Lori Vallow Daybell's phone calls. Karen Read's retrial set to start. And Houston's "lost boys".

Summary

Dateline NBC: April 17, 2025 Episode Summary

In this episode of Dateline True Crime Weekly, hosted by Blaine Alexander from NBC News, a range of gripping true-crime stories unfolds, delving into high-profile trials, verdicts, and investigative breakthroughs. The episode intricately weaves through multiple cases, providing listeners with comprehensive insights, notable quotes, and expert analyses.

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1. Lori Vallow Daybell's Trial: Unraveling the Conspiracy

Overview: The trial of Lori Vallow Daybell continues in Arizona, focusing on allegations that she conspired to murder her fourth husband, Charles Vallow. Prosecutors argue that Lori orchestrated the killing with her brother, Alex Cox, driven by greed and betrayal to collect a $1 million life insurance payout and to marry Chad Daybell, a self-proclaimed doomsday prophet.

Key Points:

• Prosecutors' Theory: Lori plotted her husband's murder for financial gain and personal freedom.
• Lori's Defense: Representing herself, Lori claims Alex Cox shot Charles in self-defense, denying any conspiracy.
• Evidence Presented: Phone calls made by Lori to Banner Life Insurance after Charles's death reveal discrepancies about the policy's beneficiary.

Notable Quotes:

• Prosecution (Nate Eaton, 03:09): "Self defense is not a crime. A family tragedy is not a crime."
• Lori Vallow (03:25): “I would not have said anything that I wouldn’t say again.”

Expert Insight: Nate Eaton, news director at East Idaho News, highlights the importance of Lori's phone calls, where Lori initially believed she was the primary beneficiary but later discovered her sister was named instead.

Courtroom Dynamics: Detective Cassandra Inkland testified about Lori's nonchalant demeanor following Charles's death, raising suspicions about her awareness and reaction to the tragedy.

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2. Karen Reid's High-Stakes Retrial

Overview: In Massachusetts, Karen Reid faces a highly anticipated retrial for the alleged murder of her boyfriend, John O'Keefe, a Boston police officer. Her first trial ended in a mistrial after nine weeks, and the retrial introduces several new elements aimed at ensuring a fairer judicial process.

Key Points:

• Jury Selection: The retrial saw an extended jury selection process due to the case's high publicity and potential biases. Out of 54 prospective jurors, 43 had heard of the case, with 26 forming opinions beforehand.
• Courtroom Security: Expanded buffer zones and increased Massachusetts State Police presence underscore the case's sensitivity.
• Prosecution's Strategy: Intends to introduce Karen's statements made outside the courtroom to strengthen their case.
• Michael Proctor's Testimony: The lead investigator previously dismissed Karen, with his testimony revealing derogatory remarks about her, potentially undermining her credibility.

Notable Quotes:

• Lisa Olson (11:55): "Judge Kenoni wanted 18 jurors and she got them Tuesday afternoon, nine men and nine women."
• Karen Reid (14:56): "Come at me."

Potential Developments: Karen Reid's decision on whether to testify remains pivotal. Her active involvement in her defense could significantly influence the trial's outcome.

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3. Verdicts in High-Profile Murder Trials

A. Monica Simtelli's Conviction

• Case Details: Monica Simtelli, accused of orchestrating the murder of her husband, Fabio Simentelli, was found guilty despite her lover and accomplice confessing to the act.
• Verdict: Guilty of second-degree murder under penal code section 187A.
• Reaction: Monica displayed intense emotion in court, while her sister expressed that justice had been served.
• Next Steps: Sentencing is scheduled for June, with Monica facing life imprisonment without parole.

B. Linda Sturmer's Guilty Verdict

• Case Details: Linda Sturmer, from Michigan, was convicted for the second time of murdering her husband by setting their house on fire and running him over with a van. Previously convicted 15 years ago, her appeals for a retrial were denied.
• Verdict: Guilty on two counts of murder.
• Immediate Outcome: Her bond was revoked, and she was taken into custody, with sentencing set for May.

Notable Quotes:

• Jury Verdict Announcement (20:56): "We, the jury, in the above entitled action, find the defendant Monica Simon guilty of the crime of murder in violation."

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4. The Gilgo Beach Serial Killer: Controversial DNA Evidence

Overview: Rex Heuerman, the alleged Gilgo Beach serial killer, faces a critical hearing regarding the admissibility of nuclear DNA evidence used by prosecutors. This advanced DNA analysis method is under scrutiny for its reliability and acceptance in New York courts.

