Talking Dateline: Breaking Point

Summary

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Dateline NBC: Talking Dateline — “Breaking Point”

Original Air Date: May 13, 2026
Host: Andrea Canning
Guest: Josh Mankiewicz

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Episode Overview

This episode of Talking Dateline dives behind the scenes of the Dateline NBC investigation “Breaking Point,” reported by Josh Mankiewicz. The episode unpacks the murder of Morgan Fox, a 29-year-old manager at a North Canton, Ohio FedEx facility, and the intense police investigation that led to the conviction of her coworker, Jason McDermott. Through in-depth conversation, Canning and Mankiewicz discuss workplace dynamics, red flags of obsession and stalking, investigative techniques, the ripple effects on the victim’s family, and answer questions from Dateline viewers.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Summary of the Case and Workplace Dynamics

• Case recap:

  • Morgan Fox, a diligent 29-year-old FedEx night-shift manager in North Canton, Ohio, was fatally shot as she got into her car for work in late 2020.
  • The murder wasn’t a robbery—nothing was stolen. It was quickly suspected to be a targeted killing linked to her workplace.
  • The FedEx facility environment was, as Mankiewicz describes, “likened to a frat house, to a boys club, a place where women felt uncomfortable” (03:07).
  • Morgan’s troubles intensified after her promotion, prompting subtle harassment and bullying, such as co-workers hiding her chair and clipboard—“making her life just a little bit more difficult” (03:07).

• Workplace personalities:

  • Canning notes (04:16) the unpredictable mix of human personalities in work environments:
    • “You put strangers into a workplace together...And there’s all kinds of things that happen at work.”
  • Mankiewicz adds:
    • “You put a bunch of people in, you add some pressure ... they’re gonna rate each other, they’re gonna date each other, they’re gonna hate each other. That is sort of human nature” (04:39).

2. Early Suspects and Police Investigation

• Initial focus on boyfriend:

  • Police first looked at Morgan’s boyfriend, Jason Skarnackia, citing his allegedly unemotional 911 call.
  • Canning expresses disagreement, thinking shock, not guilt, explained his tone (06:14):
    • “To me, he sort of sounded like somebody in shock.”
  • Mankiewicz agrees:
    • “I think you’re right. I think he was just stunned” (06:39).

• The real killer: Jason McDermott

  • Initially dismissed by police as “this ... little rabbity guy who owns a cat,” McDermott was not an obvious suspect (07:18).
  • Notably, the sheriff’s office assumed:
    • “Single guys with cats don’t commit murder” (07:50).

• Red flags and escalation:

  • McDermott had a pattern of invasive behavior—searching through Morgan’s phone, taking photos without consent, obsessive texting, and ultimately stalking.
  • Mankiewicz on confronting the killer:
    • “...you have, like, I don’t know, like, more than a hundred photos of her in your phone ... that’s obsession. That’s what that is” (10:22).

3. The Tipping Point and Methodical Plannning

• Broken boundaries:

  • Sienna, another coworker, was another object of McDermott’s attention. When she stopped accepting rides from him, it seemed to trigger intense resentment (11:00).
  • “When she started getting rides from somebody else, he was very unhappy.” (11:23)

• Premeditation:

  • McDermott set an alarm earlier than his normal time, left his phone at home to manufacture an alibi, and relied on the idea that a phone’s location equals a person’s location (12:05).
  • “If his car had not been tagged by that traffic camera, he’d be walking around today.” (12:59)

4. Interview with Jason McDermott from Prison

• McDermott’s admissions:

  • Mankiewicz paints McDermott’s behavior as creepy and persistent, confronting him in prison (15:03):
    • Mankiewicz: “So you’re unjustly accused and convicted.”
    • McDermott: “Correct...Like, like, saving the pictures ... I can see how that is creepy...and I shouldn’t have been doing it.”
    • Mankiewicz: “Creepy is a good word.”
    • McDermott: “It is, yes ... That’s behavior I shouldn’t have been doing.”

