Cold War Film Noir & Kiss Me Deadly (1955)

Summary

Podcast Summary: Dear Movies, I Love You Episode: Cold War Film Noir & Kiss Me Deadly (1955)
Release Date: May 20, 2025
Hosts: Millie De Chirico and Casey O'Brien
Network: Exactly Right and iHeartPodcasts

---

Introduction and Personal Updates

The episode begins with Millie De Chirico and Casey O'Brien sharing personal anecdotes and updates, setting a warm and relatable tone for listeners. Amidst light-hearted banter about graduation experiences and the challenges of recording while battling Covid, the hosts establish a friendly rapport.

Notable Quote:

• Millie De Chirico [05:09]: “I kept looking around and being like, oh, yeah, there's people out here like me. They're older, some have kids, some are first-generation. It felt very emotional.”

Exploring Cold War Film Noir

Transitioning into the main topic, Millie and Casey delve into the niche genre of Cold War film noir, a subgenre that evolved from traditional film noir by incorporating Cold War themes such as paranoia, espionage, and the pervasive fear of communism.

Key Points:

• Definition of Film Noir: Origins in the post-Great Depression era, characterized by dark themes, crime, moral ambiguity, and the presence of the femme fatale.
• Cold War Noir Extension: Emerges in the 1950s, intertwining film noir elements with Cold War anxieties, including references to Soviet spies and nuclear threats.

Notable Quote:

• Millie De Chirico [25:53]: “Cold War film noir is just a little subset of the film noir tradition that's already happening.”

Kiss Me Deadly (1955) Analysis

The hosts provide an in-depth analysis of the 1955 film Kiss Me Deadly, highlighting its significance within the Cold War film noir genre.

Synopsis: Kiss Me Deadly follows Mike Hammer, a rugged private investigator played by Ralph Meeker, who becomes entangled in a complex conspiracy involving radioactive materials and Soviet espionage after saving a runaway woman, Christina, who is subsequently killed.

Themes and Discussions:

• Character Analysis: Mike Hammer is portrayed as an unapologetic antihero, embodying the flawed and morally ambiguous protagonists typical of noir.
• Cinematic Elements: The film’s opening scene is described as jarring and disorienting, setting the tone for its unconventional narrative.
• Ending Interpretation: The explosive conclusion serves as a metaphor for Cold War tensions and the unpredictable nature of nuclear threats.

Notable Quotes:

• Casey O'Brien [25:54]: “This movie came out literally 70 years ago.”
• Millie De Chirico [37:00]: “He keeps slamming guys' hands in drawers and taking the law into his own hands.”

Ralph Meeker: The Heart of Noir

A significant portion of the discussion focuses on Ralph Meeker's portrayal of Mike Hammer and his impact on the film noir genre.

Key Points:

• Performance: Meeker's depiction is lauded for its realism and intensity, distinguishing him from more charming or suave noir leads.
• Legacy: Despite not being as widely recognized as contemporaries like Bogart or Mitchum, Meeker’s work in Kiss Me Deadly has garnered appreciation among noir enthusiasts and influenced modern portrayals, such as Leonardo DiCaprio’s character in Once Upon a Time in Hollywood.

Notable Quote:

• Millie De Chirico [54:21]: “Robert Ryan is like the perfect mix. He’s a real hard-boiled meanie, but he’s actually a big softy.”

Parallels Between Cold War Noir and Modern Times

Millie and Casey draw parallels between the Cold War era's paranoia depicted in film noir and contemporary societal tensions.

Key Points:

• Cyclical Nature of Paranoia: Just as Cold War noir films reflected the fears of their time, current events suggest a resurgence of similar themes, such as mistrust and ideological divides.
• Relevance of Noir Themes Today: Issues like loyalty, identity, and societal corruption remain pertinent, making film noir a timeless lens through which to view modern anxieties.

Notable Quote:

• Millie De Chirico [52:42]: “Maybe we're moving towards another one of these eras. Movies become relevant again.”

Build a Noir: Creative Segment

In a playful and interactive segment titled "Build a Noir," Millie and Casey collaboratively create a hypothetical film noir scenario, combining classic elements with inventive twists.

Creative Process:

• Setting: The iconic Ennis House in Los Angeles, known for its Mayan Revival architecture, serves as the backdrop.
• Characters:
  • Leading Man: Robert Ryan as a gambler with a tragic backstory, perhaps an ex-military man who owes money to mob bosses.
  • Femme Fatale: Ida Lupino, embodying a hard-edged, less traditionally feminine allure.
  • Buddy Character: Eli Wallach as a quirky, mustachioed sidekick involved in shady dealings.
• Plot Elements: Incorporates Cold War motifs like nuclear threats, with a MacGuffin involving radioactive materials hidden in a bikini factory.
• Unique Twist: Introduction of "horny aliens" adds a surreal and humorous layer to the narrative.

Notable Quote:

• Casey O'Brien [77:48]: “Don't bet on me on a bikini. That's stupid.”

Employee Picks and Film Recommendations

The hosts share their personal film recommendations, aligning with the episode’s noir theme while also branching into related genres.

Recommendations:

• Millie’s Pick: The Boy with Green Hair (1948) – A children’s fantasy film with underlying themes of individuality and societal conformity, featuring Robert Ryan.
• Casey’s Pick: Under the Silver Lake (2018) – A neo-noir film exploring LA’s conspiracy-laden subcultures through a surreal narrative.

Notable Quote:

• Millie De Chirico [81:14]: “It’s an allegory for being different in the era of McCarthyism.”

Conclusion and Teaser for Next Episode

Millie and Casey wrap up the episode by engaging with their audience, inviting listeners to submit film-related queries and recommendations. They also provide a sneak peek into their next episode, which will focus on the 1984 film Purple Rain and its cultural impact, particularly relating to Prince.

Notable Quote:

• Millie De Chirico [86:37]: “We're going to talk about this movie that you may have heard of called Purple Rain from 1984.”

---

Conclusion

This episode of Dear Movies, I Love You offers a comprehensive exploration of Cold War film noir, using Kiss Me Deadly as a focal point to discuss broader themes within the genre. Through engaging dialogue, insightful analysis, and creative segments, Millie De Chirico and Casey O'Brien provide listeners with a deep dive into the interplay between cinema and historical context, all while maintaining an accessible and entertaining narrative.

Transcript

[Millie de Chirico]

This is exactly right.

[Justin Richmond]

This is Justin Richmond from Broken Record. Are you the kind of person who sets standards for themselves? Like, personally, I told myself if the Lakers lose or do or die game five, I wouldn't let it impact my mood at home with family. The standard Lexus has set for themselves is to experience amazing. Lexus measures success by the feelings and emotions evoked in a driver, like exhilaration and joy. Amazing can only be achieved by knowing people on a deeper level. The standard of amazing results in machines that make you feel more human. Because a car that doesn't make you feel something is a car that stops short of amazing Experience. Amazing at your Lexus dealer.

[Casey O'Brien]

Are you still quoting 30 year old movies? Have you said cool beans in the past 90 days? Do you think Discover isn't widely accepted? If this sounds like you, you're stuck in the past. Discover is accepted at 99% of places that take credit cards nationwide. And every time you make a purchase with your card, you automatically earn cash back. Welcome to the now it pays to Discover. Learn [e-mail] credit card based on the.

[Millie de Chirico]

February 2024 Nielsen report I've never felt like this before. It's like you just get me. I feel like my true self with you. Does that seem sound crazy? And it doesn't hurt that you're gorgeous.

[Casey O'Brien]

Okay, that's it.

[Unknown]

I'm taking you home with me.

[Millie de Chirico]

I mean, you can't find shoes this good just anywhere. Find a shoe for every you from brands you love like Birkenstock, Nike, Adidas and more at your DSW store or dsw.com Casey, how are you feeling?

[Casey O'Brien]

Hi Millie. Uh, not good. I have Covid, but I'm such a bad person.

[Millie de Chirico]

That makes you record while you have Covid.

[Casey O'Brien]

It's okay. I'm power. This is my first time having Covid, so that's kind of thrilling. I'm always late to the party on fads, but Millie, I have something to say to you. As we go on, we'll remember all the times we had together. Congratulations on graduating.

[Millie de Chirico]

Was that pop and circumstance that you just sang?

[Casey O'Brien]

That was vitamin C's graduation.

[Millie de Chirico]

I have not heard that song in 20 something years. How long has it been since that song has been out?

[Casey O'Brien]

Let's see. Vitamin C. Graduation. Is that the Friends Forever Graduation Parentheses Friends Forever 1999.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yeah, I thought the lyrics that song were just Graduation Graduation. Guess not. That's sweet.

[Casey O'Brien]

Did you. Did you embrace a group of friends after your graduation and say we'll be friends forever?

[Millie de Chirico]

No, I didn't I actually. This is so funny that you say this, because I was looking around going, I don't know. I don't know a goddamn person in here. This is so bizarre. Like, well, the way that they do it and. And thankfully they did it like, this is that they did all the masters people in one session. So basically they. They used to do everything. When I was undergrad, it was like, undergrad, master's, PhD. Now the school is so big that they have to break it up. So it was only master's people, you know, so it was just. If you were. If you got a master, if you got an mba, if you got a Master of Arts, Fine Arts, whatever it is, like you would. You all. We were all in the same graduation, but I looked around and I was like, I don't know a damn person in here. I don't even think I see the dean of my college in here. I don't know where anybody is. My parents came. They were sitting in the nosebleeds. I mean, like, real high up. And so I couldn't hear them scream when my name came. So it was like. It felt very. Like I just showed up to a ceremony. Showed up just to, like, walk around in a robe.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah.

[Millie de Chirico]

And also it was raining, and we had to stand outside in the rain waiting to check in to the damn graduation. And I got rained on. I got rained on, man.

[Casey O'Brien]

I'm sorry. Did you throw a hat in the air?

[Millie de Chirico]

No, they don't do that anymore. No hats get thrown.

[Casey O'Brien]

That was when I graduated high school. They didn't let us do that either.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yeah. And actually I had to. I had to retrofit my hat to my big ass head because the graduation hats, by the way, can we, like, fucking change the style of graduation hats? They're so ugly. They don't fit right.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah.

[Millie de Chirico]

So I had to, like, go on YouTube to find out how to stick. You can actually, like, people do a thing where they cut it and then they stick a headband inside of it so it's so they can put it on top of their head so it doesn't fall off. So I did that.

[Casey O'Brien]

No, that's clever.

[Millie de Chirico]

So I was like, well, I'm not throwing this shit. I worked on it.

