Past, Present, and Future with Mark Hulmes, Jasmine Bhullar, and David Nett | Roundtable

Summary

Podcast Summary

Podcast: Critical Role & Sagas of Sundry
Episode: Past, Present, and Future with Mark Hulmes, Jasmine Bhullar, and David Nett | Roundtable
Host: geekandsundry
Date: March 16, 2026
Guests:

• Mark Hulmes (Community manager at Yogscast, GM of High Rollers)
• Jasmine Bhullar (GM behind The Outcrowd)
• David Nett (Writer, actor, lifelong D&D GM)

---

Main Theme

This roundtable episode explores the evolving world of tabletop role-playing games (RPGs), delving into the ways storytelling, audience engagement, technology, and culture have shifted over the decades. The guests reflect on their personal journeys into RPGs, the changing expectations of both players and audiences, the impact of streaming and digital tools, and their hopes for the future of the hobby.

---

Introduction & Personal Journeys ([00:33]–[06:30])

Memorable Quotes & Moments:

• "What will really change it for me is VR. Like having that headset and being able to be immersed. That would make a huge difference to me."
  — Jasmine Bhullar [00:35]
• "The underlying fundamental realities are the same. Have fun. It's not just your story, it's everybody's story. To me, that's really beautiful."
  — David Nett [01:03]

Discussion Points:

• Each guest shares their origin story with RPGs:
  • David discovered D&D at a science fair in rural North Dakota, drawn in as a nerdy, introverted kid.

    "Just the moment of creating that character, I was immediately hooked." [02:09]

  • Mark talks about growing up in India, learning languages via comics and his first experience of roleplay through Model United Nations (“I am Ireland!”), which led to D&D. [03:07–04:19]
  • Jasmine’s introduction involved being ‘the GM by default’ after pooling allowance money with friends for a third edition starter box. [04:32]
• Nostalgia and influence of 80s media (Stranger Things, Tolkien, Dune, Excalibur, etc.) on early gaming groups.

---

Evolution of the Game & Its Audience ([05:22]–[11:05])

Shift from World-Driven to Character-Driven Play

• Jasmine notes the modern embrace of pulp adventure and character-driven arcs:

  "The characters are really what drives it. It's no longer about the MacGuffin." [06:37]

• Earlier modules focused on world-ending scenarios and epic items; now, players and viewers crave character arcs and relationships.

Streaming, Showrunning & Audience Engagement

• Discussion of the challenges balancing play for both players at the table and audiences online.
  • Mark: "How do I explain this to my audience? If it's gonna take you four hours to explain, they're gone on max hit points." [07:59]
• Importance of moments for each player and the formula required for an engaging streamed session.
  • Mark: "If you feel like this person had a whole episode, maybe we should make sure some of these other players get their episode so that the audience has a chance to click with them." [10:21]

Notable Moment:

• Mark on roleplay “bleed” and being disliked for an unpopular character:

  "I didn't realize the gravity of really role playing on Twitch until I played a true neutral character that I feel like a lot of people really disliked, and it made them dislike me." [10:33]

• Jasmine: "Yeah. Just people criticizing the character for their decisions. And it's like, keep in mind, that's not me making that decision. I'm playing my character." [10:45]

---

Technology’s Double-Edged Sword ([12:12]–[14:30], [22:07]–[26:24])

In-Person vs. Virtual Play

• All agree that in-person play has unique advantages—eye contact, physical dice, table energy.
  • Mark: "You feed off of each other so much and eye contact is so big in role play." [21:55]
  • David: "Small things like even rolling the dice physically, that's a cool feeling. And clicking a button just never feels as equal." [22:13]
• But technology enables connection; Roll20, virtual tables, etc., are lifelines for remote groups.

Next Frontier: VR & Immersive Tech

• Jasmine: "What will really change it for me is VR… being able to be immersed around a table and there are my friends, and maybe they're dressed up as their characters. That’s cool." [22:51]
• Mark and Jasmine are excited about virtual tables, immersive tech, and integrating effects and miniatures digitally:
  • “Being able to just have pre-done tiles that I can snap together and then I can put a miniature down and like fire erupts around it if I click a spell card or something like that, that's amazing." — Jasmine [23:54]

The Renaissance of Tabletop

• Mark sees the popularity of board games as paving the way for RPGs' resurgence and improved products:
  • "When you bring in money, great things happen because suddenly you’re getting products developed for you that weren’t there before." [24:55]
• 3D printing/custom miniatures are highlighted as a tech enhancement (with a nod to Heroforge).

