A star defense witness takes the stand. The Zizians' leader in court. And a new scam called pig butchering.

Summary

Dateline NBC
Episode Title: A Star Defense Witness Takes the Stand. The Zizians' Leader in Court. And a New Scam Called Pig Butchering
Release Date: March 20, 2025
Host: Andrea Canning
Produced by: NBC News

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1. Monica Sementilli Trial: The Star Defense Witness Robert Baker Takes the Stand

Overview:
In a high-profile Los Angeles courtroom, Monica Sementilli faces charges of conspiring to murder her hairstylist husband, Fabio, in 2023. The trial has garnered significant attention, especially with the defense introducing Robert Baker, a pivotal witness who previously pleaded no contest to the murder and is serving a life sentence without parole.

Key Testimony Highlights:

• Robert Baker’s Background:
  Robert Baker, a former military staff sergeant with a diverse resume that includes managing X-rated movie performers, took the stand dressed in a collared shirt and blazer, still in handcuffs (04:13). His defense highlighted his sporadic relationship with Monica, asserting that her involvement in the murder was nonexistent.

• Relationship Dynamics:
  Baker detailed his intermittent interactions with Monica, stating, “It could be once a week, once every two weeks, or three times a week. It all depends on who's doing what between the both of us” (06:12). This was intended to undermine the prosecution's claim of a collaborative murder plot.

• Motive and Circumstances of the Crime:
  Baker testified that his diminishing interactions with Monica led to a breakdown, culminating in the murder of Fabio. He explained, “I murdered him because I wanted her” (07:48), directly attributing his motive to personal desires rather than a shared conspiracy.

• Prosecution’s Cross-Examination:
  The prosecution aggressively questioned Baker's credibility, revealing inconsistencies in his testimony. When Baker noted, “I have nothing to lose here,” the prosecution seized the opportunity to cast doubt on his honesty (09:05).

Conclusion:
The defense’s presentation of Baker aimed to shift the narrative away from Monica’s involvement, while the prosecution meticulously discredited his statements. As the trial progresses, the jury remains focused on the conflicting testimonies and the intricate details of the case.

---

2. The Zizians: Radical Vegan Group Faces Legal Scrutiny

Overview:
A group known as the Zizians, characterized by their radical vegan beliefs and perceived cult-like behavior, has been linked to multiple violent deaths across several states. Their elusive leader, Jack Lasota, also known as Ziz, has recently been apprehended in Maryland along with key members Michelle Zyko and Daniel Blank.

Key Developments:

• Arrests and Charges:
  On a reported call, police discovered the Zizians occupying a property in Frostburg, Maryland, leading to the arrest of three members (14:22). They now face charges of trespassing and possession of handguns. Michelle Zyko and Daniel Blank are also under investigation for the double homicide of Michelle's parents in Pennsylvania, where evidence linked their firearms to the crime (15:00).

• Group’s Beliefs and Activities:
  The Zizians emerged from concerns about artificial intelligence (AI) posing a future threat to humanity. Their extreme measures, including violent actions, are justified by their belief that they are preventing a dystopian future (16:52).

• Lifestyle and Movements:
  Financial constraints led the group to adopt a nomadic lifestyle, initially attempting to live on a boat in the San Francisco Bay before shifting to box trucks after their tugboat sank (17:54).

• Courtroom Behavior and Evidence Tampering:
  During their Maryland hearing, Ziz exhibited uncooperative behavior, including refusal to identify herself and neglecting to provide necessary documentation (18:42). Additionally, Ziz has a history of evading law enforcement, including a suspected faked death in Alaska in August 2022 (19:50).

Future Proceedings:
Next week, Jack LaSota (Ziz) will stand trial in Maryland. The court will also revisit the investigation into the double homicide, potentially linking more members to the crimes. The Zizians' legal battles are expected to intensify as authorities seek to unravel the full extent of their activities.

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3. Pig Butchering: The Emergence of a Devastating New Scam

Overview:
"Pig butchering" is a burgeoning financial scam that has deceived tens of thousands of Americans. Named after the Chinese term for fattening a hog before slaughter, this scam involves long-term cons where victims are manipulated into investing substantial sums, often leading to complete financial ruin.

Scam Mechanics:

• Method of Operation:
  Scammers initiate contact through social media, establishing a relationship that may or may not involve romance. Over time, they introduce lucrative cryptocurrency investment opportunities, exploiting victims' lack of understanding in the financial domain (29:46).

• Psychological Manipulation:
  The prolonged nature of the scam creates a false sense of profitability, making victims believe they are earning money. Eventually, access to funds is restricted, and victims discover they've lost their life savings (30:39).

• Organizational Structure:
  These scams are orchestrated by large criminal organizations, primarily based in Southeast Asia, often involving hundreds or thousands of operatives (30:56).

