Dylan Efron and Boston Rob

Summary

Teen Beat with Danielle Fishel: Episode Summary

Guests: Dylan Efron and Boston Rob Mariano
Original Airdate: February 4, 2026
Host: Danielle Fishel | Podcast: Teen Beat by iHeartPodcasts

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Episode Overview

Danielle Fishel—former “Boy Meets World” star and director—invites two reality TV icons to reminisce about their formative (and often awkward) teenage years: Boston Rob Mariano, famed Survivor legend, and Dylan Efron, Daytime Emmy-winning creator, social media star, and younger brother of Zac Efron.
This laugh-filled episode delves into sports obsessions, sibling rivalry, the pain of fashion mistakes, first kisses, high school social standing, nostalgic pop culture, and the roots of their now-viral competitive YouTube series. Danielle gently exposes their most cringeworthy coming-of-age moments, revealing how these experiences shaped—and still inspire—them today.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

Introduction & Setting the Tone

• Danielle enthusiastically claims “payback” for her televised adolescence, joking:

  "I gave you my childhood. It's time we hear yours." (02:38)

• She dubs herself, Rob, and Dylan a “reality show alliance”—with feigned seriousness, “the Modern Day Wayne and Garth.” (04:45)

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Childhood Competitiveness and Family Dynamics

• Were you always competitive?

  • Dylan: “Oh, yeah, I was. I used to cheat at Yahtzee… I hated to lose.” (07:07)
  • Rob: “I was oldest child ... if you wanted to be on top, you had to be competitive.” (07:20)
  • Rob shares he was immersed in every sport, attributing it to his mother’s dedication: “My mom would wake up at 5:30 in the morning on the weekends and drive us all over the state.” (08:25)

• Sibling Relationships & Finding Identity

  • Dylan describes sibling divergence: “When your younger brother’s beating you in basketball, maybe that’s not your sport … Zack leans into what he’s good at. It was good for us both.” (12:04)
  • Danielle relates as the parent of two sons trying to foster individuality, prompting the guests to share how their own parents navigated rivalry and shared interests. (12:22)

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Sports, Fitness, and Physical Development

• Dylan: “My talent was that I could pick up any sport really quick ... I was never the best player on the team.” (09:44)

  • Recalls being inspired by Zac’s puberty growth: “I could see that like, ‘Oh, you can actually get muscles.’ So I’d just work out with him… I just copied him.” (10:37)

• Rob: “My younger brother grew first ... but he always still respected me as the older brother.” (11:15)

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Style, Fashion, and Laughing at the Awkward Years

• Danielle asks for “worst fashion decisions.”

  • Rob: “My style’s the same ... I still rock the white on white Adidas shell toes, jeans, a black T-shirt and a backwards hat. It hasn’t changed in 40 years.” (17:28)
  • Dylan: “I was best dressed... My biggest fashion faux pas was my hair—long hair, like when long hair wasn’t the move.” (18:25)

• Danielle: “I won best hair for my high school.” (19:12)

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First Kisses: The Ultimate Right-of-Passage

• Danielle admits:

  “My first kiss happened in front of my parents...on Boy Meets World.” (19:52)

• Rob:

  “I remember my first kiss. I was in sixth grade…by the lake...I was so nervous.” (20:24-21:03)

• Dylan:

  “I’m nearly positive mine was at a dance in seventh grade…classic grinding...then we turned around and had a little action. A little French.” (22:00-22:14)

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High School Coolness, Dorkiness, and Social Status

• Would you have called yourself cool?

  • Dylan: “I had cool friends…I could go both sides. I was a dork, too.” (23:01)
  • Rob: “I always felt like in the middle ... not on the bottom, not at the top.” (23:59)

• Rob reveals a fun fact:

  “I had a scholarship to go to Harvard University as an undergrad for physics ... I took the college level class, the physics class at Harvard when I was a junior in high school.” (24:50)

• The group nerds out over physics and buoyancy equations, resulting in a funny aside about using ChatGPT to recall formulas. (26:18)

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Pop Culture Upbringings & Realities of Fame

• Rob did not watch Real World or Road Rules growing up, finding himself swept into reality TV by accident—remarking on meeting people from cult MTV shows later in life. (32:37, 33:00)

• Dylan watched Real World and is in awe of meeting its stars:

  “I saw Wes and was like, dude, I used to watch you as a kid, and he’s like, ‘you’re making me feel old.’” (33:01)

• Rob recalls meeting New Kids on the Block and Mark Wahlberg as a Boston youth, ending with an awkward basketball-gym turf war and a reunion years later:

  “The gym was closed down because the New Kids and Mark Wahlberg...and we got into a little bit of a scuffle…years later, I met Donnie again at a premiere in Connecticut. I was like, ‘do you remember that time?’” (34:22-35:16)

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Early Music Tastes & Teenage Nostalgia

• Rob:

  “A lot of rap music, gangster rap...classic rock ... Beatles era, Bob Dylan, Def Leppard, Aerosmith ... My dad played guitar, my brother played guitar. I have no musical ability at all. But I grew up listening to their generation’s music and the trash that was in our generation.” (36:22-36:54)

• Dylan:

  “My first music device wasn’t even an iPod, it was a Rio ... I grew up with a cool mix—Bay Area rap, SoCal stuff, Jack Johnson—indie rap.” (37:11)

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Grown-Up Competition & The YouTube Show

• Danielle plugs Rob and Dylan’s YouTube series “Everything’s a Competition”—and the group recounts recent absurd challenges:
  • Fruit Ninja–inspired sword challenge:

    “We had a real ninja ... He brought a katana sword that had never been used ... so sharp, dragons engraved on it.” (40:01)

  • Live reactions:
    • Dylan:

      “This was a really non competitive episode ... We were cheering everyone on ... it was so good.” (40:38-40:54)

    • Rob:

      “It came down to the very last fruit swing.” (40:46)

• On behind-the-scenes rule drama:
  • Dylan:

    “My 5 year old brain comes up with a concept that Boston Rob just tries to pick apart, hates on it. Then he wins and says, that was so much fun.” (41:15)

  • Rob:

    “Usually he doesn’t tell me about it, and he’s changing the rules.” (41:51)

  • Both agree they need an “independent rule maker.” (44:24-44:49)

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Reality TV Reflections: Would You Let Your Kids Compete?

• Danielle asks Rob if he’d want his daughters to go on Survivor:

  “If they want to? Yeah, but not yet. You have to have a certain amount of life experience ... At some point, if that's something they want to do, for sure.” (49:19)

• Dylan wishes he could be cast:

  “I grew up loving that show ... Courtney still says to this day ... I was so adamant as a kid, I was like ‘I’m gonna go on the show.’” (49:06, 49:32)

• Rob and Dylan share nostalgia for physical challenge game shows like Double Dare, Legends of the Hidden Temple, and Guts. (51:04-51:54)
• They brainstorm new “adult playground” show ideas, turning wild suggestions into new challenge fodder for their channel. (52:16-52:41)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Danielle, on the reversal of childhood over-exposure:

  “I gave you my childhood. It’s time we hear yours.” (02:38)

• Dylan, on being best dressed in high school:

  “In my photo I was wearing cut off cords and a flannel ... My biggest fashion faux pas was my hair.” (18:25)

• Rob, on being a nerd:

  “I had a scholarship to go to Harvard ... physics class at Harvard when I was a junior in high school. ... But I thought an engineer was someone who drove a train.” (24:50)

• Danielle, on her own cringe moment:

  “My first kiss happened in front of my parents … we taped it in front of the live studio audience.” (19:52)

• Rob, post-challenge:

  “He wins and says, that was so much fun. That was a great idea.” (41:15)

• Dylan, describing the perpetual competition:

  “Some of these, the routine in this show is that my 5 year old brain comes up with a concept that Boston Rob just tries to pick apart, hates on it, then he wins and says that was so much fun.” (41:15)

• Rob, on Survivor strategy:

  “You have to have a certain amount of life experience to participate in that show well.” (49:19)

• Dylan, on his dream Survivor moment:

  “My dream was to go spearfish ... but in the show today, you can’t do that. It’s moving so fast ... if you go out and spearfish for four hours, you’re going to be voted out.” (50:09)

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Memorable Segment Timestamps

• Danielle’s Introduction of Guests: 04:45
• Childhood competitiveness and cheating at Yahtzee: 07:07
• Sibling rivalry and finding identity: 12:04
• Fashion faux pas confession: 17:28
• First Kisses: 19:52 (Danielle), 20:24 (Rob), 22:00 (Dylan)
• Harvard physics story: 24:50
• Nostalgic reality TV and New Kids on the Block story: 34:22
• YouTube show creative process & rule controversy: 41:15–44:49
• Survivor reflections/advice for kids: 49:19
• Old school game show nostalgia: 51:04

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Conclusion

This episode is a joyfully candid chronicle of awkward teens-turned-competitive adults and the universal quest to “fit in”—or, alternatively, to stand out in Jabot jeans and a yearbook photo. Danielle, Dylan, and Rob embrace their cringe, tease each other mercilessly, and ultimately find camaraderie not just in their public lives, but in the vulnerable, relatable failures and foibles of their past. Fans of reality TV, sibling stories, and 90s/2000s nostalgia will find much to love—and laugh at—here.