  "To be able to go there and to create your character and 3D print not only the character, but the pose, the attitude that you want, and a smile or a frown. That's amazing." — David [26:13]

---

Showrunning vs. Home Games ([08:42], [12:22]–[14:30])

• Jasmine focuses on friends as her primary audience:

  "It's a bunch of friends playing a D and D game, but there's cameras in the room... it's the players around the table that is my focus." [08:42]

• Mark notes the need for pace and variety:

  "If people are stuck on something, you kind of just let it go... when it's happening on camera... you gotta move it along." [12:52]

• All note that reading audience chat can influence play, sometimes detrimentally (“playing to the audience”, breaking character for crowd approval). [13:57–14:13]
• Both Mark and Jasmine discourage players from reading live chat, to preserve character integrity and story focus.

---

Advice to New GMs & Playing it Forward ([26:53]–[28:47])

• Mark’s advice: Be excited with the players, not adversarial.
  • "I am with the players, and I want to see them succeed. And it's my job to tell their story. It's not their job to play out my story." [27:28]
• Jasmine advises: Start small, focus on what makes your setting compelling for your heroes. [27:38]
• David: Build a story toolbox by reading widely—books, movies, TV—so you can improvise when players go off-script. [27:53]
  • "Whether you're a GM or DM or whatever, or a writer or a TV script, we're world builders. That's what you're doing." — Jasmine [28:29]

Core Truth:

"Regardless of when you started playing, regardless of what your references were that got you playing. The advice that you guys were just talking about is very similar to the advice that I give coming from, again, 30 years of playing Dungeons and Dragons. The underlying fundamental realities are the same. Have fun. It's not just your story, it's everybody's story." — David Nett [29:32]

---

Notable Quotes by Timestamp

• Jasmine: "What will really change it for me is VR. Like having that headset and being able to be immersed." [00:35, 22:51]
• David: "It's not just your story, it's everybody's story." [01:03, 29:32]
• Mark: "You feed off of each other so much and eye contact is so big in role play." [21:55]
• Jasmine: "The characters are really what drives it. It's no longer about the MacGuffin." [06:37]
• Mark: "I want to see [the players] succeed. And it's my job to tell their story. It's not their job to play out my story." [27:28]
• David: "Whether you're a GM or DM or whatever... we're world builders. That's what you're doing." [28:29]

---

Final Thoughts: The Past, Present, and Future

• Tabletop RPGs have shifted from niche, world-driven games to mainstream, character-focused stories with massive, streaming-fueled audiences.
• Technology offers new possibilities (and new distractions), while the heart of the hobby—collaborative storytelling—endures.
• All guests encourage flexibility, player focus, and a welcoming approach for both GMs and new players as the RPG world continues to grow and adapt.

---

Timestamps for Key Segments

• [00:35] – Opening statements on VR & audience immersion
• [01:49] – Guests share personal RPG origin stories
• [06:35] – Discussion of changing narrative focus (MacGuffins to Characters)
• [08:42] – Showrunning challenges: balancing table vs. audience
• [10:33] – Roleplay “bleed” and audience perceptions
• [12:22] – Playing on camera vs. off camera
• [13:57] – Influence of chat/audience participation on player behavior
• [21:55] – Value of in-person vs. remote gaming
• [22:51] – Hopes for VR and immersive RPG tech
• [24:55] – The “renaissance” of board games and RPGs
• [26:53] – Advice for new GMs and the universality of the hobby’s core values

---

Conclusion

A rich, heartfelt discussion for both RPG veterans and newcomers, this roundtable offers insight into the changing nature of the hobby, the challenges of merging play and performance, and a hopeful look at technology’s future role in storytelling. The panelists' camaraderie, collective wisdom, and enthusiasm for the past, present, and future of RPGs shine throughout the episode.

Transcript

[Narrator/Advertiser]

This episode is brought to you by Progressive Insurance. Do you ever find yourself playing the budgeting game? Shifting a little money here, a little there, and hoping it all works out well? With the name your price tool from Progressive, you can be a better budgeter and potentially lower your insurance bill too. You tell Progressive what you want to pay for car insurance and they'll help you find options within your budget. Try it [e-mail] progressive casualty insurance company and affiliates price and coverage match limited by state law. Not available in all states.

[Mark Holmes]

Tonight on the roundtable, what will really

[Jasmine Bullar]

change it for me is VR. Like having that headset and being able to be immersed. That would make a huge difference to me.

[Mark Holmes]

Mark Holmes, Community manager of yogscast and game master of High Rollers I didn't realize, like, the gravity of really role playing on Twitch until I played like a true neutral character that I feel like a lot of people really disliked and it made them dislike. Jasmine Bullar, the game master behind the 80s inspired RPG the Outcrowd.

[David Nett]

The underlying fundamental realities are the same. Have fun. It's not just your story, it's everybody's story. To me, that's really beautiful.

[Mark Holmes]

David Nett is a writer, actor, and lifelong Dungeons and Dragons game master. How you just gave me the feels over.

[David Nett]

Cheers.

[Jasmine Bullar]

Cheers.