Law Enforcement Response:

• FBI’s Operation Level Up:
  The FBI has launched "Operation Level Up" to combat these sophisticated scams. By tracing transparent cryptocurrency transactions, the FBI has begun recovering funds and intervening in ongoing scams (31:07). Victims have been warned in time to prevent further financial losses, although the scale of the operation makes it challenging to protect all potential victims (31:56).

Prevention Tips:

• Vigilance and Skepticism:
  Individuals are advised to be wary of unsolicited investment opportunities, especially those encountered on social media. Conducting thorough due diligence and avoiding investments based on unfamiliar solicitations are crucial steps in prevention (31:58).

• Support and Reporting:
  Victims are encouraged to report scams to the FBI immediately to increase the chances of fund recovery and to aid in tracking down perpetrators (33:00).

Notable Quotes:

• Ken Delaney, NBC News Justice and Intelligence Correspondent:
  “This is a long con where a victim is encouraged to invest money and believes that they are actually making money. The scammers are fattening up the hog for slaughter, trying to get the people to fork over as much of their life savings as they can” (29:18).

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4. Dateline Roundup

a. Karen Reed Case Update

Overview:
Karen Reed, accused of murdering her police officer boyfriend, John O'Keefe, in 2022, is preparing for her second trial after the first ended with a hung jury.

Key Developments:

• Legal Proceedings:
  A federal judge has ruled that Reed will be tried on the same three charges despite her defense team's appeals to drop certain charges based on alleged juror bias (24:10). Additionally, the judge dismissed Reed’s request to postpone the trial date, keeping it on schedule (25:21).

• Defense Strategy and Challenges:
  The defense faced criticism for not fully disclosing their collaboration with expert witnesses. The judge issued a stern warning regarding their misrepresentations but allowed the defense team and expert testimonies to remain intact (24:25).

Notable Quotes:

• Judge Kanoni:
  “I’m not going to tolerate false statements, any stretching of the truth, no misleading distortions. There’s no place for that in the courtroom” (24:34).

---

b. Missing College Student in the Dominican Republic

Overview:
Sudiksha Kunanki, a 20-year-old University of Pittsburgh student, has been missing since March 6th after disappearing from a Punta Cana beach.

Key Updates:

• Investigation Findings:
  Authorities found only her clothing items on a beach chair. Sudiksha was last seen with Joshua Riebe, a 22-year-old college senior from Iowa, who has since been released and returned to the United States (25:47).

• Family’s Decision:
  Sudiksha’s family has requested that the police declare her dead, despite the absence of a body, to begin their mourning process (26:28).

Notable Quote:

• Familial Statement:
  “We are coming to terms with the fact that our daughter has drowned. This is incredibly difficult for us to process” (26:31).

---

c. Lori Valo Daybell’s Court Hearing

Overview:
Convicted killer Lori Valo Daybell appeared in court for a hearing ahead of her March 31 trial, where she faces charges of conspiring to murder her fourth husband, Charles Vallow.

Key Developments:

• Trial Preparations:
  Daybell, who is representing herself, has been restricted by the judge to a question-and-answer format if she chooses to testify (27:09). This ensures her defense remains structured and prevents unsolicited narratives.

• Expert Witness Obstruction:
  The prosecution has successfully blocked one of Daybell’s expert witnesses, citing insufficient time for the expert to review 22 terabytes of digital evidence before the trial. Daybell expressed a desire to proceed without delaying the trial (27:31).

Additional Information:
Listeners interested in deeper insights into Lori Valo Daybell’s case can explore the podcast "Mommy Doomsday" or access exclusive jailhouse interviews featured on "Talking Dateline."

---

Conclusion and Upcoming Features

Pig Butchering Scam Awareness:
Ken Delaney emphasized the importance of recognizing and reporting "pig butchering" scams to prevent financial loss and assist law enforcement in apprehending perpetrators.

Upcoming Episode:
This Friday, Dateline NBC will premiere “Poison Twist,” a case investigation involving the fatal poisoning of a beloved doctor and the subsequent legal twists that jeopardize the initial suspect’s culpability.

Call to Action:
Listeners are encouraged to engage with the podcast by submitting true crime questions and subscribing to Dateline Premium for an ad-free experience and exclusive content.

Final Note:
The episode was produced by a dedicated team, ensuring comprehensive coverage and insightful analysis of each gripping story.

---

Notable Quotes with Timestamps:

• Robert Baker:
  “Did she have anything to do with the planning or the execution of the plan to kill Fabio? Simon Tilli?” (03:13)
  “But are you telling the truth about what happened?” (09:14)

• Michelle Zyko:
  “The KLTV order for me to have a vegan diet. It’s more important than whatever this hearing is.” (18:48)
  “You are not alone. Tens of thousands of people are being scammed in this way” (32:30)

• Ken Delaney:
  “The FBI has gotten very good at tracing crypto because cryptocurrency transactions are in the open, so the FBI can see this” (31:07)
  “This is a long con where a victim is encouraged to invest money and believes that they are actually making money” (29:18)

---

This summary encapsulates the critical discussions, testimonies, and investigative insights presented in the March 20, 2025, episode of Dateline NBC, offering listeners a comprehensive overview of the major true-crime stories covered.

