← Deadline: White House
Deadline: White House
"As voters head to the polls in Michigan"
00:41:22
As voters head to the polls in Michigan, Donald Trump appears to be treating today’s primary elections as a dress rehearsal for his attempt to take control of our elections in November.
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- [00:00]
A
Hey, everybody, it's Rob Lowe here, if you haven't heard. I have a podcast that's called Literally with Rob Lowe. And basically it's conversations I've had that really make you feel like you're pulling up a chair at an intimate dinner between myself and people that I admire, like Aaron Sorkin or Tiffany Haddish, Demi Moore, Chris Pratt, Michael J. Fox. There are new episodes out every Thursday, so subscribe, please, and listen wherever you get your podcasts.
- [00:35]
B
I can't believe they're having a gender reveal for their dog. No, no, no, no.
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C
This is a breed reveal.
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D
Oh.
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B
So, yeah, they're finding out the breed
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C
of the puppy they're rescuing, so they
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B
could just be spending all their money on, like, pet insurance.
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C
Instead, we got lemonade for Roscoe and it covered vaccines.
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B
Microchipping. We saved 90% on vet bills.
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E
Oh, here we go.
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B
What do you think beige confetti means? I don't know that we'll never get this Saturday back. Get a quote for any breed@lemonade.com pet.
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E
Hi there, everyone. It's four o'clock in New York as voters head to the polls in Michigan today. Donald Trump appears to be treating today's primary elections as a dress rehearsal for his efforts to take control of our elections in November. Earlier today, the Trump Justice Department announced that the department was monitoring poll sites in Detroit, Hamtrak, Lansing and East Lansing, all Democratic strongholds. As the voting rights website Democracy Docket puts it, quote. It is not unusual for the US Department of Justice to send election monitors to observe voting in federal elections. But targeting Democratic cities in a key battleground state raises serious concerns that Donald Trump will directly interfere in this fall's midterms. And local election chiefs say the Trump administration is already trying to undermine trust in the election by targeting the Great Lakes State with debunked claims of voter fraud. Quote. While historically, election monitors have been an important part of protecting voters and ensuring the freedom to vote for communities whose access to the ballot box has been limited, the broader context of the Trump administration's political agenda of election denial cannot be ignored. That's according to one voting rights advocate. They add this quote, this latest threat of sending election monitors to three cities with large populations of black voters and other communities of color is just the latest attempt in a long line of desperate actions to interfere in Michigan's elections. Michigan, in particular has been a frequent target for Trump's bizarre and completely far false election fraud claims, which seem to amount to there was fraud when I was president in 2020 but not when Barack Obama or Joe Biden were president in 2016 or 2024. But while Michigan is one of Trump's first targets, it's becoming abundantly clear that he doesn't plan to stop there as he continues his push to federalize our elections. Just last week, Trump once again attempted to pressure Senate Republicans into pushing through the SAVE Act. He's appealed to the Supreme Court to limit mail in voting. Voters going to the polls in Michigan today, under the shadow of Donald Trump's growing attempts to undermine our free and fair elections is where we start today with some of our favorite experts and friends. Voting rights attorney and Democracy Docket founder Mark Elias is here. Also joining us, Democratic pollster and political analyst Cornell Belcher is here. And with me for the hour, former assistant special agent in charge at the FBI, National Security and intelligence analyst Michael Feinberg is here. Mark Elias, I start with you. Just frame this up today, not in terms of the polls or the candidates, but threats to our elections.
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F
Yeah.
