Taylor Swift’s ‘Life of a Showgirl’: Ironic, Raunchy Lyrics' REAL Meaning | Season 2 Premiere

Summary

Podcast Summary: Decoding Taylor Swift — Season 2 Premiere
Episode: Taylor Swift’s ‘Life of a Showgirl’: Ironic, Raunchy Lyrics' REAL Meaning
Release Date: October 5, 2025
Hosts: Joe Romm & Toni (Antonia) Romm

---

Episode Overview

This Season 2 premiere launches an in-depth analysis of Taylor Swift’s newest album, Life of a Showgirl, with a focus on lyricism, irony, and the album’s storytelling craft. Joe Romm (storytelling expert and author) and his daughter, Toni Romm (opinionated Gen Z college student), set up a season-long, song-by-song discussion of the album. Their exchanges blend generational insights, literary context, and playful banter, highlighting both critical and appreciative perspectives on Swift’s latest (and raunchiest) work.

---

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Introduction & Podcast Update

• Season Theme: Sole focus on Life of a Showgirl and its songwriting/storytelling.
• Host Dynamics: Boomer-Zoomer debate; Joe brings literary/author expertise, Toni brings Gen-Z tastes and critiques.
• Milestone: The podcast has signed a production and distribution deal with Realm ([00:57]).

2. Taylor Swift’s Puzzle & Deeper Meanings ([01:29])

• Taylor’s Intent: Joe cites Taylor's comment on Travis Kelce’s podcast: “the point of this album was everything fitting together like a perfect puzzle for these 12 songs.”
• Interpretation: The hosts insist on looking for intricate connections and irony that critics and casual listeners may miss.

3. Album Hot Takes & Generational Perspectives

• Toni’s Critique:
  • Swift’s lyricism fluctuates (“…songs like ‘The Fate of Ophelia,’ ‘Honestly, Life of a Showgirl,’ and ‘Elizabeth Taylor’ are up to snuff” – [05:27]).
  • Internet lingo in lyrics (“trolling,” “meme”) feels intentionally provocative but questionable to her ([06:29]).
  • “People just need to let this breathe and have, like, time with it…” ([05:27]).
• Joe’s Take:
  • Notes challenge of the hot-take culture. Wants to see how the album fares with actual fans, not just critics ([06:40]).
  • Swift’s effort to reinvent herself is “ambitious” and parallels with Shakespeare’s boldness ([09:14]).

4. Recurring Album Themes

• Sexual Agency & Raunchiness
  • “Wood” is the raunchiest and possibly best song, according to both ([09:56], [09:58]).
  • Connection to Shakespearean double entendres and references: “Shakespeare was very raunchy…” ([10:11]).
  • Joe notes, “I think this may be the only album by anyone but by a…female singer in which she sings one song where she says she has a big dick, and then she sings a whole nother song that her boyfriend has a big dick.” ([17:37]).
  • Support for embracing sexual humor and agency, comparing Swift to Sabrina Carpenter and Nicki Minaj ([18:10], [18:20]).
• Irony & Misunderstood Lyrics
  • Many songs are “very ironic,” easily misread when taken at face value ([16:15]).
  • Joe warns, “Taylor doesn’t inadvertently say things.” ([13:57])

5. Misogyny & Pop Critique ([14:50])

• Toni discusses the double standards faced by Swift and other female pop icons, arguing for more academic, less dismissive criticism.
• “There are valid criticisms of this album. But I think if you are somebody who's criticized this album, you need to be really careful that…you're not just pretending like you're special or cool because you don't listen to Taylor Swift.” ([15:25])

6. Song-by-Song Initial Impressions

- “Fate of Ophelia” ([11:47–13:37])

