seeping in, I imagine.
- [29:43]
Mike Ferguson
Yeah. I'm just glad that eventually Jody's case was resolved and her family maybe found some peace in that and we know who did this to this poor woman and, you know, she can rest in peace, hopefully. So the first case we talked about, Jody Sarin, was solved and her family got answers. But the next case we're discussing, Carolyn Eaton's remains unsolved. And sadly, her mom passed away. Not just waiting to find out who had killed Carolyn, but where she even was, because Carolyn's case started off as a missing person's case. 17 year old Carolyn Eaton was last seen at around 3 o' clock in the morning on February 4, 1982. Though at that time no one knew that the young girl they were looking at was Carolyn. She was spotted with an older male truck driver at the Monte Carlo truck stop in Ash Fork, Arizona. The age gap between them, she was clearly just a teenager and the man looked to be in his 50s as well as the extremely early or late hour made her stand out to Patty Wilkins, who was working as a waitress there at the truck stop that was owned by her family. She actually asked the young girl if she was okay and told her that she was welcome to stay at the truck stop if she wanted to. But the girl basically said everything was fine and, and stayed with the truck driver she had arrived with.
- [31:05]
Mike Morford
The man ordered breakfast for himself, but the girl was suffering from a severe toothache, so she couldn't eat anything. She ordered only water. It seemed to upset the man that he couldn't help her pain. So Patty actually stepped in. She crushed up a baby aspirin tablet and put the powder on the tooth that was hurting the girl, hoping it would at least dull the pain for her. It was a tooth on the lower left side of her mouth. After that, the young girl and the Truck driver left. For Patty, it was just like plenty of other people she saw passing through the truck stop. That was until 10 days later on February 14th. That day, an Arizona state trooper was searching an area along Interstate 40 not far from the truck stop because a tire had rolled off of a truck and gone off the road. While he was looking for the tire, he discovered something else altogether. The body of a young girl about 25ft off the westbound side of the highway, face down underneath a cedar tree. Wildlife had begun to tear and eat at the body, so it was no doubt a disturbing sight.
- [32:18]
Mike Ferguson
Investigators combed the scene near where the girl's body was found, looking for clues. The belt loops of the girl's jeans were torn and led investigators to believe that her killer had used them to drag her to the spot where he left her. Her bra and a red and white sweater were found near the body. It's unclear if they had been removed or if they had come off while she was being dragged. One odd thing was that the dead girl had a wadded up chunk of aspirin wedged between her teeth. There was no identification with the girl's body and no one knew who she was. She didn't match any missing persons reports from the area. Because she was found on Valentine's Day, she was given the name Valentine Sally. Police circulated sketches and a description of the girl they had dubbed Valentine Sally. And upon hearing the news, Patty Wilkins immediately felt the girl they had found was the same one she had interacted with, and she went to police who confirmed her suspicion.
- [33:11]
Mike Morford
Police asked Patty to recount every detail that she could for them. She recalled that the man at the truck stop had been wearing a brown leather vest and a cowboy hat with a peacock feather in it. He was white and about 5ft 10 inches tall with a medium build. Patty told them that the pair seemed to be comfortable with each other and that there was no reason at the time for her to suspect that there was any cause for concern. Investigators believed the girl had been hitchhiking and that the man Patty saw her with had picked her up. Somewhere along the way.
- [33:46]
Mike Ferguson
Another person, a young man, came forward and claimed he had given Valentine Sally a ride on February 2nd. He picked her up nearly two hours south of Ashwark, and she mentioned to him during the ride that she had started her trip from Phoenix, which is another hour south of where he picked her up. He recalled that the girl had told him she had been working as a dishwasher and live with some of her friends, was heading to New Jersey. Her plan Was to make it to Flagstaff, where she would ask someone at the little America truck stop For a ride to the east coast.
- [34:17]
Mike Morford
Ash fork is just about 50 miles west of Flagstaff. The area where her body was found was halfway between Ash Fork and Flagstaff. She had nearly made it there, but something went really wrong and she never made it to her destination. Investigators believe it happened quite soon after she had been at the truck stop where she interacted with Patty. Since the wadded up aspirin had not fully dissolved yet, it was believed she died very soon after Patty saw her on February 4. The medical examiner also noted that the tooth that had been hurting the girl had been prepared for a root canal up to a week before she was killed. Authorities were unable to determine what had actually killed the girl Due to the level of decomposition and the animal activity. Assuming the day of her death was correct, it had been nearly two weeks before her body was discovered. Their best guess, based on the absence of certain wounds, Was that she was strangled or suffocated.
