Materialists (2025)

Summary

Podcast Summary: Dear Movies, I Love You – Episode: Materialists (2025)

Podcast Information:

• Title: Dear Movies, I Love You
• Hosts: Millie De Chirico and Casey O'Brien
• Network: Exactly Right and iHeartPodcasts
• Description: A heartfelt exploration of cinema, treating movies as enduring crushes. Hosts Millie and Casey delve into movie culture, offering fresh takes on blockbusters and uncovering art-house gems.

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Introduction to the Episode

In the July 29, 2025 episode titled "Materialists," hosts Millie De Chirico and Casey O'Brien dive deep into the contemporary film landscape, centering their discussion around Celine Song's latest movie, Materialists. This episode promises an engaging blend of film analysis, personal anecdotes, and listener interactions.

Main Discussion: Materialists

Initial Reactions and Personal Anecdotes The episode kicks off with Millie and Casey sharing a light-hearted and personal conversation about Casey's recent limb lengthening surgery, setting a candid and relatable tone for the episode.

• Casey O'Brien [02:24]: "Have you ever heard of limb lengthening surgery? I did it last week."
• Millie De Chirico [03:33]: "Wow, you're 6 foot 11 now? That's incredible!"

This personal touch seamlessly transitions into their main topic—Materialists—with both expressing their anticipation and apprehension about the film.

Film Overview and Synopsis Casey provides a comprehensive synopsis of Materialists, outlining the central characters and plot dynamics:

• Casey O'Brien [33:14]: "Lucy Mason, played by Dakota Johnson, is a successful matchmaker who breaks down relationships into math equations—height, income, looks. She plans to remain single until she meets Harry Castillo, a wealthy and tall man, at a wedding. However, things get complicated when she encounters her ex-boyfriend, John Finch, portrayed by Chris Evans, reigniting old flames."

Critical Analysis and Key Themes Millie and Casey delve into a critical analysis of Materialists, addressing its attempt to blend romantic comedy with deeper societal themes like class, capitalism, and the superficiality of modern dating.

• Millie De Chirico [35:00]: "After Past Lives, it's tough for Celine Song to replicate that emotional depth. Materialists feels like she's swinging for something unique but missing the mark."
• Casey O'Brien [32:35]: "The movie tries to subvert the rom-com genre with its atmospheric style, but it ends up feeling unmoored and tonally inconsistent."

They discuss the film's portrayal of matchmaking services catering to a wealthy clientele, highlighting the problematic demands and biases exhibited by the characters.

• Millie De Chirico [41:51]: "Clients want partners with specific salary thresholds and unrealistic physical standards. It's a stark commentary on the commodification of relationships."

Performance Critiques The hosts critique the performances, particularly focusing on Dakota Johnson and Chris Evans, arguing that their portrayals lacked relatability and emotional depth necessary for a compelling romantic narrative.

• Casey O'Brien [49:11]: "Dakota Johnson's performance felt too muted and regal. There was no relatability or quirkiness to connect with her character."
• Millie De Chirico [54:23]: "Chris Evans was too beautiful and chic, making it hard to see him as a relatable character struggling with his own issues."

Mixed Tone and Audience Reception A notable point of discussion is the film's tonal inconsistency, especially the unexpected inclusion of humorous elements in otherwise serious scenes, which left the hosts feeling disconnected.

• Casey O'Brien [62:15]: "The caveman prologue felt so out of place in an earnest rom-com. It left me confused about the movie's direction."
• Millie De Chirico [67:21]: "The mix of dark revelations with unintentional humor made the film feel bizarre and unbalanced."

Conclusion on Materialists Despite their criticisms, Millie and Casey acknowledge the film's ambitious attempt to tackle complex themes within the rom-com framework. They express hope for a reevaluation of the film in the future, drawing parallels to other movies that were initially misunderstood.

• Casey O'Brien [70:38]: "This is the classic type of movie that might end up being reevaluated years from now. It tries something different, and even if it didn't work for us, it deserves recognition."
• Millie De Chirico [70:16]: "Like Mulholland Drive, it might gain appreciation over time for its unique approach."

Segment: Film Regrets

Introduction to Film Regrets The hosts transition to a beloved segment where listeners share their "film regrets"—movies they once loved but now view differently.

Listener Contributions Casey and Millie read and discuss listener-submitted regrets, providing humorous and insightful commentary.

• Casey O'Brien [77:46]: "I saw Gummo on a first date with someone I had a crush on. It was terrible, and the relationship didn't last."
• Kate [81:04]: "I loved Forrest Gump as a child, but now I question its reliability as a narrative tool."

Hosts' Personal Reflections Millie and Casey share their own film regrets, adding depth to the conversation.

• Millie De Chirico [87:28]: "I've watched several BTS documentaries, which I now consider film regrets."
• Casey O'Brien [85:49]: "As a kid, I loved Macaulay Culkin in Home Alone, but later saw his role in The Good Son and felt differently."

Segment: Employees' Picks

Film Recommendations In this segment, Millie and Casey recommend films related to the episode's theme, enriching the listener's viewing list.

• Millie De Chirico [91:55]: "I recommend I Shot Andy Warhol (1996), produced by Killer Films. Jared Harris delivers an incredible performance as Andy Warhol."
• Casey O'Brien [92:37]: "My pick is Whit Stillman's Metropolitan (1990). It's a brilliant exploration of social status and relationships among young Manhattan socialites."

Conclusion and Teasers for Next Episode

Millie and Casey wrap up the episode by encouraging listeners to share their thoughts and film experiences. They tease the next episode, which will focus on Jackass Number Two (2006), highlighting their passion for the Jackass franchise.

• Millie De Chirico [94:07]: "If you have any film regrets or gripes, email us at [e-mail]."
• Casey O'Brien [95:22]: "Next week, we'll be discussing Jackass Number Two—the best Jackass movie according to many. Don't miss it!"

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Notable Quotes:

• Casey O'Brien [32:35]: "The movie tries to subvert the rom-com genre with its atmospheric style, but it ends up feeling unmoored and tonally inconsistent."
• Millie De Chirico [41:51]: "Clients want partners with specific salary thresholds and unrealistic physical standards. It's a stark commentary on the commodification of relationships."
• Casey O'Brien [70:38]: "This is the classic type of movie that might end up being reevaluated years from now. It tries something different, and even if it didn't work for us, it deserves recognition."

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Final Thoughts: This episode of Dear Movies, I Love You offers a thoughtful critique of Materialists, blending personal experiences with in-depth film analysis. Millie and Casey's candid discussions provide listeners with a nuanced understanding of the film's strengths and shortcomings, while also engaging with their audience through relatable segments like film regrets and personalized recommendations. As always, the hosts maintain their signature blend of humor and insight, making this episode both entertaining and intellectually stimulating for movie enthusiasts.

Transcript

[Melita Cherico]

This is exactly right.

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[Melita Cherico]

Hey. Oh well, Casey, where are you? I don't see you at all. Why is. Why is your camera off right now?

[Casey O'Brien]

Oh, I'm just. I'm keeping my camera off for this episode.

[Melita Cherico]

Why? What. What happened? Are you. Did you get punched in the face or something? What happened?

[Casey O'Brien]

I. I just had a. Just a very, very minor, very slight procedure done this past week and I thought it best that you not see me just right now in my current iteration.

[Melita Cherico]

Oh my God. What did you get? Like A facelift or something? Like what, Billy?

[Casey O'Brien]

No, no, nothing quite like that. Okay, well, I guess you know how famously I'm five seven.

[Melita Cherico]

Are you actually five seven?

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah, I'm five seven and a half.

[Melita Cherico]

Really? I must be. I must be very short. I think I am actually really short. I can't believe it, because I thought you looked way taller than me. I'm five four.

[Casey O'Brien]

Oh, well, that's fine for, you know, a woman, but, yeah, like I said, I was. I was 5 7.

[Melita Cherico]

What do you mean you was. You were 5 7? What happened?

[Casey O'Brien]

Well, I. I didn't want to. God. Okay. I didn't want to get into it on the podcast, but. Have you ever heard of limb lengthening surgery, Lem. Le.

[Melita Cherico]

What? I'm sorry?

[Casey O'Brien]

Can you repeat limb lengthening surgery, Millie? Have you ever heard of that?

[Melita Cherico]

No, I haven't. And as a short person, I feel like I should have. What does that entail?

[Casey O'Brien]

It's a procedure where you can have your legs lengthened to add height to your overall stature. And I had it done this last week.

[Melita Cherico]

So you're telling me that you went under the knife to get longer legs, and now how tall are you? How tall are you now?

[Casey O'Brien]

So, you know, I thought it'd be great to be six feet. Oh, it would be great to be over six feet. And the max, you know, I thought that you could do was six inches, which would put me up to six one.

[Melita Cherico]

Wow.

[Casey O'Brien]

You know, but I. There was. I think there was some miscommunication. So.

[Melita Cherico]

So your camera's off because what happened? You. Now you're. You're all jangly dangly, like, what's going.

[Casey O'Brien]

I think they misheard me. And they added 16 inches.

[Melita Cherico]

What? What?

[Casey O'Brien]

Hold on. I'm 6 foot 11, Millie.

[Melita Cherico]

So what are you saying? That you're like Victor Wembanyama?

[Casey O'Brien]

That's the worst part. I'm. I'm still shorter than Victor Wimanyama.

[Melita Cherico]

And.

[Casey O'Brien]

I don't have the wingspan, you know? Now I need to get arm lengthening surgery so I look proportional. It's just a mess. Million. I'm embarrassed.

[Melita Cherico]

Okay, well, okay, dude, I mean, I don't know what to tell you. I. I feel like you can. Your worth is only getting better by being freakishly.

[Casey O'Brien]

See, that's what. That's what I feel. But I've. I've actually, it's. I've gone over. I've overshot it now, and now I'm a. I'm basically like a slender man.

[Melita Cherico]

Yeah.

[Casey O'Brien]

And it's just a disaster.

[Melita Cherico]

Well, you're gonna have to be in a niche market, a niche dating market, because, you know, you're.

[Casey O'Brien]

Well, I am married with a child and they're not happy about it, certainly. So I'm not dating anybody.