• Defensiveness and Rationalization:

  • McDermott minimizes his wrongdoings, focusing on trivial misdeeds (looking at Morgan’s phone) and overlooking the breadth of his stalking (15:36):
    • “The thing he thinks is wrong is I should have given her phone back sooner.” (15:36)

• The rare opportunity of the Dateline interview:

  • Mankiewicz notes (17:05) that this is often the only real cross-examination these convicted killers face, as most don’t testify at trial:
    • “This is frequently the only time that they get cross examined by anybody.”

5. The Family Impact: Heartbreaking Courtroom Moment

• Victim’s daughter’s impact statement:

  • Andrea Canning highlights the devastating testimony of Morgan’s daughter, Amelia, in court (19:10):
    • Amelia: “I thought monsters weren’t real. But you proved me wrong. You hurt so many people. You hurt me and the people I love. You ruined your own life because of how much of a bad person you are.”
  • Mankiewicz adds:
    • “[Jason] starts trying to look at her...One of the court officers deliberately positions himself right in between.” (19:54)
  • Canning reflects as a mother:
    • “As the mom of five daughters, I just really did not enjoy listening to that.” (18:41)

• Morgan’s legacy:

  • The family commemorates Morgan by encouraging acts of kindness on the 22nd of each month—her birth date.
    • “...you do something nice, you know, whether it’s buy someone dinner...Do something nice.” (21:00)

6. Social Media Q&A

• Tire track evidence:

  • Why wasn’t the tire track on the lawn matched to McDermott’s car?
    • Mankiewicz: “The answer is yes, if you could have matched those tires and those tracks to one another...But ... the tire tracks ... were consistent, but not absolutely his car. This was a circumstantial case.” (23:27)

• Overlapping victims:

  • Morgan and Sienna (another victim of stalking) did overlap at FedEx, but weren’t close friends (24:52).

• "Do a Morgan" tribute:

  • Multiple listeners express they’ll honor Morgan monthly by performing kindness.
    • Mankiewicz: “It’s. It’s great to make your mission doing something for somebody else once in a while.” (25:17)

• Heartbreaking timing:

  • The episode’s release ahead of Mother’s Day intensified listeners' sorrow for Amelia (25:55).

• Light-hearted ending:

  • The episode closes with Knicks basketball banter, a rare lighter moment after a heavy story (26:50).

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On workplace culture:
  • "The atmosphere at that facility was likened to a frat house, to a boys club, a place where women felt uncomfortable." — Josh Mankiewicz (03:07)
• Explaining workplace dynamics:
  • "You put a bunch of people in, you add some pressure ... they're gonna rate each other, they're gonna date each other, they're gonna hate each other. That's ... human nature." — Josh Mankiewicz (04:39)
• On the killer’s mistaken image:
  • "Single guys with cats don't commit murder." — Josh Mankiewicz (07:50)
• On obsessive behavior:
  • "You have ... more than a hundred photos of her in your phone. ... That's obsession." — Josh Mankiewicz (10:22)
• On the limits of digital alibis:
  • "...if his car had not been tagged by that traffic camera, he'd be walking around today." — Josh Mankiewicz (12:59)
• On cross-examination during Dateline interviews:
  • "This is frequently the only time that they get cross examined by anybody." — Josh Mankiewicz (17:05)
• Amelia’s victim impact statement:
  • "I thought monsters weren't real. But you proved me wrong." — Amelia, Morgan Fox's daughter (19:10)
• On the power of kindness:
  • "It's great to make your mission doing something for somebody else once in a while." — Josh Mankiewicz (25:17)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• Case Summary & FedEx Workplace Culture: 01:40–04:16
• Initial Suspect Theories & 911 Call: 06:14–07:42
• Stalking Patterns & McDermott’s Escalation: 09:14–13:13
• Digital Evidence & Tracking: 12:05–13:13
• Prison Interview with Jason McDermott: 15:03–17:48
• Victim Impact & Amelia’s Statement: 18:41–21:00
• Audience Q&A: 23:06–26:50

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Conclusion

This “Talking Dateline” episode offers a rich, candid look at the reporting behind “Breaking Point,” including analysis of workplace hostility, escalation of obsession, investigative hurdles, and the lasting pain for the victim’s loved ones. Through their trademark mix of gravity and humanity, Andrea Canning and Josh Mankiewicz dissect the tragic case, share insights on the true-crime reporting process, and end on a note encouraging kindness in honor of Morgan Fox’s memory.