[Casey O'Brien]

Well, congratulations, Millie. I mean, it's a huge accomplishment, and I know it took some time, but I think it's so great that you put in the work to finish it. Now it's done. You did it.

[Millie de Chirico]

You know, I have to say, when I was in there, when I was in the ceremony, even though I didn't know a damn person. I did feel I was. I was trying hard not to cry at several moments because it does feel like an accomplishment. And I kept looking around and being like, oh, yeah, there's people out here like me. They're older. Some of them have kids, some of them have. Are first generation, you know, first people in their family to get a master's. It's very emotional. And it's like, you're just so proud of people for sticking it out and totally. And we're never paying those loans back. Like, none of us are paying our loans back. So it's fine, but it's just. It's emotional to. I feel very proud of myself. So thank you.

[Casey O'Brien]

That's good. And you should thank. And we're all proud of you too. Like, it's so easy to. It really is so easy to give up. It's so easy to give up on things you're working on projects, degrees. And to actually finish it means you did it. You actually did it, you know.

[Millie de Chirico]

Well, and thank you for saying that because, you know, we're going to talk a little bit about Los Angeles today.

[Casey O'Brien]

Oh, we are.

[Millie de Chirico]

But the reason why it took me 11 years is because I actually left the program when I moved to la.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yes.

[Millie de Chirico]

So I. It took. And I was in L. A for five years. So then I had to come back and grovel to. For them to reinstate my credits because it had been a while since I'd been back in school. And they were like, okay, fine, well, we'll show. We'll show mercy on you. But it was like, yeah, I think it can be very easy to quit and never pick it back up, especially if you have, like, life changes and stuff. So. Yeah.

[Casey O'Brien]

Did you ever see. Remember that Simpsons episode where Homer quits the nuclear power plant and then he goes back to ask for his job back? And they're like, oh, there's a. There's a different door for people asking for their jobs back. And it's like a little doggy door you have to crawl through. That's basically what you had to do to let you back in the school.

[Millie de Chirico]

Oh, it was pretty much that. I had to find every professor that I had taken a class with and email them personally and ask them to reinstate my credits. And a lot of them don't teach at my school anymore. So it was like, shit.

[Casey O'Brien]

Really?

[Millie de Chirico]

Oh, yeah. They were like, who the fuck is this rando emailing me? I've moved on, but.

[Casey O'Brien]

Oh, my God. Well, congratulations, Millie. And congratulations to us on an incredible upcoming episode we're about to record. Yes.

[Millie de Chirico]

Let's congratulate ourselves right off the bat.

[Casey O'Brien]

Huge, huge episode. I'm so excited. This is like, kind of, you know, speaking of my area of expertise, I do feel like this is a little bit of your area of expertise. We're going to be talking about Cold War film noir and the movie Kiss me Deadly from 1955. Very excited. I'm going to set up the other thing we're doing in this episode, because you have no idea what this is, but we're also going to be doing build a new army. You know, like build a bear. Have you ever been to build a bear?

[Millie de Chirico]

Yes, I have. I have two small nephews, so.

[Casey O'Brien]

Okay, so this is the same thing, just with a noir movie.

[Millie de Chirico]

Noir, that's right.

[Casey O'Brien]

There's a lot coming up on this episode that I'm thrilled about. I mean, film noir, that's something that's near and dear to your heart, is it not?

[Millie de Chirico]

Yes, I'm a fan of noir. Now, listen. I mean, I'm an expert in the sense that I'm a fan and I used to work at Turner classic movies for 20 years. I'm not by no means like an actual expert, a la my old colleague Eddie Muller, the czar of noir, if you will, or even our friend Josh Fadem, who hosts an Aura Night in Tulsa. Like, you know, there's a lot of people who are, you know, very dedicated to the genre, and I think that's why it's going to be exciting to talk about it, because it is a niche. I mean, so it's kind of like noir is a niche genre within film, but then Cold War noir is like this whole other micro genre within it, this genre. So I don't know, I think it's fascinating. I actually think it's relevant. Again, if you will. Maybe we'll talk about that. And I'm really excited. So let's. You ready to get started?

[Casey O'Brien]

Let's do it.

[Millie de Chirico]

Okay, well, strap the in, everybody. You're listening to Dear Movies, I love you. Dear Movies, I love you.

[Casey O'Brien]

And I've got to know if you love me too. Yes or no? Check the box below.

[Millie de Chirico]

Hey, everybody, this is Dear Movies, I Love youe. My name is Mellie de Chirico.

[Casey O'Brien]

I'm Casey o' Brien and this is.

[Millie de Chirico]

A film podcast that's all about loving the films of your life, being dedicated, being wedded.

[Casey O'Brien]

Wedded. You're wetted and wedded.

[Millie de Chirico]

But this is going to be a great episode. I'm really excited about our topic. I feel like there's going to be some historical context. I'm not going to give full history lessons because you could really go hard. Sure. Like, I don't think I need to tell y' all about the Great Depression. Right. You know what? That is correct.

[Casey O'Brien]

But I do.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yes. We'll talk about it a little bit.

[Casey O'Brien]

Sure.

[Millie de Chirico]

Casey has Covid, so you're going to have to, you know, forgive him for, you know, Covid brain or whatever.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah, I do. I feel like it has been harder to keep things organized in my head since I've had Covid.

[Millie de Chirico]

Right off the bat. I have to ask just to follow up on a conversation we had maybe a couple episodes ago. Have we got any cheesesteaks in the mail? Have we got any cheesesteaks?

[Casey O'Brien]

None.

[Millie de Chirico]

Okay.

[Casey O'Brien]

We don't. I don't. We don't have a PO Box, but we've received. We've received no cheese steaks. So please, people, if. Please go to Bradley Cooper's restaurant in New York. I don't know where it is. Find it. Order a sandwich. We will not reimburse you, but please let us know what it tastes like. We need the review. And send us in a voicemail. I would love that. Like, on the street, eating the cheesesteak. Be great.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yeah, I mean, send a voicemail and then if you need to send a video, I watch the cheesesteak on the street. Come on.

[Casey O'Brien]

Absolutely. Millie, I just want to say something. You know, touching upon our episode last week where we talked about smoking. My roommate Tom, who is in the apartment with me when the guy hurled the carton of cigarettes through the window. I just checked. I just checked in with him to make sure it was okay. I talked about that on the podcast and he said, absolutely, if you. And he said, if you'd like, you can mention that I kicked the habit. So Tom is no longer a smoker. Like me. I'm no longer a smoker. And that his favorite smoking movies are the Big Sleep, Kiss Kiss, Bang Bang and the Handmaiden. That was pretty good.

[Millie de Chirico]

Pretty good.

[Casey O'Brien]

Tom sent that to us, so. Thank you, Tom.

[Millie de Chirico]

I like Tom's taste in films.

[Casey O'Brien]

Tom's great. Tom has a movie coming out pretty soon. He just wrote and directed in Ohio. And I think I can say this. Jon Lovitz is in it.

[Millie de Chirico]

Get out of here.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah. So keep an eye out for the toast.

[Millie de Chirico]

Great.

[Casey O'Brien]

Coming to cinemas hopefully soon.

[Millie de Chirico]

Hopefully that'll be on my letterboxed list soon.

[Casey O'Brien]

Absolutely. Yeah, I hope so, too. Millie, should we get into our Film diary.

[Millie de Chirico]

That's where I was headed with that.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yes, I could tell. You're leading me there.

[Millie de Chirico]

So should we open this?

[Casey O'Brien]

Huge. Heavy.

[Unknown]

Open it.

[Millie de Chirico]

God, why did I write so much?

[Casey O'Brien]

Why do I have a lot of feelings? Yeah, a lot of feelings.

[Millie de Chirico]

God, I have a lot of crushes. All right. My film diary is pretty short and sweet this week.

[Casey O'Brien]

Okay. I have. I. Mine's. Mine too. And I think you and I saw a sim. Same movie.

[Millie de Chirico]

Well, what. What is it? What is the movie?

[Casey O'Brien]

A little movie called Sinners.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yes, we did. We did. We did.

[Casey O'Brien]

What'd you think?

[Millie de Chirico]

I thought it was. I mean, am I wrong in that that is one of the most insane movies to ever be made?

[Casey O'Brien]

It's crazy. It's wild, isn't it? Yeah, I loved it. There are some. I gave it four out of five. I thought it was great. I loved watching it. I'd like to see it again. It was just. I can't. I think about it a lot. There are some big swings in the movie that made me laugh and I think unintentionally.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yes.

[Casey O'Brien]

But I didn't. It didn't detract from it, but I was kind of like, oh, whoa, okay, listen.

[Millie de Chirico]

With you. So I'm always a fan of directors making big ass swing movies like this. I'm especially thrilled that it was Ryan Coogler because I am a fan. Right.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yes, me too.

[Millie de Chirico]

To me, this was like his like huge From Dusk Till dawn meets, you know, like. I mean, his like genre vampire movie. Tons of historical, you know, context and references, but just also like plain weird. There was like, weird things happening in the movie that I loved. And again, I like, even if it wasn't intentional, I'm glad it happened. Like, I'm just sort of glad. Even if it was intentional. Holy shit, you're a genius. If it wasn't intentional, thank God it happened. I don't know. I just am like, I'm pleased either way. I suppose. I went. I went into it completely blind. I actually, I thought it was supposed to be like a Western. Like, I was thinking it's gonna be like posse or something. Like, I was like, oh, this is like, you know, some like, updated Western. Or like, you know, I. I don't know. I had literally no idea what it was about. I didn't even know it was about vampires whatsoever.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah, I. I knew there was a. There was a. A vampire element to it, but I was kind of like, what. It felt like I was. The previews made it. I felt like I was missing the bigger Picture. You know, I don't.

[Millie de Chirico]

I don't even think I saw a preview. I'm not sure I saw a trailer. And I'm not. This is. Again. Okay, I want to preface by saying this is not to say that I feel like this. That Sitters is derivative of any other movie that I've mentioned. I don't think is from. From Dust Till dawn or Posse. I just think it's similar. It's like comp. Similar in the sense that, you know, these are references that I know of movies that I've seen that are sort of in the same genre, but I think it's totally singular. Like, it's definitely its own thing. Right.

[Casey O'Brien]

I. Okay, here's the review I found that made me laugh on letterboxd from Brett Arnold. Nobody's ready for how much talk there is about eating pussy in this movie.

[Millie de Chirico]

Okay. Thank you for saying that, because that was. That was like almost word for word what came out of my mouth when I left the movie theater. I was like, they really talking about going down in this movie?