Transcript

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[Andrea Canning]

Hey, Paul.

[Ken Delaney]

Good morning.

[Andrea Canning]

You're listening in to dateline's morning meeting. How are things on the West Coast?

[Chetna Joshi]

Early.

[Andrea Canning]

Our editorial team is catching up on breaking crime news around the country. We know that we have this person of interest, but we don't know what the connection is at all. Yeah, he'll almost certainly be in Alabama in custody. They have 72 hours to arrest him. He says, I did it. I murdered him.

[Chetna Joshi]

I. I wanted her.

[Andrea Canning]

Welcome to DATELINE True Crime weekly. I'm Andrea Canning. It's March 20, and here's what's on our docket. The Zizians have surfaced again. According to law enforcement, the group of radical vegans is connected to violent deaths in multiple states. Their leader was in court last month. I haven't done anything wrong. I shouldn't be here. In DATELINE Roundup this week, we'll tell you all about an important ruling in the Karen Reed case. Lori Valo Debel has some decisions to make about her upcoming trial. And we've got a major development from the Dominican Republic on a missing college student.

[Sue Simpson]

They've asked the police to declare her dead even though no body has been found.

[Andrea Canning]

Plus, tens of thousands of Americans have fallen for a new scam known as pig butchering. Our NBC News justice and intelligence correspondent Ken Delaney has the details.

[Ken Delaney]

It goes on so long that often people think they're making money. But then eventually they find that they don't have access to their funds anymore and they've lost everything.

[Andrea Canning]

But before all that, we're heading back to a Los Angeles courtroom and the trial of the woman accused of conspiring to murder her hairstylist husband. The defense's star witness has finally taken the stand. We've Heard the name Robert Baker countless times over the course of the Monica Sementilli trial. For six weeks, the prosecution built a case that put him squarely at the center of the murder. They told the jury Baker was Monica's lover and the person she conspired with to kill her husband, Fabio in 2023. He pleaded no contest to the murder and is serving a sentence of life without parole. But Baker has consistently denied that Monica had anything to do with the crime. Last week, the defense finally called him to the stand.

[Robert Baker]

Did she have anything to do with the planning or the execution of the plan to kill Fabio? Simon Tilli?

[Monica Sementilli]

No.

[Robert Baker]

You're sure?

[Monica Sementilli]

I'm positive.

[Andrea Canning]

Over the course of several days, Robert Baker told the jury his side of the story, often offering explicit details and frequently clashing with the prosecution. DATELINE producer Chetna Joshi is here to tell us about what Baker had to say and where the rest of the trial goes from here. Chetna, thanks so much for coming back on.

[Chetna Joshi]

Good to be with you.

[Andrea Canning]

So we've heard a lot about Robert Baker in this case so far, and now we've finally seen the man himself.

[Chetna Joshi]

Yeah. So we have been sort of building to this moment, and it was fascinating to finally see Robert Baker in person. He was wearing a collared shirt and a blazer, and if it weren't for the handcuffs on his wrists, he would look like any other normal witness.

[Andrea Canning]

So keep the cuffs on during testimony.

[Chetna Joshi]

Yes, he had the cuffs on his hand. And, you know, even just the very first question from the court clerk when he had to raise his right hand to be sworn in, you can see his cuffs.

[Andrea Canning]

Okay, so how did the defense start with him? I know that they wanted to introduce his background.

[Chetna Joshi]

Right. He tells us that he served in the military for over a decade and said that his highest rank was a staff sergeant. And it was sort of an interesting moment when the defense attorney asked if he considered himself a good soldier, Robert Baker replied that he considered himself to be one of the best.

[Andrea Canning]

Yeah. And is it true Robert Baker was at one point a. A porn star.

[Chetna Joshi]

He starred in X rated movies and also managed the careers of other performers. It's a really diverse, diverse resume.

[Andrea Canning]

That's quite the background. And so then they also, this is key here. He started working at LA Fitness, which is, of course where he met Monica, correct?

[Chetna Joshi]

Yes. And that's when the defense really launches into the heart of this case, which is his time at LA Fitness. He says that he started there in 2015 and then he met Monica.

[Monica Sementilli]

I was running a racquetball league.

[Robert Baker]

Now, is this something you had done before?

[Monica Sementilli]

No, never.

[Robert Baker]

How'd you get into league? Racquetball league.

[Monica Sementilli]

I'm a smart guy.

[Robert Baker]

Okay. Well, did it? I wouldn't comment on that.

[Andrea Canning]

Within a couple of weeks, these two are hooking up. Monica and Robert, there was some discussion about how they would sneak around.

[Chetna Joshi]

Yeah. He was asked when their relationship started and how often he would see Monica. Robert Baker responded that it was very sporadic.

[Monica Sementilli]

So it could be once a week, once every two weeks, or three times a week. It all depends on who's doing what between the both of us.

[Robert Baker]

And how did you determine when you would see her?

