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Emily Harrington (3:21)

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Chelsea Handler (3:27)

Find support@hellodivorce.com I just announced all my tour dates. It's called the High and Mighty Tour. I'm coming to Washington, D.C. norfolk, Virginia, Madison, Wisconsin, Milwaukee, Wisconsin, Detroit, Michigan, Cleveland, Columbus and Cincinnati, Ohio, Denver, Colorado, Portland, Maine, Providence, Rhode Island, Springfield, Massachusetts, Chicago, of course, Indianapolis, Indiana, Louisville, Kentucky, Albuquerque Mesa, Arizona, Kansas City, Missouri, St. Louis, Missouri, Minneapolis, Minnesota, Nashville, Tennessee, Charlotte, North Carolina, Durham, North Carolina, Saratoga, California, Monterey, California, Modesto, California and Port Chester, New York, Boston, Massachusetts, Portland, Oregon and Seattle, Washington. I will be touring from February through June. So go get your tickets now if you want good seats and you want to come see me perform. I will be on the High and Mighty Tour. Hello. Hi, Kathryn.

Emily Harrington (4:32)

Ooh.

Kathryn Law (4:32)

Hi, Chelsea.

Chelsea Handler (4:33)

Hi. I'm on the heels of taking my adventure on the road. I'm heading to Antarctica in the morning and that is not a joke. I have three flights. I fly through Houston, Buenos Aires, and then Patagonia. And then I board my Barco and travel across Drake's Passage.

Kathryn Law (4:51)

Oh, my gosh. I heard that. That is like the choppiest water in the planet.

Chelsea Handler (4:55)

I know. I know.

Kathryn Law (4:55)

And have anti nausea pills.

Chelsea Handler (4:56)

Well, I. Okay, well, this is wood and I'm knocking on it. I have never had motion sickness.

Kathryn Law (5:01)

Right.

Chelsea Handler (5:01)

I mean, not unless a lot of, you know, drugs or alcohol were involved, which. Well, they will be. But I'm a very good seaworthy person, so I don't think I will. But I am bringing it just in case because this is going to be serious.

Kathryn Law (5:13)

Yes. I will say the scopolamine patches can make your vision a little bit blurry.

Chelsea Handler (5:18)

Well, we got Dramamine.

Kathryn Law (5:19)

Oh, okay. All right.

Chelsea Handler (5:21)

So is that.

Kathryn Law (5:22)

I don't know. That will make your vision blurry? I don't think.

Emily Harrington (5:24)

Yeah.

Kathryn Law (5:24)

But if you do have to upgrade to scopolamine patches, just cut it in half and we'll make your vision so blurry.

Chelsea Handler (5:29)

Okay, well, my vision is typically blurry. I mean, thinking about. Think about everything I'm putting in my body.

Kathryn Law (5:35)

Also because of the drugs and alcohol.

Chelsea Handler (5:36)

Drugs and alcohol. So, yes, I will be in Antarctica doing LSD with penguins and everyone will see me when I return.

Kathryn Law (5:44)

I'm sure the penguins will make you a changed woman.

Chelsea Handler (5:47)

So Emily Harrington is the first woman to free climb the Golden Gate route on El capitan in under 24 hours. She is a five time US national champion climber, has summited Mount Everest and skied most of the 8,000 meter peaks. Her new documentary is called Girl Climber and it's out now. Please welcome Emily Harrington. Hi, Emily. Hi, good morning. Top of the morning to you. Are you on a mountain peak as we speak to you right now?

Emily Harrington (6:17)

No, no, I'm in Tahoe.

Chelsea Handler (6:20)

I had to watch your movie twice because.

Emily Harrington (6:22)

Oh, really?

Chelsea Handler (6:23)

I couldn't believe it the first time. So I had to watch it again. I had to rewatch it. It's called Girl Climber and it will be available for everybody to stream. It's out on Jolt right now. And then it comes on some streaming platforms, I believe. Correct?

Emily Harrington (6:36)

Yes.

Chelsea Handler (6:36)

Okay, so let's talk about you and your peaks. Wow. First of all, how are you doing now? You have a baby, you're married. I feel like your energy and ambition has probably recalibrated a little bit.

Emily Harrington (6:52)

Yeah, I think that's a very accurate statement. Yeah, I've had some life changes since the movie. All good things. But yeah, just, you know, different. Different challenging and. Yeah. Energy. Sapping energy.

Chelsea Handler (7:07)

Yeah.

Emily Harrington (7:08)

Right.

Chelsea Handler (7:08)

Well, first of all, congratulations on being the first woman to climb El Capitan, the Golden Gate. You did that in less than 24 hours. You also climbed Mount Everest when you were 25 years old. So it's like, I don't know where to begin. Let's begin there. Since that happened first, you did that without really any training, you went and climbed Mount Everest with a group of people, left your Sherpa in the dust because he couldn't keep up with you. So talk to us about that decision and about how one decides to do something like that without the proper quote unquote training. I don't say quote unquote. Cause you do fucking need training to do that, right?

Kathryn Law (7:41)

Ice climbing and all that.

Emily Harrington (7:42)

Yes, you do. And you know. Yeah. Without specific training. But you have to remember that I've been A rock climber since the age of 10. So.

Chelsea Handler (7:50)

But that's not in snow though, is that.

Emily Harrington (7:52)

I mean, no, but I also grew up skiing and then, you know, in my early 20s, I started kind of diversifying in my climbing and I learned how to ice climb. I actually like wondering an ice climbing competition like earlier that year. So I had like, started acquiring the skills. I would say I just didn't have very much altitude experience, which I think is, is very important for something like Mount Everest. But thankfully it all worked out.

Chelsea Handler (8:20)

Well, yeah, it did work out. Tell us about it though. I mean, there was this. There's a great scene in the movie where you're stuck in the tent with your girlfriend who has since sadly passed away in an avalanche, which. But as you were, as you were talking about climbing Mount Everest, there's part of it where there are like five avalanches a day that happen and you have to just kind of time it right so that you don't get caught in one. I mean, that sounds absolutely fucking crazy.

Emily Harrington (8:46)

I think to, you know, the lay person, it might be a bit insane. Mount Everest is a very interesting place. I've learned a lot since being there myself. I think As a young 25 year old, I was pretty naive. Now I'm married to a mountain guide who goes to Mount Everest every year. So I have quite a different perspective on it. But yeah, it was a wild experience. It taught me a lot. It was a radical departure from anything that I was used to in my climbing. You know, Mount Everest is walking up a big snowy hill for a very long period of time with this like, excruciating suffering of high altitude. It's not technically difficult like I was used to in rock climbing, so those types of skills are actually quite easy for me. But at the same time, there was, there was a lot of suffering. There was a lot of what we call type 2 fun, which is like the, in hindsight looking back, like, oh, that was actually pretty cool, even though I was fucking miserable the whole time. So, yeah, it was, it was a really. I, I think it was a valuable experience. It changed my entire life because that was where I did meet my husband. Um, so I have a lot to thank for Everest.

