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A
My name is Mackenzie and I started a GoFundMe for the adoptive mother of a nonverbal autistic child. The mother had lost her job because she wasn't able to find adequate care for this autistic child. So she really needed some help with living expenses, paying some back bills. So I launched a GoFundMe to help support them during this crisis. And we raised about 10, $10,000 within just a couple of months. I think that the surprising thing was by telling a clear story and just like really being very clear about what we needed, we had some really generous donations from people who were really moved by the situation that this family was struggling with.
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GoFundMe is the world's number one fundraising platform, trusted by over 200 million people. Start your GoFundMe today at gofundme.com that's gofundme.com gofundme.com this podcast is supported by GoFundMe. Dan Bernstein Unfiltered Unfiltered on 312 Sports DBU on 312 what a wild news period this has been. Everything. All hell kind of broke loose as we were leaving the studio after doing our three pods yesterday and a bunch of basketball news. Lots going on in baseball. Everything is happening. We are brought to you in partnership with my bookie and first and foremost, top story is the 312 Sports Busted Bracket Challenge has concluded. We of course thank Giordano's pizza. Your bracket may bust your Giordano's pizza shouldn't get your watch party lineup delivered. Pick up@giordano's.com gameday the first place winner, a $250 Giordano's gift card, a Wilson Evo NXT game ball, the official basketball of NCAA March Madness. That goes to Matt that picked 48 of 63 games correctly. Second place, the $100 Giordano's gift card goes to Michael Johnson who picked 45 of 63. Third place, a $50 Giordano's gift card. Justin Maynard just one game behind, 44 out of 63 Bears kicker, right? No, that would be Brad Maynard who is a Bears hunter. But I don't maybe a relative. I don't know the Maynards, they're smart people. I know Brad was great at like working the clock and doing all that stuff and he's apparently does very well financially as well with some of that stuff. So yeah, the specialists have time to do other things rather than just run around and smash into things. So congrats to Matt, to Michael and to Justin and thanks to Giordano's thanks for participating in the busted bracket challenge. The big story yesterday was the purge of the Bulls front office with Michael Reinsdorf putting his name on the press release and his quotes on the press release basically saying six years and no conceivable path to a championship has made it the end of the road for Arturis Karnashovas and for Mark Eversley. We did do an emergency OWC pod. I hate that term. It's not an emergency pod, it's a pod. And we did that yesterday when we heard the news. And I have been talking to people since we. What I understand is what I heard yesterday, that this was a long time coming. It was exacerbated by the Jaden Ivey fiasco. This clearly was, if nothing else, the final straw in many missteps that have put the Bulls in an impossible situation. They're not bad enough to get a high pick. They're not good enough to matter. They are stuck in NBA hell. That's where they exist at the moment. There are going to be changes that are going to occur. The key now is what does Billy Donovan want to do and want to be so even after getting answers to some questions, I have more questions and it has to do with the difference, or lack thereof between job titles and the effective realpolitik of whatever situation you choose. It is my understanding that Billy Donovan remains highly valued by the Bulls. And again, this is a lot of this. I'm not going to tell you what my preference is or what I think are best practices. I'm going to tell you what I know about the current Bulls. Billy Donovan wants to coach somewhere he does not want at the moment. He has no desire to take the Brad Stevens route and be a suit and work in offices and look at a computer screen and. Or fly around the world scouting players are being in charge of that procedure. He is, he is a coach at this point in his career. I believe that. I've always looked at his, his idol, his mentor, other than his late father is Rick Pitino. And when you see Rick Pitino still on that bench, still MF and referees, still coaching, I look at a career path and I see, you know, Billy's no spring chicken either. He's 60 years old. I think if he had wanted to ascend to a different job, he probably could have and whatever. He's a Hall of Famer. The guy's a basketball hall of Famer. So it does lead me to believe that his desire would be at the moment to continue to coach, and that's
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C
to coach in the NBA.
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B
I think. I think he.
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C
Yeah, I don't believe he wants to.
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B
I think we would have known that.
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C
Yeah.
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B
However, the question now arises, if he wants to stay with the Bulls and the Bulls want him to stay, whether or not he changes his job title or even his job, he becomes the most powerful basketball side person on the Chicago Bulls, that it's. They could do a Bears here. And this is where we get into sort of the murky area of what I think is the right thing to do and what the Bulls might actually be doing. Because if I had to bet, my guess would be that it's not. I don't know if it's going to be a hard requirement that the new executives retain Billy Donovan as coach so much as it's going to be obvious from Jump because Billy Donovan might be involved in consulting or recommending these hires, in which case you have inverted the leadership of your organization, whether you intend to or not. If Donovan stays and there are new people nominally above him, you have told the world who your most powerful basketball voice and opinion is. That means your coach essentially would be viewed as running your team. And that's not necessarily bad. But you've got to be transparent about it. You can't be working across purposes. There was a time where the NFL went through this and the Bears were a team that went through this. And when Dave Wanstead was given personnel control because they had to, and Jimmy Johnson told him to ask for it. The old Bill Parcells thing, if you're gonna be the chef, you gotta pick the groceries, you gotta do the food shopping. If you're gonna be the chef. All those cliches that we've heard, and that's when you had Rod Graves out and Mark Hatley in, and Hatley had a title, but he functioned essentially as just trying to get Dave Wanstead what he wanted to complete his vision. Now, it wasn't a great vision and that it didn't work, it didn't fail
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C
because of that power structure.
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B
You may believe that if Billy Donovan says is the new executive VP of basketball operations, or maybe in a new structure, a different title, that if Donovan says, here's what I need. Here's the kind of players that are going to. Are going to work here. These are the types that I want. Now go get them, and I'm not going to interfere. You bring him here, you put them in uniform. I will develop them, I'll coach them up. I'll make it my goal to Win a title. But this is my wish list. I imagine it's not unworkable as long as everybody knows going in who is what.
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C
Right.
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B
That you can't bring in a Sam Presti type and then tell that person you can't fire the coach. Because the right way to do it is you put a person in charge of basketball operations and you say, go ahead and do it. This is all you. You can fire everybody, everybody. You want to fire everybody and everybody who works game days and completely make over the basketball side, go ahead and do it. But I don't think they're going to do that.
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C
No.
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B
Not if they're.
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C
If they're having a meeting, say Monday or Tuesday, next week with Billy Donovan and find out what he wants to do. If he wants to stay and be the head coach of the Bulls, you're not bringing someone in and giving them.
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B
He's going to fire him.
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C
Right. You're not. You're saying to this person you bring in, this guy's here now. I think it's more along the lines of what you said that Billy Donovan is going to say, here's what I need. Here's what I want. Go execute my plan. My desire. Is there someone in the organization now that they could put in that position that they already know?
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B
I don't think so. Okay. I don't think so.
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C
So you're gonna have to hire someone who's gonna have to say, yeah, I'll. I'll have this title, but I'm gonna defer to what the head coach wants me to do.