[Casey O'Brien]

Like they. They truly do.

[Millie de Chirico]

Three or four times. I was like. I guess it didn't occur to me that people were going down in the 30s. Like, I was like, oh, this. Like, people were like, really going. Going downtown.

[Casey O'Brien]

It wasn't. It's not a. Yeah, it's not a 21st century invention. I think it was. I will say there's a lot of talk about eating pussy in this movie, but I felt that the sex scenes were kind of oddly chaste. Everyone is completely fully clothed in every. Both men and women in every sex scene. And I thought that was an interesting choice.

[Millie de Chirico]

Well, and I did have this moment. Okay. So stylistically. So one of the main characters of film is a blues guitar player and singer, Preacher boy. Preacher boy played by Miles Katon. Katon, sure, he's great. Sammy is his other name. Later in the film, his grown up version is played by the actual blues artist, Buddy Guy.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yep.

[Millie de Chirico]

And there was a moment where I imagined the actual musician Buddy Guy watching the premiere and being like, oh, yeah, I, like, went down on that lady earlier in my life in the bar. And maybe him being like, good for me. Good for my character.

[Casey O'Brien]

I like that. I like that backstory.

[Millie de Chirico]

But that's the other thing, too. Stylistically, Prejudice Boy looks like Robert Johnson.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah. Yeah. I think that was definitely inspired by that.

[Millie de Chirico]

So then again, it was in my brain going like, well, now I'm only thinking about Robert Johnson going downtown on a couple of layers in his lifetime. This. This movie just Made me think about cunnilingus so many times. And it was just sort of like, was that intentional? Is that. Was that part of the story? Like, again, I don't know if it was amazing if it wasn't also amazing.

[Casey O'Brien]

No, but I really, I loved it. An original big movie. We don't get these that often, you know, original big budget genre movies. It was fun. Well, fun. It was a throwback to me.

[Millie de Chirico]

It was a throwback. It was. I had no idea where it was going. It literally. It was a runaway train at times. I was extremely, extremely excited by it. The. The first thing that happened that I knew I was like, oh, this is gonna be. This is gonna be a one. Is that. I was like, oh, Michael B. Jordan is playing two characters in the same frame. I'm like, is that Michael B. Jordan or is that another guy that looks just like him? I'm like, no, no, that's the same guy. He's playing brothers Smokestack. Smoke and Stack. Right?

[Casey O'Brien]

Smoking Stack. Yeah.

[Millie de Chirico]

Smoking Stack. I was like, is that really happening? I was like, that's wild. That's wild that that's happening. I had convinced myself it wasn't happening, and then I realized it was actually happening. Okay, this movie is going to be great. Strap in.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah. I think this was Michael B. Jordan's best performance I've ever seen him in, in anything.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yeah, it's real.

[Casey O'Brien]

I was delighted. It was great. Del.

[Millie de Chirico]

The great Delroy Lindo. Fantastic.

[Casey O'Brien]

Funny as I love. Incredible. Yeah, Delroy Lindo, Everybody's greatest.

[Millie de Chirico]

I mean, it is fun. It is super fun. I would say don't. I would say don't listen to us at all. Just rewind and not listen to this part and go in completely blind. Because it was fun.

[Casey O'Brien]

What else you see?

[Millie de Chirico]

The other movie that I saw besides Sinners this week was Big Trouble in Little China from 1986.

[Casey O'Brien]

Love Big Trouble in Little China. I love that movie.

[Millie de Chirico]

I have not seen it probably since I was a kid. And it's also funny. It's just all so funny and weird and it was very nostalgic for me, Sherry. And I. I personally, like, I'm a big fan of like, 80s Kurt Russell. He was like a. He was like a big, strong male hottie when I was growing up. So it was like, you know, it was like the, like the adult guy that you would see in like, the movies for kids that you're like, oh, he's so hunky. I hope one day I grow up and like, marry a guy like that. So it Brought back a lot of positive feelings.

[Casey O'Brien]

Sure.

[Millie de Chirico]

And yeah, it was great.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah, I like that movie because there's a lot of like secret passageways and trapdoors and I love movies like that.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yeah, I do too. And it's just fun. It's like a fun, you know, sort.

[Casey O'Brien]

Of like very fun.

[Millie de Chirico]

Like supernatural, like act like Asian action. It's. It's fires on all cylinders. So that's it for me. What about you?

[Casey O'Brien]

Very good. I also watched. I'd never seen this movie before and it's been on my list forever, like literally 10 years. And I was like, I need to get this off my list. And it's 12 Years a Slave from 2013. I just never seen it.

[Millie de Chirico]

Wow.

[Casey O'Brien]

And I watched it and it was good and it was sad. And yeah, it's a little bit of a broccoli movie. You know, it's kind of like you feel like you're supposed to watch it and it was good. Everyone's. It's amazing, you know, so. But I don't really have anything to say about it.

[Millie de Chirico]

Sure.

[Casey O'Brien]

But I did watch it.

[Millie de Chirico]

Steve McQueen.

[Casey O'Brien]

Steve McQueen. I love the movie Hunger and Widows.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yeah.

[Casey O'Brien]

Did you ever see Widows?

[Millie de Chirico]

I haven't, but you know, we did the small Acts movies.

[Casey O'Brien]

Small acts, yes. Those are great too. Anywho, that's. I think that's it for the film diary. Let's close it up.

[Millie de Chirico]

Oh, shut this heavy thing. I can't.

[Justin Richmond]

This is Justin Richmond from Broken Record. Are you the kind of person who sets standards for themselves? Like, personally, I told myself if the Lakers lose or do or die game five, I wouldn't let it impact my mood at home with family. The standard Lexus has set for themselves is to experience amazing. Lexus measures success by the feelings and emotions evoked in a driver, like exhilaration and joy. Amazing can only be achieved by knowing people on a deeper level. The standard of amazing results in machines that make you feel more human. Because a car that doesn't make you feel something is a car that stops short of amazing experience. Amazing at your Lexus dealer.

[Unknown]

Not everyone who handles your personal information is going to be as careful as you are. And it only takes one mistake to expose it to hackers and identity theft. Maybe that's why there's a new victim of identity theft every five seconds in the United States. Fortunately, there's lifelock. Lifelock monitors hundreds of millions of data points a second for threats to your identity if your identity is stolen. A LifeLock US based restoration specialist will help solve identity theft issues on Your behalf guaranteed or your money back. Plus, all LifeLock plans are backed by the million dollar protection package. Meaning Lifelock will reimburse you up to the limits of your plan. If you lose money due to identity theft. You can't control how diligent others are with your personal information. But with Lifelock, you can help protect it. Act now and save up to 40% your first year. Call 1-800-LIFELOCK and use promo code iheart or go to lifelock.com iheart for 40%.

Off terms apply for period protection. You can put on and forget about nothing. Beats NYX leakproof underwear. North America's number one leak proof underwear brand. Let's face it, life can be unpredictable. But your leak proof underwear shouldn't be. That's why millions of people choose Nyx for periods. For light leaks, for everyday freshness. NYX undies are super comfy, super absorbent and made to handle whatever your day throws at you. Day two of your period covered your daily run. No problem. That big sneeze? You know the one? Yup. We've got you. And with styles like bikinis, boy shorts, thongs and high rise plus sizes from extra small to 4 XL NYX. NYX makes it easy to find your perfect fit. Say goodbye to stress and leaks. And say hello to undies that work just as hard as you do no matter the leak. Find the style and level of protection you [e-mail] and use code FLO15 for 15% off. That's KN I X.com code FLO15 for 15% Off. NYX for your leaks. For your life.

[Casey O'Brien]

Alrighty, Millie. We're back for our main discussion and today we're talking about Kiss me Deadly from 1955. What a film. I'd never seen it before. Thank you for saying we should do this. Oh, now welcome you. This is a, like, this is a Cold War noir.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yes.

[Casey O'Brien]

What makes a Cold War noir to you? And I guess what makes a noir and what makes a Cold War noir to you?

[Millie de Chirico]

Okay, let me try to answer your second question first. Okay, so noir film noir, as you've just mentioned, I'm sure most of you listening right now have heard the term know what it is. But you know, it's a grouping of films that were made in sort of the golden era of Hollywood that were primarily, you know, dark subject materials. A lot of crime, a lot of these, like stories of, you know, greed and paranoia and mistrust and femme fatale. The femme fatale tradition came out of this, you know, genre. If you Will. And you got, you know, these really big film noir kind of caricatures like the Bogarts and the Sterling Haydens and the Robert Ryans and Elm Lads, you know, just like hardboiled sort of detective y type of stuff, you know, meets femme fatales, usually black and white, a lot of them shot in la, which we'll get to in a second. But, you know, the tradition of film noir really came out of the Great Depression and it was kind of ushered in by these, you know, crime novel writers, like, for example, Dashiell Hammett, Raymond Chandler, big LA connection with Raymond Chandler. So basically what happens is you've got, you know, late 30s, post Great Depression, you've got these, you know, crime novels being written by these authors. At the same time, you've got this ramp of production in Hollywood. So they're making more and more movies. A lot of people from Germany especially, but in Europe were coming over to America to work in Hollywood because of World War II. So you've got a lot of German directors and German actors who are coming in who have, you know, studied under their own film traditions in the, you know, Weimar era of German cinema. Again, trying not to like, go down the rabbit hole with the history stuff, but it's, it's a little interesting. So you kind of have all these influences coming together, plus you just got the general vibe of America at the time, which is basically moving into World War II. Post World War II, you've got a lot of crazy shit happening, a lot of like, paranoia, a lot of, again, like we're moving into this sort of McCarthyism, communist red scare. So all of these like, things are swirling together. And so you've got like the film noir tradition. And then the Cold War film noir tradition is really just an extension of that, of the history of like actual film noir, starting in Hollywood, but then moving towards like the 50s where we were getting super freaked out about communists and, you know, the Cold War, atomic bombs, you know, this kind of stuff. So that's kind of how it works, is that it's moving. It's basically cold. Cold War film noir is basically just like a little subsect of the film noir tradition that's already happening.

[Casey O'Brien]

Very good. Should I do a quick brief synopsis of the movie?

[Millie de Chirico]

You're going to have to.

