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Critical Role & Sagas of Sundry
How to Be a Better TTRPG Player w/ Ross Bryant | Quests N’ Answers
01:07:18
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- [00:01]
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- [01:04]
Dan Casey
Greetings adventurers and welcome back to Quest and Answers, the show where we talk to all manner of awesome people from around the gaming world. I'm Dan Casey and today joining me in our conversation dungeon, we have a very special guest. You've seen him gracing this stage as part of the improvised Shakespeare Company, destroying prompts with wanton abandoned on dropout shows like make some Noise in written and riffin form is one of the writers on Mystery Science Theater 3000 and even right here on Geeky Sundry as a very special guest on Sagas of Sundry Goblin Mode, just to name a few. Folks, it's Ross Bryant. Ross, how you doing?
- [01:37]
Ross Bryant
I'm doing great. Thanks for having me, Dan.
- [01:39]
Dan Casey
Of course, My absolute pleasure. Yeah, I was very excited to chat with you further. You're someone that I have seen performing out in the world before and had the chance to perform with when you joined us for Goblin Mode and I was like, okay, I want to pick his brain about all sorts of things and that's why that's, that's what we're going to do here today.
- [01:59]
Ross Bryant
I love it. It was great meeting you and I had so much fun doing that. Those couple sessions of Goblin mode. What a wonderful weird world to drop into.
- [02:06]
Dan Casey
Yes. And you joined us on Spoiler alert folks. Two of the strangest episodes in the series. Two of my favorites. But I urge you, go back, watch up to I believe it's episode 12 and 13 or 11 and 12 folks. Go watch them. You'll thank us later. But I want to talk to you a little bit first about TTRPGs, that sort of tabletop role playing games for people that Hate acronyms. I want to talk to you about your experience with them because obviously I know you. I know that you're someone who plays quite a bit of them, but how did you first get into this world.
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Mint Mobile Announcer
Of pen and paper RPGs?
- [02:43]
Ross Bryant
I'm a person who. Had I discovered these games at a young age, the. The age that possibly it is intended that they are flayed, I, I would have. I would have fallen head over heels in love with them, but I just never was. I. I'm a. I'm an adult adopter of these, of these games. I remember distinctly going to a comic book shop in Norfolk, Virginia, on a visit to my grandparents and, like, picking through the books and finding what, in retrospect were ttrpg, like modules for, like, forgotten Realms or something, and, like, thumbing through them and really being fascinated by the illustrations but having absolutely no idea what all these numbers meant, what these graphs and tables related to. And I was just totally befuddled as to what the hell this thing even was. But that sort of, like, was a splinter in my mind of, like, what was that thing? And only much, much later did a friend of mine that I did improv with in Chicago after I moved to LA invite me to this gaming group to play gurps. It was a real leap into the pandemic immediately.
- [03:57]
Dan Casey
Holy cow.
- [03:59]
Ross Bryant
So the generic unified role playing system, a famously crunchy system of role playing.
- [04:05]
Dan Casey
Thank you, Steve Jackson.
- [04:06]
Ross Bryant
Yeah, so that was my, that was my, my Road to Damascus moment as I was struck by. By the blinding light of the, of the potential of TTRPGs. And that gaming group goes on to this day. I played, I played games with them a week ago. And that crew, when the pandemic hit, was the sort of brain trust that formed this little streaming channel that, that, that was launched in, in like 2001 called the Stream of Blood. And the sort of, like, nucleus of it was the Dungeon Master or the Game Master, Jared Logan and Clinton Trucks. And they're sort of like constellation of fellow performers and dorks of which I was one. And so we started this tiny little streaming channel and it became this incredible creative outlet at a time where as a, as a theatrical improviser, I felt extremely constrained and, like, bummed out at the idea that maybe, maybe improvis in art form is about to just vanish. Are we ever going to get to do this in a theater again? And it was this wonderful, beautiful outlet of, like, recreating that sense of like, imaginative communion with your friends. And. And then Stream of Blood was Sort of absorbed into the. Into the Glass Cannon network, another. Another actual play concern. And. And I've just continued to. To dive into that world. And I. And I also do some stuff with this other network called Ain't Slate Nobody, and. And I continue to play in home games all the time. I love it. It's. It has become just such a rich component of my life, and I love them so much.
- [05:50]
Dan Casey
I'm going to have to follow up on like, 16 different points you just made, but I want to start back with one that you talking about. Going into, like, a comic book shop as a kid and being drawn in by the fantasy artwork. I feel like that is a dying art form almost, because I would cherish. I'd go every Wednesday to Webhead Enterprises in Wakefield, Massachusetts with my dad to get new comics. And the first thing I was drawn to was this row of all these tiny pictures of incredible fantasy creatures, which I realized a couple years later were magic The Gathering cards. It was the same thing, like a scholastic book fair. Always drawn to the things that should be airbrushed on the side of a van somewhere, but instead were just on a dragonlance book or something. And I feel like that even, even not being incomprehensible. I remember begging my dad and he bought me. I think it was the, like, AD&D box set. It was like one of those, like, D and D home box sets which just had this incredible red dragon on the COVID I did not get to play with anyone. I was playing by myself, just like, exploring all of these endless tomes, you know, the life of an only child who leads a rich inner life.
- [06:56]
Ross Bryant
I. I relate. I, too, was in that mode, although I didn't have the. The guts to purchase. I didn't have the coin to purchase one of those, nor was I. I. I don't think my. My parents were present. Maybe if I'd really put the screws to them, they would have. They would have gotten me that. But. But. Holy smoke. Yeah, there's a lot of, like, only child energy in tabletop role playing. Yes. Yeah. Rich, rich. Inner. Inner worlds are a part of this thing.
- [07:24]
Dan Casey
And share and then they become worlds that, yes, do become worlds that you get to share with other people. Yeah. Now, something you mentioned is, you know, obviously having that enduring quality with your gaming group. I feel like that is half the battle with getting people into TTRPGs is, you know, it does. I don't want to call it like a commitment, but you are making a commitment to your friends to show up together to play Something the same way you'd make a commitment if you made plans to go to a bar, go to a restaurant, whatever. It's just a different type of appointment that you're all making with each other. But one thing that really resonated with me is you sort of mentioned you were worried about improv potentially, instead of yes and no. Budding, going away. Yeah. During a very dark period. And having this outlet, I think is essential because for me, like, I was playing in a game of Curse of Strahd at the time with some friends, and we were playing entirely virtually, and that is just. That's been my most enduring gaming group to this day. We started playing during lockdown, and we still play every week pretty much. And it's just a nice outlet because you're not just showing up together, you're showing up together to do something communal. Communal storytelling in particular, especially improvisational storytelling. It feels like, you know, in our emails back and forth before the show, you said a couple things that really resonated with me, talking about this as a unique art form. And to me, it feels like the campfire tradition with the benefit of random chance, just they've gamified, you know, the telling of tales to entertain each other. But I'm curious. You were talking about the ritual properties of gaming.
