OWC - NBA Opening Night 2025

Summary

Dan Bernstein Unfiltered – OWC: NBA Opening Night 2025

Podcast: Dan Bernstein Unfiltered (312 Sports)
Episode: Organizations Win Championships #115
Date: October 21, 2025
Hosts: Dan Bernstein (B), Jason Bernstein (A)

Episode Overview

Dan and Jason Bernstein break down the Chicago Bulls’ outlook heading into NBA Opening Night 2025. The episode blends sharp Bulls analysis, league-wide storylines, nitty-gritty debates on roster health, and classic Bernstein humor. Key topics include injury updates, Bulls’ Most Improved Player (MIP) contenders, deployment ideas for Noah Esenge, a tribute to NBA trivia, and a skeptical look at Michael Jordan’s new “Insights to Excellence” segment on NBC’s NBA coverage.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Bulls Injury Outlook and Roster Depth

Timestamp: 02:36–07:35, 10:08–11:51

• Kobe White’s injury: Out for at least two weeks with “calf tightness,” which both Bernsteins fear could foreshadow Achilles issues.
  • Jason: “No, you don’t f. with calf tightness.” (03:53)
  • Dan notes the Bulls are right to be cautious, referencing Tyrese Haliburton’s similar injury last year.
• Zach Collins: Out for at least four weeks after wrist surgery.
• Jalen Smith: Opportunity to step up, but “struggled with conditioning at this time last year” (05:45).
• Patrick Williams: Game-time decision due to a groin issue.
• Ayo Dosunmu: Hurt his thumb during a preseason game but is expected to play.
• Roster numbers and jerseys: Jalen Smith switching to #25, Dalen Terry to #7—causing “weird” confusion (06:03).
• Trade speculation: Dan muses about Kobe White’s value, especially if the team chooses to pivot and prioritize draft capital:
  • “If somebody were offering two firsts for him, oh my God.” (10:50)

2. Bulls Season Expectations and Team Philosophy

Timestamp: 04:49–05:12, 11:51–12:43

• The consensus is the Bulls are “expected to be in the play-in, with or without [Kobe White]” (05:04).
• Jason: “Honestly, would not…care all that much. If anything, I think it would be better [if they missed the play-in].”
• Bulls likely to hold onto some pieces if White or others increase their trade value.
• Conversation on the 2025 NBA draft class being “pretty good,” and shoutout to Cam Williams (Kentucky), a projected first-rounder and personal favorite.

3. Most Improved Player (MIP) Discussion & NBA Wide Odds

Timestamp: 13:17–22:45

• Modest Gzealous (Bulls) is openly aiming for MIP—Dan contextualizes: “Most of the guys who win Most Improved Player make the All-Star team.” (13:17)
• Deep dive into MIP odds across the league, with special focus on Bulls:
  • “Modest is tied for number five” in odds. (14:53)
• Long odds and value picks analyzed:
  • Jason’s sleeper: “Bilal Koulibaly…That’s who I’d put my money on. Really. At 50 to 1?” (21:20–21:23)
• Lively banter on NBA young talent, team-building philosophies, and importance of the trade deadline.

4. Noah Esenge’s Role and Development Path

Timestamp: 26:48–29:25

• Jason: Expects Esenge to start the season in the G League due to roster logjam (“just no breathing room for his archetype right now”).
• Contingent on trade deadline moves and Esenge’s growth (weight room, conditioning).
• Dan: “If he’s developing at a rate that says this is a future contributing piece, that’s all we can ask for, right?” (29:25)

5. Michael Jordan’s Return to NBC – “Insights to Excellence”

Timestamp: 29:27–32:36

• MJ will headline taped features called “MJ Insights to Excellence” on NBC’s new NBA coverage, interviewed by Mike Tirico.
• Jason is unimpressed:
  • “He’s a maniac. I think all of his excellence came out of natural talent and being a psychopath. Like, cool…You also gotta be six eight, right?” (30:35)
  • “What else has he got to say, other than he pissed me off…I want to cut his throat open and dunk on him simultaneously.” (31:30)
• Dan: “Lesson one: Kill the—be a maniac.” (32:17)
• Both hosts pine for “Insights to Excellence” from overachievers or less-celebrated players.

6. Offbeat Bulls/NBA Trivia Showdown

Timestamp: 33:04–45:10

• Fun, challenging Bulls history/ NBA stat contests, including:
  • Six Bulls with 5,000 points for Chicago and another team (Chet Walker, DeMar DeRozan, Vucevic, Artist Gilmore, Reggie Theus, Jimmy Butler).
  • History of NBA players with 27/11/5 stat lines (Giannis Antetokounmpo, Jokic, Wilt, Baylor, Embiid, Kareem, Oscar Robertson).

7. Light Moments, Banter & Memorable Quotes

Throughout, esp. 07:38–09:23, 21:13–22:14, 25:01–26:43

• Jokes about new jersey numbers (“they are both Jason baseball numbers”—06:14).
• TikTok & meme asides about “six, seven” (Lamelo Ball/college memes)—“Every single time someone says…six, seven, I can’t help but just go six, seven, and that’s everybody.” (09:05)
• Ice cream digressions, soft serve in New Orleans, and Dairy Queen jokes tied back to Zion Williamson.
  • “Luckily for him, there isn’t a Dairy Queen in the New Orleans metropolitan area. You have to go all the way to Metairie.” (25:01)
• Beards, midterms, and self-deprecation as classic Bernstein family fare.

