“Todd Blanche is on the Hill”

Summary

Deadline: White House – “Todd Blanche is on the Hill”

Host: Nicolle Wallace
Date: June 3, 2026
Featured Guests: John Brennan, Miles Taylor, Tim Miller, Carol Leonnig, Liz Oyer

Episode Overview

In this episode, Nicolle Wallace leads a high-stakes political discussion on two interlocking stories that expose significant risks to American democracy and national security during Donald Trump’s second administration:

1. The appointment of Bill Pulte, a housing administrator with zero intelligence background and a close Trump loyalist, as Acting Director of National Intelligence (DNI).
2. The controversial $1.8 billion Trump “slush fund,” with Attorney General Todd Blanche testifying on Capitol Hill amid bipartisan suspicion about its true purpose and possible resurrection.

Wallace and an all-star panel break down the risks, the overt politicization of government agencies, and implications for rule of law and global security.

---

1. Trump’s Appointment of Bill Pulte as Acting Director of National Intelligence

[00:52–18:24; 20:47–25:57]

Key Discussion Points

• Wallace’s Summary:
  Trump replaces Tulsi Gabbard with Bill Pulte, a finance administrator with no intelligence or national security experience, as Acting DNI—an office created post-9/11 to keep Americans safe.
• Pulte’s Background:
  • Former director of the Federal Housing Finance Agency; head of Fannie Mae & Freddie Mac.
  • Nicknamed “Little Trump,” known as a “prominent Trump sidekick” (per Washington Post, Wall Street Journal).
  • Used federal resources to pursue political vendettas, targeting Letitia James, Adam Schiff, Fani Willis, and Lisa Cook.
• Guest Reactions:
  • Tim Miller ([07:13]):
    “There’s never been somebody with this little experience being nominated for a cabinet level job in the history of the Republic, honestly. … Calling him a political hack is even kind of too kind.”
  • John Brennan ([10:38], former CIA Director):
    “Donald Trump has outdid himself. I didn’t think it was possible to find someone less qualified than Tulsi Gabbard to be Director of National Intelligence, but Trump actually has.”
    • Signals disrespect for the intelligence community; sends dangerous signals to both allies and adversaries.
    • “Trump is really intent not just on disregarding the work of the intelligence community, but I think really destroying it.” ([11:32])
  • Miles Taylor ([12:28, 13:08]):
    “In a second term, Donald Trump would use the spy powers of the federal government for revenge. The writing was on the wall. Why? Because Donald Trump was the one holding the Sharpie doing the writing.”
    • Cites historic attempts by Trump to spy on White House employees; warns that now “Trump has found the type of acolytes who are clearly more than willing to do things that could get someone, a reasonable person, thrown into prison.”
• Panel Consensus:
  Pulte is not being placed for his expertise but because of loyalty and willingness to use government power for political retribution.

Key Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Wallace ([04:54]): “When your answer is, ‘we get Tulsi for four more weeks. Yay,’ you’re not happy about the new guy.”
• Tim Miller ([07:42]): “He was a corrupt grifter. He didn’t really have any skills in politics … besides sucking up to Donald Trump.”
• Tim Miller ([09:11]): “He is only put in there to do the muckraking, to go after the political foes. … That’s why he’s there.”
• John Brennan ([10:38]): “What signal does this send … to places like Russia, China, Iran, North Korea? It shows a total disregard and disrespect for the whole intelligence community.”
• Miles Taylor ([15:13]): Raises concerns about Pulte's previous cover-up and firing of internal oversight after aggressive, politicized use of his federal powers at FHFA.

Panel Analysis

• Abuse of Intelligence Powers:
  Trump is stacking the intelligence community with loyalists prepared to act on his personal grievances, including digging up dirt on Trump’s opponents using government spy powers ([16:48], Taylor).
• No Oversight:
  As acting DNI, Pulte avoids Senate confirmation and oversight for up to 210 days, coinciding with the run-up to the next Congress ([10:04], Wallace & Miller).
• Broader Threat:
  Discussed possibility of using intelligence resources against domestic political opponents, referencing previous attempts to use foreign interference claims as rationale for unprecedented actions against political adversaries.

---

2. Controversy Over the Trump “Slush Fund” and DOJ Settlement with the Trump Family

[18:24–48:07]

Key Discussion Points

• Todd Blanche’s Testimony:
  Trump’s AG faces Congress about the White House’s attempt to create a $1.8 billion “slush fund”—ostensibly to reward Trump allies and insurrectionists—which is now claimed dead in the face of bipartisan outrage ([30:06]).
• Underlying Motives:
  Experts believe the true goal is ensuring blanket immunity for Donald Trump, his family, and businesses from IRS audits and civil or criminal probes ([31:49], Linnig).
• Mistrust of Political Actors:
  • Blanche’s credibility is in question—experts assert he is executing Trump’s orders regardless of legality or ethics ([34:21], Linnig).
  • Department of Justice messaging around the demise of the slush fund described as misleading; the case is merely paused, not killed ([34:21], Linnig).
• Settlement Immunity:
  Liz Oyer and Carol Leonnig explain that the settlement waives the government’s right to pursue Trump for ill-gotten gains after office—functionally a forward-looking shield ([44:15], Linnig).
• Democratic Response:
  Rep. Alyssa Slotkin and other lawmakers connect Trump’s open corruption directly to growing economic distress and voter anger ([39:19], Oyer).