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Transcript

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[Andrea Canning]

Hey everyone, it's Andrea Canning. And today we are talking Dateline, and we're talking about Josh's episode, Breaking Point. So, Josh Mankiewicz. Hello.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

Hello.

[Andrea Canning]

If you haven't watched the episode yet, you can find it right below this one or stream it now on Peacock. So go there and do that and when you come back, we'll have more from Josh's interview with the man convicted of killing Morgan Fox. And later, we'll answer some of your questions from social media. Media. Okay, Josh, before we dive into this episode, just give us a quick summary of this episode.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

Sure. This happened back in late 2020 in in North Canton, Ohio. And, you know, a young woman did not show up for her shift at a FedEx warehouse sorting facility, which was unlike her. She was 29 years old, name was Morgan Fox. She got up in the middle of the night to go to work. She worked the early shift and she'd been shot dead as she was getting into her car in the driveway. Now, nothing was stolen. This wasn't a robbery. This was very clearly an attempt to stalk and kill her. And so the Star County Sheriff's office began investigating whether she had any enemies. And this is the story of that investigation and sort of how it played out and how it got to the end.

[Andrea Canning]

Coincidentally, right before I started watching your episode yesterday, I was driving to the Memphis airport and I see FedEx plane after FedEx plane after FedEx plane. And I'm like, I looked it up. I didn't even realize Memphis is the hub, the FedEx hub, even though your. Your stories in Ohio. But it was kind of strange, given the fact that I was just about to watch your story, when I was just inundated with FedEx airplanes.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

Right. Yeah. I mean, it's a. You know, they've got those sorting facilities all over the country, and it's. You know, this is not a. We have no information that whatever this issue was at the North Canton facility, that it was anything more than particular to that facility. But the. The atmosphere at that facility was likened to a frat house, to a boys club, a place where women felt uncomfortable. And sort of a lot of Morgan Fox's problems began when she got promoted from the line to manager. And there was a sort of a campaign of. You know, I don't know whether you'd call it harassment or bullying or. But it was a. It was a campaign of making her life just a little bit more difficult. I mean, not only were there a couple of guys there hitting on her. I'm not talking about that, but, like, they would take her chair and hide it. You know, her. Her. Her workstation chair. That's not good. You know, they. They would take her clipboard, which, you know, she needed to. To do her job.

[Andrea Canning]

So, you know, Josh, right out of the gate, I loved how you set up the episode. You put strangers into a workplace together. Right. And there's all kinds of things that happen at work. Right. Like, people are imperfect, and when you put different personalities together.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

Yeah.

[Andrea Canning]

I mean, stuff is gonna happen. For better or worse, stuff's gonna happen.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

You put a bunch of people in, you add some pressure. You have everybody working together, you know, on what's supposed to be a common goal, and they're gonna rate each other, they're gonna date each other, they're gonna hate each other. That's. That is sort of human nature that some of that's gonna happen.

[Andrea Canning]

I will just say to you, Josh, on a. On a side note, you know, working at Dateline, you and Keith. I've been here almost, what, like 14 years now. You and Keith welcomed me with open arms, and you really are the best colleagues. So we're. We're very lucky that we work in an environment at Dateline that is. Is really just a wonderful place to be.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

Yeah. And that's always been. You know, I've been in this business more than 50 years now, and. Yeah.

[Andrea Canning]

Really?

[Josh Mankiewicz]

Yeah, it's 50.

[Andrea Canning]

You don't look at Josh.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

I know. Well, it's 50 Earth years. Not the kind of. Yeah. Not the way other people measure them, you know, and, you know, over that time, Dateline is without question the best place I've worked in terms of the harmony, you know, among the staff members. But I'm glad that. I'm glad that you said that, and thank you. See, it's funny, I just remember Keith stealing your chair and clipboard. But. Okay, maybe that. Maybe I'm remembering wrong.