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Jason on Kobe White’s calf injury:
  “No, you don’t f. with calf tightness.” (03:53)
• On Bulls season outlook:
  “They’re expected to be in the play-in, with him or without him, they’ll be in the play-in, right?” (Dan, 05:04)
• On Michael Jordan’s new NBC segment:
  “He’s a maniac. I think all of his excellence came out of natural talent and being a psychopath.” (Jason, 30:35)
• On overcomplicating network features:
  “Lesson one: Be better than everyone else. Right?” (Jason, 32:28)
• On Noah Esenge’s likely G League stint:
  “There’s just no breathing room for his archetype right now on their roster…It depends on what they do at the deadline.” (Jason, 27:02)
• Trivia fun:
  “Is Taj still…It can’t be Taj. He only plays when, like, Thibodeau calls him at 3 in the morning.” (Dan, 36:47)
• On TikTok & meme culture:
  “Every single time someone says…six, seven, I can’t help but just go six, seven, and that’s everybody.” (Jason, 09:05)
• Dan on Bulls fan expectations:
  “If [Esenge] can be, by the end of the year, developing at a rate that says this is a future contributing piece, that’s all we can ask for, right?” (29:25)

---

Timestamps for Key Segments

• 0:06–2:36: Opening banter, technical difficulties, and personal updates (midterms)
• 2:36–7:35: Bulls injury report and impact on Opening Night
• 10:08–11:51: Discussion of Bulls’ trade situations and asset management
• 13:17–22:45: Deep dive into Most Improved Player odds and Bulls prospects
• 26:48–29:25: Noah Esenge’s role, G League prospects, and trade deadline implications
• 29:27–32:36: Michael Jordan’s new NBC role, “MJ Insights to Excellence”
• 33:04–45:10: Bulls trivia showdown (historic stats and NBA records)
• Throughout: Irreverent banter, ice cream tangents, meme culture, and trivia fun

---

Episode Tone & Style

True to its “Unfiltered” tagline, the podcast is candid, irreverent, and laced with Chicago-style sports sarcasm. The hosts riff on each other, tie sports back to everyday life, and aren’t afraid to be dismissive or self-deprecating, especially regarding casual fandom and media coverage excesses.

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This episode provides a comprehensive, honest preview of the Bulls' season and the wider NBA landscape—perfect for both die-hards and newcomers just jumping into Chicago sports talk.

Transcript

[A]

Foreign.

[B]

Welcome to episode 115 of Organizations Win Championships, a Chicago Bulls podcast here on 312 Sports. I'm Dan Bernstein, and that bearded man.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Growing a little playoff beard right now, Jason Bernstein. Wait, a playoff beard?

[A]

Yeah, playoff beard for midterms at the moment.

[B]

So it's a midterm beard.

[A]

It's a midterm beard. Ye. I have my last midterm on Thursday, and I have a feeling it might kick me straight in the nards.

[B]

Well, how about studying instead of doing a Bulls podcast?

[A]

Well, I think that you wasted 40 minutes of my time.

[B]

Wasn't me. It was a bad microphone.

[A]

Yeah, but it was also you for crashing out the entire time.

[B]

However, what's the midterm in?

[A]

It's technology analysis, and it's. Yeah, it's a lot of info. It's. I've done well at all the other midterms, and I don't think I've. It's been a while since I've shaved, and I'm just gonna. I'm just gonna let it. Let it ride, I think.

[B]

Technology analysis.

[A]

Oh, it's. It's. It's a lot like the FCC and fiber optic cables and the Espionage Act. There's a lot. Elon Musk. There's a lot of synthesizing that's going.

[B]

Studying Elon Musk.

[A]

Oh, yeah, because he's a piece of work, man. He's the worst. He's horrible and he's dumb. That's the thing. He's stupid.

[B]

Okay, well, you're being indoctrinated by. By the.

[A]

By the liberal agenda.

[B]

Yeah, the big universities are indoctrinating you. This is.

[A]

My professor, went to Penn and is very well versed and was in Brazil all of last week doing conferences and stuff, so I feel like I should be in good hands.

[B]

You know who else went to Penn?

[A]

I don't know.

[B]

Donald Trump.

[A]

Yeah, but I mean, he got in there because he's a. Yes. He's got money. Well, money.

[B]

Well, money. So the Bulls are starting. And by the way, thanks to Matt Abaticola for dealing with us. I didn't crash out. Yes, you did. I kind of crashed out.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Because Maggie the dog is here, and Maggie was looking at Maggie when I was running upstairs. Yeah. If Maggie runs down and hangs out with us. So we'll give Maggie a little airtime, a little screen time. Bull start Wednesday at the United center against the Detroit Pistons, who are believed to be an Eastern Conference fringe contender.

[A]

Oh, yeah, they could be real good.

[B]

And on this program, we're going to talk a little bit about this already. Injury, headwinds. There's two players out and two more players who are possibly questionable. Slash probable. I want to look at the most improved players. Odds. There's two Bulls that are showing up in there. I knew to expect one. One surprised me a little bit. I think we need to discuss how Noah Eisenge gets deployed, not just now, but what the goals are for this season. We've got Houston and Oklahoma City tonight. And I want to talk a little bit with you, Jason, and get your perspective about something that we actually talked about on Dan Bernstein unfiltered today. And that is apparently what Michael Jordan's role is going to be on the revival of NBC's NBA coverage. Is that cool?

[A]

Sure.

[B]

No, don't say yet.

[A]

I'm saying. Ugh. And he's. And he's watching me. He's watching me as I sleep. Yeah.

[B]

Well, so are Tiger and Snoop, so I think you're in good hands. I like that. Kobe White is out. Kobe White's gonna miss at least two weeks. And my guess is probably more with this calf tightness that.

[A]

Yeah. No, you don't f. With calf tightness.

[B]

That's what the Bulls are saying.

[A]

That's what happened to Halliburton. This isn't. This isn't the playoffs right now. That's what they said. He had calf tightness or a calf strain. That means he has an Achilles problem, and if he takes one bad step, he's out for the year.

[B]

It doesn't mean for sure he has an Achilles problem, but it means there is a risk of that. And especially as an Eastern Conference team, you've got no excus for not understanding the risks of that. They said it. I mean, I was reading in Julia Poe's story in the Tribune today that they said that there would be potential concern about further Achilles complications.

[A]

So.

[B]

Fine. Fine.

[A]

I don't.

[B]

I don't mind them holding it. I don't. Like.

[A]

I don't know. There was.

[B]

There was somebody on a local sports radio station who called this issue a major crisis for the Bulls.

[A]

Mm. Yeah. Totally. Major crisis.

[B]

How is. How can anyone.

