The Murder of Mark Knapp (Vermont)

Summary

Dark Downeast: "The Murder of Mark Knapp (Vermont)" – Episode Summary

Podcast: Dark Downeast
Host: Kylie Low
Date: January 29, 2026

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Overview of the Episode

In this gripping installment, host Kylie Low explores the baffling and tragic 1984 murder of 28-year-old Mark Knapp in Vermont. The episode meticulously reconstructs the events leading up to Mark's death, the ensuing investigation, and the complicated pursuit of justice. Through careful storytelling, Kylie brings to light the life of Mark Knapp, the community impact of the crime, and the many twists, setbacks, and ethical questions that defined the legal process.

The narrative is rich, empathetic, and respectful—true to Dark Downeast’s mission of honoring the human stories behind New England’s darkest crimes while refusing to let them disappear into history.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

The Disappearance and Discovery

• [02:02] Mark Knapp’s routine call home on February 22, 1984, is the last contact before his disappearance.
• His Ford LTD station wagon was found abandoned that night near Castleton, Vermont; no sign of Mark, the keys in the ignition, and the gas tank empty.
• By [02:54], Mark’s body is discovered at the bottom of a 125-foot marble quarry after target shooters spot a shape on the ice the next afternoon.
• Mark’s hands were bound. He bore minor puncture wounds, later attributed to a pair of orange scissors found nearby, but the cause of death was found to be head and chest trauma from the fall.
• Initially, police vacillated between possible homicide, accident, or suicide. The early investigation was marked by cautious optimism and uncertainty.

The Investigation: Community and Clues

• [04:44] The case deeply rattled the tight-knit Brandon, Vermont community.
• The car interior was in disarray, out of character for Mark and suggesting a struggle or someone else’s presence ([05:22]).
• 40 pieces of evidence were collected. Cigarette butts and bottles were found—Mark neither smoked nor drank.
• Similar boot prints matching ones at the car and quarry linked the two scenes. Prints were sent to the FBI.
• A witness placed Mark with a business associate at around 5pm, but his whereabouts from after his 8pm call until his death were unclear.

“Nearly every fragment of Mark's final hours was scrutinized as police searched for something that might explain how a young man like Mark… could disappear after a phone call home and end up bound and broken at the bottom of a quarry.”
– Kylie Low, [06:56]

Mark Knapp: Portrait of the Victim

• Mark was known for his intelligence, kindness, and community involvement: debate team standout, college graduate, volunteer firefighter, and mentor.
• He was “generous, kind, gentle”—the type of man described by those who knew him as someone who "wouldn't have hurt anyone, even if they were hurting him" ([08:50]).
• The community was shaken; fear and paranoia took hold.

Break in the Case: Identifying Suspects

• The Rutland Daily Herald publishes a photo of Mark’s car, leading to a breakthrough ([15:03]).
• A math teacher recognizes two hitchhikers from the evening of Mark’s disappearance: Michael Roberts (20) and Randall Daniels (18).
• Six fingerprints on the car match Randall; prints on Mark’s glasses also belong to Randall.

“Suddenly, Mark Knapp's case had names attached to it. And the names Michael Roberts and Randall Daniels were already tethered to each other.”
– Kylie Low, [16:02]

• Michael, out on conditional release for armed robbery, is seen with Randall the night of Mark’s death.
• Polygraphs, police interviews, and shoe tread evidence further implicate both.

Confessions and Arrest

• Under interrogation, Michael Roberts attempts to negotiate:

"If I tell you the truth, what kind of deal could you give me?" ([17:42])

• Both are arrested: Randall for murder, Michael for probation violation.
• The working theory: an opportunistic robbery leading to Mark’s death.

Randall Turns State’s Witness

• [20:27] Randall details to police how he, Michael, and Mark spent the night together—driving, drinking, and ultimately forcing Mark to withdraw money at an ATM.
• Randall claims Michael intended to “tie Mark up and leave him” at the quarry. Randall binds Mark’s hands, removes his glasses, and follows at a distance as Michael appears to push Mark over.
• Randall is offered a plea deal: he avoids murder charges by pleading no contest to kidnapping and agreeing to testify against Michael.
• Michael is charged with kidnapping, armed robbery, murder to commit robbery, and second-degree murder, all based heavily on Randall’s narrative.

The Legal Labyrinth: Trials and Testimonies

First Trial (June 1985)

• Michael’s defense argues Randall is the true killer, based on evidence including Mark’s camera found at Randall’s house, blood stains, and Randall’s own barroom comments.
• Randall’s testimony collapses under questioning; he repeatedly claims amnesia, contradicts himself, and ultimately recants key portions.

“Randall said, quote, he could have pushed him. He could have been falling, and Mike grabbed for him, end quote.”
– Kylie Low (attributed to Randall Daniels), [29:31]

• The jury deadlocks between manslaughter and acquittal; a mistrial is declared ([31:40]).