[Monica Sementilli]

She called the shots on that based on her schedule.

[Chetna Joshi]

Naturally, in the defense's eyes, of course, she would be calling the shots on that. She's the one with a husband, with a family. But that phrase that Robert Baker used in his testimony, that she called the shots, when I heard that, I thought, oh, my gosh, the prosecutors must be, like, hoping that the jury keys into that phrase. If she called the shots about when she's meeting with him, she also called the shots on this entire murder operation is what the prosecution would want the jury to see.

[Andrea Canning]

The prosecution alleges that Robert Baker and Monica Simontelli planned this so they could be together. They could have Fabio's money. Since Robert Baker is saying that that is not true, that she had nothing to do with this, what is he saying was his motive for killing Fabio?

[Chetna Joshi]

According to Robert Baker's testimony, it got to a point where he said at the end of 2016, he said he was not seeing her as much as he wanted to. And as he described it, it sort of did a number on him, and he couldn't handle it.

[Robert Baker]

So did she talk to you about ever tell you that she would divorce her husband for you?

[Monica Sementilli]

We touched on it lightly, but I could tell that she wasn't gonna do that. That wasn't gonna happen.

[Robert Baker]

And eventually, did that become one of the reasons why you decided to murder him?

[Monica Sementilli]

I murdered him because I wanted her.

[Andrea Canning]

One of the most riveting parts of Baker's testimony is describing the killing on the stand.

[Chetna Joshi]

Yes. You know, it's rare. Again, this has happened now twice in this trial. We. You know, it's rare to hear an admitted killer talk about how a murder has gone down. And this time, we've heard it through Christopher Austin, the other man that was with Robert Baker at the time of the murder. Now we heard it through Robert Baker.

[Monica Sementilli]

And I'm struggling with him, and I'm trying To get away from him. He's a pretty big guy.

[Robert Baker]

Then what?

[Monica Sementilli]

And I just kind of. I said to myself, I need to get him off me. I need to cut him. I took one stab to get him to let go of me. He let go and I just kind of blacked out and just tried to get him off me and just kept cutting until he stopped, until he got off me.

[Andrea Canning]

The defense wanted to get it out there, almost a preemptive strike, that Robert Baker has lied about the case in the past.

[Chetna Joshi]

Yeah. When someone who has done something like this is now telling the jury what they've done, how do you believe him? And what Robert Baker was telling the jury is, look, I have nothing to lose here.

[Robert Baker]

Now, you are a convicted murderer, correct?

[Monica Sementilli]

Yes.

[Robert Baker]

And you committed a heinous crime.

[Monica Sementilli]

Yeah, I did.

[Robert Baker]

But are you telling the truth about what happened?

[Monica Sementilli]

It's nothing to lose.

[Chetna Joshi]

That was really something that the defense attorney wanted the jury to hone in on, is that unlike Christopher Austin, who had something to gain because of his testimony, Robert Baker doesn't.

[Andrea Canning]

And the prosecution really pounced on that. You know, of course, no surprise on the lies, the inconsistencies of Robert Baker's story.

[Chetna Joshi]

Yes. As soon as the prosecutor got up, who was cross examining him, I mean, she pounced on him. And over several days has been chipping away at almost everything that he said on direct exam, she had a response for she wanted to, no matter how seemingly small a fact might be, she wanted to show the jury that this is not a witness that should be trusted.

[Andrea Canning]

So how many times had you entered the Cementilli home through the back door?

[Monica Sementilli]

Two, three? I don't know no exact number. Because I don't want to be called a liar again. So I can't give you an exact number. There's no way I can't give you an exact number.

[Andrea Canning]

Give us an estimate.

[Monica Sementilli]

I don't want to.

[Andrea Canning]

I mean, you said that it was the lie.

[Monica Sementilli]

Calling me lying days is coming. Coming to an end, so no, no.

[Andrea Canning]

Trust me, it isn't. The defense is expected to wrap up here pretty soon, Chetna. Then we'll hear the closing arguments. Such a complicated case and trial. Thank you, Chetna, for breaking it down for us. We appreciate it.

[Chetna Joshi]

Oh, really good being with you, Andrea.

[Andrea Canning]

Up next, according to law enforcement, a group of radical vegans is connected to violent deaths in multiple states. Next week, three of them will go on trial in Maryland. Long John Silver's is your trusty port of call for time honored flavors like the classic battered fish. Golden hush puppies and the irresistible aroma of the sea. Now charting a new course with $6 shrimp baskets. This Lent season, from February 24 to April 27, they're launching four Shrimp Delights Coconut Shrimp, Original Battered Shrimp, Grilled Shrimp and Popcorn Shrimp. For those with a hearty appetite, $10 shrimp sea shares offer even more bounty from the ocean deep. Perfect for sharing with your crew, plus unlock even more adventure. Between March 5 and April 17, as a secret Society Rewards member, earn your pirate badge with every online order and set your sights on the captain's table. You deserve a taste of true adventure. Visit ljsilvers.com or download the app to savor $6 shrimp baskets and $10 shrimp sea shares. Set sail with Long John Silvers this Lent Pricing and participation may vary.