- [35:22]
Mike Ferguson
So police had no idea who the victim was or the killer. They felt that if they could play out what happened that it might lead
- [35:29]
Amazon Music Advertiser
to more answers for everyone who solves crime from their couch, knows more about forensics than their own job, and has trust issues with small town sheriffs. Amazon music's millions of podcast episodes are calling. Just download the Amazon music app and start listening to your favorite true crime podcasts Ad free included with Prime.
- [35:50]
Mike Ferguson
There were a few scenarios that could explain the girl's murder. The first was that the man seen with her was trying to gain the girl's trust, which is why he was being so nice When Patty spotted them together and seemed concerned for her toothache and wasn't acting creepy. He could have made a sexual advance and when he was rejected, it made him angry. The second scenario is that tension just started running high. The man could have been very tired from driving on the road, and the girl was probably not feeling well due to the pain she was in. Maybe this is one of those heat of the moment cases where someone just snapped and it had deadly consequences. But dragging her 25ft off the highway and leaving her face down partially clothed doesn't really seem like it was a heat of the moment crime. It seems like she may have been attacked and that there might have been a sexual component. It's interesting that she was found off the westbound side of the highway, but she was trying to head east. This could point toward a situation where maybe the man started going the wrong way and she knew he had bad intentions and started trying to get away from him.
- [36:53]
Mike Morford
Police wondered if Valentine Sally's killer could be a serial killer. He had killed her and gotten away with it. He could easily have more undiscovered victims. It was a very frightening scenario. There is a convicted criminal and suspected serial killer who was known to wear a large cowboy hat that was decorated with some kind of ornate feather. His name is Royal Russell Long. He was known to be active in Wyoming, Oklahoma, South Dakota and New Mexico. There's a gap in his known activity that Valentine Salley's murder would fit right into. However, the crime he was convicted of involved kidnapping two young girls and holding them at his home. Most of the other crimes he's suspected of being responsible for also involve two girls being abducted in the same incident. He also had a very thick beard and mustache and wore pretty large glasses. Royal Russell Long has a very distinct look. It seems likely that if Patty was shown a photo of him, she would have recognized him. The sketch we do have of the suspect appears to depict a man who's older than Royal Russell Long with no facial hair or glasses.
- [38:17]
Mike Ferguson
Two years after her death, investigators believe that Valentine Sally had been identified. Her physical appearance and her dental records appeared to match those of 14 year old melody Cutlip, who had been reported missing from estichada, Florida in 1980. Melody's mother, who reported her daughter missing, led refused to claim the body of Valentine Sally because she didn't think it was really Melody. But investigators, with no evidence, and despite Melody's own mom declining to say Valentine Sally was Melody, pressed on. And Melody's name was added to a gravestone marking Valentine Sally's grave. And Patty Wilkins had even paid for her burial and headstone which simply read Valentine. But investigators got a real curveball when in 1986, Melody Cutlet returned home alive and well. She was 20 years old by that time. Her mother had been right. Valentine Sally was not Melody. Someone else out there was still missing their daughter, wondering where she could be and when she'd be home. Investigators were back to square one and the case didn't move for years.
- [39:22]
Mike Morford
And to me, more if this was a very strange, you know, scenario, you have a Jane Doe. Obviously authorities want to identify this person and they believe she could be this Melody Cutlet. But even though Melody's mother is adamant that Valentine Sally is not Melody, they go ahead and basically name her. Even going to the point of adding her name to the. The headstone.
- [39:54]
Mike Ferguson
Yeah. And I, I wonder if that came down to a case of the police Just thinking that Melody's mom was in denial and you know, she didn't want to come to the realization that her daughter was dead. But, you know, she seemed to know her own daughter and said that's not her. And she turned out to be right. So that's something we don't see a lot, this kind of thing where the person comes back. And as we mentioned, that really threw a curveball into things.