- [04:02]
G
So it's a good news, bad news story. Let me start with the good news, which is sort of flying a little under the radar screen. It is not just that the Department of Justice is now over 20, over 20 in lawsuits trying to get access to sensitive voter data from states they have sued 20 states. Actually, they sued 30 states. 20 courts have decided those cases, and the Department of Justice has not won a single case. My law firm, we are undefeated in those efforts. That includes, by the way, 12 losses before federal judges appointed by Republicans, eight appointed by Donald Trump. So that's one of the pieces of good news. The other piece of good news is that tomorrow will be the 90th day before the election, which is the beginning of the quiet day, the quiet period, which means that after that, states cannot do systematic removal of voters. And so the Trump administration is going to be in a really hard spot to try to get states to remove people. So that's the good news. The bad news is that the Department of Justice is ever searching for new ways to undermine free and fair elections on behalf of Donald Trump. We see the deployment of these folks in Michigan. They are trying to desensitize us to this. You know, we've now had a series of primary elections where they've sent people and they are trying to get us used to the idea that they will send people into predominantly blue cities in both blue states and red states, so that when they do that in the general election, they're able to say, look, this happened in the primary, no big deal. So that is something that is a bit of a warning sign. It's something I think we need to be spending time on. I'm glad you raised it, because come November, we know that Donald Trump is not going to try to win the election on the merits. He's not going to try to win the election on inflation or on jobs or on the economy. He's going to try to win it by subverting the will of the elector, trying to suppress the vote.
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E
Marcos, just take me inside what level of cooperation he may find in the years since 2020. A lot of election deniers have made their way through state government and local government. Tell me what he has on the ground in terms of election denying allies.
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G
Yeah. I'm so glad you raised this, because there's probably nothing that I stand outside of the consensus on more than this issue, which is that there has been this narrative that was largely built on 2020, and deservedly so in 2020, that the election officials stand as a bulwark against Donald Trump. And while that is true in some places, it is unfortunately not true in every place. The fact is Tina Peters was a local election official. The fact is that the Republican election officials in states like Florida and in Texas and in North Carolina, like, they are cooperating with Donald Trump and giving him big wins in what he wants. And that's not to say that they have yet taken steps to subvert the outcome of the 2026 election. Obviously, we're not there, but we do have to worry that the robust network of local and state election officials, whether they were people like, you know, Shay Moss at the very local level, or frankly, Republican secretaries of state, you know, and governors that stood tall, those have largely been replaced by MAGA loyalists and by people who will do Donald Trump's bidding. So I'm very worried about this in the run up to 20.
- [07:27]
E
Let me show all of you what Jack Smith said, just in terms of what we can expect from Trump. These are crimes that he was charged with committing. The actual crimes, I think were obstructing people's right to vote. Here's what he said about his worries for the midterms and the next presidential
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B
I'm very concerned of what's going to happen in the next election. Absolutely.
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E
Do you see, again, in things that are covered and things are public facing conduct ahead of the midterms that you investigated on January in the January 6th case?
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B
Well, I've been thinking about it more in terms of what needs to be done based on what we saw happen last time. I think a thing that all of us can do is support election workers and election officials. The last time around we saw that those people stood firm and they were in many cases the difference. It's clear to me anyways that what I've seen publicly that those people are going to be put under great pressure.
- [08:30]
E
So Michael Feinberg, I'm lifting this up and I've had Mark Elias set this up because where Brad Raffensperger became famous, I guess in half of the country, infamous in the other half for refusing to see to it to find Donald Trump, 11,780 votes. To mark Elias's point, there are fewer Brad Raffenspergers, there are fewer of these people that Jack Smith is holding up in the crimes he investigated that took place in 2020. And so I wonder if you can just speak to what it means to have DOJ under someone like Todd Blanche putting their finger on the scales of our elections.
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B
I'm quite concerned because I want to sort of echo Mark's point, but add a little bit more alarm to it in that since 2020, the Republican Party, particularly those most allied with Trump in potential swing states, has put a lot of resources and effort and been largely successful in running new candidates for election official positions. So we are not looking at the same apolitical, non ideological ranks that did serve as that dam during the 2020 era. We're dealing with a dam that has been under substantial pressure since then. And you know, there are two salient facts that we cannot forget all in all this. First of all, Trump tried to do this before. There was the violence on January 6, but there was also a long running conspiracy to try and stop the House and Senate from certifying the results of the election. This, this is not just a hypothetical, or even if it is a hypothetical, it's a hypothetical with very high probability based on past history. The second thing we need to be aware of is Trump doesn't need to steal the election, whatever that means in some sort of caper involving Ocean's eleven like escapades. He just needs to cast it in doubt. He just needs to make it seem as though one or two swing states with metropolitan blue strongholds did something untoward. He needs an excuse to call out law enforcement or the military or reject election certificates and just seize on that kernel of doubt that his die hard followers have in order to unlaunch chaos on the country. And that I think is a very real probability.
