New evidence in Karen Read's retrial. Cold case arrest in Ohio. And a big ruling in Sean Combs case.

Summary

Dateline NBC Podcast Summary Release Date: May 1, 2025

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1. Retrial of Karen Reed in Dedham, Massachusetts

Overview: Karen Reed faces a retrial for the alleged murder of her police officer boyfriend, John O'Keefe, whom she is accused of striking with her SUV, leaving him to die in a snowbank three years prior.

Key Points:

• Prosecution's Evidence: Prosecutor Hank Brennan utilized digital forensics to establish a timeline based on phone data. Expert Ian Wyther presented data showing John’s phone temperature decreasing steadily, suggesting it never entered a house, implying he was left outside (03:37).

  Sue Simpson (Producer): "The whole picture isn't straightforward... this kind of data hasn't been used often." (05:28)

• Defense's Challenge: The defense questioned the validity of the phone temperature data, highlighting the absence of temperature records for Canton on the night in question.

  Karen Johnson (Producer): "You have to wonder if the jury how much weight they'll put into it." (05:37)

• Witness Testimony: Jen McCabe, a close friend of both Karen and John, testified about Karen’s erratic behavior the morning John was found, including frantic calls and screaming without recalling visiting an after-party.

  Jen McCabe: "She was screaming my name. Screaming so many different things." (06:25)

• Prosecutor’s Theory: The prosecution posits that John was incapacitated outside, allowing Karen to abandon him.

Notable Quote:

Jen McCabe: "I was frozen. I was shocked. I couldn't believe that was him just lying there." (07:52)

Current Status: The jury deadlocked after five days of deliberation. Karen Reed maintains her innocence, claiming that John was assaulted by others after dropping him off at a party.

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2. Cold Case Arrest in Ohio: Paul Hicks

Overview: Paul Hicks has been arrested for the 2001 murder of his estranged wife, Regina Rowe Hicks, 24 years after her body was discovered in a pond.

Key Points:

• Previous Charges: In 2022, Hicks pleaded no contest to an elaborate arson scheme but was acquitted of more severe felony charges, leading to his release.

• New Evidence: Investigators uncovered bizarre purchases made by Hicks before the 2015 arson, including a wig identical to his ex-girlfriend's hair and a custom-made mask from "That's My Face," suggesting he attempted to frame his ex-girlfriend for the fire (13:02).

  Unnamed Producer: "They believe that he hired two people to go in, set the fire to his home, and that way he can frame his ex girlfriend." (14:04)

• Motive: Suspicions arise from their rocky marriage and Hicks' potential desire for custody of their child and insurance money.

• Indictment Details: Authorities allege that Hicks kidnapped Regina, placed her in the passenger seat, and drove her car into a pond, leaving a window open to facilitate his escape.

Notable Quote:

Unnamed Producer: "I do believe it put more eyes on Paul Hicks... more people started talking." (16:50)

Current Status: Paul Hicks has pleaded not guilty to charges of kidnapping and murder. He is currently in jail awaiting trial, with his bond set at $2 million and a pretrial hearing scheduled for May 19th.

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3. Dateline Roundup

a. Sean Combs' Sex Trafficking Trial

Overview: Music mogul Sean "Diddy" Combs faces federal sex trafficking charges. A pivotal pretrial ruling allows the prosecution to introduce a controversial security video.

Key Points:

• Controversial Video: A CNN-broadcast security video from 2016 allegedly shows Combs assaulting his ex-girlfriend Cassie. The defense argued the video was altered, but the judge permitted its use in court (18:28).

• Other Rulings:

  • Anonymity granted to alleged victims to protect their identities.
  • The judge denied the defense's request to dismiss psychologist Dawn Hughes' testimony entirely, allowing limited aspects related to victim behavior but excluding discussions on coercive control (19:42).

• Prosecution's Stance: The government offered a plea deal, which Combs has rejected, maintaining his innocence.

Notable Quote:

Alex Leray: "The trial is coming up very soon. Jury selection starts on Monday, May 5th." (20:16)

Current Status: Combs has pleaded not guilty. Jury selection begins on May 5th, with the trial anticipated to proceed shortly thereafter.

b. Brian Kohberger's Trial Update

Overview: Bryan Kohberger stands accused of fatally stabbing four University of Idaho students in 2022.