Second Trial and Charges Dropped

• [35:56] The state intends to retry Michael, but the case collapses when Randall invokes his Fifth Amendment right and refuses to testify without further immunity.
• First-degree murder and robbery charges are dismissed without prejudice. Michael is re-tried only for kidnapping.

Kidnapping Conviction

• Jurors hear only reading of Randall’s prior statements, not live testimony.
• Michael’s girlfriend testifies, shifting blame to Randall.
• The jury convicts Michael of kidnapping ([42:19]). He is sentenced to 10–25 years, eligible for parole after 5–6; ultimately, he serves less than eight.

Aftermath and Unanswered Justice

• Upon release, Michael Roberts is soon arrested for unrelated drug charges.
• Randall Daniels escapes custody twice before being recaptured; the contempt charge for refusing to testify is dropped.
• No one is ever convicted for Mark Knapp’s killing. Kylie reflects on whether the outcomes fit the magnitude of the crime or the loss to Mark’s family and community.

“Both men who were with him that night were convicted of kidnapping him. But no one has ever been held accountable for his death.”
– Kylie Low, [42:53]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the Community’s Response:
  “Fear began to settle over the community like a fog. People who had never locked their doors before now did. A woman told the local paper she was afraid to walk alone. Another said she no longer felt safe sitting in her own vehicle.”
  – Kylie Low, [09:30]

• On Mark’s Character and Legacy:
  “He made small phone calls home to his parents so they wouldn't worry. And then he didn’t come home.”
  – Kylie Low, [42:53]

• On the Failure of Justice:
  “The case of Mark Knapp had become something much smaller than it should have been. A murder charge dismissed, a mistrial, a kidnapping conviction that stood in place of a life taken.”
  – Kylie Low, [42:30]

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• [02:02] – Disappearance, discovery, and early investigation
• [06:56] – Mark Knapp’s background and community impact
• [13:57] – Case breakthrough via public photo, identification of suspects
• [20:27] – Randall’s full confession, plea deal details
• [28:54] – Trial begins, courtroom drama, collapse of Randall’s testimony
• [31:40] – Mistrial declared, juror insights
• [35:56] – Charges dropped due to witness issues, retrial for kidnapping
• [42:19] – Kidnapping conviction, sentencing, and aftermath
• [42:53] – Reflections on justice and Mark’s enduring legacy

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Tone and Closing Thoughts

With empathy and meticulous detail, Kylie Low honors Mark’s life, laments the failures of the justice system, and stresses the importance of refusing to let these cases be reduced to mere footnotes. The episode closes with a call to remember the victims—like Mark—who deserve attention, empathy, and, ultimately, justice.

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For sources and further information, visit darkdowneast.com.

Transcript

[A]

This podcast is supported by the RealReal. Meet Christine. She loves shopping and this is the sound of fashion overload. Too many fabulous things, not enough space. So Christine started selling with the RealReal.

[B]

I've always loved collecting designer pieces, Gucci bags, Prada heels. But my style keeps evolving. Selling with the RealReal game changer. I earn more. And they do everything.

[A]

Seriously. Just drop off your items or schedule a pickup. We handle the photos, descriptions, pricing, even shipping. You just sit back and watch your items sell fast to our 40 million.

[B]

Members and I get peace of mind knowing I earn more selling with the RealReal than anywhere else.

[A]

Exactly this. That's the sound of your closet working for you. The real Real. Earn more, save time, sell fast and only for the month of January. Earn up to $550 extra when you sell with the Real Real. That's right. Up to $550 extra. Go to therealreal.com to get started. Earn up to $550 extra this month at therealreal.com terms apply.

[C]

Sometimes in the quiet corners of our world, or even in the glaring light of day, events unfold that defy the very fabric of reason.

[D]

There is no scientific, logical or readily apparent explanation for what we witness. It challenges our understanding, our beliefs, and even our sanity. Why do these things happen? What forces are are at play?

[C]

I'm Yvette Gentile.

[D]

And I'm her sister, Racha Pecorero.

[C]

Every week on our podcast so Supernatural, we dive deep into some of the earth's most bizarre and inexplicable occurrences. We don't just observe them. We actively try to explain the unexplainable.

[D]

So if you're ready to have your perceptions challenged and your curiosity ignited, let listen to so Supernatural every Friday wherever you get your podcasts.