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E
Cornell I share all of these fears. I especially believe that we're in such a mature phase of his Election denialism and rigging of the midterms that people have become desensitized to it. It's election Day. I don't know how many newscasts started with Trump's plan to steal them, but to me it feels like the flashing red. The one mitigating factor to me is that he's at 32 to 40, 32 to 34% in the polls and plunging. And I wonder where you see the degree of enthusiasm for doing something that could be criminal.
- [12:06]
D
Yeah, well let's get into some of the data and I think sort of the predicate for it. And so I know you have me on for the data because data is fun and post. So the data piece of this is so the predicate of why this happened to your point and poll after poll. And Nicole, I'm seeing enthusiasm gaps in our polling and I know others are as large as I've seen in a long, long time where Democrats are by double digits. However you measure either enthusiasm or certainty to vote or motivated to vote, Democrats are running way ahead in all those segments. And not only see it in the polls, but you see it in the real world. If you look at the primaries that have been happening in the country right now, Democratic primaries, you certainly had a boost of Democrats participate in those primaries. And in the off year elections you see more sporadic Democrats voting. So the enthusiasm is there and then they don't have the issue. And issue after issue was breaking against Donald Trump. And in a recent poll that I saw, I think it was pointed back poll a couple days ago where Democrats even shockingly have an advantage on dealing with the economy, which you and I have talked about for years, has always been a stronghold of Republicans regardless of the actual economic facts. Americans have always trusted Republicans more with the economy. They do not now. So I don't think it's only probable that he's going to try to interfere in the election. And somehow I think it's certain. I think there's a certainty to it because they have no, because he has no other choice because he's going to be held accountable. Now for me, this is an interesting piece for me. So we also see in the data the ideal of democracy being under threat and the need to protect democracy is also not a middle of the tier voting issue issue concern for voters anymore. I'm seeing it in sometimes fourth or third, even second place behind the economy. So I think there is a sense among Americans that something is happening or something might happen and we should in fact be paying more of attention to it. And And I would like to see more of all of us messaging in this space to middle America and say to them, listen, if he interferes with this election, what he's saying is for these high gas prices and these high healthcare prices, he can't be held accountable. So you have skin in the game as well.
- [14:34]
E
Yeah. I mean, Marco Elias, how much of the sort of loss of Trump's narrative dominance is a term I learned from Angelo Carazano, and I love it. I'm going to borrow it for the purposes of this conversation. How, how much of that impedes their ability to do damage and how much hypercharges it? Like, how much do they reach for these levers because they're not winning among the American people? Or is it an inverse relationship?
- [15:01]
G
Yeah. So, look, this is how I think about it. Donald Trump prefers to deal with most problems just by lying, right? So, like, he starts every everything with a lie and then escalates those lies. When those fail to do the damage that he wants to do and that fails to accomplish what he wants, then he usually finds a way to provoke a legal fight. You know, this is a guy very comfortable with the courts in a way that I think people don't appreciate. You know, most politicians, if I go to them and I'm like, we could try to solve this voting thing in court. They're. They're like, well, we should message, we should, you know, organize, we should turn out, whatever. And those are all legitimate reactions, by the way. But Donald Trump's very comfortable with the courts. Like he was. He saw the courts as a battlefield when he was a businessman. He's used them to try to intimidate his political opponents. Very comfortable in the court. So he escalates the courts. When that fails, though, what he does is he then tries to escalate his supporters, whether it's January 6th with violence in the nation's capital, whether it is what he did with ICE officials shooting people in the streets in Minneapolis. Right. Like, it usually escalates to something that is pretty ugly and violent. And so what I'm worried about is right now, we're in that phase of we're in courts, we're fighting. And, yeah, I am proud of the work we're doing. We're defeating him. In these 20 cases, we had a big win about voter registration at national naturalization ceremonies. But Donald Trump doesn't end there. He's going to take this to the next level, and it's all of our responsibility to pay attention to what that likely will be, to call it out to litigate over it, to challenge it, to organize, to mobilize. But I don't think we're at the end of it. And this is what happens when he does lose the messaging piece of it.