• Joe: “There are great many Hamlet references…It’s quite bold of Taylor to rewrite the story so that instead of Ophelia drowning, she gets rescued…by Kelsey [Travis Kelce].”
• Toni: Critiques Ophelia's lack of agency in being rescued by a man; promises to revisit in the next episode.
• Elizabeth Taylor ([24:52–29:17])
  • Both hosts praise this as a standout. Joe connects Swift’s admiration for Elizabeth Taylor’s resilience and early fame.
• “Ruin the Friendship” ([25:41–26:23])
  • Toni clarifies, "It's a tragic story...about a dude that she had a crush on who was...friends with that committed suicide."
  • Joe correctly predicted the alternate meaning, not just rumor-based speculation.
• “Actually Romantic”
  • Called a secret diss track, possibly aimed at Charli XCX.
• “Father Figure” ([37:03])
  • Interpolation of George Michael’s title (not lyrics), tying into her love for alliteration; “Fate of Ophelia” and “Father Figure” as repeated F’s ([37:46–37:51]).
• “Eldest Daughter” ([31:43–34:06])
  • Toni: Underwhelmed, notes the struggle of a billionaire attempting to stay relatable; encourages shifting focus to academic lyric dissection.
• “Opalite” ([40:09–40:29])
  • Considered a “bop,” not yet a banger, but might grow on repeated listens.
• Showgirl/Life of a Showgirl ([40:52–42:29])
  • Thematic and meta, ending with Swift and Sabrina Carpenter breaking the fourth wall, reinforcing the album as a show-within-a-show.

7. Lyric Dissection & Hidden Meanings

• Numerical Easter Eggs: Joe uncovers a numerological reference in “Fate of Ophelia” — Swift’s and Kelce’s favorite numbers (13 + 87 = 100) (see [38:03–38:36]).
• Alliteration & Wordplay: Swift’s intentional use of alliteration and puns in both titles and lyrics ([37:32–37:46]).
• Meta-Albums: “Life of a Showgirl…ultimately she is trying to write this album the way she writes a song...with foreshadow and kind of anticipating what’s coming.” ([41:05])
• Immortality Theme: The pursuit of “immortality” — lasting artistic legacy — as a central motif ([36:15–36:28]).

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Raunchiness:
  “Shakespeare was very raunchy…Whenever he says the word die...that meant sex in the, like, 1600s.” – Antonia ([10:14])
• On Feminism:
  “Make women horny again, I think…that’s feminism.” – Antonia ([19:33])
• On Critics’ Double Standards:
  “It’s not easy to reinvent yourself. I think this is a transition album.” – Joe ([09:21])
• On Hot Takes:
  “It takes a while…you have to give it a few listens. You really do. But that's how all Taylor albums work.” – Antonia ([05:27])
• On Pop Culture & Misogyny:
  “I think a lot of the times [people] really think that they know better than [female artists] what their songs are about...there's kind of an undertone of misogyny.” – Antonia ([14:50])
• Songwriting as Puzzle:
  “She said on Travis Kelce's podcast that the point of this album was everything fitting together like a perfect puzzle for these 12 songs.” – Joe ([01:29])
• Album as Meta-Show:
  “She breaks the fourth wall...She's turning the album into saying, this has been a show.” – Joe ([41:47])

---

Timestamps of Key Segments

• 00:02 – Season intro, podcast update, distribution milestone
• 01:29 – Taylor's "perfect puzzle" comment about ‘Showgirl’
• 05:27 – Toni’s initial album critiques and generational context
• 09:14 – Discussion of Swift’s reinvention, ambition, and sexual themes
• 13:37 – In-depth: Fate of Ophelia, Shakespeare parallels, agency in storytelling
• 14:50 – Gendered criticism, pop culture, and misogyny
• 16:15 – Irony and misunderstood lyrics; Swift as literary songwriter
• 17:37 – Sexual bravado and Swift’s most explicit lyrics
• 24:52 – “Elizabeth Taylor” analysis
• 25:41 – Discussion of “Ruin the Friendship” backstory
• 29:17 – More on Elizabeth Taylor; fame, agency, and media
• 31:43 – Honest takes on “Eldest Daughter”
• 37:03 – “Father Figure” and alliteration theme
• 38:03 – Numerology: “100” as 87 (Kelce) + 13 (Swift) hidden reference
• 40:09 – “Opalite” initial reactions
• 41:05 – Meta-narrative: ‘Life of a Showgirl’ as the album’s capstone
• 41:47 – Discussion of the album’s ending/fourth-wall break

---

Summary

In this engaging, reference-rich kickoff, Joe and Toni Romm exemplify how close reading, generational dialogue, and pop culture context can unlock fresh ways to appreciate (and critique) Taylor Swift’s work. Life of a Showgirl is framed as both a personal and artistic evolution for Swift — raunchier, more ironic, and meta than ever. The hosts promise deep dives for each song, always looking for hidden depths, literary connections, and cultural resonance, while also calling out the critical “hot take” culture and double standards faced by leading female artists.