[E]

When Mark Knapp's routine commute home from work one February night in 1984 ended with his car abandoned and his body at the bottom of an old marble quarry, the shock rippled far beyond one family. Suspects were quickly identified and charged in connection with Mark Stern death. But shifting narratives and fragile witnesses fractured the entire foundation of the case just as the truth came into view. I'm Kylie Lowe and this is the case of Mark Knapp on Dark Down East. By the morning of February 23, 1984, 28 year old Mark Fuller Knapp had been gone too long. According to Yvonne Daly's reporting for the Rutland Daily Herald, around 8pm the night before, Mark had done what he always did when he was out. He called home to see if there were any messages waiting for him. It was a brief, ordinary conversation, the kind his parents had heard hundreds of times before. And they expected, as they always did, that they would hear the door open and Mark's footsteps over the threshold not long after. But they never did. So that quiet Thursday morning, after no sign of Mark all night, his mother placed the call to Vermont State Trooper Dennis Holman, who wasn't just an officer but a man who knew their son personally. Lois Webby reports for the Rutland Daily Herald that Dennis and Mark both served with the Brandon Volunteer Fire Department, where Mark's father was chief and part of the close knit world where everyone is easily accounted for until suddenly, someone isn't. Mark's name, description and details of his vehicle were broadcast to area law enforcement in hopes someone might spot him. That very Same night, Mark's 1983 Ford LTD station wagon was discovered abandoned along Route 4A near the entrance of Rock Ruby's sand pit in Castleton, Vermont. The keys were still in the ignition. The gas tank was empty. There was no obvious signs of violence, just a car sitting where it shouldn't be. At first, Vermont State Police did not assume the worst. With the vehicle out of fuel, investigators considered that Mark may have walked to a motel or sought out transportation, perhaps trying to solve a mundane problem in the dark hours rather than fleeing something sinister. But that cautious optimism lasted less than a day. Around 1pm on Feb. 24, target shooters near the abandoned Vermont Marble quarry off Marble Street Extension in West Rutland noticed something on the ice. Far below them, at the base of a 125 foot cliff, a shape lay frozen in place. Though difficult to discern for an untrained eye, troopers who responded recognized the mass as a human body. The quarry walls were sheer. There was no way to reach the body without specialized equipment, so police secured the area and stood watch through the night over someone they could see but did not yet know. The next day, a rescue team arrived with an old quarrying cage attached to a crane and divers to descend into the pit. It took six hours to recover the body, six hours of machinery echoing off stones, six hours of waiting for a name that everyone already feared to hear aloud. Among those standing at the edge was Dennis Holman, the trooper who had taken Mark's mother's call, and the fellow firefighter who had once served beside him. He confirmed what the Knapp family already the man recovered from the ice was their missing son. Dr. Paul Morrow. The state deputy medical examiner conducted the autopsy. Mark's hands were bound. There was no obvious signs of struggle in the quarry itself. Yet Mark bore several small puncture woundson his back, his chest, and at least two on his wrists. According to reporting by Joseph Zingale for the Burlington Free Press, the injuries were no larger than the tip of a pen. The wounds on his wrists were noted as possible defensive injuries. Those puncture wounds were later attributed to a pair of 5 inch orange scissors recovered from the quarry not far from Mark's body. It seemed Mark had likely been confronted with a weapon before his death, however mundane it appeared. However, the medical examiner later said the scissor wounds themselves were not significant and did not contribute to Mark's death. Rather, he concluded that Mark was alive when he went over the edge of the quarry and that he died from head and chest injuries caused by the impact. Toxicology screens were requested as part of the examination, but there was no evidence of any substance or alcohol use at the time of the autopsy. The medical examiner believed Mark likely died after 8pm on Feb. 22, based on when his parents had received that final phone call. Those first few days of the investigation were defined by theories because there was really very little to go on. Not even the medical examiner's ruling felt definitive. Dr. Morrow classified the manner of death as homicide. But police were notably more cautious with their language, stopping short of using that same term publicly. Suicide did not seem likely, though investigators did not clarify how they reached that assumption. At the same time, they also did not rule out the possibility of an accident, since it was impossible early on to determine based on the given evidence whether Mark was pushed or if he fell. One theory suggested he may have been trying to escape an assailant when he went into the quarry. Complicating everything was the location of Mark's car. The abandoned Ford LTD was found roughly 10 miles from where his body lay. Police believed Mark may have been hitchhiking after running out of gas or that someone else had been driving the car and left it behind when the tank ran dry inside that station wagon. The scene did not match what people knew of Mark. A witness described him as an orderly person, yet the interior of the vehicle was found in disarray. That detail bolstered the theory that someone else drove Mark's car at some point. With that, state police dusted the car for fingerprints and collected approximately 40 pieces of potential evidence from the area around it. Among the items recovered were cigarette butts and alcohol bottles in cans. Also notable because Mark was not known to smoke or drink, footprints offered one of the few physical links between the car and the scene of Mark's death. An impression was found at the edge of the quarry and another near Mark's abandoned station wagon. The soles appeared similar with a small circular tread pattern. Photographs were sent to the FBI for further analysis. Police were also trying to establish where Mark had last been seen alive. Mark sold construction equipment for New England Equipment Co. Inc. And a witness told police he had conducted a business transaction with Mark around 5pm on February 22. The witness said Mark indicated he was heading home afterward. We know he called his parents around 8pm that night. So where did Mark go and who did he encounter after that? Nearly every fragment of Mark's final hours was scrutinized as police searched for something that might explain how a young man like Mark, generous, kind, gentle Mark could disappear after a phone call home and end up bound and broken at the bottom of a quarry. In the warmer months, Mark Knapp lived on his own in Orwell, Vermont, slowly restoring a house most people would have given up on. The place stood out big and yellow, trimmed in green and white. But Mark saw potential where others simply saw work. Winter sent him back to Brandon, Vermont, to the town where he had spent nearly his entire life. Mark was born on June 2, 1955, and aside from college years, he never fully parted from the place that shaped him. At Otter Valley Union High school, class of 1973, he had found his voice early. He wasn't just a member of the debate team. He excelled, earning a first speaker award at a state competition. His dedication to learning carried him to the University of Vermont, where he earned a bachelor's degree in speech pathology. Later, at Linden State College, he added an associate's degree in business administration. Even while building his own future, Mark kept looking back toward home. He returned to Otter Valley to judge debate competitions while still a college student, giving time to the same program that had once given him confidence. He also followed his father, Murray Knapp, Brandon's fire chief, into volunteer firefighting, another way of placing himself quietly in service of others. There were also smaller acts no resume could capture. Mark mentored a local boy who was struggling in school, stepping into a big brother role without being asked. Those who knew him described him the same way over and gentle, generous, bright, a good student who applied himself, a man who gave more than he took. One friend said that Mark wouldn't have hurt anyone, even if they were hurting him. Nothing about Mark's life suggested recklessness. Nothing about his habits even hinted at risk. And yet, somewhere in the space between a routine call home and a drive that should have ended at his parents doorstep, Mark Knapp encountered something or someone that pulled him completely off the map. Fear began to settle over the community like a fog. People who had never locked their doors before now did. A woman told the local paper she was afraid to walk alone. Another said she no longer felt safe sitting in her own vehicle. Whoever had taken Mark, bound his hands and brought him to that quarry's edge to die, hadn't been caught, and the absence of answers was louder than any police statement. For days, the evidence offered little more than isolated facts until a black and white photograph in the newspaper cracked the case wide open.