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B
And that is a very delicate situation politically. Small p. Not.
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C
Not impossible, though.
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B
It's not impossible.
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C
But does that bring the quality of person you want in your organization?
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B
It starts with ownership. That model can work if you have a powerful direction from the very, very top.
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C
And how so? Because. Just saying that. I don't feel that confident.
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B
I don't either.
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C
Okay.
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B
And no. And this is what I keep getting back to, and my gut feeling that I keep thinking about, of how it went down yesterday is I keep saying privately to people in my text messages and stuff, and I found myself repeating this text. I didn't think Michael had it in him. I didn't think Michael had it in him. That I didn't think that he would be like, that's enough. This isn't. Okay.
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C
And how do we know for sure it was only Michael?
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B
He put his name in the press release. He's in charge. There really isn't any. And he has people he consults. One of those is John Paxson. That John Paxson is in. I don't even know what his title is right now. Emeritus Advisor.
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C
So is Pax a guy? Because he was the name. I was thinking when I asked you that question, is he a guy? You slide into that role with the
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B
understanding of he doesn't want that work. No, no, I don't. I think that job is too hard right now. It is too involved. It's. It's a global job.
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C
Maybe, maybe, maybe he's the figurehead of it.
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B
He does a Bob Pulford because that's what that would be. Now we got our second, we got our second Chicago team comp here.
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C
Yeah.
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B
We're talking about the mistakes of the Bears and then that if Paxton were to reassume some kind of role, that becomes a Pulfordian move. I don't think he would actually put his name on it or do anything like that. But I do think he would continue to advise. Hell, for all I know, Doug Collins is still advising. He was hanging around Jim Paxton. There were a lot of people who have been in and out of the bull's orbit in unofficial capacities. So I think this is going to take time to figure out. And that's because Michael's just not a hoops guy. And that's what happens when the owner. And sometimes, sometimes you want an owner who doesn't fancy himself that powerful leader. This is. You need the steady hand of a well informed owner. And this is a defining time for Michael Reinsdorf. This is it. It wasn't just the Karnashova's hire because he tried and he took it over and that was his first hire. And I think that's why he stuck with it for six years when it was clear to a lot of people that this was not working, this wasn't going in any other, any direction. But whoever it may be, my hope is that that person is more available, that person is more transparent. And I like ak. Nice guy, really nice guy. Every time I've been around him. He's funny, he's nice, he's personable, he's a good dude. But he just wasn't available enough or transparent enough in his executive capacity. I don't know what Mark Eversley ever did.
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C
So that's interesting you say that about AK because like personable and friendly nice doesn't come across. It never came out in the interactions, not interactions in, in what I've heard from him. It just. He doesn't seem like he had much to offer.
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B
No.
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C
Which is too Bad.
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B
Well, he was very guarded and English is not his first language.
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C
Yeah.
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B
Which is fine, even with the facility that he has. But I think whoever is next in this position just has to just not only just be better at all the, all the stuff and be better at understanding where the league is going, how the game is being played, the kind of athletes you need and what you're. And have a clear vision of what you're trying to do. You can't just be. Trying to be compete and have a. Be competitive and have a winning culture. You have to have that goal of winning titles and figure out how you're gonna get there and who fits in and not make everything kind of matter after the fact.
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C
So this type of structure, it can work. Do you, as someone who loves to watch the Bulls and the NBA, do you think that they should bring someone in that has full autonomy to do whatever they want? Or is this the right route to say we're going to retain Billy, Billy wants to stay. You inherit Billy, period.
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B
I hate telling a new executive that you're working for the coach, but you can establish that. You can. You know, I think the. If you want to look at how Greg Popovich and R.C. buford work together, that there are, there are ways to do it. Obviously you've got. This goes back to Jackson and Krause. It really does. When Phil Jackson was more powerful for a long time than Jerry Krause and that worked despite itself.
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C
Well, it worked because he had Michael Jordan.
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B
It worked because you had Michael Jordan and you had a unique confluence of personalities. You had an all time weirdo in Phil who for a lot of. In a lot of that weirdness was an ability to compartmentalize a lot of things that were going on. Because Jordan was the guy who could fight Jerry all the time. Right.
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C
You know, Phil would say he did publicly.
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B
Yes. And did publicly. And like that antagonism. Jordan could handle a lot of that antagonism because Jordan was, was content to be a jerk about it.
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C
Yeah.
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B
Phil was never as comfortable. Phil could be a jerk. He just was never as comfortable doing it publicly.
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C
Yeah, he wasn't going to do that publicly.
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B
Right. Kind of wearing that. And he did it passive aggressively and he did it through his representatives. So trust me, I know.
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C
What is, What's Donovan's contract situation?
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B
We don't know.
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C
Oh, we don't know what he, what he has.
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B
We don't know. We know there was, there were two secret extensions. We just know he's under contract.
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C
We discussed. That's all that's that's bizarre.
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B
Yes. Um, we don't know, but I just want this. You know, there's a way to thread this needle. I. I don't know if Michael is up to it. I don't know if he wants to really grab this thing or if he wants us. You know, he's got Paxton over this shoulder. He's got whoever he's calling, whoever he's talking to.
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C
Oh, by the way, Doug Collins has been serving as a Senior Advisor since 2017.
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B
Yes.
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C
I didn't realize that.
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B
Yeah, he was never taken off that list. There are still many of these sort of Bulls ghosts that are orbiting the airspace. And a powerful an owner can say, like, I'm not listening to you today. You're not a wartime conciliary, Tom. That there's somebody who's in charge and has advisors and knows how to use advisors and isn't just a vessel for the thoughts of competing advisors.
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C
All right, so you have, you have
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B
all the, all the parts.
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C
All the parts are in front of you. You're. You love the NBA, you love the Bulls. You want to see this team win championships. You, Dan Bernstein, what is, what is your preference? What's the route that you want, you would love to see the Bulls take?
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B
I would love for the Bulls to make sure they exhaust every option Right now at this point, the most important thing is take care of this draft. Who's running this draft? You've had all your scouts, scouting reports are in. A lot of the scouting's done by the time you get to the tournament. You know, you'll start, you'll do your workouts, you'll do your individual stuff. But there are a lot of, a lot of that board is starting to already come together and especially if somehow the Portland Trailblazers make the playoffs and you got another first round pick, right. And that you might be able to package or might be able to move up. You missed last year's draft. That's the thing that's fucking killing me in this is that had you timed this all out and really been prepared and didn't drag it into this year. That was the Cooper Flag draft. Last year you had a chance to, you know, Josh Giddy misses that shot against the Lakers, that half court shot. You're talking about different sliding doors here. So with the, you know, con canipple last year with Cooper Flag, this is a good draft this year and the more I've watched, it's a little better maybe than I thought initially, but I can get bogged down Talking about what I wish would have happened. And I like Billy Donovan. I don't know that he's earned the right to be in charge of this Bulls rebuild.
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C
Why not, though? You said he's a Hall of Famer.