[Mark Holmes]

To the moral spectrum alignment.

[Jasmine Bullar]

So how did you guys get into it? Because, like, I find, like, that's when I'm meeting like, new, new DMs and stuff like that. Like, that's always the fun thing of, like, how did you get into the game? And things like that.

[David Nett]

When I was 12, I was at the science fair in Minot, North Dakota, and I had a broken arm and I was showing off my science fair exhibit and the guy next to me had just moved to town and we got talking and he invited me to come play in his Dungeons and Dragons game. And I'd heard about it, but I was in like rural North Dakota, very religious area.

[Sponsor Voice 1]

Oh, yeah.

[David Nett]

Sort of a taboo thing at that time. This is 84ish, I think. And I went and played his game and just the moment of creating that character, I was immediately hooked. Before we even played it was everything that my nerdy, sort of introverted little self had ever really wanted.

[Mark Holmes]

That's adorable.

[David Nett]

It's kind of really adorable, especially with

[Jasmine Bullar]

the little broken arm.

[Mark Holmes]

It's like such a perfect little story.

[David Nett]

The kids on Stranger Things, that was me and my friends.

[Jasmine Bullar]

That's the title. Oh, you really fit into that 80s cliche there.

[David Nett]

Oh, gosh, yeah. So many. So much Nostalgia in that show for me, watching those kids play. Yeah.

[Mark Holmes]

I lived for a really long time in India, and so I did a lot of my growing up there. I had lived for like the first part of my childhood in America, and then I moved to India and it felt like I was Indian, but I was so different from the other kids. It was hard to connect. And I'd always been kind of a shut in. So I read a lot of books and I was trying to learn Hindi and Punjabi at the same time.

[David Nett]

Oh, wow.

[Mark Holmes]

And so my dad would buy me comics, like Hindi comics. And they were really, really bad. Like Indian comics. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. But they were. We had a superhero named Doga who's like the Punisher, but he wears a dog mask. It was bad, but it helped me pick up the languages. And that's. That's kind of where my journey with nerdiness started. And then when I moved back here, I still felt like I didn't fit in. And I started to hang out, like on the Internet and stuff. My first role play experience, and this isn't pen and paper. My first role play experience, which then got me into dd, was actually like a college program called Model United Nations.

[David Nett]

Oh, shit. Yeah. Of course.

[Jasmine Bullar]

This one was like a mega game.

[Mark Holmes]

Yeah. You compete for stakes, you know, meaningful larp.

[David Nett]

Like.

[Mark Holmes]

Yeah. And I remember really getting into it and being like, this weekend, I am Ireland and I will only speak as the Republic of Ireland. And you always speak in the third person. So I always say, the Republic of Ireland does not support that declaration. I love that the Republic of Ireland would like to abstain from voting. Like, it's like. And that was my first time role playing. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I was pretty good at it. And one of the people in that program was like, have you ever played dd?

[Jasmine Bullar]

No. That's awesome.

[David Nett]

I saw you inhabit Ireland. Let's talk about it. Before playing games, really, you took on

[Jasmine Bullar]

the Persona of Islands. You made it your own. Do you want to play some D and D?

[Mark Holmes]

Yeah.

[Jasmine Bullar]

Yeah.

[Mark Holmes]

And I was like. And that's how it started.

[Jasmine Bullar]

I started with third edition and I was like, kind of you. I was a super geeky kid, but I didn't really have a lot of friends, like geeky friends at the time. Like, I was the kid that, you know, after school I had to go and stay with my grandparents. So I would get like a dust, a garbage can lid and a stick and I'd be in the garden, like, you know, doing my own stories. And then I Was quite lucky in that. Around high school, I had a bunch of geeky friends and we were in the local comic store and they had the third edition starter box and we all kind of pitched in our allowance money. We bought it.

[David Nett]

So amazing.

[Jasmine Bullar]

Took it home and like, I was the designated GM because I put the most money in. And they were just like, you put the most money in, you keep it. You learn the rules.

[David Nett]

And. Yeah, you learn the rules.

[Jasmine Bullar]

So that's like, fair. Like, my reward is I get to run the game for you guys. But I'm glad I did because I kind of. I just poured into it. And I remember, like, I gave them the setup for the story and they were like, okay, well, what do we do? And I said, what do you guys do?

[David Nett]

What do you want to do? Yeah. And they were just like the fundamental sort of jumping off points for the kids that I was playing with were the classics, right? So we read Tolkien and maybe Dune and we had watched Dragonslayer and Excalibur.

[Jasmine Bullar]

Krull.

[David Nett]

Okay, well, Krull was. No, Krull was there too.

[Jasmine Bullar]

Okay.

[David Nett]

But those were our touch points. We had a very sort of a narrow set of touch points. It was the typical sword and sorcery fantasy stuff. What was the background of stuff when you guys started versus Now?