[A]

He's fine, but even if he's not right, it doesn't.

[B]

How can anything rise to the level of major crisis?

[A]

Yeah, it's not like he's Tyrese Haliburton.

[B]

They're expected to be in the play in and with him or without him, they'll be in the play in, right?

[A]

I would think so. Yeah.

[B]

Okay. I just. I thought I must have missed something.

[A]

That good that they don't make the play in cool. Honestly, would not. That would not care all that much. If anything I think would be better. But let's not get into that.

[B]

We have an agreement not to at the moment at least. Zach Collins is also out with after surgery to repair a fracture in his wrist. So it'll be reevaluated after four weeks and then they'll figure out a timetable for him to resume.

[A]

Jalen Smith time.

[B]

Yeah. And if my memory is correct, Jalen Smith struggled at this time last year with conditioning a little bit.

[A]

Yeah. That's why I didn't play as much. But when he was on the floor, he could play. I like his game a lot.

[B]

Sure.

[A]

And just be aware he and Dalen switched numbers. Oh, so Jalen Smith is going to be wearing 25 and Dale and Terry is going to be wearing seven. So it's going to be kind of weird.

[B]

I don't know. They're both Jason baseball numbers.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah, they are. We don't have. When was the last. I'm trying to think. Last time a bulls player worth 31. I maybe Satoransky because I know he wore 31. I'm just trying to think if that was. Yeah, I'm trying to think if that was the last time.

[B]

Well, I saw Antoine Winfield wearing 31 last night as Jameer Gibbs was blowing his doors off. God, that was unbelievable.

[A]

Jameer Gibbs is good at football.

[B]

Oh, my God. Yeah, he is. So Patrick Williams might be a game time decision with a groin.

[A]

It's always a game time decision. Whatever.

[B]

And IO. Dsumu apparently got his thumb hooked on Aaron Gordon's jersey in the Denver game, which is a good time to do it because Aaron Gordon plays for Denver. Be hard to do it in a different game. Unless you're just watching that game with Aaron Gordon and he's getting up to get a beer or something. I don't know.

[A]

So you need to be stopped. Anybody ever. You just need to be stopped. Stop that. The unnecessary. Well, it's better he did it against the Nuggets rather than against the Hawks because Aaron Gordon doesn't play for the Hawks and he was getting a beer and he hooked into his jersey. Jesus Christ, dude.

[B]

What if I can't do it for me? I'm not doing it to entertain you. I'm doing it to entertain myself.

[A]

You could do other things to entertain yourself.

[B]

Not on camera.

[A]

I mean, you can do anything on camera now.

[B]

Well, I guess that's true. Look, if what's his name on cnn. What was the guy? Who's the CNN guy? Jeffrey Toobin.

[A]

Oh, there's also a tiktoker about who does these etiquette videos. He's this English dude and he insists that everything has to be proper. And you have to. When you're at a nice restaurant, you have to eat french fries with a knife and fork.

[B]

Fork.

[A]

Or a banana with a knife and fork. And the first comment on every video is just what is the most polite way? What is the best way? I could rub one out under the table?

[B]

Well, is there etiquette to that? Is there.

[A]

That's the joke. What is the politest way in which I can rub one out under the table?

[B]

So is it the same person making that joke on every video?

[A]

I don't know, but it's a whole thing now. Of course, it's not quite like. Not. Not quite like 6, 7. I don't know if you know what.

[B]

That is, but I've seen the south park episode.

[A]

Yeah. Did you have most recent. How do you add? You have six, seven. How do you ever even heard of it?

[B]

Not until the south park episode. I had no idea what they were talking about.

[A]

You're gonna get beter Meinhoft because it is everywhere.

[B]

Well, I would have gotten Bader Meinhoft from the episode. Are college kids are doing it.

[A]

They're saying it's because it started off as so unfunny that it became fun.

[B]

Oh, no.

[A]

And college. Every single time someone says I sorry for the double negative. Whenever I HEAR the numbers 6 and 7 put together or even I see them together, I can't help but just go six, seven, and that's everybody.

[B]

But isn't it because Lonzo or lamelo ball is 6, 7.

[A]

Part of it is because there was an. There was a lamelo Ball edit on TikTok and there's this guy in the song. It just goes six, seven. And something in La Bella Ball shows up because he is six.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Six foot seven inches. And it's for whatever reason now people are just like, six, seven.

[B]

The song is doot doot by little Schmeckle or somebody.

[A]

Little Schmeckle.

[B]

What's his name?

[A]

I don't think he's Jewish.

[B]

No, but I don't. I don't know. It's Lil something or young something.

[A]

Yeah, whatever. Yeah. I don't know. But that's.

[B]

I forgot the name.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So that's not. That's not why you called. I love.

[A]

But that's not important.

[B]

But that's not important right now. It's a building filled with patients and beds. So Kobe White's out, IO is probably going to play. The only thing that I look back about why you want Kobe White to play, why he wants to play is in case you're thinking of dealing him and and how they're going to figure out which to pay or how they're going to pay. Both IO's obviously more tradable. If they finally wake up and care about draft capital, you might be able to get more for Kobe White. It's not going to be just vuch available. If White is really, really, really good, I don't know that they'd ever do it. But if somebody were offering two firsts.

[A]

For him, oh my God.

[B]

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[A]

And I think this draft class this year is pretty good too, so. And a former Tulane basketball player that I've always been high on is a projected first round pick right now.

[B]

Who's he playing for now?

[A]

Kentucky Cam Williams oh, yeah.

[B]

Even I know that name. I remember him. Who was the guy you were taking pictures of last year while he's.

[A]

Well, that. That was the. Oh, well, for a personal workout. That wasn't Cam Williams, but I took. There's the one picture where somebody's shooting.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

That. That's camp.

[B]

That's a cool shot.

[A]

Yeah, he's a really good dude. And his dad texted me merry Christmas because I sent him a bunch of pictures. Oh, he doesn't. I don't think he. Yeah, that's all right.

[B]

He means well.

[A]

I took it as a happy birthday. Of course.