[Casey O'Brien]

I believe I'm going to have to. So this movie, Kiss Me Deadly, it's kind of a bizarre film. It, like, it is, it's. It's like obviously a film noir movie, but it also has kind of a interesting other Tone, I can't place my finger on it, but it's about Mike Hammer, played by Ralph Meeker. He's a tough private eye in la. While driving one night, he almost runs over a basically nude woman on the run in the middle of the road. He's wearing just like a rain jacket. This is Christina, played by Cloris Leachman. She's in trouble, and they are soon attacked by goons, and Christina is killed. And before she dies, she tells Mike, remember me? Well, he feels this is just by a gut feeling. He's like, this is connected to something bigger. So he begins investigating, and with the help of his friend with benefits, secretary Velda Wakeman, played by Maxine Cooper, they find themselves in the midst of a conspiracy that includes radioactive material, Beverly Hills mansions, and lots of whiskey drinking. And that is Kiss Me Deadly, which I don't quite understand what the title has to do with anything, but it's a good title. And, yeah, I had. I had never seen this before. Well, I guess I wanted to ask you, like, do you have any, like, why did you pick this movie specifically for, like, Cold. Cold War film noir? Why. Why this one?

[Millie de Chirico]

Well, I mean. Okay, so there's a lot in this. I mean, I'm saying, oh, here's this, like, really kind of strange, unique micro genre, you know, but yet there's actually a lot of movies that you could fit into this category of Cold War film noir, like communist film noir, whatever you want to call it. So I think besides Kiss Me Deadly, I think one of the most popular ones is Pick up on south street, which was a movie from 1954, directed by Sam Fuller, Richard Widmark's the Star. Like, you know, basically, that and Kiss Me Deadly, I feel like, are the two big ones. But you've also got. This is a movie that I actually wrote about in the TCM underground book, which is this movie called shack out on 101, directed by Edward Dean, 1955, you know, starring Lee Marvin in one of the scuzziest roles you'll ever see. Lee Marvin, he plays a short order cook named Slob. But also, you've got movies like the woman on Pier 13, five steps to Danger, the Red Menace, the Whip Hand, Walk a Crooked Mile, the Iron Curtain, Diplomatic Courier, like all these, you know, and being directed by pretty famous people. I mean, you've got people like William Cameron Menzies and William Wellman and Henry Hathaway. So, like, you know, these were, like, pretty big noir films, but they just all kind of happen to be centered around Communism, you know, Soviet spies, people who are being like, I don't know, kind of, you know, the paranoia of maybe somebody being a communist, you know, working with a communist. Somebody's got a, there's a secret Soviet plot to like, you know, take down this and that. So this is a very fertile ground. It's very rich. I think, particularly with Kiss Me Deadly. I think there's something very unique about it. Number one, you've got Ralph Meeker, which we'll talk about in just a second. But number two, this, it's just such a bizarre, there's a lot of bizarreness about this film that I think is really interesting. Part of it is that the character of Mike Hammer, right, who is the lead character of Kiss Me Deadly, played by Ralph Meeker. Now this story was based off of, you know, the Mike Hammer character that was created by the writer Mickey Spillane, you know, another one of these crime writers. And in the book, the Mike Hammer character, dare I say he was like a little nicer than the Mike Hammer in the book. In the movie, Mike Hammer is like king of the assholes, wouldn't you say?

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah, he's a big time dick. Yeah, yeah.

[Millie de Chirico]

And they really amped that up, which I think is so interesting because again, not to get all film history one on one with you guys, but I guess I am since I'm hosting a film podcast. Like you're in the era of Hollywood, we're still under, under the production code, you know. Yes, you had assholes and stuff in films, of course, but like, you were still like underneath this kind of framework of decency, I guess you, I guess, is the best way to call it. To see an out and out sociopath like Mike Hammer in Kiss Me Deadly the movie is kind of crazy because he's kind of like unapologetic about his motives. Right.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah, I mean, I, I, in the summary of the plot, I say he has a friends with benefits secretary, but it's like he kind of treats this woman like shit. And like they're hooking up all the time, they're not really together. And he seems to be like looking to get laid elsewhere, you know, but like he still kind of expects her to be his lover, but is really unkind to her. It's a pretty wild relationship to be seen to be shown on screen without any scene of him being like, I feel bad for the way they treated you. There's no scene like that in this movie, you know?

[Millie de Chirico]

Right. And like, again, we're talking about film noir, so we're not saying any of these guys, they're all antiheroes. Like, even, like the best and nicest film noir guys are antiheroes. Right. So it's like you're. You're taking. This is the underbelly of society. We're not talking about you know, freaking, you know, I don't know, Henry Fonda in, you know, a screwball comedy. We're talking about. These are people who, like, live on the edges of society. A lot of detectives that have the little samurai apartment, the shit shack with, like, their weird bird. So it's like, you know, we're. We're talking about bad people, necessarily. So the issue of this guy being extra bad, I think, is shocking to me because it's like, you're. You're absolutely right. Number one, he's. He's basically like a playboy bachelor running around la, making out with everybody. His business is completely predicated upon him and his partner, this woman that he kind of keeps, you know, dangling a carrot in front of romantically. They're out there basically seducing people because they're. They're. They're basically divorce. You know, he's like a private investigator. He works in divorces, right?

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah.

[Millie de Chirico]

And they're basically. He's taking the wives and she's taking the husbands, and they're trying to, like, you know, woo them a little bit so they can get info to help them in their investigations. So it's all, like, for their own ends. There's no. Yeah, they're just hoeing around town, basically.

[Casey O'Brien]

They truly are. It was kind of shocking to see in an, like an older film to have a plot line like that where they're both like, yeah, we're both like, fucking and sucking all around town, trying.

[Millie de Chirico]

To get business, trying to get a.

[Casey O'Brien]

Few bucks here and there.

[Millie de Chirico]

And then, you know, on top of that, he's the kind of guy. It's like. This is, I think, why I think people love noir generally, is because you're hanging out with the scumbags, right? So Mike Hammer is running around la, you know, trying to figure out the situation with this woman in the trench coat. By the way, you said this during the synopsis, but I have to say, the first few moments of this film where the credits are rolling, where you basically hear, like. You basically hear a disembodied woman's voice basically sounding like she's having an orgasm over the credits, while it's just a shot of two people driving down the road. Wild shit. Like, I was like, every time I watch it I'm like, it sounds like a lady is like having an orgasm right now. And we don't know why. The movie just started. We know she's naked under a trench coat.

[Casey O'Brien]

It's like that scene in Curb youb Enthusiasm where Larry has a vibe. His car is like kind of beat up and has a shaky seat. And people keep. Women keep having orgasms in his car. Have you ever seen that episode? It's just like that. So the, the beginning of the movie is so jarring because you're like. The way you're introduced to these characters is like Mike Hammer almost hits this woman. He begrudgingly lets her into his car. He's like, I should kick your ass. I should kick you out of the car. He's like, not nice to her. But then he kind of protects her against the cops who stop them, who are looking for a runaway woman. And so you're kind of like, you're just totally thrown into this movie in such a crazy way. It's really like disorienting from the jump, right?

[Millie de Chirico]

And that's the thing is that. So he basically starts out sketchy and just continues to be sketchy throughout the whole film. Even as he's trying to solve this mystery and be theoretically, quote unquote, the good guy, the protagonist. Even though, like I said, he's shady as fuck. I mean, he's, you know, not only fucking and sucking, as you said, around la, but he's also like slamming guys hands in drawers and he's kind of like taking a law on his own hands. He's just like beating people up and threatening people and like, you know, walking into people's shitball apartments and like shaking them down. You know, he's like not. I mean, he's like, got his own way of doing things and they're not great.

[Justin Richmond]

This is Justin Richmond from Broken Record. Are you the kind of person who sets standards for themselves? Like, personally, I told myself if the Lakers lose their do or Die Game five, I wouldn't let it impact my mood at home with family. The standard Lexus has set for themselves is to experience amazing. Lexus measures success by the feelings and emotions evoked in a driver, like exhilaration and joy. Amazing can only be achieved by knowing people on a deeper level. The standard of amazing results in machines that make you feel more human. Because a car that doesn't make you feel something is a car that stops short of amazing experience. Amazing at your Lexus dealer.

[Unknown]

Not everyone who handles your personal information is going to be as careful as you are. And it only takes one mistake to expose it to hackers and identity theft. Maybe that's why there's a new victim of identity theft every five seconds in the United States. Fortunately, there's Lifelock. Lifelock monitors hundreds of millions of data points a second for threats to your identity. If your identity is stolen, a LifeLock US based restoration specialist will help solve identity theft issues on your behalf, guaranteed or your money back. Plus, all LifeLock plans are backed by the million dollar protection package, meaning Lifelock will reimburse you up to the limits of your plan. If you lose money due to identity theft. You can't control how diligent others are with your personal information. But with Lifelock you can help protect it. Act now and save up to 40% your first year. Call 1-800-LIFELOCK and use promo code iheart or go to lifelock.com iheart for 40%.

Off terms apply for period protection. You can put on and forget about nothing. Beats Nyx Leakproof underwear. North America's number one leakproof underwear brand. Let's face it, life can be unpredictable. But your leak proof underwear shouldn't be. That's why millions of people choose Nyx for periods, for light leaks, for everyday freshness. Nick's undies are super comfy, super absorbent and made to handle whatever your day throws at you. Day two of your period covered your daily run no problem. That big sneeze? You know the one? Yep. We've got you. And with styles like bikinis, boy shorts, thongs and high rise plus sizes from extra small to 4XL, NYX makes it easy to find your perfect fit. Say goodbye to stress and leaks and say hello to undies that work just as hard as you do no matter the leak. Find the style and level of protection you [e-mail] and use code flow15 for 15% off. That's K N I X.com code flow15 for 15% off. Nyx for your leaks for your life.

[Casey O'Brien]

I don't do they. I don't remember if they say was he a cop before?

[Millie de Chirico]

I want to say.

[Casey O'Brien]

I don't think.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yeah, I don't know.

[Casey O'Brien]

I don't know if they ever say it because usually in these it's like a private eye was formerly a police officer and so they have some code of it ethics. But he might have just gone right to private eyism and has no ethics whatsoever.

[Millie de Chirico]

I think Mike Hammer the character was ex military or something but I don't think he was a cop, which I see. But you're Right. Like, there's a lot of ex cops, like crooked cops that become private investigators. That's like a very. Maybe that's part of the. Our Build a noir later. But it's. I wanted to ask you because I know that you're like, again, not that this podcast is about the time that we lived in LA together, but let's talk about LA. Yeah, LA. And film noir is like sort of.

[Casey O'Brien]

They're in the main film noir city.

[Millie de Chirico]

It's either that or San Francisco.

[Casey O'Brien]

That's what I was thinking.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yeah.