[Jasmine Bullar]

So for me, my preferred stuff are massively influenced by Pulp Adventure in Action. Like my two callbacks that I love, like the games I really enjoy to either play or GM is ones that I can kind of trace a line back to things like Indiana Jones, the Mummy, the Shadow, like these pultene noir adventures, because that's the stuff I kind of grew up with. And like, that was the type of books that I was reading at the time and everything. What I find now, and being a GM for a game that's on Twitch and People Watch and everything else, it's. It's so character driven. Like, it's not quite soap opera or drama, but they want that Game of Thrones, that Walking Dead, that Netflix Weekly, like, what's the next big character?

[David Nett]

Dramatically, they want to ship your characters. They want.

[Jasmine Bullar]

All the ships are like, sailing. There's fleets, there's armadas of ships. The characters are really what drives it. It's no longer about the MacGuffin. I think in older editions it was always about Black Razor or there's always

[David Nett]

a world ending kind of situation in the older modules.

[Jasmine Bullar]

And that was the driving force. Whereas now I think it's so much more character. I mean, I don't know how you found it Jasmine.

[Mark Holmes]

It's weird. So when I started getting into RPGs, they were really rebelling hard against the classic fantasy you were talking about. I mean, I'd go to the comic book store and you see a plethora of systems and games, more than you can count. And there's like 40 of them that are gonna be steampunk every single time. One thing, and I'm not trying to throw shade at anybody, one thing that turned me off when I would like, flip through these books is like, they had such intense worlds to get into where the universe is like, wow, you really, like. I don't know how to describe it when you just overdo it a little bit ott. Yeah. And so they just. I would read it and I'm like, okay, I can barely get into this. How am I supposed to get my players into this? The concept of this world is so insane. You know, it'd take me an hour just to explain to them the setting. Especially when you talk about an audience. Because I stream on Twitch. How do I explain this to my audience? And, oh, they've gotta be able to

[Jasmine Bullar]

get it so quickly. Cause, you know, they tune in and they want to know it. And like, if it's gonna take you four hours to explain, they're gone on max hit points.

[David Nett]

We have a story that goes along with the workouts, but it's 100% railroad because you can't interact with the story. Right. What I'm fascinated with with you guys is that when I've game mastered and I've done so since I was. I guess when I first started doing it, I was 14, so a very long time ago. But I never had to worry about an audience following my story. I only had to worry about my players and were they engaged. And if I introduced an element that they didn't grok or they didn't lock onto, that element could go away and it didn't matter. I'm interested in balancing. Like, that's a new idea. The idea of balancing your players and an audience.

[Jasmine Bullar]

I mean, my honest answer is I don't try and balance it. Like, I always set my game out that it is a bunch of friends playing a D and D game, but there's cameras in the room, and I try and keep that. So it's like, if the audience doesn't follow something or if they latch onto a character, that's fine. But it's the players around the table that is my focus. And I write the game and I create the world for them.

[Mark Holmes]

And.

[Jasmine Bullar]

And then my Hope, which I like to think has worked, is that the audience will follow it as well as they do, and they will enjoy it as well as they do. But if you have to start really changing things for the audience, I think that that's when you're moving into a different territory. And that's not the kind of game I want to run. You know, I don't want to ever have the thing of, like, and now audience, you can vote on the next monster that they will face. I don't want to do that. Like, I want it to be in D and D game that I kind of build for my friends, and then hopefully other people can enjoy. Because also, I think that that shows the people at home, like, this is what you can be playing, and you can have these adventures.

[Mark Holmes]

The way I run my show on Hyper is probably not the way I would run it if we were just to play D and D right now, because it's like watching a Netflix show a little bit. Like, I have to tell a story in those three hours. You know, you have to have a little bit of everything. And you don't want to devote two and a half hours to a giant boss battle, because who wants to, in my opinion, combat some of the most boring stuff that happens in RPGs, but you also want something interesting to happen, so you have to get that formula down perfectly. I think another big thing is making sure that each player is having their moment or having. If you feel like, oh, I feel like this person had a whole episode, maybe we should make sure some of these other players get their episode so that the audience has a chance to click with them. And for me, I didn't realize the gravity of really role playing on Twitch until I played a true neutral character that I feel like a lot of people really disliked, and it made them dislike me.

[David Nett]

Oh, wow.

[Mark Holmes]

Yeah. Cause you know, you get bleed. Yeah, you get bleed. And that is tough, too.

[Jasmine Bullar]

Yeah. Just people criticizing the character for their decisions. And it's like, keep in mind, that's not me making that decision. I'm playing my character.

[Mark Holmes]

My character is flawed.

[Jasmine Bullar]

And it's like, yeah, exactly.

[Mark Holmes]

You're gonna make bad decisions. And as a good role player, I have to play tr.