[Melita Cherico]

Well, having said that, we have an amazing episode this week that is about one of the newest movies about modern dating, wouldn't you say?

[Casey O'Brien]

Oh, I would definitely say it's one of the newest movies about modern dating, surgery be damned. We're talking about this movie on the podcast. We're talking about materialists, Celine Song's follow up to Past Lives. And you and I both saw this in the theaters and I don't know how you feel about it. So I'm very intrigued to hear your reaction.

[Melita Cherico]

Oh, I'm intrigued to hear your reaction because obviously drove you to, to surgical heights, if you will.

[Casey O'Brien]

Well, this was on the books for many months. Happens that it's mentioned occasionally in this movie.

[Melita Cherico]

Yes, I see.

[Casey O'Brien]

As well.

[Melita Cherico]

Well, and like I want to say preface all of that by saying to you, you know this, we're doing a very brand new movie that we ve. We don't do this often. It's like a movie that's in movie theaters right now. So there's gonna be spoilers perhaps, and if you don't want to hear anything about this movie whatsoever, then you might want to not list. We would love it, though, if you want to get in there and chop it up with us.

[Casey O'Brien]

Well, not on top of that, we're going to be talking about some more film regrets. Actually, we're going to be reading people's letters that wrote in about their film regrets because a lot of people responded to that. So that'll be kind of fun to revisit that. Maybe we have some new regrets. I don't know. Might come up, but we'll see.

[Melita Cherico]

I know. I'm loving the, the enthusiasm around the regrets, but yeah, stay tuned. It's gonna be an interesting episode. You're listening to Dear Movies, I love you. Dear Mo. I love you. And I've got to know if you love me too. Yes or no.

[Casey O'Brien]

Check the box below.

[Melita Cherico]

Well, hello, you are listening to Dear Movies, I love you. This is a podcast for those who are in a relationship with film. My name is Melita Cherico.

[Casey O'Brien]

My name is Casey o'. Brien. I had my procedure reversed by. I'm back to normal.

[Melita Cherico]

God, I actually want, I've always wanted to be super tall. Did I tell you about the whole. I have, I had two inches stricken from my record by my doctor.

[Casey O'Brien]

Oh, it's like an astronaut coming back from space. You shrunk?

[Melita Cherico]

Yeah. Oh, yeah. No, I was always. I always thought I was five, six. Like, I will say, from like my early 20s until about five years ago, I was going around the world telling people I was 5 6. Yeah, I felt very comfortable at 5 6. And then my doctor was like, oh, no, you're like five, four.

[Casey O'Brien]

And I'm like, man, there is a difference, isn't there?

[Melita Cherico]

Yes. 5, 6 to 54 for me, because I come from, like, a line of shorties. My mom is like, five nothing. Five, one.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah.

[Melita Cherico]

So my dad's of average height, I would say. I mean, he's. But he's. You know, I wanted to be really tall. Like, I wanted to be like 5 10, 5, 11.

[Casey O'Brien]

I used to really wish I was taller. Yeah, it really, like, bothered me. And it wasn't so much in dating cause had no problems there, but it was just more about, like, commanding respect. And like, men treat you differently as a little short guy. You know, like in high school and college or even in bars, like, I feel like people are maybe more likely to start. Want to start a fight with you if you're littler.

[Melita Cherico]

That's.

[Casey O'Brien]

I've had that. Yeah. You know, I've had a lot of. I've had a lot of grown men grab me by the collar.

[Melita Cherico]

Are you fucking joking? Are you serious?

[Casey O'Brien]

No. Oh, yeah, I'm serious.

[Melita Cherico]

God, what's wrong with you guys?

[Casey O'Brien]

I know, it's horrible. I agree. And so I was like. I was like, if I feel like it was bigger that men wouldn't do that to me.

[Melita Cherico]

Well, I'll tell you, like, guys are disgusting for so many reasons. Besides, they pick on their own kind for being shorter. They pick on women for being old and fat and ugly. Like, this is this movie, by the way, we're gonna talk about Materialist. I think you. We've already teased that in the intro. There will be many discussions about modern dating because this movie is really an examination of modern dating. But just also, it's so blunt in the ways that it talks about modern dating to the point where it kind of unmoored me a little bit.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah.

[Melita Cherico]

You know, and then it. It really brings up, like, a lot of personal feelings about dating and about, like, these little qualifications and all the uncomfortableness about height and weight and money.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah.

[Melita Cherico]

Income, education, all of these things we feel so weird about all the time. So, yeah, hopefully you'll be able. You'll be able to talk about it because I. I was like, damn, I don't think you're short. That's the thing. I'm shorter than you and I always thought I When we were hanging out in person, I thought you were tall. So it's all relative.

[Casey O'Brien]

When we were hanging out in person, I thought you were tall. Millie, I did not think you were short.

[Melita Cherico]

I swear to God. I thought you were like six foot. I'm not joking.

[Casey O'Brien]

That is wild.

[Melita Cherico]

I even told Danielle that I was like, oh, he's taller than you know.

[Casey O'Brien]

You think I would be a podcast producer if I was six feet tall? I'd be living in a penthouse in Manhattan. I'm talking on a damn podcast in my basement.

[Melita Cherico]

That's real though. That's real.

[Casey O'Brien]

You think a six foot tall man would be doing this?

[Melita Cherico]

Listen, if I was Elizabeth Berkeley and Showgirls, I think you'd know I wouldn't be here either. This podcast wouldn't exist if we were different.

[Casey O'Brien]

These were the hands we were dealt. Millie.

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[Melita Cherico]

Oh.

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[Casey O'Brien]

But before we get into all that, Millie, we must open up the film diary, the ancient film text.

[Melita Cherico]

This is getting heavier by the day.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yes. Each. Each inscription make adds to its weight.

[Melita Cherico]

And also, you have. You have just scrapbooking, too. You're making this into a scrapbook, this film diary. You've got your little high school logo stickers all over it.

[Casey O'Brien]

Every. Every popcorn bag and bucket I flatten and tape into the pages of the book.

[Melita Cherico]

Let me ask you this. Do you want to go first this week?

[Casey O'Brien]

Oh, sure. Yes. Happy to.

[Melita Cherico]

Okay, cool.

[Casey O'Brien]

So it was just not to timestamp this too much, but this past week was 4th of July, and Trisha was like, I want to watch, like, American Patriotic Movie. I was like, wow, sure. And she was like, let's watch the Fugitive. And I was like, have you seen the Fugitive? That's not a patriotic movie. And she was like, oh, it's not. I thought it was like a. I thought it was like a political thriller. And I was like, no, it's not at all. But let's watch it. It's great. So we watched the Fugitive, which is like a very winter movie, too, which is kind of fun to watch during the summer. Fugitive is great, man. Fugitive from 1993. Harrison Ford, looking good. Have you seen the Fugitive?

[Melita Cherico]

I think I did see it, but I'm gonna get confused with Air Force One because I won one of the movies I saw in a movie theater, and it might have been the.

[Casey O'Brien]

I think the Fugitive is much better than Air Force One. Like, Tommy Lee Jones won an Oscar for the Fugitive.

[Melita Cherico]

Okay. Okay. Anyways, did you watch that Trisha Joyet?

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah, she really loved it. I think she gave it four and a half stars.

[Melita Cherico]

Wow.

[Casey O'Brien]

I also give it four and a half stars in Litter Box. And then I'm doing a little bit of research this week. So I watched Jurassic Park 3 from 2001. This is the goofiest, one of the goofiest Jurassic Parks I've seen. It was fine. It was minor. It felt to me, the stakes felt lower. It's much smaller. I thought it was just okay, okay. But then I watched Jurassic World Dominion from 2022, and that's the Jurassic park that came out right before the latest one, which is Jurassic World Rebirth. And Jurassic World Dominion I thought was very disappointing. And it made me question. I was like, what exactly is a Jurassic park movie at this point? Because Jurassic World Dominion is very like Mission Impossible. It also had like. It also reminded me of the movie Commando with Arnold Schwarzenegger where like a daughter is kidnapped and they're going after somebody. Like kidnapped. Yeah. It was a lot of. I don't know. So a little bit of a mess, in my opinion.

[Melita Cherico]

Well, thanks for telling me all that because I feel like I have to go on a similar research dive soon. Thanks a lot.

[Casey O'Brien]

Anyways, that's all the movies we. I watched this last week. What about you, Millie?

[Melita Cherico]

Well, at least you got the Fugitive in there. Four and a half stars.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yes, exactly.

[Melita Cherico]

All right, so I actually watched four movies this week, y'. All. Many of them. One, two, three. Three of them were first time watches.

[Casey O'Brien]

Wow. Okay.

[Melita Cherico]

One of them is a huge, huge first time watch. So the first movie I saw this week was Monty Python and the Holy Grail.

[Casey O'Brien]

Wow. I can't believe you've never seen it. But also, you were never a 13 year old boy, so it might make sense why that one didn't cross your path.

[Melita Cherico]

I mean, listen, I am Gen X or whatever. I'm kind of that, like, I'm in that zone. Remember Brett Berg talked about it? It's like, yes, we're like, not true Gen X, but we're also not millennial because the millennial starts like in a year or two after we were born. Because we were Both born in 79.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah. Brett Berg was talking about how you were like after the fact, kind of pushed into. He was complaining about this anyway, that he feels like he was pushed into being Gen X many years afterwards.

[Melita Cherico]

Yes, yes. I will say that there are people who are in the Gen X zone who are a little older than me, that this was their everything. Right. And I respect that. I respect it. God bless you. It just wasn't on my radar, as you mentioned. And when I finally sat down and watched it, first of all, I'm doing a DVR cleanup of all the stuff that I've recorded off of tv and a lot of it was on tcm. So this is why I watched. I finally just decided to watch this movie. I gotta tell you this. For me, it felt like I was watching something way too late. Like I was like, oh, here's something that I know is culturally significant. I totally understand why this is popular with a certain age group, but I understand why people still love it. But for me, I don't have any childhood reverence for it. So I'm just watching like kind of a, you know, kind of just like a broad comedy, you know.

[Casey O'Brien]

That movie was so hyped. I think I saw it first when I was like 12.

[Melita Cherico]

Yeah.