This episode is essential for Swifties, pop culture observers, aspiring storytellers, or anyone seeking tools to dissect modern songwriting with nuance, humor, and heart.

Transcript

[Antonia]

Hi, guys. Oh, my gosh. Season two. Welcome to Decoding Taylor Swift. This season will probably be just devoted to the life of a showgirl, and we have some interesting opinions on it. My dad loves it. I have mixed feelings and a nuanced perspective as a member of, you know, the younger generations. But rest assured that as people who are storytelling experts, my father, as he likes to brag about bonafide nerd and very, very celebrated author in his respective fields. Me personally, I am an opinionated teenager, so I also am good at dissecting things. So trust and believe that this season will be one to stick around for. And by the way, for those of you who have stuck around and have listened to season one, thank you so much. We actually have a production and distribution deal now. Oh, my gosh. Season. So thank you guys for that. Like, seriously, thank you.

[Joe Rome]

Thank you, guys. I'm Joe Rome. That was Tony Rome or Antonia. And yes, we have a distribution deal with Realm, and very excited about that. And I'm very excited about this album. You know, season one, that was all about how to use the secrets of Taylor Swift to become a better storyteller. And we dove into a whole bunch of stuff, and everyone should watch season one to go back because we're not.

[Antonia]

Going to do or listen. Oh. Because here's the other thing is now we're on video.

[Joe Rome]

We are on video now. And I want to say something about this album. Taylor said on Travis Kelce's podcast that the point of this album was everything fitting together like a perfect puzzle for these 12 songs. So there is a perfect puzzle here. And she has done her best to embed some deeper meanings that I think some of the critics are missing entirely.

[Antonia]

She. Sure, sure. Which is fair. I also think, you know, as with any good piece of art, there are very good criticisms of it, and I am here to offer them.

[Joe Rome]

Well, this is gonna be an epic Boomer Zoomer debate and discussion. And so let's dive into.

[Antonia]

Let's dive in. Oh, two pieces of housekeeping. Before we begin the debate. I'm in college now, and so in the music room next to me, there is somebody who might be playing piano and singing opera. We've just realized that that is happen. But that's beautiful. And me, personally, I'm a little bit sick. So if you see me move out of frame, that is because I'm actually coughing. And I don't have typhoid. I just have a cold. But unfortunately, as many people have told me, college is a time where you are perpetually Sick. So, yay. Okay.

[Joe Rome]

Anyway, and I just want to show people I have my new hat here.

[Antonia]

Yes, we have merch. Not for sale, but they exist in the world. And perhaps you can buy some if you feel so inclined later.

[Joe Rome]

And if you like this podcast, please tell your friends.

[Antonia]

Tell your friends. This is.

[Joe Rome]

Yeah, this is the podcast to come to if you really want to understand what these songs mean. Not what the critics have to say.

[Kitty]

Right.

[Antonia]

And not what Reddit with the Reddit has.

[Joe Rome]

Yeah, you can learn stuff on those.

[Antonia]

You can learn stuff on those.

[Joe Rome]

Yes. Are you just going to repeat everything I say?

[Antonia]

Well, basically, we are talented. We are smart, we're so cool. And our opinions are good opinions and you should listen to us is basically what I have to say. Because we know what we're talking about. You know, I love writing. I'm a philosophy major, but that's just because I'm too scared to do creative writing. I also do physics. So trust and believe that mathematically wise, there are 12 songs on this album.

[Joe Rome]

And I'm excited about this album because I've written about Hamlet and Shakespeare a lot, and.

[Antonia]

I think it's more impressive to be a broke college student. So in my opinion.

[Joe Rome]

Yeah, well, as your father, I can say it's impressive for you. It's.

[Antonia]

You know, actually, I'm not broke. I actually got a job on campus as a barista.

[Joe Rome]

So let's dive in to.

[Antonia]

Let's dive in.

[Joe Rome]

We are. Just to be clear, what are we doing in this season?

[Kitty]

Right?

[Joe Rome]

We are. This is an. We're gonna go through and just some. Give initial takes and talk about some of the larger themes in this album.

[Antonia]

This episode is specifically for takes. This is first takes.

[Kitty]

Right.

[Antonia]

We're gonna go into the subsequent songs in the subsequent. Each.