Key Points:

• Prosecution's Evidence: Hair fibers found on six of the seven bodies linked to Heuerman are analyzed using nuclear DNA, aiming to establish a genetic connection.
• Defense's Challenge: The defense argues that nuclear DNA testing is unproven in New York courts and may be unreliable, potentially undermining the prosecution's case.
• Family's Involvement: Heuerman’s estranged wife and daughter attended the hearing, emphasizing the personal toll and ongoing quest for closure despite no charges against them.

Notable Quotes:

• Dr. Sharon Derrick (23:56): "They want to in essence, have a jury rely on this, which is not trustworthy. It's not reliable, it's not scientific, and it shouldn't be utilized in a court."

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5. Lisa Olson's Investigation: The Scientist and the Serial Killer

Overview: Author and investigative journalist Lisa Olson discusses her new book, The Scientist and the Serial Killer, which chronicles the heinous crimes of Dean Corll, known as the Candyman, and the relentless efforts of forensic anthropologist Dr. Sharon Derrick to identify Corll's victims, the "Lost Boys."

Key Points:

• Dean Corll's Crimes: Over 50 years ago, Corll abducted and murdered more than a dozen young boys in Houston, Texas, with the help of teenage accomplices.
• Forensic Breakthroughs: Decades after the murders, Dr. Derrick utilized advanced DNA technology to identify the victims, bringing closure to grieving families.
• Personal Connection: Dr. Derrick's dedication stems from personal ties to the community and a commitment to resolving long-standing cases of unidentified victims.

Notable Quotes:

• Lisa Olson (25:58): "Many of the bodies were never identified until decades later. Dr. Sharon Derrick made it her mission to return the Lost Boys to their families."

Emotional Impact: The identification of victims like Randy Harvey provided profound relief and closure to families, transforming years of uncertainty and grief into moments of remembrance and healing.

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Conclusion

This episode of Dateline True Crime Weekly meticulously covers ongoing trials, recent verdicts, and groundbreaking investigative work, offering listeners a deep dive into the complexities of true-crime cases. With expert commentary, emotional testimonies, and detailed case analyses, the episode serves as an essential resource for true-crime enthusiasts seeking comprehensive and engaging storytelling.

Notable Contributors:

• Blaine Alexander: Host and narrator.
• Sue Simpson: Producer and reporter.
• Rachel White: Producer covering court verdicts.
• Lisa Olson: Author and investigative journalist.
• Dr. Sharon Derrick: Forensic anthropologist.

For More Information: Listeners are encouraged to visit DatelinePremium.com for exclusive content and to subscribe for ad-free episodes.

Transcript

[Southern New Hampshire University Ad]

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[Blaine Alexander]

Who on the call would want to do the rocket? I'm curious. It's time for the morning meeting here at DATELINE headquarters.

[Nate Eaton]

Let's rock it into the meeting.

[Blaine Alexander]

Our producers are catching up on breaking crime news around the country. Your jury's deliberating. Yeah, they just got charged like five minutes ago.

[Sue Simpson]

Long investigation does not always equal mystery.

[Blaine Alexander]

Welcome to DATELINE True Crime Weekly. I'm Blaine Alexander filling in today for Andrea, who's out on vacation this week. It's April 17th 17th and here's what's on our docket. In Massachusetts, a jury is seated for Karen Reid's highly anticipated retrial ahead of opening statements. We'll catch you up on what to watch out for this time around.

[Lisa Olson]

It was a huge challenge to seat a jury in a case that is as public and controversial as this one.

[Blaine Alexander]

Other stories on our radar this week. We've got verdicts in two murder trials and a pivotal pre trial hearing in the case of the alleged Gilgo beach serial killer.

[Rachel White]

Prosecutors hired a private lab to analyze those hair fibers using nuclear DNA.

[Blaine Alexander]

Plus, we're joined by author and investigative journalist Lisa Olson to talk about her new book on one of the deadliest serial killers in American history and the scientist who helped return his victims to their families.

[Sue Simpson]

She took the police report home. She read it late at night and she noticed names of kids who had been forgotten.

[Blaine Alexander]

But before all of that, we're heading back to Arizona where Lori Valo Daybell's trial for conspiring to murder, murder her fourth husband continues. And so does the drama. For the past week, prosecutors have presented their theory of what happened on the morning of July 11, 2019, when Lori Valo Daybell's fourth husband, Charles Vallow, was shot and killed by her brother, Alex Cox. They say that greed and betrayal motivated Lori to plot her husband's murder with her brother so she could collect $1 million in life insurance and and be free to marry her lover, the self proclaimed doomsday prophet, Chad Daybell. Laurie, who's representing herself in court, has denied all of this, telling the jury that Alex, who is now dead, shot her husband in self defense.

