Teen Beat: Hoobastank (Dan Estrin & Doug Robb)

Summary

Teen Beat with Danielle Fishel
Episode: Hoobastank (Dan Estrin & Doug Robb)
Release Date: July 15, 2026
Host: Danielle Fishel
Guests: Doug Robb & Dan Estrin (Hoobastank)

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Episode Overview

This episode of "Teen Beat" welcomes Doug Robb and Dan Estrin from Hoobastank for an in-depth, nostalgic, and often hilarious conversation about their teenage upbringings in the San Fernando Valley, their high school antics, the formation of their band, and the wild career that followed. Danielle explores their youth, musical influences, pivotal moments in their career, the origin of “the worst and best band name ever,” and much more, all through the lens of how adolescence shapes adulthood.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Early Valley Life & High School Memories

• Shared Valley Upbringing (04:35)
  • Danielle: “Fair warning up top: I am legally forced to start with 818 talk... So you are Agora High School alumni.”
  • The three reminisce about their local childhood haunts and school rivalry (Agora Chargers vs. Calabasas Coyotes).
• Agora Man & Topanga Mall (05:01 - 08:24)
  • Mourning the loss of Valley icons like the Agora Man 8 theater and Topanga Mall’s ice rink.
  • Stories about pranking friends at high school parties by secretly turning up the thermostat.
    • Dan: “We’d start to turn it up hotter and hotter and watched…” (06:32)
• Beloved Local Spots (09:05 - 09:41)
  • The trio bond over their love for Ruby’s Diner and the anguish over its closure.
  • Comical debate over local sandwich shops; Danielle admits to “bleeping out” negative sandwich discussions on the podcast.
    • “I love that feeling when they know your order.” (13:47)

2. Cobalt Café and Valley Band Scene

• Birthplace of Hoobastank’s Stage Life (10:08 - 12:33)
  • Doug: “There wasn’t a lot of places to play semi-locally… and the shows themselves turned out to… be like house parties... so low budget and, like, do-it-yourself.” (10:52)
  • Dan: “We’d joke around with other bands going, ‘Who's doing our lights tonight?’” (11:48)
  • The venue’s DIY spirit energizes their early music and cements community.
• Formation Story & Battle of the Bands (13:47 - 15:55)
  • Doug admits he played bass out of “FOMO,” and that his early band won because of their charismatic singer, not musicianship.
  • Dan: “Not ever feeling like it was a competition because... the Seattle bands, you know, they all seem to have this camaraderie.” (15:02)
  • Both recall how Valley musical camaraderie shaped them: “Everybody kind of pushed each other to get a little bit better.” (16:17)

3. San Fernando Valley Band Boom

• Incubus, Influence, and Inspiration (19:59 - 24:09)
  • Doug describes Incubus as “a couple years ahead of us” and crucial as proof that turning music into a career isn’t a pipe dream.
  • Dan recounts tech-ing for Incubus just to get into shows and collecting VHS tapes of their performances.
  • Peer influence: “If they can do it, then we can do it.” (22:40)
• Linkin Park Origins & Shinoda Connection (24:24 - 26:29)
  • Personal anecdotes about Mike Shinoda, including a prophetic yearbook signing and tales of standing up to Valley bullies.
  • Doug: “He was more known for being an artist.” (25:17)
  • Fun backstage encounters at modern festivals: “Some of those kids have movies about them.” (25:48)

4. The Band Name Debate

• Name Regret, Label Drama, and Fan Ownership (26:56 - 29:41)
  • The band was set to change their name after getting a record deal, but label execs (and fans chanting "Hoobastank") demanded otherwise.
  • Doug: “It’s the worst and best name ever.” (28:35)
  • Both liken keeping the name to having a regrettable “first tattoo you might regret.”
  • Danielle compares Topanga’s memorability to Hoobastank’s: “Sometimes something salient is more important than something good.” (29:41)
• Origin of ‘Topanga’ (30:11 - 31:42)
  • Danielle relays the (possibly apocryphal) story that her character’s name came from a traffic sign on the 101.

5. Early Gig Disasters & Lessons Learned

• Humble Beginnings & Ego (32:19 - 34:10)
  • Doug: “None of it matters. A horrible show… is all in here.” (32:30)
  • They reflect on bad gigs (empty rooms, technical failures), including a disastrous MTV VMA performance caused by monitor malfunctions.
  • Doug: “It was 90 seconds of pure terror… I spent the next decade plus trying to work through, to be honest.” (35:23)
• Maturity & Perspective (37:05 - 38:47)
  • Now, Doug “doesn’t care” about mistakes and refuses to be harsh on other performers: “Performing is not… it’s an art. There’s supposed to be humanness in it.” (37:46)
  • Balancing risk vs. reward as they age: “I’m so good at it now… what’s the reward here?” (39:01)

6. Band Name Showdown – Y2K Edition

• Who Has the Worst Name? (40:52 - 43:36)
  • Danielle asks if Hoobastank or Alien Ant Farm, Bowling for Soup, I Wrestled a Bear Once, and others have worse names.
  • Dan: “At some point, it’s just Jamiroquai or Chumbawamba... it just becomes the name.” (41:52)
  • Hilarity ensues as they recall mispronunciations: “Like Scuba Tank.” (42:32)
  • Doug concedes: “Who am I to say anything?” (43:36)

7. Music Licensing & Pop Culture Moments

• Video Game Era (43:39 - 45:36)
  • Danielle: “Kubastank’s first single, Crawling in the Dark, was featured in the PlayStation 2 rollerblading game Aggressive Inline.”
  • Doug: “I didn’t know how important it was… just thought, why?” (44:10)
  • Dan jokes that Tony Hawk Pro Skater would have been even cooler: “Inline skating will never be as cool as skateboarding.” (44:38)
  • Vivid memories of losing hours to Tony Hawk’s soundtrack.

8. Mini Bike Accident & The Perils of Rock

• Dan's Brain Surgery Story (45:36 - 53:53)
  • After buying pocket-sized “clown bikes” on tour, Dan suffers a fall from a hidden rope, leading to a fractured skull, blood clot, and emergency brain surgery.
  • Vivid, darkly humorous hospital recollections, including Doug giving him a post-surgery mohawk from his shaved hair.
  • Dan: “In the worst times ever, there’s always a little bit of humor, you know?” (52:33)

9. ‘The Reason’ – Unexpected Ballad Success

• Songwriting and Reluctance (54:24 - 56:05)
  • They never thought of "The Reason" as a major single; it was just “a mellow breather on the album.”
  • The label loved it, but the band initially fought against releasing it as a single. Doug: “We lost the battle…” (57:07)
• Realization of a Smash (56:05 - 59:21)
  • They describe the surreal experience of playing it live on tour with Linkin Park and watching the crowd explode.
  • Danielle reads a list of the most "Y2K" festival lineups ever, including them with Bob Dylan, Jessica Simpson, and Foo Fighters.
    • Doug: “Makes perfect sense tonight.” (59:05)

10. New Music & Reconnecting with Roots

• Creating "How Do You Sleep?" (59:49 - 62:36)
  • The band's first new music in eight years is a return to their fast, punk-ish roots—conceived naturally as Doug overcame a tough personal era.
  • They opted to record new music with producer Howard Benson, releasing singles and possibly a future album.
  • Doug: “Do I like the songs? Yes. Do I like the process?... I win. We win.” (62:39)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On growing up Valley:
  • Doug: “The Ventura County border is like up the street from my house… So really right there. Nailed it.” (04:31)
• On keeping the Hoobastank name:
  • “It’s the worst and best name ever.” – Doug Robb (28:35)
  • Dan: “It’s like your first tattoo that you might regret.” (28:35)
• On musical inspiration:
  • “If they can do it, then we can do it.” – Doug Robb, about Incubus (22:40)
• On live performance disasters:
  • Doug: “It was 90 seconds of pure terror… I spent the next decade plus trying to work through, to be honest.” (35:23)
  • “Performing is… an art. There’s supposed to be humanness in it.” (37:46)
• On video game soundtracks:
  • Dan: “Inline skating will never be as cool as skateboarding.” (44:38)
• On the surprise of ‘The Reason’ as a hit:
  • “Never had any intention or foresight to see what it would do.” – Doug Robb (55:19)
• On risk, reward, and getting older:
  • Danielle: “Balancing risk versus reward. I’m so good at it now... what’s the reward here?” (39:01)
• On new music and contentment:
  • Doug: “Do I like the songs… do I like the process? … I win. We win.” (62:39)

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Important Timestamps

• 04:23 – Reminiscing about the Ventura County border, high school rivalries, and defunct Valley spots
• 10:08 – Stories from the Cobalt Café's heyday
• 13:47 – Battle of the Bands, band formation, and camaraderie
• 19:59 – Discussing Incubus and local scene’s influence
• 24:31 – Linkin Park's Mike Shinoda memories and yearbook stories
• 26:56 – The debate over changing the name “Hoobastank”
• 29:41 – Origins of "Topanga" as a character name
• 32:19 – Early bad gigs and MTV VMA disaster
• 35:23 – Coping with onstage mistakes and industry pressure
• 40:52 – Band name showdown: Hoobastank vs. other Y2K bands
• 43:39 – Cultural importance of being featured in video games
• 45:36 – Dan’s mini bike accident and brain surgery story
• 54:24 – Writing and releasing “The Reason”
• 59:49 – Creating the new single “How Do You Sleep?” and future plans

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Tone & Atmosphere

The episode maintains a warm, funny, and self-deprecating Valley-teen energy. Danielle, Doug, and Dan’s banter is relaxed and candid, embracing nostalgia while unafraid to reflect on embarrassing or formative moments. There’s a sense of mutual respect and humor—about past pranks, career high (and low) lights, and the strange paths that led to adulthood.