Transcript

[Rob Mariano]

This is an iHeart podcast.

[Danielle Fishel]

Guaranteed human.

[Rob Mariano]

Seems like just yesterday that the Two Guys Five Rings podcast was in Paris for the Olympics. And now we're heading to Milan for the 2026 Milan Cortina Olympic Winter Games. I'm Bowen Yang. And I'm Matt Rogers. And we'll join athletes from 93 countries as Two Guys Five Rings hits the Italian Alps for the 2026 Milan Cortina Olympic Winter Games. Open your free iHeartRadio app. Did we mention it's free? Search Two Guys Five Rings and listen. Now.

[Danielle Fishel]

People who didn't do what John of God wanted them to do, they usually disappeared. John of God was once Brazil's most famous spiritual healer. But in this limited series podcast we uncover the darker truth behind his global empire of faith and fear. From exactly right and adonde Media, this is Two Faced John of God. Listen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Nancy Glass, host of the Burden of Guilt season two podcast. This is a story about a horrendous lie that destroyed two families. Late one night, Bobby Gumpright became the victim of a random CR. The perpetrator was sentenced to 99 years until a confession changed everything.

[Dylan Efron]

I was a monster.

[Danielle Fishel]

Listen to Burden of guilt season two starting February 11th on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. When segregation was a law, one mysterious black club owner Charlie Fitzgerald had his own rules.

[Rob Mariano]

Segregation in the day, integration at night. It was like stepping on another world.

[Danielle Fishel]

Was he a businessman, a criminal, a hero?

[Rob Mariano]

Charlie was an example of power. They had to crush him.

[Danielle Fishel]

Charlie's Place from Atlas Obscura and visit Myrtle Beach. Listen to Charlie's place on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Dylan Efron]

Give me money for cigarette. I'll never leave your filthy bed. I stay the night and one night be came two or three years.

[Rob Mariano]

The kids are not alright but that's okay cause no one here is Teen Beat.

[Danielle Fishel]

It's time once again for Teen Beat, the show where I, Danielle Fishel, a podcaster, TV director, 8th place ballroom dancer, mom of two and former child actor, finally get a little payback for for sharing my own teenage years with millions of viewers every week by convincing other celebrities to spill their most vulnerable and awkward childhood memories. Every week I am sitting with interesting people, subjects you know and love, hoping I can coax them to open up about their younger selves. The cringe, the chaos, the deeply embarrassing stuff. Because I know firsthand that it's an entertaining way to reveal who they are today. Also, I just think it's the least they can do. I gave you my childhood. It's time we hear yours. And this week, I'm talking to two men living their absolute best lives. As synonymous with Boston as Blake Lively's accent in the town he first burst onto the scene in the fourth season of Survivor, where he may have ranked 10th on the show, but he finished first in our hearts. Often referred to as the show's greatest player, he'd return for its eighth season where he placed second, but also proposed to the woman who won his now wife of 20 years, who he married in the Bahamas for a two hour special on CBS. So, like, no one really lost, he'd go on to participate in a record five seasons, taking home the grand prize on Redemption island and creating a bevy of memorable TV appearances as the greatest reality show strategist of all time, hoping that one day he might just meet a young ninja looking for a master to lead him to sensei status. And then Yoda found his Luke Skywalker on the third season of the Traitors, where he met today's other special guest, a young heartthrob who focused on a faceless career of TV production after watching his older brother skyrocket through the Disney machine in in the 2000s. But when the Daytime Emmy winning creator finally decided to step in front of the camera for off the Grid, a YouTube series he did with his brother, everything changed. He found himself not only competing on Traders and meeting his new platonic lifemate, but walking away as a winner and a new social media sensation. Then he was my fellow dance competitor on the pop culture juggernaut that is season 34 of Dancing with the Stars going viral and finishing fourth, finally landing the title he actually wanted. People magazine's sexiest tattoo. Sure, these two reality TV titans are cool now, but I can tell deep down they're just two boys with a plethora of mortifying stories from high school. So please welcome to Team Beat the Modern Day Wayne and Garth, Dylan Efron, and Boston Rob Mariano.

[Dylan Efron]

Can we just get a moment of appreciation for how good that was? My second podcast and I'm blown away every time.

[Rob Mariano]

Like, the whole time it was happening, I was like, what is going on?

[Dylan Efron]

It's insane. Like, the talent. It's unbelievable. No, it is so good. The first podcast I was on with her, I was like, do you narrate audiobooks? Because I want to listen to one.

[Rob Mariano]

I thought it was like we were like. Like one of those romance novels you listen to. Like, the starter one. And then I was like, wait, what is this? And then also this podcast about sharing our feelings.

[Dylan Efron]

Someone forgot to tell me. You didn't give him the memo. No, I did. I did. You know the strategy. You always stand back.

[Danielle Fishel]

Oh, boys, I am thrilled to have what I've just decided is my reality show alliance. The three of us, we've never really. Your show, your. Your web series is the first time we had to work together, and yet we were still on opposing team.

[Dylan Efron]

It's hard to go against them, isn't it? It's so hard.

[Rob Mariano]

But, Danielle, you're working hard. You got a Boston, Massachusetts sweater on.

[Dylan Efron]

Like, you know, I'm losing the fight.

[Danielle Fishel]

I had to butter you up because I. I mentioned that, like, how do I get in?

[Dylan Efron]

How do I get in on this? Okay, good.

[Danielle Fishel]

We'll see how it goes. So for those keeping score at home, I have forced their friendship into a trio, and I'm just totally fine with it. So first, since I am sitting with two reality show strategy legends, I wanted to know, were you both always competitive as kids?

[Dylan Efron]

Oh, yeah, I was. Yeah. My parents still say it to this day, but I used to cheat at Yahtzee. Like, I. I like. Yahtzee is hard to cheat on. You gotta wait till they. And you'd move the diamond. Yeah, I hated to lose.

[Rob Mariano]

I was like, oldest child. I had a brother, a younger brother, and younger sister, and grew up in Boston. And, like, nobody let me get away with anything. So it was like, constantly. You have to earn it. And, like, if you wanted to be on top, you had to be competitive.

[Danielle Fishel]

You also played hockey, right, at Boston?

[Rob Mariano]

I still play hockey.

[Danielle Fishel]

Did you play at Boston University?

[Rob Mariano]

I did not play at Boston University.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay. All right.

[Dylan Efron]

You're in the. What's. It's like the Senior World cup cup or something?

[Rob Mariano]

Yeah, yeah. All American, 60 or no, 50. The older person league in Florida.

[Dylan Efron]

That's it. Oh, the AARP Cup.

[Rob Mariano]

E, C, H, I.

[Danielle Fishel]

Did you win the AARP Cup?

[Rob Mariano]

Listen, I'm working on it. I'm working on it.

[Dylan Efron]

They're surprisingly good.

[Danielle Fishel]

What was teenager Boston Rob like? I imagine in fourth grade, you just ran, like, a weekly poker night or something.