Key Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Rep. Jamie Raskin ([30:06], via Wallace):
  “We would be making a mistake if we treated this judicially compelled interruption as a final conclusion to this mad ripoff scheme. It is not close to the end of the story.”
• Proud Boys leader Enrique Tarrio ([30:06], via Wallace):
  “This isn’t an abandonment. They simply state they’re going to wait two weeks. … I believe even if this fund is killed in courts or at a congressional level, the president will find a way.”
• Carol Leonnig ([34:21]):
  “We’re well past the point of, take Todd Blanche’s word for it. He really doesn’t have any credibility at this point. … The whole thing was a sham to begin with.”
• Liz Oyer ([39:19]):
  “If you believe for one minute that this guy will settle down and not pursue this, just look at the other case … between his son’s cryptocurrency scams, literally offering pay-for-play deals for the ballroom, this President is marching us through unprecedented corruption and milking the cow that is the US Government every single day.”
• Carol Leonnig ([41:05], re: Trump priorities):
  “He is after this other part of the agreement, which is the most corrupt piece… the agreement that the Justice Department will back away from these audits of his taxes, his family’s taxes, his company’s taxes.”
• Carol Leonnig ([45:49], on first-term vs. current grift):
  “The emoluments clause violations now seem so quaint because of … the unbelievable ways in which foreign billionaires and leaders are again lining Donald Trump’s pockets.”

Additional Insights

• Settlement “Immunity” Debate ([43:06]):
  DOJ claims the settlement only eliminates past audits (“not immunity”), but panelists and lawmakers assert it is a de facto future shield that prevents prosecution for further corruption.
• Historical Context:
  Relates Trump administration actions to emoluments clause reporting—now considered mere “trifling” compared to the sweeping nature and boldness of today’s corruption ([48:07], Leonnig).

---

3. Host Updates and Episode Timestamps

• 00:52 – Nicolle Wallace brings viewers into the breaking news on Bill Pulte’s appointment.
• 04:54 – Initial bipartisan reactions and the gravity of the lack of experience.
• 07:13–12:01 – Tim Miller, John Brennan, Miles Taylor discuss Pulte’s record and the threat of loyalist leadership over intelligence.
• 15:43–18:24 – The mechanics and dangers of weaponizing intelligence for political revenge.
• 30:06 – Wallace introduces the slush fund controversy and key congressional quotes.
• 31:49–34:21 – Carol Leonnig and Liz Oyer explain the true function of the slush fund and DOJ settlement.
• 39:19 – Oyer and Slotkin on why Trump’s family and business corruption is resonating amid economic pain.
• 45:49–48:07 – Leonnig reflects on the magnitude of second-term corruption compared to Trump’s first term.

---

Key Takeaways

• The intelligence community is being systematically politicized, placing unqualified loyalists in sensitive roles, risking both national security and the rule of law.
• Trump and his inner circle are expanding efforts to financially benefit from the presidency while shielding themselves from accountability, with little Congressional or legal recourse so far.
• Watchdogs warn: recent moves are not about policy—this is about power, payback, and self-enrichment.

---

Notable Quotes by Timestamp

• Tim Miller ([07:13]): “There’s never been somebody with this little experience being nominated for a cabinet level job in the history of the Republic.”
• John Brennan ([10:38]): “It shows a total disregard and disrespect for the whole intelligence community of the United States.”
• Miles Taylor ([13:08]): “Now it’s apparent that Donald Trump has found the type of acolytes who are clearly more than willing to do things that could get someone, a reasonable person, thrown into prison.”
• Carol Leonnig ([34:21]): “The whole thing was a sham to begin with.”
• Liz Oyer ([39:19]): “This president is marching us through unprecedented corruption and milking the cow that is the US Government every single day.”
• Carol Leonnig ([45:49]): “The emoluments clause violations now seem so quaint because of … the unbelievable ways in which foreign billionaires and leaders are again lining Donald Trump’s pockets.”

---

Episode Tone

The conversation is urgent, alarmed, and deeply skeptical of claims by Trump officials. With sharp humor and historical perspective, Wallace’s panelists convey both the stakes and the cynicism inherent in the administration’s latest actions.

---

For Listeners

This episode is a must-listen for anyone seeking to understand:

• How the machinery of American government can be weaponized for personal retribution and enrichment;
• Why the traditional “guardrails” (confirmation, oversight) are being actively bypassed;
• How ongoing investigations and political pushback might (or might not) constrain a White House intent on operating with minimal accountability.

---

For further developments: Keep your eyes on the testimonies of Todd Blanche, the shifting communications from DOJ, and further actions by Bill Pulte as he takes the reins of American intelligence.

Transcript

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[Nicole Wallace]

Hi there everyone. It's four o' clock in New York on a juggling knives kind of news day. Right now, Donald Trump, Trump's acting AG Todd Blanche, is on Capitol Hill. He's expected to face at least some harsh questions about Donald Trump's slush fund and the weaponization of the Department of Justice to pursue Donald Trump's perceived political opponents. We'll keep an eye on that. As soon as anything newsworthy happens, we'll dip into it or turn around for you right away, we promise. But we begin today with the big news, the biggest news story on the weaponization front. And it comes from another part of of the government, the US Intelligence agencies. Because while it is nearly impossible to choose for you the most dangerous among all of Donald Trump's radical and outrageous and sycophantic personnel choices over the last 18 months, that is no longer a kind of Sophie's Choice thing. It's now abundantly clear what the most radical and dangerous personnel decision is today. It happened. And at a time when our country is at war with Iran and facing nearly unprecedented geopolitical, economic and technological threats and challenges from literally every corner of the globe, Donald Trump this morning put a man named Bill Pulte atop America's intelligence agencies. He will now serve as of today as America's acting Director of National Intelligence. Now, some of you out there might be thinking, big deal. Tulsi Gabbard had that job until 15 minutes ago. And you wouldn't be entirely wrong to have that reaction. But while Tulsi Gabbard sullied her reputation by participating in an FBI raid of election offices in Fulton County, Georgia, Pulte has been taking far more audacious actions as a taxpayer funded federal employee. So here's who Pulte is right now. He's a housing guy. He's currently got the Title of director of the Federal Housing Finance Agency and chairman of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. To get this part out of the way, Bill Pulte has zero experience in national security or intelligence or foreign policy or military. And this is the one job in our government, the most senior one, that was created in the aftermath of the September 11 terrorist attacks to keep Americans safe. So that job is now going to be done by Bill Pulte. And Pulte's obvious and glaring and deeply concerning lack of any intelligence or national security or foreign policy or military experience. This met with outrage from Democrats and some deeply uncomfortable hot takes from Republicans. Watch.