- [09:01]
Ross Bryant
I think I sent that to you.
- [09:03]
Dan Casey
Yeah. And to me it's, you know, like. It's like you mentioned you have this gaming group. Your ritual is to play, to get like, get together on a weekly, bi weekly, whatever basis. That is the ritual, and the part of the ritual involves games. But what about specifically about gaming or TTRPGs have these ritual qualities to you, and what were you thinking? What were you thinking when you typed those words?
- [09:24]
Ross Bryant
I don't know. I. You and I may be around the same age and kind of like we're aware of these games culturally in the comic book shop, but also in the way in which culture at that time was evoking them in the language of the Satanic panic of that era.
- [09:47]
Dan Casey
Yeah.
- [09:48]
Ross Bryant
So these games have always, for me, been infused with this sort of charged with this sort of occult energy. As you. As you get to learn about them, you realize that, like, that's absolutely absurd, of course, and. But. But nevertheless, it had that for me as a. As a kid and. And as an improviser also, and somebody who is into just experimental theater and like weird performance art and stuff as a. As a. As a teenager and early 20s, something that's something that just keeps coming up again and again. How spontaneous Creativity, theatrical modes of expression, communal imaginative experiences all have these ritual components. A lot of the ferment of theatrical culture in the mid century threw up a lot of these things like super experimental site specific theater, like, like the 60s happenings, if people know what those are, these sort of like theatrical experiences where the barrier between audience and performer fades away and it takes on this thing, this aspect of a communal ecstatic ritual. If you've ever watched the movie My Dinner with Andre, Andre Gregory talks about this sort of thing a lot in that. But that same sort of mid century theatrical artistic ferment is the same thing that, that threw up improvisational theater in the 50s and 60s. You've got groups like the Compass Players in the early Second City creating spontaneous theater as an art form as it sort of exists in a continuum to this day. And things like Second City As It Goes on and Upright Citizens Brigade and that sort of. And the dropout shows that you mentioned are all part of that sort of like continuum. And, and all of these things, like, of course they're silly, absurd, fun, but they do. There is something I like thinking about in a sort of highfalutin way, the way that they are these sites where we set aside a quote unquote ritual space. We sort of draw the sigil, the circle within which different rules apply. And within that circle we surrender to this experience of collective imagining, which is just like you said, something as old as humanity itself sitting around a fire and spinning tails. And also with this ritual component of the dice, the element of random chance, the introduction of fortune, randomness, luck, which in itself is a ritual thing. When you think of something like any, like throwing, casting bones or scrying or the I Ching, things like this. And so it has all these components of, of ritual and shared imaginative communion. And that stuff is the stuff that just really speaks to my soul. I love that and I love that you can draw this line between all of these things that goes right up into actual religious ecstatic experiences. I read this CS Lewis quote recently where he's talking about how losing yourself in a work of art, in a work of literature has this quality of, of. Of this sort of a static ecstatic imagining, which he describes as in a higher state is religious experience and in a lower state is game. And I, and I kind of think that like I. I disagree with C.S. lewis about many things, but I think that you can. There's a flattening of all of these things where game is ritual is religiosity and, and I think. And something that Just keeps striking me is, I think, the Satanic panic, to get back to it, the reason that it created. That role playing games created this anxiety in the American fundamentalist imagination was not just that it was using folkloric elements that looked like devils and demons. Not just that it has these sort of ritual properties that make it look a little occult and scary. That, that, that, that the, that the fundamentalist imaginary needs to create moral panics to perpetuate itself. But also that there's a discomfort with how much a game rhymes with religion and there's a discomfort in seeing how similar these things are. That there's. That there's not too much of a bridge between someone getting hit with the spirit and someone, like creating an avatar of themselves in a character and building an imaginative world that is as real in their memory as the. Their trip to the supermarket last week. I think that's all very cool and that we get to have those kinds of experiences around a table with our friends. Eating Doritos is pretty, pretty cool.
- [14:53]
Dan Casey
You can tell that A, C.S. lewis never rolled a crit, and B, he never tried nacho cheese or Doritos.
- [15:00]
Ross Bryant
Yeah, yeah. Yes, yes, he is. He's not willing to indulge in secular imaginings and he doesn't know the pleasures of Cool Ranch.
- [15:10]
Dan Casey
Yeah, otherwise he'd be cheese stain Louis. We all, we can all agree.
- [15:13]
Ross Bryant
Yeah, otherwise the white queen would be offering the kids Cheetos paws instead of Turkish Delight.
- [15:22]
Dan Casey
Oh, my. So just a crazy side note, because I want to get back to the more important points you just made, but do you know what they call Cool Ranch Doritos outside of the U.S. no, I don't. Cool American. I learned this in Iceland. And I was like, all right, that's. Maybe they're going to change the flavor name now, but in the meantime, we'll take it. That's. That's what we're known for. Good, zesty, A zesty, chilled out ranch flavor.
- [15:49]
Ross Bryant
But the cultural legacy of America is secure.
- [15:53]
Dan Casey
Yeah, I do want to go back to what you were saying, though, because I love how you sort of broke that down, because to me, it's sort of just sort of the ritual components you are. You know, you talked about sort of like writing the sigils, making this. You're summoning this mutual, mutually agreed upon liminal space, like a narrative backrooms that you can spend as much time in or as little time and as you want, but you're all buying into and creating this collective reality and evolving it together in real time. That's what I love. It's like, you know, I love playing video games, but that is an experience that's been curated. I'm taking an active role in that. I'm pushing forward. I have to be the one to move the adventure forward. But it's still ultimately on the predetermined rails that have been laid out by the storytellers and the developers. You know, same thing with watching movies. That is a predetermined vision that has been established and curated by filmmakers with a specific vision. And yes, you can argue that when it comes to tabletop role playing games or tabletop games in general that have like a narrative element, a lot of that is given structure in many forms by the dungeon master, game master, storyteller, narrator, whatever system you're using. But it's one of the only art forms that I've experienced where everyone, it feels like, has an equal part in shaping and reshaping the end result. And you know, that that ecstatic high that you're talking about, like the joy of creating something that the joy of creating something so deeply narratively satisfying or you know, like, you know, I joke about like rolling a crit, but something like that, that has such incredible implications for this project that you've all embarked upon together. There's nothing like it that's such a.