[Rob Mariano]

Not. Not far after. Not fourth grade, but probably like, sixth, seventh grade. We started playing cards.

[Dylan Efron]

Yeah.

[Rob Mariano]

And it wasn't poker, but it was like those other games, but mostly sports. I mean, ever since I was a kid, like, I learned to skate when I was, like, 2 years old. Like, I played Hockey, played baseball, basketball, football, like every sport, all the time. And really I think like, that's what my parents did to keep me out of any other trouble that was going on. So I was lucky enough I had a mom that would wake up at 5:30 in the morning on the weekends and drive us all over the state and played lots of, lots of hockey and sports.

[Danielle Fishel]

Do you feel like you were always good at reading people?

[Rob Mariano]

You know, I don't know. I think like, I've always been observant and my dad was like a really good negotiator. Like he was in real estate and stuff, so I would watch him. But I think a lot of it's innate. I don't think a lot of people can learn how to like, like either. You got it. You don't. I think because I've tried to tell people and some people are more receptive on paying attention to different things.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Rob Mariano]

But other people just naturally see it.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Rob Mariano]

Yeah.

[Danielle Fishel]

You're good at reading social cues and picking little things up.

[Rob Mariano]

I like to tease a lot, you know, could get the upper hand.

[Danielle Fishel]

Dylan, did you have childhood hobbies?

[Dylan Efron]

Yeah. Sports? Yeah. Everything he was just saying was like, I was playing year round soccer, year round baseball. I. It was like if I wasn't playing, I was at the sports field, like playing with the wall. And it was just year round, some sport. I was never the best any of them. Like, I was pretty good and all star and most of them, but I was never the best player on the team. My talent was that I could pick up any sport really quick. So it was like, I. When baseball got too frustrating, like, I was just like, all right, I'm over this. So this took us so much time. I was like, I'm gonna go to tennis. And I made the varsity team for tennis. And it's like I could pick up sports really quick. Okay, so it was volleyball, it was tennis, it was soccer, it was baseball. Whatever sport that. Yeah, dancing. Whatever sport it was, I could pick up good. I was never the best.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay, when did you start really, like, truly caring about fitness? Like, did you guys grow up with a home gym?

[Dylan Efron]

That was something I like. My brother would come home because I was like growing up, I was big for my age and Zach was shorter. So then Zach took off hit puberty was all of a sudden came back and had muscles. And I could see that like, oh, you can actually get muscles. So like, I would just work out with him, see what he was doing. He's always reading fitness magazines. This is back like early 2000s or whatever. So it was like, he's literally reading the magazines for workouts, and I would just copy him. So, okay. That's when I started getting to the gym. And again when sports, it started to help. Like, I started to put. I was 6 foot, a buck 50. And then I started putting on muscle.

[Rob Mariano]

You know, it's funny, like, I had, like, almost the opposite. So I was the older brother, and my younger brother grew first, and he was bigger than me at one point, like, three inches taller and played on, like, a different hockey team. And he was like, the star, and I was like, second fiddle. And then I caught up and, you know, like. But it was always cool. Like, I always hear you tell the story about your older brother and how much, like, you always, like, looked up to him and stuff in a weird kind of way. Like, my younger brother, when he was bigger than me, he always still respected me as the older brother. And, like, to this day, we, like, still have a great relationship.

[Dylan Efron]

Yeah, no, that's.

[Rob Mariano]

My poor sister got dragged around the state for all the hockey games, and we put her in net and played goalie, made her play goalie. But yeah, it's similar, but different.

[Dylan Efron]

Yeah. Cause and I think that it worked in both of our advantages. It was like, I was tall, I was athletic, so I straight into sports. Zach was more in the arts. And when your younger brothers competing with you in basketball and winning, it's like, maybe that's not your sport. And Zach leans into what he's good at. It was good for us both.

[Danielle Fishel]

When you were really little, did your parents try to separate? Like, I have two sons, which is why I'm asking this question. And they're two years apart, and both of them, will they like the same thing? Or at least they think they like the same thing. Oh, Adler's favorite color is blue. Keaton's favorite color is blue. And I'm really trying to encourage them that, like, it doesn't have to be your favorite color, though. Like, green could be your favorite color. And for a long time, it was bothering Adler that he's like, every day thing. I like, Keaton likes. And now they're starting to find their own things. Did your parents nurture that or did they, like, encourage you guys to do.

[Dylan Efron]

A lot of four and a half years apart? So I think it's. It was different. It was almost the exact opposite. You, like, think I like blue? It was. It was almost like. Yeah, I think we. We were so different a lot of those ways that, like, again, my brother was in plays and stuff. I. I was like, there's no chance.

[Danielle Fishel]

There's no way. I don't.

[Dylan Efron]

My friends didn't go to. Like, I was always shocked. I'm like, how is. How is my brother making plays cool when I'm in high school and plays aren't cool.

[Danielle Fishel]

Right.

[Dylan Efron]

And it was just like, is it a different era? Is it. Was it my brother? Stuff like that? So, like, yeah, we didn't have too many overlap in our hobbies.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay, I see.

[Rob Mariano]

Seems like just yesterday that the Two Guys five Rings podcast was in Paris for the Olympics, and now we're heading to Milan for the 2026 Milan Cortina Olympic Winter Game. I'm Bowen Yang. And I'm Matt Rogers. And we'll join athletes from 93 countries as Two Guys Five Rings hits the Italian Alps for the 2026 Milan Cortina Olympic Winter Games. Open your free iHeartRadio app. Did we mention it's free? Search Two Guys Five Rings and listen now.

[Dylan Efron]

Hey, I'm Jay Shetty, host of the On Purpose podcast. On a recent episode, I sat down with Nick Jonas, singer, songwriter, actor, and global superstar. The thing I would say to my younger self is, congratulations.

[Rob Mariano]

You get to marry Priyanka Chopra Jonas.

[Dylan Efron]

And also, you know, your daughter is incredible. That's beautiful, man.

[Rob Mariano]

Yeah, thank you.

[Dylan Efron]

That's so beautiful. I can see that got you a little. Yeah, for sure. Our daughter, she came to the world under sort of very intense circumstances, which.

[Rob Mariano]

I've not really talked about ever.

[Dylan Efron]

Growing up on Disney in front of millions, how did that shape your sense of self? I went blank. I hit a bad note. Then I couldn't kind of recover, and I built up this idea that music and being a musician was my whole identity.

[Rob Mariano]

I had to sort of relearn who I was. If you took this thing away, who.

[Dylan Efron]

Am I listen to? On Purpose with Jay Shetty on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, Google, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Danielle Fishel]

In the middle of the night, Saskia awoke in a haze. Her husband Mike, was on his laptop. What was on his screen would change Saskia's life forever. I said, I need you to tell me exactly what you're doing. And immediately, the mask came off.

[Rob Mariano]

You're supposed to be safe.

[Danielle Fishel]

That's your home.

[Rob Mariano]

That's your husband.

[Danielle Fishel]

To keep this secret for so many years, he's like a seasoned pro. This is a story about the end of a marriage, but it's also the story of one woman who was done living in the dark. You're a dangerous person who preys on.

[Rob Mariano]

Vulnerable and trusting people.

[Danielle Fishel]

You're in creditor Michael Levengood. Listen to Betrayal Season 5 on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. What if mind control is real?

[Rob Mariano]

If you could control the behavior of.

[Danielle Fishel]

Anybody around you, what kind of life would you have? Can you hypnotically persuade someone to buy a car?

[Rob Mariano]

When you look at your car, you're.

[Dylan Efron]

Gonna become overwhelmed with such good feelings.

[Danielle Fishel]

Can you hypnotize someone in to sleeping with you?

[Rob Mariano]

I gave her some suggestions to be sexually aroused.

[Danielle Fishel]

Can you get someone to join your cult? NLP was used on me to access my subconscious. Nlp, AKA Neuro linguistic programming is a blend of hypnosis, linguistics and psychology. Fans say it's like finally getting a user manual for your brain.

[Dylan Efron]

It's about engineering consciousness.