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[Andrea Canning]

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[Ken Delaney]

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[Andrea Canning]

About a month ago, a man in western Maryland called the police and said three people dressed in black were camping out on his property in box trucks. When officers arrived, they discovered that the alleged trespassers were wanted for questioning in three other states. They'd stumbled across the Zizians. And not just that. They'd found the Zizians elusive leader Jack Lasota, who identifies as a woman, Michelle Zyko and Daniel Blank. They face trespassing and handgun charges here in Maryland. All three were arrested Sunday in Frostburg. People who've interacted with them say they act like a cult consisting of mostly transgender tech workers who subscribe to what's called radical veganism. And law enforcement says the Zizians are linked to sick six violent deaths around the country. Four Zizians are awaiting trial in California and Vermont, but until that Day in Maryland. Their leader had not been found. Next week, Jack LaSota, or Ziz, as she calls herself, will stand trial on trespassing and gun charges. My next guest, NBC News investigative reporter Rich Shapiro, says that may be just the start of her legal troubles. Hi, Rich. Thanks for coming on the podcast.

[Michelle Zyko]

My pleasure.

[Andrea Canning]

Okay, so just remind us about the deaths the Zizians are suspected of being wrapped up in. When you and I first spoke, Rich, two of the group's members had allegedly been involved in a shootout with border police in Vermont that led to the deaths of one of the officers and one of the Zizians. Three other Zizians were awaiting trial in California for an assault involving a samurai sword and a murder. Was the incident in Maryland also violent?

[Michelle Zyko]

It wasn't violent, but this wasn't your typical police encounter. First off, according to the probable cause statement, these people were all dressed in black, and they were well armed. In one of the trucks, police found a rifle and a handgun. Two of the Zizians were wearing ammo belts, and one of them had another gun in her waistband. And all three resisted arrest by refusing to tell the police their names and not giving them their IDs.

[Andrea Canning]

As we mentioned, Zyz was in one of those box trucks. Who else was with her?

[Michelle Zyko]

There were two other people. There was a person named Michelle Zadjko and a man named Daniel Blank. Now, Michelle's parents were murdered in their home about two years ago. And according to the probable call statement in the Maryland arrest, Daniel is under investigation for their homicide.

[Andrea Canning]

And that double homicide happened in Pennsylvania. Why do investigators want to talk to Daniel?

[Michelle Zyko]

According to the Pennsylvania State Troopers, Michelle owned a gun and ammunition of the same type that was used in the murders. And they actually tracked her down to a hotel looking for that gun. They served her with a search warrant for that gun, but she didn't have it. And they instead found it in a different room in the hotel. And that room was occupied by Daniel Blank and Zyz Lasota. They didn't charge anyone with the homicide, although Zyz was so uncooperative that she was arrested on charges of obstructing the investigation. She essentially played dead. One of the troopers said in court she wouldn't tell the troopers her name or even get up off the ground. So they had to physically carry her out of the room, and she even kept her eyes closed in the mugshot. Ziz ultimately made bail, but then skipped town, and a bench warrant was issued.

[Andrea Canning]

Have we learned any more of what this group's beliefs are why people around them keep dying.

[Michelle Zyko]

There's still a lot we don't know about this group, but what we do know is they are really concerned about AI, about artificial intelligence. Of course, ChatGPT and companies like OpenAI are full steam ahead of now on artificial intelligence and are worth billions of dollars. But about 10 to 15 years ago, there were some very smart people who thought AI could turn against humans eventually. Almost like a Terminator storyline. And these people took it really seriously, congregating online and in the Bay Area. And these Zizians, they splintered off from this broader group. They seem to have taken these concerns about AI destroying humanity to a different level. And they seem to have believed that basically anything that would stop this threat from becoming real was justified, even violence. And they saw themselves as being potential heroes in the future for being ones who could prevent that.

[Andrea Canning]

Why is this group moving around the country and living out of box trucks?

[Michelle Zyko]

Yeah, the box truck lifestyle. It's really related to how insanely expensive housing is in the Bay Area. These young people moved there to be part of this AI focused community, but not all of them could get jobs in the fields or make enough money. So there's a lot of group houses, there's roommates, some squatting, and Zyz came up with the idea of living on a boat. To try to avoid the high rents, she and some compatriots bought a tugboat in Alaska and piloted it down to the San Francisco Bay.

[Andrea Canning]

Wow.

[Michelle Zyko]

But the plan ultimately fell apart. The tugboat sank, and Ziz moved the group to box trucks.

[Andrea Canning]

There was a bail hearing for the three Zizians in Maryland. I know you didn't learn a whole lot there, from what I understand. But, Rich, we did get to hear from Zyz.

[Michelle Zyko]

Yeah. So Zyz spoke and spoke out of turn quite frequently.