[Casey O'Brien]

But before that it was like hyped up. Like, this is the funniest movie of all time. This is like the best. It's so funny. Non stop joke fest. And then when I watched it, I remember being disappointed too. I have no real affinity for this film. Like, I don't really, like, love it in the way that people, like. It's the movie that got them into comedy.

[Melita Cherico]

Right.

[Casey O'Brien]

Like, you hear people say that, that it's like, that was like a hugely influential film for them to like, be like, oh, I want to be a comedian after watching that movie.

[Melita Cherico]

Well, and like, this is the thing, this is why I don't want to. I'm not like, shitting on it ultimately, because every generation has like the comedy troupe of their, you know, of their generation. For me, it was Kids in the Hall. So, you know, I will always love anything Kids in the hall because when I was 12, I used to watch the Kids in the hall and I thought it was like the funniest thing in the world. Right. There are people that I know that have never, like, who are younger than me, who've never even heard of the Kids in the Hall. They haven't even heard of, like, Mr. Show or any of these other things. So, you know, I get that. Like, it wasn't part of my childhood. So I don't feel anything for it necessarily. The only thing I will say, and I won't say it was a bad movie. Like, I don't think it was. It's bad. It's just, you know, it's like watching like a broad comedy with a bunch of jokes that you've kind of heard third, fourth hand or whatever. The only thought that I really did have the entire time. This is like such a stupid thought was. I was like, what is it about like the 12th century? Ish. That is so horny. Doesn't it feel like the Camelot Knights era was just like real horny?

[Casey O'Brien]

Very horny, yeah.

[Melita Cherico]

At least via, like, films.

[Casey O'Brien]

I remember we watched some movie in English class my senior year. Maybe it was like Excalibur. It was some 1970s medieval King Arthur movie. And there's like a really long sex graphic sex scene in it. And my teacher got up during it and like held a notebook in front of it and fast forwarded and felt like she was fast forwarding forever. Like. So. Yeah.

[Melita Cherico]

Anyway, so I watched that for the.

[Casey O'Brien]

1975'S Monty Python and the Holy Grail first time watch. What's next.

[Melita Cherico]

Then I watched this movie that I was the first time watch for me, even though. And it's an insane that it's the first time watch because I'm such a fan of the main actor in this film. So I watched this movie called the fool killer from 1965. It was actually programmed on TCM by Joe Dante. He was like the guest programmer for the night. And he's the one that.

[Casey O'Brien]

I love. Joe Dante.

[Melita Cherico]

I do too. So he picked this movie, which I think is great because it. I don't think it's ever aired on TCM before. This would be something that I'd play on underground, to be quite honest. It's basically this like weird Anthony Perkins movie from like the mid-60s where he's like. He. He's kind of like dressed like Davy Crockett and he's like befriends this young boy and they have kind of this like pure. Kind of like Huckleberry Finn, Tom Sawyer kind of relationship. But then he's a ser. He's like a murderer or serial killer. Anthony Perkins is not the child. It's very strange. There's also like a part about like, where like a preacher comes on and starts like preaching really loudly and. And crazily. I don't know. It was kind of like a product of its time meets like a weird psychotronic movie. I don't know. It was. It was very strange. But I was ultimately, I was glad that he picked it because I was like, wow, I've never even heard of this movie.

[Casey O'Brien]

So I'm surprised Anthony Perkins wanted to do that movie be a serial killer after Psycho.

[Melita Cherico]

I mean, he did psychos 2, 3 and 4 too. So I don't know, maybe he was like, this is me. I'm just Gonna be this guy forever. But. But it was kind of like an art of like one of these like kind of interesting artifact type of films that I'm just ultimately glad I saw.

[Casey O'Brien]

Sure.

[Melita Cherico]

And then I watched two movies that was. Were part of the TCM Pride programming month in June that I just had on the dvr. I watched. My first time watch was Go Fish, the movie Go Fish.

[Casey O'Brien]

I've never seen Go Fish.

[Melita Cherico]

It was good. It's so. God, I mean, talk about like, I remember when this movie was out in the 90s, this was like a movie that got referenced a lot when we talked about, you know, like American independent 90s films. This was like one of the staples, right?

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah.

[Melita Cherico]

And for some reason I just had never seen it, even though I have seen and watched many times. The Watermelon Woman who stars Guinevere Turner, she actually wrote Go Fish.

[Casey O'Brien]

She also wrote American Psycho.

[Melita Cherico]

Oh, right. Yeah. So she's, she's it. And I don't know, I thought it was great. It was a. It's a great, like little independent movie. Kind of like a bunch of friends hanging out, black and white. It's really cool.

[Casey O'Brien]

From 1994.

[Melita Cherico]

Yeah. Yeah. And then the last movie I saw, which played pretty much immediately after Go Fish is. And this is, I've seen this movie before is Sandra Bernhardt's without you I'm nothing from 1990 on my watch list.

[Casey O'Brien]

I have not seen it. Alonzo Deralde of the Maximum Film Podcast recommended this movie to me and I. I still have not seen it.

[Melita Cherico]

I actually think that he collaborated on the Pride programming with my friend Ben Cheaves who works at tcm.

[Casey O'Brien]

Oh, he might have, because he just had it recently had a book released by tcm, the Pride.

[Melita Cherico]

Yes, Pride book. I think that was probably a promotional stunt for him to come on to talk about synergy. So anyway, it was. I actually played this movie in Underground many years ago and it was hard. It was hard to see for a very long time. It might still be actually. But yeah, it's kind of like a one woman show. And it's on. It's like in film form. It's cool.

[Casey O'Brien]

So I love Sandra Bernhardt. She's so cool.

[Melita Cherico]

Yeah, she is really cool. That's it.

[Casey O'Brien]

Awesome.

[Melita Cherico]

Yep.

[Casey O'Brien]

Close it up.

[Melita Cherico]

Ah, God, close it.

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[Casey O'Brien]

Okay, time to do our main discussion which is on 2025's materialists, written and directed by Celine Song Now Millie and I both saw this in the Theaters not together, but separately. I'm glad you didn't see it in my theater because the air conditioning wasn't working. Real hot there. So, Millie, I don't have any idea how you feel about it, so maybe you and I can each give our three word review to maybe give some insight on how we felt about this movie. And this isn't a review podcast, you know, but it's good to say how we felt about it because a lot of people are talking about this movie, saying it's bad, saying it's good.

[Melita Cherico]

Yeah, well. And like, to your point, just now, part of the reason why I pitched it was because I had friends who were texting me, being like, have you seen material? Is like, I got to know your take. I got to know your take. And I'm like, you know what? We should just do an episode about it, because I feel like you and I. Did you like Past Lives Silly and songs?

[Casey O'Brien]

Previous film came out in 2023. I loved past Lives.

[Melita Cherico]

Me too.

[Casey O'Brien]

I was a puddle.

[Melita Cherico]

Me too.

[Casey O'Brien]

Afterwards, didn't you have to be, like, airlifted out of the theater? Am I thinking about that?

[Melita Cherico]

Yeah, of course I did. It was. I was awful. I was with other people and people that I wasn't, like, super tight friends with. And I was such a disaster that I, like, ran to the bathroom after the credits started rolling, and I, like, didn't come out for a while because I was like, oh, I'm like, my eyes are puffy.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah. Like, hey, guys, you want to get some pizza? I know.

[Melita Cherico]

They probably go around now being like, God, that Millie de Chirica woman is insane. She completely, like, you know, bald her eyes out at this movie.

[Casey O'Brien]

No, but I loved it. I thought it was so. It was her first movie, but it just felt, like, so masterful. And it was in the New York Times Top 100 Movies of the 21st Century. Should have been on there. Yeah.

[Melita Cherico]

So.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah. But I love. I loved Past life.

[Melita Cherico]

Yeah. So. Well, now. So now we're moving, you know, like, to my friend. So to my friends who were like, what do you. What do you think? This is how I think in three words, right? Mm. Okay. Three words. I will say weird as fuck. What about you?

[Casey O'Brien]

Weird as fuck. Let's see. I would say mine's gonna be a question tonally. Where are we?

[Melita Cherico]

That's four words, right? I'll give you that extra word.

[Casey O'Brien]

Where are we? How about just where are we?

[Melita Cherico]

Okay. That's your. Okay. Totally. Is just your kicker.

[Casey O'Brien]

Wow.

[Melita Cherico]

Okay. Wow.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah. I mean it. The thing is, I see what she's trying to do, but this is ostensibly a romantic comedy, and it is, to me, it was not funny. I think that's kind of a key problem in it, is that I didn't find it very funny.

[Melita Cherico]

Sure, sure.

[Casey O'Brien]

And so it was hard to know the tone of it, but it also felt very sincere in the way that Past Lives is.

[Melita Cherico]

And.

[Casey O'Brien]

But it's a different movie than Past Lives. It's a different genre.

[Melita Cherico]

Yes.

[Casey O'Brien]

And it sort of has the bones of a romantic comedy, but I don't know, this just really did not work for me.

[Melita Cherico]

This is interesting. Well, okay. Before we get any further, perhaps.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yep.

[Melita Cherico]

Would you like to give a synopsis of Materialist?

[Casey O'Brien]

Sure, sure, sure.

[Melita Cherico]

Okay.

[Casey O'Brien]

Okay. So Lucy Mason, played by Dakota Johnson, is a very successful matchmaker for a high profile matchmaking service in New York City. She breaks people down to math equations. You know, height, income, looks on a scale from 1 to 10. And she plans on being single for the rest of her life. That is, until she meets Harry Castillo, played by Pedro Pascal, at a wedding. He is a 10 out of 10. He's tall and he's super rich. But he's unusual, according to Lucy because he wants to date someone like Lucy rather than a younger certified 10, which he could easily attain. And normally this type of guy would go for. But also he's a little bit boring. I don't know. Anyways, they start dating, but there's an issue because she also runs into her hot ex boyfriend, John Finch, played by Chris Evans, at this same wedding. Now he's poor and he's trying to be an actor and he's hot, but there's chemistry. There's chemistry between him and Lucy. And Lucy had broken up with him. They had been together a long time, but I don't know how far in the past they broke up. But she broke up with him because he was broke. But now she's got this ultra wealthy guy. I don't know. What's a girl to do?