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For Listeners

Fans of Hoobastank, late-90s/2000s pop-punk/alt-rock, or anyone with Valley roots will especially resonate with this episode’s heartfelt nostalgia and insider details. The episode is not only a trip through the band's history, but also a meditation on how formative years—friendships, failures, and even band names that “stuck”—shape the artists we love today.

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Next Steps: Catch Hoobastank’s new single “How Do You Sleep?” on streaming platforms, and subscribe to Teen Beat for more deep-dive interviews into the adolescent moments that shaped your favorite stars.

Transcript

[Doug Robb]

This is an iHeart podcast.

[Danielle Fishel]

Guaranteed Human. This is Danielle Fishel Ryder strong and

[Doug Robb]

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[Danielle Fishel]

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[Doug Robb]

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[Danielle Fishel]

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[Dan Estrin]

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[Doug Robb]

Redefine design, improve performance.

[Danielle Fishel]

This is whole home scenting elevated.

[Doug Robb]

Visit pura.com home to upgrade your space. On Raiders of the Lost podcast we explore cinema like no one else, including huge interviews with stars like Ryan Gosling on Project Hail Mary. It was like the Jaws shark. Didn't always work, came with its own problems. That's what made it great. The cast of Obsession on set. There was so much magic happening with each scene. We were putting together deep dives into classics like Tooth 2001, A Space Odyssey or Fight Club. Plus weekly episodes on all industry news. Listen to Raiders of the Lost podcast on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. And for more, follow aidersofthelostpodcast and at TikTok Podcast Network on TikTok.

[Dan Estrin]

Can superstars even exist the way they used to?

[Doug Robb]

2016 was sort of that last era of monoculture where we still consume things in community.

[Dan Estrin]

Everybody wanted to be Beyonce at that point. Ugh. I don't think we'll ever see another Rihanna. What does it mean to be black

[Danielle Fishel]

and eat in America?

[Dan Estrin]

You will never make me feel bad for being a black girl. For being a black American girl ever. From music to food to the conversations shaping black culture, right now, therapy for black girls is bringing it all to the mic. Listen to therapy for black Girls on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Doug Robb]

It just came out. Jeremy, what did you just do? You just set yourself up for failure.

[Dan Estrin]

I've never heard you tell this story.

[Doug Robb]

I've never told this story. This must have been tucked deep, deep

[Dan Estrin]

in the Jeremy Lin file.

[Doug Robb]

My name is MC Gin.

[Dan Estrin]

Excited to tell you about Laugh but not least. I'll be chatting with guests from all

[Doug Robb]

walks of life about the power of humor.

[Dan Estrin]

When it comes to facing difficult times, these will be conversations that remind us

[Doug Robb]

all life is hard.

[Dan Estrin]

Laugh harder. Listen.

[Doug Robb]

And last but not least, with MC Gen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts

[Dan Estrin]

or wherever you get your podcast.

[Doug Robb]

Give me money for cigarettes. I'll never leave your cooking bed. I stay the night. And one night Weekend, two or three years. The kids are not all right. But that's okay. Cause no one hear it.

[Danielle Fishel]

Take me. Hello, friends. I'm Danielle Fishel, and it's time again for Teen Beat, a podcast where I interview interesting people who have done interesting things in an attempt to uncover the realities of their youth before the spotlight. Because we know our teenage years can act as a blueprint for who we are today. I am a perfect example of this. I spent my entire youth playing a type A success obsessed overachiever. And in turn, I grew up to be. Well, maybe I'm a little too on the nose here. I see it this way. I gave you my childhood. It's time we hear yours. And this week, I'm excited to learn more about a band that not only helped define every good mixtape I've ever made, they also helped define my zip code. Born from the inspiration of punk and ska, the band with the worst and absolute best name in music has sold a staggering total of 10 million albums worldwide. Their sophomore album, 2003's the Reason, has a title track that rivals the O.C. tony Hawk's Pro Skater and Von Dutch as the most peak Y2K things I can reference. And now, over 30 years since forming six studio albums later, they've released their first new song in eight years, how do youo Sleep? A throwback to their punk roots. And I, for one, love it. This week's Teen Beat guest the pride of Ventura County's border. It's Doug Robb and Dan Estrin of Hoobastank. Welcome, gentlemen.

[Dan Estrin]

Thank you for having us.

[Doug Robb]

The pride of Ventura County's border. I was like, that's so accurate.

[Danielle Fishel]

How does that feel?

[Dan Estrin]

The border.

[Doug Robb]

The Ventura county border is like up the street from my house.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yes.

[Doug Robb]

So really right there. Nailed it.

[Dan Estrin]

Yeah.

[Danielle Fishel]

Pinpoint it to the. To the location. Thank you so much for coming on the show. Fair warning. Up top. I am legally forced start with 818 talk whenever a fellow Valley kids are on the podcast. So you are Agora High School alumni.

[Dan Estrin]

Right.

[Danielle Fishel]

And I am a Calabasas graduate. In some circles, we might be considered rivals.

[Doug Robb]

Chargers versus Coyotes.

[Danielle Fishel]

Exactly. But we can all agree that tearing down the Agora Man 8 was absolutely criminal.

[Dan Estrin]

Right. That just recently happened. Right.

[Doug Robb]

I drive by that every day. Going to the gym. Yeah. And I still look at it going, dude, I have so. I had so many memories there. So many great memories there.

[Danielle Fishel]

So many memories there.

[Doug Robb]

Yeah.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Doug Robb]

Pretty cool parking lot though, now, is it? Well, yeah.

[Danielle Fishel]

The commons, they just tore down the movie theater. In the commons.

[Doug Robb]

Right. That being said, I'm not one of those guys that. Or that. That just is, like, things need to stay the same. It's.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Doug Robb]

I don't fight the tide, like, totally. At some point when all this construction is done, I'm sure it'll look great. And the people who grow up with that will then see that as their core memory. And then they can complain later on when. When it gets torn down.

[Danielle Fishel]

Correct. I.

[Dan Estrin]

Do you remember we rode bikes through

[Doug Robb]

to the movie theater?

[Dan Estrin]

Yeah. On a Friday night. We were out with, like, 14 friends on bikes in Agora and had nothing to do while everybody was out at parties getting drunk and stuff. Us and 14 of our friends rode BMX bikes through the side exit while people were coming out straight down the hallway through. Through the Agora movie theater and out door. It was pretty funny.

[Danielle Fishel]

Were you guys straight edge?

[Dan Estrin]

We. We didn't, like, claim it.

[Doug Robb]

Not. Yeah. Not like we didn't wear it on our sleeves. You know, we had friends that partied and drank and did drugs and stuff like that, but we weren't the ones doing it, you know, it was like. It was just a choice. Like, we just decided we didn't want to do it.

[Dan Estrin]

We got off on, like, going to these high school parties, and everybody was kind of getting wasted, and we would be watching people dancing and doing whatever they're doing. And we'd go over to the thermostat. We'd. While they're sweating, and we'd start to turn it up hotter and hotter and hotter and watched. Yeah.

[Doug Robb]

We just pranked everybody.

[Danielle Fishel]

That's a perfect prank. Cause it's completely harmless, you know, like.

[Dan Estrin]

And it's really funny.

[Danielle Fishel]

It's a funny prank. Everyone suffers a little, but it's. No one really gets hurt, you know? That's really good.

[Dan Estrin]

You're burning calories.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah, exactly.

[Doug Robb]

Nobody suffers.

[Dan Estrin]

Nobody suffers.

[Doug Robb]

They're concerned about their health.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay, I will get this out of the way now. Did you hang out at the Topanga Mall?

[Dan Estrin]

Topanga.

[Doug Robb]

Nice. Dude, that's awesome. You know you have to go everywhere with her, don't you?

[Danielle Fishel]

Every follows me around.

[Doug Robb]

That's a good job.

[Dan Estrin]

Doug actually grew up in Agora, and I grew up in Calabasas.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay.

[Dan Estrin]

But I went to Agora.

[Danielle Fishel]

Right.

[Dan Estrin]

So I grew up right behind the high school.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay.