- [17:38]
Ross Bryant
High, it's such a, it's such an ecstatic experience when you, when you, when your group of friends with Cheeto stained fingers are fist pumping and cheering at the table because, because someone rolled a 20 at a, @ a pivotal moment. And from the outside, the person outside that magic circle can easily see that as utterly ridiculous. Like, what the hell is this? Yeah.
- [18:02]
Dan Casey
But from in, from the outside, impenetrable.
- [18:04]
Ross Bryant
Yeah. Yeah. Much like that is, that's the definition of a cult. It is esoteric. It is, it is something that is not known by the laity outside, but inside we know, we, we members of the secret society understand that that is, that that is an ecstatic experience that, that I have, I have laughed harder than I've laughed like any time in these games. I have, I have had moments of like, thrill and suspense more than any film I have wept in these games. And it's, and it's, and it occurs in a way that is so different from other art forms. And I truly think that these games are. It's a, it's an art form.
- [18:46]
Dan Casey
Yes. And it doesn't. And not even if you're, I think a lot of people, you know, people have been talking about like, you know, with the rise of things like Critical Role Dimension 20, etc. Actual play, I feel like people view it as an art form in that respect, and it absolutely is. But I don't think it even, it's not even if it's intended for mass consumption. Just the simple act of sitting down to do this together is a type of performance, is a type of art, is a type of storytelling that you're doing together. Even if you think you're just sitting down to play a game and.
- [19:17]
Ross Bryant
Yeah. Yeah. And it's, there's something about the intimacy of it too. As someone who does a lot of actual plays, like, and I love it and, but viewing actual plays, there, there's, there's that remove it is. It is bit consuming. It's, it's.
- [19:30]
Dan Casey
Yes.
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Ross Bryant
I like when I describe what I do to friends who have no idea what the hell any of this is. It's like we're. It's improvised radio plays. That's how I kind of describe it. But like it's altogether different when you're with your friends around your table doing your thing. That, that's, that's the kernel of it. And much like. And it's part of the reason why I love improvised theater as well. I'm just doing improv that like, like God bless Dropout for making improvisation into something that is, that is capturable on, on camera and clearly translates to a broad audience. I'm so grateful that that exists. But nothing is the same as the experience of you and your ensemble in a room with a live audience experiencing it together in real time. Much like there's nothing like the hit of you and your friends around the table with the gummy bears doing it in real time. That, that is the essence of that artistic experience. And I must, I have to say that all this time my tongue is in my cheek the whole time. Because of course any given improv show, in any given role playing game has a character named Johnny Broccoli who is a. Yeah. And these are total, total like ding dong parades. But every now and then, every now and then you touch, you touch that ecstasy.
- [20:53]
Dan Casey
Yeah. But you can to your point as well, like where you'll be playing a game that also it makes you laugh. But a character named Johnny Broccoli can also rip your heart out. It's just the journey you take together.
- [21:05]
Ross Bryant
Totally.
- [21:05]
Dan Casey
And you know, I think almost going back to your point about sort of the like satanic panic, I feel like that when people are thinking about stuff like TTRPGs and perhaps a reluctance to Adopt them or why they were othered in that way is I think ultimately sitting down to play a game like D and D. It is performing the act of play something that feels frivolous, something that feels counterintuitive to like. Like that good old fashioned like puritan pilgrim work ethic where you just have to like, you know, just rise and grind. Hustle culture. If you're not doing something that's furthering your, your end goals, then it's not worth doing.
- [21:45]
Ross Bryant
But the instrumentalization of everything we do is a curse of our modern life to me. And I think it's, it's one of the amazing poetic things about these games is that you don't win them. Like, like you win when interesting things happen. You win when a beautiful story is told. Yes, you might win when you lose. Some of the most powerful moments in these games are when my characters die.
- [22:13]
Dan Casey
Yes, Absolute one. One of my favorite, Some of my most resonant like experiences have been playing games where every character's intended to die. Things like Ten Candles, for example, where it's like, hey, you're doomed. What are you going to do with the time that you have? And to me it's just such a fascinating question to explore where you're not trying to just get the high score, get a plus 12 broadsword, which look, there's a time and all fun, but it's nice when you can sort of break through and sort of get yourself out of the like power gamer brain and tap into okay, what's, what's really important here and that's connecting with the people I'm sitting with at a table because I'm taking the time to do this amid all of the hustle and bustle. Like, yeah, you know, I don't know where, I don't know where play sits on Maslow's hierarchy of needs, but it should be in there. It should be something that you do for yourself. Because even if it's not playing a ttrpg, doing something positive and enriching for yourself that you know, is not just in service of the things you need to do to survive, I do feel like is important to girding your quality of life.
- [23:19]
Ross Bryant
I feel like play is just so rich for its own sake. I mean, as somebody who has kind of like accidentally devoted his life to play, I feel like I'm, I, I feel it incumbent upon me to be its champion and advocate. And, and yeah, I think it's, there's this Ursula K. Le Guin quote that floats around the Internet and I, I found it a few weeks ago and it really, and it really resonated with me for all the kind of things that we're talking about here, but especially that, like people from outside seeing it as frivolous. And, and it comes from a question that I too have sometimes, like, is this escapist? Is this kind of denying? Is this a sort of infantile refusal to look at real life, to like to go into these imaginative worlds? Because I don't feel that that's true. I feel that that's some cursed, cursed, cynical part of me talking. And this Ursula K. Le Guin quote articulated it for me better than I could have. This is, this is Le Guin.
- [24:16]
Dan Casey
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Dan Casey
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- [26:24]
Ross Bryant
Okay. Fantasy is escapist and that is its glory. If a soldier is imprisoned by the enemy, don't we consider it his duty to escape? The moneylenders, the know nothings, the authoritarians have us all in prison. If we value the freedom of the mind and the soul, if we're partisans of liberty, then it is our plain duty to escape and take as many people with us as we can. Like.
- [26:50]
Dan Casey
Incredible.
- [26:50]
Ross Bryant
I love that. That that is the escapism that we, that we, that we seek. Now obviously in these games there is part of it that is like setting aside time out of life, out of. Out of the currents of real life and, and communing with, with friends and fellowship. But to call that escapist is to debase friends and fellowship and play, which are very, very important. And I read up on this quote a little bit more. She herself, in this quote is paraphrasing a much longer quote of J.R.R. tolkien, who is even more kind of like revolutionary in how he describes it. He describes people who criticize fantasy as escapist, that they are confusing the escape of the prisoner with the flight of the deserter. That there, there's. That the deserter is, is escaping from, from reality. The deserter is in a way escaping by acquiescing to the, to the cursed reality nature of their reality, perhaps. Whereas the escapist is, is the person trying to free themselves from prison. And, and I feel like, I don't know, not to get political, but now nowadays there's a lot of cursed energy out there that, that I think having a rich and playful imagination is not merely escapist. It allows us to, to push into mental areas where we can imagine a future that these people do not want us to even contemplate.