[Melita Cherico]

Very good, Very good. Wow. Yeah. This. Okay, so I don't even know how to begin because I will say, I think first and foremost we need to talk about what I think it's kind of like in the music world, there's that, like, second album curse. It's like the second film curse, right?

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah.

[Melita Cherico]

Because Celine's song, you know, is an Asian woman. She made this really deeply emotional and poignant movie First Time Go. She wrote and directed Past Lives. Right. And it pulls a lot from her personal life because, you know, that situation Effectively, from what I've read online and how she's talked about, it was sort of true to life for her.

[Casey O'Brien]

And in past lives, basically, she reconnects with an old fling who lives. Who's from Korea, but she's married to someone, but she wants to meet this guy in person when he visits New York, this guy from Korea. And she's kind of, like, openly talking about, like, I had feelings for him and I'd like to see him. And the husband's kind of like, are you gonna, like, get with this guy? And she's kind of like, I don't know what's gonna happen when I see this guy. So it's kind of a. Yeah, it's sort of a love triangle type of movie. Past lives is.

[Melita Cherico]

Yeah. And it has this sort of, like, really beautiful, like, kind of through line, which is the kind of invisible thread of connection that Koreans believe in, where basically, you're always going to be connected to certain people, whether or not you're actually physically with them or whatever. And it's also, like, to me, a lot about being from another country and immigrating to. It's like an immigration story about, you know, seeing yourself as, like, after you've moved to the west, like, being a more Westernized person versus the way you were when you were living, you know, growing up in Korea and how, you know, what kind of life do you have here versus the one you would have back home? I mean, it's just very complex. I was very, very moved by it. So, you know, I feel like because of that, it won a lot of awards. It got a lot of acclaim. There was just. I feel like in that way, when you make this incredibly amazing first album, there's just no way that the second thing is gonna make as much of an impact. I feel like you're fucked in that way. So there was this moment where I do feel like she could have made any movie and it would have been like. I mean, she could have probably made a Marvel movie at this point.

[Casey O'Brien]

But, like, I'm sure there were offers.

[Melita Cherico]

I know any movie she would have made would have ultimately been like, well.

[Casey O'Brien]

It'S not like this first one, totally.

[Melita Cherico]

So I like to give a little grace for that, I will say. But I also think that as a movie, I. I won't say. Yeah, I thought it was one of my friends on letterboxd, Scott Youngbauer, who, like, does a really great podcast called the Movies that Made Us Gay with his partner Peter. He said that this movie was secretly one the weirdest movies he's ever seen. And it was perfect because I was like. I thought it was kind of weird, too. It's a. It's weird in the. The topic, the pacing, the actors, you know, I don't know. I thought it was kind of strange, and I'm sure I'm gonna get into it.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah. I mean, you feel very unmoored.

[Melita Cherico]

Yes.

[Casey O'Brien]

You're kind of like, what is this movie?

[Melita Cherico]

Yes. Well. And like, this is. I think one of the most fascinating little trivia bits about Materialist is I did not know this at all. And how I came to find this out was in this totally random way on TikTok, which is where I find all of my information at this point. So Celine Song used to be a professional matchmaker. Did you know that?

[Casey O'Brien]

No, not until you sent me the TikTok.

[Melita Cherico]

Yeah. So there was a woman that used to come across my TikTok feed for months and months and months. Her name was Lily Womble, and she. She actually hosts a podcast and she has a very famous TikTok, but she's. She calls herself a feminist dating coach. Right. So she's somebody that kind of, you know, is a professional matchmaker working in New York, but is, you know, trying to do something different, I suppose. And she's. She. Her insights are really interesting. I like, every time her TikTok comes across, I sit and listen. But she was the one that I saw a story right before I saw the movie that was like, I used to work with Celine Song at the same matchmaking company, and pretty much the movie is like, word for word, what we experienced together working for this company. Like, a lot of the dialogue of the dates and stuff, like those, like, first person kind of perspective sequences of the Dakota Johnson character. Talking to these people about dating was apparently like real. Real conversations. Like, real people said those things, by the way, which is kind of horrifying. But I thought that was so interesting because I was like, I had no idea that she did any of that. This, I think, is a huge, huge theme of the film and maybe is a little bit of an explanation for the field itself, maybe a rationalization for the field of matchmaking. And that's class. That's money. Right. I. I will say I've never used a matchmaker. Never really thought about it. And that's a lot. A lot of that is because I don't have money to do these things.

[Casey O'Brien]

Totally.

[Melita Cherico]

I would never. I couldn't justify spending the money to hire a professional matchmaker on top of that. And this, I think, is a huge part of the film. Yeah, I feel like with. With this, the type of matchmaking that they're talking about in this film and perhaps maybe the matchmaking that they were doing in real life as people who were working in the industry at one point, they're working primarily with people who have a lot of money. You know, they have education, they have things. There's like, attributes about them that they feel like they need to find in other people that they feel like they can't just find organically. Right. They need some kind of person to come in there and create a filter that will, you know, basically bring them people that are what they want, what they feel like they match with on a, you know, cultural, societal, financial level. Right.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah.

[Melita Cherico]

And this is, I think the. The. That's why I think it's interesting because it's a world that I just don't know anything about. And I actually think it's interesting. Sl. Horrifying. And I think that's why I was unmoored by this movie, because it was like, there are many, many times in this film where the realities of what people want in partnership were so fucked up that I was like, oh, how do. How does anyone find anybody? Totally. Like, like there are moments in the movie where they're interviewing potential clients or their clients and these, these extremely specific tastes and they have all of these expectations that all of these, you know, this, like, one person hands them, like, several sheets of printed out paper that's like, this is what I want in a partner, you know, and they talk about this in interviews that I've seen with, like, the people that worked in this field, but also with like, people involved in the movie about the racism, the fat phobia, the, you know, the sort of like the misogyny of this world of like, the ways like, well, you will, you know, see it in the movie where people are like, I don't want to date anybody that has more than a 20 BMI, which is insane. Like, to even say it, to even say it is insane. Or they don't. They only date white people. Or, you know, they only date people that have this salary, which in, in this film was insane. I was like, oh, they gotta make like 500k a year. I'm like, holy.

[Casey O'Brien]

I don't know a single person who makes that much money in my life.

[Melita Cherico]

Listen, we wouldn't be doing a podcast if we knew.

[Casey O'Brien]

Again, we wouldn't be doing a damn podcast if we knew people like this. Yeah, no, and I think the matchmaking service allows People to feel comfortable. That's like part of the services thing is that, like, it makes people feel comfortable enough to be like. To say the most horrible stuff to them.

[Melita Cherico]

Yes. Well, in a way, they're kind of like. I mean, they're like, well, I'm paying for this, so I'm going to get what I want out of it, which is I'm going to say exactly what I want, even if it's problematic or, you know, like, would get me canceled. Yeah. And that was extremely distressing as. And listen, we're in different lots in life, right? You're married, you have a child. You don't really have to think about any of this at all.

[Casey O'Brien]

It's true. You just don't.

[Melita Cherico]

I am single. I've never been married. I don't have children. I have never. Like, I. I don't. I'm not on apps. I don't like, I'm not doing that whole song and dance thing at all.

[Casey O'Brien]

Have you ever been on the apps?

[Melita Cherico]

Briefly. Like, I. I've had. So there were like maybe two times where I. I was on an app for literally more than one week. And when I say that, meaning I probably had it for two weeks, I was constantly deleting. Cause I just felt so weird about them. Like, they don't feel natural to me. I don't like the gamification of dating that it does. Like, it makes you. It's like playing games, basically.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah.

[Melita Cherico]

And I just never felt like I would win at the game, to be honest. And so I just was like, well, I'm gonna delete this app. I. I downloaded it very, like, early days of. I think it was Tinder, like, real early Tinder days, like many, many years ago. And then I downloaded it, I think again when I moved to la and then was on it for maybe two weeks and then deleted. Deleted it. Because that just. Just doesn't feel natural and good to me. So.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah.

[Melita Cherico]

Have you. Were you on apps?

[Casey O'Brien]

That's how I met my wife.

[Melita Cherico]

Oh, interesting.

[Casey O'Brien]

Met Trishan Bumble.

[Melita Cherico]

What?

[Casey O'Brien]

I was in those streets. I was in those app streets for a long time. Lived there.

[Melita Cherico]

Wow. Yeah.

[Casey O'Brien]

And I guess so after watching this movie, I was like, where the women are like, they can't be shorter than whatever, six feet and they have to make this much money. I was like, yeah, I saw this. I saw this on the app. There's a lot of women who put, like, no men under six feet on. On their apps, you know, and. Which is fine. I don't care. But it's Like, I guess I. I had sort of had a piece of taste of that from the apps. And then on the reverse, seeing how, like, awful the men were being like, this 48 year old, 38 year old guy is like, I want someone more mature. And they're like, okay, so someone in their, like, 30s, and he's like, oh, no, no, no, no, no, no. They got to be in their 20s, 27. They need to be 27. You know, I was kind of like, yeah, men are nasty and disgusting and like, these rich men are disgusting. So I guess I wasn't as shocked by that. And so I was kind of like, what is this movie trying to say that I didn't already know or experience?

[Melita Cherico]

I see, I see. Yeah. Okay. Yeah, I mean, I guess. I guess you did. You were in those streets a lot more than me. I. Yeah, I feel like the, The. The bluntness at which that. That they talked about dating was hard to hear.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah.

[Melita Cherico]

And it was like kind of a constant throughout the movie. Now, this is the strangest part for me. So during the course of the movie, you have Dakota Johnson, who is playing the matchmaker. She matches a couple, they get married. She goes to their wedding. This is where she meets the Pedro Pascal character who's the brother of the guy that's getting married right now. She's like, I want him as a client. And he's like, I want you to be my girlfriend. And that is exactly what I thought was kind of strange on. In the onset about Materialist, which I was like, dakota Johnson is extremely attractive. She's extremely.

[Casey O'Brien]

Everyone is so hot in this movie. Everyone has. No one has looked. Everyone looked as good as they've ever looked. I thought in this movie.

[Melita Cherico]

Right. There are times in the movie where I was like, is she the right person for this role?