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B
He is. He's never built a champion before. He's. And how many playoff series is he even made as an NBA coach?
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C
So here's what makes me pause a little bit is because they're already behind.
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B
They've been behind.
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C
They're already. I'm talking about for this draft. And you're not going to be able to get someone in place that you can have full confidence, can build a championship for this draft because that, that guy coming in, that executive that comes in should have full autonomy to blow out the entire organization if they want
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B
and say, these guys all suck.
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C
Everyone's got to go.
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B
As we talked about, I'm bringing in
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C
my own guys, the scout and like, you could be fucked for this draft.
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B
You shouldn't be, but you could be.
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C
You shouldn't be, but you could be.
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B
Well, the, it's, it even goes beyond that because as we discussed on OWC yesterday, we've been going through this season looking at how can somebody play with Giddy and Bou Zealous. And the new guy might be like, I'm not building a team around Josh. Giddey is, you know, he's. I can trade that contract. I can move. And, and, and the whole Modest Bouzelis thing. This next person would be like, I know AK loves the guy and they've got their, their Lithuanian connection and he feels strongly about the kid who's around Chicago. And yeah, he's good, but I don't know why everybody's so crazy about Modest Boozel. I'm getting this guy up out of here.
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C
Okay. I didn't want to go down in there because there's other. We're looking at the front office stuff and that's bigger picture right now. But for me, you, you don't have like to me. Okay, I think Josh Goodies are really good player. I think Buzzelis is a really good young player to me right now.
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B
They're.
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C
They're, they're the sixth guy coming off a bench.
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B
No, they're better than that. They're both better than that. Okay, well, they're, I think they can both be starters on a Titleist, but neither one is the guy.
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C
Okay, but if, okay, if they're the starter on a title team, they're your fifth starter. They are not. They're certainly not the Best guy on a championship team.
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B
No, I think.
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C
And they're not the number two guy on a championship team.
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B
I. Giddy can be if his. If his defense picks up a little bit. He does a lot of really interesting stuff with the way the game is going. He plays modern basketball. And I think Boozelis has improved three point shooting. I think they can both. They. I think they could both be part of it.
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C
Oh, yeah.
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B
But what I'm saying is I want whoever's running your team to disagree with me potentially and be allowed to disagree with me. Gone.
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C
Yeah. No, I agree.
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B
If you were to take over, you should be allowed to say, this isn't part of my vision.
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C
Right. So I think at best, Giddy could be a starter on a championship team, but he certainly isn't the guy. And he's my fifth starter. And either one of those guys I could see being a bench guy for sure.
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B
And I don't know.
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C
Really quality player.
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B
And I don't know if Billy Donovan. I see. Here's the thing.
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C
Does he feel that way?
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B
I don't know. He could be doing all this because he's been doing his job. So his job is to build what he can build out of the players he's been given. I don't know if deep down he gets home after work and he comes home and he puts his briefcase down and he sits on the couch and he pours himself a glass of wine and he's like, I can't win with these. I don't know. This team sucks. I don't know. I'm doing the best I can here. I don't know what he says to his wife when he comes home, but it may be that he doesn't. And this is when it's possible that an empowered owner gets everybody in a room. And a charismatic, empowered owner. And Michael Reinsdorf's a lot of things. He is not charismatic. No, I will say he's principled. And I think he's also a good guy. I don't think among. As billionaires go, I always say this. If it's a billionaire, presume the billionaire is awful until proven otherwise. You should always default to a billionaire being horrible. And if they're not, you're pleasantly surprised. And I would count Michael Reinsdorf in the group of people that were pleasantly surprised. I think he's a good person. I don't think he's a charismatic sports owner, but he would have to sit in a room and say, listen, you're the coach, you're the personnel executives. We're winning titles. Here. Here's what we're gonna do. Here's what we're gonna. It'd be okay to argue about. Here's what we're not arguing about. Here's what. Here's what rises the level of. Bring it to me. Here's what doesn't. But I need everybody in this room to be on the same page. And we are gonna. We are gonna disagree. We are going to. We're gonna have our fights, and that's okay. But we're gonna. We're gonna listen to each other. We are going to be open to different ideas.
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C
But
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B
you over here, you're in charge of this. You're in charge of this and establish it and know who does what. And the owner has to know exactly whether or not something's on the right track or wrong track and not just say, okay, I filled this position. I filled that position. And now I'm just gonna sit back. I would like a little more. If you've got all these advisors around you, if you got Doug Collins and John, the purpose of that, to be advisors to the ownership, is to empower that.
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C
Yeah.
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B
So get on the same page. Do you want to be dinner theater? You want to put on a show every night? You want to have Dabull or Benny or whoever it is? Does Da bowl still exist?
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C
I don't think so.
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B
No, it's Benny.
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C
Is he arrested? Yes.
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B
I think he's always there. I think it's the bit now, I think every game they bring him out, they arrest him, they throw him in jail, and then he's lost in the system, and then he becomes institutionalized and never gets out. And he gets out and he doesn't do well because the world moves too fast.
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C
And he can't get rehired by the Bulls because he's convicted felon. He can just run for president
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B
and he wins, Oddly enough. It's a long bit. It really is.
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C
It takes a long time.
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B
Yeah, it takes a long time. I would probably cut that back a little bit. So there. There are a ton of known unknowns. There are a ton of unknown unknowns right now. And I'll try to find stuff out the best I can, but at the moment, this is. I hope this is an opportunity for the Bulls to figure some things out. I believe Billy Donovan could play a role, but I wouldn't. I wouldn't necessarily say the future of the Chicago Bulls is tied inextricably, no matter what, to what Billy Donovan wants. You don't have to give him that power right now.
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C
Yeah, I agree with that. And you know, I know Michael Reinsorver has been in charge. So there's, there's two ways that I look at it. Number one is if he has been and has had full authority, why did it take six years?
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B
Because he doesn't like exercising the authority and he's not comfortable exercising the authority.
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C
Well, then do we know that? And, and we know that he's really had it, though. That's the whole point. Well, the. Yes.
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B
Like. Yes, we know for sure Michael's in charge. Yeah.
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C
Yeah.
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B
The biggest reason I honestly, the. This, this is an Occam's razor. The biggest reason why he didn't do this earlier is because he personally likes Arturis Karnashovas and wanted to give him every chance.
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C
Well, he gave him every chance.
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B
Exactly. He hung on too long.
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C
Yeah. He gave to.
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B
Maybe he trusted his friend for too long. Okay, that, that is the easiest, simplest, realest explanation about what happened. He didn't want to have to fire a guy he likes. And he kept hoping that things would just keep getting better when if anything, they were getting worse.
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C
Like it's, it's a really daunting task that lays before them. And you could agree with me or disagree with me and think that they, they need three starters, they need four starters. They could need five starters for a championship team. I mean, there's a lot. There's a lot.