[Andrea Canning]

I need the KLTV order for me to have a vegan diet. It's more important than whatever this hearing is.

[Ken Delaney]

All right, I. I've asked you to please hold on and not speak right now.

[Michelle Zyko]

And her concern was the diet that the jail had been giving her.

[Andrea Canning]

She.

[Michelle Zyko]

She said it wasn't vegan, and so she was starving, essentially.

[Andrea Canning]

It's such a small thing to. It's such a small. It's such a small thing to. To dine over.

[Michelle Zyko]

And she also talked about being almost delirious and that that made it such that she couldn't really help in her defense.

[Andrea Canning]

So what ultimately happened at this hearing? Were they released?

[Michelle Zyko]

They were not released. The prosecutor had pointed out Ziz's flight from prosecution in Pennsylvania. And a footnote in this story that we haven't even talked about. And it is important to note that at some point in the last several years, Mr. Lesotho faked his death, we believe, to escape investigation at that time.

[Andrea Canning]

Yeah, back In August of 2022, the Coast Guard got a distress call. Someone said Ziz had fallen over the side of her boat in the San Francisco Bay and just disappeared.

[Michelle Zyko]

Ziz's hometown paper in Alaska actually published an obituary for her. And. And that isn't even the only fake death in the group. Several years ago, on the same day in August 2022 that the Coast Guard was searching the bay looking for Ziz's body, a lawyer told the California court that he believed his client, Gwen Danielson, had died by suicide. Ziz and Gwen, they stayed on the tugboat together. Now, as in last month, Gwen's father has spoken to some media outlets, saying that Gwen left the Zizians but is alive and maybe now will come forward and talk about what the group is trying to do or has done now that Ziz is in custody.

[Andrea Canning]

You can't make this stuff up. Okay, Zyz, Michelle and Daniel Blank, they'll all be in court next week.

[Michelle Zyko]

Yeah, that's right. On Monday, we hope to hear more. It will also be interesting to see if another law enforcement agency will try to take them into custody to get some answers about what happened to Michelle's parents.

[Andrea Canning]

Okay, Rich, I don't know how you're keeping this all straight, but thank you. You can read Rich Shapiro's reporting on the [e-mail] thank you so much. Up next, it's time for DATELINE Roundup. We've got an update on the Karen Reed case and the latest from the Dominican Republic, where a college student went missing two weeks ago. Plus, have you heard of pig butchering? It's a new kind of financial scam. Our NBC News justice and intelligence correspondent, Kendallanean will be here to give us all the details. Now streaming. What do you know about the Happy Face Killer?

[Sue Simpson]

He's my father.

[Andrea Canning]

It's so good to see you, Missy. Experience the thrilling new series. He said he killed another woman. Inspired by a true life story. If I don't deal with him, he will never leave us alone. You don't see how the word same, do you?

[Robert Baker]

Annalee Ashford and Dennis Quaid star.

[Andrea Canning]

I am not responsible for what my dad did. This going how you hoped. Happy Face new series now streaming exclusively on Paramount.

[Rich Shapiro]

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[Andrea Canning]

Optimize your nutrition with Factor America's number one ready to eat meal service. Factor's Fresh, Never Frozen meals are dietitian approved and ready to eat in just 2 minutes. Choose from 40 weekly options across 8 dietary preferences like calorie, smart and protein. Plus Factor's keto meals can help you lose up to 8 pounds in 8 weeks. Get started at FactorMeals.com Factor50 off to get 50% off plus free shipping on your first box weight loss with Factor Keto based on a randomized controlled clinical trial. Results will vary depending on diet and exercise. Welcome back. Joining us for this week's DATELINE roundup is DATELINE producer Sue Simpson. Hey, Sue.

[Sue Simpson]

Hey, Andrea.

[Andrea Canning]

All right, for our first story, we are back in Dedham, Massachusetts, for the latest on the Karen Reed case. She is the woman accused of killing her police officer boyfriend, John O'Keefe, back in 2022, something she denies. And she is heading to trial for a second time in a few weeks after her first trial ended with a hung jury. Sue, you were in court on Tuesday for a pretrial hearing in the case. What can you tell us?

[Sue Simpson]

Well, Andrea, there was a ruling on an issue we've been talking about on the podcast for the past few weeks involving Reid's defense team and two expert witnesses they called to testify at her trial. The prosecution accused the defense of not disclosing how closely they worked with those two witnesses on their testimony and that they paid them thousands of dollars. After the trial, the defense said they didn't do anything to cover up intentionally.

[Andrea Canning]

What did the judge decide?

[Sue Simpson]

Well, on Tuesday, the judge ruled that the defense attorneys did in fact make repeated misrepresentations, her words about their relationship with the two experts. And Judge Kanoni issued an exceptionally stern warning to the defense.

[Andrea Canning]

I'm not going to tolerate false statements, any stretching of the truth, no misleading distortions. There's no place for that in the courtroom.