[A]

This podcast is supported by the RealReal. Meet Christine. She loves shopping, and this is the sound of fashion overload. Too many fabulous things, not enough space. So Christine started selling with the RealReal.

[B]

I've always loved collecting designer pieces, Gucci bags, Prada heels. But my style keeps evolving. Selling with the RealReal game changer. I earn more. And they do everything.

[A]

Seriously. Just drop off your items or schedule a pickup. We handle the photos, descriptions, pricing, even shipping. You just sit back and watch your items Sell fast to our 40 million.

[B]

Members and I get peace of mind knowing I earn more selling with the RealReal than anywhere else.

[A]

Exactly this. That's the sound of your closet working for you. The RealReal earn more, save time, sell fast, and only for the month of January. Earn up to $550 extra when you sell with the RealReal. That's right, up to $550 extra. Go to therealreal.com to get started. Earn up to $550 extra this month at therealreal.com Terms apply sometimes in the.

[C]

Quiet corners of our world or even in the glaring light of day. Events unfold that defy the very fabric of reason.

[D]

There is no scientific, logical, or readily apparent explanation for what we witness. It challenges our understanding, our beliefs, and even our sanity. Why do these things happen? What forces are at play?

[C]

I'm Yvette Gentile.

[D]

And I'm her sister, Racha Pecorero.

[C]

Every week on our podcast so Supernatural, we dive deep into some of the Earth's most bizarre and inexplicable occurrences. We don't just observe them. We actively try to explain the unexplainable.

[D]

So if you're ready to have your perceptions challenged and your curiosity ignited, listen to so Supernatural every Friday wherever you get your podcasts.

[E]