[Dish Network Announcer]

I believe it puts the country at risk. I think it puts Americans at risk. And the audacity. He doesn't even have no intelligence background. He's got no national security background. And if you politicize intelligence, you end up in wars. You end up being less secure. At a time of growing threats around the world, this nomination raises a fundamental question. Is the President looking for independent intelligence or political validation? Do you think that Bill Pulte has the experience to be the acting dni? And same with you or Senator Cotton, as the chairman of the Intelligence Committee, is he the kind of person you

[Tim Miller]

want leading the Intelligence Committee?

[Miles Taylor]

I'll defer to the chairman on that.

[Tim Miller]

We have four more weeks with Director Gabbard as the dni. I have no observations on the matter. Understanding is the Senate doesn't have a role in. In confirmation of an acting director. But would you like a. I see no, no evidence of any qualifications for that job.

[Nicole Wallace]

When your answer is, we get Tulsi for four more weeks. Yay. You're not happy about the new guy. Now, the new guy, the housing guy, Mr. Pulte is very accomplished in one category. He is perhaps the most prolific foot soldier in the retribution campaign being waged by Donald Trump. He is, politically speaking, defined by a proven track record of unwavering loyalty to Donald Trump's darkest ambitions. He's taken it upon himself to be Trump's guy. Washington Post describes Pulte this way as a, quote, prominent Trump sidekick. Wall Street Journal reports that some people in the Trump administration labeled Pulte, quote, little Trump, as the federal housing finance director. This person, Mr. Pulte, pushed DOJ to pursue cases against Trump's perceived political enemies, weaponizing bogus mortgage fraud allegations against New York Attorney General Letitia James, Senator Adam Schiff, Fulton County District Attorney Fani Willis, and Federal Reserve Governor Lisa Cook. Perhaps most alarmingly, he's coming in at a time when Donald Trump has proven he's actively working to get the DNI's hands on domestic election oversight and interference projects of his own in this country. As we said, Tulsi Gabbard sullied her record forever, her legacy, when she showed up at a DOJ raid of Fulton County's elections warehouse, an operation she later testified to Donald Trump told her to oversee. Well, Pulte is fired up and ready to go on that front and clearly willing to pick up where Tulsi Gabbard left off. It's where we begin today with some of our favorite experts and friends. Former CIA director and our senior national security and intelligence analyst John Brennan's here. Also joining us, former DHS chief of staff during Donald Trump's first term. Miles Taylor's here. And rounding out our esteemed panel, political analyst, host of the Bulwark podcast, Tim Miller's here. Tim, I'm going to start with you because there's nothing for an intelligence person to say about this person. This is a political hack. And he's now the dni. What happens next?

[Tim Miller]

You're correct. I mean, he is, he's the most, this is a person. There's never been somebody with this little experience being nominated for a cabinet level job in the history of the Republic, honestly. And that includes the Secretary of war that was a former weekend talk show host. Right. I mean, at least Pete Hegseth was in the military. Bill Pulte has no experience about this at all. Calling him a political hack is even kind of too kind to him.

[Nicole Wallace]

He's like mean to us political hacks.

[Tim Miller]

Yeah, right. And he was a corrupt grifter. He didn't really have any skills in politics. He really didn't demonstrate any skills in politics besides sucking up to Donald Trump. I mean, among the other things he was doing was, if you remember during the pandemic, the kind of meme stock push where people were pushing up random stocks like Gamestop that had no value and running up their stock number. And then there'd be a rug pull and the big investors would make money and the regular investors would lose their shirt. Bill Pulte was one of the people that was involved in that. He's done the same thing with crypto rug pulls, promoting worthless, I don't know if I can say the word s coins. And having people invest in these worthless coins where he makes money and his friends make money and regular people lose their money. And then at the, at the Federal Housing Agency, the main thing he did was use his access to mortgage documents. He also Made himself the head of Freddie and Fannie to go after Trump's political foes. And that's like the extent of his political work, actually going after political foes with dubious attacks based on the way that they filed their mortgage documents. So that is this guy's track record. And that's why he's been chosen to run dni, because he showed that he would do what Trump wants, which is use the power of the government to go after political foes and try to things about them that can cause them problems. And the good news about this is that Lisa Cook and Tish James are still unfazed and Adam Schiff by his efforts to dig through their mortgage documents and make sure they dotted the I's and crossed their T's. But hopefully he'll be that ineffective at dni. But I don't think that he's in this job to actually do the job of the Director of National Intelligence. Not only does he not have intelligence, I don't that he's brought in there to do that. I think that Marco Rubio and the other people in Donald Trump's national security team will continue to do that work. I think he's in there to do the dirty work, to do this sole job of now using his expanded access to the information about Americans to try to go after Donald Trump's political foes. I think that will be basically his only duty there. And he's gonna have 210 days to do it. Cuz that's the length that you can be in an acting cabinet level position, bar some intervention from Republicans in the Senate, which I don't expect.