[B]

This means happy birthday.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

Now, Modest Gzealous has made it clear he wants to win Most Improved Player. So my question here. This is not why should I show an mvp? There you go. That's. Well, if he is Most improved player, and most of the guys who win Most improved Player make the All Star team.

[A]

Yeah. I can remember only one who hasn't, and that's CJ McCollum. Is that your question?

[B]

No, it's not. Okay.

[A]

I thought it was. I thought I was gonna go two. Two weeks in a row where I guess what you're asking.

[B]

No. So last year, Dyson Daniels was mip.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

That second you got paid second in depoy voting, led the NBA in steals. And he's part of the reason why a lot of people are very high on Atlanta and also their addition to Kristaps Porzingis that people think is. Oh, I forgot about that. Yeah. Yeah.

[A]

When he's healthy, still good. You saw what he did in Boston for their championship. I mean, good basketball player.

[B]

Yeah. And he's seven foot three.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I mean, he's. He is legit.

[A]

But the.

[B]

It's. This is one of the hardest to predict right now. And in recent years, it has been a player that makes a leap toward stardom and becomes an All Star or all NBA. And here you want to. Can you guess some of the names that are at the top of the odds list?

[A]

At the top of the odds list. Okay. Well, I think so. Modest is going to be on there, obviously. Right.

[B]

Modus is maybe not at the top. Modest is. Is tied for number five.

[A]

I think Jaden Ivy could be on there.

[B]

It's such a long list. Jade. Yes. Jaden ivy is. Is 50 to 1.

[A]

Okay. Jalen duran.

[B]

There are 1, 2, 3 jalens, but Jaylen Duran is not one of them.

[A]

Jalen Green.

[B]

Jalen green is 40 to 1.

[A]

He said there are two other jalens. Are they all spelled the Same. No, great.

[B]

There's another J A L E N and a J A Y L E.

[A]

N. J Y, L E N. J.

[B]

A Y L E, N. Okay, so.

[A]

It'S not Jalen Williams, the other one from the Thunder. No, but that's another name I was thinking because I still think he's a good player. Would it be Jalen Noel?

[B]

No, it's. It's 35 to 1 for Jalen Wells.

[A]

Oh, okay. Yeah.

[B]

And then. And then Jalen Johnson.

[A]

Oh, yeah.

[B]

Is also 41. Right. And there's another Atlanta guy. So here's your list.

[A]

Great year last year.

[B]

Your favorite right now is Amen Thompson.

[A]

Okay. Yeah. At.

[B]

At nine to one. Assad's well down the list. There's a. They're one is much, much better than the other. Andrew Nemhard is 12 to 1.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Benedict Matheran 15 to 1.

[A]

Cumberbatch.

[B]

No, he's 15 to 1. Denny of Dia is 17 to 1. That's a good name because he's going to. He's going to matter a lot on that team now.

[A]

Yeah. And they just restarted. Oh yeah. I like Portland.

[B]

A lot of people like.

[A]

Good. But I told you to monicamara. He just got paid and people are saying it's an overpay and he's getting paid 20 million a year and I think he's going to win defense player of the year this year.

[B]

They remind me of perhaps what Houston was like three, two, three years.

[A]

Yeah, they got a lot of pieces, but they need that dude and a.

[B]

Coach that fits where they are at the right time. So Avdia 17:1 on there.

[A]

Even though he's already pretty good.

[B]

No, he's an MVP candidate.

[A]

You think he's gonna get mvp?

[B]

No, I didn't say that. Yes, I said he's gonna get MVP votes.

[A]

That's what I said.

[B]

Oh, I thought you said you said he was gonna get MVP.

[A]

No MVP votes.

[B]

I got you. All right, so at 20 to 1 you've got shade on sharp modus and OSR Thompson. Then Peyton Pritchard and Josh Giddey at 22.

[A]

Wow. Interesting.

[B]

Well, look, if he has double his second half from last year, he's an all star.

[A]

Oh yeah.

[B]

So reed shepherd at 30 to 1. Jalen Wells 35 to 1. A group at 40 to 1 of Scoot Henderson, Kyle Filipowski, Jonathan Kuminga, Jalen Johnson and Jalen Green. And Michael Porter Jr.

[A]

It's getting a little too late for Porter Jr. And Commander.

[B]

I thought the same. Then you have Stefan Castle and Carlton Carrington.

[A]

Oh, I love Bob Carrington.

[B]

Castle is.

[A]

Is Kaishan George up there as well?

[B]

Let me just read the rest of the list and.

[A]

Yeah, Castle Castles.

[B]

And he's better than this. Yeah, he's. He's. He's going to be an all star soon. I know.

[A]

I don't know why he wasn't the number one overall pick in that draft. And I called it from the very beginning. I was like, this dude is really good and don't let him go to San Antonio. And he went to San Antonio. And now they have Dylan Harper and San Antonio is going to be really terrifying. And I might go see them this. This Saturday or next Saturday, maybe.

[B]

What's a ticket? Not much again, even now.

[A]

Yeah, I guarantee you it's cheap.

[B]

All right, here's the group at 50 to 1. Chris Boucher, Nikola Jovic. Didn't you talk to him?

[A]

Yeah, I did.

[B]

Wasn't. He was. He came here.

[A]

He was with the Sioux Fall Sky Force, and I was trying to get an interview with him in the Miami Heat. Denied it. But I do talk to him kind of informally. Yeah.

[B]

Yeah. You did go up to him and say something.

[A]

Yeah, we talked for a second.

[B]

But your guy who you saw at Harborside. Max Christie.

[A]

Not Harborside. Schomburg.

[B]

Oh, Schomberg. Sorry. In a golf day. Max Christie's 50 to 1. This might be. Khalil Ware is 50 to 1.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I don't agree with this either. Anthony Simons at 50.

[A]

Too good. Yeah, he's got some. He's. He's got some stuff.

[B]

He's too good.

[A]

You think he's too good? Well, it was Tyrese Maxey last year.

[B]

Yeah, I guess. Jared McCain at 50 to 1.

[A]

He's hurt, though.