[Danielle Fishel]

Mind Games is the story of nlp. It's crazy cast of disciples and the fake doctor who invented it at a new age commune and sold it to guys in suits. He stood trial for murder and got acquitted. The biggest mind game of all, NLP might actually work. This is wild. Listen to Mind Games on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcast. Give me the worst fashion decisions that young Dylan Efron and young Rob Mariano made. What did, what was like when you think back and you think of those.

[Rob Mariano]

Family photos, listen, my style's the same.

[Danielle Fishel]

Did you wear a baseball hat to prom?

[Rob Mariano]

It hasn't changed in 40 years.

[Dylan Efron]

That's the problem.

[Rob Mariano]

I still rock the white on white Adidas shell toes, jeans, a black T shirt or a dark T shirt and a backwards hat.

[Dylan Efron]

It's the classic thing. It's like my dad. My dad's dressed the same for so long that the style's back now, but now he's changing it up. You know, he's in college shirts. I was like, no, go back to what was cool.

[Rob Mariano]

I mean fashion was never really like a thought for me. I can't say that there was a period of time like probably like middle school to early high school where like there was a fancy pair of jeans called Jabot jeans and everybody wanted them.

[Danielle Fishel]

And have some Z cavaries.

[Rob Mariano]

I didn't have the. I didn't have them, but some of the kids did. But like, I mean it wasn't really something I really thought about.

[Dylan Efron]

I did in high school. You know how you get like yearbook awards or whatever. I was best dressed and in my photo I was wearing cut off cords and a flannel. I'D say my biggest fashion faux pas was my hair because I had long hair. Like, long hair. Like, when long hair was not feminine looking hair as a, like in my middle school years where I'm looking feminine already. So it was like that set. Yeah. I don't think long hair was the choice back. Yeah, I loved it. I loved being different in that way. But, yeah, it was like, until I started looking a little more masculine. It probably wasn't the move.

[Danielle Fishel]

Were you wearing Converse in your best dressed photo? I feel like.

[Dylan Efron]

I bet. Or Vans, probably.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay.

[Dylan Efron]

Yeah, Vans. Brown cut off cord and a flannel.

[Danielle Fishel]

I won best hair for my high school.

[Dylan Efron]

You do have good hair.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah, thanks. Back in 1999, that was, that was my superlative.

[Dylan Efron]

I think hair for guys is one of those things that, at least for me, like, I would never have noticed hair as a kid. Like, like someone everybody thinks I don't have.

[Rob Mariano]

I have plenty. I know you've got a full head.

[Dylan Efron]

Of hair, but as you get older, hair is like, hot. You're like, oh, she's got good hair. That is not like high school. You're not looking at hair.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah, that's an acquired mature taste.

[Dylan Efron]

It is. You start noticing it like, you know, he's got good hair. Is Lauren from Dancing with the Stars. I, I, I was standing next to her one. Yeah. I was like, oh, you got great hair. And she's like, wow. Not many people tell me that. I was like, that's really good.

[Danielle Fishel]

I know she does. She has gorgeous hair. I have admitted that my first kiss is on television. I had never kissed a boy before that very first episode of Boy Meets World where I had to slam a young Ben Savage up against a locker and kiss him. So my first kiss happened in front of my parents because we didn't rehearse it during the week. So when we taped it in front of the live studio audience, my parents and my grandparents were present for my first real kiss. I want to hear about your first kisses. What was your first kiss? How old were you?

[Dylan Efron]

You take it.

[Rob Mariano]

I remember my first kiss. I was in sixth grade.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay.

[Rob Mariano]

And school we just moved from. I grew up in, like, a part of the city of Boston and my parents moved to, like, the suburbs. So it was the end of sixth grade, year before summer. And I had a girlfriend and it was supposed to be, you know, summer was coming, and to make it official, I had to give her a kiss. And I remember we went, there was a lake by the house. And I was so nervous. I remember. And I Just went. We went for a walk down by the lake, and I kissed her.

[Danielle Fishel]

Did she know?

[Rob Mariano]

I don't know. Like, I think she probably wanted it a lot longer than I did, so. No. Like, the first real kiss. That's what you're talking about? Real kiss?

[Danielle Fishel]

Real kiss.

[Rob Mariano]

Real, like, French kiss.

[Danielle Fishel]

Kiss.

[Rob Mariano]

That's what it was called.

[Dylan Efron]

Just go back. No, I haven't. I haven't heard it in a while, but now I'm envisioning him with all his. His Boston bros. Be like, bro, I French kissed her.

[Rob Mariano]

I know. It was like. It was like, after. It was like, so, so how'd it go? You good? Like, yeah, yeah, good. But leading up to it, I was so nervous.

[Dylan Efron]

Did you kiss her? Yeah, French kissed her.

[Rob Mariano]

That was under structure. We didn't have to say that. That was understood. Bro.

[Dylan Efron]

Just bragging to your buddies.

[Rob Mariano]

I hate you, literally. This is a friendship based on hate, not love.

[Dylan Efron]

We're competing against each other too much, though.

[Danielle Fishel]

All right, what's. What's your first kiss?

[Dylan Efron]

I'm nearly positive mine was at a dance in seventh grade, and it was, like, classic grinding and stuff like that.

[Rob Mariano]

Norwegian grinding, Swedish grinding.

[Dylan Efron]

I was definitely the sweet spot where it was like, every dance was just grinding. And there's always, like, chaperones that are like, hey, separate. Separate.

[Rob Mariano]

Yeah.

[Dylan Efron]

But, yeah, I think it was grinding. And then we turned around and had a little. A little action. A little French fruit.

[Rob Mariano]

See, we called action something else that came later.

[Dylan Efron]

Mine wasn't full French. It was like, like, so, like, uncomfortable.

[Rob Mariano]

Talking about all of this right now, looking at him.

[Dylan Efron]

Thank God they're like.

[Rob Mariano]

Like you didn't tell me about it beforehand.

[Dylan Efron]

I can't say it was a great. I wasn't in full French yet. I had some work to do.

[Danielle Fishel]

If it wasn't full, you hadn't gone full French. Okay.

[Rob Mariano]

Wow.

[Danielle Fishel]

All right. Would you guys have called yourselves cool in high school?

[Rob Mariano]

No.

[Dylan Efron]

Yeah, I. I think I had re. I had cool friends.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Dylan Efron]

And I. I, I think I was. I could go both sides. I was kind of a dork, too.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay, so what made you a dork?

[Dylan Efron]

Like, I, I. I still, like, wanted to get good grades. I remember, like, and it just depends on the year. Like, I think my dorkiest year was prob. And I remember I would, like, skip recess. Just go into, like. Like, I was. It was like, that age where you're, like, writing poems and, like, and stuff like that.

[Danielle Fishel]

Loved writing that.

[Rob Mariano]

I don't even. I don't even.

[Dylan Efron]

He's like, who I'm trying to think.

[Rob Mariano]

If my ears are actually working.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Rob Mariano]

Like, is there a stage where you go through writing poems?

[Dylan Efron]

I loved writing. It was like, I would, like, go there early to start writing.

[Rob Mariano]

Other than, like, when your teacher is teaching you about different haikus and shit, and you have to, like, oh, iq.

[Dylan Efron]

Yeah, I loved it. See, like, I was a little dorky, but then I had really cool friends, too, so I was like, it just depends on the year. I had some super dorky years, and I had some ones where I felt cooler.

[Danielle Fishel]

You must have been cool.

[Rob Mariano]

I felt. I always felt like in the middle. Like, I did, like. Like, there were always some kids that were, like, way cooler, but I wasn't, like, on the bottom, like, I always felt in the middle.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Rob Mariano]

And I think, like, growing up, like, my parents, like, they made a conscious effort to always make sure that we were kind of, like, in the middle of, like, you know, like, where we lived, like, how much they gave us, how much, you know, like, we did. We had to work for, like, stuff, but also, like, you know, not on the extreme. And I think that helped a lot.

[Danielle Fishel]

That's really smart. You don't ever want to be an outlier.

[Rob Mariano]

I think it's hard.

[Dylan Efron]

Yeah.