[Joe Rome]

Right. So then next episode, we will devote just to track one, which is actually.

[Antonia]

That's perfect. Cause we'll end up having 13 episodes.

[Joe Rome]

This is how it takes.

[Antonia]

We will.

[Joe Rome]

And we may also do some bonus episodes. We'll have to figure that out. But the plan now is each episode, we're going to dive in to a song and go through and explain exactly what Taylor's doing, just like we did for other songs. In fact, the 13th episode of last season, we did that for Cardigan.

[Kitty]

Right.

[Joe Rome]

And that was part of Folklore. And we did that because Max Martin, who co authored a lot of these songs, said he wanted to do, you know, kind of storytelling. And that album had interconnected stories. And these. This album also has songs that refer to each other.

[Antonia]

Sure.

[Joe Rome]

And so Anyway, what's the first song?

[Antonia]

Yeah, is. Well, okay, let's just do some general hot takes first. Yeah, first hot take. I think that we were promised lyricism, folklore. I think that there are certain songs like the Fate of Ophelia, Honestly, Life of a Showgirl, and, you know, a few others like Elizabeth Taylor, that I think are really up to snuff. They are quite good, and you have to give it a few listens. You really do. But that's how all Taylor albums work. That's how they've always worked. People hated Midnights. When it came out, they were like, what the hell is this? And now a lot of people are like, it's her best album. So I think that what needs to happen is people just need to let this breathe and have, like, time with it. The. The thing is, when you. When you use the words trolling and meme in a song about the Internet, obviously she used them to elicit reactions. Sure. I'm not sure that that is something that I can get behind. I think that Taylor Swift is such a talented songwriter, she could have found other things to.

[Joe Rome]

Well, let's. Can we do these in order, my daughter? Okay.

[Antonia]

But you give your hot takes first. You give your hot takes first. You give, like, a hot take first, then we can go down the line.

[Joe Rome]

Well, first of all, I've read a lot of the critics, and I think that it is a challenge to do hot take of an album, as you said. First of all, I want to see what actual people who have to pay money for this album do.

[Kitty]

Right.

[Joe Rome]

How do these songs do in the real world?

[Kitty]

Right.

[Antonia]

That's.

[Joe Rome]

That's very important to know, as. Is this a popular success?

[Kitty]

Right.

[Joe Rome]

She's a pop singer, and that means selling albums.

[Kitty]

Right.

[Antonia]

I'm actually going on the US top 50 right now.

[Joe Rome]

It takes a while. I. I don't even think it's possible to get in until, like, Tuesday. She launched it on a Friday because they.

[Antonia]

Sorry, yeah, no, you continue. I'm gonna go off screen and, like, hack my guts out.

[Joe Rome]

My daughter has not figured out how to take a cough suppressant. This is.

[Antonia]

Yeah, you know what? If Taylor can do it with a broken heart, I can do it with a broken esophagus.

[Joe Rome]

And that's how the show must go on. The show girl must go on. Yes.

[Antonia]

Fact.

[Joe Rome]

And my daughter has been on stage, and she understands and I appreciate her, you know, her commitment to the craft here. I don't know what you're doing.

[Antonia]

Oh, my gosh. Thank you.

[Joe Rome]

And she's Also been directing me. We did it. We did a promo.

[Antonia]

Yeah, we.

[Joe Rome]

We did a promo.

[Antonia]

Now, the official director and script supervisor.

[Joe Rome]

Yeah, yeah, we did. We did a promo. And I thought take six was pretty good, but apparently my director daughter.

[Antonia]

His delivery is kind of stale.

[Joe Rome]

I'm sorry.

[Antonia]

That's okay. That's okay. That's okay. Acting is hard. Acting is hard. Like, personally speaking, I'm a way better director than I am actor because you can't hear yourself. So that's. You have to give yourself grace, Jo. You really do. You really do. I think that you have a talent within you that people are going to try and exploit, and you cannot let them. But you. You have to foster that talent. You have to learn how to use it for yourself, and that's what I try to do for you.

[Joe Rome]

All I can say is that my daughter director drove me so hard that we didn't get a decent take, and it ended up being number 13, the take we're using.

[Antonia]

That's true. We didn't even try that. That's kind of scary. I can't lie.

[Joe Rome]

Yeah. It just happened that way. So.

[Antonia]

Would you excuse me?