Key Points:

• Death Penalty Eligibility: The judge ruled that Kohberger remains eligible for the death penalty, dismissing defense arguments related to his Autism Spectrum Disorder (ASD) diagnosis, as no court has deemed ASD a disqualifying factor for capital punishment (20:34).

Notable Quote:

Alex Leray: "No court has ever found ASD to be death disqualifying diagnosis." (20:01)

Current Status: The ruling upholds the possibility of the death penalty pending a summer trial.

c. Anna Kanesevich Case

Overview: Anna Kanesevich, a Colombian-American woman, disappeared in Madrid in early 2024. Her husband, David Kanesevich, was arrested for her presumed murder.

Key Points:

• Evidence Against David: Security footage depicting a masked individual resembling David entering Anna's building and spray-painting cameras. Additionally, David was seen purchasing the exact brand of spray paint used in the incident (21:19).

• Recent Development: David Kanesevich was found dead in the Federal Detention Center in Miami, ruled a suicide. His death halts the upcoming trial, leaving Anna's fate unresolved.

  Alex Leray: "Her family... now we may never know where he put Anna's body." (22:34)

Notable Quote:

Anna's Family Statement: "The suicide of Anna's murderer closes a painful chapter in our lives." (22:34)

Current Status: With David Kanesevich's death, the case remains unresolved, and Anna's body has yet to be found.

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4. Courthouse Security with Sheriff James Brown

Overview: Sheriff James Brown discusses the complexities of maintaining security in courthouses, especially during high-profile and volatile trials.

Key Points:

• Security Measures: Deputies are strategically placed to respond to unpredictable behaviors. In high-risk cases, plainclothes officers are deployed to blend in and respond swiftly when necessary (24:10).

• Handling Protests: Temporary barricades and collaboration with other agencies ensure that protesters do not impede courthouse access while respecting the right to peaceful demonstration (26:50).

• Protecting Individuals: Protection is extended not only to judges and attorneys but also to defendants, who could be targets from disgruntled family members or others (25:20).

Notable Quote:

Sheriff James Brown: "You have to have a lot of plans and flexibility to be able to address any threat that comes up." (25:49)

Insights: Effective courthouse security requires a balance between visible protection and unobtrusive presence to maintain a safe and fair judicial environment.

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5. National Awareness and Upcoming Episodes

National Day of Awareness: Monday marks the National Day of Awareness for Missing and Murdered Indigenous Women and Girls. Andrea Canning highlights the alarming statistics and shares a report on Nevaeh Kingbird, a 15-year-old who disappeared in Bemidji, Minnesota, in 2021.

Upcoming Episodes:

• Sean Combs' Trial: A special episode delves into everything necessary to know before Combs faces trial on sex trafficking and racketeering charges.

• Murder in Minot: A two-hour episode explores the chilling murder of a popular college student in North Dakota, the ensuing fear in the community, and the relentless pursuit of truth by her family and friends.

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Final Note: Stay informed and engaged with the latest true-crime investigations by following Dateline NBC. For more detailed coverage, visit DatelinePremium.com for ad-free listening and exclusive content.

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Produced by Franny Kelly and Katie Ferguson. Associate Producers: Carson Cummins and Caroline Casey. Senior Producer: Liz Brown Kuriloff. Additional credits include Kim Flores, Gaynor Veronica Mazeka, Rick Kwan, Jesse McGinty, Bryson Barnes, Paul Ryan, and Liz Kula.

Transcript

[Andrea Canning]

Hey, good morning, everyone.

[Unnamed Producer]

Good morning.

[Andrea Canning]

You're listening in to dateline's morning meeting.

[Unnamed Producer]

Oh, is that a Kentucky Derby horse?

[Andrea Canning]

Yeah, it's called journalism.

[Unnamed Producer]

Oh, cool.

[Andrea Canning]

Our team of producers is swapping tips about cases in the news.

[Unnamed Producer]

This is fairly high profile, kind of splashy.

[Andrea Canning]

What was the evidence that got them to arrest him?

[Sue Simpson]

Now he says, that's my ex girlfriend. She did this.

[Andrea Canning]

Welcome to DATELINE True Crime Weekly. I'm Andrea Canning. It's May 1st and here's what's on our docket. In Ohio, a man is arrested for the decades old murder of his wife 24 years after her body was found at the bottom of a pond. How did a latex face mask and a bizarre arson plot lead investigators to his door?

[Unnamed Producer]

They learned that there were some really bizarre purchases a short time before the fire started.