[Casey O'Brien]

I think maybe a lot of the problems from the movie come from Dakota Johnson's performance. In some ways.

[Melita Cherico]

Yes.

[Casey O'Brien]

I. She's so beautiful. And she's kind of like, in the movie, she's like, you don't want to date an old hag like me. And it's kind of like, all right.

[Melita Cherico]

Give me a break. He exactly wants to date you.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah. But also, there are parts that are, like, supposed to be kind of funny, but I don't know if Dakota Johnson delivers those lines in a way that's, like, funny. And she really is doing nothing. It's very muted acting, and I feel like this role kind of required a little bit more, I don't know, tenacity or something. And I know She. I know Celine's song name checks broadcast news. But I was thinking a young Holly Hunter would have been really good in this movie.

[Melita Cherico]

Okay, so let's. Let's dig into this, because this is. This is what I think is a tenant, a core tenant of the rom com. Okay? And you'll have to forgive me if this, you know, sounds a bit weird, but I'm gonna say it. I think that obviously the avatar for us, especially for me for, like, let's just say me as a woman, a straight woman who is interested in men, okay. Is the relatability of the lead character, okay? And with rom coms, that person, your avatar, can be sexy, but they also have to be cute, okay? They have to be relatable so they can be extremely attractive. And Lord knows, I mean, there's so many rom coms where that woman is extremely attractive. I mean, Julia Roberts and Pretty Woman and, like, freaking even. I mean, I remember when Richard Jones's diary came out where everybody was like, renee Zellweger is supposed to be like some chunky Uglo, and she's extremely beautiful.

[Casey O'Brien]

Sandra Bullock. I feel like every movie they're like, oh, she's hideous.

[Melita Cherico]

You know, and it's like, famous, famous actress who is extremely gorgeous and could have any man she wanted. But there is an element of, I don't know, some kind of this cuteness or this relatability or this quirkiness. And that is something that I don't think Dakota Johnson gave in this movie. There was no way in for me with her at all. She could be a boss bitch. She could be wearing her, like, you know, power blazers and. And click clacking around and, you know, she could be doing her job just fine and really good at what she does. But was she giving me, like, a way in beyond that? Like, is she nice? Is she like. Does she have, like, you know, I don't know, like, weird?

[Casey O'Brien]

Well, that's the whole fucking thing where she's like, I drink a Coke and beer, and it's like, no, you fucking don't. What? And what. Okay, can we talk about this real quick? Her drink of choice is that she orders a Coke and beer together, and we never see her drink it. Does she mix the two together or does she drink them separately? But it was supposed to be kind of her, like, quirky thing she does.

[Melita Cherico]

Well, right? And I think if she. If we did see her mix it and. And chug it like a boss, then I'd be like, oh, I get it. Like, get her. Yeah, you know, but it was. There was nothing for me to grab onto. I was like, it would be great if, like, she clogged a toilet at least once in this movie. Or, like, did something, like, funny and weird and like, actually, like, humanistic. To me, it didn't feel that way. So it was.

[Casey O'Brien]

She's so elegant and just so demure and kind of like.

[Melita Cherico]

Yes.

[Casey O'Brien]

Muted and regal that there's no way in with her. You're totally right.

[Melita Cherico]

It was like she suffered from being, like, too chic. Too chic. And even though there were moments where she was like, well, I only make $88,000 a year or whatever, which, by the way, in any other part of the country, you'd own a home, but you live in New York City and you're a beggar, apparently, if you make 88K.

[Casey O'Brien]

Popper. No, totally. And there's like several moments where she's like, I grew up poor. I was poor. And I was like, you weren't. Like, I was just like, I don't believe you. Like, you weren't.

[Melita Cherico]

Show it. Show how that works. Because it's not. You can say the things, but I feel like there has to be a moment in a film where we get it in a. From a character perspective. But I gotta tell you, as much as we're kind of like. It seems like we're kind of dogging out, Dakota Johnson in this movie, Chris Evans was not much better.

[Casey O'Brien]

Like, I 100% agree. Everything that we said applies to him.

[Melita Cherico]

Yes.

[Casey O'Brien]

I'm like, you. You are not. You are too beautiful and too chic. Your hair is too gorgeous. And like, they kept being like, he lives in a shitty apartment. And it's like, it just didn't feel like. Didn't feel he wasn't relatable. I don't know.

[Melita Cherico]

He wasn't.

[Casey O'Brien]

It was. Everything you say we just said about Dakota Johnson could be applied to him as well.

[Melita Cherico]

Yeah, I mean, there was, I think there was kind of an effort maybe with the accent work to try to make him into this like, Mindy Kaling guy type, you know, like the like, lovable, like, Jersey, New York type of dude. But it just.

[Casey O'Brien]

I don't know.

[Melita Cherico]

I know. That's what I'm saying. I just don't think it hit. And this is, I think, the problem with the relationship, because, spoiler alert, they're, you know, they broke up many years ago, but now they're kind of back in each other's lives. And I think you do have the traditional rom com setup of the, like, should I go with, like, the rich, handsome guy or, like, the poor guy that I love type of thing, right? Yeah, but. But the idea that the two of them wanted to get back together was never really fleshed out in a way that made me compelled. Like, I was like, I don't 100% agree.

[Casey O'Brien]

There was no. There was nothing in their story that was like, see, I've changed. I'm different now. I've. Or I've come to a decision that we should be together. It's just kind of like they end up back together. There isn't really an inciting incident that propels them back to each other. They just kind of end up back in each other's arms.

[Melita Cherico]

Well, and, like, there's nothing human that gets shown in the film that makes you believe that they want each other despite all of the, like, economic machinations and the pressures of capitalism, which are, by the way, are insane. Like, at this point in our life, I think that people are concerned about money, and they are concerned about money and lifestyle in a way that is not romantic. It is not good. It's not good. People aren't good people. Now about money. People will break up with you for being poor now, and people won't even date you if. And this is like. I think the part. This is the truest part of the movie is that it is so cutthroat in a way that makes you feel like shit. And that's what I felt like. I felt like shit when I was, like, you know, watching parts of this movie. So in my mind, I'm like, show me the thing that is going to bring these people together despite all the pressures and all of the bullshit and the horribleness of modern capitalism. Show me what they have is. And it's not dancing in a barn with, like, string lights. Which, by the way, Seline's song had string lights on past lives, too.

[Casey O'Brien]

It's a millennial problem. It's a millennial disease. Yeah. If I'm not, I'm cursed with it. I love a string light.

[Melita Cherico]

Light. You love an outdoor string light. That's so interesting.

[Casey O'Brien]

We love anthropology. We love an outdoor string light.

[Melita Cherico]

I love that you just reduced it down to millennials. You're like, it's a millennial problem. Okay.

[Casey O'Brien]

It's a millennial problem. I will say I was like, this is a millennial movie from almost the beginning. The beginning of the movie plays with, like, kind of a montage of Manhattan, and they're playing Cat Powers Manhattan. I was kind of like, I don't know this feels very 2011. I don't know.

[Melita Cherico]

I felt like it's millennial coded. That's what you're saying.

[Casey O'Brien]

It was very millennial coded.

[Melita Cherico]

Although I do love that song. The.

[Casey O'Brien]

I do too. I do too. I love cat power, and I love that song. Yeah.

[Melita Cherico]

But it's. It's funny because that moment where they. Spoiler alert. They go drive upstate and cry.

[Casey O'Brien]

Spoiler alert. There are string lights and slow dancing underneath.

[Melita Cherico]

Yes. And I think that was supposed to have been the, like, hey, isn't it. Aren't these. They're supposed to be together. She's not supposed to be with Pedro Pascal in his, you know, spotless, well appointed Noguchi lamp apartment. Like, this is, like, this is who she's supposed to be with. But it was not enough for me. I think it just didn't feel enough. It felt kind of hollow. Their relationship fell kind of hollow. He. I mean, towards the end, spoiler alert. You know, he's basically like, I know I'm poor, but I know I'm gonna love you. And I'm like, is that it?

[Casey O'Brien]

And then she's like, and I'm gonna be. I'm gonna complain about being poor for the rest of our lives, but let's do it. And I was like, well, that sounds bad.

[Melita Cherico]

I was like, are you really about to go back in that apartment with the guy who left the condom in the living room and stealing chargers and. Yeah, you about to do that, girl? Like, what's up? Like, I don't know. I don't think. She didn't give any indication that she was about that life. And he didn't give any indication that he was gonna do anything different. I know. It just felt not.

[Casey O'Brien]

It didn't feel very romantic. No, it, like, didn't feel. I don't know. I didn't feel anything. I think that's a big problem here. I felt like for how much we emotionally felt in past lives, I felt nothing throughout this whole movie. For me.

[Melita Cherico]

Yeah. So do you.

[Casey O'Brien]

Except disgust at the dating stuff. I suppose I did feel something with that, but just. I don't know. I didn't get the tinglies.

[Melita Cherico]

Well, okay, so this is, I think, maybe what we need. I don't know. Hopefully I can flesh this out enough to make you understand what I'm about to say. Do you think that the tinglies comes from a latent but inherent corniness to rom coms that exists and you cannot make a beautiful atmospheric rom com?

[Casey O'Brien]

I think that is correct. I think that inherently and in romance, in General. Inherently, there's a bit of cornball going on now. Do you think that Selene's song was kind of like, I want to make a romantic comedy without the cornball intentionally?

[Melita Cherico]

You know, I don't think she was, like, doing the elevator pitch in the studio being like, I'm gonna make a beautiful, slightly cold, atmospheric rom com. I'm gonna turn it on its head. Like, I think that that's just maybe her visual, creative style that she was trying to apply to a genre that is way more earnest and corny by nature. Does that make sense?

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah. No, I think you're 100% correct.

[Melita Cherico]

Yeah.

[Casey O'Brien]

Can I tell you the biggest laugh? The theater I was in. Gone.

[Melita Cherico]

Okay.

[Casey O'Brien]

For this.

[Melita Cherico]

I want to hear. I want to hear this because I feel like it's the same one, but go ahead.

[Casey O'Brien]

I don't know. I don't know. Maybe it's not. So there is a kind of a prologue and epilogue in this movie of cavemen and cave people, which is not meant to be funny. Falling in love.