[Dan Estrin]

And so, yes, I was at the Topanga Mall back when they had an ice skating ring.

[Doug Robb]

Yeah. And I was like. And prior to that, I lived all over the valley, like, probably. My parents moved to Agora when I Was in third grade.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay.

[Doug Robb]

But we lived in Canoga park in Tarzana. Like, it's Encino. It was everywhere.

[Dan Estrin]

Everywhere.

[Doug Robb]

Same with him. I remember going to the Topanga Plaza.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yep.

[Doug Robb]

You don't have a little jingle for Topanga Plaza. We'll do it again with the ice skating rink.

[Dan Estrin]

Yeah.

[Doug Robb]

And the Orange Julius. And wasn't there. I want to say one of my older brothers worked at the Puppin Taco. Like, on Topanga. It was across the street from what was like a skate park or some kind of big slide. I remember being really young. Now I'm starting.

[Dan Estrin]

Like, there was a big golf.

[Doug Robb]

Like, was it like a golf and

[Dan Estrin]

stuff type of a thing? Did it have a slide over where the Village is on the corner of Victory in Topanga? I don't remember if there was, but it closed down when we were really. Really.

[Doug Robb]

I saw Empire Strikes Back and Indiana Jones and the Temple Doom at the Topanga Theater. So going way back now.

[Danielle Fishel]

Going way back. I. I'm still devastated that the rubies is gone.

[Dan Estrin]

Dude, wasn't I talking about this in

[Danielle Fishel]

the car just today? You were talking.

[Doug Robb]

We were talking about rubies.

[Dan Estrin]

Well.

[Doug Robb]

Well, I was talking.

[Dan Estrin]

I had. I had seen something recently on Instagram that you had done, and you were talking about places in the Valley, and. And you brought up rubies and rubies.

[Doug Robb]

And I was your thing because you stopped eating red meat. And that was one of the few places besides Fat Burger that served turkey burgers. So that was like. It was like, if we were gonna go eat, it was Fat Burger or Ruby's.

[Dan Estrin]

And I went to Ruby's when we would come home from tour or even. Even a little bit before that. I was there, like, three days a week. I had their sweatshirt.

[Danielle Fishel]

Like, I still have my Ruby sweatshirt. I actually have art in my house of rubies on the pier.

[Dan Estrin]

Scooby Dooby down to Ruby's or something like that.

[Danielle Fishel]

Absolutely.

[Dan Estrin]

And when I go to.

[Danielle Fishel]

I'll.

[Dan Estrin]

I'll go to Orange county just to go eat at Ruby's.

[Danielle Fishel]

Same.

[Dan Estrin]

And if you drive by that promenade area and you look up on there.

[Danielle Fishel]

Still there.

[Dan Estrin]

It's still. It's kind of says it. And I shed a tear every time I drive by.

[Danielle Fishel]

I'm telling you. How could we not keep rubies alive in the Valley? Like, I feel like we need.

[Dan Estrin]

This will bring it back.

[Danielle Fishel]

Maybe this podcast. If there's one thing I want to be known for, it's bringing back a rubies. Okay. One place I know you both also hung out was the Cobalt Cafe. Which was a now defunct music venue in Canoga Park. Somewhat legendary early stops for bands like afi, Less Than Jake, and yes, Hoobastank. Tell me about the Cobalt Cafe and what it meant to you as teens.

[Doug Robb]

I think the honest answer is, back then, there wasn't a lot of places to play semi locally, you know, like, if we wanted to play shows that weren't high school parties and stuff like that, we had to go down to the city. And it's difficult to get a bunch of teenage kids to go down to Hollywood all the time, you know?

[Dan Estrin]

Yeah.

[Doug Robb]

And I don't know how did we stumble across that as a place to play, But I remember, however it was. It was like, oh, you know, this is cool. It's kind of like a living room. Like, we're playing in someone's living room. Let's just do it. It's a place to play. And the shows themselves turned out to be so much. They were like house parties, like bodies flying all over, kicking stuff off the ceiling. And it was so low budget and, like, do it yourself.

[Dan Estrin]

Mm.

[Doug Robb]

It kind of fit the vibe.

[Danielle Fishel]

The vibe of the music.

[Doug Robb]

Yeah. So it was cool. But I don't know how we. We stumbled upon.

[Dan Estrin]

Well, when we were going to. When we were in high school, there was a band that was a little bit younger than us that had a show there, and I remember going to see them play there. And because I lived off of Valley Circle, I would just shoot up Topanga to Sherman Way, and there it was. And I went and saw them there, and I. And it was. At that point, it was. It was kind of nice. It was a nice place where you go. And you walk up and you get your latte and whatever it was and a book or, you know, there was seats everywhere that were spread out, and it was. It was clean and nice, and I just remember kind of going like, oh, okay. There's a. There's a venue to a degree that's kind of close, and the stage is about this high. Really, really crappy PA system. Horrible light system, no lights.

[Doug Robb]

We would just stand in the back and flick the lights off and on.

[Dan Estrin]

Yeah. There was a light switch. There was a light switch.

[Doug Robb]

We would joke around with other bands going, who's doing our lights tonight?

[Danielle Fishel]

Like, who's. Who's running your lights?

[Dan Estrin]

Yeah.

[Doug Robb]

Yeah. So it would be the opening band or the band behind us, like, just to. To push the fader up and down, like during cli. Like, climactic moments during the set.

[Dan Estrin]

Yeah. But we just ended up needing places to play, and we didn't really care where we played. And it was close enough to get a lot of our friends from school to come out. And it was super cheap, you know,

[Doug Robb]

it was like five bucks. Five bucks to get in or something like that. It was.

[Danielle Fishel]

Right.

[Doug Robb]

You know?

[Dan Estrin]

And we became friends with the owner, Dave, who I'll talk to still every once in a while. And, yeah, it's a bummer that it's not there anymore. They still actually do Cobalt Presents shows at different locations throughout the valley now.

[Danielle Fishel]

Right.

[Dan Estrin]

But he had to close it down, I think, during COVID or something like that. And now it's a. Like a flooring store. Because I go to Cabaret as the. The sandwich.

[Danielle Fishel]

The Italian love cavarettas.

[Doug Robb]

I still haven't eaten there yet.

[Danielle Fishel]

Gosh, you're missing out, dude.

[Dan Estrin]

It's really good, you guys.

[Danielle Fishel]

Like, I'm not into the bread.

[Dan Estrin]

Yeah, it's too hard, right? It's that. It's like.

[Doug Robb]

It's like eating fruit.

[Dan Estrin]

Yeah.

[Danielle Fishel]

It's like, I feel seen. My husband loves it.

[Doug Robb]

Really? I'm more of an Italia deli guy, so.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah, I love that place too.

[Doug Robb]

Yeah.

[Danielle Fishel]

I will also. The one thing I will say about is they have great cannoli.

[Dan Estrin]

I haven't tried good cannoli, but the times that I would. Well, the guy that I think owns. Used to. Used to work at Cabaret is, from what I've heard.

[Danielle Fishel]

Oh, okay.

[Dan Estrin]

And I do like their sandwiches, but they have. Don't they have two different breads there? You can get the crusty bread or the softer bread.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah, but the softer bread is still hard.

[Dan Estrin]

No, you're right. You're right.

[Doug Robb]

I don't like a sandwich where I

[Dan Estrin]

bite into it and everything shoots out the back of it.

[Danielle Fishel]

Exactly. No, thank you. By the way, every time we talk about and I complain about it, I bleep out on the podcast because I don't want to disparage the business. So it's kind of a running joke

[Dan Estrin]

that I have like.

[Danielle Fishel]

Like a terrible sandwiches.

[Dan Estrin]

I love. I would go to Cabaretta and they would just like, hey, Dan, so do you want. They knew what I wanted all the time. Yeah, it's my spot. I love.

[Danielle Fishel]

I love that feeling. You two met at a battle of the bands, right? Has enough time passed that you guys feel comfortable admitting whose band was better?

[Doug Robb]

We didn't meet in the battle bands, but that was our first performance together.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay.

[Dan Estrin]

You know what? There's things about his band at the time that I. That I looked at and was like, wow, there's things about them that I really like, that I would like our band to be more like.

[Doug Robb]

And vice versa. Like, okay, from my perspective, I was. I was playing bass in the band. I'm not a bass player. I was just a hack guitar player.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay.

[Doug Robb]

And I was filling in to play bass out of fomo, basically because my closest friend at the time was a singer and he was extremely charismatic guy. Like, that's. That's why we won the Battle of the Bands, because of him. He was a popular dude, extremely funny, very energetic, all that kind of stuff. But I remember looking at his band and going, oh, these guys are like players, like all, like, they're so good at what they do and being kind of the same thing. Like, God, dude, I wish. I wish my band knew how to play as well as they did. We're just covering Rage against the Machine and Alice in Chain stuff and you

[Dan Estrin]

guys were doing like, we were writing coverings. But I just remember not. Not ever feeling like it was a competition because growing up, idolizing, like, the Seattle bands, you know, they all seem to have this camaraderie between them that I always envied and. And I just liked having friends that were in bands.