[Andrea Canning]

In DATELINE roundup, we've got the latest on two blockbuster cases, the sex trafficking trial of music producer Sean Combs and the murder trial of Brian Kohberger. And an unexpected development in the case of the Florida businessman accused of murdering his estranged wife in Spain.

[Alex Leray]

Some pretty shocking news.

[Andrea Canning]

Plus, for the first time on the podcast, we're joined by a sheriff as we head into a summer of big trials. Sheriff James Brown tells us what it's like trying to keep people safe inside and outside the courtroom.

[Sue Simpson]

You just have to have a lot of plans and flexibility to be able to address any threat that comes up.

[Andrea Canning]

Before all that, we've got the latest from Dedham, Massachusetts, and the retrial of Karen Reid.

[Alex Leray]

All persons have any business before the honourable Beverly Kennedy, justice of the Norfolk Superior Court. Court is now open.

[Unnamed Producer]

You may be seated.

[Andrea Canning]

It's the start of another day in the second trial of the woman accused of drunkenly hitting her police officer boyfriend with her SUV and leaving him to die in a snowbank three years ago.

[Jen McCabe]

All right.

[Unnamed Producer]

Good morning, counsel. Good morning, Ms. Reed.

[Andrea Canning]

Good morning, jurors.

[Unnamed Producer]

Good morning.

[Sue Simpson]

Good morning.

[Andrea Canning]

Karen Reed denies the charges against her and claims that after she dropped John O'Keefe off at a party, he got beaten up by some of the people there, attacked by a dog and dragged onto the front lawn to die in a blizzard last summer. A jury deadlocked after five days of deliberation this week at Karen's retrial, the new prosecutor on the case painstakingly laid out a timeline of what he says happened the night John died. He introduced some fresh evidence and also brought back old witnesses. Here to tell us how that played out in the courtroom is DATELINE producer Sue Simpson who joins us now from Massachusetts to give us the latest. And, sue, did you win the lottery this week and get a seat in court?

[Karen Johnson]

I have not won the lottery yet, but there's always next week.

[Andrea Canning]

Last week, you and I talked about how Hank Brennan, the prosecutor, promised to take the jury step by step through the events using data from John's and also Karen's phones. So what story is he tell?

[Karen Johnson]

So, last week, Andrea, we heard investigators read text messages from Karen's phone establishing that John and Karen had a fight in the hours before John's death. Those text messages show that they made up. Two of them made up. But the prosecutor wanted jurors to know that their relationship was far from perfect. The prosecutor's next big witness on Monday morning was someone who could use John's phone to tell jurors what happened next in the timeline, the prosecution's version of events.

[Andrea Canning]

Of course, you are talking about digital forensic examiner Ian Wyther, and he's a witness we've been looking forward to because some of this is new testimony this time around.

[Karen Johnson]

Yes, yes. Prosecutor Brennan got Ian Whiffin to talk about the temperature of the battery in John's cell phone. Something I honestly knew nothing about until this retrial started.

[Andrea Canning]

Yeah, me neither. And that was a big point during opening statements. Why does cell phone temperature matter?

[Karen Johnson]

So the prosecution's theory is that John O'Keefe was lying grievously wounded in a blizzard. So you'd expect, if he had it with him, to get colder and colder and colder from the moment Karen drove away. Remember, this is the prosecution's pov. So apparently our phone batteries log their own temperature often, and that's to make sure they don't overheat. Now, investigators can use that data to figure out how cold or hot it is outside where the phone is. So when Whiffin was on the stand, the prosecution had him walk the jury through a graph he'd created that showed John's phone getting colder on the drive to the party, from the bar to the aftermath, and then getting steadily colder and colder. The prosecution argued this means that John's phone never went inside the house.

[Andrea Canning]

Karen's defense, of course, challenged Whiffin, this expert, on cross examination.

[Karen Johnson]

Right. Right. So we know that there was a blizzard, as I've said, on the night that John died. And as all our listeners know. But John Okeefe's phone stays somewhere between 50 and 40 degrees from 1:30am to to 6am Then it gets colder. Right. When Karen finds John and John's Phone is discovered under him.

[Andrea Canning]

Do you know what the temperature was in Canton January 29, 2022? I do not know. Don't you think that that would be.

[Sue Simpson]

An important piece of information? I didn't think it was.

[Andrea Canning]

So what does that say to the defense?