- [40:23]
Mike Morford
Answers as to the true identity of Valentine Sally finally came just after Valentine's Day in 2021. Investigators used forensic genetic genealogy to track down any potential relatives of the yet unidentified Valentine Sally. They were able to find her first cousin who was living in the St. Louis area of Missouri. And and that quickly led to some progress. Forty years after she died, investigators were able to confirm that Valentine Sally was actually 17 year old Carolyn Celeste Eaton. She ran away from her Bellefontaine neighbors Missouri home around Christmas time in 1981 after an argument with her family. She was one of six daughters born to Donald and Hila Eaton. Somehow, at some point she made it to Ash fork, Arizona, about 1400 miles west. Tom Taylor, a missing persons detective from St. Louis county, told the St. Louis Dispatch, it's an absolute reminder that hope springs eternal for police investigators and someone with a missing family member.
- [41:37]
Mike Ferguson
Pass.
- [41:37]
Mike Morford
Patty Wilkins, who never forgot her brief interaction with Carolyn, was very emotional when Carolyn was identified, telling WSOC tv, it's like one of my girls. She may not have been Carolyn's family, but she has spent years caring deeply about the girl she feels she let walk out the door and to her death. She also said, I could have done a million different things that I didn't do. I could have pulled her off that truck. I could have forced her to stay with me. I could have called 91 1. Patty had regularly called the police when it looked like a runaway teen was passing through. But Carolyn wasn't alone. And Patty had no way to know she had run away from home or that she had just met the man she was with.
- [42:28]
Mike Ferguson
You really have to feel bad for Patty. It's clear that she's felt some guilt for what happened to Carolyn despite her not being at fault at all. And she's thought of Carolyn for all these years. But Patty did try. She asked Carolyn directly if she was okay. She offered her a place to stay if she didn't feel safe with the man. I don't think there's much more she could have done. Maybe writing down the man's license plate number and details about his vehicle. But Even doing that still likely wouldn't have saved Carolyn, since she was killed so soon after Patty saw her. News of Carolyn being identified was welcomed by Patty, who had always felt a connection to her. Years after she was killed, she told WSOC tv, it's only been me and her, but now she's got a family. Isn't that great? It doesn't get any better. I love you, and I'm glad you're going home.
- [43:16]
Mike Morford
And we talked in the earlier case morph about guilt. Right. And I do believe there's guilt or the feeling of guilt. Whether or not that person should feel it, that's a different question. But here you have a woman in Patty who had what obviously was a pretty brief interaction with this girl who later wound up dead. But it stuck with her. It was part of her life for so many years, if not for her entire life. It just goes to show you what these types of events can do to people, what effect they can have on people.
- [44:03]
Mike Ferguson
Yeah. And Patty, you know, she tried to sort of offer help if the girl needed it. She turned her down. She also didn't see anything troubling, any clear sign that, you know, Carolyn was in trouble when she was in the truck stop. So, you know, what else could she have done, you know, short of grabbing her and saying, you're not going with this guy, and why would she do that? It. That just wouldn't happen because there was nothing there to that stood out to her. So, you know, we talk about guilt and feeling it all those years, and it's clear Patty did. But I think most people would agree she has no reason to feel guilty.
- [44:45]
Mike Morford
And if Patty was feeling guilty about not doing more to help the girl she only saw one morning at work for a short time, I would imagine that Carolyn's family had been living with a lot of guilt over the situation, too. As far as anyone knew, Carolyn was so upset that she left her home and never came back. She never reached out. They must have wondered at least once whether something bad had happened to her and whether they could have done or said anything differently that last time they saw her. Maybe they thought she was out there the whole time, just unwilling to see them. One thing, though, is for sure, her mom died without ever finding out what happened to Carolyn.
- [45:29]
Mike Ferguson
So now one part of this mystery is solved, and Carolyn has her name back. But one name the police are still seeking is the man she was last seen with, her presumed killer. If you have any information about the murder of Carolyn Eaton, you can contact the Coconino County Sheriff's office at 800,338, 7888. Maybe you know something about who the man she was last seen with could have been a truck driver who wore a felt cowboy hat decorated with peacock feathers, was fond of wearing vests, and would have traveled through northern Arizona in the early 1980s.