[Casey O'Brien]

There's something about night in LA too, because it is such a sunny city, you know, there's not very many tall buildings, so it's just like sunshine is pouring down on you all the time. So when it's dark, it feels very inverted from its normal personality as a city. And even when you're in LA now, you can kind of just sort of step into that film noir mode. Like, you can kind of like cosplay as if you're in a film noir just by being in the city. You know, in certain parts of downtown, or whether you're like on the Angels Flight, which is in this movie, or in some of the older parts of town in la, it's. It. It's fun to kind of like enter that world in a real way, you know?

[Millie de Chirico]

Well, I like, I think that's like kind of what I think la. I mean, there's practical purposes, like I mentioned earlier, there were, there were practical purposes for film noirs to be shot in la, Right? Because again, you've got, you know, basically Germans making cheap B movies downtown. Right? But then you've got this real strong contrast of vibes, let's just say vibe contrast, if you will. Because you're absolutely right. The thing that makes LA alluring, at least for me, and part of the reason why I always wanted to live there and I enjoyed living there, is because you've got this like, high, low scenario of like, great weather, great vibes, people running around drinking tonics and going, you know, fucking sweating in workout classes and dreams and hopes. And then you've got like the Black Dahlia and like fucked up shit and like, you know, weird, you know, parts of town that seem, like, sketchy. And you've got the underbelly of la, which has a lot of homelessness and crime and, you know, corruption. So there's like two things happening at the same time. And I think that that's why LA is fascinating. And I, I actually think that there are other parts of America that are like that, too. I feel like the south is sort of like that. Like, there's.

[Casey O'Brien]

I can totally see that.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yeah. Which again, there's a huge tradition of, like, the Southern Gothic there, where it's this whole, like. We think it's this idyllic, amazing place that's super positive and sunny and wonderful, but that's actually, like, fucked up. That's what I think LA and the south have in common. But that's what I think makes LA fascinating and from. In the lens of film noir, that's what makes it fascinating, is that it is weird and scary and fucked up. And there are people running around, you know, shutting people's hands and drawers and opening lockers at the Hollywood Athletic Club. Let's. I want to talk about the ending.

[Casey O'Brien]

Of Kiss Me Yes, Please.

[Millie de Chirico]

Which I'm gonna say spoiler alert, but.

[Casey O'Brien]

This movie came out a long 70 years ago.

[Millie de Chirico]

70 years.

[Casey O'Brien]

Literally 70 years ago.

[Millie de Chirico]

So I think we're allowed to reveal the ending of Kiss Me Door.

[Casey O'Brien]

We're outside the window.

[Millie de Chirico]

What did you think of it?

[Casey O'Brien]

Okay, so I. One. One question I guess I had. So there's this mysterious package that's. Everyone wants to get their hands on. And Christina, the woman who is killed at the very beginning that they pick. That Mike Hammer picks up in his car, she is kind of close to Leachman. He finds this package through, you know, investigating her past, basically. And he opens it up. He finds it in a locker at the Los Angeles Athletic Club. And he opens it up, and it is. It's kind of like in Pulp Fiction when they open up the briefcase and there's a bunch of light coming out. It's like that. But it's like. Or like the Ark of the Covenant in Indiana Jones. But it's like bright light comes out and he's like, ah. And he, like, burns himself and closes it back up. And when that happened, I was like, what is that? I was like, is this, like a fantastical element that I'm unclear on what it is, but no. It's like radioactive material, I guess, presumably to make some sort of bomb. Right. And that's where sort of the Cold War.

[Millie de Chirico]

It's what they would call. It's what they would call a MacGuffin.

[Casey O'Brien]

Sure.

[Millie de Chirico]

You know, it's like this thing that everybody's obsessed with getting. You don't know what's in it. You don't know what it is. And then it. When you find out what it is, you're like, oh, what is that? Are you serious? Because you have to understand that again, we're in this sort of, like, Cold War era. We're very worried about nuclear weapons. We're talking about, like, there. There's mention of the Manhattan Project in Los Alamos and things like this. In the actual plot of this film, they actually say the words Manhattan Project and Los Alamos. So you're like, oh, this is nuclear. This is something that is being blown up in the desert and going to cause great destruction. And it happens to be in a box in a locker at a gym.

[Casey O'Brien]

In a suitcase in it. Yeah. Was. It sort of felt like they didn't do any scientific research on what, like, radioactive material looks like, because I was like, I don't think that little leather attache would, like, protect anything from radioactive material. And I don't think if that's plutonium, it's not just bright and shiny.

[Millie de Chirico]

And there's this moment where when Mike Hammer finds it, he finds it in the locker. He opens it, cracks it open, and it's like, ouch. Oh, my gosh, my hand is burned. I'm like, oh, no. You would be blown to fucking smithereens, dog. You wouldn't just have a little rash. I mean, this is like, the implications of what this could be are so huge that it gets really simplified.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yes. It gets Chernobyl. I was like, that's not what happens. You know? But then the end. So there. I don't even know how to explain this, but, like, he finds Christina's roommate, who. It's very. The. The plot is very confusing, too. It's hard to follow. But the roommate isn't who she says she is. And she's also after this nuclear material. And the end is her opening up the suitcase because she's not sure what it is either.

[Millie de Chirico]

Right, right.

[Casey O'Brien]

And she's like. He's like, don't open that up. And she's like, I. I want to open it because she knows it's worth money, but she opens it up and absolutely gets exploded and, like, caught on fire. And it's insane.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yeah. It looks like the end of who Framed Roger Rabbit or something.

[Casey O'Brien]

I don't know.

[Millie de Chirico]

It's like some.

[Casey O'Brien]

It's like. I mean, it's kind of like in Indiana Jones when the Ark in a Covenant is, like, blasting people and they're, like, exploding sort of. And like that the house they're in catches on fire and explodes. I mean, it's wild. It's wild stuff. And it's, like, so insane.

[Millie de Chirico]

But she, like. Yeah, she gets obliterated, basically. And you're like, oh, this, like, simple little thing in an attache is, like, ripping the skin off of this poor woman. And then they're, like, running from the beach house.

[Casey O'Brien]

Just opening the little flap on the attache is enough to, like. It's so crazy.

[Millie de Chirico]

I think that's ultimately, like, why I appreciate this movie so much is because it does have this, like, bizarre ending. You know, again, going back to, like, what we were talking about, like, in terms of this era of Hollywood, I mean, there was, like, so much paranoia. McCarthyism was insane. Like, if you think about that, like, in the ways, like, there was, like, the blacklist and sort of, you know, the ways in which, like, there were people just basically, like, unable to work because they were, you know, affiliated. And there was just like, a witch hunt going on. And it was just like this crazy time. So it was this. You know, there was inspiration for a lot of movies. I mean, like. And we talk and not just film the war. I mean, you think about movies like Invasion of the Body Snatchers, it was like those. These are movies that are all about this sort of, like, paranoia, this sort of. The themes of, like, loyalty. Are you with us or against us? Are you American or un American? Are you, you know, gonna comply or are you gonna be, you know, have your own mind and. And do your own thing? I mean, it's. It was very.

[Casey O'Brien]

It could be anybody, too. It's kind of like it could be your girlfriend who could turn against you. You know, it's. It's anybody. It could be your enemy.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yeah. And I feel like, dare I say, we're sort of in another high key paranoid moment right now in the world, in our country, certainly in America, where I feel like, yeah, we're like, back to square one in that way. You're like, oh, there are people who are actively. Like, there are witch hunts happening. There are, you know, like, there's paranoia. There's, like, loyalty tests. There's all the shit that's happening in the same way that was happening, you know, back in this era, in the Kiss Me Deadly era. So it's. It's just interesting how cyclical things are and how movies become relevant again, you know?

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah. I mean, Nikki Glazer, the comedian, I was just watching an interview with her, and she was saying a lot of comedians who tour abroad, when they come back into the country, a lot of them are being asked, like, what do you do for work? You're a comedian in your set. Are you critical of the president? You know, it's like nothing has really happened. But they're asking Those types of questions again, you know, those loyalty tests and. Yeah, I think we're right back at it.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yeah. And so who knows? I mean, maybe we have another. You know, I like to call them these, like, proliferations of themes in films, like where you have over a course of like, maybe five, 10 years, you know, a lot of movies that are grouped together that have similar traits. And I feel like maybe this is another. Well, maybe we're going to move towards another one of these eras. You know, who knows? But. But yeah, I just think this is just such a fascinating little micro genre. Like I said, there's a ton of movies you can actually go online. And people have compiled lists on Letterboxd especially, but also IMDb. But before we wrap this section up, I wanted to talk about Ralph Meeker because he is an actor, first of all. Like, I think that he's really unknown in the larger scheme of Hollywood. Like, it's kind of like, yes, you know, the Bogarts and the Henry Fondas and, you know, whomever. Like the, you know, Cary Grants. But, like, Ralph Meeker was like a. He seems like kind of an odd guy in a way.

[Casey O'Brien]

He. I'm fascinated by him.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yes.

[Casey O'Brien]

I thought he was really great in this. I mean, he totally carried the movie. He feels like a movie star, but he also feels kind of regular.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yes.

[Casey O'Brien]

I don't know. He played a very realistic asshole in a way that, like, without kind of the charm.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yeah.

[Casey O'Brien]

Like, he didn't have that kind of like. Like, Cary Grant can play an asshole, but you're like, it's Carrie.

[Millie de Chirico]

Oh, yeah. He's so charming and cute.

[Casey O'Brien]

He's so charming and handsome where, like, Mike Hammer is just kind of like a dick. And he kind of gave me a little bit of. I. I thought he kind of looked like Timothy Oliphant. Is that crazy to say?

[Millie de Chirico]

No, he kind of. It's like a. I can see that. Like an Timothy Oliphant meets. Almost kind of like a Charlton Heston Y look.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah.

[Millie de Chirico]

Like, those eyes. I. Ralph Baker is very interesting to me because, again, I think he is an actor that probably is. Like, if he were just doing like a real quickie little review of classic Hollywood, he probably wouldn't be like one of the first guys you'd think of. Although, you know, he sort of was famously. He's like the guy, like, after Brando played Marlon Brando, obviously played Stanley Kowalski in Streetcar Named Desire on Broadway. He was the guy that replaced him. So he kind of like, was famous for playing Stanley from Streetcar. He was Also in this great, fantastic movie, which was actually the movie that was called this before, the Jonathan Demme version, which is something wild, 1961. Is that right?

[Casey O'Brien]

That's correct.

[Millie de Chirico]

Hey, 1961. I knew that's like, my party trick is knowing. Honestly, I think it's because I worked in at TCM for so long. It's like, I sort of know release years for all movies.

