DarkHorse Podcast: "Hey Siri, why are American kids so sick?" — Aaron Siri on DarkHorse

Podcast: DarkHorse Podcast
Hosts: Bret Weinstein and Heather Heying
Guest: Aaron Siri, civil rights attorney and managing partner at Siri Glimstad
Date: December 24, 2025
Episode Theme:
A deep, critical exploration of the historical and legal evolution of the American childhood vaccine schedule, its scientific underpinnings, concerns over safety/testing, the incentives shaping the industry, and the broader question: why are American children experiencing so much chronic illness?

Main Theme and Purpose

This episode investigates the unspoken realities underlying vaccines and the CDC’s vaccine schedule for children in America. Host Bret Weinstein and guest Aaron Siri use their evolutionary and legal expertise to question the safety testing of vaccines, highlight flaws in the regulatory systems, address the incentives created by liability immunity, and reflect on the consequences for the health of American children. The episode scrutinizes foundational vaccine narratives (polio, Spanish flu) and probes the broader public health impacts and ethical considerations.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Aaron Siri’s Background and Approach

• [00:40] Aaron Siri: Civil rights lawyer specializing in vaccine-related law, known for recent U.S. Senate testimony.
• New book, Vaccines. Amen, explores how acceptance of vaccines has become akin to religious faith, not science-based inquiry.

2. Personal Journeys of Vaccine Reevaluation

• [01:28] Bret Weinstein shares how his faith in vaccines was shaken by the COVID-19 vaccine rollout and the “safe and effective” narrative.
  • Quote:

    “If they had said, we don't know of any harms, I might have accepted it. But because I knew they were lying right away, I started to dig further into what it meant.” (03:09; A/Bret)

3. Evolution of the Childhood Vaccine Schedule

• [05:08] Historical Schedule (1970s–80s): Only three main vaccines: DTP, MMR, OPV. Uptake was 50–60%—only a few total shots by age 1.
• [13:41] Modern Schedule:
  • As of 2025: 25 injections by the first birthday, not including COVID vaccines (up from 3 in the 1980s).
  • Additions include HepB, Hib, pneumococcal, inactivated polio (IPV), influenza, among others.
  • Most shots clustered in the first six months of life.
• [16:37] Raises concern: “A child is built by natural selection to live in a world of pathogenic infections. It is not built for all this technological intervention.” (A/Bret)

4. Testing, Safety, and Placebos

• [22:49] Aaron Siri’s Central Revelation:
  • No currently licensed routine injected childhood vaccine was ever licensed based on a true placebo-controlled trial.
  • Clinical trials often use earlier vaccines or experimental products as controls, creating a cascade where the original “baseline” was never established.
  • Quote:

    “There is not a single routine injected childhood vaccine on the schedule today that was ever licensed based on a placebo controlled trial.” (22:49; B/Aaron)

• [24:07] Bret’s Reaction:
  • Notes the logical flaw: Bootstrapping safety by testing against earlier presumed-safe—but never proven-safe—shots.
  • Quote:

    “You have a loophole built into our system of safety testing... You only need to commit fraud once.” (25:19; A/Bret)

5. Liability, Market Forces, and Economic Incentives

• [32:58+] The 1986 National Childhood Vaccine Injury Act gave manufacturers permanent immunity from liability for vaccine injuries.
  • Vaccine makers now face no market force incentives to ensure safety, unlike with other products.
  • Mandates guarantee a market; the federal government promotes and buys the product; and injury lawsuits are effectively impossible.
  • Quote:

    "It is the only product in America that has the immunity I just described on a permanent basis. The only one." (35:39; B/Aaron)

6. Scientific Fraud and Regulatory Capture

• [44:32] Discussion on how regulators (FDA, CDC) are influenced or captured by industry.
• [45:05+] Marketing is indirect: Pharma funds journals, medical education, and “learned intermediaries”—there’s no open debate or transparency.

7. Case Studies on Specific Vaccines and Diseases

a. Polio

• [55:38+] The “polio narrative” is heavily mythologized.
• Polio outbreaks only began after certain environmental shifts (e.g., metal/arsenic-rich pesticides), not simply due to the virus itself.
• Changing diagnostic criteria post-vaccine artificially reduced case numbers.
• Quote:

  “The change in diagnostic criteria will make it look like this vaccine is causing a radical reduction...” (75:08; A/Bret)

b. Spanish Flu

• [105:03+] Deaths attributed to the 1918 Spanish Flu pandemic were heavily influenced by secondary factors—bacterial pneumonia and lethal aspirin dosing, not just the virus.
• Parallels drawn to COVID: Medical interventions (ventilators/remdesivir) harmed more than helped, amplifying perceptions of crisis.

c. Measles

• [109:41+] Mortality dropped >98% before vaccines, likely due to improvements in sanitation and public health, not immunization alone.
• Studies show reduced rates of cardiovascular disease and some cancers in those who had childhood illnesses like measles, suggesting possible long-term benefits lost through eradication.