[Nate Eaton]

Self defense is not a crime. A family tragedy is not a crime.

[Blaine Alexander]

But earlier this week, the jury got to hear Laurie under very different circumstances as the prosecution played snippets from her interviews with detectives. And what happened.

[Nate Eaton]

Charles was coming with me at the.

[Blaine Alexander]

Back, yelling at me. Give him his phone. And calls with an insurance agent in the wake of Charles's death. Here to fill us in is Nate Eaton, the news director at East Idaho News and an NBC News consultant on this case. Nate right now is calling us tucked away in the corner of a courthouse in Phoenix. Nate, thank you so much for joining us.

[Dr. Sharon Derrick]

Yeah, good to be here. I apologize for the noise. We're on our lunch break, so it might be a little loud out here, but I am tucked away and ready to report what's been happening.

[Blaine Alexander]

Listen, thank you for giving up your food to bring us up to speed. So this week, the trial has given the jury a chance to hear Lori's voice from the hours and days after her brother, Alex Cox shot Charles Vallow. And some of this comes from phone calls that Lori made to Banner Life Insurance after her husband's death. So tell us about those phone calls and why they're so important for the prosecution here.

[Dr. Sharon Derrick]

Lori thought she was the sole beneficiary of a $1 million life insurance policy. Days after he shot to death in her front room, she called the life insurance company to cash in on that policy.

[Nate Eaton]

Are you aware of who the primary beneficiary of the policy is? It's me.

[Dr. Sharon Derrick]

They told her that they would send her information via email. She learned a few days later that she was not the recipient. Instead, it was her husband's sister.

[Blaine Alexander]

How did she react when she found out? That had to have been very surprising for her.

[Dr. Sharon Derrick]

Oh, yeah, she was shocked. She was upset. She called the life insurance company lady and tried to get answers as far as why this happened.

[Blaine Alexander]

Okay, let's listen to some of that.

[Nate Eaton]

Conversation so I can tell you that the beneficiary was changed in March of this year. Okay. Okay. I'm trying to figure out what he was doing. Since we have five kids and we've been married for 15 years. I'm sorry. Did he change it to one person or was it several? Unfortunately, I can't release that. I'm sorry. I deal with this business all the time, so I kind of know how it works, but I'm completely surprised. Right. We have our 7 year old with autism that we adopted together, so I am surprised that he would do that without telling me.

[Blaine Alexander]

Interesting. I'm fascinated on what it must have been like to be in the courtroom listening to those calls play. What was the mood inside the courtroom? How were people reacting?

[Dr. Sharon Derrick]

I think people were really into this, really intrigued, because we got to hear her demeanor. In fact, when the operator said, tell me how your husband died. Lori pauses for a moment.

[Nate Eaton]

And what was the cause of his passing? Well, he was shot. Okay. So I don't know how I want to put that. Okay. All right. And I hate to ask, but is it. Yeah, you can just say yes or no.

[Lisa Olson]

It.

[Nate Eaton]

Is it. Was it a homicide? No, it was an accident. An accident. Okay.

[Dr. Sharon Derrick]

It's almost as if she was thinking through, how do I answer this question, and what are they going to put on the form?

[Blaine Alexander]

Also this week, the prosecution called the detective, Cassandra Inkland, to the stand. She interviewed Lori in the hours after the shooting, and the jury got to hear some of that this week.

[Cassandra Inkland]

Did you actually see. See the shot or did you just hear it?

[Blaine Alexander]

I didn't see the shot.

[Nate Eaton]

I heard it and then I came back around and I saw that he.

[Blaine Alexander]

Was on the ground. What else did we learn from the detective during her testimony?

[Dr. Sharon Derrick]

This is a detective who went to the scene the morning of the shooting. A couple of things stuck out to her. One is how nonchalant Lori was about the whole thing. The detective said that she didn't think that Lori knew that her husband was dead. Lori and Tyler went into a police van, and the detective said, I'm going to go over and I'm going to let her know her husband's dead.

[Cassandra Inkland]

I think at some point I asked her something to the effect if she would step out of the van to talk to me. And at that point she said that she already knew because she was there, which was kind of a surprise. I wasn't necessarily expecting that.

[Lisa Olson]

Did her demeanor change at all when she's telling you that she was there and knew he was dead?