[Karen Johnson]

You know, it's really confusing. The whole picture isn't straightforward. And remember that this kind of data hasn't been used often. It hasn't been widely studied.

[Andrea Canning]

You know, you have to wonder if the jury how much weight they'll put into it.

[Karen Johnson]

You do.

[Andrea Canning]

So after that, expert Jen McCabe took the stand. She's one of the headliners in this trial. She was at the party that night.

[Karen Johnson]

Right. And to remind everyone, Jen McCabe is the friend of. Good friend of John O'Keeffe's. She was also with Karen the next morning when they discovered John's body. So this is the second time that I have seen Jen McCabe on the stand. And I did notice this time that she repeated again and again that there was a lot of screaming that morning. That Karen was screaming at phone calls, that Karen was screaming at her.

[Jen McCabe]

When they met, I was downstairs making coffee. I go to my front door and I open it and she's screaming, jen, Jen. She screamed that three times.

[Karen Johnson]

Jen also testified that Karen did not remember going to the after party house.

[Jen McCabe]

I had told her, karen, I saw you guys outside. And then she told me she didn't remember being there. And then she started saying, could I have hit him? Did I hit him? Just all over the place, like screaming my name. Screaming so many different things.

[Karen Johnson]

There were three women out looking for John O'Keefe early that morning in the dark, in the wind, in the awful snow. Carrie Roberts, another good friend of John's, Jen McKay, both in the front seat and then Karen in the back. Remember, Karen was the first to see the body. And she basically kicked her way out of the car. Cause the other women couldn't see this dark blob lying on the snow.

[Jen McCabe]

And all of a sudden, Karen's screaming from the back, there he is. Or something. Something to the effect of, there he is, let me out.

[Unnamed Producer]

Did you know what she was talking about?

[Jen McCabe]

I had no idea. Like she's batshit crazy.

[Unnamed Producer]

Then what happens?

[Jen McCabe]

Carrie got out. Then I got out of the car, walked around the back of the car.

[Karen Johnson]

And when Jen came around, she realized when she saw Carrie Roberts wiping the snow off John's face, she realized, that's my friend. That's my really good friend. And she got choked up on the stand for the first time.

[Unnamed Producer]

Is that the first moment you realize that that was John O'Keefe on the ground?

[Jen McCabe]

Yes, it was.

[Unnamed Producer]

What do you do?

[Jen McCabe]

I was frozen. I was shocked. I couldn't believe that was him just lying there.

[Andrea Canning]

That must have been very hard for Jen McCabe. Something that she, of course, was asked about by the prosecution was that infamous Google search has long to die in cold. That was meant to be how long to die in cold. According to the defense, Jen made the search overnight, hours before Karen even knew John was missing. So that goes to their theory of some kind of attack on John and then a cover up by people at the party. Sue, what did we hear about that this time around?

[Karen Johnson]

Right. So Jen McCabe testified that she went home from the after party, she was in bed and it was 2:27 in the morning, and she was just googling her daughter's sports teams and various things in that realm of her life.

[Unnamed Producer]

Peaceful night.

[Jen McCabe]

Yes.

[Unnamed Producer]

Did you go to sleep, Ms. McKay?

[Jen McCabe]

Yes.

[Karen Johnson]

So she said, of course, that she didn't type in hass long to die in the cold until about 6:23 in the morning at the scene of John's body when Karen asked her to please find out how long it takes for somebody to die in the cold.

[Andrea Canning]

Has there been an expert up to say that sometimes Google searches get the times wrong?

[Karen Johnson]

According to the prosecution and the expert from earlier, IAN WHIFFIN, Jan McCabe opened a browser window 2:27 in the morning. And that when Karen asked her at 6:23 in the morning find out how long it takes to die in the cold, she was using the same browser window.

[Andrea Canning]

I've always wondered about that. So, sue, do you feel like this trial is similar to last year or do you feel like it's taking on a different vibe?

[Karen Johnson]

This is a different trial, without question. And just here's an example. I got to court on Tuesday morning at 8am I wanted to see what the scene was outside because obviously I remembered it from the last trial. And I counted one by one, and there were only 19 protesters. And it even looked like, you know, some of their signs were kind of beaten up and they were weathered. Now, of course, things could change. The weather's gonna get better. But it was just a moment in time where I thought, yep, things have changed.

[Andrea Canning]

Sue, thank you so much. Maybe next week you'll win the lottery.