[Nicole Wallace]

Well, Director Brennan, we already heard the threshold for Thune and Cornyn to intervene. They're talking about. Thune says quota have to go through a confirmation process. No, he won't. Ms. Tim just said he has 210 days to be there as an acting. I don't imagine they'll put him up and put him through a confirmation process. Donald Trump can have him do whatever he wants him to do in an acting capacity without being vetted, without being confirmed. And I wonder if you let your imagination run a little wild, how much damage he can do there.

[John Brennan]

Well, a lot of damage, Nicole. And I must admit that Donald Trump has outdid himself. I didn't think it was possible to find someone less qualified than Tulsi Gabbard to be Director of National Intelligence, but Trump actually has. And so this is the person who serves as the President's principal intelligence advisor. That's in statute that's in law. And so what signal does this send, first of all, to places like Russia, China, Iran, North Korea? It shows a total disregard and disrespect for the whole intelligence community of the United States. What signal does it send to our allies and partners? Trump does not care about intelligence. He puts someone like this wholly unqualified, without any intelligence experience to be the head of the 18 intelligence agencies, to try to orchestrate them, to make sure that they are delivering for the American people and national security. And what message does it send to the workforce of the intelligence community? He cares so little about the intelligence community.

[Liz Oyer]

He puts some.

[John Brennan]

Somebody, someone like a Bill Pulte who's a charter member of the Trump lick spittle club, has no qualifications whatsoever to actually be the leader for these number of days or whatever. And yes, he doesn't have to be confirmed by the Senate. But again, the signal it sends to our adversaries, to our allies, to the workforce, it shows that Trump is really intent not just on disregarding the work of the intelligence community, but I think really destroying it.

[Nicole Wallace]

You know, I think sometimes we can project our concerns and we can study the patterns here in, you know, year 7000 or year 9 of the Trump story, but sometimes they just say it out loud. And Miles Taylor saying it out loud is what Steve Bannon and a far right activist named Jack Posebyc did today. Here's what Bill Pulte will be doing as acting dni.

[Miles Taylor]

He's looking for action, action, action. Does Bill Pulte have decades of experience in intelligence? No.

[Tim Miller]

Is that actually necessary to fill this billet?

[Adopt Us Kids Narrator]

No.

[Tim Miller]

Remember, those were some of his top

[Miles Taylor]

targets as well as who else? Letitia James and Fanny Willis.

[Tim Miller]

So look at the signal, not the noise.

[Miles Taylor]

Fanny Willis, that's Georgia. What do we know that Tulsi was working on at dni? Georgia?

[Tim Miller]

I certainly hope that the appointment of

[Miles Taylor]

Bill Pulte over there, while Bill isn't, is a time where the DNI can actually start digging in on the domestic side of terrorism as well as the international.

[Liz Oyer]

Oh, it has to.

[Tim Miller]

I think that's why they, I think it's one of the reasons Pulte selected

[Miles Taylor]

because Pulte will go there. What's coming, Miles, digging in on the domestic side. You know, I went back in time, Nicole, and like four years ago, I came on your program to talk about one of my biggest worries that I know Tim shared, I certainly know the director shared, which is that in a second term, Donald Trump would use the spy powers of the federal government for revenge. The writing was on the wall. Why? Because Donald Trump was the one holding the Sharpie doing the writing. I remember in his first term, I can tell you when this happened, October of 2018, I remember getting a phone call from John Kelly, who was White House chief of staff, talking about how Donald Trump had been spouting off about the need to monitor the phones of White House staff. He wanted to tap the phones of his employees. Why? Because he was worried they were saying bad things about him to each other and to the media. John Kelly didn't need to worry about executing that order because he was never going to break the law to spy on White House staff on behalf of Donald Trump. But that's the key. John Kelly wasn't going to do it. And I've always said that the only reason Donald Trump wasn't able to abuse the spy powers of the federal government to fulfill his revenge designs is the people under him weren't willing to go to prison for him, at least at that period of time. Now it's apparent that Donald Trump has found the type of acolytes who are clearly more than willing to do things that could get someone, a reasonable person, thrown into prison. And to put people like that inside of the spy community, that is the worry here. Let me remind you what happened at the Federal Housing Finance Administration. It wasn't just that Bill Pulte allegedly dug through the files to dredge up information on the president's adversaries. After the inspector general opened up an investigation into that, guess what happened? The inspector general got fired, the ethics investigators got fired, and then loyalists got put into those jobs. There is an active cover up that was being investigated at the fhfa. So we're not just talking about someone who may be weaponizing his powers. We're talking about someone who may be involved in covering up that weaponization and who's now going into a place that by definition operates in secrets and compartments. That's where Donald Trump wants his revenge investigations to live as far away from the light as possible.

[Nicole Wallace]

I guess I'll spoil this one for everybody. Your White House staff was lying. Not lying, was lying. If they were saying they weren't leaking about you. We literally couldn't get off the phone in the first term because one would call and interrupt the other who was calling to talk about the crazy thing they spared the country that you wanted to do. Donald Trump. The other piece, though, is more important. And I just want to surface some of Ms. Now's reporting. A grand jury was investigating whether Bill Pulte and Ed Martin improperly appointed unauthorized people to help in mortgage fraud investigations of Trump's critics. The investigation you're talking about, Miles, the Government Accountability Office opened an investigation into Bill Pulte after Senate Democrats asked for a review of his referrals to DOJ alleging mortgage fraud. I mean, if you look at the damage that he did to the rule of law with access to housing and mortgage information, I'll ask you the same question I asked Director Brennan. What do you imagine he'll do inside the intelligence agencies?