[Cassandra Inkland]

No.

[Dr. Sharon Derrick]

And Lori did get pretty fiery with that particular detective on cross examination.

[Nate Eaton]

What did you say that made me say that I was already there?

[Cassandra Inkland]

I was asking you to step out of the van and you said, I was there. I already know.

[Nate Eaton]

I already know what?

[Cassandra Inkland]

That Charles had died. I was trying not to tell you in front of your daughter.

[Nate Eaton]

That would have been nice, but that wasn't the point. How did I know you were coming to give me a death notification?

[Sue Simpson]

Sharing reject to speculation.

[Blaine Alexander]

Sustained.

[Dr. Sharon Derrick]

Another thing is Lori made a really big deal about the mood of the scene, that everybody was nonchalant. And that's how the detective described Lori's behavior. And Lori fired back at her.

[Nate Eaton]

Do you have a degree in psychology?

[Cassandra Inkland]

I do not.

[Nate Eaton]

Do you know what a person should act like if they're in a stressful situation?

[Cassandra Inkland]

So there isn't one way to act. There's just behavior that is striking.

[Nate Eaton]

Striking behavior.

[Cassandra Inkland]

Correct.

[Nate Eaton]

Okay. And it would have been non emotional if I was trying to be calm for my daughter.

[Sue Simpson]

I object to speculation. Sustain.

[Nate Eaton]

Were you being calm?

[Cassandra Inkland]

I believe so.

[Nate Eaton]

Were the other detectives being calm?

[Cassandra Inkland]

I believe so.

[Nate Eaton]

It was a pretty calm environment that day, was I not?

[Cassandra Inkland]

I don't know if I'd agree with that, but.

[Nate Eaton]

Well, no one was running around hysterical, right?

[Cassandra Inkland]

Correct.

[Nate Eaton]

Okay.

[Blaine Alexander]

There is just so much here. Nate, thank you so much for keeping us up to speed. And for more on the trial, you can also check out Nate's show, Courtroom Insider. That's live at 8pm Mountain Time on the East Idaho News YouTube channel every day after court.

[Dr. Sharon Derrick]

Thank you, Blaine. Good seeing you.

[Blaine Alexander]

You too. Coming up, as Karen Reid's blockbuster retrial gets underway, how her own words may come back to haunt.

[Dr. Sharon Derrick]

Hey, everybody, I'm Al Roker from the Today show. Let's kickstart your wellness journey with the all new Start Today app. Everything you need for a healthier you all in one place. Fitness challenges for all levels. Meal plans that are easy and delicious and so much more. It's built to fit your lifestyle and our experts will guide you every step of the way. Come on, let's do this.

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[Blaine Alexander]

Start today from the App Store on your Apple device. Now.

[Jenna Bush Hager]

Terms apply. Cancel anytime through Apple under profile settings.

[Blaine Alexander]

Hey, guys, Willie Geist here reminding you to check out the Sunday sit Down podcast. On this week's episode, I get together with Saturday Night Live star Bowen Yang to talk about his extraordinary road as the son of Chinese immigrants to SNL and that dream role in the wicked movies. You can get our conversation now for free wherever you download your podcasts.

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[Blaine Alexander]

Karen Reed's first trial began almost a year ago. Reed was charged with second degree murder, among other charges for allegedly killing her boyfriend, John O'Keefe, a Boston police officer. Prosecutors say she left him to die in the snow after hitting him with her SUV outside of a party at the home of another Boston police officer. Now for its part, the Defense argued that O'Keefe had been beaten up inside the house and Reed was being framed for his death. Reed has pleaded not guilty. Her first trial ended after nine weeks without a verdict. I'm declaring a mistrial in this case. In the years since, Karen Reed's case has never been far from the head headlines as attorneys have continued to battle it out in pre trial hearings and Reid herself has spoken out. This week a jury was finally selected for the retrial with opening statements set for next Tuesday. DATELINE producer Sue Simpson joins us again to bring us the very latest on what to expect this time around. Sue, there is so much to watch here. Thanks so much for joining us. To break it all down.

[Sue Simpson]

Yeah.

[Lisa Olson]

Hi, Blaine. Hi.

[Sue Simpson]

Hi.

[Blaine Alexander]

Okay, so let's get into it. On Tuesday, we finally got a jury. That is big.

[Lisa Olson]

Yeah, it really is big. Judge Kenoni wanted 18 jurors and she got them Tuesday afternoon, nine men and nine women. All of the jurors are going to be seated for the entire trial, but after closing arguments, only 12 of them are going to be chosen to deliberate.