[Danielle Fishel]

Would you two have been friends in high school?

[Rob Mariano]

I think maybe. Yeah, I think we would have.

[Dylan Efron]

I think we would have. I think. I think over sports.

[Rob Mariano]

Yeah.

[Dylan Efron]

Yeah, I think over sports, we would have. And then we probably just would have got separated when I went to, like, the. The AP classes.

[Rob Mariano]

And I was actually a wicked small school. Dylan doesn't even know I actually. It's a true story.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Rob Mariano]

I had a scholarship to go to Harvard University as an undergrad for physics and as a junior in high school. And I went and I took the college level class, the physics class at Harvard when I was a junior in high school. And he's wondering whether or not it's true or not, but it is. No, I believe it's true. Yeah.

[Danielle Fishel]

Wow.

[Rob Mariano]

Physics I loved, like. See, here's the thing. I never knew what, like, different professions were, which is ridiculous to think about, but when I went to college, like, I didn't know what an engineer did. If I did, I would have been an engineer. Okay. Because I love that kind of stuff. Like, I have that kind of brain and stuff, but I thought an engineer was someone that drove a train and that was it. I didn't know what the college of engineering was. I was like, wow, like, people paying a lot so they can go drive trains, which is really dumb. And I get it now how dumb it is, and it's like, yeah, you probably wouldn't have made it as an engineer, but I would have. I liked, like, that kind of stuff.

[Danielle Fishel]

Wow, that's really impressive.

[Rob Mariano]

But I was terrible at, like, grandma and English and this.

[Dylan Efron]

This makes sense. We were literally having an argument over what the equation of buoyancy was last night. Last night.

[Danielle Fishel]

What is the equation of buoyancy?

[Dylan Efron]

Buoyancy equals mass. Yeah. Volume grab. The density is just the.

[Danielle Fishel]

You guys remember this from school?

[Rob Mariano]

We were discussing it and.

[Dylan Efron]

Yeah, chat.

[Rob Mariano]

GBT helped us.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay.

[Dylan Efron]

Both of us together, we almost got the full equation.

[Rob Mariano]

So close. Not bad. For, like, 30 years removed.

[Dylan Efron]

I took two physics class, but I. My second one, I realized it wasn't.

[Danielle Fishel]

That good on the second one.

[Dylan Efron]

Yeah, second one, I was like, all right, I'm not.

[Rob Mariano]

But I did. I only had two AP classes. I don't have all of them.

[Dylan Efron]

I had a lot. But my school was also pretty sick. They offered a lot.

[Rob Mariano]

Seems like just yesterday that the Two Guys five Rings podcast was in Paris for the Olympics. And now we're heading to Milan at the 2026 Milan Cortina Olympic Winter Games. I'm Bowen Yang. And I'm Matt Rogers. And we'll join athletes from 93 countries as Two Guys Five Rings hits the Italian Alps for the 2026 Milan Cortina Olympic Winter Games. Open your free iHeartRadio app. Did we mention it's free? Search Two Guys Five Rings and listen now.

[Dylan Efron]

Hey, I'm Jay Shetty, host of the On Purpose podcast. On a recent episode, I sat down with Nick Jonas, singer, songwriter, actor, and global superstar. The thing I would say to my younger self is, congratulations.

[Rob Mariano]

You get to marry Priyanka Chopra Jonas.

[Dylan Efron]

And also, you know, your daughter's incredible. That's beautiful, man.

[Rob Mariano]

Yeah, thank you.

[Dylan Efron]

That's so beautiful. I can see that got you a little. Yeah, for sure. Our daughter, she came to the world under sort of very intense circumstances, which.

[Rob Mariano]

I've not really talked about ever.

[Dylan Efron]

Growing up on Disney in front of millions, how did that shape your sense of self? I went blank. I hit a bad note. Then I couldn't. Couldn't kind of recover.

[Rob Mariano]

And I built up this idea that.

[Dylan Efron]

Music and being a musician was my whole identity. I had to sort of relearn who I was.

[Rob Mariano]

If you took this thing away, who.

[Dylan Efron]

Am I listen to? On Purpose with Jay Shetty on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Danielle Fishel]

In the middle of the night, Saskia awoke in a Haze. Her husband Mike was on his laptop. What was on his screen would change Saskia's life forever. I said, I need you to tell me exactly what you're doing. And immediately the mask came off.

[Rob Mariano]

You're supposed to be safe.

[Danielle Fishel]

That's your home.

[Rob Mariano]

That's your husband.

[Danielle Fishel]

To keep this secret for so many years, he's like a seasoned pro. This is a story about the end of a marriage, but it's also the story of one woman who was done living in the dark. You're a dangerous person who preys on vulnerable and trusting people.

[Rob Mariano]

You're a creditor.

[Danielle Fishel]

Michael Levengood. Listen to Betrayal, Season 5 on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. What if mind control is real?

[Rob Mariano]

If you could control the behavior of.

[Danielle Fishel]

Anybody around you, what kind of life would you have? Can you hypnotically persuade someone to buy a car?

[Rob Mariano]

When you look at your car, you're.

[Dylan Efron]

Going to become overwhelmed with such good feelings.

[Danielle Fishel]

Can you hypnotize someone into sleeping with you?

[Rob Mariano]

I gave her some suggestions to be sexually aroused.

[Danielle Fishel]

Can you get someone to join your cult? NLP was used on me to access my subconscious. Nlp, AKA Neuro linguistic programming, is a blend of hypnosis, linguistics, and psychology. Fans say it's like finally getting a user manual for your brain.

[Dylan Efron]

It's about engineering consciousness.

[Danielle Fishel]

Mind Games is the story of nlp, its crazy cast of disciples, and the fake doctor who invented it at a new age commune and sold it to guys in suits. He stood trial for murder and got acquitted. The biggest mind game of all, nlp, might actually work. This is wild. Listen to Mind Games on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. We know that you met your girlfriend, Courtney, an actual human angel that I love. Yeah, she's the best. She's incredible. In high school, do you remember asking her to be your girlfriend?

[Dylan Efron]

Oh, the actual ask. It happened super organically. But I remember we, like. We both remember locking eyes in the math hall. That was, like. That was the first time we, like, saw each other. She says she's. She knew who I was and, like, I was an older kid, so she always, like, knew who I was. But that was the first time that we, like, locked eyes, and we're like, hey, wow. But then I think I, like, reached out on MySpace. Oh, my gosh.

[Danielle Fishel]

MySpace.

[Dylan Efron]

Yeah. And then we played tennis and she didn't know me. I'm pretty quirky again once you get to know me. So, like, I. Again, I just, like I'm just doing my own thing. I was like, hey, you want to play tennis? We played for a little bit, and I was like, I'm thirsty. I'm gonna go to Jamba Juice. And then I left. And she was like, oh, that went awful. Yeah. She told me way later. She's like, why'd you leave to go to Jama Juice? I was like, I was thirsty. And she's like, no. Like, I thought you were like, hated me. Yeah. I was like, I don't know.

[Danielle Fishel]

We had just started playing tennis after locking eyes in the math hole, and you left me for a.

[Rob Mariano]

That's good, bro. You were playing hot to guess. I like it.

[Dylan Efron]

It works. That's just me. I was like, I. I think I'm like, a one.

[Danielle Fishel]

Did you offer her a Jamba Juice?

[Dylan Efron]

I have no idea. I have no idea. I was just doing my thing.

[Danielle Fishel]

Would you offer her a Jamba Juice now?

[Dylan Efron]

Of course.

[Danielle Fishel]

I asked her to go walk with you.

[Dylan Efron]

I have no idea if I didn't or what, but, like, I thought the day weren't great, so I. I had.

[Danielle Fishel]

No idea it was over.

[Dylan Efron]

Just over.

[Danielle Fishel]

Time for a juice.

[Dylan Efron]

I think it's like, the same way, like, when Courtney and I have. Sometimes I'm like, all right, we said what we're gonna say, but she'll keep talking. I think it was just one of those where I'm like, oh, yeah, like, we're done. I had no idea.

[Danielle Fishel]

Did you have a high school sweetheart?