[Danielle Fishel]

Right.

[Dan Estrin]

And his lead singer was also a close friend of mine. And that's kind of how Doug and I met.

[Doug Robb]

He was the bridge. Yeah.

[Dan Estrin]

And, yeah, I really liked just having other bands. That. And that. That same thing at Calabasas with the audio event guys, you know, the Boyds and Einsingers or whatever. You know, we just kind of grew up with that around. And before anybody had record deals. And it was nice seeing them at Arties, at their parents houses.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Dan Estrin]

Coming over and listening to our new songs and vice versa. It was.

[Danielle Fishel]

Right. It wasn't new. It wasn't a competitive thing. It was like, it helps to have more people like us around us.

[Doug Robb]

Yeah, it was. Everybody kind of supported each other and. And I felt there was a. It wasn't competitive, but there was a healthy competition. I don't. I don't want to say like. Like we're trying to beat them, but

[Danielle Fishel]

you raised each other's bars. Yes.

[Doug Robb]

I was like, I definitely think everybody kind of pushed each other to expand a little, get a little bit better, a little bit better.

[Danielle Fishel]

This is Danielle Fishel, Ryder Strong and

[Dan Estrin]

Will Friedle from Pod meets World.

[Danielle Fishel]

Your home tells a story and scent is part of it.

[Doug Robb]

With Pura's smart diffusers, every room can

[Dan Estrin]

have its own fragrance, its own feeling bright and energizing.

[Doug Robb]

In the kitchen, calm and grounding in the bedroom.

[Danielle Fishel]

Set schedules, adjust intensity, and control every diffuser right from the Pura app.

[Dan Estrin]

Your whole home scented exactly the way you want it.

[Doug Robb]

Visit pura.com wholehome to start building yours.

[Dan Estrin]

Hi, it's Alec Baldwin. This season on my podcast, here's the thing. I'm speaking with more artists, policymakers, and performers like composer Marc Shaiman. Once you've established that you have the talent, it's about the hang. It's the pleasure of hanging out with the people that you're with. You know, Rob and I was always a great hang. We would sit in kibbets for hours and then eventually get around to the music. That's what I mostly think of when I think of him. The time together. Laughing Lawyer Robbie Kaplan.

[Doug Robb]

The great gift of being a lawyer is the ability to actually change things in our society in a way that very few people can. You can really make a difference to causes in the United States if you bring the right case at the right time. Marriage equality.

[Dan Estrin]

Yeah.

[Doug Robb]

Windsor's the perfect example. Director Morgan Neville.

[Dan Estrin]

Film school teaches you all the wrong

[Doug Robb]

things about making documentary.

[Dan Estrin]

What do you want to say? Documentary is all about your ear. What do you hear?

[Doug Robb]

I feel like my job is listening really, really hard.

[Dan Estrin]

Listen to here's the thing on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Doug Robb]

We've all been there. We've had seasons that have shaken everything. The question is, what remains when the shaking stops? Hi, I'm Gary Valenciano, and on my podcast Unshaken with Gary Vee, I sit down with amazing personalities and we talk about the seasons that nearly broke them, the lows that carried them to their highs. Listen to Unshaken with Gary Vee on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Danielle Fishel]

Betrayal Weekly is back with brand new stories from threatening text messages disturbing a small Midwestern town. It was from an unknown number. Who else is getting these messages? Why did it start with us? To long cons and stolen identities.

[Doug Robb]

Who lies about being this sick? This was the last time I ever believed a word she said.

[Danielle Fishel]

New voices, each with the courage to tell their own stories. Story, he said.

[Doug Robb]

I have been kidnapped. Okay, just try and act normal. He was essentially on the run.

[Danielle Fishel]

Every family has secrets.

[Dan Estrin]

The rug had been pulled from underneath me.

[Danielle Fishel]

Oh, my God. It was right in front of my face and I didn't even see it. Listen to Betrayal weekly on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcasts. You Were part of a San Fernando Valley boom of bands in the late 90s to sign record deals, which included the Apple of the Calabasas, Eye Incubus. What role did they play in your careers? And getting the attention that then led to a record deal.

[Doug Robb]

Honestly, a huge one. Like, I think it's like you said, I always. Factually, but also just from my perception, they always seemed a couple. They were a couple years ahead of us. You know, like, they started a band a couple years before we did, et cetera, et cetera. They were. They were and are just amazing musicians. And at the time, I didn't see music as a legitimate career. Like, I grew up listening to, early on, Van Halen. And I don't know, the people that were professional musicians that I enjoyed were, like, virtuoso, the best of the best. Like, pro athletes. Like, you don't accidentally become a pro athlete. You know what I mean? So it was the same kind of mindset for music for me. So I loved it. I understood that I didn't have the. Means to get that good. I just wasn't that disciplined. I didn't have it. And then in high school, when Nirvana and the whole Seattle thing happened, it wasn't like all of. Someone said, hey, I could actually do this. But it did expose me to another side of music, writing, songwriting, that was like, oh, you don't have to shred over everything to use this as, like, an avenue. And so that kind of planted a seed of, maybe this is something I could do. But then, Dan, like you said, knowing these guys forever and being around them prior to their record deal, I kind of feel like they were the biggest local band for sure. And, you know, eventually playing shows with them and becoming friends with them and their brothers and stuff, when they got a record deal, which was, I think, like, in the late 90s, 98, 97, somewhere around then, it was probably a moment when I like, oh, my God, like, they're actually doing it. They're do. They're. That's what they're gonna do. Holy. This is. Is this, like a thing? Like, is this an option?

[Danielle Fishel]

Like, is this something we could do?

[Doug Robb]

Yeah.

[Danielle Fishel]

Is this.

[Doug Robb]

Is this a legitimate way to go through life? So it wasn't like they all of a sudden made me go, now we can do it. But it definitely made me go, oh, my God, dude, this is. It's not a pipe dream. They're actually gonna do this. And so it's very inspiring on that level, for sure. Again, kind of gave you the confidence, like, oh, if they can do it, then we can do it.

[Dan Estrin]

Yeah.

[Doug Robb]

And then like I said, along with opening for so many shows, playing so many shows with them. I mean, Dan, you used to go and tech for Mikey for fun, you know, just to get into shows and.

[Dan Estrin]

Yeah, I mean, I went to. Yeah, you've been doing it forever, right? So, so did I. And so I remember them and they were always, you know, like the cool dudes, like the cool guys. And I kind of got to know them a little bit after that, became friends with the guitar player. And we didn't, we weren't really. We were just kind of starting off as a band, but I knew that I wanted to play music and start a band. And they were a local band just playing local shows. And I would take my video, my VHS video camera with me everywhere. And so I would take. I would start to go to their shows with them and help them out with their equipment. Kind of like a roadie. A roadie before they were anything and whatever. So I have tons of old videos of them playing, like parties and just, oh, that's really small places all over the place. And so I got to, you know, stand on the side of the stage and watch them and hang with them, drive the shows early, help them with their equipment, just chat with them, go to their houses and watch them rehearse. And. And like he said, it was inspiring. And we were, we were all into the same types of bands at that point. We were inspired by the same types of bands, which I think ended up being the result of the sounds to a degree of.

[Doug Robb]

I mean, it's the same, same musical influences, same, you know, skating and beach, lifestyle type, the environment, you know, it shapes, it shapes what you, what you sound like. And so, yeah, it was, it was a, it was a cool time.

[Danielle Fishel]

And over at your high school, the origins of Linkin park were also born. Did you guys know Mike Shinoda growing up?

[Dan Estrin]

Yeah.

[Doug Robb]

Yeah.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay.

[Doug Robb]

Yeah. I was like, what is it, your yearbook? One of those yearbooks he, he signed, like, basically, oh, you're going to be a famous musician. I'm going to do your artwork for you.

[Dan Estrin]

So back in high school, he wasn't a musician. I mean, he was a, he was a musician. I, I guess I'm sure he played piano and whatever he did. And he. I feel like I remember him being into hip hop music back then, but he was the grade below me and we were friends. I knew him. And same with the guitar player, Brad. I was tight with Brad, but I remember graduating high school, you Know, everybody signs the yearbooks and seeing it, whatever it is. And he, and he drew a picture in my yearbook and wrote something about, you know, I'll buy your albums when you get famous, whatever, and you buy my T shirts. Because he was, he was doing art.

[Doug Robb]

I think he was more known for being an artist. Yeah.

[Dan Estrin]

And it's cool. We run into those guys every now and then over the years. And you know, over the years he will always, he always tells the same story about how I protected him from a bully in high school. And I don't fully remember, but I kind of remember he, yeah, he was just, he was cool. And I think there was like these, you might remember these like wannabe gangster type of kids that were in Agora and Calabasas and I mean, but some of those kids actually committed murder.

[Danielle Fishel]

Correct. Some of those kids have movies about them.