[Melita Cherico]

Sure.

[Casey O'Brien]

And quote, unquote, getting married. And so you see that at the beginning. And then there is some voiceover. And towards the end, there's a voiceover of, like, I think of the cavemen, the first cavemen to fall in love and get married. What was that? Like, blah, blah, blah. And sort of as she's doing that voiceover, we see Chris Evans walk in front of, like, a natural history museum. And it says, like, coming soon, caveman exhibit. And people really laughed at that.

[Melita Cherico]

What?

[Casey O'Brien]

Because it was like, why is there so much damn caveman stuff going on? I don't know. And I kind of, like, was, like, laughing at it, too, because I was like, really? Did they have to have a caveman exhibit happening in the background? I don't know. I just thought that this is what.

[Melita Cherico]

Makes this shit truly bizarre to me. Like, when the. Okay. When this caveman thing happened, I was like, where the hell are we going?

[Casey O'Brien]

Like this. Me too. I plugged my ears, Millie, during that part, because I was like, this feels like a rom com beginning where he gets, like, stepped on by a dinosaur. Like, I swear to fucking God that I thought that that was going to happen because it was like. I was so. I was so just, like, tumbling out into lost space. I had no idea.

[Melita Cherico]

You saw too many Jurassic park movies. You're like, oh, Chris Evans is getting.

[Casey O'Brien]

Stepped on by a dinosaur. I'm coming in with some bias. I'll admit I'm coming with some bias. But it just, like, that's how out of the realm of safety I felt. I was like, I have have no idea what's going on.

[Melita Cherico]

I was like, is this the. Is this 2001 a space odyssey?

[Casey O'Brien]

Like, what are we doing here?

[Melita Cherico]

This is insane. And I mean, just the idea that a rom com earnestly starts like that earnest.

[Casey O'Brien]

This was not for comedy.

[Melita Cherico]

This was absolutely not for comedy. Okay, so the biggest laugh that came in my movie.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yes, I want to it.

[Melita Cherico]

Spoiler alert.

[Casey O'Brien]

I think I know where you're. I think I know where you're going to, but continue.

[Melita Cherico]

Okay, so Pedro Pascal's character, okay, is like, you know, obviously, I mean, he ends up being the backer of the film. If you know what a Baxter is. It's like, you know, the kind of. It's kind of like film slang for the guy that. That does not end up with the main character. And he's like the, you know, the lame duck type of guy, right?

[Casey O'Brien]

It's like Bill Pullman in Sleepless in Seattle.

[Melita Cherico]

That's right. He's the. He is the Baxter, the guy that loses the girl for Chris Evans, right? So he is revealed at some point in the film, by the way, this was dark as fuck. The reveal was very dark. Also very strange. But it's revealed that he has had leg lengthening surgery, much like I did.

[Casey O'Brien]

Earlier in the episode, but it got reversed.

[Melita Cherico]

And in the beginning of the movie, anecdotally, they're talking these. You know, Dakota Johnson's talking to her coworker, and, you know, her coworker's telling her this anecdote about how there's now surgeries where you can be taller. You can be actually made taller and that, you know, in the dating pool, being tall is obviously a benefit. And like, guys who are rich, who are trying to date supermodels who are 22, are. A lot of them are getting this surgery and you're like, how absurd. How absurd. And then you realize that he. His fucking ass got the surgery, right? And it's revealed in this very dark, intimate way, which also kind of made me laugh in a strange way. Cause I'm just like. I don't know. This is like really tense. And I. I feel like it's.

[Casey O'Brien]

Again, this is not. I felt like this scene was not played for comedy.

[Melita Cherico]

No, it's not at all. I mean, it's so strange. So then he doesn't want to talk about it. He goes to the kitchen, you know, and he. Then they start having their. Like, what are we doing? Am I supposed to be with you? I Don't know. I think you want me, but you don't want me. And you're just. You like me on paper. So they kind of like, have their breakup moment, right? There's like a Lyra Bitch Pascal just like, is this about the leg? And everybody laughed. Really?

[Casey O'Brien]

But that's not a joke. I didn't feel like that was a joke.

[Melita Cherico]

It wasn't a joke. But I think it was just like his delivery and the absurdity of the entire scene, like, the absurdity of all of it, just. Everybody just laughed because we were just like, it is about the leg, actually. I think maybe. I don't know.

[Casey O'Brien]

That would have been a great moment if she was like. It's a little bit of a like. But she was like, no, I just. I feel like I know you more now because of that. But then at the end of that scene, he crouches down to where he would have been at 5, 6, and he's like, could you have dated me? He's like, I never would have asked you out if I was this height. And she's like, I think you would have. And it, like, cuts to a wide of him, like, crouching with his little butt out. And I'm like, is this not funny? This feels funny, but it's not a joke either.

[Melita Cherico]

I just felt very strange again, very strange. But everybody laughed. I don't think it was supposed to be funny. And yet I think there was like, a tension building up with the audience where we're like, okay, we have to laugh at this. As much as I've talked about disliking a lot of what was happening, I am giving. I'm. I'm saying to you that I think she. If any movie she would have made would have ultimate, ultimately been compared to past lives, and she would have lost ultimately. I also. I also think that the marketing of this movie is very strange. Like, and a lot of people have said that. Like, I've read reviews about how people were like, you know, the way that this film was being presented is not what actually it was. And maybe, I mean, we've seen that happen many times in Hollywood where a film is not what we thought it was, because whatever. Like, the marketing people at wherever company are like, we're trying to make this into a movie that we want to sell, not what this movie actually is type of thing.

[Casey O'Brien]

I will say this didn't feel like a sellout movie to me. And it didn't feel like. I felt like Celine song was trying something. I don't feel like ultimately it Worked, but I still, like, respect the movie and what it was trying to do. I do think she ultimately failed at doing that. But that doesn't. Like, a lot of great directors try to do something and don't do it. Like, I mean, this is maybe a silly example, but I think of, like, Ari Aster's beau is afraid. I was like, that did not work for me. And I don't know what that was. But that doesn't mean I like him less than as a filmmaker or. I don't feel like this takes away anything in my opinion of her as a filmmaker, you know, because I feel like she really swung for something, and that's kind of all I ask of film directors to, like, try something interesting and to do something unique, you know, And I think she really tried to do that.

[Melita Cherico]

Yeah. And I mean, like, she should continue to make all the movies that she wants to make. Honestly, like, even if this one ultimately, you know, wasn't hitting as hard as past lives, I mean, this is, I think, what's going to be actually really interesting as we talk about this a lot in Hollywood about, you know, movies that are panned or misunderstood and they get reevaluated. I mean, I can actually see people reevaluating this movie later.

[Casey O'Brien]

Like, I. A hundred. This is the. This is the type of movie that ends up on, like, the Criterion Channel or the Criterion collection, like, 20 years from now, where it's like, we didn't quite understand this at the time. And I would be one of those people who didn't quite understand it at the time. But I think this. This is the classic type of movie that screams for reevaluation years from now.

[Melita Cherico]

Yeah. You know, and this. I'm so guilty of that, too. I mean. I mean, I think one of the famous ones is that I remember not really enjoying Mulholland Drive, David Lynch's Mulholland Drive when I first saw it, and then I saw it many years later. I saw it fairly recently in the past year, and I think it's a masterpiece. So, I mean, a lot can change totally, but ultimately, yeah, I feel like this is such a bizarre film for me. The one thing that I do think is really interesting is that, okay, so Past Lives is a movie that's ultimately about three people, sort of like a love triangle.

[Casey O'Brien]

Mm.

[Melita Cherico]

Then there was a lot of conversation around when Challengers, the movie Challengers, came out. So that movie was written by her partner. Mm. And that is ultimately a movie about a love triangle. And I remember everybody being like, huh, that's really interesting. There's like a love triangle. Two love triangle movies made by a couple that's interesting. And then you got this movie that's.

[Casey O'Brien]

Also sort of about a love triangle.

[Melita Cherico]

What is it about love triangles in this family? What's up?

[Casey O'Brien]

Do you think part of it is that Celine song was trying to say to people after past lives? Because at the end of past lives, she goes back to her husband. She doesn't hook up or get with the Korean man from her past. Do you think that this movie is her way of saying, like, no, no, no. I always will prefer the artsy poor guy over the successful rich tall guy?

[Melita Cherico]

I mean, perhaps. Yeah. I mean, I feel like, okay, that's a very interesting concept that this family is drawn to stories about love triangles. However, it is kind of a great narrative device. Right? I mean, there's just totally. There's a lot of drama in that scenario, so why not?

[Casey O'Brien]

Can I say something sort of something else that unmoored me from the very top of the movie?

[Melita Cherico]

Sure.

[Casey O'Brien]

Dakota Johnson's co worker Daisy, who she talks to about the height lengthening surgery and kind of the other woman who she works with, she's played by Dasha Nekrasova. Do you know who that is?

[Melita Cherico]

No.

[Casey O'Brien]

She is the host of the podcast Red Scare. And she used to be a huge Bernie Bro, huge socialist advocate, and now she's a huge right winger Donald Trump supporter and like Alex Jones fan.

[Melita Cherico]

What?

[Casey O'Brien]

And she's like, really pro Donald Trump now and has been for a little while. And I was like, why is she in this fucking movie?

[Melita Cherico]

Wow.

[Casey O'Brien]

And so I was just like, what the hell? When I saw her on screen.

[Melita Cherico]

I did not clock that whatsoever. I've never even heard Red Scare, though. So that's my interesting. Wow. Huh. Well, is there anything else to say about Materialist? I mean, I feel like we obviously went super hard. Super. Like, I think we both came to the same conclusion about it. And I'm actually surprised that we both felt very similar about it because a lot of times you and I don't. And you know, which I think is also great. I mean, that's part of having a podcast with you is that we.

[Casey O'Brien]

It is interesting we were like, completely aligned on this because if you look at, like, I. A lot of my friends and people who like whose film opinions I really respect, really liked this movie and were like, oh, I love this. This is really working for me.

[Melita Cherico]

Huh.

[Casey O'Brien]

So just because I didn't see it with this one does not mean that you won't like I. I don't. I actually don't think this is a bad movie because I think what she's attempting is honorable and good, you know, but. So I'm not even, like, saying people should skip it because it is an interesting film.