Chelsea Handler (9:53)

That's not good advice for our listeners. That's how you meet your soulmate, by climbing Mount Everest. Because I mean, how many people are gonna be able to just whip it out and do that when you're doing these things? Because I think a through line of this movie is your fear, not your fearlessness. It's pushing beyond your fear. And it's about really kind of the adrenaline that comes from beating your fear and moving past any sort of boundaries that we may set for ourselves and also committing to the pain of it. Right. The pain is a side. It's kind of almost a side notion. It's like that's part of the process to get where you're going. Kind of one of my takeaways from watching this is that a. You wanted to be up there. Like, you know, you didn't want to be thought less than as a woman because women are, you say this in the beginning of the film, inferior or thought to be inferior physically to men. And you wanted to prove that that's not necessarily true.

Emily Harrington (10:49)

Correct? I mean, I think more than anything, I wanted to prove something to myself. And I think throughout the. That journey on Golden Gate, it became more evident that it was much more an internal struggle than an external struggle. That said, I do think the film did a really nice job of kind of like expressing these more feminine characteristics of vulnerability, of expressing fear, crying, showing emotion. And it kind of, you know, a lot of these things that are perceived of as weaknesses. I think the film does a really nice job of kind of revealing those things as strengths. I was very vulnerable. I was very honest about my fears and my struggles and my failures. But I think a lot of those things are what eventually enabled me to. To be successful because I did become comfortable sitting in those spaces of fear and struggle and failure. And I think those are pretty important human experiences to have that a lot of us just don't get to have in daily life. We don't get to confront those uncomfortable things very often.

Chelsea Handler (11:50)

The movie starts out with you attempting El Capitan with Alex Honnold, who we all know from Free Solo. And you kind of weren't really as prepared as you would want to have been. And then you go back again the next year, you do more training, and then you train on El Capitan, and then you make a third. You make your next attempt. Right. So it's kind of like, how do you frame those periods of time that were in the movie from the beginning to the end? Like, when you look at that, do you say, do you think, oh, I wasn't prepared enough? Like, do you. You accept that?

Emily Harrington (12:21)

Yeah, absolutely. Like, I think that first attempt, I actually knew that I wasn't prepared. But sometimes you need to kind of like, try the thing in order to figure out what you need to do differently. Like, you have to go fail in order to find out what needs to change and what you need to improve upon. And so for me, that attempt was actually just. I didn't really expect to be successful. Like, the weather didn't look good. The season was really tough. The entire wall was wet. Like, the odds of success were pretty slim, but it was like I need to go try to kind of like see where I'm at and see where my fitness is and see the weak points so that I can like go back and train and then I can come back and be better. So you kind of have to go. I had to go fail in order to like figure out what to do.

Kathryn Law (13:05)

Almost like a dry run.

Chelsea Handler (13:07)

Right, Or a wet run.

Emily Harrington (13:08)

It was a dry run.

Kathryn Law (13:09)

And to be fair, you got like wetland and hailed off the side of the mountain. So fair.

Chelsea Handler (13:14)

Yeah, so. And then you go, okay, so then you go back and start trading with him, which, by the way, great support system. I mean, he's like the best, the best climbing buddy you could possibly have. And your husband, of course, is also a great support system. But I mean, it felt like, you know, the first time I watched it, I wasn't sure how many times you had done it. I was like, wait, did I just watch her four or five times do the same thing? And then I realized, oh, okay, this is you practicing and this is you on a pitch where you fall down a pitch and then you redo the pitch. So there's all these kind of different. There's all these different kind of technical terms that I wasn't familiar with. But I mean, it's an incredible feat and it's incredible strength of mind because you talk us through when you were younger and you know you had an eating disorder, you were eating only carrots for a certain period in your life where your mother was said your arm, your hands turned orange because you were only eating, eating carrots. And to be doing your physical activities with that little nutrition and what you were doing in terms of rock climbing and ice picking and all of those things, like the wear and tear that that must have had on your body and the innate strength that you had to even continue to do that in those conditions.

Emily Harrington (14:19)

Yeah, I mean, I think eating disorders are pretty pervasive in the sport of climbing just because it is kind of a, a strength to weight ratio sport. And you do see like really short term gains. And it's very obvious when it happens. But like, it is short term, like it doesn't last. And so I think for me, I just started emotionally and physically breaking down and recognizing that climbing was making me really unhappy. And it was becoming a punishment. And that's actually when I started transitioning into other avenues of climbing different disciplines. That's when I had the opportunity to go to Nepal, to go to the Himalaya. And then the following year I went to Mount Everest. And with that kind of climbing, you really cannot get away with not fueling properly. Like, it's just not an option. You just won't go anywhere on the mountain. And so that was really eye opening for me, was like, oh, actually, like I need to fuel my body in order to, to be successful. And it took several years for me to kind of like wrap my brain around it. I kept kind of having, falling back into the bad habits. But I think, you know, thankfully I had some really good mentors and really good influences on me. And then I did kind of diversify and go into this other realm of climbing and, and, and recognize essentially what I was doing wrong. That the approach was, was just flawed.

Chelsea Handler (15:34)

And how, how was the approach flawed? Because of the eating disorder or because of everything surrounding that?

Emily Harrington (15:40)

I think everything. I think the idea of trying to control every single thing in my life and having this really like perfectionist mindset and being super hard on myself if things didn't go perfectly, um, it was just beating me down. And then the eating disorder was kind of a, you know, it was kind of just like an effect of all of those feelings. And then it was like a cycle of punishment. Like if I didn't succeed, then I had to train harder and I had to eat less and I had to do more. And so it was just like this cycle of exhaustion and punishment and honestly just unhappiness. And I think a lot of like athletes can, can relate to being kind of stuck in that space.

Chelsea Handler (16:17)

And do you think that's more of a female thing, female athlete thing, or do you think eating disorders are pervasive among, in sport as well?

Emily Harrington (16:25)

I think it's pervasive among men as well. I just don't think it's as talked about.

Chelsea Handler (16:29)

Right.

Emily Harrington (16:29)

I don't think it's as accepted for men to talk about it even. But I do know some men who have struggled with it and you know, I think that they're much more prone to kind of like hiding it and not talking about it and having it. People not really like, think it's an issue with men, but I very much think it is.

Chelsea Handler (16:47)

Okay, so halfway through this movie, you're attempting to climb. You start, I think at 4 in the morning, you're attempting again to climb El Capitan, you're with Alex and his. His girlfriend and you have a fall.

Emily Harrington (16:57)

You fall.

Chelsea Handler (16:57)

How many feet did you fall?

Emily Harrington (16:59)

I think I fell like 50ft. It's something.

Chelsea Handler (17:02)

I mean, how did you not get more injured during that fall?

Emily Harrington (17:06)

I don't know. Honestly, I think it was like one of those super lucky situations. I completely like flipped upside down and I think I flipped upside down and there was so much. There was so much slack in the system that the rope actually caught me on my neck and like burned my. I had like this crazy rope burn up all up and down my neck and I did hit my head. I lost consciousness. So for me, like, I don't remember a whole lot because I did lose consciousness. I think it was like far more traumatic for the people who were there and rescued me.

Chelsea Handler (17:36)

And that's all caught on camera. So that was also incredible. Cause you're hearing you scream and you don't know exactly what has happened to you. And then we see you in the hospital and we realize that you. You are injured, but you're not. It's not like you can't walk again. Which is what Alex was worried about when he heard that fall.