[Karen Johnson]

Thanks, Andrea. I sure hope so.

[Andrea Canning]

Coming up, before he was arrested for the murder of his estranged wife, an Ohio man was accused of an elaborate plot involving a Mission Impossible style face mask and Arson. On the evening of October 18, 2001, 25 year old Regina Rowe Hicks left her boyfriend's house in Huron County, Ohio, to pick up her son. She never arrived. A few days later, her body was found inside her car at the bottom of a pond. Her family was devastated. For years, they were tormented by unanswered questions. They were sure Regina had been murdered.

[Unnamed Producer]

It was like gripping a piece of.

[Alex Leray]

Your insides out, and you ain't gonna get that back.

[Andrea Canning]

Now, almost 24 years later, there has been an arrest in the case, and it's a name the family knows well. Regina's estranged husband, Paul Hick Hicks, has pleaded not guilty to charges of kidnapping and murder and is in jail awaiting trial. But that's not all. As it turns out, Paul Hicks is no stranger to law enforcement. In 2022, he pleaded no contest to charges relating to an elaborate arson scheme. Here to bring us up to speed is reporter Karen Johnson from our NBC affiliate WLWT in Cincinnati, who has been following this case since 2019. Karen, thank you for joining us.

[Unnamed Producer]

Yeah, thank you for having me, Andrea.

[Andrea Canning]

Yeah. So take us back, Karen, to when you first heard about Paul Hicks. This wasn't about murder initially. This was for a house fire.

[Unnamed Producer]

Yeah, it was in 2019 is when the name Paul Hicks first came on my radar. And it was after the Claremont County, Ohio, Sheriff's Office had released a video to us of this massive fire inside a house. But what caught my attention even more was what we saw before the fire. And we saw two people, male and a female, walking into the house. This woman had long, curly hair. They had gas cans. They started clearing the house, the electronics, the TVs. So it appeared maybe it was a robbery. Then they doused it and lit the house on fire.

[Andrea Canning]

So Hicks, who owned the house, actually reviewed the security footage with the police and said he recognized someone in that video.

[Unnamed Producer]

He said, that's my ex girlfriend. Looks just like her. The hair. And at first, investigators believed it was probably her. They questioned her.

[Andrea Canning]

But there was far more to this than that.

[Unnamed Producer]

Oh, so much more. The ex girlfriend is saying, absolutely not. You know, we broke up. I have no idea what you're talking about. I was not in his house. I had nothing to do with this.

[Andrea Canning]

Okay. So they believe her and they start digging into this and they come up with a completely different theory which, you know, now points the finger at Hicks himself.

[Unnamed Producer]

Yes, it took a lot of investigating, and it actually took a civil suit by Allstate. Their investigators did so much of the legwork on this, and Got subpoenas for cell phone records, talked to other associates of Paul Hicks, and they learned that there were some really bizarre purchases a short time before the fire started.

[Andrea Canning]

What were these bizarre purchases?

[Unnamed Producer]

One was a wig that looked identical to his ex girlfriend's hair. They also noticed a purchase from a company called that's my face.

[Andrea Canning]

Oh, my. Okay, what is that's my face?

[Unnamed Producer]

Well, that is a company where you could send in photos of someone and you can have a mask made to look like that person.

[Andrea Canning]

Okay, this is crazy. So they now believe that Paul Hicks had a special mask made to look like his ex girlfriend?

[Unnamed Producer]

Yes.

[Andrea Canning]

This is nuts. He also put things in a fireproof box.

[Unnamed Producer]

Yes, the video surveillance system. In months leading up to the arson, he had purchased a pretty elaborate surveillance system. And he had it, according to investigators, in a firebox so the cameras would record. And even if the cameras got destroyed, the data would still be collected. So that way he can show investigators, hey, I have video proof that two people walked in the house, and one appears to meet my ex girlfriend.

[Andrea Canning]

So did they think that Paul Hicks himself was wearing the mask then, of the ex girlfriend and the wig or someone else?

[Unnamed Producer]

They do not believe it was Paul Hicks. Investigators believe that he hired two people to go in, set the fire to his home, and that way he can frame his ex girlfriend. The reason why investigators say he tried to frame her was so he can get custody of their child and also for the insurance money.

[Andrea Canning]

How does it all end, then? With the fire? Something finally happens criminally.