- [28:23]
Dan Casey
1,000%. It's. There's so much ambient psychic damage that you take from simply opening up any, any application on your phone, any news site, reading any headline. There's just a level of absurd doomerism that's permeating the culture in a way that I think now more than ever makes it essential to carve out time for escapism because you're not trying to bury your head in the sand. Obviously. Like, there's extremes and that's not good either, but sort of taking a break from just the never ending onslaught of the abattoir of horrors that we exist in as we continue terraforming our way to the fury road. I think that there's, I think there's a lot of utility and I say that I realize utility is probably not the best word, but there's a lot of it serves you in every capacity, both enriching the spirit and like preventing you from preventing your actual health from getting too low.
- [29:24]
Ross Bryant
Yes, yes. Play is just good for a one, just good for you. Like I, I, I, I already earlier was like, not everything has to be instrumentalized. There are instrumental reasons to do this. There's, there's good benefits to be had. But I, I never want to lose sight of that. These things are, are pleasant for their own sake. We do these things because we love them now, not just because, like it's going to create new linkages in my neurons or whatever and make me a more effective manager or something.
- [29:50]
Dan Casey
I, I like you could make a lot of money selling a course called like D and D for MBAs.
- [29:56]
Ross Bryant
Don't think I haven't thought that and been tempted. Like, I think you, you definitely could. It would probably benefit many people as, as coming from a person who has taught, taught many corporate improv workshops. I have, I have, I have, I have crossed that, that boundary certainly. And I think, and hopefully God bless if I can, if I can convince one person getting an MBA that like the power of listening might be more important than the power of talking, then great. I too wake up each morning and open my social media apps and instantly take 15 points of sanity loss.
- [30:33]
Dan Casey
Yeah, just unrecoverable.
- [30:36]
Ross Bryant
Just.
- [30:36]
Dan Casey
I've lost so many stat points at this point. I'm just like a tall baby walking around.
- [30:42]
Ross Bryant
Yeah.
- [30:42]
Dan Casey
One thing I do want to talk about that you mentioned sort of things that you love and sort of uniting this act of communal storytelling with a live audience and your love of improv and your love of creating with, you know, your troupe, you know, you are not just a fantastic performer and storyteller, but now I would argue that you're a bit of a game designer as well. Through a show that you have developed a live comedy show called Chill Touch. So for people who don't know, can you Tell us a little bit about what Chill Touch is and how it employs TTRPG mechanics.
- [31:14]
Ross Bryant
Yeah, it wears the TTRPG mechanics very lightly, I will say. But it's an improv show. We're doing improvised scenes based on audience suggestions. Just like 99.9% of improv shows, we just steal some dice mechanics from our favorite games. The premise of our show is that. That we build a table of suggestions, like a whole grid of them, and then we use. We use the. The, you know, the scrying bones of. Of fortune to. To pick our suggestions for us. We roll on our table and we create unique combinations that the dice allows to inspire us to do our scenes. And because, of course, we're playing in front of an audience that is well steeped in the worlds of these games and the fantasy and sci fi that we all love, we err a little bit more on the side of digging into those tropes than we probably feel comfortable doing in our other improv shows. So not only are we trying to pay homage to the sort of genre worlds that we. That we love playing in in the games, but we kind of steal the dice to get us into some fun and interesting, inspirational places for our show. But it is, by and large, just a fun improv show with people like all the people that we play with, the other members of the ensemble being like Sarah Kaplan, Mary Lou Zacharino. We all play D and D together every other week. So our show asks the question, you've seen plenty of improvisers do actual play shows. What if nerds did improv? It's an idea whose time just may have come.
- [32:59]
Dan Casey
See, I love that concept. And I'm also curious because we're seeing. I feel like right now it's a very interesting time because we're seeing D and D TTRPG mechanics leaking through onto the stage in various ways? I mean, there's the Off Broadway show, the twenty Sided Tavern. There's stuff like this. So for you, did you. Are you approaching this just from a perspective of, hey, we're going to do what we're going to do, and we're going to hope that the audience has an awareness of what TTRPGs are, or did you have to think about, okay, how do I adapt these ideas in a way that's maybe comprehensible to someone that maybe likes fantasy and sci fi, but has never seen a polyhedron like a D20 in their life?
- [33:41]
Ross Bryant
Luckily, it doesn't. Luckily, it doesn't take that much explaining. But yeah, the origin of this show was that we wanted to do a comedy show at Gen Con, the big TTRPG convention that happens annually. And all of us have done actual play shows. I truly think that that's just such an amazing and unique mode of improvisation. I love it for that. And I was like, well, great. What if we just kind of strip away the mechanic? What if we just did an improv show of the style that we've all trained in for ages and. And we all perform week to week at. At various theaters around LA and. But just kind of lightly sprinkle on some. Some. Some game stuff because we're. It's very funny. We're now dealing with. In improvisation now because these actual play shows, like, like critical role, like D20, et cetera, are so popular. A lot of people are getting into improv now because of actual.
- [34:45]
Dan Casey
Wow.
- [34:46]
Ross Bryant
Like, that is now one of the biggest on ramps into comedy improv, which is kind of my.
- [34:53]
Dan Casey
This should be the real satanic panic.
- [34:55]
Ross Bryant
Yeah. So I feel like, honestly, audiences are maybe more aware of. Of the game mechanic stuff than they are of the sort of language of improvisational theater. Perhaps. It's. It's. It's funny. I. But I just. I just, like. I just. I love improv. I love doing shows with my friends. It seemed like a great place to do it and a fun way of like, trying to just kind of get the break out of the. Break out of the way in which most actual play shows are in a live context, which is like five people with laptops sitting at a folding table, like just. Just standing up and doing. Doing. Doing the type of improvisation that we're used to doing in theaters. Felt. Felt really good.
- [35:41]
Dan Casey
Yeah, it's. It's a really. It's a really fascinating union between the two because. And also really interesting to hear that that pipeline has been created of, like, the DND to ucb. Yeah, yeah. Sort of on ramp there. Now, obviously you have an amazing background in improv. That's how I came across you first as an improviser. I urge anyone out there who has not seen the Improvised Shakespeare Company to go and do so at their earliest convenience. Because I've seen a lot of improv in my life, and it is a plus. Absolutely well worth your time. But I'm curious for you, Ross. How does. How do you feel that your experience as an improviser informs how you approach storytelling specifically in like, a TTRPG environment?