[Andrea Canning]

Yeah. That did not happen, Mr. Funny Guy. So, you know, one of the things that was said about Jason, the boyfriend. Right. About Morgan's boyfriend, was that he didn't sound right or he didn't sound frantic enough or whatever. I. It's funny, because I kind of disagree. To me, he sort of sounded like somebody in shock.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

Right. Well, I think we now know that's exactly what he was. When the sheriff's office first listened to that 911 call, they thought. And, you know, I mean, this is true. 911 calls get evaluated just like homicide investigators, always very judgmental of what that first 911 call sounds like. Does it sound right? Does it sound forced? Is it staged? And so they were. They were looking at that pretty closely, and they thought Jason Skarnackia sounded too flat. But, yeah, I think you're right. I think he was just stunned.

[Andrea Canning]

Yeah. And who wouldn't be right, you know? Yeah.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

I mean. And, you know, not only that, not only did. Did the sheriff's office listen to that 91 1-call and think the boyfriend doesn't sound frantic enough, they also, on their first interview with Jason McDermott, thought, this is this, like, little rabbity guy who owns a cat. This is not our murderer. And they were wrong both ways.

[Andrea Canning]

Right. And I actually quoted you here in my notes. Single guys with cats don't commit murder.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

Right. I mean, that's. That. That's certainly what I would say with

[Andrea Canning]

my cat on my lap.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

Well, first of all, you're not a single guy. You know, I'm not sure that that theory. I'm not sure you disprove that theory. But, you know, that wasn't my theory. That was the Star County Sheriff's office that thought, this guy. This guy is not a killer.

[Andrea Canning]

Do you like cats, Josh?

[Josh Mankiewicz]

I'm a dog person. I say that having no pets, when I retire, I'm going to get a dog, but until then, I travel too much, and I don't think. I don't think that would be fair to the dog. How many pets do you guys have?

[Andrea Canning]

We have a dog and three cats.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

Yeah.

[Andrea Canning]

Yeah. And since we do these from home, my cat sits on my lap, usually during the. The podcast. So she just jumped down, though you might have heard her meowing earlier. I don't know.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

There's a. There was a great. There was a great documentary about the 1986 Mets in which they interviewed Keith Hernandez. It. One of the stars of the team, you know, in present day. And he had his cat with him, like, during the entire documentary. The cat's, like, climbing all over him, and it's all over the set. It's in between the lens and him. It was great. It was like an extra character.

[Andrea Canning]

Speaking of Jason.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

Yes, Jason. Yes.

[Andrea Canning]

The killer Jason. Jason is so creepy. The things that he did. Looking through her phone, taking, you know, through Morgan's phone, taking videos of Morgan.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

Yes. And then that whole episode with Sienna, also creepy. All of it super creepy. And when I spoke with Jason, you know, one of the things I said to him, you know, and he's been locked up for years now, I said, you know, are you. Were you obsessed with Morgan Fox? No. No, no, no.

[Andrea Canning]

Okay, well, no.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

Hold on one sec. Sorry.

[Andrea Canning]

Phone's ringing.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

Oh, sorry.

[Andrea Canning]

I always like to ask you, who calls? Because you seem to get calls in the middle of talking. Dateline. Who was it?

[Josh Mankiewicz]

It's. It's Amazon. Be good. If it were FedEx, that would be. That's good. But it's probably not.

[Andrea Canning]

Josh gets a package in the middle of a podcast about a package company. Delivery company. All right, so Jason. Creepy.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

One of the things I said, one of the things I asked Jason was whether he was obsessed with Morgan. He's like, no, no, no, no. Okay, well, you have, like, I don't know, like, more than a hundred photos of her in your phone. Right. This is not your girlfriend, but your phone is packed with photos, and you were at least a party to sort of searching through her phone when she didn't have it. And you've contacted her on text a zillion times. That's obsession. That's what that is. And that's one of the reasons why Sienna complained. That. It's one of the reasons why Morgan complained.

[Andrea Canning]

Yeah. Well, and Sienna. What really struck me was the moment that she decided to stop getting rides with him to work was really the tipping point for him.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

Yeah. I mean, you know, she. She loses her license, he sort of gallantly steps in, which is kind of his M.O.