The photo ran in the Rutland Daily Herald on February 27, 1984, along with an appeal to the public asking anyone who had seen Mark's Ford station wagon or anyone near the sandpit, anyone who may have picked Mark up or anyone who had been in that area between 5 and 9:30pm on February 23rd to come forward. In the absence of any other leads, investigators hoped someone would recognize Mark's car in the newspaper. Thankfully, one woman did. She was a high school math teacher, and when she saw the picture, she felt a jolt of recognition. Just days earlier, she and her husband had picked up two hitchhikers near that very stretch of road on Route 4A. One of them was a former student of hers, 20 year old Michael Roberts. He didn't recognize her, but she recognized him. Around the same time forensic technicians were working the car itself, six latent fingerprints lifted from the outside came back matching an 18 year old named Randall Daniels. More prints on a pair of Mark's glasses inside the vehicle also belonged to Randall. Suddenly, Mark Knapp's case had names attached to it. And the names Michael Roberts and Randall Daniels were already tethered to each other. Long before Mark's death, Michael was out on conditional release for armed robbery. Randall was expected to testify in his defense in that case. On top of that, on the very night of Mark's death, an officer spotted Randall and Michael leaving a bar together sometime after midnight. That put Michael in violation of his release condition. Police brought both of them in for questioning in mark's case. On February 29, Randall showed up wearing sneakers with soles that appeared similar to the unusual tread found both near Mark's abandoned car and at the edge of the quarry. Meanwhile, in another interrogation room, Michael waved his right to remain silent, telling officers he only wanted a lawyer if the questions became incriminating. They became incriminating almost immediately. Yet he reportedly never asked for his attorney. Michael gave a long account of where he had been between February 21 and 24, the days surrounding Mark's death. He said he went to bed early on the 22nd and then stayed homesick the next day. But when detectives compared his story to his friend, Randall's details didn't line up. When confronted with the inconsistencies, Michael agreed to take a polygraph. Despite his insistence that he was telling the truth, the results suggested deception. And then he asked investigators a question that changed the tone of the entire interview. If I tell you the truth, he said, what kind of deal could you give me? Investigators weren't making any deals, nor not yet anyway. By the end of the night, both men were under arrest. Randall Daniels faced a first degree murder charge for the death of Mark Knapp. Michael Roberts was taken into custody, too, but for a probation violation stemming from that night, he was seen out past his probation curfew with Randall, two hitchhikers, one abandoned station wagon recognized in a newspaper photo, and a math teacher who never forgot a student's face, all culminating in an arrest for Mark's murder. Finally, it felt like the case was moving towards real justice. At the time of Randall's arrest, investigators said robbery appeared to be the likely motive for his murder. Rutland County State's Attorney James P. Mangin confirmed that Mark's car had been taken, even if only temporarily, before being abandoned, along with personal property and money. According to the state, the investigation showed that Mark and Randall Daniels had gone somewhere together on the night of Mark's death. Prosecutors alleged that Mark was taken to the edge of the quarry and stabbed multiple times with a pair of scissors. The rope used to bind Mark's hands reportedly had slack at the end, leading police to believe he may have been led to the edge of the quarry while restrained. But even with an arrest and some clarity about the circumstances of that night resulting from the investigation, critical questions remained unanswered. Authorities still would not say whether Mark had been pushed or had fallen into the quarry. One theory suggested he may have been prodded in the back with the scissors, causing him to go over the edge. Randall Daniels entered a not guilty plea to the murder charge and was held on $200,000 bail. Almost as soon as Randall was arraigned, his buddy Michael Roberts appeared in court as well in connection with his unrelated cases. He admitted that he had violated the terms of his probation. For months, the case sat in that uneasy space between accusation and proof while the only suspect in custody for Mark's death awaited trial. But then, on June 20th and 21st, investigators interviewed Randall Daniels again. This time, he gave what police described as a full account of what he claimed had happened and what he said he had witnessed on the night Mark Knapp died. What he told them would become the backbone of the entire case against Michael. Randall said he and Michael Roberts were together on February 22nd when Mark, an apparent stranger to the both of them, asked if they wanted to get a drink, and they agreed. Climbing into a station wagon, the three men drove around and eventually stopped to buy beer. Randall claimed that at one point, they picked up a hitchhiker and drove the person to Castleton before returning to Rutland, and they parked near a tire store on Woodstock Avenue. Now, according to Randall, it was there that Michael allegedly began demanding money from Mark. When Mark said he didn't have any, Randall claimed he saw Michael slap him and demand his wallet including his bank card. Michael then allegedly forced Mark into the backseat and drove him to an atm. There was a withdrawal from Mark's bank account sometime before midnight on February 22nd. Randall claimed he initially tried to use the ATM himself but couldn't. So he brought Mark back to the machine and made him withdraw the money, which Randall then handed to Michael. He said he had been given a pair of scissors to use against Mark if he tried to escape, but that he gave the scissors back to Michael after the withdrawal. According to a state police affidavit, Michael then told Randall he knew a place where they could tie Mark up and leave him. Mark was driven against his will to the quarry in West Rutland with the stated intent of trapping him in a shed or outbuilding on the property. Randall admitted that he tied the rope around Mark's hands himself and removed Mark's clean glasses, saying he did so at Michael's direction. But he claimed it was Michael who ordered Mark to walk up a path towards the quarry, Hands still bound. Randall said he rounded the corner and was several steps back when he saw Michael and Mark standing face to face Before Michael allegedly raised his hand toward Mark and Mark fell off the edge. Randall said he looked over but couldn't see to the bottom of the quarry. It was too dark. The affidavit stated that afterward, Michael and Randall returned to Mark's car, drove it to New York City, got Chinese food as well as a parking ticket outside the restaurant before heading back north until the station wagon ran out of gas in Castleton, Vermont, where they abandoned it. Randall submitted to a polygraph examination, which investigators said satisfied them that he did not know Michael intended to kill Mark. With that, Randall was offered a plea deal. Randall entered a no contest plea to a kidnapping charge related to Mark's death. As part of the deal, investigators publicly identified Michael Roberts as the person they believed prodded Mark off the quarry's edge. Investigators believed Randall when he stated he was several steps behind Mark and Michael as they approached the quarry and that Randall had no idea what was about to happen. In one affidavit, state police we have been able to establish that in fact, Randy Daniels did not push or cause to be pushed or know that Mark Knapp was going to be pushed or plunged into the quarry. At West Rutland, State's Attorney Mangin told the judge that Randall could not face a lesser murder or manslaughter charge because it was Michael's separate, independent action that ultimately caused Mark's death. The plea agreement came with a recommended sentence of 5 to 11 years on the kidnapping charge. As reported by John Donlon for the Rutland Daily Herald, Randall was also required to testify against Michael at any future trials with conditional immunity. The conditions of this arrangement being if prosecutors felt Randall was being dishonest or making inconsistent statements on the stand, immunity went away. He was later sentenced to between three and 10 years for the kidnapping conviction. Days after the plea agreement was made official, Michael Roberts was charged with kidnapping, armed robbery, murder to commit robbery, and second degree murder. He entered a not guilty plea and was held without Bailey. The story about Michael's alleged involvement in Mark's death was based almost entirely on Randall's statements and recollections of that night. A defense attorney for Michael argued that no other evidence could actually link Michael to Mark's death. However, an affidavit by Vermont State Police Detective Bernard Chartier stated that two of Michael's fingerprints were also found inside Mark's car, one on the neck of an empty schnapps bottle and another on a paper bag of soy sauce containers. In May of 1985, months of uncertainty gave way to a decisive move. State's Attorney James Mongin escalated the case, reshaping the stakes for everyone involved. The charge against Michael Roberts was upgraded to first degree murder, a charge that required proof of premeditation. And thanks to Randall, again, they had hints of it. Randall had given another statement to investigators claiming that on the night of Mark's death, Michael allegedly said he was worried that Mark might be able to identify him. And that was a problem since he was already facing charges in other armed robbery. At the same time, prosecutors dropped the felony murder count, determining that the killing had not occurred in close enough time to the alleged robbery. To meet that standard, Mark and amended the assault and robbery charges to clarify the details for a jury. The judge ruled that Michael would be tried first on the murder charge alone. Trying all three charges together, the court said, would be both prejudicial and unnecessarily complicated. By the summer of 1985, the charges were set. For the first time since Mark Knapp's death, a jury would finally be asked to decide what really happened at the edge of the quarry.