- [36:23]
Ross Bryant
In a way, I feel like I was very like the type of improvisation that I've spent the most time Doing really helped me to a become a player in these games and throw myself in and. And it's really helped as a GM as well when as I've begun doing that more. Both Improvise Shakespeare and a lot of the other shows that I do are our narrative. This is getting a little bit into the weeds of improv, but they're narrative improv shows. A lot of shows that you see are what we as improvisers might call montages, where you get one suggestion and that sort of inspires a collection of scenes that are kind of loosely connected to that suggestion and they riff on each other and it sort of creates. It's almost. It should look a little bit like a sketch comedy show. And there are slightly more codified forms. We would say things like if people have a passing familiarity with improv, they might know of forms like the Herald, which are where you get a suggestion and you sort of as a group brainstorm out themes and premises and then improvise scenes with those premises. And it has this sort of like theatrical structure. And then what improvisation expert does is because we're like trying to imitate to the best of our ability. The vibe of a Shakespeare play is we kind of take from both where it has a sort of Herald esque structure, where we do. We do scenes and group scenes, but we do try to tell a story.
- [37:53]
Dan Casey
We.
- [37:54]
Ross Bryant
Which is not the goal of most improv shows. In fact, when you're learning improv, teachers will often tell you not to focus on story and especially not to focus on plot. They. They will. And that's very useful advice because you can get kind of bogged down in planning, which is the death of improvisation when you start planning and you stop listening. So the way that we kind of get over that in, in narrative improv shows like Improvised Shakespeare and the others that I do is that you. You turn off the part of your brain that's trying to plan ahead and you focus on listening like you should in all improvisation. But you also really are focused on what characters want. And that's the thing that drives you through the show. As long as a character is always pursuing something they want, and the more personal and sort of emotional it is, the better, the more they push for that plot just happens. It happens totally organically. And it really opens up your mind to the way like to writing stories and watching shows, the most effective ones are ones where characters are clearly pursuing a want throughout. And then the plots don't feel as kind of mathy and, and clunky maybe as Long as you have just like an emotional drive, propelling a character and just having that muscle built up is so helpful in, in games because as long as your character can articulate that kind of emotional want, what's the reason they want to go on an adventure? What do they want from their fellow players? What do they want from the villain in this story? What do they like? Then you can get into just engaging with the world through that lens versus, like I said, planning. Now there's a type of player that loves to create like a book length backstory for their character. And that's great coming from improvisation, I, I find that burdensome. I like to come up with back. I like to improvise backstory. Like so that when something happens, the way it emotionally resonates with a character implies backstory. That when I say it becomes true. So it all happens in the moment and you just have to kind of pay attention to it and maintain it in your memory and your notes. So having that sort of want first mindset is super helpful both as a player because you. It helps you to engage in the world more. It's very helpful as a GM because knowing precisely and clearly what NPCs want and especially what your villains want keeps the story very compelling. Because the villains are not necessary. They're not villains in their minds. They want things for very particular reasons. And being able to articulate that is going to make it so much richer and it's going to make story just happen.
- [40:43]
Dan Casey
Exactly. I really appreciate that sort of. I think active listening is something that can sort of fall by the wayside sometimes and being too precious about, you know, this ream of backstory you've built up, if that's, if that floats your boat and like that helps you envision the world and buy into the reality and by all means do it. But I feel like having this sort of like scaffolding. I think that's. I think that's totally appropriate. But know that something else may go on the outside. It may be a totally different building by the time that you're done. And yeah, I just, I appreciate that approach to it. I'm curious though, do you. Do you find yourself when you're sitting down to create a new character, do you find yourself falling into specific tropes or patterns? Or do you find yourself drawn to particular styles of character or class, et cetera? Anything like that?
- [41:34]
Ross Bryant
Dan. Great artist. Borrow brilliant artist Steele. Of course. When I sit down and make a character, the first thing I'm thinking of is what's another character in fiction or history that I would want to. That, that I, that I'm like kind of riffing on or borrowing from. And yeah, my, my, I like what you said. Scaffolding. I think that's a very good way to put it. Just like a few little, little pylons that you can, that you can rest things on, but not, but not something fully, fully so fleshed out that you feel hidebound to, to desperately cling to it at the expense of the story as it's proceeding. For example, in the Glass Cannon Network, we, we're playing through the famous Call of Cthulhu scenario. The Masks of Nyarlathotep, which is set in the 1920s. All the, the investigators are solving this big horror mystery and 1920s, I knew I wanted, I was like, I just finished reading Evelyn Waugh's Brideshead Revisited and I wanted to. So I was like, I want to make a character that would be in that world, not necessarily like a one to one of any particular character, but, but, but an Evelyn Waugh esque guy. And so, so picking a sort of upper crust dilettantish English gentleman who is a veteran of the First World War and dealing with that and, and also has some kind of unresolved desires about maybe one of his, one of his college classmates, let's say. I was also pulling from like E.M. forster, E.M. forster's Maurice and Room with a View and stuff. Basically it's like, what were the last three books I read? I want to, I want to make, I want to make somebody like that. So, so that just kind of gives me a little like one or two little bullet points that I can kind of put in my mental cocktail shaker and kind of blend together, but that's all I've really got. I think anybody who plays these games knows that you can have all those ideas in your head, but you never really get to know the character until you played maybe two, three sessions. And then when they start to interact with the other characters, then you learn so much about them and they sort of take on a life of their own.
- [43:59]
Dan Casey
Yeah, always the nice moment, you're like, actually my accent is going to suddenly change because I've decided I don't want to do this for 90 more hours.
- [44:08]
Ross Bryant
Absolutely. Or if you're me, you're going to dig into the accent harder and do it more.
- [44:14]
Dan Casey
Yeah. Triple down. Oh, people aren't digging it. Don't worry, they will come back around and be enjoyable. Now one thing that stands out to me about you as a performer is I'm very impressed with your command of language. You're someone who is very verbose, and you're able to summon, I think, a level of erudition that I find incredibly impressive and I think would maybe not be as easy for others to conjure at a whim. Do you find that that is something that leaks into a lot of your characters? Is that just sort of a bit of Ross spilling out into these people.