[Blaine Alexander]

Okay. So in the initial trial, a lot of our listeners will remember that jury selection happened in the first week. This time around it took double that time. So why, why did it take longer this time around?

[Lisa Olson]

Blaine, it was a huge challenge to seat a jury in a case that is as public and controversial as this one. Let's just look at the numbers from court. For Tuesday's jury pool pool number 10, there were 54 people, 43 had heard of the case, 26 had formed an opinion. And that's about half of the people there. And eight reported having a bias. So then you have other conflicts. For instance, nine of the jurors said they knew witnesses, four knew either some of the lawyers invol in the case or the district attorney outside of court. This week, Karen Reitz said she wasn't bothered by the long selection process.

[Blaine Alexander]

Interesting. So that longer process, that's just one of several differences between the first trial and the Second, as it's playing out, another big difference is what's happening outside the courtroom.

[Lisa Olson]

Yeah, so I was up there for the start of jury selection, and there are metal barricades around the courthouse. There are more Massachusetts State Police. It's a very different vibe. Karen Reid has a lot of supporters, and many of them wear pink to show their support during the first trial. They had signs and they had bullhorns. They even dressed up their dogs in pink to show that they were standing with her. But they were kept back from the actual courthouse. There was a buffer zone for the first trial. It's just grown bigger. For the retrial, Judge Kanoni ordered an expanded buffer zone, and four of Karen's supporters filed a lawsuit in federal court arguing that it limited their right to free speech. On Monday, a judge denied the suit and said that Kanone's expanded buffer zone, his words, direct advance the goal of ensuring a fair trial. An attorney for the protesters said they're going to appeal.

[Blaine Alexander]

There was also some news this week from the prosecution about their strategy for this retrial. They filed a notice saying that they intend to introduce statements that Karen's made outside of court.

[Lisa Olson]

Yes, Karen was outspoken after her first trial, and she's been speaking out ahead of her second trial. She's done a lot of media interviews. She sat down with Dateline, of course, for a lengthy interview. But she also talked to documentary makers and to magazine writers. And now the prosecution wants to turn her statements against her. Their strategy is basically to take her words to help make their case. Karen was asked about that strategy outside of court, and she answered with a bit of bravado, you know, come at me, were her exact words. Come at me. But she also wanted to make it clear that she knew what she was saying in each interview. As she put it, I would not have said anything that I wouldn't say again.

[Blaine Alexander]

So one thing we are expecting to look pretty similar in the second trial is the witness list. And there's one name in particular that people, of course, are very curious about. Michael Proctor. A lot of our listeners will remember that name. Just remind us who he is, and do we expect to see him take the stand this time?

[Rachel White]

Yeah.

[Lisa Olson]

Michael Proctor was the lead investigator in the case, and he was fired by the Massachusetts State Police earlier this year due to misconduct, including, and this is very big, sending demeaning and derogatory text messages about Karen Reid during the investigation. His testimony was a really dramatic part of the first trial. Defense attorney Alan Jackson forced Proctor to read some of those text messages he sent on the stand.

[Dr. Sharon Derrick]

So these came from me.

[Blaine Alexander]

She's a whack job.

[Dr. Sharon Derrick]

She's gross.

[Blaine Alexander]

No nudes so far.

[Dr. Sharon Derrick]

No nudes so far. Correct? Correct. And you said that to your bosses?

[Blaine Alexander]

Yes, sir.

[Lisa Olson]

We expect Proctor to take the stand. It's a tough call for the prosecution, though, because if they don't call him, you can bet the defense will.

[Blaine Alexander]

And after the jury was selected on Tuesday, speaking of who may testify, Karen Reed herself was asked if she planned to testify. She said, quote, to be determined. So what do you think? Do you think we'll see her take the stand this time?

[Lisa Olson]

Million dollar question, maybe a billion dollar question. She's almost fully fledged. She's almost a fully fledged member of her own defense team. She knows the facts inside and out, but, you know, always the case. And you know this, Blaine. The defense is going to give the prosecution a real target if they put her on the stand. So we'll have to see.

[Blaine Alexander]

Interesting. So opening statements scheduled to begin in this case this coming Tuesday. One last thing that will be different this time around. Getting into the court. So last time, for the longtime listeners of our podcast, they'll remember that you were faithfully sitting in line with your soccer chair very, very early in the morning. You've been the MVP of our coverage this entire time, by the way. But you don't have to do that this time. That's not the case. What's changing this time around?

