Curse of: America’s Next Top Model
Episode: Introducing — Smart Girl Dumb Questions
Release Date: November 21, 2025

Episode Overview

This episode of Curse of: America’s Next Top Model departs from the usual exploration of reality television’s legacy to introduce listeners to the new podcast Smart Girl Dumb Questions, hosted by Naima Raza. Naima shares a sample of her show, specifically a candid and deeply insightful conversation with acclaimed psychotherapist and relationship expert Esther Perel. Together, they tackle the evolving complexities of love, gender roles, feminism, and how social changes have upended our ideas of relationships and selfhood.

Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. How Modern Life Complicates Love and Identity

(02:57 – 06:11)

• Naima Raza sets up the conversation by sharing her own “confused” experience, caught between traditional and modern value systems.
• Esther Perel notes, “You are constantly translating between different value systems. There’s a lot of certainty here, very little freedom. There’s a lot of freedom here and very little certainty. Because everything now has to be negotiated, right? Everything that was a rule has become a conversation.” (04:13)

2. Shifting Foundations: From Duty to Authenticity

(05:16 – 07:36)

• Esther observes the evolution from relationships built on “duty and obligation, by loyalty and community” to those defined by “feelings rather than values and by personal authenticity.” (05:21)
• Many people, especially in the West, now straddle both worlds, encountering increased ambiguity and self-doubt.

3. The Realities of Feminism’s Advances

(06:58 – 09:28)

• Naima asks, “Has feminism fucked us?”—prompting Esther to reflect on the multi-generational process of change:
  • “Every time I want to be critical of feminism, I only have to think about the places where women have zero voice or power or protection.” (07:47)
  • Esther traces generational shifts from a mother working tirelessly with no complaint, to women expecting partnership, to her own “designer generation,” which aims to create custom-fit relationships but struggles to know its own desires.

4. Marriage: From Cornerstone to Capstone

(09:28 – 10:18)

• The guest highlights a statistical and philosophical shift in the United States: “In the 60s, 80% of people in their 20s…were married. Today, 20% of people in their 20s are married.” (09:28)
• Marriage has shifted from a starting point to a finishing touch after self-development—creating greater focus on partnership as validation of hard-won identity.

5. The Overemphasis on Self

(10:18 – 11:03)

• Perel critiques “a bit too much self in front of every word…self love, self care.” (10:22)
• When Naima asks what word she’d prefer, Esther simply replies: “Other.” (10:28)
• The conversation explores the value of obligation—how it can “give,” rather than simply “take,” and how it’s undervalued in modern Western culture obsessed with authenticity.

6. Loneliness and the Loss of Relational Models

(11:03 – 12:35)

• Esther links today’s loneliness crisis to a lack of focus on relational obligation and interdependence.
• Naima, as someone connected to obligation via cultural roots and family, finds herself uniquely positioned to explore these tensions.

7. Masculinity, Feminism, and Social Change

(12:35 – 14:01)

• The two discuss whether there’s been a “masculinity revolution” comparable to feminism, concluding that the change for men has been spottier and more rigid, and would benefit from systematic reflection and new narratives.
• Esther: “Men have not had [a revolution] in as systematic a way… the restrictions are much stronger on the men.” (13:58)

8. The Allure of Nostalgia and Trad Wife Trends

(14:30 – 17:37)

• Naima brings up the rise of “tradwife” (traditional wife) trends and nostalgia for defined gender roles.
• Esther explains how times of rising authoritarianism rekindle rigid gender structures, providing “structure, order,” and the comfort of knowing “everyone knows their place.” (17:37)
• Perel: “Wherever you have rises of authoritarianism… it is accompanied with a redefinition of rigid gender roles…Because if you redefine the role of the woman, you redefine the role of the men.” (16:25)

9. Commodification of Love and Sex – “Emotional Capitalism”

(18:20 – 20:45)

• The hosts dissect the “materialist” dating trend, where people are evaluated like stocks (height, salary, etc.).
• Esther: “There is something about that in our culture…consumerism marrying romanticism, becoming romantic consumerism…It’s emotional capitalism.” (18:43–18:59)
• Dating is increasingly transactional, and the boundaries between psychological terms and business practices have blurred, with authenticity and vulnerability adopted as business buzzwords even as romantic relationships are increasingly hedged, negotiated, and commodified.

10. The Alienation of Swiping Culture and Technology

(20:04 – 20:36)

• Esther critiques the way dating apps and disembodied interaction make people forget “there’s actually a human being on the other side.”
• Naima brings up the rise of AI romantic relationships, hinting at a future where “maybe there won’t be a human being.”

11. A Cliffhanger on Romance Across Decades

(20:36 – 20:52)

• Naima poses the question: “Would you rather date in 1985 or 2025?”
• Esther’s answer is withheld, teasing listeners to catch the rest on Smart Girl Dumb Questions.

Memorable Quotes & Attributions

• “Everything that was a rule has become a conversation.”
  — Esther Perel (04:13)

• “Authenticity and to be true to ourselves is not an easy thing to come by.”
  — Esther Perel (08:13)

• “Marriage has shifted from cornerstone to capstone… You come to help me preserve my hard won identity.”
  — Esther Perel (09:56)

• “A bit too much self in front of every word, I would say.”
  — Esther Perel (10:22)

• “Other… I think that the overemphasis on the self is not necessarily helping us at this point.”
  — Esther Perel (10:28)

• “Obligation is not hot at this moment… It’s not popular.”
  — Esther Perel (11:03)

• “Women have had about 50, 60 years of examining their lives and their position… men have not had it in as systematic a way.”
  — Esther Perel (13:34)

• “Trad wives is very clear… it brought a sense of structure, order. Everyone knows their place.”
  — Esther Perel (17:37)

• “You have consumerism marrying romanticism, becoming romantic consumerism… It’s emotional capitalism.”
  — Esther Perel (18:43)

• “In the midst of that, we’re going to somehow find love. But we are bringing in an enormously transactional… What will satisfy me, what is on my list?”
  — Esther Perel (20:04)

Important Timestamps

• 02:22 – 02:57: Naima Raza introduces Smart Girl Dumb Questions and guest Esther Perel.
• 04:13: Perel on negotiating between value systems and the paradox of freedom vs. certainty.
• 05:21 – 06:05: Shift from duty and obligation to authenticity in relationships.
• 07:36: “Designer generation” and generational changes in women’s roles highlighted.
• 09:28 – 10:18: Discussion of marriage trends and identity.
• 10:22 – 10:28: Over-indexing on “self” vs. “other.”
• 13:34 – 13:58: Masculinity’s lack of a parallel revolution to feminism.
• 16:25 – 17:37: The connection between authoritarianism and traditional gender roles.
• 18:43 – 18:59: “Emotional capitalism” and the commodification of relationships.
• 19:04 – 20:36: Dissecting cultural trends like materialist dating and swiping culture.

Conclusion

This episode offers a complex, nuanced look at the conflicting forces shaping today’s relationships, gender roles, and sense of self. Estimable guest Esther Perel, with host Naima Raza, supplies listeners with wisdom both personal and universal—raising more questions than answers, in the best possible way. The sample of Smart Girl Dumb Questions promises in-depth, challenging, and refreshingly candid discussions for listeners craving context and clarity in a chaotic cultural moment.

For listeners intrigued by these thought-provoking themes, full conversations and more await on Smart Girl Dumb Questions.