[Miles Taylor]

There is no limit. There's no limit. Look at what has already happened in one of these cases. Take John Bolton. Regardless of what you think about the facts and circumstances in the prosecution against John Bolton, people forget that that case, that was reportedly a zombie case that had died in the Biden administration they decided not to pursue. It came back to life when Donald Trump's appointee at the Central Intelligence Agency brought forward information over to the Justice Department and the FBI. That's still an unexplored thread about why the CIA was getting involved into an investigation into one of Donald Trump's top enemies that also, at the time, sprouted worries. Wow. What if they start using other information, foreign intelligence, information collected by the US Government to look into Donald Trump's enemies? Anytime I travel overseas or Tim travels overseas, or you or Director Brennan, there's probably a pretty good chance when we're out there making cell phone calls and sending emails that foreign bad guys are hoovering up our communications. Well, what if the CIA is also grabbing those and the DNI and they're seeing what we're talking about in our private lives, and the president's appointee over there decides he wants to look into that information. He wants to see what was said in those phone calls. He wants to see what we're saying to our wives and husbands and friends. And who is to look over their shoulders and stop them from doing that? This was once a B movie plotline that's now very possible inside this government with people who seem equipped to do it.

[Nicole Wallace]

Yeah, I want to ask all of you to stick around. I mean, you've also got their full frontal war against the free press and all of the spy powers that you could envision them deploying in that fight. Also ahead for us, Acting Attorney General Todd Blanche is testifying right now on Capitol Hill follows Donald Trump's stated plan to abandon his $1.8 billion slush fund to pay his allies and supporters, including enough to potentially violent insurrectionists. Blanche's testimony comes as more and more politicians from the right and the left are saying today that Donald Trump is likely to bring this back to life, to revive it, to reward his allies. Plus, it's one thing for us to have to wake up every day to Trump's deranged social media posts. But now Donald Trump appears to be flailing on the world stage. He is reportedly frustrated and bored by the war in Iran. Secretary of State Marco Rubio starts a debate on Capitol Hill about what the meaning of the word war is. And later in the broadcast, another big primary day in America with voters from New Jersey to New Mexico to California, California casting important votes ahead of this year's midterms. Jacob Sobroff will be on the ground for us talking to voters. We'll bring him to you as well. All those stories and much more and Deadly White House continues after a quick break. Don't go anywhere.

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[Miles Taylor]

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[Tim Miller]

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[Carolyn Linnig]

I was at Fulton county, sir, at

[Liz Oyer]

the request of the president and to

[Adopt Us Kids Narrator]

work with the FBI to observe the this action that had long been awaited.

[Nicole Wallace]

I was not aware of what was

[Carolyn Linnig]

in the warrant or was not.

[Dish Network Announcer]

And what was the president's specific request for you to go to what was the specific request for the president for you to show up in Fulton county

[Nicole Wallace]

to go and observe the FBI's activities on this issue? Director Brennan, if Tulsi Gabbard was asked to observe the FBI's activities on the action. And the action was raiding the elections office in Fulton County, Georgia. What is the plan?

[John Brennan]

You got me, Nicole. I have no idea why Tulsi Gavard was directed supposedly to observe what was going on there. The Director of National Intelligence does have a role in terms of conducting assessments or overseeing assessments about any type of foreign interference in our election system, but it has no operational role at all on any of these matters. And I think, as both Tim and Miles alluded to, the Director of National Intelligence, Intelligence, though, does have tremendous ability to authorize certain types of intelligence collection, surveillance programs and activities that could be directed purely for political purposes. And so while Tulsi was willing to do things at Donald Trump's behest, having someone like a Bill Pulte, who I think has demonstrated his time already in government, that he's willing to go to great lengths to go after Donald Trump's enemies, this is just abject politicization of the intelligence community process. And when you have a leader like Bill Pulte, again, who has no experience, no qualifications whatsoever, but has now will have tremendous authority and responsibility as the Director of National Intelligence, Tim, what's important

[Nicole Wallace]

to note is that all this information is coming from Steve Bannon on a public broadcast from things that are out in the open. And when I say that he won't even apply himself to this job, that's because it won't be his only job. Donald Trump posted this quote, I'm appointing the director of the Federal Housing Finance Agency and Chairman of Fannie Mae Freddie Mac Bill Pulte to serve as acting Director of National Intelligence, blah, blah, blah, experience managing the most sensitive matters in America, the safety and soundness of the markets, $10 trillion at Fannie Freddie, a substantial increase from where it was 12 months ago. During this period, he will remain in those jobs as the Director of Federal Housing Finance Agency and the Chairman of Fannie and Freddie. So he's going to have three jobs. Clearly, Donald Trump isn't interested in any functional operational dni.

[Tim Miller]

No, of course not. I have something to be pretty alarmed about. But first, I think there is something interesting about the fact that he's going to have three jobs. And that is maybe my only quibble with what Miles said before the break about how that they. Their ability to investigate enemies and go after enemies is limitless. And it might be limited slightly by having the horses to do so. And the fact that they can't find enough stooges to do all these jobs is like the tiniest Silver lining here. And I expect that we'll start to hear more leaks out of DNI and there's some remaining people that are legitimate public service folks that still work there. And so I'm slightly skeptical about his ability to execute on all this. On the other side of that coin, a part of the reason that he can do the three jobs is that again, like, he's not going to do the job of Director of National Intelligence. Like, he is only put in there to do the muckraking, to go after the political foes. Like that's why he's there. And I think that there's some areas about that in particular that are pretty concerning. And that's where I go back to the Tulsi Gabbard thing in Fulton County. And I might not be an intelligence expert like Mr. Brennan, but I am a little bit of a MAGA ologist and I just think back to the 2020 election fraud ST and think about all of the fake allegations of foreign interference. There were Italian satellites, Venezuelan, the Hugo Chavez and the Venezuelans had gotten inside the Dominion voting machines. They were all the Chinese bamboo ballots in Arizona. They had all these accusations that there was foreign interference on behalf of the Democrats that were all false. This falls in his remit now, though, with the FBI DNI counterintelligence remit. Now you have Kash Patel and Bill Pulte that can either chase these fake investigations, fabricate them, do what they did on the mortgage documents, come up with small pieces of evidence that Democrats or election officials were communicating with overseas people in ways that might have been totally appropriate but seem suspicious to me. I think that is the real plan. And if you go back to his 210 day period as an acting DNI, that takes us through the election and through the seating of the new Congress next year. And that's where I have my Spidey sense up.