[Lisa Olson]

You know, Blaine, it's almost a letdown. And I can tell you, when I go up there this time, I am putting that soccer chair in my trunk. I'm gonna have it with me as kind of a talisman for. But this time, let me tell you what the system is. You know, there's a lottery system. I mean, something called a randomizer. Selects 10 reporters from about 30 who want to sit inside the court. There's only 10 seats in this tiny, tiny courtroom. But, you know, whether I'm in the court or streaming the trial online, I'm going to be watching it very closely and reporting back to tell you about it. And, you know, I might be sitting in my chair when I do it.

[Blaine Alexander]

That's what the people need. We need the Sue Simpson soccer chair. Sue Simpson, our intrepid reporter who has been all over this case from the beginning of time. Sue, thank you so much. Thank you for joining us.

[Lisa Olson]

Thank you.

[Blaine Alexander]

Up next, verdicts are in on two separate murder trials that we've been following. Two female defendants, both accused of murdering their husbands. Will either of them walk free plus, author Lisa Olson is here to talk about her new book on the man she calls the worst serial killer you've never heard of and the scientist who's working to bring closure to the families of his victims. Join me, Jacqueline Coley, on a brand new podcast seen on the Screen, presented by Make It Universal and Rotten Tomatoes. Meet the innovative people at NBCUniversal as they share their journeys, inspirations and the movies that shape them. Each episode is an intimate and fun conversation about the impact of film. Seen on the screen is available now. You can find it on Apple, Spotify, YouTube, or wherever you find your favorite podcast.

[Jenna Bush Hager]

A true crime story never really ends. Even when a case is closed, the journey for those left behind is just beginning.

[Blaine Alexander]

Since our DATELINE story aired, Tracy has harnessed her outrage into a mission. I had no other option. I had to do something.

[Jenna Bush Hager]

Catch up with families, friends and investigators on our bonus series after the Verdict. Ordinary people facing extraordinary circumstances with strength and courage.

[Blaine Alexander]

It does just change your life. But speaking up for these issues helps me keep going.

[Jenna Bush Hager]

To listen to after the Verdict. Subscribe to Dateline Premium on Apple Podcasts, Spotify [e-mail] Hey, everyone.

[Blaine Alexander]

I'm Jenna Bush Hager from the Today show and I'm excited to share my podcast, Open Book with Jenna. It is back for season two. Each week, celebrities, experts, friends and authors will share candid stories with me about their lives and new projects. Guests like Rebecca Yarros, Kristin Hannah, Ego Wodom, and more. Like a good book, you'll leave feeling inspired and entertained. Join me for my podcast, Open Book with Jenna. Listen now on Apple Podcast Asks. Welcome back. Joining me for this week's roundup is DATELINE booking producer Rachel White. Hi, Rachel.

[Rachel White]

Hi, Blaine.

[Blaine Alexander]

How are you? So good to talk with you.

[Rachel White]

It's great to be here.

[Blaine Alexander]

Okay, so let's dive in. Let's start with two verdicts that came back last week in trials that we've been following pretty closely here on the podcast. First up, the murder trial of Monica Simtelli, the wife of Hollywood hair stylist Fabio Simentelli. Rachel, just real quickly remind us about that.

[Rachel White]

Absolutely. So Monica Sementelli was accused of masterminding a plot to have her husband killed. Even though her lover, former porn star and sex offender Rob Baker, and his lifelong friend Christopher Austin confessed to carrying out the murder itself, a jury still had to decide just how involved Monica was with the plan.

[Blaine Alexander]

That was a long trial, a very long trial, about 10 weeks. How long did it take the jury.

[Rachel White]

To deliberate on this so they deliberated for about 8 hours and 45 minutes, and that was spread out over three days.

[Blaine Alexander]

Okay, gotcha. So let's take a listen to what the jury decided here. Here's the verdict. We, the jury, in the above entitled action, find the defendant Monica Simon guilty of the crime of murder in violation.

[Rachel White]

Of penal code section 187AMonica was very emotional in court, put her face in her hands and sobbed. But Simmentelli's sister said justice had been served and Fabio could now rest in peace.

[Blaine Alexander]

So what's next for Monica now?

[Rachel White]

She's going to be sentenced in June, and she faces life in prison without the possibility of parole.