- [46:03]
Mike Morford
And I do think more if there are some, you know, kind of unique identifiers there. But again, 1980s, what are we talking about? 40 years? 40 plus years. It's possible that someone could have some information. But I do want to talk a little bit about, you know, truck drivers. We have covered truck driving serial killers. There have been quite a few of them, let's face it, driving kind of a long haul trucking route in and of itself kind of lends to the ability, if one were so inclined, number one in the 80s, to be able to pick up someone pretty easily. Right. A lot of people were hitchhiking. We know that. And then I think secondly, you're moving around so much that back during that time frame at least it would have been a lot tougher to track someone's movements. I think some of that has changed today with GPS and the tracking that a lot of these trucks have. But in the 1980s, I don't, I don't know how some of this stuff was tracked, if it was at all.
- [47:26]
Mike Ferguson
It was definitely a dangerous time, hitchhiking. And then you have truck drivers that, you know, trucks all over the place. And you know, if somebody wanted to be a predator and pick up a young girl that was hitchhiking, it would be easy to take them to a whole nother location. They could disappear anywhere along the way. And you know, I think back then there probably were some, some missing young girls that were victims of truck driving killers. I think overwhelmingly most truck drivers that I've dealt with, that I've heard stories about, that I've talked to, I think most truck drivers are the opposite. They, they see a young girl on the road, they want to help them, they want to give them a ride to keep them safe. They, maybe they think of their daughter, their wife, their sister. So I think overwhelmingly most truck drivers are going to help a young girl in need, not harm them. But we know that some, some predators were mixed into, into that bunch of truck drivers.
- [48:29]
Mike Morford
Yeah, no doubt you're right. I mean, you could look at any profession and say, well, by and large, most people in that profession are, you know, they're good people, they want to do the right thing. But in every profession, there are some people who decide, you know, they want to. They want to break the law or they want to be killers. It. You know, there's really no profession that's immune from that. And we've covered a lot of them, from truck drivers to doctors. But, you know, there. There are some similarities in these two cases. You know, we talked about guilt. I think that's kind of universal between cases where someone involved is going to feel guilt, even if they really have nothing to feel guilty about. And I think Patty fits that. That mold for sure. The second thing that really jumped out at me is, you know, in the differences between the two cases, obviously one is solved and one is unsolved. And you can really kind of see the impact in that difference. Right. One family gets answers and another one doesn't.
- [49:53]
Mike Ferguson
Yeah. And I think it's sort of bittersweet because in. Especially in Carolyn's case, she's eventually identified, so at the very least, her remaining family has that. But they still don't know who killed her. And they may never find out. And that's. That's got to be very tough to know that they may never know who did this.
- [50:17]
Mike Morford
And then you have the common connection of Valentine's Day. Right. So you have, for two sets of friends, families, horrific cases that will forever be connected with that day. There's just no way around it. That day was changed for so many people connected with these two victims. But that's it for our episode on the Valentine's Day mysteries. As always, if you love the show but you haven't done so yet, take a minute, go out, leave us a review. You can give us a rating, but also keep telling your friends. Word of mouth about the podcast really goes a long way.
- [51:02]
Mike Ferguson
If you want to find us on social media, run every major platform to search for criminology podcast on your favorites. You can also go to our website, criminology podcast.com to check out news about the show and old episodes. And if you want to join a discussion group about the podcast and the cases we discuss, head over to Facebook and search for criminology podcast discussion and fans.
- [51:25]
Mike Morford
So that's it for another episode of Criminology, But Morph and I will be back with all of you next Saturday night with a brand new episode. So until then, for Mike and Morph, we'll talk to you next week.
- [51:36]
Mike Ferguson
Take care, everyone.
- [52:08]
Libsyn Ads Representative
Marketing is hard, but I'll tell you a little secret. It doesn't have to be. Let me point something out. You're listening to a podcast right now, and it's great you love the host, you seek it out and download it. You listen to it while driving, working out, cooking, even going to the bathroom. Podcasts are a pretty close companion. And this is a podcast ad. Did I get your attention? You can reach great listeners like yourself with podcast advertising from Libsyn Ads. Choose from hundreds of top podcasts offering host endorsements, or run a pre produced ad like this one across thousands of shows. To reach your target audience in their favorite podcasts with Libsyn Ads, go to libsynads. Com. That's L, I B S Y N Ads. Com. Today.