[Joe Rome]

My daughter. My daughter. Yeah. Video is new to us. These are supposed to. These will be going up on YouTube.

[Antonia]

You know, it's fine. Is this a bit. This can be a bit, right? You know, cost till I kill myself.

[Joe Rome]

Look, my basic take is that. That she's. First of all, I think this is ambitious.

[Kitty]

Right?

[Joe Rome]

And, you know, is she trying to reinvent herself? I saw some of the critics saying, well, you know, she should really keep reinventing herself. It's like, you know, guess what, you critic. When did you ever reinvent yourself? It's not easy to reinvent yourself. I think, you know, this is a. I think this is a transition album. She has met Travis. There are a lot of songs on this album where she's clearly, you know, in kind of a blissful love with Travis and also a kind of a sexual bliss. This is a very. This has a. The raunchiest song on it.

[Antonia]

It does. I think it's the best song. I can't lie.

[Joe Rome]

Yeah. Wood.

[Antonia]

I really like wood.

[Joe Rome]

A lot of people thought it might be raunchy. We were a little skeptical because, you know. But I will just say this. Shakespeare was very raunchy.

[Antonia]

Oh, yeah. That's like, all he did. Like, half of it is just sex jokes.

[Joe Rome]

Yeah.

[Antonia]

Like, whenever he says the word die, like, talking metaphorically. Usually that means, like, having sex. Usually it means that having sex. Whenever Taylor or whenever Shakespeare Said the word die, like, metaphorically, like, I was dying yesterday. Like, that meant sex in the, like, 1600s. So look.

[Joe Rome]

And in fact, when we get to, you know, the next episode, episode two, we're gonna dive into the fate of Ophelia and.

[Antonia]

Which I like. I really do think that is well written.

[Joe Rome]

Good lyricism. Yeah, Look, I'm obviously very biased. She put Shakespeare in a lot of her songs. And in fact, she was being interviewed, and she says she has this thing where she doesn't like tragic endings to Shakespeare's plays. She did a whole song write Love story where she rewrote the ending of Romeo and Juliet. And so she's like, I'm rewriting Ophelia's story. And I like that. But if you read Hamlet, you know, there's a whole raunchy dialogue between Hamlet and Ophelia, which we can get into. So.

[Antonia]

Yeah, Gundy to an honoree.

[Joe Rome]

Yeah. Well, and also. And so, you know, the critics who are like, oh, Wood is like, you know, that's just too raunchy for her. It's like, no, you're missing the point.

[Antonia]

It's like. It's also like, get with the times. Okay? Let's really quickly dive into our first impressions of the fate of Ophelia.

[Joe Rome]

Yeah. And look, so let's talk about the fate of Ophelia.

[Antonia]

Let's talk about the fate of Ophelia. One minute you. One minute me. Okay. Or we can just have a discussion.

[Joe Rome]

We should have a discussion. But next episode, we're gonna have a long discussion, right?

[Antonia]

Yes.

[Joe Rome]

So we don't have to get in deep. I think that there is a lot going on in this song. There are great many Hamlet references. I don't think the critics have, like, noticed all of them and understand know what she's doing.

[Antonia]

So next episode, you're, like, the ultimate Hamlet nerd. So, like, next episode is going to be very interesting. Ever since I was. He made me, when I was, like, five years old, memorized the to be or not to be speech by singing it to me. And until I was like. When I was like, actually, two, and until I was, like, five, I had it memorized, and then I had to remember it again for high school. But it was so. It was really easy. Like, like, when I tell you that this man is, like, probably the most nerdy person that you'll ever meet in your entire life, if you have the opportunity to meet him, like. Like, the eye contact, will it be there all the time? Maybe not, like, the. Like, the references to, like, really Esoteric pieces of art. Yes, that will be there. He will tell you everything that you need to know. And that's. That's what. That's your truth. And I think that's beautiful. So that is why you really should listen to the next episode. Like, not to plug the next episode, but you should listen to it.

[Joe Rome]

Well, look, I think Hamlet's the most famous play of all time. The great.

[Antonia]

My favorite Shakespeare play, and it's mine. That and Twelfth Night.

[Joe Rome]

It's the greatest tragedy of all time. And so it's quite bold of Taylor to rewrite the story so that instead of Ophelia drowning, she gets rescued. And in this case, it's pretty clear she's rescued by Kelsey. So.