[Blaine Alexander]

Okay, and a quick plug for those who have not seen the Dateline episode that Josh did on this. It should be on your Dateline feed, Peacock, wherever you see it. But it was a fantastic episode about that case. Okay, let's move on to the trial of Linda Sturmer, the Michigan woman accused of killing her husband by setting their house on fire and running over him with a van. This was Linda's second trial on these charges, right?

[Rachel White]

That's right, Blaine. And listeners might remember the that 15 years ago, Linda was convicted and got a life sentence for this crime. But after just eight years behind bars, a federal appeals court said she should get a new trial, citing ineffective counsel and prosecutorial misconduct.

[Blaine Alexander]

So this is her second go round. Now facing a jury, what verdict did they reach this time around?

[Rachel White]

Yeah, so they came back guilty on two counts of murder, and her bond was revoked and she was immediately taken into custody. So her sentencing will be in May.

[Blaine Alexander]

All right, so up next, Rex Heuerman, that's the accused Gilgo beach serial killer, back in Suffolk county court this week for a hearing regarding some pretty critical evidence in this case. Rachel, what's this one about?

[Rachel White]

The hearing was something called a fry hearing. So this is when a judge hears arguments to decide whether scientific evidence that the prosecution or the defense wants to present to a jury is based on established science and therefore would be admissible. What's under discussion in this case is the prosecution's use of nuclear DNA.

[Blaine Alexander]

Okay, so let's talk about nuclear DNA. How does that come up in this case?

[Rachel White]

According to prosecutors, investigators found hair fibers on or around six of the seven bodies that they say Huroman dumped on Gilgo Beach. Prosecutors hired a private lab to analyze those hair fibers using nuclear DNA, which is a cutting edge DNA analysis.

[Blaine Alexander]

Well, Rachel, the prosecution says that the lab's analysis linked Heuerman to the hairs found on the victims. But the defense says this method of DNA testing has never been used before in New York courts and has also called it substandard.

[Dr. Sharon Derrick]

They want to in essence, have a jury rely on this, which is not trustworthy. It's not reliable, it's not scientific, and it shouldn't be utilized in a court.

[Blaine Alexander]

So Rex Heuerman's estranged wife, Asa Ellerup and their daughter Victoria Heuerman were at the hearing this week. Did either of them have anything to say to the press this week?

[Rachel White]

Ellerup's attorney said it's important for the family to be here to obtain whatever type of closure they're going to get out of this case, unquote. He went on to say that Assa and Victoria's DNA was allegedly found on some of the victims bodies, but emphasized that the prosecutor has said neither have been charged or are considered suspects.

[Blaine Alexander]

So Heuerman has pleaded not guilty to all of the charges against him. And of course, we will certainly be waiting to see how the court rules on this. All right, Rachel, thanks for joining us this week.

[Rachel White]

Thank you for having me.

[Blaine Alexander]

For our final story today, we wanted to talk about a fascinating new book that's just been published. It's called the Scientist and the Serial Killer. On an August afternoon more than 50 years ago, police officers gathered at a boat shed in Houston, Texas, where they dug up the bodies of more than a dozen young boys. They were the victims of the so called Candyman serial killer. His name was Dean Corll and he got the nickname the Candyman because of the years he spent helping his mother run candy stores in the area. That's where he ended up meeting some of his victims. Others he lured to his home with the help of two teenage accomplices. The murders were only exposed after one of those accomplices shot and killed Corll. But that was not the end of the story. Many of the bodies were never identified until decades later. A forensic anthropologist in the Harris County Medical Examiner's Office by The name of Dr. Sharon Derrick made it her mission to return the Lost Boys to their families. We're joined now by Lisa Olson, the author of the book and an investigative journalist who has spent years researching this story. Lisa, thank you so much for joining us to talk about this.

[Sue Simpson]

Thank you for having me.

[Blaine Alexander]

Well, Lisa, I guess, you know, before I even get into the case itself, I want to ask, how did this come to be something that you dove into and ultimately wrote a book about?

[Sue Simpson]

I moved to Texas from Seattle, which was the hunting ground of the Green River Killer, and he got away with his crimes for much longer because some of his victims weren't identified. So I became really interested in this whole world of America's silent mass disaster, the 40,000 unidentified victims of murder, suicide, and accidents that are all over our country. So when I came, I met Dr. Derrick, who was already diving into this serial killing case.

[Blaine Alexander]

I wanna talk about Dr. Sharon Derrick and kind of her work in really restoring identity to these kids. One talk to me about what that looks like, because, yes, you talk about the, you know, scientific method of going through and actually identifying the kids, but restoring identity in a bigger sense as well.