Emily Harrington (17:53)

I think we were all worried about that. I did have back pain, but then like I went to the hospital and they were kind of in disbelief too. They were like, you felt how far? Like, oh my God. And then they did all these tests and they were like, you're fine, you can, you can leave. So, you know, I had a concussion, obviously, but. And mentally I think I was pretty shaken. And it took me a while to kind of like get back to a place where I felt comfortable climbing again, where I could really trust myself. But yeah, I got, I got incredibly lucky.

Chelsea Handler (18:22)

And it's just such a mental, like when you. I'm watching this movie and watching you, I just felt such a. An understanding of like, it's almost. I mean, of course it's physical, it's all physical, but it is so more. It's if not more mental than commensurate to how physical it is. I want you to talk to me about that. What part of you do you think is mental and for this kind of thing or. And what part is physical?

Emily Harrington (18:46)

I mean, I think it's massively mental. I think the ability to kind of look at this 3200 foot wall and say, okay, I'm going to try to climb it in under 24 hours. It's just a massive mental and emotional undertaking. And it's really hard to not feel incredibly daunted when you're standing at the bottom. So it very much is a process of, like, breaking it down into these more digestible pieces and maintaining composure over this really long, long period of time. And then there is a level of exhaustion that you eventually reach, you know, halfway up the wall, two thirds of the way up the wall or whatever that may be. And there is, like, this mental component of, like, you have to keep going even though you feel exhausted. I mean, it's just like any endurance sport, where you really have to kind of like, dig into those mental reserves and the mental endurance in order to kind of like, keep. Keep moving. And you have to have a lot of belief and a lot of faith that you do have that little bit of extra to keep going.

Chelsea Handler (19:44)

Yeah. What would you say to people who are. I mean, who are struggling with that? Because it's any athlete. You know, I was just at the U.S. open, and you could see people who are not mentally, like, you know, they're tougher physically than they are mentally. Their mental game isn't there. And then when you see people who are mentally clicked in, you know, you could see how they are just unbeatable. Like, they just keep going and they keep going. But it's not something that is, you know, it's not a permanent state of mind to be mentally prepared for something.

Emily Harrington (20:12)

No, it's not. But I. I think that it has to be trained, just like your body has to be trained. And I think that's a lot of things that, like, maybe amateur athletes don't often recognize is a lot of these elite athletes are doing mental training alongside their physical training. So they're preparing their minds just as well as they're preparing their bodies for, like, the big. The big day or the game or whatever the match or whatever that is. And it does. It takes a lot of work up front to kind of prepare your mind and then, you know, be ready for when circumstances arise that are out of your control on the day to kind of, like, deal with those circumstances and deal with the pitfalls and keep going. I think it. It. You have to think of it like a muscle. Like, I do work with a sports psychologist who kind of, like, has helped me for years get to the point where I'm ready on the day. And I just think that that's often something that's missed, is that we also, like, train our minds just as much.

Chelsea Handler (21:09)

And do you think you were leaning. I mean, of course you were leaning on Alex kind of in an emotional way. Right. Even though he was there to Climb with you, you know? Cause watching it, first of all. But they don't show your sports psychologist in this movie.

Emily Harrington (21:22)

No, it's like a little clip of me talking to her on the phone. Okay. There's quite a bit of liability with that, I would imagine.

Chelsea Handler (21:31)

How did you feel? How did you feel watching this film and seeing yourself at all these different stages in your life?

Emily Harrington (21:38)

It's funny because everybody sees the film and then they, you know, everybody kind of, like, thinks they know you and they know your story, and part of that is true. But it really, truly is just like this little snapshot of my life. And thankfully, I really like the movie. I think it's done quite well. I'm really proud of it, and I'm proud of the whole team. And so it's been a really fun kind of reliving of the whole journey. It's been pretty nostalgic. And I think after, after I did Golden Gate, I went through this period of time where I was kind of downplaying it in my head. I think a lot of athletes go through this. You kind of do the thing and then you're a little depressed and everything feels melancholy, and you're like, well, what am I doing now? I'm lost. I definitely went through that. And so now that the movie's out and I've had some distance from it, it's been really fun to kind of feel proud. I don't think I felt like this is the most proud I've felt of the actual achievement, because I got to kind of relive it with all these people, and people are inspired by it, and that's just such a cool process to go through. Yeah.

Chelsea Handler (22:37)

How many times have you climbed it since then? Since you've, since you've had a baby?

Emily Harrington (22:43)

No, I haven't, I haven't been back. I mean, no, I have been back. I've been back every year. I just haven't been to El Cap. I've climbed in the valley, at other areas, other walls that are quite a bit shorter. I haven't quite, I haven't quite gotten the, like, fire back to climb on that wall. Every time I drive into Yosemite, I look at it and I'm like, oh, my God, it's so big. I can't believe I did that. So I'm, yeah, I'm getting there slowly, but it's been kind of a long road to get back to that style of climbing for me. I, I, I do still climb a ton, and I train really hard. And thankfully, there's all these different styles of climbing that kind of like are a bit easier and less time consuming than free climbing on El Cap. So I, I still rock climb a bunch. I haven't made it back to El Cap yet. But I really hope so. You hope so.

Chelsea Handler (23:27)

And now you. And you climb with your baby, right? I mean, I guess they're not a baby anymore. Toddler.

Emily Harrington (23:32)

Toddler. He's. He's two and a half. Yeah, we. We try to do trips that are like kind of like friendly for families. We have a bunch of like all of us have kids now. We're just all like aging athletes. Like Honnold has two kids now. So we all go together and like bring the vans and go and it's just like complete chaos. But we all get to climb and kind of help each other out and it's, it's super fun. But yeah, we bring him along. He's like pretty excited. He's pretty stoked on like swinging around on the ropes and like talking about climbing. But yeah, it's kind of like a family affair now.

Chelsea Handler (24:06)

Another thing I'm really jealous of is that you've skied so many peaks in so many different countries. What is it? 8,000 peaks? Is that what it says?

Emily Harrington (24:13)

8,000 foot peak, 8,000 meters.

Chelsea Handler (24:16)

8,000 meters. 8,001 peaks. I'm like, who's counting all those peaks? 8,000 meters?

Emily Harrington (24:22)

I haven't done 8,000 peaks. Yeah, I'm a skier. You're a skier?

Chelsea Handler (24:27)

I love skiing. Yes. But I mean, I've never done anything like that.

Emily Harrington (24:30)

No.

Chelsea Handler (24:30)

I would be fucking shitting my pan.

Emily Harrington (24:33)

I mean, skiing was my first passion. I started skiing when I was 2 years old and I was a ski racer and I quit for climbing. And then I moved to Tahoe when I met my husband. And he's a. He's like a professional big mountain skier. So he's skied like a lot of the biggest mountains in the world. And I've like joined for some of the trips. But for me, skiing is like, I've since rediscovered it. It's total second passion. And it's just like this really amazing alternative to climbing that I have where like, I don't have any like weird expectations or performance or like anxiety or identity like wrapped up in skiing. Like skiing is for me. It's like this amazing, fun, lovely activity for me to do with my husband. And it's just like one of my favorite things. Like sometimes I'd much rather go skiing than go climbing because it just is such a refreshing alternative to like my Career, which is rock climbing.