- [16:55]
E
You know, you listen to Michael Feinberg talking about his commitment to the $1.8 billion slush fund where monies could go to insurrectionists who violently beat cops to within inches of consciousness. And in a couple instances of their lives, when you hear him talking about financial awards for his supporters who were investigated and held accountable, and you lay that over all of the action to sow distrust in our elections, what do you think extremists are hearing from him?
- [17:30]
B
That they could get paid for violence? I'm not mincing words here because I don't think people realize what that slush fund, which despite Todd Blanche's statement to committee today, is still something that can very much be used in some circumstances that's fundamentally incentivizing political violence. He is, he wants to give cash rewards to people who attacked law enforcement officers and tried to stop the peaceful transition of power. This is a signal to them that there will not be consequences to their actions if they act violently again in the future. I honestly don't understand how it could be interpreted any other way. And as of this afternoon, and I know we'll get into this later in the hour, at his back, he has what is now the nation's largest and most powerful personal law firm, the Department of Justice and its largest firm of private investigators and fixers, the FBI, under the control of his personal criminal attorney who has been willing to violate policy and cross red lines to help Donald
- [18:58]
E
Trump since day one and nearly at the cost of his own dream job being confirmed as attorney general. Cornell, I want to bring you into how Democrats respond to all of this. I have to sink in a break before we do that. Also, head in today's show. More on today's primary contest and the shift away from Donald Trump, from many of the voters who put him back in office just 16 months ago. We'll look at his plunging popularity on this last big day of primary contests ahead of the midterms. Plus, the Senate Republicans who voted to advance Todd Blanche's nomination for AG will now have to own everything Todd Blanche does while serving as head of the Department of Justice, from unlawful indictments and political prosecutions to illegal kidnappings by ICE to the all out incompetence and cover up related to the crimes of Jeffrey Epstein. We'll get reaction. Also later in the show, disgraced Republican Congressman Max Miller is facing more and growing calls to resign as the allegations against him are making it harder and harder for his party to look away. All those stories and much more when Deadly White House continues after a quick break. Don't go anywhere.
- [20:09]
A
Hey everybody, it's Rob Lowe here. If you haven't heard, I have a podcast that's called Literally with Rob Lowe and basically it's conversations I've had that really make you feel like you're pulling up a chair at an intimate dinner between myself and people that I admire, like Aaron Sorkin or Tiffany Haddish, Demi Moore, Chris Pratt, Michael J. Fox. There are new episodes out every Thursday, so subscribe please and listen wherever you
- [20:42]
H
get your podcasts with the vifguard, Hytrulo, Escartigamod, Alpha and Hyaluronidase QVFC Pre Filled Syringe Self injection is in your hands. It's your treatment routine. You set the time and same day each week. Take the pre filled syringe with you on vacation or have it handy for cozy staycations. For more information, visit livevividly.com that's L I V E V Y V idly.com brought to you by Argenics Summer routines
- [21:15]
C
live or die by how easy they are. And honestly, if something takes too much effort, I'm out. That's why Groons is my go to. It's one daily pack of gummies covering my greens, vitamins and minerals. Plus it has 6 grams of prebiotic fiber which is more than 2 cups of broccoli. No mixing powders, no giant pills, no hassle. I just rip open the pack and I'm done. They taste good and make it easy to stay on top of my health even when life gets busy. Save up to 52% off with code podcast at Gruns Co. That's Code Podcastruns.