[Nicole Wallace]

In particular, Miles, if you look at who the guardrails were, they were lifelong Republicans, Chris krebs. Bill Barr, Mr. Rosen, I think was the name of the person who replaced Bill Barr. Mr. Miller, I think was the person at the Pentagon. I mean, the people who found those theories too batshit crazy even for maga. Were all MAGA officials in good standing with Donald Trump until he wanted to steal the 2020 election?

[Miles Taylor]

That's right. And, and now to Tim's Spidey sense, they're going to weaponize the things that those folks put in place to try to protect our elections. So Chris Krebs and I helped write something called Executive Order 13848. This is the one that Donald Trump and his flunky lawyers think gives them the authority to go seize ballot machines. And if they suspect foreign interference, okay, because I co wrote the executive order, I can tell you it does not give them the authority to do that. We actually wrote that executive order after Director Brennan had made very clear that the Russians meddled in our election, tried to nuke our democracy from the outside, digitally, by plane. And so what we did was we wrote an executive order for the president, for any president to be able to automatically sanction any country that meddled in our elections. That was it. That's all the executive order does. But a bunch of lunatic lawyers have reread it with creative beer goggles and said, no, no, it gives us the power to go seize voting machines. It gives no such power. But people like Bill Pulte will happily put on those beer goggles for Donald Trump when they look at the law. That's the worry. That's the thing that we're, I think, concerned about here is this is the equivalent of Donald Trump naming his golf caddy as the Surgeon General because the golf caddy never corrects his score.

[Nicole Wallace]

And we can't make jokes like that anymore because tomorrow's another news cycle. And that may very well be what we have to cover with some semblance of a straight face. So let's put a pin in those until this moment has passed. Miles, please. Director John Brennan, Miles Taylor, Tim Miller, thank you all for starting us off on the story today. Coming up, as Acting Attorney General Todd Blanche testifies on Capitol Hill, there is alarm growing among Trump's own political party that he and his Department of Justice will find a way to reward insurrectionists with taxpayer funds, even if the slush fund is ostensibly killed. We'll bring you that reporting next.

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[Nicole Wallace]

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[Nicole Wallace]

Acting Attorney General Todd Blanch is right now on Capitol Hill. He's expected to face questions about Donald Trump's politically toxic slush fund, which the Trump administration announced yesterday was slash is dead. For now, many lawmakers, including Republicans, are expressing public worries that the fund could somehow be revived. After all, Trump is a man who considers politically toxic, more of a challenge than a warning. As Congressman Jamie Raskin writes, quote, we would be making a mistake if we treated this judicially compelled interruption as a final conclusion to this mad ripoff scheme. It is not close to the end of the story. Agreeing with Congressman Raskin, none other than Proud Boys leader Enrique Tarrio. Tarrio was convicted of seditious conspiracy for his role in January 6th. He told PBS News this, quote, this isn't an abandonment. They simply state they're going to wait two weeks. I believe even if this fund is killed in courts or at a congressional level, the president will find a way they can just settle the tort claims and lawsuits that has no judicial review or congressional oversight. And it would mean a lot more money and compensation, end quote. I want to bring in senior investigative reporter Carol Lennig. Also joining us, former Department of Justice pardon attorney Liz Oyer. She was fired by Donald Trump's Department of Justice after refusing to reinstate actor Mel Gibson's gun rights. Caroline, bring me the latest reporting you have about the whole settlement. The slush fund is just a part of it. The other part of it is, of course, promising that the IRS will never investigate Donald Trump or his kids or his businesses ever, right?

[Adopt Us Kids Narrator]

That's right, Nicole. And you know, that promise, just to bring viewers up to speed, that promise of immunity was never really disclosed when this slush fund was created. This retrospective effort to protect Donald Trump and his family from any audits or civil or criminal liability for a tax record that investigators concluded was a long decade running criminal conspiracy. And it's part of the reason that federal judges gathered together in a motion last week which apparently was very persuasive to the judge overseeing this case and said that they believed a fraud had been committed on the court because of the lack of disclosure about that immunity, that blanket immunity. You asked Nicole, rightly. What do we know? What's the latest? What we know is that senators are beside themselves about whether or not this, as Senator Tillis called it, pork payout for punks, whether this is going to be revived, whether it has any chance of being sort of resuscitated in the future. You know, the Justice Department has concluded they're not going to fight right now over a judge's decision to stay moving forward with the slush fund because of the concerns about fraud here, because of the concerns about how this was structured. And. But that doesn't mean the Department of Justice can't whip around and do something different in two weeks. As Enrique Tarrio says, a lot of Donald Trump supporters are telling us that Donald Trump is basically hurting the party. These are political supporters and allies and advisors that he's hurting the party, hurting the Senate, hurting the midterms with this desire for this slush fund. And it has to be dead. Ding dong, the witch is dead, or else there is going to be a political cost for the entire party.