[B]

Chet Holmgren at 50 to 1. Jaden Ivy at 50 to 1. Donovan Clingan.

[A]

Yeah. I'm telling you, I still think eventually, if he learns how to. If he starts shooting, which I think is possible for him because he has good touch, I think a Brook Lopez type of player is possible. Like an old Brook Lopez. I'm not saying Brooklyn Nets all star Brook Lopez, but I'm saying when he was in Milwaukee and he was really valuable for that team, I think that type of player, not all star level, but a good starting center. I think that's possible because he's huge. He's a mountain.

[B]

I know. And he plays really hard. Brandon Miller at 50 to 1.

[A]

Still like him a lot.

[B]

Crazy talent. If they could just get a handle on that team of who does what and when.

[A]

Yeah. Who does it on and off the court. Can you guys stop punching people and murdering people?

[B]

Well, Brandon had some issues off the court in college. They haven't resurfaced.

[A]

Yeah. Miles Bridge is still on that team.

[B]

Brandon Pajemski.

[A]

Yeah. Okay. I think he's White Hustle guy. I'm not the biggest. I don't see. I think he's more talented than TJ McConnell, but I don't see how. How much higher his ceiling is than what he already is.

[B]

Okay, what about Cam Whitmore?

[A]

Yeah, I like it. I like his game a lot.

[B]

And lastly, Bilal Koulibaly.

[A]

That's who I'd put my money on. Really?

[B]

At 50 to 1?

[A]

Yeah. Yeah.

[B]

Really?

[A]

Yeah. I would put a dollar on that. I'd buy that for a dollar. Okay. No, don't make me sound like that. But I love Koulibaly. Okay. He's freakishly athletic, great defender. I think he has more of a chance at his age than to. Than Patrick Williams did when they were the same age to become Kawhill Leonard.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

I want to.

[B]

You have more of a chance at. He's how old?

[A]

Young. He was drafted the same year as Muhammad. He's like, 21.

[B]

Okay. Because Patrick was 19 when he was drafted.

[A]

Yeah. I'm saying when Patrick was 21 or going into his third season, let's say.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

I think Koulibaly has more of a chance to be Kawhi Leonard than I did for Patrick Williams at that time.

[B]

Okay. Yeah. Because we had a much larger sample size of Patrick Williams's game and health and everything.

[A]

Third year when. Right. In Patrick. Third year. Yeah. He's been hurt a couple of times, and I just think he's got the body for it. He's got the athleticism. He can actually make a dunk. He's not as good of a shooter as Williams is, but I almost. But he's more aggressive. He's a. He's a. I think. I think he could be an absolute beast.

[B]

Okay, there you have it.

[A]

I like Washington, too. I think they're. Although they have C.J. mcCollum and Chris Milton, which I don't really understand, but.

[B]

No, that's. Those are just, like, placeholders. Those are just contracts.

[A]

Yeah. Did you know that the Pelicans don't have a single player under the OR at the age of 30 or above on their entire roster?

[B]

Good.

[A]

Yeah. Their oldest players, Kavon looney, and he's 29. And I think that's just for veteran presence because they got rid of McCollum. They got Jordan Poole back. Which I would say, for this team, makes more sense.

[B]

I read your story. I read what you wrote in the paper.

[A]

You did?

[B]

I read your piece. Yeah?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I thought you could have gone a little harder on some of the opinions because I didn't.

[A]

I didn't need to. That's not really what we were looking for there. Okay.

[B]

Because I didn't know if that was just.

[A]

I couldn't just say Zion is fat.

[B]

He's not now.

[A]

He's not. Yeah. Scary. Scary. Yes. I wish I could have said that I hate Derek Queen's game, but I'm not gonna say that.

[B]

Well, I thought you do. You didn't. Wait, you said guys whose game you liked if you. If you're scouting.

[A]

No, I only said one. I said Jeremiah Fears.

[B]

You said you always liked Jeremiah Fears. I was in the Derek Queen, like, thumbnail. I was expecting something about his lack of athleticism, his lack of leaping ability, his lack of explosiveness.

[A]

I tried to say subtly, like, Elton.

[B]

Brand comps kind of thing.

[A]

I tried to say it subtly.

[B]

I know, but see, I. I also know how you really feel about Dairy Queen.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Not Dairy Queen.

[A]

I think he's.

[B]

That's different. So how. Wait, how is.

[A]

How is he. I think. I think he's Thaddeus Young in a lot of ways.

[B]

Thaddeus Young was a great career.

[A]

Great career, but not an all star.

[B]

No, but the guy that made a.

[A]

Lot of money and a great career player, comp wise. I think it's very similar.

[B]

Has anybody made the joke around there about Zion Williams being near a guy who's. Who's Zion Williamson? Being around a guy whose name can easily be confused with Dairy Queen?

[A]

No. Okay. Okay.

[B]

I'm just thinking, like, if their lockers are next to each other. And he's always thinking, derek Queen. Derek Queen. Derek Queen.

[A]

Luckily for him, there isn't a Dairy Queen in the New Orleans metropolitan area. You have to go all the way to Metairie.

[B]

Seriously?

[A]

Yep.

[B]

Where do you go for soft serve in New Orleans?

[A]

Well, the commons has it. The dining hall here has it.

[B]

Really?

[A]

Yeah. There's soft serve.

[B]

Oh, I'd be there a lot then.

[A]

Yeah. Max never. Max loves his soft serve.

[B]

Well, who doesn't?

[A]

Yeah. And he only gets vanilla.

[B]

Yeah, vanilla's the best. What do you get? Swirl.

[A]

I would either get the swirl or vanilla.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

He made fun of me for getting the swirl. Dude, it's nowhere near as good. Just get the vanilla. Right.

[B]

And then he'll probably pull out charts and graphs to explain exactly how he's objectively correct.

[A]

Of course.

[B]

I hate people like that.

[A]

Yeah, but it pisses. Yes. Because he's really smart and it's really annoying. He doesn't go to class and he gets 95s on all of his tests. And I'm sure he can hear this right now. And hopefully he unlocked the bathroom door because he forgets to do that a lot.