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B
But don't even look at the micro right now. We can't because the draft is going to be. The macro is either Michael, run your. Run your team. You've got to run your team right now. At this day, today, Michael Reinsdorf has to do some things that he never really wanted to do before. Yeah.
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C
And you asked the question, though, does he have it in him to do it?
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B
Does he have it in him? My hope is if he has it in him to make this. You can't do this without being willing to try to rise to the occasion to do what's next.
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C
Eight, two years of contract. Forget the guys. Forget what I'm saying. Like he, he, he was able to see past that.
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B
It's the responsibility. It is, it is doing the work that it's. Now you gotta, you gotta. We gotta watch somebody own.
- [28:32]
C
Yeah.
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B
Right now we gotta watch somebody own. And it matters in the NBA in ways it manifests itself. And because of the personal relationships you have, there's so few are so powerful that the relationship between star player and owner individually, personally matters in the NBA in ways it doesn't in other businesses. I don't. I don't necessarily think that Tom Ricketts has to personally get along with Pete Crow, Armstrong. I don't necessarily know.
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C
The NBA is different. I.
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B
Right. I don't necessarily think that George McCaskey has to have that kind of relationship with Caleb Williams. The NBA is different because of the way the players are empowered and because of the nature of the culture of the game.
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C
And, well, also, what one player can
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B
do for your organization, period, matters more.
- [29:20]
C
Right.
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B
Your best player can have the ball every time and guard the other team's best player every time. No team should be more aware of that than the Bulls. When Derrick Rose kept running into LeBron James, that's that. It doesn't. It just doesn't matter. That's your best, and that's their best. Their best is going to be yours because he's twice the size and better. So the Bulls should know that. And this is a critical watershed time for the Michael Reinsdorf Bulls ownership. So the stakes are high, I would say. And whenever the stakes are high, My Bookie is where you turn your bets into bankroll. There's always a big matchup on the schedule. Everybody's watching. Everybody's got their hot take. No matter the sport, the props can be just as fun as the final score. And that's why my bookie is there. You know, I love the prop board. I'm always giving you something. I actually, I gave you something that wasn't a prop for DBU picks yesterday.
- [30:16]
C
That would have been stupid three pointer.
- [30:18]
B
That would have been Connecticut seven. And I stupid three that bounced off the glass. But did you see that leave his hand? He feathered that thing up. Little reverse cobra and boom, boom. Right in backspin. Perfect calls Glass. In it goes.
- [30:33]
C
He didn't call glass. He barely called stadium.
- [30:35]
B
I called. I called glass and won that bet. The My Bookie prop board. Deep fun to play. Player performances, game milestones, everything in between. The kind of action that keeps things interesting all game long. Get in. Right now, it's one account, one wallet. You can bet the spread live bet during the action, jump into the casino during halftime or between games. Everything lives in that one place. Go to MyBookie AG right now with the code DBU. Your first bet is covered up to 500 bucks. If it doesn't hit, you have the bet back, bonus token. That's why you use the code. You use dbu, you have the bet back, bonus token. And then it's like that missed bet never happened. It's all at MyBookie AG. Don't just watch the action. Make it pay with MyBookie. Congratulations to Michigan. Congratulations to Dusty May and his squad. That's how you do it now. And I think that's gonna be the example.
- [31:36]
C
Five transfers.
- [31:38]
B
It's not just five transfers. You paid over $10 million. And this is not an insult. I'm not saying, oh, they paid all this money.
- [31:45]
C
No, that's the landscape of college basketball.
- [31:48]
B
This is how you do it. You have a plan. This is pro basketball. You spend your money wisely, you make a budget, you find talent that fits what your coach wants to do. This is what we're talking about here. There's no difference between a lot of these jobs now. And this is why Mike Malone can go coach at Carolina. We'll get to that. But this is all pro basketball. They're wearing college names. But your champion of that, the champion of minor league pro basketball this year, American minor league pro basketball that isn't the G League, is the University of Michigan that happens to have that particular professional team. And that's what coaching is now in college. It's being able to put new guys together to know what you want. You need your personnel guy. You need your general manager to do the pro thing. Find players who fit what you want to do, coach them up, have some redundant pieces, know that you can weather some injuries because Linda Borg is hurt. I don't care what anybody says. They weren't talking about it enough last night.
- [32:58]
C
Oh, I thought they talked about it every.
- [33:00]
B
Okay, but he's hurt. Hurt. He. He's. He. He. He's hurt.
- [33:04]
C
Yeah, he was a. He was a soldier out there, though, man. Yeah, he was doing what he could.
- [33:08]
B
Set an example.
- [33:09]
C
But.
- [33:09]
B
But he was. They. They won a national championship with their best player hurt. That's a deep team. That's a hell of a coach. Now, let me also say Danny Hurley. And I still know him as Danny just because he was always Danny forever. And then he became Den. Same thing happened to me. He is a maestro. Dan Hurley is a genius of a coach. He may be a penis of a person, and I don't even know. Sometimes he cracks me up. His wife is hilarious. And I just. The whole Jersey thing. I'm a sucker for the whole Jersey thing. He can be really funny when he wants. He also can be annoying, pissy little weenie. But my God, can that guy coach. His offense is gorgeous. He. And he said it, too. When he told. When he. When he said during one of the breaks, he goes, yeah, we're able to make them have long possessions, we're having longer possessions. We're slowing the game down. We can make this the only kind of game we could possibly win. He said that in the middle of the game. Like that's the difference between basketball and oh, we got to block better, we got to tackle better and we got to block better and tackle better. Or they talk to the, you know, the baseball managers, you know. Well, we got to just. When we get our pitch, we just got to hit it. He is explaining his strategy to you in the middle of the game. Cause there's no hiding anything in basketball. There's no hiding anything. How about the fact Dusty May springs a full court press on him? And a well executed press. They got that corner trap. They even defended the middle of the floor. Because you coached before.
- [34:56]
C
Yeah, you gotta get to the middle of the pressure. You get to the corners, you're screwed.
- [34:59]
B
Where's your pressure release, big guy? Middle of the floor. And they broke that press the second time they saw it. They had it like they'd practiced against it. And I'm just watching like God damn it, this guy's on it. And if you notice the way that Hurley runs that, that zoom screen handoff, five out offense. It's matchup picking. They force switches.
- [35:24]
C
Yeah.
- [35:25]
B
And they switch and they switch and they switch until they get the switch they want. And they may take 30 seconds to
- [35:29]
C
do it, but they get there. Then they exploit it.
- [35:31]
B
But they're picking and picking. And Caravan is such a good college basketball player and he'll, he'll make some money playing overseas or stick on the back of an NBA rough shooting night
- [35:41]
C
his last, last couple of games. I know. Oh, no, no, no.
- [35:43]
B
There was something going on with that rim.
- [35:45]
C
Not to take. Oh, it wasn't always Mullins.