[Casey O'Brien]

But it's impressive.

[Millie de Chirico]

Thank you. But, yeah, so he was in that kind of like Something Wild 1961 and Something Wild 1986 don't really have much in common. But, like, Ralph Meeker was in that original one and he was also in Paths of Glory, Kubrick's Paths of Glory. But I think for people our age and for people kind of more modern audiences, he was sort of the inspiration for Rick Dalton, which was the Leonardo DiCaprio character in Once Upon a Time in Hollywood. And Tarantino, from what I've read, was a huge Ralph Meeker fan, or is a huge Ralph Meeker fan. And so he was like, the inspiration for that character. Which is interesting because I gotta say, I think Rick Dalton's my favorite character in that movie. Movie, so.

[Casey O'Brien]

Oh, yeah. It is interesting, though, because kind of like Leo's character in Once Upon a Time in Hollywood, it's like Ralph Meeker died when he was 67, which is, like, pretty young to die. But he was kind of. His career had been over for, like, a long time at that point.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yeah.

[Casey O'Brien]

Like, it's just sort of interesting how at this time it's harder to have a long acting career. You know, like, there are so many actors now at 67 who are, like, getting so much work, you know, but, like, he was just not able to keep going for whatever reason. And then he died.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yeah. And I think that's kind of like what. What Once Upon a Time in Hollywood certainly was trying to sort of address was this idea of, like, an actor who was sort of out of fashion by the late 60s and was sort of like, not knowing his place because he was like, you know, he was known for playing tough guys or was sort of like a man's man, but then was like, now kind of cucked, if you will, by the industry.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah.

[Millie de Chirico]

And so he's just like, well, now what do I do? Because I'm not like a hippie. I'm not hip, but I'm, you know, also the stuff that made me famous is no longer cool, so I don't know what to do. And. Which, you know, is like an eternal problem for middle aged People is what. How to be. How to be when you're middle aged. But Ralph Baker to me is interesting. And you're so right. I mean he has this like macho quality. He's blonde, he's hunky, he's like. But then he's not like kind of, I don't know, like a dandy or like Cary Grant or even like got that little wink that like Paul Newman has or something. He's just kind of like, I don't know, kind of like what you see is what you get kind of guy. And it's very. He's very interesting to me. So.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah. Well, fabulous. I mean I. This made me want to watch more noir.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yes.

[Casey O'Brien]

Because I've seen some, but it is just kind of like. It's like stepping into a bubble bath. I mean it's just like. It's so. It just has this velvety feel to it and it just is so moody and fabulous and I love seeing all the old LA stuff and. Yeah, no, I really. It's kind of got me inspired.

[Millie de Chirico]

Well, I mean, to be honest, I mean, you're a big David lynch guy. Like you gotta watch this stuff. It's like part and party of everything. It's connective.

[Casey O'Brien]

Blue velvet.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yes. I love noir. I feel like it is exactly how you said, it's this warm bath, but it's also this like you're with the scumbags. I love it. It's like though, yeah, you're kind of in these dark worlds and there's like shady characters and great lines, great smoking, great, like weird plots with character actors galore. If you're a character actor fan, noir is your ticket, baby. You'll love it. So.

[Casey O'Brien]

Well, you know, it's almost like. And I think Inherent Vice kind of touches upon this. Film noir is kind of a slacker genre because usually the lead characters have kind of failed out of something and they have a lot of time on their hands and they're kind of just bumming around and they're bored a lot and they find themselves in dangerous situations but like in the meantime they're kind of just hanging out at their apartment or getting drunk and that's kind of a fun like world to like step into. It's like this sort of slacker genre.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yeah, it's. It's lovable losers. At the end of the day, that's all it's about. People who have nothing to lose and they're like, you know, basically down and out and they got like one shot at redemption type of thing. Yeah, I mean, who can't sympathize with that in a way? Like, I just feel like that's such an interesting place to start from a character perspective. And I don't know, I like an underdog. I always have. So that's why I like noir, you know.

[Casey O'Brien]

Fabulous. And just please, listeners out there, don't. If you have radioactive material in a little leather case, you know, just dispose of it properly and don't open it in a beachside house that could explode.

[Millie de Chirico]

Don't bring it to the place where you work out. Come on.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah, exactly.

[Millie de Chirico]

Have a little tact, if you will.

[Casey O'Brien]

Millie. This segment is called Build a Noir. Now, we've been to Build a Bear. I have a daughter. We built a bear on her birthday. You know, you kind of select the items that go on the teddy bear.

[Millie de Chirico]

It can get really pricey, right?

[Casey O'Brien]

It can get really pricey. But we went on her birthday, so she got a free bear. So we had the very cheap version. So, yeah, it can get kind of pricey. But it was a fun experience for us and for patience. So there's just a lot of things that kind of go into a typical noir kind of like we touched upon already. And I'm just going to kind of give you prompts and see we can kind of build the noir off of this and sort of see what kind of story we get into here. Does that sound okay?

[Millie de Chirico]

That sounds amazing.

[Casey O'Brien]

Okay, so first of all, we have to pick a location. Now, we talked about this a little bit. A lot of them are set in la, but they can be set elsewhere. Where would you like to set this film noir?

[Millie de Chirico]

I was thinking about this.

[Casey O'Brien]

Where's your perfect film noir set?

[Millie de Chirico]

I personally think it's gotta be in one of the house. LA houses. You know, LA is very famous for Hell, yeah. Modernist architecture. They've shot a lot of new. They shot a lot of neonawars in this house. But they also, it's. There's a lot of other movies shot here, but there's this Frank Lloyd Wright house called the Ennis House.

[Casey O'Brien]

Oh, yeah.

[Millie de Chirico]

And it's very famous. I'd say it's by one of the most famous houses in la, wouldn't you say?

[Casey O'Brien]

Oh, definitely. Yeah.

[Millie de Chirico]

It's got this, like, crazy. It kind of looks like an ancient temple or something. It's made of like, you know, it's like. What do they call it? Mayan Revival? Is that the type of architecture? But, you know, it's like anytime you've seen a movie from like the 80s or 90s and there's a villain that has like a layer or something that's like. This is the house that they filmed it in, right? Yeah. I would like Blade Runner and like, what's the Vincent Price movie House on Haunted Hill or something.

[Casey O'Brien]

That's it. House on Haunted Hill is set there. Fabulous. So, okay, great. The Ennis House. I love this. That's one of them. Okay, fabulous. And who do you want to play your leading man? Do you have a. Do you have a favorite noir leading man?

[Millie de Chirico]

Why are you asking me this question? Why? I. Because I have too many.

[Casey O'Brien]

I know, I know.

[Millie de Chirico]

I've talked about Sterling Hayden many times before.

[Casey O'Brien]

Sure.

[Millie de Chirico]

I'm actually not gonna. I've talked about. God, I've talked about Robert Mitchum. I've talked about.

[Casey O'Brien]

Does it bother you that Sterling Hayden kind of squealed on people during like the huac?

[Millie de Chirico]

Yeah, there's a lot of people that did. Like, this is. It's so hard. You go and you read like, you know, stuff about, you know, some of these. This is the thing, I think, that makes this era so fascinating is that there was so many people that were like part of, part of snitching, part of not snitching. I mean, it's, it's, it's really crazy. And.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah.

[Millie de Chirico]

And yeah, it bums me out whenever I do hear of old actors that participated. Like, wasn't Ward Bond this like, classic, like, snitcheroo?

[Casey O'Brien]

Like, he just was like, oh, I don't know about that.

[Millie de Chirico]

Hugely like. And he's in one of my favorite movies of all time, Johnny Guitar, as is Sterling Hayden. But, you know, it's like he was like the king of the. I mean, he was like really, really right wing from what I heard. I think my choice, ultimately the Chicago guy, I have to go with Robert Ryan. To me, Robert Ryan is like the perfect mix. Like, I see him as this real hard boiled meanie, but he's actually a big softy.

[Casey O'Brien]

What were some of the. What are some of the big movies he was in? Was he in the Wild Bunch?

[Millie de Chirico]

Yeah, he was in his. Well, his most famous. I would say he was in a lot of famous noirs. He was in act of Violence. His. One of his best noirs was called the setup from 1949 where he played this like down on down and out, down on his luck boxer. But he was in a ton of stuff. He was in a lot of Nicholas Ray movies. He was in On Dangerous Ground, but then he kind of did westerns at the same time. And then like later in his career. Did a lot of westerns and a lot of, I don't know, action adventure type movies. But, you know, it was like he was kind of famously like a man of few words type of thing. Like, there was a thing in the Chicago Reader, I want to say, like, maybe 10 years ago where he was kind of this, like, actor that was just kind of doing his job. And he was kind of just like, never really in the press. He's just kind of like a straight lace type of dude. And then his kids found a letter that he had written them and was basically like, here's my entire life. Here's every detail I never told you about myself.

[Casey O'Brien]

Whoa.

[Millie de Chirico]

I know. And they. I think they published a lot of it in the Chicago Reader. And, like, his kids were interviewed and stuff. Just like, one of those stories that's, like, really fascinating. It's like getting to know your dad after he died through a letter.

[Casey O'Brien]

That's crazy.

[Millie de Chirico]

But I love him. He's like. I said, he's played huge assholes, but I actually think he was a sweet man in real life. And he was not Ward Bond. I think he was pretty progressive. So cool. Yeah.

[Casey O'Brien]

And what's his occupation in this movie?

[Millie de Chirico]

Oh, God. Oh, gosh. Oh, gosh. What could he be? I mean, he's obviously been a private officer. He could have been a private eye. He could be a crooked lawyer. What are some other types? Film noir types. A bookie could be, like, a.

[Casey O'Brien]

Up. Is there, like, an author? Is that one, like, a writer?

[Millie de Chirico]

Yeah. I mean, you've got, like, what, Sunset Boulevard type of vibes. Like a journalist. A. A screwed up journalist. Or maybe like a. Like in Sweet Smell of Success. He's like a up PR guy or something. Like, I actually love, like, a card player. Like, and I think it's because I like California Split so much.

[Casey O'Brien]

Sure.

[Millie de Chirico]

So maybe it's just like a card player.

[Casey O'Brien]

Gambler.

[Millie de Chirico]

Gambler that owes a lot of money. Owes a lot of money.

[Casey O'Brien]

Sure. Okay. So that sort of leads into my, you know, like my next category. Tragic backstory for our leading man. Maybe there could be something about, like, owing money, you know, something like that. Do you have anything other.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yeah.