[David Nett]

So do you think about it when you're crafting your show? Do you think about it in terms of episodes then?

[Mark Holmes]

I never think of the entire campaign in terms of episodes. But I will try to create a nice end point, because I never want to end it at a part where I feel like it's a cliffhanger or it's an awkward ending because that just pisses off your audience, and it pisses off your players because they're just like, really?

[Jasmine Bullar]

If that's true, I am in such trouble because I am so bad for cliffhangers. I am really bad.

[David Nett]

I'm a big cliffhanger junkie.

[Jasmine Bullar]

Like, I'm so bad for it. Like, it is the worst. But I kind of. There is a sick part of me which, like, when I do it, and it's like, a really good one. Like, you know, they open the tomb and then I go, like. And we'll find out what's in there next week. They'll be like, I try and see what I do in arc, but I do it so that each player does have, like, a arc dedicated to their backstory and their character. Just because I want to make sure that everybody around that table feels like they've had their moment to be the hero. That might be two sessions, that could be six sessions. It depends on what the backstory is and everything else. But in terms of episodes, it just tends to be however much we can squeeze in.

[David Nett]

Do you guys feel like running the shows? Like, show running the shows has changed the way that you play when you're not on camera, or do you play anymore on camera? Not on camera. I don't know if you have time to.

[Mark Holmes]

I do.

[David Nett]

Yeah.

[Mark Holmes]

I enjoy playing off camera. I. I don't want to say it's more formulaic when you're doing it with a show, but I definitely change things around. And part of it is, like, there's situations will occur when you're just hanging out with your friends, you know, and playing a game that, like, if people are stuck on something, you kind of just let it go. And when it's happening on camera, if my players are stuck on something, you

[David Nett]

gotta move it along.

[Mark Holmes]

Something will happen to move it along. Whereas if I'm off camera, I don't really care. If they're stuck and we're just hanging out, drinking beers, playing D and D, it can be stuck for a while. But when people are watching, it's like, you can't be here for more than 15 minutes. After that, it's getting old. Or if they can't figure out how to beat a boss, even though they should, because you gave them all the right hints and they should have asked the right questions to the right PCs. And part of it is, after looking at Twitch chat logs and stuff like that, after the episode, you see the audience, like, how did they not use fire all the backseating. Like, how do they not know?

[David Nett]

I didn't think about the case of backseat players.

[Jasmine Bullar]

That's crazy.

[David Nett]

Are you kidding?

[Jasmine Bullar]

Backseat players?

[Mark Holmes]

Yeah, there's a lot of backseating, and they're just like, how does he not know?

[David Nett]

Do your players then read chat?

[Jasmine Bullar]

Well, I was gonna say, do you.

[Mark Holmes]

Do you let them know? We do not. I do not allow my players to read Chat.

[Jasmine Bullar]

I think mine do, but not like I tell them not to. I'm like, don't read Chat. Like, even I, like, I struggle to go back and read stuff because I used to do it when we started, and I was like, I missed that. Or I missed that. Now I'm kind of like, you know what? If I miss stuff, it's okay. Like, it's fine.

[Mark Holmes]

Well, I feel like when you read chat, this syndrome will pop up, especially if you're working with a lot of other twitch talent where they want to

[Jasmine Bullar]

play to the audience, and it's like, no play.

[Mark Holmes]

Yeah, they want to, like, there's a little showmanship, or they want to be quippy, and they want to, like, curry favor with the audience. And so they don't stay as true to their characters. They'll pop out of character to do something that they know the audience will like. Because you do take it really personally when you're sitting here and you're reading Chat, and everyone's just like, I love this person, but I hate this true neutral character because they're boring or they're evil or blah, blah, blah.

[David Nett]

I really worry about technologies like Roll20 and what they do to the game, because the joy of the game for me is the freedom of the game. And if I have to spend a bunch of time beforehand building maps and putting pogs on maps and trying to prep for the session, and then the characters go around that, which is one of my favorite things, and I'm left on my heels. It seems like that technology almost limits me, and I wonder if you guys have experienced that technology and used it, because I haven't doubted that fear I have.

[Mark Holmes]

I will say that after doing both.