- [35:48]
B
It was working for Mullins at time it was Illinois. It was both halves of that game. They should check that out. That was a story. That rim on that end is a story. Yeah, I don't know what's going on down there with, with your spring load or whatever it is. Something was messed up with that rim. And I don't know what gamblers knew, but something was weird. And I'm not alleging anything, no skull duggery or anything. It's just, it's just random. It just happened. But I is the stuff that Hurley is doing in modern ball where when everybody's running five out, NBA teams are running it, it's all variations of the, the horns action, the three man Spain pick and roll, that there's a lot of these international actions that are being used where instead of every pick and roll being just two guys, there's a third guy involved. There's always going to allow for some kind of open shot and. Or a switch and a mismatch. You can't. You can't have. You have to pick one or the other. Either we're going to switch and there's going to be mismatches, or we're going to allow open shots.
- [36:53]
C
Right.
- [36:55]
B
You got to pick. There were. But Hurley did everything he could do. That was a. Michigan's way better. Michigan wins eight out of 10 times. They play nine out of 10. And he did everything he could do. Hurley did to make that one of. Make that the one.
- [37:12]
C
Yeah, yeah, it's right. So I haven't watched a whole ton of UConn basketball outside of the Illinois game and then last night, but watching the offense, it's really cool. I was trying to picture what I was picturing on the half court was a grid, you know, and. And he has. He has four guys in movement simultaneously. And the thing that I saw that happen a lot is you have four guys in a line, like in a grid, and to go one way, to go the other way, and then he start. Then you start to incorporate the grid going. Going east. West too, as well. So you might have two guys going one way, two guys going the other. Then one guy breaks off going east. But it was. It was like. I was just like picturing like a New York City grid.
- [37:51]
B
If you squish transportation grid.
- [37:53]
C
And it's like those are the lines and those are the movements. One guy has the ball, four guys are moving. It's just. It was really. It's really interesting.
- [38:00]
B
Well, what's fascinating is when you add into that. That's a. That's an interesting observation on your part.
- [38:05]
C
Yeah.
- [38:05]
B
Looking at it sort of generally, yeah, you do get that. But what really defines it and when you have a team that understands it and feels it, it's when the diagonals come like you. That's your basic. But when you get a weak side dive cut that comes in at an oblique angle that's wide open because of the. You lull a defense into a rhythm a little bit too. When you're going to use 28 seconds on the shot clock to try to slow the game down and people are like, you're calling out a good def. Gets tiring mentally and physically because you're calling out on your left, switch it. On your right, switch it. I got it. I Got it. And just say who's covering who? And by the time you're like, okay, he's going here, he's going here, he's going here. Then a guy puts his hand up and slices in at an angle you're not expecting. That's exactly how it's designed.
- [39:05]
C
Yeah. Because if you have two guys in the middle at the top, like at the three point line, two guys on the outsides in the corners.
- [39:11]
B
And there's two horns and they call horns. And there's those two guys up top.
- [39:15]
C
Those two corner guys go, go north. The two guys at the top of the key go south. And then you break that one guy in the corner diagonally. He's not running off one screen, he's running off two screens. Double right. And so it's just, it's, it's really, there's a really great movement if you, if you just watch the guys moving without the ball. It's really pretty to watch.
- [39:33]
B
It is.
- [39:33]
C
And you can see. So. But then the coach of me was thinking, how frustrating is that to. To teach though? Like, to get that in practice in great rhythm.
- [39:44]
B
Well, you also. That's why Hurley has a reputation as being one of these borderline old school abusive guys. I'm gonna say he's hitting people or raft bombing people, but I could imagine
- [39:54]
C
the screaming, which is why his voice is destroyed.
- [39:57]
B
And when you heard later in the game, you heard, I think it was Raftery talking about when they choose their players, it's the buy in. And it has to be somebody who understands what we're doing. Like what this is about. Oh, yeah, yeah, for sure. That's what they're talking about. They're talking about the drilling and the ropes.
- [40:17]
C
You're gonna run your ass off.
- [40:19]
B
You're gonna be. If you're gonna do that, you've gotta out condition everybody. And they said that too during the game. You get tired playing Yukon and that idea people talk about. It's not people jumping over your back that wears you down. It isn't people setting hard screens that wears you down. It's having to keep running and moving and never stop. And always thinking that this is just this relentless mechanism that is that you're gonna have and you're gonna have to actually keep executing every single time. And once they, Once you turn your head and that cut comes and the big guy gets you sealed.
- [40:59]
C
Yeah. Because you can't fuck up where you're supposed to be.
- [41:01]
B
But you got to make your free throw, but. And then you can't turn it over.
- [41:04]
C
You could take those double screens too and then you have variations of it. Are you going over the top or underneath and then you go over the top on both or do you go over the top on one, then underneath on the other and breaks that guy
- [41:14]
B
who is in split it.
- [41:15]
C
But you split it. But then you go from one corner to the other corner and then the other guy that's going north gets the ball and then you're wide open for a three in the corner. I mean it's just all the variations to it to know where you have to be, when you have to be there. It's just, it's, it's really intricate. It's really, it's really fun to watch.
- [41:30]
B
And the fact that Michigan was disciplined enough to do exactly that.
- [41:35]
C
Yeah.
- [41:36]
B
With a team of all guys that this, this coach didn't even see until the start of this year.
- [41:40]
C
Yeah. Because they were able to move, move defensively and around those screens really, really well.
- [41:46]
B
And when you have a guy seven three.
- [41:47]
C
Seven three doesn't hurt. Yeah, that, that doesn't hurt things.
- [41:50]
B
I'll call it right now lottery pick.
- [41:54]
C
Okay. Now I know going into it yesterday you talked about how well he moves and he does move pretty well for you got it. A guy seven three. But he's, he's not, he's not long
- [42:03]
B
term moving very well unless he's got foot problems.
- [42:06]
C
I don't know. Dud.
- [42:07]
B
He's, he, he's light on his feet. He's not a plotter. He's. I think he's a lottery pick.
- [42:14]
C
That's interesting because I like, I thought I saw like plotting attacks.
- [42:18]
B
No, he's got dancers feet at times.
- [42:21]
C
He did.
- [42:21]
B
But he's, he's a lottery. He looks like he's slow.
- [42:25]
C
He's.
- [42:26]
B
He's not so big. He's a poor man's. Kristaps Porzingis. That was Jason scouting report on him. We last night in the discussions I was in. I think he, I think he's a. Is he Sean Bradley? You know, Sean Bradley was not terrible. He played a long time average like 10 and 5.
- [42:43]
C
Yeah. If his, if his body allows him, he has potential to play for a long time. Whether it's Europe or here.
- [42:49]
B
Oh no, it's here. If he wants, he can pass. He's 7 3.
- [42:54]
C
I know, I know. I just, I may not be as high as you are on him, but
- [42:59]
B
he's better than Zach Edie right now. I was not high on Zach Edie because he couldn't move. But this is like Zach Edie with an ability to really move.