[B]

He locks you out of the bathroom?

[A]

Yes, but there's a way to pick it. But it's really frustrating when I'm trying to take a shit. Oh, can I say that, Jason? Well, yeah. He's trying to take a dump. Your roommate should not. Then I have to. I have to pick the lock to my own bathroom.

[B]

All right. Well, Creel.

[A]

Yeah. Creole Creamery is nine minutes from Tulane. Creole Creamery is pretty good.

[B]

Is it?

[A]

Yeah, it's ice cream. Yeah.

[B]

Yeah. But I don't like the sound when I hear Creole. I don't think ice cream.

[A]

What does that have to do with how good the ice cream is?

[B]

Nothing.

[A]

So then shut up. Why are we talking about ice cream? Because of Zion Williamson?

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Oh, okay. Let's get Bulls.

[B]

All right, let's go. Let's ask real quick.

[A]

All right.

[B]

If everything works out reasonably well. I'm not saying ideally, but what is the. The by the end of the season? What is Noah Esenge doing for the.

[A]

Bulls by the end of the season? I think what they're going to do with him, I think they are going to put him in the G league for a bit because there's. There's just no breathing room for his archetype right now on their roster. I think they have so many guys like that, or at least forward wise, they're too packed. I think, because you got modest Williams, Okoro is going to be in that mix. Dale and Terry, I think, can play a little bit of that forward. Even Giddy's big and you can get. He's more of a guard, actually. But there are a lot of guys right there in that. In that spot. And I think he's going to go to the G League in a. For the beginning of the season. I think it really depends on what they do at the deadline and how they approach that. And if they do anything or try to offload some stuff. I do think he has that sort of skill set where it's not like he's locked into a certain position. So why not run him at the 5 or run him at the 2? If they get rid of Vouch. If they get rid of IO, they get rid of Kobe. Right. So I think. I think where he is at the end of the season when it comes to his role, I think has a lot to do with the trade deadline. And I also think it has a lot to do with how much in this. It's a little bit more difficult in the season because you're really worried about conditioning. But how is he going to get in the weight room? Is he going to get bigger?

[B]

Well, I think they're.

[A]

Maddie said Gatorade squirt bottle guy. I hope not for the 12th of.

[B]

G League could be good or bad for him.

[A]

It was good for Modest, I guess, right?

[B]

It's. Yeah, I don't know how good it was for Modest. I don't. Everybody's small and I don't want him to get used to playing around six, nine guys when he's going to have to get used to playing. Playing against 611 guys, you know, above the rim guys. And sometimes it's a small, fast league. So I just hope he's deployed properly. I do. But. Okay, I think you're right. I think if. If he can. Can be by the end of the year, if he's developing at the rate that says this is a future contributing piece, that's all we can ask for, right?

[A]

Yeah. Okay. All right.

[B]

Now, before we do the showdown, I want to ask you this and just generally how you feel about this, that I'm reading from the story in awful announcing that says that Michael Jordan's much hyped return to NBC and their coverage and being part of the NBA. Everybody's excited about it. We're going to find out tonight exactly what it is. But NBC said his main contribution will come in the form of a segment titled MJ Insights to Excellence. I think it should be Insights into Excellence, but it's saying Insights to Excellence. The first edition will be airing during tonight's doubleheader and saying throughout the season the series will air. It's unclear how often and nobody knows exactly this is going to be everything he's going to be doing or just part of it. But they're going to be taped segments to provide analysis that will air during pre game shows or halftime shows. And it will be Mike Tirico interviewing Jordan.

[A]

Okay, cool. Great. Okay.

[B]

So you have the big old I'm not interested sign.

[A]

Yes. He's a maniac. I think his. I think all of his excellence came out of natural talent and being a psychopath. Like, cool, cool. You got to work hard to be great. You got to be immensely talented to be great. Wow. You also got to be six. You got to be six eight, Right? I almost said six seven. Made a joke. But I.

[B]

But I mean, he's not 6 8, but. But he's 6 6.

[A]

But. I understand that. But it, like, really. It's Michael effing Jordan. I think that it's Michael Jordan, for Christ's sake. Insights into. Insights to excellence from Michael Jordan. Yes. Great. What's. What else has he got to say other than he pissed me off because he won MVP and I didn't, so I want to cut his throat open and dunk on him simultaneously.

[B]

End of lesson one.

[A]

Right.

[B]

What's the deal?

[A]

I'd way rather hear. I think Rest his soul, but I think Kobe would be so much better at this because he can actually. He wasn't. He worked really hard, but he wasn't a psychopath.

[B]

Yeah, kinda. But you know what?

[A]

How about this?

[B]

How about insights to excellence with the aforementioned TJ McConnell? Hell yeah. Right? Like that's a dude.

[A]

Cause he wasn't immensely talented.

[B]

Right?

[A]

Ryan Archetype.

[B]

How about that?

[A]

No.

[B]

Right.

[A]

He's Insights to March Madness excellence with Rein Archetiacono and Adama Sanogo, Bulls legends.

[B]

Insights to mediocrity is different. But I.

[A]

They're both final four most outstanding players.

[B]

Yeah, I know, but if Jordan. Jordan's like, lesson one, Kill the. Be a maniac.

[A]

Listen one. Be better than everyone else. Right?

[B]

Just be better than everyone else.

[A]

Just. What does he have to say that he hasn't already said or at least proven?

[B]

I don't know.

[A]

I don't know.

[B]

Okay. Now it is time.

[A]

Sorry.

[B]

Don't apologize.

[A]

I know you're right. I know I am.

[B]

No, I know.

[A]

I, I, I. Stop it.

[B]

Bastard. All right, here we go. It is now time for the OWC trivia showdown.

[A]

All right.

[B]

I'm gonna.

[A]

I'm.

[B]

I went first last time.

[A]

Right? Okay, I'll start you. So I loved this question. Okay. And I kind of thought of it, and I think this is one of the best ones I've ever done. So I just want to give credit to AT J. Sneller. Wm. On Sporkle. I love Sporkle. The quizzes. Can you name the six Bulls players to score 5,000 points with the team as well as 5,000 points with another team?