- [21:46]
E
We're back with Mark Cornell and Michael Feinberg. Cornell, to Mark's point about how Trump is never done trying to break things, in this case our elections, part of me wonders what would happen if he applied this to do good, right? To grow the economy or to eradicate measles, which was eradicated. But I digress. If he's not installing election deniers at local and statewide offices or trying to use his Justice Department to obtain voter data, he is perverting the United States Postal Service. And let me read you how some blue states are responding. California and other blue states warn of extreme risk in backing Trump election. Order quote California and other Democratic led states told the Supreme Court that granting the federal government's pending request for emergency relief, President Donald Trump's mail in ballot EO would have extreme consequences ahead of the fall's midterms. They said that backing the administration would let the government rush out an unprecedented legally indefensible voter verification and ballot interception program that would, among other things, give the U.S. postal Service far reaching new powers and responsibilities. Because of the high risk of errors and the limited window for correcting mistakes, many of the millions of voters who rely on mail voting would likely be denied mail ballots and as a result would be disenfranchised. It is amazing the whole of government approach to disenfranchising voters and suppressing voters that they think won't vote for them. But I wonder if you can just speak to what you understand to be the sort of whole of government response from Democrats.
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D
You know, I wish it weren't just from Democrats because truth of the matter is we've got to have more Americans who are, who are, who want democracy. And look, that, that, that post office could be determining elections is just insane. And Elon Martin's better than most. Like so many states, their primary way of voting is mail. I mean, go to Oregon and places out west where, where, where mail were, you know, mail in ballots is basically how they, how they hold, hold their, hold their elections. And, and you gotta think at some point. And Nicole, we've talked about this before, but it's tough to do it on campaigns, right, because you know, so much of the message you, you know, pollsters say here's the top two messages. Just talk about these two messages and the message is always the economy. So we don't have these conversations more broadly from a campaign standpoint. But I at some point think Americans aren't as dumb as we think they are. I think Americans can hold multiple ideas in their heads and we don't simply just have to talk to them 100% all the time about, about, about their pocketbook issues. I think they're smart enough to understand, okay, I have pocketbook concerns, but I also have concerns about holding my electeds and my government accountable. And if I lose that, if I lose the ability to hold our government and our elected officials accountable, the price I pay is far more higher than sort of the pocketbook prices that, that I'm paying and the next generation is paying. And I think that's a conversation that yes, I want Democrats to have, but my God, Nicole, I want more Americans in the middle and on the left and the right to also want democracy.
- [25:09]
E
Yeah, I mean, I see Jon Ossoff trying to make it a bigger conversation than a battle of two parties policies coming to a head, you know, placing this election in a broader frame. I think about, look how well he's
- [25:24]
D
doing, by the way. That should be positive to others that you can actually have this conversation and not lose.
- [25:31]
E
Right, right. Well, I think about the Republicans who tried to stand up for democracy and they all lost their jobs, people like Liz Cheney and Adam Kinzinger. And I watch Cornyn with a feeble attempt to stand up to someone who is carrying out in public the most brazen perversion of the rule of law. And I think Cornyn was an attorney general or prosecutor. I mean, what do you make of voters growing fatigue, Cornell, with the fecklessness of Republicans who won't stand up to Trump on anything?
- [26:03]
D
I think what I make of it is, and I think it was in the Fox poll a couple weeks ago, is that Democrats now have the largest generic ballot advantage in their polling as they've ever seen. And I know we've had a lot of gerrymandering conversations, but we don't know how exactly the more rig of going to work out. But we need a broader mobilization, not the left, but also in the middle among voters. And I think a lot of data points to that right now.
- [26:35]
E
Mark, just give me your viewer's guide to what you're watching from a protecting democracy standpoint tonight.
- [26:43]
G
So look, I think the most important thing that we have not talked about that I think goes to the protection of democracy tonight and in the future. And we talked here about the failings of the Republican Party. We've talked about how Democrats could talk about this more. But I want to pick up on something Michael said about the largest law firm being the Department of Justice. You know, I'm right now out there with my law firm. We're litigating 87 cases in 43 states. We are 60 lawyers. There was an article this weekend in the New York Times by Michael Schmidt about one big law firm, Paul Weiss, a law firm that if we were talking four years ago, we would be talking about the role of big law firms in standing up for democracy, not just in the big cases, but in a whole lot of little cases. And what this report showed is that this was a systematic decision by the leadership of Paul Weiss to turn away from its long history of doing work for democracy, of standing up against Donald Trump and his, his efforts to subvert it, and instead to put money and greed and profit above all of it. And this wasn't accidental and it wasn't in one day and it wasn't one person. It was just an institutional decision by, by this law firm to do this. And I think everyone in the legal industry needs to read that article. I think everyone in law school needs to read that article. But honestly, I think everyone, large institution needs to ask whether, where they are, whether they are, you know, fighting the fight or whether they are a large institution maximizing profits. And because, you know, when I think about what voters will face today, it's a microcosm of what they're going to face in the fall. And if the large institutions of our government, the large corporations, the large media outlets, the large law firms, if they're not doing their part, like, yeah, the voters are, can hold these ideas and we will do everything we can, but it will be with a lot fewer resources fighting those election deniers than we used to have.