- [43:08]
C
Yeah. I just think he has, he could, he could, he could be really successful at a pro level. I just, it really. As long as you're not depending on him for a lot. I don't, I, I just don't see
- [43:19]
B
I'm going to have a difficult time if I, if I'm not saying top of the line ahead of debons.
- [43:25]
C
Yeah.
- [43:26]
B
Or Peterson or even Boozer or maybe Caleb Wilson. But I'm somebody the teams have passed on. I mean we're going to get 15 years from now or 12 years from now if he's healthy. Somebody's going to say why didn't an athletic 7 foot 3 guy go earlier in the draft? Yeah, it's sort of like with Luca would be like why didn't the MVP of the Euro League go first overall in a draft or go wherever, you know, go.
- [43:52]
C
Well, it certainly plays above the rim better than Boozer.
- [43:54]
B
Yeah, well Boozers a below the rim player. I mean that's just all there is. But I, I don't, I don't know why it's taken Mara this long to sort of rise up draft boards or maybe I'm wrong and I'm an idiot. That's certainly possible too. Quick note too that on the Mike Malone hire at UNC make all the jokes about how they have a type in their revenue generating sports but Mike Malone might just succeed there. What a, what a step. And what does it say about the big strokers in charge of the money at North Carolina to be willing to say we want a pro coach here because that is the most collegiate atmosphere for them to do. It tells you about the state of college basketball where the University of North Carolina wants a guy that won an NBA championship. I think it's great. I think it's great and I think it's good for basketball if the college game can, if you can just find the shooters because college game can be really hard to watch sometimes. But I think it's, it's good for the game. If you're looking for, hey man, we're going to, we're going to bring in pros here. We're going to treat them like pros. That's the other thing about Michigan I wanted to say. They carry themselves like professionals. Their body language is pro. They don't, they are, I mean Cadeau is, is emotional who played at Carolina.
- [45:14]
C
Yeah.
- [45:15]
B
But they're, I'll tell you that, that McKinney, I think he's staying in school. Trey McKinney yeah. Keep an eye on that dude. His, some of, some of what he is doing already is NBA. He's got an NBA body for sure. That's got. That guy's going to play too. So if he comes back next year, he's going to be a top five pick in next year's draft. But they carry themselves professionally and they should because they're wealthy professionals.
- [45:45]
C
I liked, I liked Johnson from Michigan.
- [45:48]
B
Yeah, I mean, he's, he's not going to be a star. He's, he's.
- [45:51]
C
I liked him though.
- [45:51]
B
You can bring him in off your bench and have him.
- [45:53]
C
Yeah, he's a guy. Get some files for you, get some rebounds.
- [45:56]
B
Yeah, he plays so hard.
- [45:58]
C
He does play hard. I like the way he played.
- [46:01]
B
Yeah, that, that, that, that's high motor. Dude who comes in, you're like, jesus, this guy's got 10 rebounds in a quarter.
- [46:07]
C
Yeah.
- [46:08]
B
So, yeah, there was, there was. There's a lot of good out there and it was, it wasn't the best played game in general, but that's college basketball and that's two good coaches and a lot of missed shots. It was very rough and a lot of missed shots.
- [46:21]
C
It was a very rough game.
- [46:23]
B
But it's been a good season and hope maybe Illinois can be that one that standing under the confetti next year. We'll see. It's going to be, it's a, it's going to be a tough climb for them. Boy, it's very basketbally today, but so be it because you know, you can get all the cuddle. I should mention if you weren't listening to off the Ivy.
- [46:43]
C
Oh, yeah, yeah.
- [46:44]
B
Let me just work the news on the news on Kate Horton's bad, real bad. That they, they all. They're telling us now they know more. They're not telling us more that there were the earlier reports. Jesse Rogers, our old buddy, saying that the MRI not clean. That means there's structural damage in that elbow. For their evaluation, he's going to go see Dr. Keith Meister down in Dallas. I don't know if he's a doctor in a cowboy hat, but he could be. He could be. And I, I would say don't. Do not expect Kate Horton back this year. Just don't. And I, My guess is he's. He's definitely out this year. And my other speculation would be that this is career.
- [47:27]
C
That's speculation. That's your guess? Let's just make that very clear. We haven't been told that or heard
- [47:32]
B
that or has been said based on likelihoods and percentages of a second Tommy John or the failure of a first Tommy John graft. Yeah, the success rate goes from 85 to 90% to closer to 65% to even be able to play ball again.
- [47:52]
C
I agree with you that he's done for this year. Again. Just made that very clear. We haven't heard that. It hasn't been reported. That's just what we're feeling about it. And if you are unaware of off the Ivy, which is our new Cubs podcast here at 312 sports releases every morning around 9:30. It's the first thing that we have released here in 312 sports Monday through Friday. Any special situations where there's breaking news will be there live as well, too. We did that last Friday after the Kate Horn injury when he was removed from the Indians game. So check out off the Ivy. Make sure that you're listening to that daily podcast as well for all your Cub stuff. We'll of course have have Cubs News and Cubs Talk here on DBU every day. But you really want to get into the nuts and bolts of the season. In each game, in each series. Make sure you check out off the Ivy. But Cade Horton being reevaluated after an MRI was not very clean. Further evaluation coming and he's seeing a specialist down in Texas. And we'll have more for that when when news comes out on Kate Horton. But remember, check out off the Ivy on 312Sports.
- [48:57]
B
You know what is going to be starting on Thursday and that is.
- [49:02]
C
I do. And I'm excited about that because you more coverage. Now.
- [49:05]
B
Where is it?
- [49:06]
C
It's on Prime.
- [49:08]
B
Okay.
- [49:08]
C
It starts off on prime and it gives you two extra hours of coverage.
- [49:13]
B
All right. I'll take all the coverage I can get. Agreed. So I was trying to think now that Rory has completed the career grand slam with his win at the Masters. We know he set the menu and everybody got to enjoy his sticky toffee pudding or whatever it was that. But the question now, now who is there as the next person you would just like to see win a Masters?
- [49:41]
C
I was interested.
- [49:42]
B
For whom are we rooting? Yeah.
- [49:43]
C
When we discussed it briefly before and I was curious to know what angle you were going with it. I hadn't thought about it, but when you said that name, that's the first name I would have thought of had I sat down to say who do I want to really see win now? Because for me it's I want to see Tiger win every single Masters, which obviously he's done Playing. I know, but that's where I was always at with Tiger. It's like, you want to see him do that? This the guy that you mentioned was probably the guy that I would say is number one on my list.
- [50:11]
B
For me, it'll never happen. Probably not, but Ricky Fowler. To me, Ricky Fowler is the guy that I would like to see it happen for. For whom I would like to see it happen. That would just be. The sentimental choice for me, would be Rickie Fowler. And maybe he'll have a great first day and be on the leaderboard. I don't know. I don't know if there's any magic left there. I thought he was on track to be one of these guys, and he just never was. I've always loved Tommy Fleetwood, but I kind of thought the fact that he won the FedEx cup last year for his first ever, and he almost blew it, and then he wins his first ever PGA tournament, happens to be the FedEx Cup. It's not a major, but I feel better for him now.