[Unnamed Producer]

So 2015 is when the fire took place inside the house. He was indicted in 2019, and finally in 2022, when we thought this case would be going to trial, we learn there's been a plea deal and all of the felony charges, including the most serious aggravated arson, they were all dropped. And he pleaded no contest to a misdemeanor charge of insurance fraud. So he got no time, and he ended up leaving Clermont county and moving back to where he was from in Northern Ohio.

[Andrea Canning]

And we should be clear, Karen. Paul Hicks has never admitted to masterminding a plot to frame anyone. He's denied ever trying to get back at his ex girlfriend or hiring anyone to set that fire to his house.

[Unnamed Producer]

You're correct. He has never admitted to the allegations.

[Andrea Canning]

So it seemed like the dust had settled for Paul Hicks. But then last week, he gets indicted in a cold case murder that happened years before the fire.

[Unnamed Producer]

Yes, he was indicted on three counts of murder and one count of kidnapping in connection to the 2001 murder of his estranged wife Regina Hicks. He was never named a suspect in Regina's death up until he was indicted last week. But family had their suspicions, friends had their suspicions.

[Andrea Canning]

So according to the indictment, the authorities say that that Paul Hicks put her in the passenger seat of their car, then drove the car into the pond, but left the driver's side window rolled down so he could escape. What did prosecutors say was Hicks motive?

[Unnamed Producer]

I can't really speculate. But leading up to it, I have heard, you know, they had a rocky marriage. Towards the end they had kind of separated. She had a new boyfriend. So it wasn't the best relationship.

[Andrea Canning]

Why was he charged now? Is it possible that this, this fire, you know, renewed interest?

[Unnamed Producer]

I do believe so. I think it put more eyes on Paul Hicks. I know we gave the fire a lot of coverage. A lot of Ohio media organizations gave the fire a lot of coverage. So, you know, I do believe it pushed people more, I think, to open up about what they knew about Paul Hicks. I think more people started talking.

[Andrea Canning]

How has Hicks responded to these new charges?

[Unnamed Producer]

All we know at this point is Hicks did enter a plea of not guilty in court last week. But so far that's the only response that he has made is that not guilty plea.

[Andrea Canning]

His bond is set at 2 million and he has a pretrial hearing on May 19th. Karen, thank you so much for joining us. This is a fascinating case.

[Unnamed Producer]

Thank you.

[Andrea Canning]

Up next, it's time for DATELINE roundup. We've got updates from the courtroom on the upcoming trials of Sean Combs and Bryan Kohberger. Plus Sheriff James Brown on keeping courtrooms safe for everyone. Welcome back to the show. Joining me for this week's roundup is DATELINE associate producer Alex Leray. Alex, welcome back to the podcast.

[Alex Leray]

Hi. Glad to be back.

[Andrea Canning]

So first up, we have news of a potentially game changing pretrial ruling in the federal sex trafficking case against music mogul Sean Diddy Combs. It's about a video that's been at the center of this story long before criminal charges were even brought against Combs. Alex, remind us what the video is and what happened with that. It's certainly a lot of people have seen it at this point.

[Alex Leray]

Yes. So this is a security video that was broadcast by CNN in May of last year. So four months before Combs arrest, it allegedly shows him assaulting his former girlfriend Cassie in a hotel hallway in 2016. Prosecutors referred to the video in their indictment and want to show it to the jury as a part of their criminal case against him. The defense asked the judge to throw the video out, arguing the video is wholly inaccurate, having been altered, manipulated, sped up, and edited to be out of sequence. All claims that CNN has denied. And on Friday, the federal judge overseeing the case ruled that the video can be shown in court.

[Andrea Canning]

And there have been some other big rulings recently which have gone against the defense.

[Alex Leray]

Yeah. So the judge agreed to grant anonymity to alleged victims 2, 3, and 4 in the indictment. And he also refused to grant a delay in the trial, which the defense had asked for. But there was a partial victory for Combs attorneys. They had asked the judge to throw out the testimony of a prosecution witness by the name of Dawn Hughes. She's a clinical and forensic psychologist with expertise in sexual abuse.

[Andrea Canning]

And Alex, the judge didn't throw out her testimony completely, but he did limit it, right?

[Alex Leray]

Yeah. So she will be allowed to testify about why sexual assault victims might delay disclosing their abuse and stay in relationships that are abusive. But she won't be able to testify about coercive control or how perpetrators act to control their victims.