[A]

This podcast is supported by the RealReal. Meet Christine. She loves shopping. And this is the sound of fashion overload. Too many fabulous things, not enough space. So Christine started selling with the RealReal.

[B]

I've always loved collecting designer pieces, Gucci bags, Prada heels. But my style keeps evolving. Selling with the RealReal game changer. I earn more and they do everything.

[A]

Seriously, just drop off your items or schedule a pickup. We handle the photos, descriptions, pricing, even shipping. You just sit back and watch your items sell fast to our 40 million.

[B]

Members and I get peace of mind knowing I earn more selling with the RealReal than anywhere else.

[A]

Exactly this. That's the sound of your closet working for you. The real real. Earn more, save time, sell fast and only for the month of January. Earn up to $550 extra when you sell with the Real Real. That's right. Up to $550 extra. Go to therealreal.com to get started. Earn up to $550 extra this month at therealreal.com Terms apply sometimes in the.

[C]

Quiet corners of our world or even in the glaring light of day, events unfold that defy the very fabric of reason.

[D]

There is no scientific, logical or readily apparent explanation for what we witness. It challenges our understanding, our beliefs, and even our sanity. Why do these things happen? What forces are at play?

[C]

I'm Yvette Gentile.

[D]

And I'm her sister Racha Pecorero.

[C]

Every week on our podcast so Supernatural, we dive deep into some of the earth's most beliefs bizarre and inexplicable occurrences. We don't just observe them, we actively try to explain the unexplainable.

[D]

So if you're ready to have your perceptions challenged and your curiosity ignited, listen to so Supernatural every Friday wherever you get your podcasts.