[Antonia]

Yeah, and we'll not get into it. But I do just want to say, like, I think that. Like, I do think that it is a very interesting choice because Ophelia is a character whose whole story is about her lack of agency. Right. She drowns because of her lack of agency. I think the fact that she had to be saved by another man is a very interesting choice on Taylor's part. That's a little critique that I have that we'll talk about next time.

[Joe Rome]

Oh, I think that. Yeah. And I think there's a lot. I do think there's a lot going on in this song. And as we've said, and one of the things that troubles me with the critics hot takes is I'll see a critic quote a line from a song and say, ooh, there was New Yorker said, oh, Taylor inadvertently said this. No, no, no. Taylor doesn't inadvertently say things.

[Kitty]

Right.

[Joe Rome]

That was the point of the first.

[Antonia]

I think that's. The other thing is people really do assume that she's just like some sort of untalented, kind of one of those mediocre women who just gets really popular. And like, you know, and implicit in that is kind of. I. It also happened when Beyonce's Cowboy Carter come out came out. It was. It was something like, you know, like, sure, but, like, what are you really doing? Like, what are you actually doing when. When it comes to. When it comes to female artists, I think a lot of the times people really think that they know better than them what their songs are about. I think we have to realize, and this is not a conspiracy theory. It's not me, like, clutching at anything, grasping for straws. It is. I'm being honest when I say I. I do think that Taylor Swift has not, like, lost her game. You know, I think that what she thinks.

[Joe Rome]

Yeah.

[Antonia]

And I think is just that, you know, you can have criticisms for artists. You really can, but the stuff that I see on Reddit and Instagram, very valid things. However, a lot of it kind of has a little undertone of, like, kind of misogyny. Right. A lot of people like to criticize Taylor because she's gotten really popular, so she's an easy target. Right. She's kind of a way that you could kind of subvert, you know, the whole pop scene. You could kind of say, oh, I'm not like those people that listen to Taylor Swift. Like, I'm not basic. Right. I think the problem with that is that there's kind. I mean, nobody really said that about Bruce Springsteen. He was super pop. Nobody. Okay? People who said that about the Beatles, the tone was completely different. Right there. There was no undertone of. There's just this basic bleach blonde Barbie. Right. As she references in her other song, the because. Because society will try to masquerade sexism as just, I don't want to be, you know, basic or like, this is just too girly for me or this is too much for me, or it's just, like, not good. I think that there are valid criticisms of this album. There really are. But I think if you are somebody who's criticized this album, you need to be really careful that what you're doing is not just pretending like you're special or cool because you don't listen to Taylor Swift.

[Joe Rome]

Well, look, you know, one of the points we made in season one is that many of her songs are very ironic, and if you read them literally, you might get the exact opposite meaning of what she attends.

[Antonia]

Right, Right. But that's all of irony. People don't think of her songs as literature. And when it's. When you're looking at a song called Wood, like, I know, Gotta knock on Wood, My boyfriend's magic wand. When you just look at those, it's a little bit hard to be like, how is this? It was the best of times, it was the worst of times.

[Joe Rome]

Oh, a little bit hard. My daughter made a double entendre herself.

[Antonia]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, whatever.

[Joe Rome]

I know you're gonna plug your ears when we talk about all of those.

[Antonia]

Oh, my God.

[Joe Rome]

Whatever my daughter got. For those who haven't seen season one, when we. I pointed out that a lot of that all too well, was about teenage sex. My daughter was like, I can't have my father talk about teenage sex. And now Taylor has rolled out her raunchiest album ever. And this album, you know, What?

[Antonia]

Taylor is just giving me strength. And honestly, the worst part of hearing you talk about sex jokes is just that now it makes me sad because I'm so single and so lonely. So it really does just make me sad. It doesn't even hurt anymore. It just makes me sad. I'm not even lying.

[Joe Rome]

Well, whatever you want to say about this album, I think this may be the only album.

[Antonia]

Okay. It's the first week of college.

[Joe Rome]

I think this may be the only album by anyone but by a. By a female singer in which she sings one song where she says she has a big dick, and then she sings a whole nother song that her boyfriend has a big dick.

[Antonia]

Clay. So any children that watch this, all you have to know is that a dick is a nickname for Richard.

[Joe Rome]

In some other songs, she gets very much more overtly raunchy.

[Antonia]

But she also should.