[Andrea Canning]

And Alex Combs has, of course, pleaded not guilty to the five charges against him. And at this latest hearing, the prosecutor revealed the government offered him a plea deal.

[Alex Leray]

We don't know any details of the deal that was offered, but we know that Combs rejected it.

[Andrea Canning]

Okay. The trial is coming up very soon. Jury selection starts on Monday, May 5th. And we will be paying very close attention. For our next story, we are off to Idaho for an update on the case of Brian Coburger, the man accused of fatally stabbing four University of Idaho students in 2022. Alex, what's new there?

[Alex Leray]

So the big news is that the judge has finally weighed in on whether Bryan Kohlberger could face the death penalty if convicted at his trial this summer. And it looks like the answer is yes. Earlier this week, the judge denied a defense motion to take the death penalty off the table because of a legal technicality. And this was after he ruled last week against another defense motion which said that Kohlberger shouldn't face a death penalty because of his diagnosis of autism Spectrum disorder, or asd. In that ruling, the judge pointed out that no court has ever found ASD to be death disqualifying diagnosis.

[Andrea Canning]

Thanks for that update. For our final story, there is news in a case that, Alex, you've previously talked about on the podcast.

[Alex Leray]

Yeah. So this is the case of Anna Kanesevich, the Colombian American woman from South Florida who disappeared in Madrid in early 2024. According to prosecutors, she had moved to Spain to start a New life after separating from her husband, businessman David Kanesevich, and he was arrested for her murder last year. Anna's body has never been found, and David denied any involvement in her death.

[Andrea Canning]

Remind us how David was allegedly tied to this case.

[Alex Leray]

Sure. So, federal investigators said David kidnapped Anna from her apartment and killed her. Their security camera video of a masked man entering Anna's building around the time of her disappearance and spray painting the security cameras in the lobby of the apartment building. Authorities say that the man looked a lot like David and also that David was seen on camera at a nearby hardware store buying that exact brand of black spray paint.

[Andrea Canning]

So David's arrest was almost a year ago. What is the latest now?

[Alex Leray]

So, in some pretty shocking news, David Kanesevich was found dead on Monday morning at the Federal. Yeah, at the Federal Detention center in Miami, where he was awaiting trial. That was supposed to start in June. His defense attorney confirmed that he died by suicide and asked for a thorough investigation.

[Andrea Canning]

Mm. My goodness. How has Anna's family responded to this news?

[Alex Leray]

Yeah, so I spoke to Sana, her best friend. You know, she's. She's definitely shocked and still processing the whole thing. She was getting ready for trial. She was planning on being there. Her family has also released a statement that said the suicide of Anna's murderer closes a painful chapter in our lives. Previously filled with the dread that he might not face justice, now we may never know where he put Anna's body.

[Andrea Canning]

Oh, wow. Alex, thank you for that and for all these updates. We appreciate it.

[Alex Leray]

Thank you, Andrea.

[Andrea Canning]

Courthouse security has come up a lot on the podcast recently. Think about the buffer zone set up around the courthouse for Karen Reid's latest trial. Or the stun belt Lori Valo Daybell wore under her clothes at her Arizona trial. But tensions run high in all kinds of courtrooms. In Wisconsin earlier this month, a convicted killer was tackled to the ground by bailiffs after she lunged at her attorney. In California last year, a defendant stabbed his own attorney with a pen. And who can forget the judge in Las Vegas that was attacked by a defendant. Reddin flew through the air, tackling her, sparking this bloody brawl that sent one corner court martial to the hospital. Our next guest, Sheriff James Brown, is the chair of the National Sheriff's Association Court Services Committee. It's his job to help law enforcement come up with the best practices for security. Hi, Sheriff Brown.

[Sue Simpson]

Good afternoon.

[Andrea Canning]

So I'm sure you've seen all those examples we just gave. Very dramatic.

[Sue Simpson]

Yes.

[Andrea Canning]

The Vegas judge. I mean, that one was crazy. Where he just lunges at her and then the flagpole falls down and. Oh, that was scary.

[Sue Simpson]

Yeah. One of the things that is very important with courthouse security is placement of the deputies that when a defendant or someone is sitting beside their attorney, you're going to have to react to whatever they do.

[Andrea Canning]

Yeah. I actually covered a trial where a bailiff stepped on the defendant's foot and he went crazy. So, I mean, it's just you never know what is going to happen in a courtroom. Sheriff, who is responsible for keeping courthouses and courtrooms safe?