[Doug Robb]

Yeah.

[Dan Estrin]

And I went to high school with those kids and, and some of them I think might have used to mess with him or something. I don't remember what it was, but I was a year older and just thought they thought it was lame. And I think I stood up for him one time or something like that, but, but yeah.

[Doug Robb]

Did you see him in Portugal last week? A couple weeks ago.

[Dan Estrin]

We, we, we were just in Portugal doing a festival with them and I, I, I didn't talk to him, no. But I, I, they were there. But the last time I saw him was last year. We did a festival together and we hung out a little bit with them backstage and chatted and it's cool.

[Danielle Fishel]

I mean, Mike made us some beautiful art as a wedding present that's hanging in our house. He combined all of the things that Jensen and I love and painted them on. And Rubies, Rubies is on there. Wu Tang is on there. It's quite a mashup. But it's very special to us. So Mike is close and special to us. Did you guys ever think of changing your name? Like, what other options did you have for band names?

[Doug Robb]

Yes, the short answer is yes. We. Ubistank was perfect for a bunch of 18 year olds, like playing, you know, house parties and ska, metal, punk music, you know, it was perfect. But by 2000, when we had a record deal offer, we didn't actually sign as Hoops think. We just signed as the individual members because it was kind of like, all right, we have what if. Yeah, we're a decent. We've, we've spent the last five years, you know, building up what we have. But now potentially it's going to Go national or global, now's the time to. If we're ever going to switch it, now's the time.

[Danielle Fishel]

Did you guys think of that yourselves or did the label say something to you?

[Doug Robb]

I want to say, no. We did.

[Danielle Fishel]

So smart.

[Doug Robb]

We're like, okay, this is. This is. We've it. You know, time to shed the baby teeth.

[Dan Estrin]

Yeah.

[Doug Robb]

You know, and then we. We played a show at the Whiskey, and our A and R guy was at the show, and at some point in the show, they were. They were. The audience was chanting, hooba stack.

[Dan Estrin]

Hooba stack.

[Danielle Fishel]

Right.

[Doug Robb]

Show's over. So we're in the dressing room, and he comes up and he just. You guys cannot change that name.

[Danielle Fishel]

Don't even think about it.

[Dan Estrin]

Yeah.

[Doug Robb]

And I'm like, I remember even poo pooing it. They were like, dude, forget it. We'll have this conversation later because it's done. We're not. We're changing the name. And though that never happened, we were convinced to keep the name, change the spelling of it, but keep the pronunciation the same. And, yeah, like you said earlier, it's the worst and best name ever. Yeah.

[Dan Estrin]

It was never anything that we were super proud of. It wasn't like we were like, we got the name. It was kind of the opposite, and it still is the opposite. It's. We. We realize how stupid it is. And I've always said that it's Doug, and I actually don't have any tattoos, but it's kind of like your first tattoo that you might regret. Of course, when you're.

[Danielle Fishel]

I had a butterfly tramp stamp that was sitting pencil. Like, sad. Yeah, I had it removed. I mean, that kind, you know. Yes. That was my first tattoo.

[Doug Robb]

You have your A R guy convince you to keep it.

[Danielle Fishel]

My guy had no idea. No say in it.

[Dan Estrin]

So it's. Yeah, it's kind of like that. Except for we kept our tramp stamp. And listen, our.

[Doug Robb]

Our barbed wire tribal armbands. We still have them, but. But eventually, yeah, like, eventually those armbands are going to be cool again. Or if they are not already, for sure.

[Dan Estrin]

Some people think it's the coolest thing ever, and it makes the most sense. And others think it's the dumbest thing ever. And we're like, we get it. We get how stupid it is. If you like it, cool. If you don't, we don't care.

[Doug Robb]

It doesn't. It's just a name.

[Danielle Fishel]

It's just a name. Also, sometimes something salient is more important than something good. Like Topanga is The most salient name maybe, of any TV character ever. And that doesn't necessarily mean that the name Topanga for a person is great. But, like, I will be known for the rest of my. No one will ever forget Topanga from Boy Meet. Like, that show. Like, that's so it.

[Dan Estrin]

How did that come about?

[Danielle Fishel]

So we don't fully know. We don't know the true story. Lots of different people have taken credit for it. The most commonly told story, and certainly the funniest, is that Michael Jacobs, the executive producer and showrunner, was driving from Hidden Hills to Burbank, where we were shooting, and they called and were like, we need a name for this character. And he was at the 101 in Topanga, and he looked up and said, topanga. And said, had they called me one minute later, she would have been De Soto.

[Dan Estrin]

Right.

[Doug Robb]

Or Reseda.

[Danielle Fishel]

Or Reseda Tampa. So that's the story told. But there. There have been, like, four or five different people who said, that's not true. I created the character. I came up with the name.

[Doug Robb]

I would say, don't trust those people.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah. Just go with the Dishonored story.

[Doug Robb]

I like the. More like, I saw it and that's it.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Doug Robb]

The other one's, like, I created that.

[Danielle Fishel]

The one thing I would say is that Topanga was a flower child. She had hippie parents, Jedediah and Chloe. Her father was a luthier. Luthier Lu. And so the idea that Topanga was started because Topanga Canyon was a hippie hangout is. Is what? When people say, like, it was thought out for me, this character, this flower child, what would her parents have named her? And they picked a place where maybe she would have been conceived. That was kind of the other backstory.

[Dan Estrin]

So it's just coincidental that you were there in Calabasas going to Calabasas High School, where Topanga Canyon was right up the street.

[Danielle Fishel]

Correct.

[Dan Estrin]

I always was like, there's a connection somewhere, you know?

[Danielle Fishel]

No, that was just coincidental. I was. That I was cast as the person living in Calabasas, and that the. The Topanga Mall was my mall. Yeah. Very kismet. You know, like, things just work out the way they're supposed to. Do you remember your worst early show? Like, you guys have formed a band, and now you're gonna go perform somewhere and just. It's terrible. Or were you always awesome?

[Dan Estrin]

No, no, no. We've had a lot of horrible shows, I'm sure. But some of those ended up, in hindsight, were probably none of it matters.

[Doug Robb]

None of that matters. I was like, horrible show is all. It's all here.

[Dan Estrin]

Like Summerfest, which we call Summer Flop.

[Doug Robb]

Yeah. Like, is it horrible because there's nobody there?

[Danielle Fishel]

Uh huh.

[Doug Robb]

What if. What if you performed beautifully for nobody? Does that make it a bad show? I don't know. Like, back then it might have. Cause it's all ego. I'm getting a little too. Like, you're very deep, deep about this. Yeah, well, it's because we've been doing it for so long. At some point you have to, you know, all shows are not created equal. At some point you have to figure out what it is that makes you comfortable. Like, is it how well you do or how well you feel you've done? Did you sing well? Did you perform well? Did you. Did the audience like it. Did they. Was it large but unengaged? Was it small but totally locked in? Like, what do you prefer? And I think you just have to take the wins from that. I was just thinking the first show that we did, though, that I felt awkward was pretty early on. It was the show at the Las Palmas Theater. And that was only like our second club show ever. Like, we'd only done like house parties and we did a show at the Roxy. And I think our second club show was at the Las Palmas Theater. And I remember thinking the show at the Roxy was awesome. Lots of people, like, the bar was set.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Doug Robb]

And then we go play this other show at a different club not too, like, long after. And there was nobody there.

[Danielle Fishel]

Right.

[Doug Robb]

And I don't necessarily remember thinking like, God, this sucks. But I, I just. When you said that, I was like, I remember going, oh, okay, it's not all, it's not all good.

[Dan Estrin]

Like, I think one of the worst shows that we had would have been in the height of everything. And, and it was when we did the MTV music awards, the VMAs. And that was because we get, you know, you go to do these things and there's rehearsals. You're going to be on television performing, and it's live. There's these rehearsals day before, and you're getting all the sound dialed in. You're getting. We. We run in ear monitors so we can hear everything that way. So there's no monitors for us to hear ourselves on stage. You're.

[Doug Robb]

I don't even think there's amps right.

[Dan Estrin]

Or there, I don't remember. But you're relying on everything that's coming through here in your ears. And we went through the rehear the day before, dialed everything In. It was great. And then we're up on stage the day of at the VMAs. You guys are going in two minutes, whatever it is. We're like, okay, cool. Yeah, we're gonna be on tv. Cool. MTV Music Awards. And then it starts. And everything was off in ears, so we couldn't hear what we were doing, which was hard for all of us. But specifically, probably you. Cause you had to sing. I could at least be like, pop one out and kind of hear a little bit what I was doing. And it was challenging because you're trying to.

[Doug Robb]

It was terrifying.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yes.