[Casey O'Brien]

Anything else to flesh that out?

[Millie de Chirico]

He would. Yeah. I'm trying to think of what are some classic predicaments. A lot of it is, oh, owing money to, like, you know, mob bosses. There's also the, like, trying to make money for a wife that he never married or something. You know what I mean? Let's, like, try to get the girl back type of scenario, but he's down and out. Maybe there's like an estranged child thrown in the mix. I don't know. I feel like that's probably his tragic backstory is that he owed. He was a good guy. Maybe like an ex military that came home from the war, couldn't find his footing, got involved in playing cards for money, and then owed a shit ton to this Edward G. Robinson type. Does that work for you? Very good. Okay, good.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah, that's great. This is great. This is all going right into Final Draft. Okay. Yeah. Okay. So then there was like. This is sort of a weird question, but, like the little crime that leads to a bigger crime, it seems like in noirs is always like something small that is just kind of the seedling, the mustard seed that grows into something larger. Do you have any sense of what that could be? The small crime? Maybe it could be around a card game or something.

[Millie de Chirico]

Well, there's obviously the, like accidentally running into naked woman on the side of the road. Sure. There's finding. Finding piles of money or attache cases or. Yeah. Finding a finger or a foot. Maybe. Maybe we should go that direction. They're like, you know, like, almost in sort of that, like, John Sales Lone Star predicament where it's like, I'm in the. I'm out in the desert and I found a. It wouldn't be. Yeah, I wouldn't be desert. So maybe they're walking around Los Fifi in la.

[Casey O'Brien]

Los Fifi.

[Millie de Chirico]

And there's a finger. A thumb. A thumb is good.

[Casey O'Brien]

A thumb. That's an important, you know, one.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yeah, there's a thumb that appears when he's stumbling out of a diner at three o' clock in the morning.

[Casey O'Brien]

Stumbling out of Fred 62, maybe. Let's see.

[Millie de Chirico]

I'm gonna go House of Pies, but, you know, whatever.

[Casey O'Brien]

House of Pies. Yeah, sure. Okay, Cool, cool, cool. And then Femme fatale. Who could that be?

[Millie de Chirico]

Oh, God. Who could it not be? I, I mean, you got Gloria Graham. I love Rita Hayworth. I think she's like, you know, in Gilda, she's kind of like a, a, A redhead. I like, like a femme fatali. Redhead. I would go somewhat. A little bit more butch, to be honest. Okay, like. And I. When I say butch, I don't mean like, you know, I'm not saying that like we're gonna go. I don't want to go classic pretty girl. I like somebody with a little edge to them. Maybe like an Ida Lupino or like a. I want to say Mercedes McCambridge someone a little less pretty angelic and more like harder edged.

[Casey O'Brien]

Let's go with Ida Lupino.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yes, let's do that. Robert Ryan and Ida Lupino have already been in a movie together, so, you know.

[Casey O'Brien]

No, this is perfect.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yeah.

[Casey O'Brien]

Any sort of historical back backdrop to what's going on. You know, we talked about the Cold War, but like, a lot of times it seems like there's sort of leaks in historical things. World War II, you know, that type of stuff.

[Millie de Chirico]

Let's. Let's come up with something funny. What happened. What happened in the forties that was funny?

[Casey O'Brien]

What happened in the forties that was funny'? Oh, that's a good question.

[Millie de Chirico]

Nothing. It seems like nothing funny happened in the 1940s.

[Casey O'Brien]

Maybe like the invention of television or something.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yes, maybe it's. What did, like, potato chips get invented or something? I don't know. Maybe like a famous potato chip that was around in the 1940s. Oh, the bikini made its debut as a fashion statement in Paris in 1946. Maybe the invention of the bikini, that becomes a thing.

[Casey O'Brien]

I like this.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yes.

[Casey O'Brien]

Maybe. Maybe there could be some sort of, like, you know, a bikini. Something's getting smuggled inside of the stitching of a bikini or something and somebody has to wear it. You know, something like that.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yeah. Maybe the own. The owner of the first bikini factory is owed money in a card game by Robert Ryan. And then. Oh, my God, we could have this huge end sequence that happens in a bikini factory. It's like a. At the. Like a Kubrickian type of, like with the.

[Casey O'Brien]

With the mannequins, like. Yes. A room full of mannequins with bikinis. Oh, God.

[Millie de Chirico]

Come on. It writes itself.

[Casey O'Brien]

This writes its damn self. Okay, does this movie have a tragic ending or a non tragic ending?

[Millie de Chirico]

Oh, God. I mean, I feel like so many Robert Ryan movies end so badly that I just want him to.

[Casey O'Brien]

I actually felt like Kiss Me Deadly was not a tragic ending. I mean, the two. Our two leads essentially got away.

[Millie de Chirico]

I mean, he got shot, though.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah. But I think he's gonna live. I feel like that was sort of the implication.

[Millie de Chirico]

He's gonna go back to his apartment and remove his own bullet, as we all know.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yes. And I mean, he'll probably get cancer from, you know, getting burned by radiation within a few years.

[Millie de Chirico]

Well, I want. I personally want Robert Ryan to win one, so I feel like it should be good.

[Casey O'Brien]

Good non tragic. I like that. You know, and Kiss Me Deadly. Did you like his answering machine? That was pretty cool. I'd never Seen, like, such a fancy answering machine on the. Built into the wall.

[Millie de Chirico]

Well, I. That's. Yeah, I. I actually thought to myself, was he one of the first answering machine guys? Had to have been, right. 1955.

[Casey O'Brien]

And it. It was funny because it was like he'd listened to the message, and then he'd pick up, and I was like, oh, that was happening then, too, I guess.

[Millie de Chirico]

I know what. You're screening your calls. You're like, I don't want to answer this. Oh, wait a minute. I should.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah.

[Millie de Chirico]

Sidebar. Were you. Are you old enough? I just want to ask to have heard and enjoyed the song Kiss Me Deadly by Lita Ford.

[Casey O'Brien]

I know Lita Ford Kiss.

[Millie de Chirico]

Because that was one of my favorite songs when I was, like, nine years old. And that is in basically the entire reason why I even know this movie.

[Casey O'Brien]

You know, I must say, I'm not totally familiar with this song.

[Millie de Chirico]

Oh, my God. I went to a party last Saturday night.

[Casey O'Brien]

This is good. I'm listening. I like this.

[Millie de Chirico]

Kiss me once. Come on, Pity baby. Kiss Me Deadly. Come on. You don't remember this? She's, like, rising on the floor and, like, her. Like. Yeah, I'm seeing Sunset Strip bikini underwear. Like.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah.

[Millie de Chirico]

Anyway, that's. That's how I even knew the term Kiss Me Deadly enough to want to watch the movie of the same name. So there you go.

[Casey O'Brien]

Lita Ford. Thank you. Thank you for your service.

[Millie de Chirico]

Could she be in the movie at some point? Could she come in later?

[Casey O'Brien]

That would be great. Okay. I'd love that.

[Millie de Chirico]

Okay.

[Casey O'Brien]

Maybe she. She could be the bikini factory owner. Do we have a title for this?

[Millie de Chirico]

Oh, it's gotta be something good, because this is, like, one of the things about film noir that I love of these film noir titles.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah.

[Millie de Chirico]

Like, some of my favorites. There's a movie called Kiss the Blood Off My Hands. Kiss the Blood Off My Hands. I mean, is that not sexy? There's also a movie called I Wake Up Screaming. Like, I mean, I could go on. There are so many great film noir titles. There's also one of my favorites that I actually saw at Noir City in San Francisco many years ago, hosted by Eddie Muller. It was a movie called. It was about libraries, and it was called Quiet, Please Murder. I mean, come on. Okay, let's think about this, because we're.

[Casey O'Brien]

Let's think about this.

[Millie de Chirico]

We've got bikinis.

[Casey O'Brien]

We've got bikinis. We've got gambling. What about this? Okay, this kind of something. This is stupid. Like, something that combines the bikini and gambling. Like. Like bikinis. Bluff or something like that. Or like.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yeah, it would be. Yeah, something like, like I married a bikini cheater or something like. It would be something like long and stupid like that. Or like he folded. No, it would be bet. Or, you know, he bet on bikini or something like that. Don't. Don't bet on a bikini. How about that? Don't bet on me on a bikini.

[Casey O'Brien]

Don't bet on a bikini. Okay. I like it.

[Millie de Chirico]

So stupid.

[Casey O'Brien]

Okay. Anything else, Millie, that you want to add? Any add ons? Any? Oh, I missed one. I missed one funny little buddy. Who's the who plays a funny little buddy?

[Millie de Chirico]

A funny buddy? Why are you asking me this?

[Casey O'Brien]

It seems like every film noir there's like a funny little buddy that dies.

[Millie de Chirico]

Oh, yeah. You gotta have like your Claude Rains, you know, Peter Lorre, like your little short guy.

[Casey O'Brien]

I really. I would have been good as the funny little buddy. I think that would have. I would have really killed at that time. You could have crushed me with a car. You could have, you know, thrown me off a building.

[Millie de Chirico]

Listen, if. If I was at a film noir, I would own a flop house. I would either be a prison guard. I'd be a prison guard. I'd own a flop house. I'd own a laundromat. That is like a back alley place to play cards. I'd be called Big Rita or Auntie Ann or something like. It would be some. You know who I love? I love this actor. And he was a big character actor, Eli Wallach. I know he was in a lot of westerns, but Eli Wallach, you know, noir. Playing Robert Ryan's funny buddy with a little mustache.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah.

[Millie de Chirico]

You know, maybe. I mean, unfortunately, Eli Wallach played a lot of Mexicans and Italians in his life.

[Casey O'Brien]

Huh. I recently saw a movie that he was a play day.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yeah.

[Casey O'Brien]

Mexican man.

[Millie de Chirico]

And he could be like Mandy Patinkin and Princess Bride. Like, have a little bit of that, like a little Latin lover vibe. And like, just be like, you go, when they get your bikinis today.

[Casey O'Brien]

Perfect. There you go. Kind of offensive.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yeah.

[Casey O'Brien]

You know, that was an Italian accent.

[Millie de Chirico]

So I can do it. I'm half Italian.

[Casey O'Brien]

Sure. Abs wonderful. Well, Millie, I think we built our little film noir here. Oh, my God.

[Millie de Chirico]

As for add ons, I don't know what to. Like, some seasonings. I don't know what to.

[Casey O'Brien]

Some seasoning. Yeah. Some flair.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yeah. I do think the nuclear bomb thing is really funny. Maybe an alien. Maybe an alien can just come down from the sky.