[Melita Cherico]

Yeah. It's pro cigarettes. I think we need to make that distinction.

[Casey O'Brien]

Great cigarette, actually. Again, you know what I will say, you know, we talked about in our episode, which dad loved. He loved the cigarette episode and how he's like. You can tell when actors don't know how to smoke. He's. He brought. He brought that up. That. He really loved that conversation.

[Melita Cherico]

Oh, my God. Casey's dad. Thank you.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah. Kevin o'. Brien.

[Melita Cherico]

Kevin.

[Casey O'Brien]

Shout out.

[Melita Cherico]

Shout out.

[Casey O'Brien]

But I will say I feel like Chris Evans and Dakota Johnson don't know how to smoke. That was.

[Melita Cherico]

I feel like he smokes weed. There's also that, too, where you can see somebody who smoked marijuana but never cigarettes.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah.

[Melita Cherico]

So interesting. Well, I think Pedro Pascal should have just taught them all how to do everything. Like, listen, I'll teach you. Oh, yeah, teach every. All the tricks in the book.

[Casey O'Brien]

Can't you just see a cigarette just hanging on his lip as he's doing, I don't know, something fixing a car?

[Melita Cherico]

I mean, they showed the trailer for the new Ari Oster movie, and he's in that. Yeah. And Eddington, he looks damn fine. He need. Like, he's. He is my. He should just be in Westerns again. I know. I'm ascribing, you know, careers to these very famous people where I'm like, I'm sorry, but you should just stay in erotic thrillers with Pedro Pasc. I'm like, could you just stay in westerns and, like, you know, kind of, I don't know, like morality tales, action films or something? I don't know. He's just as like. Like, he's got that gravitas.

[Casey O'Brien]

He does. He's good, man. I love Pedro Pascal.

[Melita Cherico]

He doesn't have to lengthen his legs a damn inch as far as I'm concerned.

[Casey O'Brien]

How. How tall is Pedro Pascal in real life? Let me look this up. Do you ever do that, look up height on celebrities?

[Melita Cherico]

Of course. I. I think they're all lying. That's why I don't really think about it.

[Casey O'Brien]

I mean, see, he's 510 in real life.

[Melita Cherico]

Yeah.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah. I thought he was taller. He's supposed to be 6 foot in this movie.

[Melita Cherico]

So, I mean, that's what I mean is that, like, how tall is anyone? Like, I feel like I'm the Shortest person ever. I feel like you're the tallest person ever. So I have, like, you know.

[Casey O'Brien]

Well, I am now, thanks to my surgery.

[Melita Cherico]

Oh, Jesus Christ. Well, okay. We've done all we could with materialists. I suppose it's time to move on.

[Casey O'Brien]

Time to move on. All right, so a few weeks ago, we did a film regrets segment which was very popular, huge numbers. And we got a few people writing in about their own film regrets. And I thought it'd be fun to kind of read some of these.

[Melita Cherico]

Sure.

[Casey O'Brien]

Just to. And if you have any new film regrets, Millie, hop in.

[Melita Cherico]

Okay, I will.

[Casey O'Brien]

Film regrets. Hi, Millie and Casey.

[Melita Cherico]

Ooh.

[Casey O'Brien]

Film regrets. When you started talking about film regrets, my mind immediately turned to Harmony Korine. But then you, of course, beat me to the punch. Honestly, I hope everyone who came up watching films in the 90s has some regret about Harmony Korine. Here's a brief synopsis of my own story for your entertainment. I saw Gummo on a first date with a guy I had a huge crush on. It was uncomfortable and terrible, but after it was all over, he still wanted to continue to date me, which I took as a good sign. Like he'd passed some kind of test. He was cool. He liked Harmony Korine. Of course, looking back, his belief that a Harmony Korine movie was appropriate fodder for a first date should have raised a million red flags. The relationship, short lived, thankfully, turned out to be as unsavory as the movie. Anyways, thanks for the show. I love listening, Elizabeth. So that's sort of in reaction to the conversation.

[Melita Cherico]

Thanks for writing.

[Casey O'Brien]

Have you ever been on any dates that were like, whoa, this isn't a good first date movie?

[Melita Cherico]

I don't think so. Anytime I've watched something problematic, I go by myself because I just know. I'm like, if I brought somebody to come see Wake and Fright or Cannibal Holocaust, like, people would think I'm a horrible person.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah, yeah.

[Melita Cherico]

So I just go and do that on my own.

[Casey O'Brien]

Wake and Fright. Not a good first date movie. There's too much kangaroo murder in that.

[Melita Cherico]

Listen, I felt like a bad person with a trench coat when I did that alone. That was on Valentine's Day too. I watched it on Valentine's Day. Jesus Christ, what a psycho.

[Casey O'Brien]

Okay, I saw Steve Jobs, the Danny Boyle, Michael Fassbender movie on the first date with my wife and we ended up married.

[Melita Cherico]

And then Steve Jobs, he had a Steve Jobs themed wedding. And uh huh.

[Casey O'Brien]

We all wore black turtlenecks and little glasses and tucked our black turtlenecks into jeans and we all looked beautiful.

[Melita Cherico]

Now that's a wedding I'd crash. So.

[Casey O'Brien]

Hi, dear Movies. The first three movies I regret upon a second watch would be the following. Number one, Garden State. I should direct you to one of our early episodes about Garden State, Casey's favorite. I'm just going to read the movies that they said they have a little bit of an explanation, but I'm just going to read the movies that they sent in. So number one was Garden State. Number two was 500 Days of Summer. I. These are kind of similar. Yeah, I think that you would like as they're kind of sincere movies and I could see how that you got turned off by those over time. Number three, true romance. I'll just read what they have to say about this. I remember finding this so darling and refreshing and how bold it was. I remember thinking there was so much nuance and cleverness with Dennis Hopper's scene dropping N bombs left and right to Christopher Walken. Upon watching it again. Yikes. It just feels like another moment where Quentin Tarantino wants to say the N word many, many times over. Did not age well. Many thanks, Katie. Thank you, Katie.

[Melita Cherico]

Katie, thank you for those film regrets.

[Casey O'Brien]

Okay, and then here's a voicemail that I'll play for you for the last one.

[Kate]

Hi Millie and kc. I was inspired to send this voicemail based on your film regrets section. I loved the movie Forrest Gump growing up, but when I was listening to an episode of I Saw what yout Did, I think you talked about Forrest Gump being an unreliable narrator. And that shook me to my core and made me question my entire existence. Essentially because I was so moved by Tom Hanks performance as a nine year old that I wrote him a letter. And I don't actually know if my mom ever sent it or if she kept it, but I did do that. And that led me to a question which is what performances really moved you as a child? I'd love to hear that. So thanks.

[Casey O'Brien]

And that was from Kate. Thank you so much for sending in that voicemail, Millie. Rocking people's worlds about Forrest Gump.

[Melita Cherico]

Yeah, I actually, that is a little. I mean, when I said it, I feel like I. I'm the one that called him an unreliable narrator, didn't I?

[Casey O'Brien]

I can't remember exactly how that conversation.

[Melita Cherico]

I can't remember either. Well, yeah, and when you, when you find that out, you're like, huh, what? So you're telling me that he did not go to Vietnam and he did not create an extremely successful shrimp company and he wasn't a ping pong champion, and he didn't run across the country and create the Shit happens sticker.

[Casey O'Brien]

I. Yeah, I kind of. I disagree with this thesis. I think. I don't think of him as an unreliable narrator. I think all that stuff happened in the world of that movie. I trust.

[Melita Cherico]

Well, that's where you and I finally disagree.

[Casey O'Brien]

Finally.

[Melita Cherico]

So to answer the second part of.

[Casey O'Brien]

This question, what were some performances that moved you when you were a child?

[Melita Cherico]

When I was a child, like, everything moved me. That's the thing is that, like, it only took me being an older person to be like, oh, is it good? Or was I horny? I mean, as the question. Yeah, I mean, shit, I fucking loved Patrick Swayze in every movie. In Ghost and in Dirty Dancing, I was like, it moved you beside myself. I cried when D.B. sweeney confessed his love to Moira Kelly in the Cutting Edge. I cried when Kevin from Home Alone was in the. The church with Old Man Marley. So all these moments, I've cried. I've cried. I cried the entire time through this movie called the Boy who Could Fly, which I think was, like, maybe a Disney movie with Fred Savage about the autistic boy who's the neighbor of this, like, family. I think Bonnie Bedelia was the mom. I don't know. It's like I cried throughout that entire movie. That performance. Performance. I thought Christian Slater and Untamed Heart was. Should have won an Oscar when I was 12. Okay.

[Casey O'Brien]

That was a big narrative of for me as a child being like, I truly don't understand why Space Jam wouldn't get nominated for Best Picture. Like, I don't understand, like, as a child.

[Melita Cherico]

It only. It would only get nominated for, like, like, a technical Oscar. And they don't even show it. They. They do that ceremony on, like, Thursday mornings.

[Casey O'Brien]

I remember going to the movie theater with my grandparents, who would see everything. They would see every movie. And I remember frequently, I would be like, that movie was awesome. And they'd be like, that stunk. I remember seeing the Phantom with Billy Zane.

[Melita Cherico]

Oh, yeah.

[Casey O'Brien]

And I was like. Like, you know, I was 8 years old, and I was like. Loved it. I was on the edge of my seat, and I was, like, dancing out of the movie theater. And my grandparents were like, that was a waste of 10 bucks. I wish I could have that afternoon back. That stunk.

[Melita Cherico]

And I'd be like, what is it this? Kevin's parents?

[Casey O'Brien]

Or is there my mom's parents? The chicks, I love them.

[Melita Cherico]

Oh, boy. Oh, boy.

[Casey O'Brien]

I did love them. But My grandma especially was very vocal about movies she thought were bad. So I thought that was that. I look back on it.

[Melita Cherico]

I love that. I. I swear my parents loved every single movie that they came across. So I have no idea what that would be like to come out of a movie, be like, that was a piece of.

[Casey O'Brien]

Holy Lord. Movie performances that moved me. I. I can't even really as a kid.