Chelsea Handler (25:28)

Right, right. And in what ways do you think that you've applied what you've learned from actually accomplishing that and having. Having such. Not a bumpy road, but you know, your challenges along the way to accomplish what you set out to do, which was climb El Capitan in less than 24 hours on that route. Like, how have you been able to measure how that experience has influenced your, like, mother. You know, being a mother or. And having a baby and being a parent, like, how does it influence your decisions or challenges that you face in your real life?

Emily Harrington (26:01)

Yeah, I mean, I just like to say that having a kid is like embarking on a lifelong expedition. Like, when you go on an expedition, it's like you're. You're like. Sleep gets all fucked up. You're, like, not eating as well as you want. You're not. You don't have a routine. Like, you're exhausted. But you still have to, like, perform, and you still have to, like, keep moving forward, and you still have to keep trying. And that's kind of what parenting is. It's like, some days it, like, sucks, and you're tired, and, like, nobody's happy, but you just, like, keep moving. And every phase is temporary, and you just keep going. And, like, when you look back on it, you're kind of like, oh, yeah, actually, like, that was a great memory. That was a super fun time, even though it was, like, really hard. And so I think we've sort of applied that to our parenting. It's just, like, another adventure that we're embarking on, and we're still, like, trying to do all the same things. We're still trying to go places. We're trying to be skiers, we're trying to be climbers, we're trying to be athletes, and we're trying to incorporate our son into it. Of course, like, things have changed, and we've, like, pivoted a little bit, and we have different priorities, and we approach risk completely differently than we used to. But that's not to say that we don't still take risks. I think risk is, like, a very healthy part of living, and it's something that we should all, like, talk more about. So, yeah, we just kind of, like, view it in. In that framework of, like, what we've always done in our lives. And, like, we're going to keep doing what we do. We're going to keep trying hard. We're going to keep trying to do hard things. Being a parent is also hard, but it's also like, really fun. And we've chosen it. And so this is like our chosen, like, suffering and our chosen adventure. And it's mostly awesome.

Chelsea Handler (27:36)

Well, I like what you said about taking risks. Like, how does that apply to being a parent? Like, what are some ways in which you take risks as a parent? Because I think people think about that as, like, a solo journey, right? Risk taking, like, oh, that's about me, and you're only putting yourself at risk. But is there any way in which you do that as a parent?

Emily Harrington (27:54)

Yeah, I mean, we take risks in our own, like, athletic endeavors still, my husband and I, and we talk very clearly about those things. And we, you know, kind of like, weigh whether or not the. The experience or the achievement is going to be worth the risk. And some things just nowadays just aren't as worth it. So we. We kind of don't do them. We back off. But also, we, like, encourage our kid to take risks. We encourage him to think about risks. And, like, if he falls down, he falls down and he learns something from it. We don't really feel like we want to be like, the bubble wrap parents and kind of like, prevent him from. Yeah, prevent him from experiencing, like, failure and, you know, getting hurt and stuff like that. I mean, obviously there's, like, guardrails that we have, but I think for the most part, we're, like, pretty stoked on bringing him along for adventures and, you know, really open to talking about risks. And I think, you know, it's going to be harder as he gets older. I think that's the trick with parenting is like. Like, when your kid finds their passion, hopefully they find their passion, you know, not really worrying about. About those things and really worrying about what could happen to them. I think that's gonna be, like, one of the biggest hurdles right now. It's, like, all very simple. He's two, so, like, it's not. It's not that hard. The decisions aren't that hard yet.

Chelsea Handler (29:06)

Yeah. In the movie, you talk about the first time you went rock climbing and like, that you said a light turned off. I would say probably on or off. Right. When you experience that, just talk a little bit about finding the thing that moves you.

Emily Harrington (29:19)

Yeah, I feel super lucky that I had that experience. I was 10 years old and we were at this. I grew up in Colorado. We're at this lake, and there was one of those artificial walls, and I climbed the wall, and I just remember, like, I was really afraid because I could, like, feel the air under my feet, and I felt exposure. And I was like, Feeling fear. But I just like kept going, kept going and got to the top and came down. And it was just like this really empowering feeling to be afraid and feel exposure but continue to work through it and get to the top. And it was just one of those feelings where I just. I immediately went to my dad and I was like, how do I do this again? Like, this is what I want to do. I just. I want to do that again. So I went. He took me to the climbing gym and then everything just took off from there.

Chelsea Handler (30:05)

And I know it's obviously a mostly male sport. Like everything in the world is. So what is the community like with climbers? Because in the movie there's feature, you know, there's other climbers featured. Some are mostly male. There's a couple of women in there. What's the vibe like? Do you go in a group typically? Do you ever go by yourself or is that a. No, no. You always need a buddy.

Emily Harrington (30:25)

Yeah, it depends on what you're doing. I will say that climbing is. It's growing massively. It's an Olympic sport now and it's just like exploding across the world because of climbing gyms, I think, and the female participation has just skyrocketed. And it is one of the only sports, I think, where the difference between men and women is quite a bit narrower and it's getting more narrow. Like, some of the best climbers in the world are females. Some of the most well known climbers in the world are females. Because it is a very complicated sport. It rewards strength, but it also rewards flexibility. And it also rewards like, you know, puzzle, like the ability to solve puzzles. And it rewards body awareness. And so there, there are these spaces where females can really excel. And we have, and we do have these like standout achievements in climbing. Like what Lynn Hill did in the early 90s when she was the first person to free climb El Cap in a day like that is like the most groundbreaking achievement in rock climbing. And it is owned by a woman and everybody knows it. So in that way, climbing is very unique. That said, there are, you know, there's obviously more male participation than female. And when I was growing up, I basically like just climbed with boys. There weren't that many girls. But now it's like, like just so different. Yeah, when we go rock climbing, generally if you're climbing with a rope, you have a partner. And so I go with my husband or I have friends around. I have a lot of friends, like I said, who have kids now. So we kind of can all Go together. If I'm going to the climbing gym, I sometimes will just go by myself and put my headphones in and just like go get my workout in. That's like the most effective, easiest way to, to train is to just like go by yourself and do your thing. So yeah, it's, it's a mix. But if you're going outside, generally I have a partner. Cause I like to climb on a rope or with a rope.

Chelsea Handler (32:12)

Do you mentor any young climbers? Any young females?

Emily Harrington (32:16)

Yeah, I mean, I think I'm sort of stepping into that role as a mentor right now, especially with the film coming out. I am also a part of the North Face Global Athlete Team, which is this really amazing, like, it's a very like, well formed team of athletes. And we get together and there are opportunities to mentor the younger athletes. I've now been on the team since 2008, so I'm like one of the older athletes on the team. And growing up I had mentors like Conrad Anker, who brought me to Mount Everest, and Hilary Nelson, who's in the film. And so now I'm sort of stepping into that role with the younger athletes on the team, which has been super fun. And then also I'm now working with this nonprofit called Z Girls, which is like mental health coaching for adolescent girls. And what it is is they like pair a professional athlete with a mental health coach. And we do these like virtual calls where we kind of help young girls. They're like ages 11 to 14, kind of like deal with all the struggles of being an adolescent and confidence and all of those things. And that's been kind of a really cool way to like mentor just more young women.