[Nicole Wallace]

The problem with covering lying liars and the lies they tell as lawyers is that Todd Blanche, since we've been on the air, testified that they are not moving forward ever with the slush fund. But to all the reporting that exists and to Enrique Tarrio's interview with npr, he's been promised money. He's been promised that they'll settle the claims and pay them. And you describe this as, quote, your pick for the single most corrupt of Blanche's actions, the settlement of Trump's $10 billion lawsuit against the IRS. Explain.

[Carolyn Linnig]

Well, we're well past the point of, take Todd Blanche's word for it. He really doesn't have any credibility at this point. And the way that this has played out really just illustrates that the whole thing was a sham to begin with. Donald Trump's lawsuit was frivolous. A court knew that it was frivolous. It was circling the drain, on the verge of being dismissed when this settlement agreement. Court is now rightly investigating whether that was a fraud on the court, whether that was deception by the Justice Department and by Donald Trump's personal attorneys, which clearly it Was. Now the Justice Department is trying to save face by walking away from this and they're misrepresenting the circumstances of how that has happened. There was a, a tweet yesterday from the Justice Department's official account that was really stunning because it essentially said that a court has struck down the settlement fund. It said that a court found that the Justice Department under no circumstances can move forward with this settlement fund. And they go on to say, while we disagree with the court, we're going to abide by the court's ruling. So that is them saying essentially we're walking away from this because the court said that we had to, not because we made a huge political mistake. That's actually not true. The court put a 14 day pause on the enforcement of the settlement fund so that the parties could brief the question of whether it's legitimate and enforceable. No court has said that it's not valid. And the Justice Department is, you know, trying to mischaracterize that in order to save face, which really just shows that we cannot trust anything that is coming out of Todd Blanche's mouth. What is to hold him to that position that this is not going to be enforced ever. There's no reason to just take his word for it and believe it. The same way that there's no reason to take his word for it and believe it, that Glenn Maxwell is not going to get a pardon. He just has zero credibility. And we need to see something much more concrete than Todd Blanche saying this isn't happening before we can believe it.

[Nicole Wallace]

Right. There's not a single example where he hasn't done exactly what Donald Trump has told him to do that's in the record. Yet I'm going to do two things and ask both of you to stick around. I'm going to show you some of this questioning that is underway and we'll bring you more of the reporting on the political fallout. What Carol Lanig is talking about from the slush fund. Don't go anywhere. I wanted to ask what your plans

[Adopt Us Kids Narrator]

were for the fund after June 12th.

[Liz Oyer]

So thank you. So, look, we're not moving forward with the fund. You're right that there's a date that in the case in the East District of Virginia in June. But we are not moving forward with the fund, period. The reasons for

[Nicole Wallace]

period, I don't know. I have kids, Carolina. I was looking for the cross fingers behind the back. What do you make of that?

[Adopt Us Kids Narrator]

Well, I think it was really valuable that you used that particular clip, Nicole, because minutes later I'm alerted by colleagues here at Ms. Now, minutes later, after that question and answer session happens, he goes on to say the acting attorney general goes on to say that he will not promise that the Department of Justice won't move to protect its rights in litigation. Which kind of leaves this open question, why are you saying that? What are you trying to protect if you are not going to move forward with this fund? I understand why Liz and others fear that they can't really put a lot of faith or stake in what the acting attorney general has said. As a reporter covering what's been happening, it's been really striking to see the whiplash that Todd Blanche has gone through. I mean, he, I understand from sources, was not a fan of this slush fund. It was created without his knowledge and it was a surprise to him initially. And then he was brought out to say that it was a great idea just last week and totally defensible. And now it's apparently not a priority and not worth pursuing. I think we don't know what Todd Blanche's motives are, but clearly the Senate has really rattled the White House's cage and said, what are you doing over there?

[Nicole Wallace]

The only thing I'd add on the timeline, Liz, is that the Senate Republican meeting didn't go very well. Todd Blanche got the, you know what kicked out of him, and that was behind closed doors. Here's what Alyssa Slotkin said in terms of an issue that has extraordinary political salience and that is the flagrant, brazen corruption of the Trump administration at a time when the economy is ailing.

[Liz Oyer]

Now, we understand and we've heard that the president is waving the white flag or starting to wave the white flag on not moving forward with this fund, at least right now. But if you believe for one minute that this guy will settle down and not pursue this, just look at the other case that came over here at the same time as the weaponization fund. And that's how we fund the ballroom that he's building. President told the entire country over and over again, don't worry, this will be privately funded. It won't cost the taxpayer dollars any dollars. When the bill came over here just a couple of weeks ago, they're asking for a billion dollars to pay for that ballroom. So if you believe that a temporary two week hold by this president means anything, I have a bridge I want to sell you. And the tip of the iceberg of the corruption that's gone on this administration is this weaponization fund. But it is obvious that between his son's cryptocurrency scams between him literally offering pay for play deals for the ballroom, that this president is marching us through unprecedented corruption and milking the cow that is the US Government every single day.

[Nicole Wallace]

Liz, it's one of the longest running Trump scandals is the flagrant public corruption that he and his family engage in. But it has newfound political salience, and I don't understand all the reasons. Perhaps it's the fact that every time you drive by a gas station, the price of gas is higher. People are really struggling. For some reason, Donald Trump's out in the open corruption, and that of his family is really bothering voters. What do you make of the cases being prosecuted by Democrats?

[Carolyn Linnig]

Well, I think that what we're seeing here is that this whole thing about the slush fund really was a sleight of hand. Donald Trump did not care at the end of the day about whether these folks who were supposedly going to get payouts get them or not. What he cares about money coming into his own pockets. That is what Donald Trump cares about. And so whether other people who were supposedly wronged by the Biden administration get paid at the end of the day is not what Donald Trump is really after. He is after this other part of the agreement, which is the most corrupt piece of it, which is the agreement that the Justice Department will back away from these audits of his taxes, his family's taxes, his company's taxes. They will agree not to bring any claims against him in the future for any misconduct in office. That is really what Donald Trump is after here, because that's what's valuable to him personally. And that is the the most corrupt part of the agreement. I think that if the rest of it falls apart, if the slush fund never happens and nobody gets paid besides Donald Trump, he will consider that a victory. He will claim credit for trying to get his friends and allies a payday. And at the end of the day, he is the one who's going to walk out the door with all of our cash.