[Melita Cherico]

As a kid. That's a kid.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah, I know. But that's the thing. It's tough because I don't really feel like I noticed movie performances in the same way I do now. You know, I think I would say the one thing, thing that comes to mind is in the Never Ending Story when Atreyu's horse, like, gets stuck in the mud and dies. I remember thinking the kid was really. I was like, I really felt for Atreyu and was really impressed by them in that movie.

[Melita Cherico]

Yeah.

[Casey O'Brien]

That's the only thing I can really. I can't think. I mean, Macaulay Culkin was my favorite actor. I remember thinking that, like, he's my favorite actor.

[Melita Cherico]

Actor. So you. But you had seen him in other things other than the Home Alone series by that point?

[Casey O'Brien]

No, I don't think so. I think I've just seen him. I'd seen him in Home Alone 1 and Home Alone 2. What more was there to see? And then I remember when the Good son came out, I was like, mom, can I see that? And she was like, no, you cannot. I was like, what? She's like, that's rated R. I was like, how could Macaulay do me like that? That being an R rated movie?

[Melita Cherico]

Yeah, that's. That was the cut. I mean, we talked about like dark kid turns in the Showgirls episode. That was his little dark turn, right?

[Casey O'Brien]

He's not, he's not the good son. He's the bad one. He's a bad boy in that one. Anyways, that's. Any other film regrets you got Millie before we.

[Melita Cherico]

Of course. I have film regrets every day of my life. So I could name all of them. I mean, I can't believe how many BTS documentaries I've watched. Watched. That should be a film regret. I mean, are you kidding me? I've seen like four or five. How's that even possible? Four or five? Yeah, I've seen like four or five BTS documentaries, Casey.

[Casey O'Brien]

Like, you know, I feel like you're. You're kind of cooking the books on your letterboxd diary there because I don't. I. Those have not been brought up in the, in our diary sections.

[Melita Cherico]

I watched them pre the sequel, this podcast, so. Okay, but if you go deep enough, you'll see him. You'll see Jungkook. I am still Jungkook Colon. I am still. I mean, I swear I. I've never heard of a band making so many documentaries. I mean, I guess there's like seven of them. They've been around for over a decade. I guess you get a couple. But I feel like they've got a lot, a lot of documentaries about them. So I don't know, I've seen a lot of them and I'm like, that's how. That's a film. Regret, I suppose. Would you call now, let me ask you this, this is a hard question. Would you call Materialist a film or.

[Casey O'Brien]

No, I would not. I would not say that. Even though I reviewed it negatively, I'm glad I saw it. I love movies like this that are trying to like Broadcast News is a movie I hold so dear. And that threads the needle of drama and romantic comedy that I think this movie was attempting to do the same.

[Melita Cherico]

Sure.

[Casey O'Brien]

And I love the Apartment, which also threads that needle. Well, yes, but it's a difficult thing to do and there aren't many movies in that kind of genre that I felt like Materialists was trying to be a part of. But. Yeah, you know.

[Melita Cherico]

Yeah, yeah.

[Casey O'Brien]

I don't know. Ask me again in 20 years when we're still doing this podcast.

[Melita Cherico]

Yeah, we're still like, like in the basement being 58 and 54 respectively.

[Casey O'Brien]

Oh, I'm 57 and a half bump.

[Melita Cherico]

I'm giving you the extra. Okay. I'm your, I'm your friend. Well, listen, I'm, I'm loving the film regrets, so keep sending them to us, please. So, so fun.

[Casey O'Brien]

Love it. Millie, moving on to our employees picks, which is our film recommendations based on the theme of the discussion. Do you have a recommendation for us today?

[Melita Cherico]

I actually do and I know we're gonna have to go down one of the little tributaries this week because, you know, we talked about Celine Song who directed Materialist in past lives. We talked about those ad nauseam. So I'm actually. One of the things that is. Was really interesting to me is when I was watching Materialists and I saw the production credits at the beginning of the film, I realized that it was produced by Killer Films, which is a production company that's co owned by Christine Vachon, who is a very, very famous producer, was extremely important to like the 90s independent cinema movement. She in fact produced Go Fish Which I talked about in my film diary. But she did everything. I mean, she did all the Todd Haynes movies. That's how she kind of got her start. Kids Happiness, Velvet Gold Mine. Boys Don't Cry. There's a ton Hedwig, but one of my favorites from her production company is a movie called I Shot andy Warhol from 1996.

[Casey O'Brien]

And we just mentioned Guinevere Turner earlier, who co wrote American Psycho with Mary.

[Melita Cherico]

Harron, who directed I Showed Andy Warhol. So yeah, this was, this was the movie where Lily Taylor plays Valerie Solanis, who was a really important, in my world, feminist, lesbian, activist, poet, sort of was adjacent to the Warhol universe, which is why she shot Andy Warhol at some point. But Lily Taylor is incredible in this movie. I actually think Jared Harris, the actor Jared Harris plays Andy Warhol and he's probably the best Andy Warhol I've ever seen.

[Casey O'Brien]

I love Jared Harris. I feel like he doesn't get the respect he deserves.

[Melita Cherico]

Oh, I love him too, so, so much. Stephen Dorff plays Candy Darling, which I think was a big thing at the time. Like I remember people saying that that was a notable thing anyway, so if you haven't seen it, you should watch it. That's my employee pick.

[Casey O'Brien]

Fabulous. Fabulous. So I was sort of thinking about New York, dating, conversations, penthouses. And I kept thinking about class.

[Melita Cherico]

And I think I know where we were going with this.

[Casey O'Brien]

Do you? I was thinking about Whit Stillman's Metropolitan.

[Melita Cherico]

That's exactly what I thought you were gonna say.

[Casey O'Brien]

Oh, really good.

[Melita Cherico]

I swear.

[Casey O'Brien]

This is one of my all time favorite movies from 1990. It's Whit Stillman's first movie. I think he like sold his apartment or something to get the money for this, or I don't. He like raised the money himself. And it basically takes place in like, I don't know, a few people's apartments. And it's a. It's an incredible movie about a bunch of young, wealthy socialites during the debutante season in Manhattan, which I didn't even know was a thing. And I don't know, it's just, it's such a fabulous movie and it is kind of talking about people's statuses and like what they bring to the party and like how. How much someone is kind of worth socially. And I don't know, it's just, it's one of my all time favorites. And it's so funny and I feel like it's so influential and I feel like, like Noah Baumbach wouldn't Be here if it weren't for Whit Stillman. And yeah, I think it's just great. Such a great movie.

[Melita Cherico]

Hey, that's a good one.

[Casey O'Brien]

Thank you.

[Melita Cherico]

Good job, employee.

[Casey O'Brien]

Thank you, fellow coworker.

[Melita Cherico]

All right, well, I guess that's the end of our sod, right?

[Casey O'Brien]

That's the end of our sod.

[Melita Cherico]

Yeah. I wonder if you have. If anybody out there is listening and you want to talk about any of the stuff that we talked about with us, because you can email us [e-mail] we love film advice. If you need it, we have it. If you have a film gripe, if you have a film regret, please send it our way. Same email address. Also, if you want, like, our last person who wrote in, leave a voicemail, just record it on your phone, make sure it's under a minute long, and email it to dearMoviesacactlyratemedia.com Fabulous.

[Casey O'Brien]

You can also follow us on our socials earmoviesiloveyou on Instagram and Facebook. Our letterboxd handles are caseylee o' Brien and Mdecherico. And you can listen to Dear Movies, I Love youe on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. And, hey, read and review our show. It helps makes us look cool.

[Melita Cherico]

Thank you. Thank you so much. All right, so, Casey, what are we doing next week?

[Casey O'Brien]

We're doing jackass number two from 2006. Many people are saying, and I'm one of them, that it's the best Jackass movie. And, ooh, I'm excited to talk about this. I'm passionate, passionate about Jackass, you know.

[Melita Cherico]

For like, two notes of your little tribute, your little Minuteman tribute. I totally thought you were gonna do the Deliverance theme song.

[Casey O'Brien]

Ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding, ding. You know, I played the banjo for a while. I took banjo lessons for, like, three years. That was pretty good.

[Melita Cherico]

That tracks.

[Casey O'Brien]

Haven't played one in a long time, but I took lessons at the homestead pickin parlor.

[Melita Cherico]

Wow.

[Casey O'Brien]

Anyways, that's neither here nor there.

[Melita Cherico]

Well, that's a fascinating bit of trivia to just tuck into the end of an episode, Casey. Well, Casey, great job today wrapping your feelings around a complicated film.

[Casey O'Brien]

Thank you, Millie, for coming up with the concept of this episode and being like, stop the press as we need to talk about this movie.

[Melita Cherico]

Movie.

[Casey O'Brien]

And I think it was a great idea and a great episode.

[Melita Cherico]

Well, and I'm glad that you got your leg lengthening reversed, because I like you just. I like you just the way you are. Okay.

[Casey O'Brien]

Thanks, Millie. I appreciate that. Need to hear that sometimes.

[Melita Cherico]

You could make more money though. I'm just saying.

[Casey O'Brien]

Yeah, I know. Don't remind me.

[Melita Cherico]

Bye everyone.

[Casey O'Brien]

Bye.

[Melita Cherico]

This has been an exactly right production. Hosted by me, Millie De Cho, and produced by my co host, Casey o'. Brien.

[Casey O'Brien]

This episode was mixed by Tom Bryfogel. Our associate producer is Christina Chamberlain. Our guest booker is Patrick Cotner and our artwork is by Vanessa Lilac.

[Melita Cherico]

Our incredible theme music is by the best band in the entire world, the Softies.

[Casey O'Brien]

Thank you to our executive producer, producers Karen Kilgarith, Georgia Hardstark, Daniel Kramer and Millie dco. We love you. Goodbye.

[Melita Cherico]

Be kind. There's a time and a place for filet of fish, but breakfast is for sausage. Biscuits, biscuits. McDonald's breakfast comes first.

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[Casey O'Brien]

Hey, it's me, Earhart. Mind if I pick the next song? Listen, even though we're eating better, people who've had one heart attack are at higher risk of another. But we're Repatha Evolocumab plus a statin lowers LDL C, our bad cholesterol and our heart attack risk. So let's talk to our doctor about Repatha.

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