[Sponsor Voice 1]

Greetings, adventurers. Time for a quick lore drop. Did you know that I used to be a bank teller? That's true. In a previous life, I sat behind a desk in my shirt and tie, and I mostly gave people the state quarters they were asking for. Is that dating myself? That was during a period of time where it was very important that people had the exact state quarters that they needed at any given time. But doing that taught me a valuable lesson. Not that People were absolutely bonkers for quarters. But it taught me what I liked and did not like about a bank. Things that I like are banks that are built for you. Things that I don't like are banks that charge you overdraft fees, monthly fees and are really just trying to nickel and dime you so you can't even get your quarters. See what I did there? And that's why I was stoked to learn about Chime. Chime is changing the way that people bank. It is fee free smarter banking built for you. Not like old school banks that charge you things like overdraft and monthly fees. It's built for you. And Chime isn't just another banking app. They unlock smarter banking for everyday people with products like MyPay giving you access to up to $500 of your paycheck anytime and getting paid up to two days early with direct deposit. Some old banks still don't do this. So no overdraft fees, no minimum balance fees, no monthly fees. Chime turns everyday spending into real rewards by making your spending work harder. And they can bank fee free. You have overdraft coverage that you can count on. You can build credit history stress free. You get paid when you say up to $500. You can earn up to 3% APY on savings, which is by the way seven times higher than a traditional bank. And it's rated five stars by USA Today for customer service which means you can talk to real humans 247 with which honestly thank goodness now they also have a product called the Chime Card. A way to build credit history with your own money and get rewarded every single time. There's no annual fees, no interest and no strings attached. And when you get qualifying direct deposits, you get 1.5% cash back on eligible Chime card purchases. Now this is something that I wish I had known about when I was younger because it sounds like the perfect solution for me, especially if I had just been starting out in my career. But honestly, it just seems like a no brainer upgrade to a smarter fee free way to manage your money from the get go. Now Chime is not just smarter banking. It is the most rewarding way to bank period. Join the millions who are already banking fee free today. It takes just a few minutes to sign up. Head to chime.com criticalrole that's chime.com criticalrole

[Sponsor Voice 2]

Chime is a financial technology company, not a bank. Banking services a secured Chime Visa credit card and MyPay line of credit provided by the Bancor Bank N.A. or Stride Bank N.A. myPay eligibility requirements apply and credit limit ranges $20 to $500. Optional and products may have fees or charges. See chime.com feesinfo advertised annual percentage yield with Chime plus status only. Otherwise 1.00% APY applies. No min balance required. Chime card on time payment history may have a positive impact on your credit score. Results may vary. See chime.com for details and applicable terms.

[Sponsor Voice 1]

Greetings adventurers. You know who my favorite character in Beauty and the Beast is? I know that's the question you thought I was gonna ask you. Well, the answer is Madame Wardrobe. She's strong, she's tough and she's fearless. She has no qualms about diagnosis, diving off the top rope to save the day. And that got me thinking about my own wardrobe. What pieces do I own that would make me feel strong and fearless and like I could tackle anything? Well, it starts with something that mixes well but also lasts a long time. And that is where a company like Quint's really shines. Premium fabrics considered design and everyday essentials that feel effortless to wear and dependable even as the seasons change. Because Quint has the everyday essentials I love with quality that lasts Lightweight cashmere sweaters, short sleeve Mongolian cashmere polos, linen bottoms and shorts, tees and 100% Pima cotton and European jersey linen. These are the versatile pieces that make a wardrobe actually work season to season, whether or not someone you know got turned into a piece of furniture. Quint's works directly with top factories and cuts out the middlemen. You're not paying for brand markup or fancy retail stores, just quality clothing clothing. The cashmere is 100% Mongolian, the same stuff that luxury brands use. The Pima cotton is long staple and that means it stays soft and doesn't pill. The European jersey linen is breathable and lightweight. Everything's built to hold up to regular wear and it still looks good. Their clothing is rated between 4.5 and 5 stars by thousands of people wearing it every single day. And they only partner with factories that meet rigorous standards for craftsmanship and ethical production. Now that cashmere polo sweater. I wear it way more than I thought I would because it looks good. It feels expensive, but it's actually quite affordable. So stop over complicating your wardrobe. You don't need a closet full of options. You need a few pieces that actually work no matter what. So right now go to quints.com criticalrole for free shipping and 365 day returns. That's a full year to build your wardrobe and and love it. And you will now available in Canada too. Don't keep settling for clothes that don't last. Go to Q u I n c-e.com criticalrole for free shipping and 365 day returns. Quints.com criticalrole

[Narrator/Advertiser]

yes, online shopping is quite literally at our fingertips, but that doesn't mean it's always simple to buy. Whether it's trying to remember one of a million different logins so you can actually place your order, or getting almost all the way through checkout before realizing your card is nowhere near you, there are many hiccups that can get between you and placing that order, which is why it's such a relief when you see that purple pay button that has all of your information saved, making checkout as simple as a tap of your screen. That iconic purple shop pay button is why Shopify has the best converting checkout on the planet. Meaning less carts going abandoned and more sales going to you. Shopify is the commerce platform behind millions of businesses around the world and 10% of all e commerce in the US from household names like Thrive Cosmetics, Gymshark and Allbirds to brands just getting started. And they're not just great at converting sales. If people haven't heard about your brand yet, Shopify can help you find your customers with easy to run email and social media campaigns. And they have world class expertise in everything from managing inventory to international shipping to processing returns and beyond. Tackle all of those important tasks from one place, making your life easier and your business operations smoother. See less carts go abandoned and more sales go with Shopify and their Shop Pay button. Sign up for your $1 per month trial today at shopify.com realm go to shopify.com realm that's shopify.com realm

[Mark Holmes]

there are pluses and minuses and one of the big pluses to doing it in person is you feed off of each other so much and eye contact is so big in role play.