- [28:51]
E
Yeah, I'm familiar with that reporter and that story. And to me, the theme of that story is the theme of the collapse of the political party I was once a part of and I will never support again because of its role in enabling authoritarianism in the United States of America. And I guess my thought in reading that piece is for all of the people who make all those law at that firm, millionaires multiple times over and over and over and over again. I would ask all their corporate clients, how many times in the history of the human race has appeasement worked out for the appeaser? Like, I'm just not sure it's a great bet for all their millions and billions of deals to bet on the appeasers. Because the history of the human story suggests that the appeasers usually do not prevail in the end. Mark Elias, Cornell Belcher, thank you for starting us off on this Election Day. Michael Feinberg sticks around. When we come back, Donald Trump and his one time personal attorney getting what they want at the Department of Justice. Democrats still sounding the alarm though, about the danger Todd Blanche poses to the rule of law in our country. That warning on the future of the DOJ is next.
- [30:08]
A
Hey, everybody, it's Rob Lowe here. If you haven't heard, I have a podcast that's called Literally with Rob Lowe. And basically it's conversations I've had that really make you feel like you're pulling up a chair at an intimate dinner between myself and people that I admire like Aaron Sorkin or Tiffany Haddish, Demi Moore, Chris Pratt, Michael J. Fox. There are new episodes out every Thursday, so subscribe please. And listen wherever you get your podcasts
- [30:42]
H
with the vifguard, Hytrulo, efgartigamod, Alpha and Hyaluronidase QVFC Pre filled Syringe Self injection is in your hands. It's your treatment routine. You set the time and same day each week. Take the pre filled syringe with you on vacation or have it handy for cozy staycations. For more information visit livevividly.com that's L I V E V Y V I d l y.com brought to you by
- [31:12]
C
Argenics Summer Routines Live or die by how easy they are. And honestly, if something takes too much effort, I'm out. That's why Groons is my go to. It's one daily pack of gummies covering my greens, vitamins and minerals. Plus it has 6 grams of prebiotic fiber which is more than 2 cups of broccoli. No mixing powders, no giant pills, no hassle. I just rip open the pack and I'm done. They taste good and make it easy to stay on top of my health even when life gets Busy. Save up to 52% off with Code Podcast at Gruuns co. That's Code Podcast r u n s co
- [31:44]
E
today, Todd Blanche, the person who has bent the Department of Justice toward Donald Trump and his personal interests more than anyone who has ever worked at the department before, is one step closer to being confirmed as AG and finally getting his coveted job promotion. After two GOP holdouts, Senators Thom Tillis and John Cornyn, caved to Blanche's hollow written commitments to them about Donald Trump's slush fund and sweeping tax immunity, the Senate Judiciary Committee advanced Blanche's nomination to be the next Attorney General of the United States to the full Senate. The vote to advance Blanche did not come before these damning indictments from Democrats of Blanche's leadership and Republicans on the committee.
- [32:28]
G
Folding today, I think, is a sad and embarrassing day for this committee, as it looks like on a party line vote. We are going to advance out of this committee, probably the most discreditable person ever to seek the office of Attorney General of the United States. The reasons to vote against him number in the hundreds. I don't know where this committee goes after it stops being taken seriously. The President reiterated just the other night that he hates me, which I could tell you, wounds me deeply. He's entitled to his own views about me or anybody else. He is not entitled, however, to use the Department of Justice to go after his political opponents. And the day we say that's okay and the day we confirm an Attorney general who says that's okay is the day that the rule of law becomes merely an unenforceable idea.