[Sue Simpson]

So those are the sheriff's offices, but each state is different. It's really one of the things that the sheriff's offices are known for is providing courthouse security.

[Andrea Canning]

So what is everyone titled in a quorum as a bailiff?

[Sue Simpson]

Well, it depends. Mostly they're known as bailiffs. They're still deputies. And the bailiffs will have different responsibilities. They have to keep the judge safe, the attorney safe, the person charged safe, victims, witnesses.

[Andrea Canning]

You know, we don't really think as much about keeping the defendant safe, but absolutely, the defendant could be a target from an angry family member.

[Sue Simpson]

Yes. So one of the things we do in those situations is we provide a security buffer where it's a little more difficult for someone to get to that defendant. And you just, you kind of hear different things that are being said out in the community. So you have an idea of, you know, if someone's saying they're waiting to get to court because they're going to do something. So you just have to have a lot of plans and flexibility to be able to address any threat that comes up.

[Andrea Canning]

Yeah. Because it's really the whole picture. Right. It's not just what's happening in that courtroom.

[Sue Simpson]

Right. But one of the things that we run into of jury trials is you don't want to have what some people would consider an overbearing presence of deputies. Because if you're a jury, you're sitting there saying, oh, yeah, something is really going on here. One of the things that we do just to prevent that, if we have, you know, high risk, high profile cases, we'll actually have some people in plain clothes. No way that'll sit in there. And so if something happens, you know, they can quickly just show their ID and help the bailiffs in uniform.

[Andrea Canning]

Oh, my gosh. I did not know this. They're like the air marshals of court.

[Sue Simpson]

Yeah.

[Andrea Canning]

What about outside of the courthouse? You know, this is where we saw Karen Reid. So many supporters and also people, you know, who aren't happy with her either that had to have a real plan because I've been to that courthouse and it is, it's tiny and there's not a lot of room out in the front of the courthouse and the road is right there. I mean, that can be a real.

[Sue Simpson]

Problem when we've had high profile cases. We've been able to have temporary barricades placed that would help, you know, prevent vehicles from getting to people. But the main thing is people have the right to be out there and protest the case one side or the other. So as long as people can still get in and out. We also work with other agencies. You'll reach out to a neighboring agency or the state police and they'll assist.

[Andrea Canning]

Yeah. And some people coming out of court may not wanna talk to the media or be harassed by people.

[Sue Simpson]

Yeah. There have been times where we've had to actually walk with people to their vehicles.

[Andrea Canning]

Well, Sheriff Brown, we thank you so much for all you do to keep people safe. Very, very important work. Thank you for coming on the podcast. We appreciate it.

[Sue Simpson]

You're welcome. And thanks for having me.

[Andrea Canning]

That's it for this episode of DATELINE True Crime Weekly. But one more thing before we go. Monday is the national day of awareness for missing and murdered indigenous women and girls. According to the National Institute of Justice, 4 out of 5American Indian and Alaska Native women have experienced violence in their lifetimes. I've covered several cases of young women who have gone missing from their communities or been murdered, including 15 year old Nevaeh Kingbird, who disappeared into the snow in Bemidji, Minnesota in 2021. We've included a link to my report about Nevaeh from our Missing in America series in the description of this episode. Take a listen to that and maybe one of you knows something about her case. Next week on DATELINE True Crime Weekly, we've got a special episode for you with everything you need to know ahead of Sean Combs's trial on sex trafficking and racketeering charges. And coming up this Friday on dateline, don't miss Blaine's all new two hour episode after a popular college student was found stabbed to death in her bedroom. Fear gripped a North Dakota town. Rumors did, too. But her family and friends vowed to find the truth.

[Unnamed Producer]

It was scary. I mean, because at that time, anybody and everybody is a suspect to me.

[Andrea Canning]

Watch Murder in Minot at 9, 8 Central. Thanks for listening. DATELINE True Crime Weekly is produced by Franny Kelly and Katie Ferguson. Our associate producers are Carson Cummins and Caroline Casey. Our senior producer is Liz Brown Kuriloff production and fact checking helped by Kim Flores, Gaynor. Veronica Mazeka is our digital producer. Rick Kwan is our sound designer. Original Music by Jesse McGinty. Bryson Barnes is head of audio production. Paul Ryan is executive producer and Liz Kula, senior executive producer of Dateline. Bye, everybody.