- [44:48]
Ross Bryant
For better or worse? I. I am like. I. I like wordiness and, And, And. And. And, yes, I. Part of what I love about making characters, especially. Especially characters in Call of Cthulhu, and. And I really loved it in Blades of the Dark as well. Like these sort of. Very. These sort of very arch, heightened fantasy history sort of places. One thing I love about the. Engaging with things set in the past or reading things from the past is that, like, the way people wrote and talked is so. Can be so mellifluous and poetic and. And to our modern ears, verbose and with this, like, odd syntax that you kind of have to follow as it spools out in these unfamiliar ways. And I like to get. I really love to get on the wavelength of that and try on those types of voices, try on that style of speech. Yeah, that's. I understand that's totally. Not for everyone. But, yes, wordiness and trying to get into the lingo of a particular region or era is very, very fun for me. That's part of why I like this.
- [46:00]
Dan Casey
For the record, I love it. It's something. It's something that I was like, man, this is awesome that he's able to summon this ability like this and manifest it in that way. As the son of an English teacher, I very much appreciate it.
- [46:11]
Ross Bryant
I, too, am the son of an English teacher. That part of my personality is very much just a. That's the chip off the old block. Thanks, Mom.
- [46:20]
Dan Casey
Right? Yeah. It was my dad. I'm just like, you know what? I wish I still had weekly vocab tests so I could just keep adding more words to the lexicon. Yeah.
- [46:29]
Ross Bryant
Yeah. Mom was definitely the sort of person reading, like, Roald Dahl books with us and. And being very, like, really loving and being. My mom is a person who's really tickled by obscure vocabulary and finding interesting, funny words. And so, of course, that. It's like, this is a way to please mother. So.
- [46:50]
Dan Casey
Yeah. You'll never guess what I learned today.
- [46:53]
Ross Bryant
Yeah.
- [46:54]
Dan Casey
Yeah. My dad would drop in just words in the conversation that would just feel patently absurd as a child. And I'm like there's, there's no way goldbricker can be a real term that feels like something you just made up. But nevertheless, here we are. He was right as he was with most things.
- [47:10]
Ross Bryant
Yeah. Yeah.
- [47:12]
Dan Casey
So I want to also talk a little bit about. You mentioned that you're spending some time behind the screen too. What is your approach to. You know, you told us a little bit about your approach to character building, but what's your approach to world building? Especially like when you are sitting down with a group of players. Like, you have your philosophy when it comes to character creation, but how, how does that shift when you are on the other side of the screen?
- [47:34]
Ross Bryant
Yeah, obviously when you prep a game, you've got to, you have to prepare. You've got, you need more, more preparation. You can't be as off the cuff with it maybe as I like to be as a player, but I still don't like to plan too, too much. I always like that there's, there's like a sweet spot where you, where you've got again want based. Who's the. If there is a, if there is a villain or an oppositional force in this game, who are they? What do they want? Why? What's their philosophy like articulating that stuff? That to me is the most important thing. And again, yeah, I'm like, I'm trying to steal from, from the things I love, the things I find compelling. I. I've been DMing this home brewed D and D campaign with my friends. It's. It's the people in Chill Touch basically. And a few more play this D and D game and I think I just finished reading a bunch of the books in the Trader Beru Cormorant series, if people are aware of that. It's a terrific fantasy series that I, the first book in particular I really love. And it's, it's a very interesting fantasy world. It's. And it involves a lot of like political maneuvering between different kind of ducal houses. And I liked, I really liked that vibe. I like that vibe of. Because it reminded me of like the Renaissance in Europe of, of like warring states in, in Italy during the Renaissance, like the. Or. Or these horrible conflicts like the Hundred Years War in the Holy Roman Empire. And so I was like, I'm gonna make, I want to make a little, a little group of duchies and make our players like agents of one of these duchies and just have a lot of this kind of background intrigue going on that slowly reveals itself to the players. As they have to. As I present them with opportunities again and again to like, pick sides in this conflict where all the sides seem flawed in their own way, or maybe they might find their own way through this, this thorny network of, of political intrigues while at the same time uncovering this historical sort of mystery and learning more about, like, what happened centuries ago in this, in this realm. So that's a lot, that's a lot of stuff going on, but it's. Yeah, you just. I kind of sketched out a map and, and, and figured out like, what's the general vibe of all these areas? What do they want? And then, and then you just kind of turn the players loose and let them, let them cook and.
- [50:11]
Dan Casey
Yeah, because then it's, it's. Imagine. It's nice to have all of that understanding of how everything's interconnected, their relationships, but, you know, there's a non zero chance that a good chunk of that could, could never come into play.
- [50:23]
Ross Bryant
Exactly.
- [50:24]
Dan Casey
So being able to be like, okay, well, they want to go this direction, so let me get a bit more granular with these specific duchies and their, their disagreements over tariffs.
- [50:35]
Ross Bryant
Right, right, right. So, yeah, week to week, as they explore, I, I have the fun of like, following their imagination and kind of trying to. Yes. And their ideas and build out this world more and more and more. And part of the fun of it is just this whole little realm is slowly, but slowly building and in our imaginations and as more and more details get added. And it's very cool to have this little world into which we can escape every now and then.
- [51:07]
Dan Casey
Absolutely. I, I relish the experience. I talk a lot about in video games, that joy of discovery, but here it's sort of peeling back that collective fog of war as you're both discovering what this thing is in real time. Because, you know, you might not know what lies down the road, but you're picking up on sort of the clues your players are putting down about what might float their particular boats and it becomes this mutual push and pull, which is always exciting to experience. Experience. Unless things go completely and utterly off the rails, which can be exciting for.
- [51:37]
Ross Bryant
Different reasons, which certainly happens. I, I think every. But, but yeah, I think every DM or GM has had the experience of like, having their, their pet theory about the big thing that's about to be revealed and then one of your players theorizes a much better idea and you're like, oh, yeah, it's that now.
- [51:53]
Dan Casey
Yeah, that was absolutely what I was going to say when I Started talking. Yeah, I've experienced the opposite as well, where a dm I was playing with a very dear friend of mine. He presented us with. There was a large train onto which all of these nobles were boarding, and there was an item on the train we needed. And obviously we snuck onto the train. And afterwards he's like, I. I really didn't think you guys were gonna board the train and do some sort of train heist. I'm like, but I thought you were. I thought you were literally railroading us in this instance, but that's okay. And it wound up. It wound up being a very memorable session. But it's just that I think there's that moment of people like your stomach dropping when something goes completely out of control.
- [52:39]
Ross Bryant
Yeah.
- [52:39]
Dan Casey
But I think to your point of, you know, just being able to articulate wants and thinking and just listening and sort of figuring out, okay, well, they clearly want a train heist. I will do my best. And we did. And it was great.