[Sue Simpson]

But the judge ruled that despite its misrepresentations, the defense team, including Alan Jackson, can remain in place and the experts are going to be allowed to testify again at Reid's second trial on Top.

[Andrea Canning]

Of that, there was also a ruling by a federal judge in this case last week.

[Sue Simpson]

Correct. That judge ruled that Karen Reed will be tried on the same three charges she faced at her first trial. Her defense team was trying to get the second degree murder and the leaving the scene of the accident charges thrown since they say several jurors contacted them after the trial and said the jury had unanimously agreed to acquit Reid on those two charges and they were only hung on the manslaughter charge. But the federal judge said that wasn't enough to dismiss the charges and her team is appealing that decision.

[Andrea Canning]

And the defense has made a request to push back the trial date.

[Sue Simpson]

Allen Jackson made that request because of that appeal that we just discussed. So we'll have to wait and see what the judge rules on that.

[Andrea Canning]

Okay. For our next story, we're off to the Dominican Republic for an update in the case of Sudiksha Kunanki, the 20 year old university of Pittsburgh student who disappeared from a Punta cana beach on March 6th. Yeah.

[Sue Simpson]

The only sign of Kunanki they found are items of her clothing on a beach chair. And she was last seen with a 22 year old college senior from Iowa. His name is Joshua Riebe. And last weekend Ribe was seen by NBC News on the beach with investigators pointing towards the sea. He said, I'm just trying to help them out. The ocean is a dangerous place.

[Andrea Canning]

According to the police in the Dr. This is not a criminal investigation. But Reby's lawyers were in court this week. Regardless, they requested his release and it was granted. He left the Dominican Republic on Wednesday. And there was another major development sue this week regarding her family and their wishes.

[Sue Simpson]

Yes, there was.

[Andrea Canning]

We are coming to the terms with.

[Chetna Joshi]

The fact that our daughter has drowned. This is incredibly difficult for us to process.

[Sue Simpson]

They've asked the police to declare her dead even though no body has been found.

[Andrea Canning]

So tough for them.

[Sue Simpson]

Yeah.

[Andrea Canning]

For our final story, we're off to Phoenix where convicted killer Lori Valo Daybell was in court on Tuesday for a hearing ahead of her March 31 trial. She, she is accused of conspiring to murder her fourth husband, Charles Vallow. She denies having anything to do with his death and she's representing herself at this trial. What went down at the hearing?

[Sue Simpson]

Well, the judge laid out some parameters for Laurie if she chooses to testify in her own defense.

[Andrea Canning]

If you do want to testify, it will be question and answer, meaning you need to write out all your questions that you want to be asked. You can't take the witness Stand and just give a narrative. The judge also looked over witness stand. And the prosecution is asking that one of Laurie's expert witnesses be blocked.

[Sue Simpson]

That's correct. The witness Laurie is requesting is a tech expert who would review 22 terabytes of information on a hard drive. The problem is, according to the prosecution, the expert doesn't have enough time to review all that evidence before trial. And the judge basically asked Laurie if she wanted to postpone the trial to give the expert more time.

[Andrea Canning]

That's going to take him time to extract and analyze and then prepare a report. Months, maybe. I understand that, your honor, and I'm hoping he can do it in an expedited manner. You're the one pressing for your speedy trial. So you want to go to trial or you want to have him do that work that you want? Because I don't think both are going to happen.

[Sue Simpson]

But Laurie said she wants the trial to continue on schedule with whatever information the expert can gather in time.

[Andrea Canning]

I'm sure Keith's team will be following this closely. And any listeners who want to learn more about Lori Valo Debel's case can listen to Keith's podcast, Mommy Doomsday, or check out his exclusive jailhouse interview with Laurie that aired recently. You can also hear Keith tell me more behind the scenes details on Talking Dateline. We'll put links to those shows in the episode notes. Okay, sue, thank you so much for joining us.

[Sue Simpson]

Thanks, Andrea.

[Andrea Canning]

For our final story, we've caught wind of a new cryptocurrency scam that's sweeping the nation, one that potentially plays on people's hearts and their wallets. It's been given the name pig butchering, and it's so widespread the FBI is intervening. Our next guest, NBC News justice and intelligence correspondent Ken Delaney, is here to tell us what exactly the FBI is doing about it and how to avoid the scam yourself. Hi, Ken.

[Ken Delaney]

Hey, Andrea. Good to be with you.

[Andrea Canning]

You too. Okay, so this is such a horrible, horrible term. First of all, pig butchering. Why that phrase and what does it mean?

[Ken Delaney]

Yeah, it is awful. It comes a Chinese term meaning fattening up the hog for slaughter. And the hog in this case is the victim, because this is a long con where a victim is encouraged to invest money and believes that they are actually making money. The scammers are fattening up the hog for slaughter, trying to get the people to fork over as much of their life savings as they can and even borrow money to give over to these scammers.

[Andrea Canning]

So, okay, so how do they Carry it out.