[E]

Michael Roberts murder trial began in June of 1985. From the outset, his strongest defense was clear. The attorney argued that his friend Randall Daniels, the first man arrested, the man who had admitted tying Mark's hands, who had placed himself at the scene, was far more likely responsible for Mark's death. At trial, new details emerged to support that theory. Mark's camera was found at Randall's house and blood matching Mark's blood type was discovered on Randall's jacket. According to the defense attorney, a witness also claimed that soon after Mark's death, Randall had been in a bar telling people, I think I may have killed someone. The state's star witness could have been the weight the prosecution needed to assuage any doubt in the jurors minds. But things didn't play out quite so simply. Randall Daniels took the stand as required by his plea agreement. He answered basic questions about where he lived, the correctional facility, his admitted involvement that night, and how he knew the defendant. Then. Almost immediately, his memory seemed to evaporate. He said he didn't remember seeing Mark on the night of February 22nd. He didn't remember Mark speaking with Michael. He Couldn't recall whether he had been drinking. To nearly every substantive question, he answered, I don't know or I can't remember. When the prosecutor confronted him with his earlier statements, Randall agreed he had made them, but said he couldn't remember whether what he said had been true. He even said he was no longer certain that Michael had pushed Mark. The testimony was so derailed that the judge abruptly called a recess. When court resumed the following day, the judge personally swore Randall back in. That was when Randall's story changed in a significant way. This time, Randall testified that Mark had already been falling when he saw Michael put his hand up in Mark's direction. Randall said, quote, he could have pushed him. He could have been falling, and Mike grabbed for him, end quote. Still, he conceded that his memory from earlier statements closer in time to the incident were probably clearer and more reliable. Randall's testimony was shaky at best, so the prosecution did what they could with the other witnesses. The state also presented testimony from a correctional officer who described a conversation he had with Michael while he was in custody. According to the officer, Michael had joked about going ice fishing together. When the officer declined, Michael allegedly said it would be easy to cut a hole in the ice, put someone in, seal it back up, and pour water over it so it would freeze, adding that you would be lucky the last guy didn't even make it through the ice. The defense conceded it was a tasteless remark, but argued it should not be held against him. Ultimately, the defense centered its argument that the state had built a compelling case, but against the wrong man. They suggested to the jury that the evidence pointed far more convincingly at Randall Daniels, who was now mysteriously struggling to remember his own story, despite a conditional immunity arrangement that required him to tell the truth. The state, they said, had not proven beyond a reasonable doubt that Michael Roberts was responsible for Mark Knapp's death. What the jury had before them was anything but clear cut. After several hours of deliberation, the jurors informed the judge they were unable to reach a verdict on first degree murder. The judge instructed them that they could consider first degree murder as well as second degree murder, manslaughter, or acquittal, and sent them back to deliberate. They returned, still deadlocked. On June 8, 1985, the judge declared a mistrial. In the days that followed, some jurors spoke with the media. One said the jury had been split seven in favor of manslaughter and five for acquittal. The defense seized on that statement, arguing it amounted to an implied acquittal on the first and second degree murder charges and sought to limit any retrial to manslaughter only. However, a judge later ruled there was no such implied acquittal. The mistrial opened a new, more unsettling phase in the pursuit of justice for Mark. Michael's second trial was scheduled for several months later. But then, In October of 1985, the case took its most stunning turn. Rutland County State's Attorney James Mongin dismissed the first degree murder and robbery charges against Michael Roberts. The decision stemmed from a critical problem. Randall Daniels had indicated he would likely invoke his Fifth Amendment right against self incrimination if called to testify at a second murder trial. Having already altered his story once on the stand, Randall feared potential perjury charges if his testimony changed again. He sought blanket immunity from any future perjury prosecution. But that was something the estate's attorney could not grant. And without Randall's testimony, which made up the vast majority of the case against Michael on the murder charges, the prosecution was left without its cornerstone. Now, the murder charge against Michael was dismissed without prejudice, meaning the state retained the right to refile them later. But nevertheless, the biggest charges were dismissed for the time being, not because the questions had been answered, but because too many of them no longer could be. Like his friend Randall, Michael would only face a kidnapping charge for a night that ended someone's Life. Michael Roberts second trial was scheduled to begin on December 9, 1985, but the trial faced an 11th hour delay. The state's attorney asked the court to allow jurors to consider an alternate theory of liability that Michael had aided in the commission of a felony, even if he had not personally carried it out. Prosecutors argued this was necessary to avoid an acquittal on a technicality. Should jurors believe Michael was guilty of something but not convinced he committed the kidnapping as charged. The defense objected to this alternate charge, saying they needed time to rework their strategy around the new theory. And so the delay was granted. Meanwhile, Randall Daniels once again indicated he might invoke his Fifth Amendment right if called to testify in the kidnapping trial. The state's attorney countered that by accepting the plea deal, Randall had waived that right. Remember, the agreement also allowed prosecutors to revoke his conditional immunity and file murder charges if they'd determined he was giving false, misleading, or incomplete testimony. Ultimately, Randall Mongen agreed. Randall could invoke his Fifth Amendment right on a