[Casey O'Brien]

I love that film noir alien. Because that, you know, that's kind of like what the X Files is a little bit like. I love.

[Millie de Chirico]

Maybe the aliens are hoardy and they're like, oh, we heard their bikinis down here. We need to learn about them.

[Casey O'Brien]

Sure.

[Millie de Chirico]

Horny aliens is my seasoning, Casey.

[Casey O'Brien]

Great. Wow.

[Millie de Chirico]

Wrap it up. Put a bow on it. It's ready.

[Casey O'Brien]

Save us money. Horny aliens. I love it. Awesome. Well, thanks for playing along, Millie on Build a Noir.

[Millie de Chirico]

I can actually do this all day, so thank you.

[Casey O'Brien]

Moving on. We have our employees picks, film recommendations based on the theme of the discussion today. Today was an all film noir episode.

[Millie de Chirico]

Well, I'm actually gonna go a different route, if you don't mind.

[Casey O'Brien]

Ooh, I don't.

[Millie de Chirico]

Because we are talking about movies that were made in this sort of, like, Red Scare era in Hollywood. So there is a movie that is not technically noir. It's mostly a children's movie. It's kind of a fantasy film, to be honest. It is a movie called the Boy with green hair from 1948. It was directed by one of my favorite directors of all time. If not, well, he's in the top three bear minns, Joseph Lozi, who was blacklisted and was sent to Europe to make art films with Elizabeth Taylor and Richard Burton. So he won, essentially, I think.

[Casey O'Brien]

Sure.

[Millie de Chirico]

But it's this movie that stars the adorable little baby at this time, Dean Stockwell.

[Casey O'Brien]

King.

[Millie de Chirico]

An absolute king rip. Wait, is he still alive? No, he's got a.

[Casey O'Brien]

No, he's dead. He died a few years ago.

[Millie de Chirico]

He died? Yeah. So he essentially plays this little boy who wakes up one day and his hair is green and he doesn't know why, and he's just like, ah, my hair is green. And then everyone's like, why is your hair green, boy? That's weird. You're a weirdo. But he has the sympathetic ear, who is actually played by Robert Ryan, who we just talked about. My favorite film noir guy and the star of Don't Bet on a Bikini. He plays this kind of, like, advocate because this boy is having issues with getting picked on for being different. And the movie is essentially an allegory for being different in the era of McCarthyism and the Red Scare, because, again, Joseph Losi was exiled. So it's like it's kind of, again, like a movie that's about this topic, but is obviously, like, not a noir. It's more of a kids film. But that is my recommendation. It's a very good movie. And I feel like, as a kid's movie, you're like, holy Fuck. This is pretty. Pretty good and pretty powerful.

[Casey O'Brien]

So very good.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yeah.

[Casey O'Brien]

Dean Stockwell, what a career. I mean, I kind of forget he was like a child actor. And he has this incredible later half of his career with some of the best movies ever made.

[Millie de Chirico]

He's the best.

[Casey O'Brien]

Wow. He's amazing. I am going to. You know, I am not well versed in film noir, but I do. I want to. I want to be. I want to be better. Maybe I should study under Josh Fatem.

[Millie de Chirico]

Sure.

[Casey O'Brien]

And there's this movie that is. I would say is a noir, but is. So I feel like it kind of takes out. It sort of takes out like the private eye or like the main character having any sort of drive. And it just includes kind of all the like slacker conspiracy elements. And that's a movie. And I don't even know if I consider this a great movie, but I enjoyed it and I thought it was a big swing. Under the Silver Lake from 2018 with Andrew Garfield. Did you ever see this movie, Millie?

[Millie de Chirico]

No, I have not.

[Casey O'Brien]

It's very bizarre, but it's like LA celebrity conspiracies. And there's like this slacker guy played by Andrew Garfield who's like a out of work actor. And he meets this mysterious woman who's in his apartment. Apartment, swimming pool. And then she vanishes. And he kind of is like seeking after. He's trying to find her the rest of the movie. And he runs into all these bizarre characters and he's kind of gross. But it's a great LA movie. It's very surreal and strange and it's kind of unlike any other movie I've ever seen. It's directed by David Robert Mitchell, who did it.

[Millie de Chirico]

It follows huge when it came out.

[Casey O'Brien]

So, yeah, I'll say. Under the Silver Lake.

[Millie de Chirico]

Pretty good. I like a Neo noir or like a throwback.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yes, a Neo Noir.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yeah.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yes. That's awesome. All right. That's our show this week.

[Millie de Chirico]

Did you have fun?

[Casey O'Brien]

Thank you, Millie. I had a lot of fun. I loved watching this movie, truly. I really had a blast.

[Millie de Chirico]

I know. I said when I saw you rated on letterboxd highly. I was like, I did it. I did it.

[Casey O'Brien]

You got him.

[Millie de Chirico]

Got him. Well, I'm glad. And I can't wait for next week, by the way.

[Casey O'Brien]

Next week we are on hiatus.

[Millie de Chirico]

Well, that's why I can't wait. But the week after.

[Casey O'Brien]

Okay. But the week after. I also can't wait for that. Do you want to tell them what we're talking about?

[Millie de Chirico]

Yeah. I feel like you have A personal stake in this just because you're a Minnesota boy. But we're going to talk about this movie that you may have heard of called purple rain from 1984. We're going to get into it, get into everything. Prince.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah.

[Millie de Chirico]

We talk about your hometown a little bit.

[Casey O'Brien]

Well, I live less than a mile away from the house that Prince lives in in that movie, so I feel like I should film something in front of it.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yeah, I think you should. I think you should do the podcast from it, if you could. Yeah.

[Casey O'Brien]

Record the episode right in front of. On the lawn. Yeah, I think that's a good idea. Can't wait. I can't wait to re watch it, too. It's been a while since I've seen.

[Millie de Chirico]

Purple Rain, so that's interesting. I watch it probably like every other year or something.

[Casey O'Brien]

Really?

[Millie de Chirico]

Yeah, I've seen it so many times. It usually plays in the movies, like all the time. I don't know why.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah.

[Millie de Chirico]

Somebody is always inviting me to a screening I a purple ray and I'm like, man, I just saw that movie.

[Casey O'Brien]

I was just at First Ave this month seeing a show.

[Millie de Chirico]

Wow. Well, there you go.

[Casey O'Brien]

So. But that's our show. In the future, we'd like to give out film advice at the end of our show. So if you need. If you need any specific recommendations, need help navigating a director's filmography, or need a film gripe resolved, please write in. You can email us at Dear Movies at exactly right media.com or you can ask us via voicemail, which we love. We'd love to play the voicemails on the show. Just record. Record a voicemail on your phone that's under a minute and email it to DearMoviesactlyRightMedia.com all right.

[Millie de Chirico]

And if you want to follow us on social media, we are at Dr. Movies. I love you on Instagram and Facebook. If you want to follow us on letterboxd, our handles are Aceylee o' Brien and at Mdecherico.

[Casey O'Brien]

That's right. Listen to Dear Movies. I love you on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts and rate and review our show. We love when people rate and review our show, particularly when they say nice things. But yeah, so get out there. It helps spread the word for the show.

[Millie de Chirico]

Yeah, we would love it, guys. I mean, let's get serious. I need you. I need you to like. I need you to like me. I need you to like Casey. I need you to like us. We love you.

[Casey O'Brien]

You know What? We haven't. We haven't received one. One love letter in our email inbox.

[Millie de Chirico]

What?

[Casey O'Brien]

So if you want to write us a love letter, please do so. You can, you can send that to dearMoviesactlyRightMedia.com I mean, listen, Casey has Covid. I have Covid.

[Millie de Chirico]

Be nice. Like feel something. Feel for once. All right, on that note, as I'm yelling at our listeners to love us, feel something. We will see you all in two weeks. We'll see you all in two weeks. And don't open suitcases that you don't know what's in them.

[Casey O'Brien]

If you see them, a little glowing coming out of the suitcase. Just keep it closed, keep moving on.

[Millie de Chirico]

Goodbye.

[Casey O'Brien]

Bye.

[Millie de Chirico]

This has been an exactly right production. Hosted by me, Millie de Chericho, and produced by my co host, Casey o' Brien.

[Casey O'Brien]

This episode was mixed by Tom Bryfogel. Our associate producer is Christina Chamberlain, our guest booker is Patrick Cotner, and our artwork is by Vanessa Lilac.

[Millie de Chirico]

Our incredible theme music is by the best band in the entire world, the Softies.

[Casey O'Brien]

Thank you to our executive producers, Karen Kilgariff, Georgia Hardstark, Daniel Kramer and Millie de Chirico.

[Millie de Chirico]

We love you.

[Casey O'Brien]

Goodbye. Be kind.

[Unknown]

Not everyone who handles your personal information is going to be as careful as you are. And it only takes one mistake to expose it to hackers and identity theft. Maybe that's why there's a new victim of identity theft every five seconds in the United States. Fortunately, there's Lifelock. Lifelock monitors hundreds of millions of data points a second for threats to your identity. If your identity is stolen, a LifeLock US based restoration specialist will help solve identity theft issues on your behalf, guaranteed or your money back. Plus, all LifeLock plans are backed by the million dollar protection package, meaning Lifelock will reimburse you up to the limits of your plan. If you lose money due to identity theft. You can't control how diligent others are with your personal information. But with Lifelock, you can help protect it. Act now and save up to 40% your first year. Call 1-800-LIFELOCK and use promo code iheart or go to lifelock.com iheart for 40% off terms apply.

[Casey O'Brien]

New out of nowhere obstacles. New all or nothing moments. New less than likely triumphs. Season two of the Unshakeables podcast has it all. Hi, I'm Ben Walter, CEO of Chase for Business and host of the show. We're excited to bring you more inspiring stories from small business owners who share the what are we gonna do? Moments that ended up changing everything. Listen wherever you get your podcasts. Chase Mobile app is available for select mobile devices. Message and data rates may apply. JPMorgan Chase bank and a member FDIC Copyright 2025 JPMorgan Chase & Company. Add Dry Eye relief to your routine with Refresh OPTV Mega 3, a lubricating eye drop with a moisture rich, preservative free formula enhanced with inactive ingredients like flaxseed oil and antioxidants. This formula supports all three tear film layers and provides advanced hydration to instantly moisturize and soothe dry eyes. Refresh Optiv Mega 3 is safe to use as often as needed so you can make it part of your wellness routine. Find Refresh online or in the Eyedrop section at all major retailers. FSA and HSA eligible.