[Doug Robb]

Live music Award show. You know, we're not even playing a full song. I think we're playing, like 90 seconds of something, and boom, we walk out. And I think it was at the arena in Miami. So it's all just noise. It's live audience and stuff like that. And I'm like, dude, something doesn't feel right. And I immediately realized that nothing's working at all. Not even like, oh, it's too loud. It's just not working. So I. I pop my things out and I'm trying to go by what I'm hearing, right? But there's all the slap back and whatever. And basically it was like flying blindfolded, you know, Like. And, you know, I did the best I could at the time, but. But it was a wreck. It was 90 seconds of pure terror. Anxiety and terror. Yeah. To which, like, I spent the next decade plus trying to work through, to be honest. Really, like, dude, any. Any type of little hiccup in a performance, especially if it was, like, on radio or on tv, like, that would trigger this, right? That. That thing again. Yeah. And the thing. Honestly, I didn't care that much. I just didn't care. I'm like, oh, it's 90 seconds. It was bad. Whatever like that. But people are just ruthless, you know?

[Dan Estrin]

Yeah.

[Doug Robb]

And I. Honestly, if it happened now, I would be able to go, like, you guys, I don't care. Like, I don't care.

[Danielle Fishel]

Whatever.

[Doug Robb]

This is what happened. I don't care. But at that point in our career, that point of me just being a human being, it was too. I didn't have enough confidence to shield from outside opinion.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yes.

[Doug Robb]

Like. Like I said today, I would. I could care less, right.

[Danielle Fishel]

If I.

[Doug Robb]

My pants fell down in the middle, I wouldn't go. Whatever. I would. I'd laugh about it. But at that time, I was too vulnerable to that. Like, I still was leaning on what people's opinions were of the band. And of course, oh, my God. You didn't think I sounded good? Like, ah, yeah, that was a tough one to get through. That was. That was probably a moment. Performing in this band.

[Danielle Fishel]

Did it ever make you, like, refuse to wear in ears, like, no, I can't trust that I don't want to do it.

[Doug Robb]

No, it didn't. It just made me go like, what it really did is it made me be less harsh on other people.

[Dan Estrin]

It did.

[Doug Robb]

It made me go like, you know what?

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah, dude.

[Doug Robb]

This is a complicated, you know, industry. Performing is not, you know, it's. It's. It's an art. There's supposed to be humanness in it.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Doug Robb]

And if you mess up, that's fine. That's fine.

[Dan Estrin]

Right.

[Doug Robb]

Whereas in the past, I might have been like, oh, that person sounded terrible. Oh, my God.

[Dan Estrin]

You know. Right.

[Danielle Fishel]

They don't have talent.

[Doug Robb]

Yeah. Not even that, but just.

[Danielle Fishel]

They don't know what they're doing.

[Doug Robb]

Just been kind of dumb and immature about it. And it really made me go like, oh, dude, like, now I'm on that side of the fence. Like, it's one of the reasons why I'll never accept singing the National Anthem anywhere.

[Dan Estrin]

Oh.

[Doug Robb]

Because I've been offered a bunch and I've said no every time. And they're like, why? Like, it's going to be Monday Night Football. We're going to fly out to Philly. Like, Howard Benson was like, oh, I'll go too. We're going to do the whole thing. I'm like, howard, if I nail it. If I nail it, it's forgotten by kickoff.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Doug Robb]

If I it up, it's immortalized. It's literally a lose lose. There's no win in this at all. And I don't even care. I'm not even like, oh, it's something I died to do. Just don't want to do it.

[Danielle Fishel]

One of the things I say often that I am thankful gets better with age, is balancing risk versus reward. I'm so good at it now. I'm like, what's the reward? What's the reward here? Yeah.

[Doug Robb]

What am I. Yeah.

[Danielle Fishel]

What is the thing I would hope happens? And like you said, you go out there and nail it. And guess what? It means nothing to me. Nobody except for you. And then the risk, like you mentioned, you botch the National Anthem. It's talked about for a few days.

[Doug Robb]

Right.

[Danielle Fishel]

And it lives forever on the Internet. And you end up in clip shows as top 10 worst, you know. No, this, this is.

[Doug Robb]

There's a certain amount of. Of. Because there's so much media in general in all forms, that even the worst, what you might consider the most embarrassing, whatever, mess up, just doesn't have a life span anymore.

[Danielle Fishel]

I know.

[Doug Robb]

Doesn't.

[Danielle Fishel]

I know.

[Doug Robb]

I don't know if that's good or bad. Plus the shamelessness of society in general. But, yeah, I don't. Yeah. It's like, you can mess up so bad now, right. And think in the moment. This is my life. I've basically done something so harmful to myself or career or whatever like that. And realize if you just stick your head out the window, nobody's paying attention. Nobody's paying. And even the ones that are, tomorrow, they will be paying attention to something else.

[Danielle Fishel]

Exactly.

[Doug Robb]

Like, it's kind of crazy how short the attention span has become even for.

[Danielle Fishel]

And we have a friend, too, who says that the only people who will talk to you about it, like, the people who will bring it up to you, are the people, like, the people closest to you. But he says it's not fair. They basically have Google alerts for you on their phone. Like, you know them so well. It's being fed directly to them as if they had a Google alert. That's not what the population is like. No one knows. No one gives a shit. Okay. I wanted to list a few other bands from your class or groups who've just played Warped Tour around the time that you did. Maybe even names that have been mentioned in the same breath as Hoobastank at some point. And I want you to tell me who has the better name. Them. Or Hoobastank.

[Doug Robb]

Okay.

[Danielle Fishel]

Alien Ant Farm.

[Dan Estrin]

Who has a better name?

[Doug Robb]

I think that's a clever name. I've always thought it was a clever name. We love those guys.

[Dan Estrin]

Yeah. I don't know. I. Yeah, absolutely love those guys.

[Danielle Fishel]

I'm not trying to start any beef,

[Dan Estrin]

but I've always felt like their name was a little great. It was awesome.

[Danielle Fishel]

So we're gonna go with Hoobastank on that one.

[Doug Robb]

I don't like that. It's three words. How about that?

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay. Right.

[Doug Robb]

I'll take. I'll take Hooba Stack. Okay.

[Danielle Fishel]

Bowling for Soup. Another three word.

[Doug Robb]

Another band that I love, like, personally, but I've never liked that. I've never liked that name either.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay.

[Dan Estrin]

We had. We did a show with them not too long ago, and Jarrett, the lead singer, wanted to do a tick tock with us about that. Like, who has the dumber name?

[Doug Robb]

Right.

[Dan Estrin]

And we ended up not doing it, but we will.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay.

[Doug Robb]

But that's another thing. That, like, I don't spend any time thinking about, like.

[Danielle Fishel]

Right.

[Doug Robb]

I don't see those guys and go bowling for sleep. What a silly name. No, it's the name.

[Dan Estrin]

Yeah. At some point, it's just Jamiroquai or Chumbawamba or, you know, it just becomes the name.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yes.

[Doug Robb]

Yeah.

[Dan Estrin]

As stupid as it may sound when

[Doug Robb]

you first hear it, when I hear

[Dan Estrin]

you say our band name, I kind of. I'm like. And not because it's you. It's just hearing our name. Sometimes, like, if I run into somebody and like, oh, you play in a band? Oh, what's. What's. And I'm just waiting. I just. I'm waiting for it.

[Doug Robb]

Like, oh, what do you play?

[Dan Estrin]

I play guitar. What's the band called?

[Danielle Fishel]

Darn it.

[Dan Estrin]

I got it. And it's either. They either know it right away, like, really? Or it's, what? What? And I gotta say it again. And.

[Doug Robb]

Yeah, that's the worst. Oops. Mistake. No, no, like.

[Dan Estrin]

Like Scuba Tank.

[Doug Robb]

Yeah, yeah.

[Dan Estrin]

Scuba Stank. You know,

[Doug Robb]

what about.

[Danielle Fishel]

I wrestled a bear once.

[Doug Robb]

That's a band.

[Dan Estrin]

That's a band.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Dan Estrin]

You just make that up now. It really is a band. I think Hubisang is.

[Danielle Fishel]

We're getting easier. I set my friends on fire.

[Doug Robb]

So I'm not a big fan. See, I don't know these bands personally, and I'll just go out. I'm just gonna say that they're better than us so I don't hurt any feelings. Okay. All these bands that you're saying they're better than us. But I've never been a fan of bands with long names. Like.

[Danielle Fishel]

That long. Yeah, yeah.

[Doug Robb]

Like, I'm just like, dude, come on, come on.

[Danielle Fishel]

Don't give us a mouthful.

[Dan Estrin]

Who else you got right?

[Danielle Fishel]

Gardening, not architecture. Yeah, see, that's a really hard one.

[Doug Robb]

Like I said, these are great bands. They're better than us. They're more successful, they're better looking. All of it. They're all of it. But I've just never been a fan of the long names like that. But like I said, who cares? Who cares? My band's called Hoobastang.

[Dan Estrin]

Who am I to Josh?

[Doug Robb]

Who am I to say anything?