- [33:31]
F
We are in dangerous waters. We are turning the ideals of justice and this committee into a mockery by letting the least qualified person, a person proven to do Donald Trump's will over the law. He is about Trump and not truth. He is about corruption and not the Constitution. He is about being Donald Trump's lawyer and not the people's lawyer. This is so deeply wrong. We will rue the day that we let this man have this much power under such a corrupt president.
- [34:05]
E
When pressed after the vote on his capitulation to Todd Blanche and Donald Trump, here's what Senator Cornyn had to say for himself.
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H
The president was saying as recently as
- [34:15]
E
yesterday that he likes the idea of this fund, that he wants to find some way to pay these people. Does that concern you as someone who's tried to fight against getting this anti weaponization fund in place?
- [34:26]
G
Well, there's nothing we could do to rein in the president when he said he likes the fund and he wishes still exists. But the fact of the matter, it's dead. And that's all we could do under these circumstances.
- [34:42]
E
Quote, there's nothing we can do except for the little complicating fact that you are a co equal branch of government. But that's a real important window into how they see themselves. Quote, nothing we can do to rein in the president. I want to bring in senior investigative reporter Carol Lennig. Michael Feinberg is with us as well. Carol, your thoughts?
- [35:02]
I
It is sort of striking to see Senator Cornyn and Senator Tillis, who both basically had President Trump up against a corner for a short period of time, say that there's nothing they could do under these circumstances. I mean, nothing they could do would be to not vote the nominee out of committee. That's one thing they could have done. Perhaps they believe that Donald Trump's threat to basically install Blanche as an acting Attorney general and revive the fund, separate and apart from Tillis and Cornyn's pressure, was essentially a big loser for them, that they were going to have some sort of pie or embarrassment in their faces because the president would get exactly what he wanted no matter what kind of pressure they applied. But they could have stopped this vote. And that isn't really up for debate. I've heard many people, Nicole, say, including on your program, that the senators believe that Blanch is the best they could get under this president, but the best they could get is an Attorney General who has made clear since the moment he was put in the acting role that he'll do whatever Donald Trump asks him to do, including fast tracking a case he knew was a loser and the previous attorney general thought was a loser, the Seychelles case, the minute he had the chance to begin auditioning for this job.
- [36:39]
E
I wonder, too, where they think their legacies go when he's someone who's participated in threats against judges, something you and I have talked about over the last week. These are people who've couched or excused or created a permission structure for themselves at different points in the Trump story. By saying they cared about the people that he was appointing to the judiciary, Todd lynch endangers the safety of judges. So say the judges.
- [37:09]
I
Say the judges. And it's real. It's. It's really palpable. Nicole, on the federal bench, regardless of which president appointed you, from which party, judges are quite frightened, and rightfully so, for themselves and for their family members. Again, I think you and I have talked about this. It's a tender topic. The more details you get into to explain this to the public, how serious this is, the more you offer clues and maybe even more inspiration to people who want to threaten those judges. But I think the bigger picture here is that Donald Trump has been the beneficiary of that kind of threat, that rhetoric that he pushes so hard that encourages some loose cannons, some incredibly unstable people, some hugely ardent followers to threaten these pillars of our rule of law. That kind of threat has been a huge political benefit for him. I mean, please see the picture of January 6, his December 19, 2020 tweet. Come to Washington and it'll be wild. And then sending people who were his supporters to the Capitol to fight like hell for their country, including to threaten that they would gather up the vice president by the neck and hang him. Hang Mike Pence. This was the chant that the Secret Service agents of Mike Pence heard outside his office window at the Capitol when they decided, we have got to get the hell out of here. So threats have always worked for Donald Trump. I am remembering, and I'm sorry to go on a little bit, but I am remembering the first time this put a chill in my spine, and it was watching a rally in 2016, if I'm remembering right, in Louisville, Kentucky, where a black female student who was exercising our First Amendment rights to protest Donald Trump's presidency was pushed around like a pinata by older white male veterans that Donald Trump had whipped into a frenzy with the promise that he would pay their legal bills if they got in trouble for smacking somebody around.