[Rob Mariano]

I had. Yeah. I had a couple different girlfriends in high school, so then I wouldn't really have. Sweetheart.

[Dylan Efron]

Sweetheart.

[Danielle Fishel]

Sweet. Rob, you were a superstar in that first massive wave of reality tv.

[Dylan Efron]

Whoa.

[Danielle Fishel]

But you were also the perfect demo for its birth on mtv. Did you watch a lot of Real World?

[Rob Mariano]

I didn't, no. None of it.

[Danielle Fishel]

None.

[Rob Mariano]

Really? Yeah. It was so wild. Like, even, like, applying to be on Survivor. It was kind of just like a spur of the moment thing.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Rob Mariano]

And, like, Yeah, I could have never imagined, but I didn't. I didn't watch any of those other. I still don't know. Like, now it's a challenge. Like, we did Traitors last season. I met some of those people, but I realized, like, that came from that.

[Dylan Efron]

Now did you watch it?

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Dylan Efron]

Yeah, of course. That was the craziest thing about walking into. Because I only watched it when I was young.

[Rob Mariano]

Wait, you watched, like, the old Real World?

[Dylan Efron]

Yeah. That's why when I saw Wes, I was like, holy. Like, I don't. I watched, like, it was always on school, like, Same way Boy Meets World was. That was on channel 45. This would have been on channel 60. But, like, I watched, like, a few seasons here or there. But Wes was so iconic in those seasons, so I met him. I was like, dude, I used to watch you as a kid, and he's like, you're making me feel old.

[Danielle Fishel]

Right.

[Dylan Efron]

What's so crazy is, like, he is old.

[Danielle Fishel]

He's not. Yeah.

[Rob Mariano]

So you watch reruns?

[Dylan Efron]

No, when I was, like, I was watching this when I'm 12 or something. He's like 17, 18. Like, he was. He was young. He was like. He was fight. Starting fights. He was just, like, strong. It's crazy that we're like six years apart, whatever.

[Rob Mariano]

We are. Yeah. But, like, feels like.

[Dylan Efron]

Yeah, it felt like I was watching a grown man get in fights and stuff like that. But he was 18.

[Rob Mariano]

It's wild, man. Like, like, the whole way that it's gone for so long.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yes. You know, you also, though it were in Boston right around the time of new. Of New Kids on the Block. Are you.

[Rob Mariano]

Were you a blocker? No, but I remember when that was, like, a whole big thing. Yeah.

[Danielle Fishel]

Do you know any of them?

[Rob Mariano]

I. So.

[Danielle Fishel]

Tell the story.

[Rob Mariano]

So the part of Boston where I grew up was called High park, and it's like a section of greater Boston. And, like, once a year in the summer, they had these things called Hyde Park Days where they blocked down the streets, and it was basically like a block party. Like, the businesses would go out, sell food and whatever. And the new kids were brand new, and they were doing, like, a local performance. Like, they were just getting started. They were big, you know, and it was like Donnie Wahlberg and, like, Jordan. I can't remember them all.

[Danielle Fishel]

McKnight.

[Rob Mariano]

Yeah. Yeah. But we had a gym that we used to play basketball in called the Municipal Building. And every day we'd go there, me and all my friends would play basketball. Well, it was High park day, so we go in and play basketball. And the gym was closed down because the new kids and Mark Wahlberg. Marky Mark at the time, was there, and we got into a little bit of a scuffle.

[Dylan Efron]

You fought?

[Rob Mariano]

No, no, we didn't fight. But they were like words back and forth, like, this is our gy. What are you doing here? And they closed it down for them to play while they did it. And it's funny because years later, Donnie had a movie come out. Or Mark. I can't remember which one. One of them had a movie come out. Huckabees. And they had A big premiere in Connecticut at Mohegan sun with a golf tournament. So it was the first time I saw him 20 years later. And like, I was like, hey, do you remember this time? And he, like, looked at me, he's like, were you there? And I was like, like, yeah, that was me. But everybody loved the new kid. They're great now. Like, we're good. But everybody loved them. They were huge New kids on the block. For sure.

[Danielle Fishel]

It was.

[Dylan Efron]

I saw the song.

[Rob Mariano]

There were lots of songs, but there's like, got a bunch.

[Dylan Efron]

It's Chinese food. Makes me sick. That's not them.

[Rob Mariano]

No, that's not them.

[Danielle Fishel]

That's my lfo.

[Rob Mariano]

I'm not. I'm not singing any of the songs that I know.

[Dylan Efron]

They reference new kids.

[Danielle Fishel]

So what was the music you listened to as a kid or a teen?

[Rob Mariano]

Oh, really bad music? Yeah, like a lot of, like, rap music, like gangster rap music, like classic rock. Like, my dad is like, you know, Beatles era, Bob Dylan, 60s. So, like, my dad played guitar, my brother played guitar. I have no musical ability at all. But I grew up listening to their generation music and the trash that was in our generation.

[Danielle Fishel]

Don't call it trash.

[Rob Mariano]

I know, but looking back, but like, there was some like, hard rock, like Def Leppard, you know, Aerosmith, obviously the Boston band. They were big. I love music, but like, it wasn't like a big thing in my life.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah. What was on your earliest ipod, Dylan?

[Dylan Efron]

Oh, gosh, it wasn't even an ipod. It was a riot.

[Rob Mariano]

Oh, really?

[Dylan Efron]

All right. Yeah, my dad was a little budget finder. Yeah, I love that.

[Danielle Fishel]

I love that. Your dad's like, I'm gonna find a deal.

[Dylan Efron]

Yeah, I think I got the Rio. It was like a little red ipod looking thing. Oh, my God. That was a blue one. I'm shocked I remembered the name. It probably held like 100 songs. We had a cool mix where I grew up in the central coast because we got a lot of Bay area rap influence. So like Andre Nicatina and a bunch of like, like cool rap influence from there, but then some SoCal as well. So it was a weird mix of like guitar, like more like Jack Johnson Y type stuff and singer, songwriter, and.

[Danielle Fishel]

Some cool, like indie rap.

[Dylan Efron]

Yeah, that's. That was pretty much my list.

[Danielle Fishel]

Well, now we get to see grown up Dylan and Rob take their competitive streaks to a whole new level with Everything's a competition, a YouTube show where the two of you are going to head to head in various challenges from pottery to medieval times duels, where did this concept come from?

[Rob Mariano]

All from Dylan's brain.

[Dylan Efron]

I'm just here for the ride.

[Rob Mariano]

It's like we're in preschool or kindergarten and he has like some unfinished business and he wants to settle it.

[Dylan Efron]

All those challenges I lost in the fifth grade physics class. I need redemption. Like, we were literally talking about, like the dropping eggs from. Yeah. From the heights. And Jensen's like, oh, our kids just did it. Yeah.

[Danielle Fishel]

And his didn't break.

[Dylan Efron]

I see.

[Rob Mariano]

That's good. I did it. I did it when I was a kid.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Rob Mariano]

I was telling him I made like, airbags were like brand new airbags and cars and like I built a tube with like two balloons on each end and put the egg in the middle.

[Dylan Efron]

How the airbags is it. Was it already inflated or did you have the mechanism actually going in?

[Rob Mariano]

No, I was already inflated.

[Danielle Fishel]

He was an engineer, so he probably.

[Dylan Efron]

Just invented the airbag.

[Rob Mariano]

Wrong kind of engineer.

[Dylan Efron]

How'd you do that? Just your parents car. You like airbag? We.

[Danielle Fishel]

We used a pool noodle. So we cut a pool noodle and then cut the sides, put the air. The noodle around it and then wrapped that to really absorb.

[Dylan Efron]

I so badly want to share my strategy, but I'm probably going to reuse it if we shoot this episode.

[Rob Mariano]

So I have a new one. And I was like, I'm glad you said that because I was just going to tell you I have the foolproof one that I know works every time. But I'm not saying it now because you just said that. And I'm gonna use that speak for this competitive. That's how it goes.

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay, I see. I mean, do we wanna talk about the episode we just did?

[Dylan Efron]

Yeah.

[Rob Mariano]

Yeah, let's talk about it.