[Andrea Canning]

right, his thing.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

I'm gonna. I'm gonna be the. The. The heroic guy here, and he Starts giving her rides, and at one point, she sort of feels guilty about the fact that he's going out. And. And she said, sienna says, I made it very clear to him, we are friends. I am giving you gas money. Nothing. El, leave her alone. And when she started getting rides from somebody else, he was very unhappy.

[Andrea Canning]

Yeah, he seems like a hothead. Like, if he doesn't get what he wants, then, you know, I guess the title of the show, right. Breaking Point, like, he finally. He finally snapped. I mean, this is the first time that I've ever heard of a killer setting an alarm to go carry out the killing.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

The analysis of his phone showed that he'd set his alarm earlier than he normally did. But, you know, this is a. This is a trend that we're, I think, increasingly gonna see because I think the criminals of this world have figured out that, you know, the equation of, like, where you are, where your phone is, law enforcement kind of also assumes you are. And, you know, Jason left his phone at home, went out, committed a murder, and came home. And he did this in the middle of the night at a time when most people's phones would be at their house and not being used because they would be asleep. So that gave him a very plausible alibi and a window to commit the crime in. And. And if his car had not been tagged by that. That traffic camera, he'd be walking around today.

[Andrea Canning]

Yeah, I'm working on a story right now, too, with a traffic camera or a tag reader. You know, it's hard to get away with things these days, isn't it?

[Josh Mankiewicz]

It's never been harder. I mean, in this case. I mean, that traffic camera made all the difference.

[Andrea Canning]

Yeah. No, it's so true. When we come back, we'll hear more from Josh's interview with the man at the center of this case, Morgan's killer, Jason McDermott.

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[Josh Mankiewicz]

the exit, turn right into the drive thru. Nope, I'm making dinner tonight.

[Andrea Canning]

You don't have time.

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[Andrea Canning]

I'll just get a salad and fries.

[Jason McDermott]

No, just the salad.

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But salad cancels Fries.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

Salad only.

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[Andrea Canning]

Salad, fries.

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[Josh Mankiewicz]

Salad?

[Jason McDermott]

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[Andrea Canning]

Josh, your interview with Jason in prison. You bring up the phone, and you said in the show he was looking at Morgan's phone like it was a Sports Illustrated swimsuit issue. We have some more. We have some sound about that.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

Right. So you're unjustly accused and convicted.

[Jason McDermott]

Correct. Like, I'm not gonna say, like, any of my behavior was all appropriate. I had inappropriate behavior at times, for sure. I will never deny that. But me, inappropriate behavior? Like. Like. Like you like the saving the pictures.

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Yes.

[Jason McDermott]

I can see how that is creepy and everything like that. And I shouldn't have been doing it.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

Creepy is a good word.

[Jason McDermott]

It is, yes. And I like Sid having time to reflect on that. Yes. I 100 realize, like, man, that's behavior I shouldn't have been doing. I should not have. Just because we're friends on social media doesn't mean I should have been saving, like, the pictures that she sent me and stuff.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

Yeah, I mean, you know, his whole. I know his whole message is the only thing I did wrong was look at her phone and then lie about having looked at her phone. Like, like, you know, like the nearly stalking, like, behavior of making himself omnipresent for both Morgan and Sienna and, like, not picking up any message that these women wanted to be left alone to do their job. He didn't get that. Taking pictures of her without her consent. Like, the thing he thinks is wrong is I should have given her phone back sooner.

[Andrea Canning]

No, Jason. Yeah, yeah, wrong answer. And Josh, you cut to the chase with him. You said, let me guess, this is all a big mistake, which you knew you knew what he was saying.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

I knew he was going to say. Well, you know the interesting thing? You know, this is one of the advantages of this job that you and I have, which is frequently when you're interviewing these guys, there's a point where they stop Answering questions from police like they got a lawyer or they just clammed up. Right. Or in some cases they don't talk at all. And then they don't testify at trial because they don't want to face cross examination of whatever story it is that they're telling. And so this Dateline interview that they do, when, when these guys do it, this is frequently the only time that they get cross examined by anybody.