Chelsea Handler (33:19)

I was so amazed watching the film. Like when you guys whipped out of bed, like on the side of the mountain, I was like, wait, they're gonna go fucking sleep now. I'm like, I mean, it's kind of amazing what you can bring up there with you. Cause the definition of free climbing. You tell me, what's the definition of free climbing?

Emily Harrington (33:35)

Yeah, so free climbing is exactly what you imagine it to be. It is using your hands and feet to ascend a wall.

Chelsea Handler (33:42)

And no rope you use, use.

Emily Harrington (33:44)

No, you use a rope. So this is where it gets confusing. Free climbing is using your hands and feet to ascend a wall. And you use a rope and protection in case of a fall. Now that's. So it's. It's meant to be compared against aid climbing, which is how like back in the 60s, they climbed walls like El Cap. They would like, place protection and pull on the protection and they would use the ropes. That's called aid climbing. Because they thought it was impossible to free climb. Like, they thought it was impossible to. To climb just the rock itself. And now we have free climbing. The. The reason that it got fucked up is I blame Alex Honnold because of free solo everybody. The term free everybody just associates that with like, no ropes. Free solo is actually free climbing without a rope.

Chelsea Handler (34:26)

Okay.

Emily Harrington (34:27)

It's the term solo that differentiates it.

Chelsea Handler (34:29)

Okay.

Emily Harrington (34:30)

Free climbing is anything. If you've ever been to a climbing gym and you're like climbing on the little. The colored holds, that is free climbing. Like, anytime you're just using your hands and feet to ascend, that's free climbing. It's just like this umbrella term. And in general, we use rope and protection in case of a fall.

Chelsea Handler (34:45)

And what are you doing to eat on your way up? What are you taking for nutrients?

Emily Harrington (34:50)

I'm kind of like a snacker. So I would bring just like a variety of, like, bars and dried fruit and nuts and salty things, a lot of water. You know, we had like, a good support crew with us. So, like, Alex had a backpack with a bunch of stuff in it, and he wasn't free climbing. He was like, ascending the rope behind me so he could carry, like, a lot more. And then, yeah, we had. Adrian brought down some food for me. So, yeah, it's just like kind of. It's kind of like running an ultra marathon or like running a long race. It's like you kind of want to be fueling a little bit every hour, essentially.

Chelsea Handler (35:23)

Yeah. What did you think, Katherine, when you watched the movie? I mean, did you have to watch it twice like me?

Kathryn Law (35:28)

I didn't watch it twice, but I was wrapped like, my attention was just.

Chelsea Handler (35:33)

It was really intense. I mean, it really, like, real. Just tough stuff.

Kathryn Law (35:37)

Yeah. Two things that really were shocking to me. One being the choice to sort of announce that you were gonna do this project, that you were gonna free climb El Cap. Not the easiest route, but, you know, a different route, a harder route, in under 24 hours before you did it. Because if you hadn't announced it, like, no one would know that you, quote, unquote, failed a few times. No one would know if you never made it. But I thought that was so interesting that you chose to do that.

Chelsea Handler (36:05)

Did you do that so that you would do it?

Emily Harrington (36:08)

I mean, I don't know. I think, like, in this day and age, like, as an athlete, you're kind of like your own brand and so you do have to tell stories. And I'm a firm believer in kind of, like, bringing people along for the ride in all of its forms, like, in the failure and the success. And I think people are. But the reason people are so, like, kind of drawn to the film is because they can relate to it, because there is a lot of failure. And because I did tell the story and I wasn't afraid to, like, be vulnerable.

Chelsea Handler (36:39)

And you wanted to give up, and there were times where you wanted to give up, even while you were climbing, you were like, forget it. I can't do it. And they're like, you're gonna do. Your husband, I believe, was like, you're gonna do it today. You know, like, I mean, that is anything that is something that anybody can relate to is failing and wanting to give up and throw in the towel. But the perseverance, what separates, you know, the winners.

Kathryn Law (37:01)

And the other thing about that is that was after you had had a fall on that success attempt, you know, the attempt that you were successful, and that fall is so excruciating to watch where you just head first hit the wall, I mean, and end up with.

Chelsea Handler (37:14)

A hole in your head.

Emily Harrington (37:15)

Yeah.

Kathryn Law (37:16)

But the fact that you, like, stop, you have yourself a little cry, and then you go the rest of the way the fuck up the mountain, like, that to me, was so incredible. And you know what you were saying earlier about showing emotion, that is a perfect example of that. Like, you got that out of your system, and then you kept going.

Emily Harrington (37:32)

Yeah. And that's what I tell people. It's like, people are like, how did you keep going? Like, you wanted to give up? And it's like, yeah, I did want to give up, but I kind of knew, like, I also needed Adrienne there to be like, nope, you're not. You're not done. I would tell you if you were done. Like, you. You're fine. Like, we did first aid and everything. I didn't actually have a concussion, but I really needed to, like. Like you said, I needed to, like, get it out of my system and, like, have the cry, express all the doubts, like, express that I wasn't feeling confident. And then it was like, okay, like, all of that's out there. I got it off my chest, and now I can, like, try again. Which, honestly, like, logistically, it kind of was the easiest thing to do. Like, bailing at that position on the wall is quite difficult. Like, you're not. It's not just like, you're gonna, like, hop in your car and, you know, Go home and have a nice.

Chelsea Handler (38:17)

What does happen when one bails at that point? Cause I would, I would think you would just belay down or rappel down or what.

Emily Harrington (38:24)

Super convoluted and really difficult to do. Like you can't really repel straight down off that section of the wall for various nuanced reasons. The easiest way is up. So you could like ascend ropes basically or aid climb out. But at that point it's like why don't you just try to climb the pitch one more time, you know. So I like kind of big wall free climbing is cool. And it kind of like forces you into these positions like you're kind of like forced into trying to. Because it's actually just like kind of the easiest thing to do in the moment.

Chelsea Handler (38:54)

And what is that called when you're sandwiched in between like, like in a cave when you're crack? Yeah, the crack. What is it? What's the term for that? Is just a crack?

Emily Harrington (39:03)

Well, yeah, it's crack climbing when you're ascending a crack. But what we. When it's like wider than your, your hands can fit, then that's called like wide climbing or off width climbing. And it's this super like uncomfortable like specific style of climbing that is very unique to El Cap and other like, like, you know. Granite. Yeah.

Chelsea Handler (39:23)

I mean it seems impossible.

Emily Harrington (39:25)

It's like it like sucks. It's like my least favorite kind of climbing and I'm like not that good at it.

Chelsea Handler (39:32)

So when you summited and you got to the top for the first time when you, I mean the way you wanted to, I think you had done it before, but not that like not free climbing.

Emily Harrington (39:41)

Right.

Chelsea Handler (39:41)

So the first time you did it and you break down and you're emotional and you're joyful and all the things. And you say this really great line about like your hungry, you're wet, you're cold, but everything is perfect. Something along those lines, which I thought is a great. Yeah, I love that line. Yeah, it's really beautiful. And that kind of sums up everything that anyone would feel after fighting your way to get somewhere. What was it like for you to watch yourself do that and be in that state?

Emily Harrington (40:07)

It's so awesome. Like I always. Whenever the film is premiering and I have to be at a premiere, I always leave for the middle and then I always make sure to come back for the end. Cause I do. It's like, it's just so special and I just feel so lucky that I it. You know, I got to, I get to Experience it again. It was just such a relief, honestly. Like a relief and surreal and joyful. I was just so stoked. And then what people often don't realize is, like, you have to, like, walk back down off the top, and it takes, like, three and a half hours. So we were just, like, at the top, and then we had to walk back down. We got back at, like, 3am or something.