[Danielle Fishel]

I did notice a sentence that I think might be the most. Most Y2K group of words ever uttered. And it really only works with your name. Kubastank's first single, Crawling in the Dark, was featured in the PlayStation 2 rollerblading game Aggressive in line.

[Doug Robb]

I think he just opened a portal.

[Danielle Fishel]

Can you tell our younger listeners how important it was to have a song in a video game.

[Doug Robb]

I didn't know at the time, to be honest with you. I didn't. I remember our manager at the time just going like, yeah, we're gonna put it in this and this and this. And I'm like, why?

[Danielle Fishel]

Why?

[Doug Robb]

Yeah, who cares? Like, and then, you know, time passes and we see kids at shows going, oh my God, that's like my favorite song in this game.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Doug Robb]

I'm like, oh, man.

[Dan Estrin]

I always thought it was when people would say that they heard our song in that. I always thought to myself, like, it's just not as cool as it being in Tony Hawk Pro Skater, which it wasn't in. And I'm like, if it was in,

[Doug Robb]

it will never be. No, no. Inline skating will never be as cool as skateboarding.

[Danielle Fishel]

That is my favorite video game.

[Dan Estrin]

Tony Hawk of all time.

[Danielle Fishel]

Oh, yeah, I played that game, dude.

[Doug Robb]

I just had a flashback of the sound of you playing that in the back of the bus. Just imagine, just close your eyes and just hear the PlayStation controller going and stopping. And you don't even realize what you're doing. You're just going all these numbers, the dice and all these tricks and everything.

[Dan Estrin]

Yeah, yeah. Such a great. The first one was such a great game. I still have it. I think it was on like PlayStation 2.

[Danielle Fishel]

It was PlayStation 2. I could. I. There were a couple of days when I was not working and I was like, oh, I've played this for nine hours. I played this for nine hours today. It was as if I had a full time job.

[Doug Robb]

How many combos can you do?

[Dan Estrin]

That's what we. We would have competitions to see who could get more combos. We wouldn't even play the game. That's what we were doing. We'd pass the controller to the next guy. Okay, you, you do a combo?

[Doug Robb]

Yeah, you got to do ten in a row. Like,

[Danielle Fishel]

I also realized while you were recording your second album, Dan, you were seriously injured in a mini bike accident. Can we know all the details about that, please?

[Dan Estrin]

Yeah, we had just actually finished recording. And did we even release the record yet?

[Doug Robb]

No, it was in between. Like we had recorded it and mixed it and mastered it. Like the artwork that time between our job being done and the record label now taking it and setting up like marketing and stuff like that. So there's a few month window.

[Dan Estrin]

We had just started this tour. We were In Myrtle Beach, S.C. we had to go early in the morning to a morning radio station to go do an interview, Doug and I, and we had Our radio rep pick us up, who we ended up becoming friends with. And so we're like, hey, after the interview, can you take us somewhere cool? Whatever. And I don't know. We ended up at this meet at a place that sold mini bikes. And Doug and I and our bass player and. Well, we. All four of us, we bought these. These bikes. These little mini.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Doug Robb]

Pocket rocket, like.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay. Yep.

[Dan Estrin]

Gas powered. Tiny. You look like clowns riding them. And we bought them that. That day.

[Danielle Fishel]

You're a tall guy.

[Dan Estrin]

I mean, thank you.

[Danielle Fishel]

I need to be on a little bike.

[Dan Estrin]

I actually still have the bike. It's in my garage. And so we bought these bikes. I remember being super excited because I. I had seen them in like. Like movies when I was a kid. Went back to the house of blues that we were playing, and we were cruising around all day long on these things, like riding around the venue, the parking lot, and then we'd head back to the tour bus. And the. They had, like, a rope tied off where the buses were so that fans wouldn't walk back there, although you could kind of dip underneath them and go. And we. We would just be riding, and as we were going back to the bus, we would kind of dip our heads like this and go under the rope and then put the bikes under the bus, go do sound check, whatever. Played the show, finish the show. I'm in the back playing Tony Hawk or something like that of the bus, eating pizza or something like that. And I hear Doug yell like, dan, we're going for a ride. Like, let's go. Let's go right around the parking lot. And I'm like, no, I'm cool. I'm playing video games. He's like, let's go. And I was like, all right, let's go. Totally sober. Went out for this ride. We weren't wearing helmets. We were riding around, going fast, just being idiots, whatever, and then slowing down, like, you're coming to the end of the ride. You're going really slow. We went to go dip under. I went to go dip under the. The rope, but I had kind of forgot that they had. That they had tied up a second rope underneath it that was a little bit lower. And he was right behind me. And I remember it. It hitting me right across the. Right here. And it threw me back, and I. I hit my head. But I remember thinking to myself, as it happened, I just bought this motorcycle. It was a thousand dollars. I don't want to scratch it. And I held the bike up to not scratch it, and I hit My head, and it didn't look that bad.

[Doug Robb]

And we weren't going super fast. You see people fall all the time. It didn't seem that. That serious. You know, he gets up, gets on the bus. Time passes. It's getting a headache.

[Dan Estrin]

Oh, man.

[Doug Robb]

Honestly, I didn't, you know, I didn't think anything of it. And then our tour manager's like, we should go get this checked out before we go to the next city. And it was getting progressively worse and worse and worse. So we ended up going to the ER because it was getting really bad.

[Danielle Fishel]

Do you all go with him?

[Doug Robb]

It was just me and the tour manager.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay.

[Doug Robb]

Yeah. And then at some point it was getting really bad. Like he, you know, like basically writhing on. On the bed going, dude, like this. My head is hurting so bad. So they, they X rayed him and there was a, like a little fracture and a blood clot forming. And so they said, yeah, dude, you need to get. You need to get it. You need brain surgery right now. You need to release the pressure on this thing. So, yeah, I. I feel like it was either me or the tour manager was the one who gave the green light to cut him open, Doc, like, yeah, let's. Let's do this. And yeah, the next day they had these. Head shaved and recovering from head surgery.

[Dan Estrin]

South Carolina, you know when you have a night out of drinking and like a day or two later you're reflecting on that night and it's, It's. You remember bits and pieces of it. It's blurry, but whatever. And so that's kind of how my memory is of that night. And we were driving to the emergency room in a cab before Uber. And so, like, and we had told the. I remember my tour manager was like, can you step on it? Can we go fast? And we got pulled over by the cops. Oh, my God. We told the cops what happened and they didn't care. They still wrote us a ticket, got to the hospital, and I just remember being in this room and it's super. It was very, very blurry and wasn't feeling well at all. And my head just started getting worse and worse. And like, I, I remember I had to. I had to pee really bad and I couldn't get my belt undone or something. And I'm like, complaining about it. I remember you're like, helped me out, whatever it was, and I think I peed in a trash can or something. Like that is what I. I don't remember, but I kind of remember that. And then I remember the doctor coming in and starting to. To tell me what was going on, but I couldn't really understand what was going on. And then I just remember Doug saying, they need to do surgery on you right now. Something like that, you know? And I just was like, I don't care. Just get me out of this pain. Please get me out of this pain. And then I don't know that this happened, but I remember. All I remember was something going over me like this. And then I was out. And my hair was long, a little bit longer than it is now at the time. And I remember waking up to them shaving it. And they shaved only half of it off. So I had half a head of hair that was long and then half of it was bald. And like he said, I woke up the next day and there was a tube sticking out of my head. I just remember opening my eyes and the band guys and the crew guys all walked in and started taking photos around me. I remember everyone's just like, we just started kind of. I mean, I was out of it, but I was still. Yeah, he's kind of joking around. And then I remember my mom and my sister walking in, and they lived in Calabasas, and, like, they flew out, and I just remember they walked in and I was like, wow, okay.

[Danielle Fishel]

Did you remember that you were in South Carolina?

[Dan Estrin]

I knew where I was. Okay. Yeah. But I wasn't. I was on morphine and I wasn't thinking clearly at all. And, yeah, I just. I remember that kind of. And I had to stay in the hospital. I don't even know how you remember

[Doug Robb]

the first thing you told me.

[Danielle Fishel]

What was the first thing he told you?

[Doug Robb]

No, it was like, he's like, doug, Doug. And he's like, you know, have sleep like that. I forget what the context was, but I'm like, what? What? I'm close. He's like, I got a tube in my. Yeah, so he had a catheter, but he wanted to tell me.

[Dan Estrin]

You know, there was always something like that. Like, in the worst times ever, there's always, like, a little bit of humor, you know?

[Doug Robb]

Like, that was the cool thing he wanted to tell me about.

[Dan Estrin]

And I remember I knew he'd get a kick out of it. I just remember being, like, messed up and going, like, I gotta tell somebody. This would be kinda funny.

[Doug Robb]

Somebody's gotta know.

[Dan Estrin]

But, yeah, I was. I ended up flying home and we canceled the rest of the tour. I had to go home, have photos of me with this huge scar that goes like this across my head. Half my head's. Bald and the other half is long. And I needed a haircut. So Doug came over to my house and he shaved the rest of my head and did a mohawk. And we ended up taking all the hair. Remember that? Yes.