[Andrea Canning]

I was totally thinking that as I was watching your interview. Yes.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

Yeah. I mean, this is a big responsibility for, for all of us at Dateline because this is frequently the only time that that person is going to get asked any toug it doesn't happen on the stand. And you know, sometimes they'll do one or two or one and a half police interviews, kind of like he did.

[Andrea Canning]

Yes, yes.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

You know, and then they're, they're not talking anymore.

[Andrea Canning]

They're not talking. Yeah, I know. It is really important for us and the families. They, they, they pay such close attention to these interviews. And a lot of them are, you know, their first instinct is, you're not talking to him or her, are you? You know, they don't, they don't want you to. And then they realize, you know what? We will ask the tough questions.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

We're actually telling the entire story. Right. And so we always try to talk to everybody involved, but that doesn't mean that we're not going to ask this guy unpleasant questions, whoever he is, whether it's Jason or somebody else. And we, and we do, we're always going to challenge them on their story. And sometimes families really want that, as you, as you point out.

[Andrea Canning]

Yeah. You know, FedEx at the end, you know, we asked FedEx, you, your team on this story asked FedEx for a statement. And I thought to myself, okay, they didn't really say too much other than, you know, their, their thoughts or prayers or hearts or whatever it was go to the family. But I'm thinking, you know, what I really wanted to hear was we've taken a really hard look at our, you know, guidelines for employees or something. It just felt, and maybe they are doing that, but it would have been nice to hear it publicly.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

They just said, our, our, our thoughts are with the family and, and friends of Morgan Fox.

[Andrea Canning]

Yeah. And Amelia Morgan's daughter. Her victim impact statement. That was really one of the most heartbreaking victim impact statements. To think of that poor little girl having to be in court in front of the man who killed her mom. Assuming was she in court or was it a recorded statement? I Don't. I don't know. I was assuming she was there. She was there since we couldn't see her, but, I mean, my goodness, as the mom of five daughters, I just really did not enjoy listening to that.

[Amelia Morgan's Daughter]

I thought monsters weren't real. But you proved me wrong. You hurt so many people. You hurt me and the people I love. You ruined your own life because of how much of a bad person you are.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

It was heartbreaking. No, no, she was there, and he's trying. He. You know, he knew her because he'd spent so much time around Morgan. He'd met that little girl. And so at one point during the statement, like, he's everybody else's victim impact statement. He's looking straight ahead. Right. He's not. He's. He's not. They're not making an impact. But she starts talking, and he starts trying to look at her. Right. Turning around and look at her. One of the court officers deliberately positions himself right in between.

[Andrea Canning]

I love that.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

Right. Like Jason and Amelia. So that he can't see her, and she won't be intimidated or frightened by

[Andrea Canning]

that because she called him a monster. Right. She said, he's a monster, and now she's having to face monster in court.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

Yep.

[Andrea Canning]

Like, just. Just absolutely heartbreaking.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

What I. What I hope is that that courageous act will one day be something that she'll look back on and think, I, you know, I did it right. I. I stuck up for my mom.

[Andrea Canning]

Yeah. I mean, it will shape her, you know, in some way, and I hope for good that she will be a strong, you know, girl who grows up to be a strong woman. Because that statement was strong. She was not. That little girl was not weak, you know, and you could hear it in her voice.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

Well, and that's Morgan Fox, too. And Morgan Fox, like, never backed down from a fight. That's what everybody said.

[Andrea Canning]

Always protecting.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

I mean, that attitude by Emilia, that is straight from her mom, which is, I'm not afraid of you, and I'm gonna say my truth.

[Andrea Canning]

And, you know, Amelia's surrounded by really good people, at least it seems, because when they started talking about a Morgan, you know, this idea that on the 22nd of every month, which is the birth date of Morgan, that you do something nice, you know, whether it's, you know, buy someone dinner or pay someone a compliment or do something nice for you. Do something nice. After the break, we will answer some of your questions from social media.

[Social Media Commenter]

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[Andrea Canning]

Now, Josh, we are going to answer some questions and hear your comments from social media. You ready?

[Josh Mankiewicz]

I'm ready.

[Andrea Canning]

Okay, let's start with Marcia Elford. Marcia says, why did the police not match the tire tracks on her lawn to the tires on Jason's car? Wouldn't that have moved it from circumstantial evidence to factual?