[David Nett]

So what would need to happen for a remote system to work like that for you? Because I feel the same way. But again, I'm super old.

[Mark Holmes]

Yeah, well, I don't know. I don't know how you feel. To me it does feel really static because you're looking at a webcam you're not looking at into somebody's eyes and making that connection. Small things like even rolling the dice physically, that's a cool feeling. And clicking a button just never feels as equal.

[David Nett]

It's important I have my oh I

[Jasmine Bullar]

like the fact that you brought yours, like I have mine with me whenever

[David Nett]

anything important is happening. This is from when I was 12. This is my first. Not my first D20, but one of my oldest. Yeah.

[Jasmine Bullar]

Oh my goodness, that's amazing.

[David Nett]

You guys were important to me, so

[Mark Holmes]

I brought that one.

[Jasmine Bullar]

Oh, that's amazing.

[David Nett]

Man.

[Jasmine Bullar]

I feel bad now.

[David Nett]

Why do you feel bad now?

[Jasmine Bullar]

Roll20 is a fantastic tool for four people that just cannot physically get together. What will really change it for me is VR. Like having that headset and being able to go around a table and. Yeah, maybe the DM can do fancy stuff with miniatures and you can zoom in and all that stuff. But just being able to be immersed around a table and there are my friends and maybe they're dressed up as their characters or whatever. That's cool. Like, I think that would be super awesome. Just to make it a bit more, you know. Yeah. Engaging. Like, I think you're right. Like it's just too easy to be distracted and not feel connected to those players.

[Mark Holmes]

There was like a video floating around the Internet of like that table surface where you could put a map on it and you could put your players.

[David Nett]

Are you excited about the idea of that? So I was just gonna ask, is there something that you're really hoping will happen?

[Mark Holmes]

That, that for me would be. That would be great. I would love to be able to.

[David Nett]

Even with the prep work you would have to do as a game master in order to make that work.

[Mark Holmes]

I think the immersion would be worth it, you know.

[Jasmine Bullar]

Yeah. And I think for me, like, if I'm gonna do like that big epic scene anyway, I have to put that prep in now regardless.

[Mark Holmes]

I'll.

[Jasmine Bullar]

I'll print out a map on poster paper or I'll draw it out, or I'll buy the miniatures and set it all up to be able to do that on a PC much faster. Like being able to just have pre done tiles that I can snap together and then I can put a miniature down and like fire erupts around it if I click a spell card or something like that, that's amazing.

[Mark Holmes]

For me, I am so hyped for the stuff that's coming because I look around and I realize board games are taking off and our pen and paper RPGs are gonna be right behind them. And Open Legends. Huge success on Kickstarter. People are playing pen and paper and tabletop RPGs and just tabletop games in a way that they weren't before. There's been this like a renaissance or a resurgence and these really Great board games are coming out and people are buying them. And that's amazing. I think 10 years ago we probably wouldn't have seen that. Now people are playing like Pandemic and just like, games are so much more accessible.

[Narrator/Advertiser]

Right.

[Mark Holmes]

And what that's done is it's brought money into the stuff that we love. And when you bring in money, great things happen because suddenly you're getting products developed for you that weren't there before. And it's going to make your job as a gm, it's going to make getting creative better and easier, and you're going to be able to do stuff you weren't able to do before. And that makes me so excited. And on Hyper, we have a biotech show called Death from above. They 3D print their mechs. And so when your mech's arm gets blown off, they literally crack, honestly, 3D printing.

[David Nett]

So that's one of the technologies that I have found has enhanced my game because my players and I are fairly old school. But there's a. Oh, gosh, I've forgotten the name of the company now that does the 3D printed custom miniatures.

[Mark Holmes]

Right. I know.

[Sponsor Voice 1]

It's exactly Heroforce.

[David Nett]

Thank you. This last time that my high school group and I got together, you know, the old Fogies gaming club, i3D printed all their characters, custom characters for all of them, and brought them to the game. And that's, you know, the going through, going to a store and hoping, you know, again, when I was starting and we didn't do a lot of strategic, you know, miniatures play, we were playing 1E and 2E. And it was all what they call theater of the mind now, which makes me kind of vomit. But it was all in our imaginations. You know, we didn't play a lot with minis, but we had minis of our characters to show marching order and all that stuff. But you go to the game store and you hope that there's something roughly like the character you're playing.

[Mark Holmes]

Yeah. You just settle with anything.