[Kitty]

Right.

[Joe Rome]

She's a grown up woman.

[Antonia]

Well, and also she's influenced clearly a lot by Sabrina Carpenter, who has in the past also done stuff like that, which is why I like Sabrina.

[Joe Rome]

Well, I will also note that. That Nicki. Nicki Minaj.

[Antonia]

Nicki Minaj.

[Joe Rome]

We sing her Instagram.

[Antonia]

Prepare, bro. That's how I prepare for these freaking makes. I will wrap a little bit of Nicki Minaj.

[Joe Rome]

And sometimes I do. Sometimes I play star.

[Antonia]

Sometimes I have gotten him to do it, too.

[Joe Rome]

All right, Nikki. Nikki put on Instagram that she was. She so needed to hear Wood. That was her favorite song on the album. I think it's got mine. Yeah.

[Antonia]

Yes.

[Kitty]

Right.

[Joe Rome]

So. And by the way, I think Wood is a dividing line for a lot of people because a lot of critics.

[Antonia]

Are like cool, hot people and the ugly, dumb people. I'm just kidding. I'm so sorry. If you don't like Wood, that's well within. You're right.

[Joe Rome]

There are a lot of critics, maybe the older ones, who are like, oh, this is beneath Taylor to make these raunchy puns.

[Antonia]

And in a way, they're right. It is beneath.

[Joe Rome]

There you go. And I'm so sorry. I think this is a very much a running theme in these songs is the. The. The raunchiness and the sexual language. And I think this is. And. And I just want to say, as we have often talked about Taylor foreshadowing things, her most romantic song ever is Lover, and it has a line that.

[Antonia]

You say my dirtiest jokes for you.

[Kitty]

Right?

[Antonia]

So she is make women horny.

[Joe Rome]

Again, I think dirty. Clearly. If she and Taylor.

[Antonia]

If she. And you know, that's feminism. That's feminism.

[Kitty]

Yeah.

[Joe Rome]

Look, if I hope that that Taylor and Travis enjoy telling dirty jokes. That's what regular couples and people.

[Antonia]

That's what regular couples do.

[Joe Rome]

They do.

[Antonia]

And you know, like Tyrant by Beyonce. I love Tyrant. Love Tyrant. So dirty. I love wood.

[Joe Rome]

I think Rihanna's song.

[Antonia]

Oh my gosh. Yeah. All of her songs. Really?

[Kitty]

Yeah.

[Joe Rome]

You know the boyfriend who kisses her.

[Kitty]

Right.

[Antonia]

Yeah. Kiss me. Right.

[Joe Rome]

Kiss me right.

[Kitty]

Yeah.

[Joe Rome]

So look, that's the world that we're in. And you, you critics out there, if.

[Antonia]

You Take me to church. Take Me to Church.

[Joe Rome]

Was the OG Take me to church.

[Antonia]

Oh, gee.

[Joe Rome]

Well, actually, there's one more OG than Take me to Church, which is Despacito.

[Antonia]

Oh.

[Shopify Ad Reader]

If you've shopped online, it's extremely likely that you've bought from a business powered by Shopify. You know that purple shop pay button you see at checkout? The one that makes the process from I think I'm ready to buy to I can't wait till it gets here. So incredibly easy.

[Antonia]

That's Shopify.

[Shopify Ad Reader]

And there's a reason so many businesses sell with it. Because Shopify makes it easy to start and run your business. Shopify is the commerce platform behind 10% of all e commerce in the US from household names like Mattel and Gymshark to brands just getting started. It gives you a leg up from the very beginning with hundreds of beautiful, ready to go templates to express your brand style so you don't have to spend time coding a website. Shopify allows you to tackle all the important tasks in one place, from inventory to payments to analytics and more. Plus they have built in marketing and email tools to help find and keep new customers so you can easily spread your brand's word. And did I mention that iconic purple shop pay button button that's used by millions of businesses around the world? It's the reason why Shopify has the best converting checkout on the planet. Your customers already know it, love it, and actually use it. If you want to see less carts being abandoned, it's time for you to head over to Shopify. Sign up for your $1 per month trial and start selling today at shopify.com realm. Go to shopify.com realm shopify.com realm.

[Joe Rome]

Despacito possibly.