Chelsea Handler (40:45)

Do you walk down off the back of the mountain or you rappel back down?

Emily Harrington (40:48)

You, like, walk. No, you don't rappel down. You kind of, like, walk back and then wind your way around, and you actually end up having to do, like, three or four rappels, and then you. You hike through the woods and down. But it takes, like, three hours, and it's super easy to get lost. It's. It's just, like, a whole thing, especially.

Kathryn Law (41:03)

In the middle of the night, and.

Emily Harrington (41:04)

I know.

Chelsea Handler (41:05)

I know. I don't even understand how people do this in the middle of the night with a miner's lamp.

Emily Harrington (41:09)

What?

Chelsea Handler (41:09)

And also, all of those hooks. Are those hooks already on all these mountains? Because where do these hooks come from? Like, are they permanent on El Capitan that you're hooking your ropes to?

Emily Harrington (41:20)

Yes, so some of it is. So there are bolts that the first ascensionist, like, the people who go up there and, like, find the line and make the route, sometimes they put in bolts where they drill a hole in the wall and then they hammer in a bolt, and you can clip a carabiner to that, and that's how you clip your rope in. So the bolts are permanent. And then we have, like, traditional gear, which is, like. We have these devices called cams, and they're like. They're like pieces of metal. And you squeeze. You squeeze a trigger, and it, like, contracts, and you stick it in the crack and it expands, and it's actually super solid and will hold a fall, but you put those in and then you remove them. So we have, like, gear that can be placed permanently and then gear that can be removed, and it kind of just depends on the style of climbing and the place. Some places have specific rules about bolts. Like, some don't allow it. So it's all, like, again, very nuanced, but, yes, some of the gears up there and some of what we bring with us and, like, put it in and take it out.

Chelsea Handler (42:12)

Okay. Okay, we're gonna take a break, and we're gonna be right back with Emily Harrington from girl climber Limu Emu. And Doug here we have the Limu Emu in its natural habitat, helping people customize their car insurance and save hundreds with Liberty Mutual. Fascinating. It's accompanied by his natural allies.

Emily Harrington (42:36)

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The binoculars watching us. Cut the camera. They see us.

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Kathryn Law (46:34)

We are back.

Chelsea Handler (46:35)

We're back with Emily.

Kathryn Law (46:36)

Are you ready to give?

Chelsea Handler (46:38)

We're gonna field some if we're gonna field some questions from callers and give some advice. And I'm sure these are related to your experience in life.

Kathryn Law (46:44)

They'll all be in your wheelhouse, more or less.

Emily Harrington (46:46)

Okay, perfect.

Kathryn Law (46:47)

Okay, great. Our first question, this one's an email comes from Molly. She says, dear Chelsea, I need travel recommendations and advice on how to have fun, feel empowered, but stay safe while traveling solo as a 44 year old female. Oh, I'm finally out of a 20 year toxic marriage and looking forward to finding myself Again on the slopes after years of raising kids without much of a partner financially scraping by and wasting so much time, money and energy on getting legally unhitched. On December 25th at 12pm, I will be child free and on winter break from work for over a week. Chelsea, where should I go?

Chelsea Handler (47:24)

Tahoe. Go skiing?

Kathryn Law (47:27)

Yeah, she says, I used to love to travel Europe, but that was always in his shadow on his schedule, with his rules. I'm an avid skier, I've got all the gear, but finances are a thing. I've been saving and will have about $3,500 to spend on the whole trip.

Emily Harrington (47:41)

Soup to nuts.

Kathryn Law (47:42)

I love all the places you travel and I'm hoping to reconnect with the independent, intelligent 20 year old woman I was just before I met my ex. In the meantime, maybe I can know what it feels like to reclaim my narrative even for a week. I know you love Whistler and I'd be all in if I can financially swing it. What are some other places of your favorite places to go in the middle of winter to get away and have fun?

Chelsea Handler (48:01)

I think Tahoe has the most options and is the most affordable. Tell me if I'm wrong. I mean, Aspen's expensive, Whistler's expensive, Tahoe's a little bit more affordable with a lot of array and they've been having great snow for the last like five years. Do you agree with that, Emily?

Emily Harrington (48:16)

Yeah, I mean, I'm biased, but I love Tahoe and there are. We have so many ski resorts around Lake Tahoe that you can kind of like pick and choose. Some are more expensive than others. Some are more, you know, for expert skiers, some are more for beginner skiers. The terrain differs, but you do have a lot of options and a lot of traffic.

Chelsea Handler (48:34)

Like there's going to be a lot of people there, like in a good way. You know, it's Tahoe's really popular and it's accessible. It's not as bad as like some of these other ski towns where there's only one way in and one way out and if your flight gets delayed, you're on a bus for eight hours. I feel like Tahoe doesn't have that problem as as often as like a place like Aspen does, or even some of like, you know, Telluride or Jackson Hole, same kind of thing. So yeah, I think you should go to Tahoe.

Kathryn Law (48:59)

All right, Molly, you're going to Tahoe.

Chelsea Handler (49:01)

There you go.

Kathryn Law (49:01)

Excellent. Well, we do have people calling in, so our first caller today is Scarlet. She says, dear Chelsea, I could really use your take on a recurring family vacation issue. I live in the Rockies with my long term boyfriend. My family and his are both on the east east coast. To keep things fair, my boyfriend and I split the holidays. Thanksgiving with my family, Christmas with his. Especially because my family is Jewish and Christmas is my boyfriend's favorite holiday to spend with his family. The issue is my mom has a long standing tradition of surprise family Christmas vacations. She books the whole thing without telling us the destination, just sends a packing list and reveals where we're going at the airport. Cute as a kid, but as an adult she still books my flights and accommodations without asking me and it has made it difficult to balance the surprise trip and whatever else is going on in my life. I've directly asked her many times to please run trips by me before booking anything on my behalf, but it seems to fall on deaf ears. Or she just ignores me. One year in law school I had a chance to go abroad over winter break. I explicitly asked her to wait until I had my travel dates for the program and told her it would be my only opportunity to go before I was done with law school. As soon as I had the dates, I called her and lo and behold, she'd already booked the family trip anyway. I ended up cramming in both trips, bounced across four time zones and crashed so hard afterward that I barely kept up with classes. I fear this set a bad precedent because now it seems like as long as she books the trip first, she gets dibs on my availability.

Chelsea Handler (50:24)

She doesn't get to book your trip. This is ridiculous.

Kathryn Law (50:29)

So another Christmas issue that came up was the first year that she and her boyfriend decided to spend the holidays together. Her mom booked the Christmas trip without telling her and so she wound up having to go with her family and they'd already spent Thanksgiving with her family, so it was a little unfair on his behalf. So now this behavior has expanded to all family events. She gets passive aggressive if I say no, it keeps asking me to reconsider and honestly, I'm exhausted trying to juggle her expectations with my job as a brand new baby lawyer and my life in law school. I learned that if I don't bake in time for myself to recharge, my body will force me to repay that debt later via blinding migraines. So here's my question. Is it reasonable to skip family trips even if I'm technically available? Do reasons like work, needing a break, or just not wanting to go make me an asshole? I'm so resentful that even her generosity, she pays for everything, is starting to feel suffocating. Do I need to adjust my attitude, Scarlett?