8. Unintended Consequences and Chronic Childhood Disease

• [120:16+] Bret and Aaron discuss how chronic disease, especially immune-mediated (asthma, allergy, ADHD, etc.), has surged since the 1980s in parallel with the expanding vaccine schedule.
• Observational data indicate unvaccinated children experience far fewer chronic health issues.
  • Amish and other unvaccinated communities display dramatically better health statistics.
  • Quote:

    “The chronic diseases that have an etiology from immune system dysregulation... have exploded since the early 80s…” (120:16; B/Aaron)

9. Definition of Vaccines, Legal Loopholes, and Current Policy

• [123:21] Aaron’s rhetorical definition: What unites vaccines isn't their technology or efficacy, but their government-granted immunity from liability.
• [126:43+] Loophole: If a vaccine is recommended for the childhood schedule, it retains liability immunity—even when given to adults (e.g., HepB).
• [128:53+] Medical providers themselves have immunity for vaccine injuries, fundamentally warping the doctor-patient relationship.

10. Autism, Data Transparency, and “Religious” Mantras

• [132:02+] According to Aaron, the claim “vaccines do not cause autism” is not scientifically established—it is, at best, an article of faith.
  • Multiple legal requests failed to yield any CDC evidence for safety re: autism and the majority of routine childhood vaccines.
  • Quote:

    “The claim that vaccines do not cause autism is just a religious mantra. It's not a scientific statement.” (132:02; B/Aaron)

11. Scientific Fraud and Legal Obstacles

• [158:05+] Scientific versus legal fraud: Most of the misleading vaccine science is "in the open"—permitted by legal definitions, despite basic scientific absurdity.
• Proof of legal fraud is hard without inside information; fraud is thus rare in court, even when the science appears deceptive.

12. Paths for Reform and the Role of Informed Consent

• [173:05+] Systemic change will be difficult: regulatory agencies and Congress are heavily influenced by industry, and there are no “moneyed interests” advocating for truth or safety.
• The “last safeguard” is the parental/citizen right to refuse—a matter of civil rights and bodily autonomy, rooted in the Nuremberg Code.
  • Quote:

    “The point is that I don't know how to fix the swamp. But people should be able to say no at the end of the, at the end of the line.” (175:10; B/Aaron)

• Discussion of global best practices (e.g., Denmark)—fewer required vaccines, minimal HepB shots without higher disease rates.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

| Timestamp | Speaker | Quote | |-----------|---------|-------| | 03:09 | Bret | “If they had said, we don't know of any harms, I might have accepted it. But because I knew they were lying right away, I started to dig further…” | | 22:49 | Aaron | “There is not a single routine injected childhood vaccine on the schedule today that was ever licensed based on a placebo controlled trial.” | | 25:19 | Bret | “You only need to commit fraud once. … One false indication that it is safe, and you use that as a control. … It will hide the harms of later vaccines.” | | 35:39 | Aaron | "It is the only product in America that has the immunity I just described on a permanent basis. The only one." | | 132:02 | Aaron | “The claim that vaccines do not cause autism is just a religious mantra. It's not a scientific statement, ... not an evidence-based statement.” | | 151:18 | Bret | "The zeal is because you have to get rid of that control group otherwise the scam will be revealed. … The Amish are the loophole." |

Timestamps for Key Segments

• Vaccine schedule evolution: [05:08–16:37]
• Placebo & safety testing gaps: [22:49–32:00]
• Liability Act (1986) & market incentives: [32:58–38:00]
• Regulatory capture/marketing: [44:32–48:00]
• Polio myth deconstruction: [55:38–77:18]
• Spanish Flu and self-inflicted medical harm: [105:03–109:41]
• Rise in chronic disease / unvaccinated health comparisons: [120:16–124:25]
• Autism & vaccine safety data suppression: [132:02–138:53]
• Legal fraud vs. scientific fraud: [158:05–167:21]
• Informed consent and civil rights: [173:05–175:58]
• Denmark and international comparison: [177:51–178:53]

Conclusion

Core Takeaways:

• The expansion of the vaccine schedule is unparalleled and largely unexamined in its total health consequences.
• Safety testing for vaccines systematically avoids true placebo-controlled trials or sufficiently long safety review periods.
• The liability shield granted by the 1986 Act has undercut the market pressures that would normally ensure safety, creating moral hazard.
• Regulatory systems and the information ecosystem are deeply aligned with manufacturers, blocking meaningful scientific inquiry.
• Long-term population health — as reflected in surging chronic illness rates — is not being measured against vaccine exposures, leaving parents and professionals “flying blind.”
• The last line of defense is the right to refuse — but even this is under threat due to social mandates and sanctions.

Final Message:
Parents and citizens should approach vaccines as products — with skepticism, critical analysis, and careful study — not as sacred interventions. True freedom and health demand the restoration of market forces and genuine informed consent, with liability for harms and open scientific debate.

Further Resources

• Aaron Siri’s Website: AaronSiriOfficial.com
• ICAN: Informed Consent Action Network
• Book: Vaccines. Amen by Aaron Siri