[Dylan Efron]

Yeah. He's all excited.

[Danielle Fishel]

We just had so much fun playing live fruit ninja.

[Rob Mariano]

Yes.

[Dylan Efron]

We had a real ninja. Master Shervin.

[Danielle Fishel]

Master Shervin came from dragons. Mma. Dragons, martial arts, where my kids go to karate and I have taken classes. And he brought a katana sword that had never been used. So sharp, razor sharp, razor sharp dragons engraved on it. Just a beautiful sword.

[Dylan Efron]

It is cooler than I could have imagined a sword would be.

[Danielle Fishel]

Right?

[Rob Mariano]

Yeah.

[Danielle Fishel]

Now you're like into swords.

[Dylan Efron]

Yeah, no, I've always been into swords. Let's be real.

[Danielle Fishel]

So do we want to talk about how it went? We broke up into teams. Dylan and I were on a team. Rob and Jensen were on a team.

[Dylan Efron]

Yeah. Yeah. I would say this was a really non competitive episode. Like we didn't really care. It was just so fun.

[Rob Mariano]

The most Climactic episode that we've had. Yet it came down to the last, the very last fruit swing.

[Dylan Efron]

We were cheering everyone on. Like, I was so happy Jensen got his. Yeah, it was so good.

[Danielle Fishel]

It was just like relaxed.

[Dylan Efron]

It wasn't really competitive. Yeah. Which was cool. It was a cool change to not be so competitive for anything episode.

[Rob Mariano]

Okay, you guys want the truth?

[Danielle Fishel]

It was painful.

[Rob Mariano]

It was actually a lot of fun.

[Dylan Efron]

It was, it worked a lot. Like some of these I. The routine in this show is that my 5 year old brain comes up with a concept that Boston Rob just tries to pick apart hates on it. Then he wins and says, that was so much fun. It is like, I wish we had a montage of him just so happy he wins and goes, that was so much fun. That was a great idea.

[Danielle Fishel]

It's your version of Howard Stern's the hate list. You know, at the end of the year, they do a compilation of every time throughout the year. He says, I hate something. I hate lines, I hate the cold. I, you would have. That was so much fun.

[Rob Mariano]

This one was a lot of fun. But like, usually he doesn't tell me about it and he's changing the rules.

[Dylan Efron]

Oh, no, the, the best one we shot. Like, I, I don't know if it's our best episode, but it was so fun because we did a fire making challenge which we hadn't thought of for some weird reason. Yeah, it was actually the first time I've seen him nervous. Like, I, I, I, it's a lose.

[Rob Mariano]

Lose situation for me, Danielle. Right? Like, I'm the guy that, like, should know how to do the fire. Right?

[Danielle Fishel]

Okay.

[Rob Mariano]

So if I do it and I win, like, it looks like I'm dunking on him.

[Dylan Efron]

Right.

[Rob Mariano]

He came up with the idea. But if I lose, I look like a complete.

[Dylan Efron]

And to his credit, he didn't complain. Like, I was like, I don't even know if I want to tell him because how funny would it be if I, I just like, yeah, he just walked into it. But I was like, I can' to him. I've, I, I haven't cheated. I haven't researched stuff. I was like, I gotta tell him what it is. He was down, but it was literally like he showed no nerves. It was right before. I just see him going like, he's like, he's like legit doing like big exhales.

[Rob Mariano]

Like, it's like all on the line for me.

[Dylan Efron]

And in the very beginning, his fire is not starting. This is faulty wood. This isn't working. And he's just.

[Rob Mariano]

Yeah.

[Dylan Efron]

One thing after another. He was. Was. And seeing him stress for that minute was so great.

[Rob Mariano]

Imagine if like the competition was a sit up challenge or pull up challenge and all of a sudden I take the lead. No.

[Dylan Efron]

Trust me, right? Look, I'm saying I fully understand. I give you props for stepping up to the plate, but it was so cool.

[Danielle Fishel]

It was a sweet moment for you to.

[Rob Mariano]

Needless to say, it ended and he said, well, I'm going to need redemption. We got to do that again. I'm just saying, like every single episode.

[Dylan Efron]

Spoiler.

[Rob Mariano]

You know what was really like when we leave, when we leave here, we're going to get in the car and he's going to go, you know, that was a really great episode. I think, like, if we did it again, right, and next time we'll just.

[Dylan Efron]

Alternate fruits or I think master servant's going to be coming back because we're doing knife throwing. We got to tap into the sunset.

[Danielle Fishel]

Master Shervin is your guy for sure.

[Dylan Efron]

This is where we run into issues a lot, though, because we come up with a plan and we change it last second. Because the. We are the ones ultimately in control of it. And when we make changes on the fly, sometimes we should have stuck with our gut. So it's. It's hard.

[Rob Mariano]

We need like, this is him in. I'm gonna give you the inside baseball. This is him mad about a challenge that he lost yesterday.

[Dylan Efron]

No, it's. It's not the first time it's happened, though.

[Rob Mariano]

But it's like we both agreed to it.

[Dylan Efron]

No, no, no. I'm saying, but that's the, that's the danger is like, our rules are so flimsy and ultimately I'm making them the day before. So then he's like, oh, I don't think this rule's fair. And then I'm like, oh, maybe it isn't. So it's like, like ultimately, when the show scales up, we need to have like a rule maker and we just.

[Rob Mariano]

Show independent rule maker. That's not on your side.

[Danielle Fishel]

That's why Today I said, Mr. Shervin needs to be the one.

[Rob Mariano]

I agree.

[Danielle Fishel]

Because then you have someone who goes, all right, I heard the rules myself.

[Rob Mariano]

Yes.

[Danielle Fishel]

And now I'll be the person to.

[Rob Mariano]

Do have to give it to Mr. Shervin because he was a man of loyalty and integrity.

[Dylan Efron]

When.

[Rob Mariano]

When Dylan did not cut the fruit, he said. Said that unlike in a previous episode when we were lawn bowling and every single advantage went right to it, but.

[Dylan Efron]

He thinks I set that up. I didn't. I showed up. I. I didn't. And. And anyone can confirm. I don't know this guy. It was just from the. My first role, he was like, this guy's good, and. And he. He sucked up to me. I can't deny that.

[Danielle Fishel]

Right.

[Dylan Efron]

But he thinks I. He thinks I know this guy. I don't.

[Danielle Fishel]

Don't know.

[Rob Mariano]

Let me just tell you why. Let me tell you why I think. Because certain challenges, we do, right? It's supposed to be even playing field.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yes.

[Rob Mariano]

Nobody's supposed to have an advantage. That's true on two separate occasions. Now Dylan's created challenges, and we found out after that he has intimate knowledge of the event we went to go do. We get to go do ceramics. And after the event is over. Oh, Dylan took a ceramics class in high school.

[Dylan Efron]

And the thing that he just. Just goes in one ear, out the other is, I've never done the wheel.

[Rob Mariano]

I don't care what I did. You did a class in ceramics?

[Dylan Efron]

I didn't. I got a C from pinching clay. It was my least favorite class I ever did, But I was there pinching pots. And he's like, oh, he did this. This is nullified. I'm like, what about the boat regatta? The boat regatta I did in high school as, like. As one of these, like, things. I built a boat 15 years ago.

[Rob Mariano]

When were you gonna tell me? Never told me about it. Well, we have a challenge run. We're gonna build boats out of cardboard, and we're gonna race them. And then Courtney comes in and goes, oh, this is just like you did in high school. What?

[Danielle Fishel]

Well, I mean, Dylan would never say that. Like, having dance experience in high school.

[Rob Mariano]

He tried. He tried to get me to do a dancing competition right after he goes, you know, it'd be great. We should do a dance off. I'll get my friend. We can do a dance off. Let's do a flex competition.

[Danielle Fishel]

Danny. Danny can be the judge.

[Rob Mariano]

Yeah, Danny will judge. Danny will be my partner.

[Dylan Efron]

And, you know, you bring someone from home. So hard to hear because he does the same stuff. Like, the amount of times he's wanted to do an eating competition, every time we pass a Beni Hana, he's like, oh, what if we do the green light challenge? And whoever can keep the green light on.