Chelsea Handler (51:22)

No. I'm suffocated by this letter. It's too much. It's too much. She needs to chill out, and you need to put it in writing. Like, I have.

Emily Harrington (51:30)

Absolutely.

Chelsea Handler (51:30)

You, repeatedly. You are not listening to me. You are not hearing me. You guys are both splitting the holidays. Like, she has to respect that. Like, she has to respect that you're in a different part of your life now. You're an adult. You live with her. You're not her little daughter that she has to pay for to take everywhere. Like, that's just not the way it needs to go down. So I would recommend writing a very stern email saying you've left me no recourse but to actually write this letter to you. And these are the rules moving forward. Like, you're not telling me where I'm going. We're not doing surprise trips anymore. You have to get my permission before I agree to go on a vacation. What do you think, Emily?

Emily Harrington (52:06)

Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I could never let someone book a flight for me. I can't do it. I, like, way too controlling to handle that. Yeah. You gotta lay down the law for sure. Yeah.

Kathryn Law (52:18)

And I think, unfortunately, you're gonna tell her this again. She's gonna do it again. And I think the only way she's actually gonna stop is when you say, like, sorry, those dates are ones I told you were not available. And then you don't go on the trip. I think this is when she's gonna have to learn the hard way.

Emily Harrington (52:31)

Yeah.

Chelsea Handler (52:31)

You're gonna have to actually follow through on not going on some of these trips.

Emily Harrington (52:35)

Yeah. And I think that's been the hard part is, like, I actually have to. Even though she's paid for it, even if she beat me to booking my own trip, to still say no. And maybe that will finally be when it sinks in. What about timing? Do you have any. I think putting it in writing is a good idea, but I guess trying to find, like, a good time to talk about it. You know what I mean? Or. I don't know, anything.

Kathryn Law (52:56)

As early as possible.

Chelsea Handler (52:57)

Yeah, exactly. Today. You should do this today. Like, start crafting that email today so that because the holidays are coming up and you're gonna face this issue again, and you have to give her something that's close enough to the holidays. It's perfect timing. Go in preparation for the holidays this year. That's how you could start it out. I'm giving you this advance warning. I do not want you planning a vacation. Unfortunately, I've tried to express myself over the years, and you're not listening to me. This is what we're doing. We're spending Thanksgiving here. We're doing, you know, whatever. You decide that how you guys are gonna split, like, what you've been doing.

Kathryn Law (53:26)

And you can even give her the range of dates now, you know, because I guarantee she's already looking. She's already looking at dates.

Emily Harrington (53:33)

For all I know, she's already booked it.

Chelsea Handler (53:35)

But that's if you want to go. Do you want to go away with her this year?

Emily Harrington (53:39)

Not over Christmas, no. And I don't. And I think that. Yeah, like, I think from here on out, I'm just not going. And I think what's been tough is that, like, if I miss that or like, she's kind of been like, score keeping or she kind of, like, tracks. So it's like, for other family vacations too. She'll be like, well, you can work remote over here. We'll pay for everything versus, like, kind of under. Like, she only accepts a logistical reason for why I can't go. She doesn't really accept, like, a. I don't have the bandwidth for it right now. You know what I mean? Like, she wants, like, a real issue versus, like. Yeah, I don't know how to kindly explain. Like, it's not that I don't want to see them. It's that I'm too. I don't know, like, I just don't have the bandwidth or the energy or I just, like, would rather spend that time doing something else.

Chelsea Handler (54:24)

Yeah. And I mean, you don't have to say that, but you can just say that her controlling, like, nature is taking the fun out of these vacations for you. Also, you know that it makes you want to withdraw or retreat, that you don't necessarily want to go because of her insistence upon going.

Kathryn Law (54:40)

And I think the blinding migraines are a really solid reason. Like, I do need to take that time to restore because that's when people are gone. That's when nobody needs me. Like, that we find ourselves in that situation as well as, like, people who don't live in the same place. As we grew up, it's sort of on us to travel, and we had to make the decision a few years ago of, like, that's the only time we get to rest for the year. So, like, we're gonna stay home and we do miss Christmas with our families.

Chelsea Handler (55:05)

Emily, what do you guys do with your Families. Your respective families in the holidays.

Emily Harrington (55:09)

Yeah, I mean, it's pretty similar. Like, we, we definitely have to kind of, like, massage the situation a little bit sometimes and, like, accommodate people. But at the same time, I think traveling is exhausting and I think it can be really hard on, like, your body. And so I like being home for the holidays and I kind of like, laid on the law with it a little bit. But we'll, we'll do like, okay, we'll do Thanksgiving with you, but we're not doing Christmas or vice versa, you know? Yeah, it's kind of one of those things. It's like you kind of like, you want to be there and you want to, like, show that you love them, but only to a certain extent. Like, sometimes vacations can be, like, super stressful.

Chelsea Handler (55:45)

Stressful and hard, especially with your families, you know?

Emily Harrington (55:48)

Yeah, yeah. And like, family's important, but also, like, if you, you want to be, like, in a good mood and having good time with people when you're on the vacation, you don't want to be, like, resentful the whole time.

Chelsea Handler (55:58)

Also, you can also threaten. Like, like, if you don't listen to me now, then our next step is going to therapy together. You know what I mean? If you don't, if you don't hear me now, we're going to have to go to a therapist because that's what you're going to have to do. You're going to have to have someone mediate.

Emily Harrington (56:11)

Yeah. Because I think that's what the other thing that's interesting about. She gets to plan everything. She picks the destination and all of that sort of stuff. There's no buy in from anybody. You know, like, there isn't like a back and forth. It's just this thing that's decided for us and it's just been hard to. Yeah. Accommodate that. And I'm getting, like, very resentful of the whole thing, so.

Chelsea Handler (56:31)

Okay, well, good luck. Let us know what happens.

Emily Harrington (56:33)

Yeah, I will.

Chelsea Handler (56:34)

Even though we know what's gonna happen right away, we want the long term repercussions or the long term outcome, not repercussions.

Kathryn Law (56:41)

Email us after you write the email. And then also in January when you've had to have her cancel your part of the trip.

Emily Harrington (56:47)

Yeah, we'll see.

Kathryn Law (56:49)

All right, thanks, Scarlet.

Emily Harrington (56:50)

Well, thank you so much. It was so nice to meet you. Bye.

Chelsea Handler (56:53)

Bye. Scarlett, thanks for calling in.

Kathryn Law (56:54)

Thanks.

Emily Harrington (56:55)

Bye. Bye.

Kathryn Law (56:56)

So let's go to another. Another caller here. We've got Rachel calling in. She says, dear Chelsea, I'll start Off by saying I have a difficult relationship with my brother's wife. They've been together for over a decade, and our family has stayed mom and just accepted the fact that she's not going anywhere. Until I found out that they've been having marital issues, and she suggested a divorce. As much as I want to celebrate this news, my heart broke for my brother. Fast forward to now, and I find out they're supposedly doing great. How am I supposed to accept this and act like I don't know about their past issues? Everyone's telling me to leave it alone because I'm not supposed to even know this in the first place, but I want to talk to my brother about it. What should I do? Rachel.