- [50:55]
C
Yeah.
- [50:55]
B
Like, that still kind of felt like a. Like a validation. It's a tough list. You know, it's. I like Max Homa, I like Tony Finau, but I'm not going to be, like, in there cheering, like, let me just say, conditionally, I guess. If Feena was in it, I will be rooting for him. If Homa is in it, I guess I'll be rooting for him because we're going to have all of these, you know, douchebag live guys who are going to be coming back and playing in this, too. But, you know, Matt Kucher isn't going to win. He might lead through a couple of rounds, but he's not going to win. He's too old. And I don't feel strongly about Ludwig Oberg. Maybe you do. Maybe you love Victor Hovland. That was always another name on there. But. But go ahead, pick people. You like Russell Henley. You like Patrick Cantley.
- [51:50]
C
I mean, and then Scheffler's got to be the favorite as far as odds are concerned. I mean, to get his third.
- [51:55]
B
Got to get his irons right. He's just.
- [51:58]
C
But is he. You know, have you seen that? I looked at it. I'm sure I haven't looked at it, but I'm sure I would. I would guess he's got to be the favorite to. To win the Masters.
- [52:08]
B
Yeah, I would think so. But. All right.
- [52:10]
C
And it's fine. It doesn't excite me.
- [52:12]
B
Doesn't make me angry right now. Scotty Scheffler, John Rahm, Bryson DeChambeau, Rory McElroy, Oberg, Shoffley, Fleetwood Cam Young, Matt Fitzpatrick, Hideki Matsuyama. Then it's Morikawa, McIntyre, Minwu Lee, Justin Rose, who always is comfortable at the Masters.
- [52:35]
C
Yeah. Oh, my God. I just. That's the last thing I want to see. He's got punch me face.
- [52:39]
B
Justin Rose.
- [52:41]
C
I'm not a fan.
- [52:41]
B
Oh, there's so many worse people.
- [52:43]
C
Not a fan.
- [52:44]
B
Brooks Koepka, Jordan Spieth, Chris Got her up is a name you're probably going to get to know because he's been around a lot. My guy. Akshay Batia, 57 to 1.
- [52:53]
C
What's Fitzpatrick?
- [52:55]
B
Fitzpatrick is plus 23 and a half. 23 and a half to 1.
- [53:03]
C
I'd root for him.
- [53:05]
B
Okay.
- [53:05]
C
I would root for him. But, yeah, Ricky Fowler idea. I don't think it's going to happen. But.
- [53:09]
B
But that's.
- [53:11]
C
From a sentimental standpoint, I think you nailed that.
- [53:16]
B
That's just my feeling. But, you know, Gary Woodland has been a tremendous story coming off his recent victory after dealing with PTSD after brain surgery. So everybody's rooting for Gary Woodland right now. But you start looking way down into the odds. Here are the. I don't even see Fowler. But you know, after day one, that Freddie Couples is probably going to shoot at a 70, right? You know, he's going to. Because he's still young enough. He's 5,000 to 1. You ought to put something down there. He is. Yeah. You're 5001. V.J. singh, Brandon Holtz, Fred Couples. Others, the amateurs, Jackson Harrington, Mike Weir. Still out there, Matteo Pulcini, Jose Maria Olafauble will be in the field.
- [54:06]
C
And then so DeChambeau, his best finish, is tied for fifth. And that was. That was last year.
- [54:14]
B
But he's always in it.
- [54:15]
C
I'd root for him, too. So what is. He's only one. So he's won the US Open twice.
- [54:23]
B
I don't think Fowler's in the field, is he not?
- [54:27]
C
Oh, can't root for him.
- [54:28]
B
No, I can't. No. I can't find his name. Yeah, no, he's. I don't. I'm looking like, where's. Where's Fowler? Like, I can't find him. He's not here unless I am missing him. So.
- [54:44]
C
Nope. Yeah, he's not. He's failed to qualify.
- [54:47]
B
JJ spawn at 72 to 1.
- [54:50]
C
Yeah. Fowler failed to qualify after missing the cut at the Valero Texas Open, finishing outside the top 50 in the Official World Golf Ranking 65th.
- [55:00]
B
No, that takes that out. Oh.
- [55:01]
C
It's the second consecutive year he's missed the tournament, so I guess we can't root for. We can root for him. It's never. It's definitely not going to happen.
- [55:08]
B
He can come over and watch with us if you want. That'd be fun, right? So we could all hang out at the Hooters over there where John Daly is. You know, throw a couple back, have some wings, chill out. I don't know if he's. They're tearing down that Hooters.
- [55:21]
C
I thought in Augusta. Yeah.
- [55:23]
B
And apparently it was some sort of big deal. It was like when they tore down the McDonald's of the taco Bell by Wrigley. Oh, my God, you. All the memories that came from my McDonald's.
- [55:35]
C
Hey, I ate a lot of that Taco Bell in 2011.
- [55:37]
B
I bet you did. Yeah, I bet you did. You know, whenever the stakes are high, my bookie is where you turn bets into bankroll. There's always a big matchup on the schedule. Everybody's watching. We all have our hot takes. And no matter the sport, these props are just as fun as the final score. That's why I use my bookie. We do. Every Monday and Friday, we do DBU picks right here. My bookies, prop boards. Deep fun to play, player performances, game milestones, everything between. The kind of action that keeps things interesting all game long. So get in. Now, if you haven't done it, you register, you make your deposit, you use the code DBU at MyBookie AG. And then your first bet's covered up to 500 bucks with something they call the bet back bonus token. And that way you can invoke the token. You play that, and that way that first bet can unhappen. If you want one account, one wallet bet, the spread, live bet during the action, there's a casino. You can go there during halftime, between games. Everything is in that one place. MyBookie Ag. So don't just watch the action. Make it pay.
- [56:39]
C
With my Bookie, I was 2 and 2 last night. I lost Michigan with that 7. I was given 7, and I won
- [56:47]
B
that, by the way.
- [56:48]
C
Yeah, you did. I know. That stupid three pointer off the glass that you called, apparently. And then who else lost for me? Oh, it was Denver.
- [56:56]
B
Denver.
- [56:57]
C
Denver and Portland. They were. Denver was laying. Were they laying? Eight and a half and they won by five. They were losing most of that game. It was really. I was watching on my. My phone.
- [57:08]
B
We're rooting for. If you're a Bulls fan. Root for Portland.
- [57:13]
C
Well, they lost last night by 5,
- [57:14]
B
but so make the playoffs.
- [57:15]
C
But that gets me. I'm at. I'm 47, 26 and one in NBA and college hoops.
- [57:21]
B
It's a hell of a year, man.
- [57:22]
C
Yeah, it's been pretty.
- [57:23]
B
Pretty lucky. Well, that's not. After a while. I don't think that's luck.
- [57:28]
C
I do.