- [52:54]
Ross Bryant
So much of it is just reskinning your plans on the fly of like, oh, that thing that I thought was going to take place in a hot air balloon that's in a submarine now.
- [53:01]
Dan Casey
Yeah.
- [53:04]
Ross Bryant
Yeah. It's not that. It's not that hard. We get so. We get so hung up on clinging to our plans and.
- [53:12]
Dan Casey
Yeah.
- [53:12]
Ross Bryant
And you can, it's, it's, it's okay just, just to go with the flow a little bit. That's that I can, I can, I can thank improvisation, be spending my time in the improv trenches to be like, it's going to be fine. Things are going to work.
- [53:26]
Dan Casey
It's all, I think definitely to people's benefit if they can develop any sort of comfort with improv. Just, it'll feel less like conversational free fall and just knowing that you can tuck and roll when you hit the ground and keep running.
- [53:38]
Ross Bryant
Yeah.
- [53:39]
Dan Casey
Yeah.
- [53:39]
Ross Bryant
And I feel like even as a, like your, your players give you more grace than you probably think. You don't have to be up there delivering your. The, the one man show of the century all the time. Like if they throw you for a loop, just be like, hey, can you give me five minutes while I take some notes real quick? Everyone's going to be fine.
- [53:54]
Dan Casey
I'm going to do some rejiggering, go get some more gummy bears from the kitchen.
- [53:58]
Ross Bryant
Totally.
- [53:58]
Dan Casey
Yeah.
- [53:59]
Ross Bryant
They will be grateful for a break to go and eat stuffed crust pizza.
- [54:02]
Dan Casey
Exactly 1,000%. Now, I'm curious as well. You mentioned that you're playing in this homebrew world. Do you have a favorite homebrew rule that you like to employ or that you've encountered in any of your games?
- [54:14]
Ross Bryant
I don't. I don't think I've got any homebrew rules in that game necessarily. One of the ones I tell you, one of the rules that I've this.
- [54:23]
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- [56:16]
Ross Bryant
I play a lot at home and on cam with Jared Logan, someone who I think is like a true genius at whatever this art form is. He's a Mozart of it and he has a lot of like little, little rules that flow through. And my first time playing Call of Cthulhu, one of my favorite TTRPGs was with him and I think rules is written you can spend as much. There's a mechanical luck in Call of Cthulhu which like if you fail a roll, you spend luck points to get Your role to be a success. But that of course lowers your luck stat, which if you need to have a lucky break later when you roll against it, is going to make it harder. Like the luck is always a diminishing resource. Now in Rules is written, you can spend as much of it as you want to get your. To get your roll down. The house rule that Jared uses, I think you could never spend more than 12 points. So. Because as. Which I thought was just the rules when we played it.
- [57:15]
Dan Casey
That's very funny.
- [57:16]
Ross Bryant
So that when I. When I played it later and people were like, okay, I'm going to spend 40 points of luck to make that a success, I was like, what? You could do that?
- [57:24]
Dan Casey
Excuse me. Point of order.
- [57:25]
Ross Bryant
Yeah, we were dying a lot.
- [57:28]
Dan Casey
Yeah.
- [57:30]
Ross Bryant
Yeah. Jared is a tough taskmaster. He makes it hard on you, but that makes it fun. It raises the intensity. So that is actually a fun rule. But I can see why some players might not find it fun because it's not necessarily to your benefit.
- [57:45]
Dan Casey
Yeah, I think that. Absolutely a case of, I think knowing your audience, like, knowing what your group wants. That's definitely. If they like an experience that has a possibility for higher player lethality. 1000%. I definitely can get on board with that.
- [57:59]
Ross Bryant
And I'm sure more people have said this, but Blades in the Dark, my other favorite improv game we're playing right now, TTRPG game. Oh, man. Is it good?
- [58:08]
Dan Casey
So good.
- [58:09]
Ross Bryant
The flashback mechanic in that is so awesome. And I think if you can find. That's one that you can incorporate into lots of other games. If you can. If you can find the attendant kind of cost that a flashback entails. It's so great.
- [58:25]
Dan Casey
Yeah, it's. I'm always a fan of any system that employs some sort of like shared narration rights almost because that to me speaks to our point earlier about it being a communal act and sort of, you know, it's. I love the idea that it's. We don't have time to showcase every single thing that went into it because you as the player getting new information in real time, which would have affected what you would have done previously. But in. In Blades in the Dark in particular, just plays out so beautifully. But also I love how the dice, you know, it's a success with consequence. It's a failure with consequence, an amazing success. It's. There's still that level of variance in there that determines what's going to happen and, you know, get to manage your stress as well to make sure you don't crash out.
- [59:11]
Ross Bryant
Yeah, that game is so elegantly and beautifully made because you're right. It gives. It empowers everyone to. To contribute to the narrative of the and the world building. Everyone is kind of a GM in that game. You. You're all you. You can contribute so much but the mechanics also it's a game like you've got a. It's not just you telling a story. There's a lot of push pull and. And economy to keep track of and compromises. You have to make that. They make it so suspenseful and great.
- [59:42]
Dan Casey
Well, since we're on. Since we're on the subject of we talked about Call of Cthulhu, talked about Blades in the Dark. I'm curious what is your favorite TTRPG that you think people are either sleeping on or you wish got a bit more shine or a game that you would be excited to sit down and play with a group of people that have not played before?
- [59:59]
Ross Bryant
Golly. I mean those Call of Cthulhu and. And Blades in the Dark are probably my favorite games just because they're so. They're so narrative focused and that's what I like. I like most as far as like for a first timer I would. I would go with either of those honestly. But just to bring up one that I haven't, that I haven't spoken of before. A game that just. Just crossed my desk. My. This same little home group did a. Did a two shot of this game that I'd never heard of before called Eat the Reich. The. It's a slim little little game. You could. You could absorb it pretty quickly and the premise is utterly irresistible and crazy. It's that during World War II when Germany has occupied France, there is a secret allied special forces organization called F A N G that brings Fang that brings vampires into the. Under the aegis of the allied powers, airdrops them into occupied Paris with one mission. Drink Hitler's blood.
- [61:11]
Dan Casey
Incred. Incredible premise that is. I've seen this at my local game store and now I simply must pick it up. That's incredible.
- [61:20]
Ross Bryant
It's. It's. We. We all just played the pre gen characters from the book and it was so fun. It's also. It's so gonzo and crazy and over the top in a very fun way. And, and in the way that you know, you play a new game and you're kind of trying to get your arms around it the whole time like how are we playing exactly right. It's a very player empowering game. You. You. You are given a lot of leeway to Describe a lot about what you do and. And the world. It's. It's an interesting. It's an interesting narrative driven game with a lot of, like, interesting mechanics along the way. And the world it's in is just so compelling. And again, not to get political, but there was something very cathartic about, like, about sucking a bunch of fascists dry. Felt very good.