[Doug Robb]

We made a wig.

[Dan Estrin]

We took the hair and we scooped it into a bowl and then evenly distributed all the hair and then hair sprayed the out of it. And then we all wore it. We all wore it into photos. I have the photos too. I have photos of Doug wearing at me wearing it. It just looks so stupid. Oh, man.

[Doug Robb]

Yeah.

[Dan Estrin]

And I ended up. Ended up healing and I have no feeling on the side of my head still.

[Doug Robb]

Nerve damage.

[Dan Estrin]

Yeah, nerve damage. And if I was to shave my head, you'd see this scar right here. Wow.

[Danielle Fishel]

Wear helmets, kids.

[Dan Estrin]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Danielle Fishel]

Because even going slow, you know, crazy. Well on that second album is the reason a favorite of all time for me and many, many others. Where did the inspiration for that song, a bit of a ballad come from?

[Doug Robb]

When you say a bit of a ballad, that makes me go like that makes me think that you're implying, guys, we should write a ballad, you know, like kind of thing, you know, like which. Which honestly was a common question or misconception. On our self titled album we had some mellow songs. We just never released them.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yep.

[Doug Robb]

On the the independent album we put out on our own prior to record deal, we had some songs that were more mellow. It wasn't so much, at least from my perspective in the bands, I feel like it was just like, oh, when we put out music there's going to be a certain percentage that's probably up tempo and heavy and there's maybe one or two songs that are mellow.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Doug Robb]

Just for balance almost, you know. So when we recorded it, it was on the album. That's kind of how I saw it. I never saw it like guys, we just did something in fact post, you know, recording the album and mixing.

[Dan Estrin]

We.

[Doug Robb]

You have the powwow with the producer and the record label and the management, stuff like that. And you go around thinking like discussing what's gonna be the single, possibly a second single. And I don't think anybody chose that song. Not because we didn't like it, but it just isn't. It was the same. There was a really mellow song on the first album called To Be with youh. In my head I'm all. That's that. That's this song for that. It's just a mellow kind of a breather on the album. Good song. Proud of it. But never had any intention or foresight to see what it would do. So, yeah, that's inspiration wise. It wasn't something different than what we did.

[Danielle Fishel]

When did you know it was sticking? Like, oh my gosh, this song is really sticking for us.

[Dan Estrin]

We knew that there was something about it. Well, the record label really liked it. We had to go to some big meeting with all like the big wigs at the record label and listen to the record with them at this huge table with everybody sitting around it. And when it got to that song, just like he said we were, it was just another. I was proud of the song because I felt like the album had some like, diversity. You know, heavy songs, mid tempo songs and slow songs. By the time we got to the second chorus, fourth, last chorus, they were, they were singing like there was. The heads of the company were like singing the chorus already and had just. We're just really excited about it. We're like. We got excited because they got excited. Okay, great. They're.

[Danielle Fishel]

They're happy about this.

[Dan Estrin]

I don't know. I mean, I don't know when we realized it was.

[Doug Robb]

There was a moment. One of the first tours that we did on that album was Linkin Park's Meteora tour. And there was a moment, I want to say, towards the end of that tour, we started where that song had become a single, which we had fought against, smartly fought against, and lost. We lost the battle for the. Changing the name. And so maybe you know what they're talking about.

[Danielle Fishel]

Just don't trust your instincts.

[Dan Estrin]

Yeah.

[Doug Robb]

And so we started playing it and I want to say it was Atlanta. I could be wrong. I remember playing the song and the reaction was like, ridiculous, like nothing I'd ever seen. And we'd been a relatively successful band up to that point, you know, like, we had some successful songs. And so I was used to the reaction of, oh, that's the big single.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Doug Robb]

But I, I started seeing this thing like, oh, dude, this is huge. And then playing with, Playing shows with Incubus and these other bands. Those are the type. The guys that would be like, would you guys sew this week? Would you guys sell this week? You know, like, they would keep track of numbers and other bands. Yeah. Like, oh, we did this this week. And at some point we started passing them. And that's when I started going like, oh, dude, this is. This is kind of out of our control now. Like, it's.

[Danielle Fishel]

You mentioned Atlanta. I wonder if it was music Midtown 2004.

[Doug Robb]

I mean, I definitely remember those festivals. I Loved those festivals.

[Danielle Fishel]

Well, I have to tell you, I looked when I came across this in research, I have to read to you the small sampling of what concertgoers saw that weekend. Kubastank, Puddle of Mud, Ludacris, Journey, Foo Fighters, Wyclef, Jessica Simpson, Hole, the Strokes, Jason Mraz, and Bob Dylan.

[Doug Robb]

Makes perfect sense tonight.

[Danielle Fishel]

It's beautiful. It's beautiful.

[Dan Estrin]

We did that festival.

[Doug Robb]

I think it's like a food court.

[Dan Estrin]

Yeah. I remember standing on stage, looking out and not being able to see where the audience ended. It was just a sea of people and. And it was pretty surreal.

[Danielle Fishel]

It's pretty amazing. Well, now you guys have your new song, your first in eight years, and it is a return to your roots of sorts. Maybe not the costumes, but it is a jump back into punk. How do you sleep? I love it. I made sure I listened to it several times before I talked to you. Well, what made you guys want to get back into the studio? Or are you always in the studio? You just decided to release this one?

[Doug Robb]

Like you said, we put something out in 2018. I don't know. I feel like. I don't want to say. We've spent a lot of time kind of searching, like, trying to find our way back. Like you said, it's like a return to punk, which, ironically, I would have never described us as punk, but we've been described as punk. Early on, I can only speak for myself. And from 2018, 2019 through, like, 2022, there was just a lot of going on in my life personally, along with COVID and all this other stuff, you know, that I had to deal with. It wasn't the most. You know, it wasn't the best environment for me creatively. And during that time, Dan and everybody else in the band, they continue to write and send me. And I kind of feel like once I got through what I needed to get through, I felt. I don't want to say inspired, but I just felt kind of normal again. And there's. I mean, even musically, though, like, you've gone through. Well, we all have, like, phases of, like, you want to do a little bit less this and less this, and. And I kind of felt like me coming back to feeling like I'm in a normal creative space, linked up with you, starting to write these ideas that kind of reminded me of earlier stuff, and they were kind of inspiring for me. And honestly, we just like, let's record these, let's demo these. So he sends me the idea, I sing stuff over, I send it back, we go back and forth until we have this kind of pseudo song. And the producer who did a few of our records, Howard Benson, who's also Calabasas, he's a friend of ours, and he's. Over the years, he's always checked in with us, and we're like, what do you guys have? Anything? What do you got? And we've sent him stuff before, and honestly, a lot of times he's like, that's cool. But maybe, yeah, maybe like this. And it never would pan out. But we sent him sometime last year, we sent him these ideas, and he was blown away. He was really excited about it, and so it just kind of made sense. We're like, let's. Yeah, let's record these songs. And then it got into like, well, are we going to do an album? Are we going to do a song? We kind of just settled on. Let's just do one at a time or a batch at a time and see what happens from there. So we ended up recording four songs, and I. I don't know, I'm really stoked on the way they turned out. I've detached myself from the outcome.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yep.

[Doug Robb]

You know, great. Do I like the songs when I listen to them? Yes. Do I like the process? Do I like everything? Yes. And then that's it.

[Danielle Fishel]

That's it.

[Doug Robb]

I win. We win.

[Danielle Fishel]

Correct.

[Doug Robb]

Everything else is out of my hands. And so we have more songs that we want to record and maybe we'll put them all together and put, like, a proper album.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yes, I would love that. I'm forcing Dan and Doug to hang out for just a little bit longer. We dive even deeper into Hoopestank lore and play. A listener's voicemail details their own embarrassing teenage moment. It drops this Friday on the dedicated Teen Beat feed and listen. A lot is happening over there, including my new recap podcast for Dancing with the Stars, the Next Pro, with co host Val Shmerkovsky. All you have to do is search for Teen Beat wherever you get your podcasts and subscribe. That way you never miss another moment. And send me your voice memos. I want to hear your embarrassing moments. Record a voice memo no longer than two minutes and email it to teenbeatpodmail.com you may just hear it on the next episode. You can hear the first new song from Hoobastank in almost a decade. How do you sleep? Wherever you stream music and catch them this summer on the road, if they stop in your city, like North Ridgeville, Ohio, on August 15th or Gillette, Wyoming, on August 29th, check dates now on hubastank.com thank you guys. 818 Forever Teen Beat is an iHeart podcast produced and hosted by Danielle Fishel, executive producers Jensen Karp and Amy Sugarman. Executive in charge of production Danielle Romo, producer and editor Tara Sudbaksh. The theme song is by Mark Hoppus. Yes, that Mark Hoppus. Follow us on Instagram teenbeatpod.

[Doug Robb]

This is an iHeart podcast. Guaranteed Human.