- [57:29]
B
I mean, it probably is a little, but that's pretty good.
- [57:33]
C
Yeah, I would take that. I'd like that.
- [57:35]
B
What's your percentage like?
- [57:39]
C
It's pretty good.
- [57:40]
B
What was it, 40 something?
- [57:42]
C
47, 26 and 1. Now that. That one, though, I'm calling it because it was a tie. But I. I still got the win for that. So technically, you could go 48 and 26 six times. 48, 26.
- [57:56]
B
Like, yeah, you're. You're. You're doing great.
- [57:58]
C
Yeah, I'd like to do that for the NFL.
- [58:01]
B
We got some time.
- [58:02]
C
I know, but.
- [58:03]
B
But we also have a Don't miss forward progress today because I've got some Bears stadium stuff on there. You're gonna.
- [58:09]
C
Sweet. Let's go.
- [58:10]
B
So we're gonna do that. That is gonna wrap up.
- [58:12]
C
Oh, no, no, no, it's not. Not.
- [58:13]
B
It's not. I didn't know you were gonna.
- [58:15]
C
Do. You have one thing you have to do.
- [58:16]
B
That's why I put the question mark on the thing.
- [58:17]
C
Yeah. You have to do this.
- [58:18]
B
What do you mean, I have to do it? It's a manila envelope.
- [58:20]
C
Take it. Take the envelope.
- [58:22]
B
What is it? What are you doing to me?
- [58:23]
C
Just do it. Says Diane. Says Lieutenant Dan. Lieutenant Diane. Dan.
- [58:29]
B
You got magic legs.
- [58:30]
C
Well, there's no magic legs in there. Open it up. Nothing's gonna come out of you. Not like critters or anything. Opening up a wave envelope full of spiders.
- [58:41]
B
I like spiders. Spiders are good guys.
- [58:44]
C
I don't like spiders. What do you got there?
- [58:49]
B
Ew.
- [58:51]
C
Yeah, you said you would eat them on camera.
- [58:53]
B
No, no, no. Oh, yeah.
- [58:55]
C
You said you'd eat them on camera.
- [58:56]
B
I gotta take out my Invisalign.
- [58:58]
C
Oh, they're taking your teeth out. I was like, what the hell is happening?
- [59:01]
B
No, I'm doing Invisalign to fix this. This weird tooth.
- [59:04]
C
Oh, okay.
- [59:04]
B
Yeah, yeah, it's cool. They 3D print these things.
- [59:07]
C
It's really neat. I seriously thought you're taking your teeth off for a second. I was like, what the.
- [59:11]
B
No, I got to take my Invisalign off. Okay. What is this? Oh, it's. Oh, this is just a regular Kit Kat.
- [59:19]
C
Yeah, but it's. It's a special Halloween shape, though.
- [59:21]
B
It's like the Count.
- [59:22]
C
Yeah, it's the Count who does letters.
- [59:24]
B
It's shaped like Denz and pillow.
- [59:26]
C
He does letters.
- [59:27]
B
He does. No, he doesn't.
- [59:28]
C
The Count.
- [59:29]
B
A, B, C. Sir.
- [59:32]
C
What? You're doing it wrong.
- [59:35]
B
It's the Count.
- [59:37]
C
All right. See how good. So I found those in. Jackie still had a bag of Halloween candy I found in his closet.
- [59:42]
B
They're stale.
- [59:43]
C
Well, I would. Yeah, I would think so. Is it good, though, or. No.
- [59:51]
B
Totally different ratio of much more chocolate.
- [59:54]
C
Oh, really? For the Count.
- [59:55]
B
This is, I would say, too chocolaty. Really not wafery enough.
- [60:00]
C
Okay. What about the other thing?
- [60:01]
B
Oh, I've had that before.
- [60:03]
C
What's your review on that? You know, you want to hold it
- [60:06]
B
up so people can see cookies and cremay.
- [60:10]
C
Yeah, I've never tried. Didn't want to. I didn't want to.
- [60:15]
B
Okay, Put this over in the. In the kitchen so everybody can have it.
- [60:18]
C
Somebody grab it.
- [60:19]
B
I'll put the one I took a bite out of, too.
- [60:21]
C
Those. Wait, the. The Count, though. Those are Count. They're both the same flavors, though, right? Even though the packages are different.
- [60:28]
B
Yeah, but you put the green.
- [60:30]
C
Oh, they're the same flavors, though, right? They're not like.
- [60:34]
B
Yeah.
- [60:34]
C
Okay. So it's just the packaging is different for Halloween?
- [60:37]
B
I think so, yeah. This one has. What the hell? Oh, a skeleton with little bones on it.
- [60:43]
C
Okay.
- [60:46]
B
And this has pumpkins on it.
- [60:48]
C
Pumpkins. Okay. All right. But they're the same flavor. Yeah.
- [60:50]
B
But very chocolatey.
- [60:51]
C
Oh, so too chocolaty.
- [60:53]
B
Yeah, For a kit. It's really not a Kit Kat.
- [60:56]
C
Does that have something to do with being old and stale? Does that, like, take away the wafer?
- [61:02]
B
It might. I think that's an actual. That's a good analytical question. I think in our differential diagnosis here, is it possible it would be more cookie Ish if the cookie were fresher.
- [61:15]
C
Fresher. And not decomposing within the chocolate? All right, so if we're doing. What do we do? We do four slices of pie, or is it. On a scale of five slices of
- [61:23]
B
pie, it's about a seven.
- [61:25]
C
So how many slices of pie would an old stale.
- [61:29]
B
1.
- [61:29]
C
Oh, wow.
- [61:30]
B
1. See, let's keep this one because I think this is Dan Zampillo. Because we know he's the Count.
- [61:37]
C
Yeah. Put it in front of the camera so people can see he is the Count. We have Dan in a little package.
- [61:42]
B
Yeah, because you know that Dan Zampillo now is the executive producer of Gamut Podcast.
- [61:47]
C
Yes.
- [61:48]
B
He's like, in charge of programming the entire network.
- [61:50]
C
You can't use his nickname.
- [61:51]
B
No, but I'm just shortening his nickname.
- [61:53]
C
Don't use his nickname.
- [61:54]
B
I'm not.
- [61:55]
C
Don't say it.
- [61:56]
B
The old nickname. I'm changing it. I'm adapting it.
- [61:58]
C
Don't say the old nickname.
- [62:00]
B
Just like Federal Express became FedEx, Kentucky Fried Chicken became KFC, his previous nickname could become the Count.
- [62:08]
C
Just the Count.
- [62:09]
B
Yes.
- [62:09]
C
We're not gonna do the other part?
- [62:11]
B
No. Okay. No, we're definitely not. Not even. That's one thing that will remain filtered. How about that? Yeah, that doesn't that on my face. But that doesn't pass through the filtering test on Dan Bernstein Unfiltered, which has been brought to you in partnership with my bookie, Dan Bernstein Unfiltered. Unfiltered on 312Sports.