[Sue Simpson]

Absolutely. In the 2000s, she discovered that. That in fact, a third of Coral's victims had never been identified, even though many of them were from the same neighborhood. Her first time into the morgue, she goes in to the cold storage unit and she is assigned as a forensic anthropologist to these unidentified cases. And she finds these boxes of bones. And she's very galvanized by that. And she's able to use, you know, all the tools that we read about in csi, of course, you know, DNA, DNA comparisons to siblings and parents, and her new technology to find clues that lead her to the siblings and the parents who were still looking for them all these years later.

[Blaine Alexander]

At the time the Candyman was abducting kids, parents were reporting their kids missing. But for some reason, the police just didn't connect some of these reports to Dean Corll, even after the bodies of his victims were discovered. And this quest to identify victims actually became personal to Dr. Darragh.

[Sue Simpson]

She had parents who met in the neighborhood. She had cousins who grew up in this neighborhood. So she really took this personally. She felt these were crimes that, once they were discovered, really affected a whole generation of people. And she knew there would be people out there still looking. People whose grief was what they say are frozen. You know, people who weren't able to mourn their lost relatives because they didn't know for sure what had happened to them. When you look back at the cases, it's really heartbreaking how many times the parents tried to get the police to do that something. And at the time, the attitude was, no, they ran away. And actually, even after the crimes were found, the police chief at the time blamed the parents for not being more sort of attentive. He refused to believe that his officer should have noticed that there was a serial killer at work. And so Dr. Derek became very personally and professionally engaged in this case. She took the police report home, she read it late at night, and she noticed names of kids who had been forgotten. Like Randy Harvey is one of the names his sister had multiple times saying, my brother would never leave and not tell my mom and I where he went. So she's trying to find the families to link them to the bodies. And the first one she does find is Randy Harvey, who had been riding his bike to work on the day he disappeared. And he had gone off with his bell bottom pants with his shirt with the peace sign on it. So she describes Lenore Harvey, Randy's little sister, as being, you know, sort of almost giddy seeing his clothing because she could never resolve in her heart for sure that he had died. And so when she gets the proof and she realizes that she's been right all along, she has a huge sense of relief. She's able to have a memorial service for her brother. She plays the zombies at his service.

[Blaine Alexander]

So Randy is the first identification that Dr. Derek made in this case. And through her work, she was actually able to increase the number of known victims.

[Sue Simpson]

Tell us about it was, you know, originally thought to be 27 and it's definitely 30. It could be as many as 40. And she goes on to be able to provide those answers to family after family.

[Blaine Alexander]

This is a fascinating story, Lysa, and I'm grateful for Dr. Derek's work on this and just her tireless work to bring some dignity and identity back to these young men and their families. And many thanks to you too, you know, for just telling these stories in this fascinating book. The title again is the Scientist and the Serial Killer.

[Sue Simpson]

Thank you.

[Blaine Alexander]

And that's it for this episode of DATELINE True Crime Weekly. But remember, if you want to leave us a message with questions or suggestions for cases you'd like us to cover, you can reach us on social media, ainenbc, or call that phone line, 212-413-5252. And if you like the show, and we hope you do, please go online and vote for it. We have been nominated for a Webby Award in the crime and justice podcast category along with Dateline's Missing in America season three. So voting closes on Thursday, April 17th. You don't have much time. We've included the voting link in the episode description, so please, please go and vote. We appreciate you so much. Finally, get ready for a weekend of classic Datelines on NBC. We have episodes for you on Friday and Saturday at 9, 8 Central and a Sunday episode at 10, 9 Central. Thanks so much for listening. Dateline True Crime Weekly is produced by Franny Kelly and Katie Ferguson. Our associate producers are Carson Cummins and Caroline Casey. Our senior producer is Liz Brown Kuriloff. Veronica Mazeka is our digital producer. Rick Kwan is our sound designer. Original Music by Jesse McGinty. Bryson Barnes is head of audio production. Paul Ryan is executive producer and Liz Cole is senior executive producer of Dateline. See you later. Bye bye.

[Jenna Bush Hager]

DATELINE Friday A family divided by love and death.

[Dr. Sharon Derrick]

All we want to know is the TR truth.

[Blaine Alexander]

There's a lot of clues but no easy answers.

[Jenna Bush Hager]

Their relentless pursuit uncovers a secret that changes everything, he says.

[Blaine Alexander]

You wouldn't believe what we found is huge.

[Jenna Bush Hager]

Dateline Friday, 9, 8 Central. Only on NBC.