[B]

Now it has to be a just a single second other team.

[A]

Correct. 5000 points with two different teams and one of the. And, and there are six Bulls. I think that's why I think it's A really good question.

[B]

It is 5,000 points with one team and another team. So that. My first question is, did Jordan score enough with the Wizards?

[A]

No, he did not.

[B]

And he didn't. I wonder what his total was. But so right.

[A]

With.

[B]

With so five. But he scored 3,000 a season before with the Bulls and with one other team, and there are. There's only six total.

[A]

Six total.

[B]

Does the ABA count? Because I'm gonna. I'm gonna guess Artist Gilmore.

[A]

I'm guess Artist. Yes. Then, yes, Artist Gilmore is one of them.

[B]

Okay. Okay. Ag.

[A]

So ABA counts?

[B]

Let's just say that I think so, because I don't. I don't remember exactly how some of the years.

[A]

San Antonio and Chicago.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Did.

[B]

Reggie Theus do it with the King? Yes. Okay.

[A]

Did.

[B]

Yep. So Gilmore and Theus are two. There's four more left.

[A]

Four more.

[B]

Boy. Five. Oh, no. He didn't have enough with the Bulls?

[A]

Who?

[B]

No, maybe not even close.

[A]

Who?

[B]

Gervin? No. Who Gervin?

[A]

No, not.

[B]

I'm just trying to think of scorers who then had time with. Oh, this is a great, great trivia question.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

5,000 is a lot of damn points. So like D. Wade.

[A]

No, not D. Wade.

[B]

It's not D. Wade. It's not Rondo.

[A]

Not Rondo.

[B]

It's.

[A]

I'll say this for one. One player. You are in the right area. Era.

[B]

Sorry, the right era. Did anybody, like, back in their way to 5,000 is what I'm wondering?

[A]

No, in. Just think about that era of Bulls. Rondo, Wade. Think about that era.

[B]

Butler.

[A]

Correct. Jimmy Butler here in Miami.

[B]

Okay, so that's three.

[A]

Not Kirk Heinrich or Bob Love or Derrick Rose. Right. Mat. Maddie's guessing in the. In the chat as well. All right.

[B]

Okay. Let me see. There's got somebody from that era. Because it's not. It's not. Dang. It's not. There are guys who play.

[A]

Two of these players that you have left are currently playing.

[B]

They're Currently playing. Currently playing in the NBA?

[A]

Yep. Right now. In the NBA.

[B]

Not in some weird overseas team or something. Jesus.

[A]

It will.

[B]

Is Taj still. It can't be tied.

[A]

Not Taj Gibson.

[B]

He didn't score enough. And he only plays when, like, Thibodeau calls him at 3 in the morning. Are you in shape? Who is this?

[A]

Whoa. And the other guy played a long time ago. And he's a Hall of Famer. Long time ago.

[B]

A Hall of Famer.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And scored 5,000 points with the Bulls.

[A]

Correct.

[B]

Is he known for being a Bull, like.

[A]

Or no.

[B]

Oh.

[A]

I would say he finished his career with the Bulls, but he was still.

[B]

Pretty good when he finished his career.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Geez.

[A]

Seven time all Star.

[B]

The old guy.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Give me the other team.

[A]

Philadelphia for the old guy.

[B]

Was it the Philadelphia Warriors?

[A]

No. 76ers.

[B]

But wait, also, hold on. Did. Did Elton Brand do it?

[A]

Was not Elton Brand.

[B]

I just wonder because he had some huge scoring years for the Clippers.

[A]

I've got.

[B]

All right, this is.

[A]

I mean, he might have done it, just not as a Bull.

[B]

Oh, Brandon score enough of the Bulls. That's what you're saying. I get it. And okay, Ben Gordon scored a lot, but then that was kind of it.

[A]

Not Belt.

[B]

It's not Gord. Because he went to the Pistons and he was on a couple of different teams. Is it Javante Green? No. Did you ever have a jersey of this guy? Of any of the guys left?

[A]

Of any of the guys left? No, I did not. That's a great question. Hence why they probably scored that many points. Right?

[B]

Because you didn't curse them. You didn't curse them with adjacent jersey.

[A]

There's only one guy right now that I. I don't think I've cursed, and it's Cade Cunningham.

[B]

You're saying two are still playing?

[A]

Two are still playing.

[B]

Playing well.

[A]

Yeah. Well enough. One of them we've talked about quite a bit in this episode. Not quite a bit in this episode, but we mentioned his name a lot in this podcast and one of the other names we have mentioned a lot before. We did on previous episodes. Yes. Because they're currently playing and they were both Bulls during the time of our podcast.

[B]

And scored 5,000 points. I'm trying to think of some weird names.

[A]

Like, they're not weird names.

[B]

It's not like Mirotic, who's still scoring a ton overseas.

[A]

Not weird names.

[B]

I don't mean the name Meritage is weird. I mean like random.

[A]

I know. These are both not random guys at all. The last one is definitely the hardest.

[B]

Okay. It's not Kyle Korver.

[A]

Way easier.

[B]

Way easier than.

[A]

Oh, my God. One of them was like a multiple time all star with the Bulls while we were recording this podcast. Huh. It's not Zach Levine. It's the other guy.

[B]

Oh, DeMar.

[A]

DeMar DeRozan.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Toronto and Chicago and one other one that we've talked because he had that. He, like, he didn't play that long with the Nicola Vuchevich. Come on, dude. Really took you that long to get vouch?

[B]

I don't. I try not to think about him. All right, and who's. Who's the old timer?

[A]

Chet Walker.

[B]

All right. I mean, I might have guessed it just randomly, but I didn't know Chet. Chet Walker, DeMar, DeRozan, Vuch, Gilmore, Theus and Butler. That's a great question. Okay.

[A]

You should have gotten the other two fast.

[B]

Yeah, no, I definitely should have. I just. I was thinking backward instead of primacy. All right. This is. It's hard to think, it's hard to believe that Giannis Anetokounmpo might be underrated.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

But I would. I wouldn't say he's underrated, but I would say he's taken for granted.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Giannis Anetokounmpo, in each of his last seven seasons, has averaged at least 27 points, 11 rebounds, and five assists.