- [62:12]
Dan Casey
Yeah, I. I can see why that would be satisfying, even if I can't definitely draw a direct parallel to current events. All right, so my last question for you, Ross. It's Game Night. You've been tasked with choosing any board game, tabletop game that you want to bring, game of your choice. What are you showing up to Game Night with?
- [62:34]
Ross Bryant
I'm bringing Regency Cthulhu. There's a Call of Cthulhu hack that is set in Jane Austen era Regency England, and that's what I would bring.
- [62:48]
Dan Casey
Oh, my gosh.
- [62:49]
Ross Bryant
I have one little homebrew scenario that I've played both as a. On. On the Insulin Nobody podcast and at home, and I had so much fun kind of inventing it and playing it, and I. It's just so I. What. What I love most about Call of Cthulhu, even aside from the Cthulhu. Cthulhu esque stuff in it, is just that it's a historical fiction game that you get to play in different eras, and the Regency era is so. It's so hypercharged with emotion. You. Whether. Whether you're playing it as a Jane Austeny thing or a Bronte thing or a Bridgerton thing, you could. You're bringing that. It speaks to me because you have that, like, heightened language, like we were talking about. Heightened emotions like we were talking about. And the idea of dark and twisted horrors invading, you know, the Bennett sisters cotillion is pretty fun.
- [63:49]
Dan Casey
Mr. Darcy's even darker secret.
- [63:52]
Ross Bryant
Yeah, yeah. Heathcliff was left on the heath by what.
- [63:59]
Dan Casey
And who came back.
- [64:00]
Ross Bryant
Yeah. Mr. Rochester's got something locked away up there in his attic. What is it?
- [64:05]
Dan Casey
What is in Ms. Havisham's cake?
- [64:07]
Ross Bryant
Yeah.
- [64:08]
Dan Casey
No, I love that. I didn't realize there was a Regency hack for Call of Cthulhu that. I will absolutely have to check that out. If we can find a link, we'll put it in the description below. But, Ross, thank you so much for taking the time to join us today. I really appreciate it. This has been such a wonderful conversation around stuff that I think is very near and dear to both of us. So, you know, I would urge everyone out there who's listening to make Some time to go play. This week, next week, whenever you can at your earliest convenience. But in the meantime, Ross, where can people find you on the World Wide Web if in fact you want to be found?
- [64:39]
Ross Bryant
Good question. These days, we must hide in the shadows, lurking, waiting for our time to strike. No, you can find me on Instagram. Yeah, I'm on Instagram RossBB. So, yeah, come and follow me there. That's really the only social media I regularly engage with.
- [64:59]
Dan Casey
Yeah. And if you like cartoons, you will be doubly rewarded. So please give Ross a follow.
- [65:04]
Ross Bryant
Yes, Yes. I actually. I don't know, this might be another edit point, but I can find the next Chill Touch date here.
- [65:11]
Dan Casey
Oh, yeah, absolutely.
- [65:12]
Ross Bryant
And please come. Like. Dan was so kind, bringing up the Improvised Shakespeare Company with those kind words. I love that show. I love doing the show. And we do tour around, so come and see it in la. We play at the Largo once or twice a month here in Los Angeles, but we're also. We tour around the country, so keep an eye on that website or on my Instagram to know when we're going to be coming to your town. And if you are interested in Chill Touch, the. The daring show that has the courage to finally let nerds play improv, you can see our next show at Upright Citizens Brigade here in Los Angeles on Saturday, May 31st at 7pm and if you're elsewhere in the world, that is available on live stream, so you can watch it through the power of the Internet as well.
- [66:00]
Dan Casey
Yes, you're no longer bound by the shackles of geography. Through the World Wide Web, anything, including laughter, can be yours. That's awesome. I didn't realize they were live streaming now. That's amazing. Fantastic. Well, Ross, thank you again, folks. You can find me each and every week trapped here in the Conversation Dungeon on Geek and Sundry. Also on Nerdist, wherever fine podcasts and videos are found. And thank you so much. So get out there, go play, and we'll see you next time. Bye. Bye.
- [66:25]
Ross Bryant
Bye.
- [66:33]
Vulgar History Announcer
Have you ever heard about the 19th century French actress who with so many lovers that they formed a lovers union? Or what about the aboriginal Australian bandit who faked going into labor just to escape the police, which she did escape from them. It was a great plan. How about the French queen who murdered her rival with poison gloves? I'm Ann Foster, host of the feminist women's history comedy podcast, Vulgar History. Every week I share the saga of a woman from history whose story you probably didn't already know and you will never forget. After you hear it? Sometimes we re examine well known people like Cleopatra or Pocahontas, sharing the truth behind their legends. Sometimes we look at the scandalous women you'll never find in a history textbook. Listen to vulgar history wherever you get podcasts. And if you're curious, the people I was talking about before, the Australian woman is named Marianne Bug and the French actress was named Rochelle no less. Name just Rochelle. And the queen who poisoned her rival is Catherine de Medici. I have episodes about all of them.
- [67:35]
DC High Volume Batman Announcer
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Dan Casey
It's not as bad as it looks.
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Dan Casey
Batman as he's called, possesses extraordinary physical skill.
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Dan Casey
Look there.
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Ross Bryant
What the hell?
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- [68:11]
Dan Casey
He's got a motorcycle.
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Ross Bryant
Get after him or I'll have you shot. Take him down.
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Sponsor Announcer
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- [68:22]
Ross Bryant
Thinks he's a damn Robin Hood. He dies.
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eBay Announcer
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Sponsor Announcer
Hit the floodlight. It's showtime. New episodes every Wednesday. Follow and listen wherever you get your podcasts.
- [68:40]
Ross Bryant
Batman hasn't attacked anybody.
- [68:43]
Dan Casey
You mean blow up the building?
- [68:52]
Sponsor Announcer
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- [69:08]
DC High Volume Batman Announcer
If you're looking for a podcast adventure, check out Dum Dums and Dragons. A podcast where improviser and comedians who've never role played before journey into the world of Dungeons and Dragons. Dum Dums and Dragons has been featured on the official Dungeons and Dragons podcast, ranked number two of all fiction podcasts in America and has been downloaded more than 4 million times. Dum dums and Dragons can be discovered anywhere hilarious podcasts can be found. It's like Lord of the Rings if everyone was an idiot.