[Ken Delaney]

They reach out over social media. Often they're. They're trying to sort of create a romance spark, but not always. I've interviewed victims that were. Romance was not involved at all. It was just really a great investment idea. And then over a long period of time, the person seduces the victim, develops a relationship, and then says, oh, and by the way, I have this great investment opportunity for you in cryptocurrency, and then drags them along that way. And a lot of people don't understand what cryptocurrency is and how to invest in it. They know, though, that a lot of people have made a lot of money in it. And so, you know, romance scams are as old as humanity. Right. But this combines the romance scam aspect with social engineering to find people who are vulnerable with this sort of mystery around cryptocurrency. And, you know, it goes on so long that often people think they're making money, but then eventually they find that they don't have access to their funds anymore, and they've lost everything.

[Andrea Canning]

Awful. Who is behind the scams? I'm sure it's very difficult to catch these people.

[Ken Delaney]

Yeah, it's multiple organizations, but the big drivers are believed to be organized criminal groups located in Southeast Asia. And they're big operations, sometimes involving hundreds or even thousands of people.

[Andrea Canning]

You have spoken to the FBI, and they have launched something called Operation Level Up. What kind of progress are they making in combating these scammers?

[Ken Delaney]

Yeah, so this is a really interesting thing that they're doing. The FBI has gotten very good at tracing crypto because cryptocurrency transactions are in the open, so the FBI can see this. And what they've started to do is claw back some of this money. So they've actually been able to get victims back their money. And then the other thing they do is if they see evidence that someone is being scammed, because the FBI has a lot of cyber surveillance going on, and they're looking at some of these criminal groups. I spoke to a victim. He was about to take out a loan and go in further into debt and turn that money over to the scammers. And he got a call from the FBI who said, hey, you're in the middle of a cryptocurrency scam. Don't give them that money. So that saved him from further pain. But, you know, I got to say, that is a small, small percentage of the. Of the larger universe of money that's being stolen. They don't. They don't get most of it.

[Andrea Canning]

What are some signs people should look out for?

[Ken Delaney]

The basic rule of thumb is you should never invest in anything, but particularly cryptocurrency based on a solicitation that you got on social media or online. But also just in general, if people are reaching out to you that you don't know and are acting familiar and trying to become your friend, you know, you should have a healthy dose of skepticism about that and do your due diligence.

[Andrea Canning]

You have spoken to some of these victims and, you know, the one thing we can't stress enough is this can happen to anyone.

[Ken Delaney]

It's remarkable. Exactly that. You're exactly right. I spoke to a cancer researcher like an esteemed scientist who. Who essentially turned over his life savings falling victim to this scam. And again, it goes back to you could be a sophisticated person, but somehow people keep falling for this idea that these folks have a unique way to make money and you can only do it through them. And then people just fall victim to.

[Andrea Canning]

Ken, to anyone who's embarrassed that they were taken by this. What's your advice?

[Ken Delaney]

You know, I asked that question to a federal prosecutor because so many people are embarrassed. And I said, what is your message to these people? And she said, you are not alone. Tens of thousands of people are being scammed in this way. As soon as you realize you've been the victim of a con, please report it to the FBI because they might be able to get some of your money back. They might be able to catch these people. If you don't report it, the chances of that go way down.

[Andrea Canning]

Yeah. Okay. Great advice. Thank you, Ken, for joining us and for raising awareness about this.

[Ken Delaney]

Great to be with you.

[Andrea Canning]

So here's something new we're trying. If you have any true crime questions you want our team to look into, anything you've always wanted to know about investigative techniques, legal terminology, scams you've heard about, anything at all. We'd love to hear your voice on the podcast. Send us an audio message on Social at DatelinenBC and we'll see if we can get some answers for you. That's it for this episode of Dateline True Crime Weekly. To get ad free listening for all our podcasts, subscribe to Dateline Premium. Coming up this Friday on Dateline, it's a case I've been following for nearly a decade. When a beloved doctor was fatally poisoned at her workplace, investigators narrowed in on a most unusual suspect. But now a new ruling, new questions, and a stunning development have turned this case upside down.

[Ken Delaney]

It all just really came out of the blue.

[Andrea Canning]

Maybe this isn't the slam dunk case that some people think it is.

[Ken Delaney]

A lot of people's heads are spinning with all of this.

[Andrea Canning]

Watch Poison Twist this Friday on NBC at 9, 8 Central or stream it on Peacock starting this Saturday. Thanks for listening. Dateline True Crime Weekly is produced by Franny Kelly and Katie Ferguson. Our associate producers are Carson Cummins and Caroline Casey. Our senior producer is Liz Brown. Kurloff production and fact checking helped by Sara Kadir. Veronica Mazeka is our digital producer. Rick Kwan is our sound designer. Original Music by Jesse McGinty. Bryson Barnes is head of audio production. Paul Ryan is executive producer and Liz Cole is senior executive producer of Dateline.

[Ken Delaney]

Good stuff.

[Andrea Canning]

All right.

[Rich Shapiro]

See everybody.

[Andrea Canning]

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