question by question basis. When the trial finally opened In January of 1986, the issue became moot. Randall flat out refused to testify at all and was held in contempt of court. Instead of live testimony, the jury heard Randall's previous statements and depositions from the first trial. The prosecutor, defense attorney, and a court clerk took turns reading from the transcript, and jurors were instructed to listen as though Randall were physically on the stand. By Michael's second trial, the narrative of the case had shifted yet again. In this version of events, Mark was said to have approached Michael and Randall asking for directions, and then allowed the two men, who admitted they had no cars or driver's licenses and relied on walking and hitchhiking into his station wagon. The story of how Mark lost his money also changed. In one previous deposition read to the jury, Randall said he and Michael told Mark a fabricated story about having wives and children, but no money. According to that account, Mark said he had no cash in his wallet, but offered to drive them to an ATM down the road. Michael's girlfriend then testified in his defense, and her testimony stood in sharp contrast to Randall's earlier statement. She told jurors that Michael told her that it was Randall who orchestrated the entire evening, and that Michael believed Randall only meant to scare Mark by taking him to the quarry with his hands tied. But Mark fell in. Despite the new wild cards and stories from witnesses and evolving narratives of that night in February 1984, this time around, the presentation of evidence proved powerful enough for the jury to make a final decision. On January 10, 1986, the jury found Michael Roberts guilty of kidnapping. Prosecutors said they were still considering future charges of murder, assault and robbery. Six weeks later, Michael filed a motion for a new trial, Arguing that the defense had been denied the opportunity to newly cross examine Randall on the kidnapping charge. Because the jury had only heard transcripts from the earlier murder trial, the judge denied the request and ordered sentencing to proceed. Michael Roberts was sentenced to 10 to 25 years in prison for kidnapping Mark Knapp, with eligibility for release after five to six years. He had already served 27 months of that while awaiting trial. At sentencing, the prosecutor called him, quote, unquote, one of the 10 most dangerous men in the state of Vermont, end quote, Citing his criminal history. Michael later entered a no contest plea to an unrelated armed robbery charge that predated Mark's death and received an additional four to six year sentence to be served concurrently. At the end of it all, Michael Roberts served less than eight years of of his 10 to 15 year sentence for kidnapping. Upon his release, he went right back to building his criminal record. From what I've seen in public records, he was arrested in 1993 and charged with conspiracy to distribute cocaine. As for Randall Daniels, the contempt charge against him for refusing to testify was ultimately dismissed. But then, In April of 1986, soon after his request for parole was denied, Randall escaped from his minimum security cell at the Rutland Community Correctional center along with two other inmates. Monica Allen reports for the Rutland Daily Herald that Randall remained at large until May 3, when he was picked up hitchhiking. He later entered a no contest plea to the escape charge, only to escape again from work detail in 1987. By the time the courtrooms emptied and the sentences were handed down, the case of Mark Knapp had become something much smaller than it should have been. A murder charge dismissed, a mistrial, A kidnapping conviction that stood in place of a life taken. Whether you believe that either of the men intended to kill Mark that night, outrage over the outcome is not only understandable, I think it's appropriate. Mark Knapp is dead. He did not die in a way anyone could accept as inevitable. He died after being bound, driven against his will, and led to the edge of a quarry, allegedly prodded with scissors over a 125 foot drop. Both men who were with him that night were convicted of kidnapping him. But no one has ever been held accountable for his death. Whatever the exact moment that sent him over the edge, Mark endured a terrifying ordeal before he fell. The system struggled to hold anyone fully accountable for this devastating loss of life. The investigation lurched from theory to theory. The story changed. Witnesses recanted or forgot. A plea deal meant to strengthen the case weakened it instead. Evidence that might have clarified the truth was never heard by a jury. A star witness refused to testify. A murder trial collapsed into a mistrial. And in the end, the legal process delivered something that felt like a conclusion, but only on paper. Michael Roberts served less than eight years for kidnapping a man who never came home. Randall faced even less time than that. Do those sentences measure up to the sound of machinery echoing through a frozen quarry as rescuers brought Mark's body back to the surface? Does that time served fairly account for the agonizing hours that his family waited for answers? Or the fear that settled over their community when no one knew who, if anyone, would be held responsible? Mark was the son of a fire chief, a volunteer firefighter himself, a debate team standout who went on to study speech pathology and business? Who came back to judge high school tournaments? Who mentored a struggling kid simply because someone needed to. He fixed up a house because he believed in building something with his own hands. He made small phone calls home to his parents so they wouldn't worry. And then he didn't come home. No verdict can restore what was lost that night at the quarry's edge. But telling Mark's story without allowing it to be reduced to a footnote in someone else's criminal history is one way of refusing to let the outcome be the final word. Thank you for listening to Dark Down East. You can find all source material for this [e-mail] Be sure to follow the show on Instagram arkdowneast. This platform is for the families and friends who have lost their loved ones and for those who are still searching for answers. I'm not about to let those names or their stories get lost with time. I'm Kylie Lowe and this is Dark Down East. Dark down east is a production of Kylie Media and Audio. Chuck. I think Chuck would approve. Hi, I'm Ashley Flowers. And I'm Britt. And if you're on the edge of.

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