[Josh Mankiewicz]

The answer is yes, if you could have matched those tires and those tracks to one another to the exclusion of all other cars. But just as with the gun, which maybe came from Jason's parents house, the tire tracks on the car were consistent, but not absolutely his car. This was a circumstantial case.

[Andrea Canning]

And a lot of the cases we cover are largely circumstantial, sometimes all circumstantial. And you know, we see convictions all the time with circumstantial cases. They're, they're a lot tougher for Prosecutors, but. And they make for interesting date lines.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

You know, journalists are sort of in an abusive relationship with circumstantial evidence, because circumstantial cases are. Are frequently very, very strong, which this one was. You know, it's one reason why the jury did not take forever to deliberate, I think. So, you know, the idea that a circumstantial case sort of isn't a real case is, Is. Is. Is not legitimate. This was. There was a great deal of evidence. Circumstantial evidence, but there was a great deal of evidence against Jason McDermott.

[Andrea Canning]

Okay. Josh Yeghead, 22, don't recall it being mentioned during the show that Morgan and the other stalking Victim worked at FedEx together. Did I miss that?

[Josh Mankiewicz]

Their careers at FedEx overlapped, but they were not close friends. Sienna had nothing but good memories about Morgan, I think. But they were not. They were not pals.

[Social Media Commenter]

They.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

They knew each other.

[Andrea Canning]

Okay, this is a sweet comment from Shelly Hosick. I am going to celebrate Morgan on the 22nd of each month and do a Morgan. Such a sad episode.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

I think Morgan's family's onto something there. I think everybody should do that. That's a great thing. It's. It's great to make your mission doing something for somebody else once in a while. It's great.

[Andrea Canning]

It feels good being nice to people, doesn't it? And doing nice things.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

I'm gonna start that next year. But I hear that it does feel good. Yes.

[Andrea Canning]

What do they say? It's a lot easier to smile than it is to frown.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

Right? Right. Exactly. Yeah.

[Andrea Canning]

Look, Josh, we're smiling.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

I know. Look at that.

[Andrea Canning]

Okay, Chuck DZ, 76. Oh, that baby's testimony broke me. She shouldn't be. She shouldn't be mourning her mom. And it's Mother's Day weekend.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

Chuck dz, long time friend of Dateline online. Yeah. And as usual, Chuck is right. It's. Yeah, it's. It's. I mean, it's coincidence this, that this ended up airing right before Mother's Day, but that doesn't make it any less poignant or awful. And, you know, that little girl is still surrounded by family, and she's. She's doing very well.

[Andrea Canning]

I mean, we have so many, sadly, children that we've profiled on Dateline through the years that are without their mom. Well, our hearts go out to all the children of victims from our stories. It's absolutely heartbreaking. But let's finish this on a lighter note, Josh. We had a lot of fans apparently multitasking on Friday, Francis MPU said, nicks win. Time for dateline. Go Nicks.

[Josh Mankiewicz]

Hey, it's nice, you know, Michael Ray Richardson just passed away a few months ago, but, you know, he'd have been thrilled to see the Knicks coming back. His famous quote, the ship be sinking when the Knicks were not doing well, but now the Knicks are doing better.

[Andrea Canning]

Yeah, I've been to one Knicks game and my a friend of mine, this is going back quite a ways, was dating the owner of the 76ers and they were playing the Knicks. And so we went to the Knicks game and we sat courtside and it was quite a treat. I have to tell you, I would

[Josh Mankiewicz]

have been in the nosebleed seats. You were, you were leading, you're leading a charmed life, Ms. Kany.

[Andrea Canning]

Well, through a friend, I mean, you know, anyway, thank you so much. Thank you for all of your insight in this Talking dateline. It was a very, very well done, fascinating episode. That is it for Talking DATELINE this week. And thank you for listening. Remember, if you have any questions about our stories, you can DM us your audio or on our socials a linenbc or leave us a voicemail at 212-413-5252 for a chance to be featured right here. You can also watch the video version of this talking DATELINE on Peacock or YouTube or subscribe to the NBC News app. See you Fridays on dateline on NBC.

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