[A]

It's pretty damn good.

[B]

Okay. All other players in NBA history. There are only six other players who have. Who have done it ever and have only combined for nine such seasons. Okay, so he's done it seven in a row.

[A]

All right.

[B]

And there are six guys. There are six other guys in the history of NBA basketball. 27, 11 and five.

[A]

Jokic.

[B]

Jokic, yes. He's done it twice.

[A]

Did Westbrook ever get to 11? No, not Westbrook. Oscar Robertson did it once. Okay.

[B]

He did it in 61. 62.

[A]

Okay, that's two. LeBron?

[B]

No.

[A]

Wow. Okay. Shaq once, maybe.

[B]

No.

[A]

Kareem twice. Okay, so that's three. And you said there's six guys.

[B]

Yep. You got three more. One guy did it twice, the other two did it once.

[A]

Magic.

[B]

No.

[A]

Didn't score that much. Yeah.

[B]

And I don't know that Magic ever averaged that many rebounds.

[A]

Was Blake Griffin ever that good?

[B]

No, that's a. That's an out of left field guess, but.

[A]

Yeah, but I thought maybe one year.

[B]

Yeah. Some crazy peak year. No, none. There's one in here that.

[A]

That is really not helping me.

[B]

Either.

[A]

One of the Malones?

[B]

No.

[A]

Interesting. Okay.

[B]

Nor the third. Jeff Malone. No.

[A]

It's not going to be Pippin.

[B]

Nope.

[A]

I think of just, like, really good players.

[B]

Yeah. This. Can I.

[A]

Are there any, like, obscure names on here?

[B]

I wouldn't say obscure, but. But one of them did it in. In the. In the 2023, 2024 season.

[A]

And beat.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And beat 34, 7, 11 and 5.6.

[A]

Oh, my Lord. Yes. That's good.

[B]

Now you got two more. One guy did it twice and the.

[A]

Other guy did it once. Okay. It's not going to be like Pau Gasol wasn't good enough. You know he's a Hall of Famer, or at least going to be if he has been inducted.

[B]

These guys are both big boy table.

[A]

Hall of Famers, Big boy table, Bill Russell.

[B]

Nope.

[A]

Wilt.

[B]

Yes, wilt in 65 or 63. 64. Wilt average 36. 9, 22.3 and 5.

[A]

And then. Hold on.

[B]

65. 66. Wilt average 33.5, 24.6 and 5.2.

[A]

Wow. All right. I have. I would be shocked if it's not going to be one of these three players. Okay. All right. My first guess is going to be Akeem.

[B]

No.

[A]

Second guess is going to be David Robinson.

[B]

No.

[A]

Third guess. Tim Duncan. No. Damn it. Dirk.

[B]

No. Farts.

[A]

Don't. Don't tell me. Don't give me a hint. Don't do anything.

[B]

Don't do anything.

[A]

Don't. Okay. Bob McAdoo.

[B]

No. Great. Great guess, though. I guess they just pull that name out of it. But you want the year?

[A]

Sure.

[B]

19. 60. 61.

[A]

Oof. Bob Pettit.

[B]

No, that's too late for Bob Pettit, right?

[A]

No. He won MVP in like 55. I don't know.

[B]

Too late for its peak, I think.

[A]

Elgin Baylor.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Elgin Baylor. Average 34. 8. 19. 8 and 5.1.

[A]

Football knowledge isn't terrible.

[B]

That's pretty good.

[A]

I know a little bit.

[B]

Pretty good.

[A]

Pretty good. Yeah.

[B]

What a great question on your beard.

[A]

And I get wiser.

[B]

Yes. I'm telling you, you're gonna look like Rabbi Ben Gum Leal of the shtetl if you grow that thing out.

[A]

I don't know if it's starting to itch. It's getting annoying.

[B]

Well, do what I did during when we grew our finals beards, where you grow the whole thing out and then you have fun shaving it off.

[A]

I could go midterm mustache. No.

[B]

Do me a favor. If you're gonna do this, you're not living in my house, so I don't care. So shave it off in stages. So when the first thing you do, do like a big mutton chops with the goatee and then. And then.

[A]

I can't do that.

[B]

Then just do goatee and then do like stash and soul Patch.

[A]

Yeah. I've been asking people if I should grow it out. And I talked to Max and you. He goes, dude, I wish I could grow a beard. Everyone else, both of my other. My brother can and I can't and pissing me off. So if I were you, I would grow it out because you actually have the ability to do it. And I hate you for it.

[B]

No, I think I say grow it out. I like it. And then at the end, Mom's not gonna kill you.

[A]

I think I. Although I have a date. I have a date party on Saturday. I think I gotta shave it before then, right?

[B]

Why? How do you know a date party won't look awesome?

[A]

I don't know. It's cowboy themed.

[B]

Maybe I go do a Frank Zappa. Do the. Do like a Fu Manchu mustache with the soul patch.

[A]

You forget about women, Dad?

[B]

I don't care if it's. What do you mean I forget about them? Well, they might love it.

[A]

All right.

[B]

Ask. Ask your date.

[A]

All right. Jesus.

[B]

Yeah, you gotta have fun with that. I would say enjoy that. All right, so that is gonna wrap.

[A]

Neckbeard, though, like.

[B]

Oh, yeah, neck beard. You look like Kyle Orton. Bad. Not as drunk, probably. Well, that's OWC number 115. Thank you for listening.

[A]

And.

[B]

And look, I promise we're gonna. We're working on what's going on with Apple podcasts. We don't know exactly what it is, but wherever you. You know, we're gonna. We're gonna do our best. We got a ticket in with Apple to try to figure out how to populate it, but thanks for joining us. We will hit you back next week. We'll have actual Bulls games to talk about. How about that?

[A]

Fix your mic, dude.

[B]

I'm trying, I'm trying. I got the old one here. I'll take it. And Marcus will fix it. He'll figure it out. All right, see you. All right.