[Rob Mariano]

I'm like, it was fogo de chow fun.

[Dylan Efron]

Let's do a beer drinking contest. It's like, it's. It's. It happens both ways. He's just more influential when he says these things.

[Danielle Fishel]

Here is. This is A good. These are good special episodes where you guys get to pick the, you know, like, you're gonna do the Boston Rob episode, and it's like, three things. He gets to pick.

[Rob Mariano]

No, we already did.

[Dylan Efron]

We already did. Fire making. But he, he likes the. You chose that. You came up with that somehow it's a lose, lose. No matter what it is. It is.

[Rob Mariano]

People are gonna be like, oh, well, of course you were supposed to win that. Like, why are you guys doing everything that's so easy for Rob? Just, dude, bad, bad everything.

[Dylan Efron]

What can I pick? We're doing a spelling bee later today, and, like, somehow, like, I, I, I was good in, in seventh grade.

[Danielle Fishel]

Liter.

[Dylan Efron]

You were good in seventh grade. See, this is what I mean.

[Rob Mariano]

It's skewed so bad.

[Dylan Efron]

This is why it's like, what do you think? You would think I'm a national spelling beach.

[Rob Mariano]

Oh, my gosh.

[Danielle Fishel]

Rob, I've met your daughters. They're all amazing. Would you ever encourage them to be.

[Rob Mariano]

On Survivor if they want to? Yeah, but not yet. Like, I really think, like, there's a sweet spot. You have to be. You have to have a certain amount of life experience to be able to participate in that show. Well, Right. I remember the season I won. I went all the way to the end with a girl still friends with great girl Natalie Tanarelli. She was only 19 at the time, and she just didn't have enough life experience to navigate, you know, the deception, all of it. So I think, like, you know, at some point, if that's something they want to do, for sure they could do it. Yeah. I wouldn't stop them. Wow.

[Danielle Fishel]

Would you ever go on Survivor? You'd kill it on Survivor.

[Dylan Efron]

Yeah. Like, I grew up loving that show, so I think it would be super fun. But it's, it's, it's weird now because, like, that show, they don't cast people that are known, so I think your ship has sailed. I, Unless they did a different version, it might just be one of those ones where you would get picked up, picked out early. I don't know. Like, I don't know. They've had.

[Rob Mariano]

You'd be great if you listened. I would tell you. You have to listen, though.

[Dylan Efron]

Yeah. Like, that was my first love of a show. Like, when Courtney still says to this day, like, she was like, I was convinced you're gonna go on that show because I was so adamant as a kid. I was like, I'm gonna go on the show.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah.

[Dylan Efron]

But, yeah, it was the athletic stuff. I really, like, wanted to go Spearfish. I wanted to go live on an island. I wanted to do the challenges. And the show has evolved a little bit away from that stuff that I love.

[Rob Mariano]

But that is the fun part. That's the part of the show that I love. Even though I'm known for the strategy part and the deception and the cutthroat, the part that really initially drew me to it was exactly what you're talking about, the adventure.

[Dylan Efron]

And we were literally just talking about this strategy wise. Like, my dream was to go spearfish. Like, it's so funny for me watching the show as a spear fisherman and seeing people like shoot reef fish and like in 3 foot of water, it's like, no, I'd go beyond the break and spearfish. But in the show today, you can't do that. It's moving so fast that if you go out and spearfish for four hours, you're going to be voted out.

[Rob Mariano]

Yeah.

[Dylan Efron]

So it's, it's so. It's. It's tough. I want to do. I still want to do it. I would play the game as is for sure.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah. I like, I like games where they're. I love physical challenges. I like am up for anything that's a physical challenge. The deception, lying stuff would just be. I'm like, I would just. I can't do it.

[Rob Mariano]

You say, I know Danielle.

[Dylan Efron]

Danielle said.

[Rob Mariano]

She's so smart. She said it. But I see it and I call you out on that nonsense.

[Dylan Efron]

Yeah.

[Rob Mariano]

Really good though. But I think, like, remember, like when we were kids, there was a show, Double Dare.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yes.

[Rob Mariano]

Do you remember that show? I love that show. And I don't like, understand how anybody would ever not go for the physical challenge.

[Dylan Efron]

Yes.

[Rob Mariano]

Like, that was like the initial, you know, idea and like that adventure part of it, the obstacle courses, it brings out your inner kid, I think a little bit.

[Dylan Efron]

Show from a long time ago where it was like at the very. The last obstacle is they had to climb up Mount Fuji or whatever. What was that show called? Different teams of like two. I used to love that.

[Danielle Fishel]

Is that also on Nickelodeon?

[Rob Mariano]

I think it was.

[Dylan Efron]

What was it? Guts.

[Rob Mariano]

Oh, my God.

[Dylan Efron]

God. Aggro Crag. Yeah, the. Yeah, that show. And then the one where there was like, like they would have to go through the jungle and then those scary people would pop out. Do you remember that one? I don't know. Legends of the Hidden Temple. Those, like, that was my jam. I've always wanted to do that.

[Rob Mariano]

Like, your kids are young. Like you're. They're at the age where like they love to go to the park. Right. Like so I remember when my kids were that young, like how much fun they loved going to the park and. And I always thought like they should do a show. Give it away now. Right. Whatever. The playground but for adults where you get to play all the games and there's some kind of built in challenge to it.

[Danielle Fishel]

It's a good idea.

[Rob Mariano]

I think we could do that. Yeah.

[Dylan Efron]

You make you versus me a teeter totter.

[Rob Mariano]

How many times?

[Dylan Efron]

How'd you break your bag?

[Rob Mariano]

The speed. That's what we'll do.

[Dylan Efron]

We'll measure.

[Rob Mariano]

We'll get a radar.

[Danielle Fishel]

A radar who can spin it fast.

[Rob Mariano]

You can spin the other person who get.

[Danielle Fishel]

Yeah, that's what you got to do.

[Rob Mariano]

And this is our creative process.

[Danielle Fishel]

I love it.

[Rob Mariano]

You're seeing it live.

[Danielle Fishel]

Well, I love it. I love you both. Thank you for being here. Teen Beat is an iHeart podcast produced and hosted by Danielle Fishel, executive producers Jensen Karp and Amy Sugarman. Executive in charge of production Danielle Romo, producer and editor Tara Sudbaksh. The theme song is by Mark Hoppus. Yes, that Mark Hoppus. Follow us on instagrambeatpod.

[Rob Mariano]

Seems like just yesterday that the two Guys five Rings podcast was in Paris for the Olympics. And now we're heading to Milan for the 2026 Milan Cortina Olympic Winter Games. I'm Bowen Yang. And I'm Matt Rogers. And Will joined athletes from 93 countries as Two Guys Five Rings hits the Italian Alps for the 2026 Milan Cortina Olympic Winter Games. Open your free iHeartRadio app. Did we mention it's free? Search Two Guys Five Rings and listen.

[Danielle Fishel]

Now, people who didn't do what Joan of God wanted them to do, they usually disappeared. John of God was once Brazil's most famous spiritual healer. But in this limited series podcast, we uncover the darker truth behind his global empire of faith and fear. From exactly right and adonde Media, this is Two Faced John of God. Listen on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Nancy Glass, host of the Burden of Guilt season two podcast. This is a story about a horrendous lie that destroyed two families. Late one night, Bobby Gumpright became the victim of a random crime. The perpetrator was sentenced to 99 years until a confession changed everything.

[Dylan Efron]

I was a monster.

[Danielle Fishel]

Listen to Burden of guilt season two starting February 11th on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. When segregation was a law, one mysterious black club owner Charlie Fitzgerald had his own rules.

[Rob Mariano]

Segregation in the day, integration at night. It was like stepping in another world.

[Danielle Fishel]

Was he a businessman? A criminal? A hero?

[Rob Mariano]

Charlie was an example, a power that had the crush.

[Danielle Fishel]

You Charlie's Place from Atlas Obscura and visit Myrtle Beach. Listen to Charlie's place on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an I heart podcast, guaranteed human.