- [39:40]
E
I remember the same summer of 16 in Chicago when he made comments about how he liked it when cops roughed people up. He said, don't be afraid of roughing them up. People that were taken out of his rallies. I want to press both of you more on what following up on what Senator Cory Booker says about ruining the day that any of these senators voted to confirm Todd Blanche. I have to sneak in a quick break first while I'll be back on the other side.
- [40:17]
F
This is ridiculous. We got nothing, no guarantees whatsoever that this slush fund still can't go forward. We got nothing that the President of the United States can't cheat on his taxes and have no accountability. The president is a tax cheat. We have a known arsonist and we have just in this committee given him a whole barrel full of gasoline to light on fire our tax laws and have no accountability for the conflagration.
- [40:54]
E
Michael Pymer, I listened to that and I thought behind voting in the person who did the deal that allows Trump to cheat on his taxes both in the past and in the present and in the future, which is with that settlement does in terms of how I understand it as a non lawyer, the department has basically operationalized looking the other way for political corruption. And I don't know if people think that Donald Trump just became the most successful business person of his life and that's why he made $2.3 billion last year for the first time ever, more than when he was working full time. He's presidenting at least some of the time. I guess that's what we call it. But what do you make of what's behind the architect of the tax cheat deal? Also turning the Department of Justice into an institution that no longer upholds the rule of law when it comes to flagrant corruption.
- [41:50]
B
Bullies and thugs attract bullies and thugs, whether it is somebody who filled out a real time application to become the Attorney General of the United States or whether it's the sort of person who thinks it's okay to attack a police officer on January 6 because their candidate of preference did not win. And we make these mistakes, and I think Senator Booker is one of the few who do not. But we make these mistakes in public where we talk about these issues as if there was no history, data or evidence from us to drawn on to things, see how things are going to play out in the future. We don't have to ask ourselves if Todd Blanche is trustworthy and his testimony now can be believed. He testified when he was becoming deputy attorney general that there would not be politicized prosecutions in the Department of Justice under his watch. Let's ask Jim Comey or Letitia James or the Broadview Six or Don Lemon or David Hearn whether there have been politicized prosecutions under Todd Blanche's watch. You would have to be either living under a rock or the world's biggest idiot in all history to deny that there have been politicized prosecutions under Todd Blanche. So to think that there's going to be any integrity now that he is the attorney general, to think that he is going to stand in the way of politicized prosecutions, to think that he is going to enforce corruption laws against Trump or antitrust laws against people like the Ellisons, you're living in a fantasy land.
- [43:49]
E
Michael Feinberg and Caroline, thank you both for marking this day with us and joining us today with your insights. After the break, Trump's D.C. u.S. Attorney Jeanine Pirro dropping charges against three more people who did not, as it turns out, vandalize the reflecting pool. The fallout continues on that front. We'll bring it to you next. Funny thing happened. Jeanine Pirro is now in the fight of her political life to keep her job as DC's US Attorney. According to new reporting from CBS News, she carted a box full of evidence from the Interior Department to the White House on Monday in a bid to prove to Donald Trump that the damage to the reflecting pool was caused by shoddy construction and not by vandals, as he repeatedly said after he told reporters that she had, quote, folded like an umbrella and, quote, choked. That's according to sources familiar with the matter. A spokesperson for Pirro's office declined comment. It now looks like there's only been more folding because the Department of Justice has also moved to drop misdemeanor charges against three other defendants who were accused of damaging the reflecting pool. According to court filings, CBS News is reporting that the meeting between Trump and Pirro was, quote, sometimes heated. But as of now, she still has her job. Wouldn't you love to know what it was like to show Trump a white box full of evidence? Hmm. We'll keep you updated on that story after a break. Donald Trump's poll numbers continue to plunge. How that's impacting the major primary races around the country today. The next hour of Deadline White HOUSE starts after a quick break. Don't go anywhere.
- [45:37]
F
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- [45:53]
J
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- [47:00]
F
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