[David Nett]

Yeah. And if you're creative, there's definitely not happening. But to be able to go there and to create Your character and 3D print not only the character, but the pose that you want, the attitude that you want, and a smile or a frown. That's amazing.

[Mark Holmes]

And we're getting all this, like, media that's talking about it and getting the conversation started, and that's inspiring people to get into it as well. And I'm sure there will be some bumps along the way. Whenever something becomes mainstream, it goes through its growing pains. And we'll probably have some crappy stuff produced along the way.

[David Nett]

We've had a couple of bad D and D movies.

[Jasmine Bullar]

I was gonna say, like, I think actually, you know what? People are kind of. They can appreciate it, and they can see that, actually, you can make some good stuff.

[David Nett]

What is the tip that you give to new Dungeon Masters? What is the advice that you guys give coming up when you did, learning to play when you did?

[Mark Holmes]

For me, it's that I feel like often there's an antagonistic relationship between the GM and the players, and so often groups have trouble finding a gm. And for me, I'm the opposite. And I always. I encapsulate my GM style as, like, the kid from Stranger Things. Like, you know how when they're fighting the Demogorgon, he's like, oh, and the Demogorgon does. He's not mad that they killed this creature he made. He is excited.

[Jasmine Bullar]

He cheers with them.

[Mark Holmes]

That is me. I cheer with the players. I cry with the players. I am with the players, and I want to see them succeed. And it's my job to tell their story. It's not their job to play out my story.

[Jasmine Bullar]

Yeah, I think, like, my general advice kind of follows the same thing of, like, start small. Start with a town. What makes it interesting? What makes this somewhere that your adventurers want to go, that makes the heroes want to explore? You know, what about it makes it unique?

[David Nett]

I think the other thing that I recommend to new players, that has always been my advice, is that they read a lot. I think as a Dungeon Master, one of the best tools that you have is a whole bunch of story references at your fingertips, whether it's reading a lot or watching a lot of movies or whatever. Because whatever shit that your players throw at you, whatever crazy thing they decide to do, that was not what you expected. If you have a bunch of stories at your disposal, whether it's things that you've written or things that you've read or movies that you've seen or TV shows that you've watched, you just have a. That's your toolbox in a lot of ways. As a storyteller, that's your toolbox. And you can throw things at them and pull things out of them.

[Jasmine Bullar]

And it's funny because I get people that say, like, I want to do something like this from this show, but I don't want to just rip it off. It's like, that's okay. You can change a few things here and there. But, yeah, at the end of the day. Whether you're a GM or DM or whatever, or a writer or a TV script, we're world builders. That's what you're doing.

[David Nett]

And there's a reason that whether it's Dungeons and Dragons or whether it's Shadowrun or the World of Darkness games in almost all of those game books, they give you a reference reading list in there. This is what inspired us. This is what can inspire you. There's a reason that shit's there. Whether it's video games or books or movies or TV informs the way you understand story. What I love about all that is that regardless of we all started at different times playing, regardless of when you started playing, regardless of what your references were that got you playing. The advice that you guys were just talking about is very similar to the advice that I give coming from, again, 30 years of playing Dungeons and Dragons. The underlying fundamental realities are the same. Have fun. It's not just your story, it's everybody's story. You know, those things remain the same. And that's to me, that's really beautiful. And that

[Mark Holmes]

gave me the feels over here. Close your eyes. Exhale. Feel your body relax. And let go of whatever you're carrying today. Well, I'm letting go of the worry that I wouldn't get my new contacts in time for this class. I got them delivered free from 1-800-contacts. Oh my gosh, they're so fast.

[Jasmine Bullar]

And breathe.

[Mark Holmes]

Oh, sorry. I almost couldn't breathe when I saw the discount they gave me on my first order. Oh, sorry. Namaste. Visit 1-800-contacts.com today to save on your first order.

[Sponsor Voice 3]

1-800-contacts this episode is brought to you by Athletic Brewing Company. No matter how you do game day, on the couch, in the crowd, or manning the snack table, Athletic Brewing fits right in with a full lineup of non alcoholic beer styles you can enjoy bold flavors all game long. No hangovers, no buzz, no subbing out for water in the second half. Stock the fridge for tip off with a variety of non alcoholic craft styles. Available at your local grocery store or [e-mail] your beer fit for all times.

[Sponsor Voice 4]

My dad taught me a lot, including how easy it is to forget to cancel things. So I downloaded Experian, my bff. Big financial friend. Experian could help me cancel my unused subscriptions and lower my bills, saving me hundreds a year. Get started with the Experian app today. Your big financial friends here to help you. Results will vary. Not all bills or subscriptions eligible. Savings not guaranteed. $631 a year. Average savings with one plus negotiations and one plus cancellations paid. Membership with connected payment account required. See experian.com for details.

[Jasmine Bullar]

Experian.