[Nicole Wallace]

Let's listen in to some of this questioning.

[M]

The acting attorney General of the United States, I didn't.

[Liz Oyer]

What are you saying is a conflict? I don't understand what you're saying. Listen, the fact that I used to have a job and I have a

[M]

current job, I've got less time left. But I take. On what you're doing on this, is that you've taken one piece and you said, okay, we have had a ton of backlash on this $1.8 billion flush fund, however, so we'll, well, we not Move on that. But as part of the settlement, which you've said, which is this immunity for the President and his family and his business, et cetera, that stands. Thank you for that.

[Liz Oyer]

It's not immunity, ma'.

[John Brennan]

Am.

[M]

Thank you.

[Liz Oyer]

It's a promise.

[M]

Thank you. It's immunity.

[Liz Oyer]

It's not immunity. Okay, so it's not immunity. What it says is like anytime the IRS settles with an individual taxpayer or another company as part of the settlement, it's standard, it's typical to get rid of past ongoing audits. It's not a forward looking document. It's nothing that gives any sort of immunity in the future to the President or his family or his organizations. And so by you saying that, it's just, it's not true.

[M]

By you saying what you've said, it is not true. So thank you. And I yield back.

[John Brennan]

Time of the gentlelady has expired. Mr. Clyde, thank you.

[M]

You're an attorney here. I never got something this year.

[Liz Oyer]

Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

[Nicole Wallace]

And Liz, I mean, he's getting pressed there about the settlement part of this. His answer is quite parsed. But explain what the, what she was describing as immunity, the, the protective piece of the settlement really was and what his dodge there means.

[Carolyn Linnig]

Yeah, she's right. The Supreme Court has already given Trump immunity from criminal prosecutions. What he's getting here is immunity from civil lawsuits by the United States. Todd Blanche has waived away our rights to seek any recourse against Donald Trump for any ill gotten gains while he is in office. All of this money that he's lining his pockets with, that belongs to the taxpayers. We are not going to be able to try to get that back after he leaves office because of this agreement. And the same goes for the money that his sons are pocke, the money that they are making hand over fist selling drones, getting government contracts, all of that corrupt abuse of the presidency is profiting the Trump family. And the number one interest of Donald Trump and his family is to be able to keep those profits at the end of this administration. Todd Blanche has enabled that by signing this waiver of claims, this release of claims that says even in the future after Donald Trump has left office, after Todd Blanche is no longer the Acting Attorney General, the United States will not and cannot sue Donald Trump to get our money back.

[Nicole Wallace]

Carol Linnig, I've talked a lot about David Farenthal's early body of reporting. He was at the Washington Post at the time. He's now at the New York Times about violations of the emoluments clause. I think he went to Pulitzer for that reporting. Donald Trump has been stealing from the taxpayer since the day he was inaugurated the first time. What is your way of sort of explaining and quantifying the scope and magnitude of the second term? Grift?

[Adopt Us Kids Narrator]

Yeah, David is a good friend and we worked together at the Washington Post when he was writing about the emoluments clause and the very, very, I mean, he was careful and conservative in his reporting, but it was the clear violation of that clause over and over every day. And in very small ways I helped David because one of the ways he was enriching himself, Donald Trump was in that first administration was taking everybody to bringing all sorts of foreign governments in to Washington, D.C. to stay at his properties where they were, you know, running up enormous bills at the Trump Hotel downtown and other places, renting the ballroom as if they were going to have a wedding for weeks and then and banks of rooms where they did not stay or very few people stayed. And all of that was to curry favor with Donald Trump and to line his pockets, essentially because foreign governments understood that the way to Donald Trump's heart and the way to getting what they wanted policy wise was to take those kinds of steps. I gotta say, Nicole, the emoluments clause violations now seem so quaint because of some of the things Liz is describing and some of the things we've reported at msnow and our competitors and friends at, at other news organizations have been reporting. Most recently the New York Times won the Pulitzer for great work led by Eric Lipton about just the unbelievable ways in which foreign billionaires and leaders are again lining Donald Trump's pockets. A sheik who put in a 49% stake into something near and dear to Donald Trump's heart, his World Liberty llc. I think it's an llc. But this, this way in which people are buying access to Donald Trump, buying what they need, is enriching the president in a way that the emoluments clause looks so trifling.

[Nicole Wallace]

The relativity is a hard story, I think, for all of us to tell, but there's no one better than the two of you. Thank you. Carolina Glassoyer, thank you so much for spending time with us. We'll continue to keep an eye on the hearing that is underway. Thank you. Way we'll keep you updated. We'll bring you any news that comes out of it right away. Quick break for us when we come back. Marco Rubio, the National Security Advisor and Secretary of State, having to answer for Donald Trump's war with Iran. What senators today are calling a quote, dumpster fire. Stay with us.

[Angie Hicks]

Hi, I'm Angie Hicks, co founder of angie. When you use ANGIE for your home project, you know all your jobs will be done well. Roof repair, done well. Kitchen sink install, done well. Deck upgrades, done well. Electrical Upgrade, done well. Angie's been connecting homeowners with skilled pros for nearly 30 years. So we know the difference between done and done well. Angie, the one you trust to find the ones you trust, find a pro for your [e-mail].