Chelsea Handler (57:34)

Hi, Rachel, this is our special guest. Emily Harrington's here today.

Emily Harrington (57:39)

Hi.

Chelsea Handler (57:39)

Hello.

Emily Harrington (57:40)

Nice to meet you both.

Chelsea Handler (57:41)

Hi. Are you hiding in a closet right now, calling us?

Emily Harrington (57:44)

I am.

Chelsea Handler (57:46)

Perfect. Okay. So you heard that they were having problems from. Who told you?

Emily Harrington (57:52)

I was prying.

Chelsea Handler (57:53)

Okay. And so you've never heard anything from your brother regarding that? I have not heard anything from the.

Emily Harrington (57:59)

Source, but I have heard it from. Now, multiple sources at this point.

Chelsea Handler (58:04)

But you're. And he's saying everything's fine with their marriage? Well, as of the latest update about.

Emily Harrington (58:09)

A week ago, things are back to not being great.

Kathryn Law (58:12)

Okay.

Chelsea Handler (58:12)

Okay. Well, I think what you should do is very innocently let your brother know that you're there to lean on if he needs that. But I would. I would assume just from what you've told me and the fact that you are in a closet, that your brother knows how you feel about his wife and is probably not going to come to you with any information. So all you can do is just let him know that you're there if he knows about anything. And I wouldn't even make it specific to his marriage. I would just remind him that you're his sister and that you love him and that if there's anything he ever needs or wants to talk about that you're available. And I would leave it at that.

Emily Harrington (58:53)

Okay. I'm. I've been thinking about doing that. I just worry about by doing that, he's gonna know something's up, which then.

Chelsea Handler (58:59)

Yeah, but you're gonna.

Kathryn Law (59:00)

Like, even if no one told you, you can tell when people are, like, not getting along, having a difficult time. Like, you can cut. Just say I picked up on some things. You know, if he asks.

Emily Harrington (59:09)

Yeah, that's what I was kind of hoping towards. Like, the vibes seem to be kind of weird between.

Chelsea Handler (59:13)

Yeah, you can Say something like that, but just don't be, you know, like, when people aren't revealing things, it's hard to go in on them. Hard. You know, like, tell me everything. Like, it can't be gossip. It's his life. So just be sensitive to the fact. Emily, do you agree with that? What do you think?

Emily Harrington (59:30)

Yeah, I totally agree. I think being sensitive and being like, like, yeah, expressing that you're. You're there and you're supportive and you're a sounding board and you're always available to chat is good. It's hard because you kind of like, never know what's really going on in a relationship. Yeah. Unless you're like, in the relationship.

Chelsea Handler (59:48)

Even then sometimes you don't know what's going on.

Emily Harrington (59:50)

Yeah, exactly.

Chelsea Handler (59:52)

And it just seems to be so.

Emily Harrington (59:53)

Like, flip flop back and forth. So I never know, like, where they stand one day. And so I'm like, when do I approach it?

Chelsea Handler (59:59)

What do I say?

Emily Harrington (60:01)

Yeah. Even though I've never said anything.

Kathryn Law (60:03)

You're right.

Emily Harrington (60:03)

Like, he knows my feelings about his wife. Yeah.

Chelsea Handler (60:08)

So it's better to come, especially if he's having trouble with her, like, he might have, you know, oh, I can't talk to you because you. You already don't like her. You know what I mean? You have to kind of open up the avenue to say, like, anything is safe here. It's okay. You don't have to gang up on whatever's going on with her. It's like you just want to be there to be a support and listen to him. You don't have to go.

Emily Harrington (60:27)

Yeah.

Chelsea Handler (60:27)

She's such a bitch. Or I can't believe her. When are you going to leave her? That's not the right approach. I think you should really just be dialed into showing up for him and helping him in any way that he feels comfortable asking for help. Cause men are hard to help sometimes. You know, they don't. They're not effusive like women. We're not emotional. I mean, Emily and I were just speaking about that. You know, how it's so much healthier to be able to express your emotions. And I think the people that bring that out best in men are typically women. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Emily Harrington (60:57)

Especially my brother.

Chelsea Handler (60:59)

Yeah. So we wish you well.

Emily Harrington (61:01)

Thank you. Appreciate it. It was so nice meeting you both.

Chelsea Handler (61:04)

Nice to meet you, too. Take care. Take care.

Emily Harrington (61:06)

Take care. Bye. Bye. Bye.

Chelsea Handler (61:08)

Okay, and we'll be right back with Emily Harrington.

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Kathryn Law (61:24)

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Chelsea Handler (62:41)

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Emily Harrington (62:44)

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I just tap the bed to use.

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Kathryn Law (65:21)

Yeah, Agreed.

Chelsea Handler (65:22)

Yeah.

Emily Harrington (65:23)

Thank you. Well, thank you so much.

Chelsea Handler (65:24)

Yes. Take care.

Emily Harrington (65:25)

Thanks for having me on.

Chelsea Handler (65:26)

Yes, thanks. Absolutely. Bye. Bye.

Emily Harrington (65:28)

Bye, guys.

Chelsea Handler (65:29)

I just announced all my tour dates. They just went on sale this week. It's called the High and Mighty Tour. I will be starting in February of next year, so I will be touring from February through June. So go get your tickets now. If you want good seats and you want to come see me perform. I will be on the High and Mighty tour.

Kathryn Law (65:50)

Do you want advice from Chelsea? Write in to dearchelseapodcastmail.com Find full video episodes of Dear Chelsea on YouTube by searching eercelsea podcast. Dear Chelsea is edited and engineered by Brad Dickert executive producer Kathryn Law. And be sure to check out our merch@chelsea handler.com.

Chelsea Handler (66:13)

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Yep.

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Emily Harrington (66:55)

Not the cutest. Then I found pod 5 from 8 sleep and it changed everything.

Chelsea Handler (67:00)

It's built with women's health in mind and helps with those brutal hot flashes.

Emily Harrington (67:04)

It is a smart mattress cover that cools your body before a hot flash hits. And when I need an instant relief.

Chelsea Handler (67:10)

I just tap the bed to use.

Emily Harrington (67:12)

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Chelsea Handler (67:17)

By over 50% and it even cools each side of the bed independently. Go to 8sleep.com Chelsea use code Chelsea and get up to $700 off Pod 5. You'll thank me later. Dogs aren't just pets. We know this.

Emily Harrington (67:31)

Doug is one of the most important.

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Emily Harrington (68:26)

Then the space hamster flew his hot air balloon all the way to the bottom of the ocean.

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Emily Harrington (68:46)

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Chelsea Handler (68:57)

Ah, greetings from my bath festive friends.

Emily Harrington (69:00)

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Chelsea Handler (69:04)

Most of my money getting 5% cash back when I pay in 4. No fees, no interest. I used it to get this portable spa with jets.

Emily Harrington (69:13)

Now the bubbles can cling to my.

Chelsea Handler (69:15)

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Emily Harrington (69:21)

See paypal.com promoter points can be redeemed for cash and more. Paying for subject to terms and approval.

Kathryn Law (69:25)

PayPal, Inc. And MLS 910457 this is an iHeart podcast.