[Antonia]

But. But like music in Spanish, like learning Spanish has been such an eye opening experience for me because now I'll just be listening to Bad Bunny and I'll be like oh my God. Wow. How did I not realize this five years ago?

[Joe Rome]

Props to Bad Bunny for getting the Super Bowl.

[Antonia]

I Love Bad Bunny. Oh my gosh.

[Joe Rome]

Props to Bad Bunny for getting the Super Bowl. But yes, Despacito. You have to get the. I'm not a Spanish speaker. You have to go and look up the translation to realize. Yes, this is one of the raunchiest.

[Antonia]

That's how I practiced in AP Spanish when I was in junior year. Let me tell you guys something. Tell your kids, tell yourselves, if you're in a Spanish class, listen to Bad Bunny because that'll help you. If you're going abroad, you need to be listening to the raunchiest, craft, craziest, like most slang ridden songs that you can in Spanish. Because that's what, that's how you learn. That's how you learn. And honestly, I think that English speakers really should be like, listening to, like, I've seen so many songs, like so many reviews that have been like, I didn't learn English for this. But the thing is, is unfortunately. Yes, you did. Yes, you did. Because whether or not you like this album, the fact is that this is an incredibly wide ranging use of, of themes of, of. Of language. It captures the zeitgeist. I mean, this is like, this is the moment that we live in. Like, it really is. And that's also.

[Joe Rome]

And we will get into the best of the songs and the least of the songs.

[Antonia]

The worst of the songs.

[Joe Rome]

The worst of the songs.

[Kitty]

Yeah.

[Joe Rome]

Look, I.

[Antonia]

The fact is, is that, okay, whenever I'm thinking of criticizing like an artist, like, because everybody has implicit sexism, even women, whenever I think to myself, wow, this is quite shitty, I say to myself, if a smaller artist released this, if somebody like, I don't know, just to throw, like Malcolm Todd, if Malcolm Todd did this, if like a small mailer artist or like released this, or if it was like, I don't know, between friends or like, or like, I don't know, something like that, like smaller alt people, I say to myself, like, I don't know, would I think the same things? Usually the answer is like, no. I think that a lot of it is because she's popular. It's not because she's a bad songwriter. So some of it now, some of it as we'll get to in eldest daughter.

[Joe Rome]

Well, and look, you know, and let me add, let's remember she brought in Sabrina carpenter for track 12. Sabrina's made a whole career out of the sly, winking raunchiness, right?

[Antonia]

I love Sabrina Carpenter.

[Kitty]

Right?

[Joe Rome]

And more power to her.

[Kitty]

Right?

[Joe Rome]

But you know, power to her latest album. We could do a whole, you know, I mean, her latest album is kind of a brilliant compendium of kind of ironic, sexy raunchiness. So the point is, you know, let's. Let's go through some of the other songs. I know. I know, but.

[Antonia]

But we don't have to do all the songs, but we can touch on the most important songs. So the other song that I really like is Elizabeth Taylor. I will say the chord progression that I used in my little improv thing, that was very bad, and you don't have to go back and listen to it, but I had a very similar. I predicted a little bit of the Elizabeth Taylor. Elizabeth Taylor. That was my version.

[Joe Rome]

Yes, you did. You called out that she would be using. That she would be saying Elizabeth Taylor's name that way as. As a. Yeah, yeah.

[Antonia]

And I also just want to say I predicted literally, perfectly. I told you bitches. I predicted that she would. It would be a song, Eldest daughter, where she only used the word eldest daughter once. And it was, like, in the middle of, like, some verse. I predicted that. And you know how I knew? Because Lord did the same thing with favorite daughter.

[Joe Rome]

Well, I got one prediction right, too.

[Antonia]

Yeah. What was yours? What was yours?

[Joe Rome]

Because everybody was saying, ruin the friendship. Yeah, everyone was saying, ruin the friendship was.

[Antonia]

That's the other song that I liked. And people who are talking about it being like, why is a grown woman talking about high school romance? You do not know this story. You don't know the lore.

[Joe Rome]

It's a tragic story.

[Antonia]

It's about a dude that she had a crush on who was. She was friends with that committed suicide.

[Joe Rome]

Yeah, it's a very tragic story, but I just want to point out that everyone was saying. It was about Blake Lively, and I, during our discussion, said, well, there is a second meaning to ruin the friendship where you don't want to ruin a real friendship by getting, you know, romantic.

[Kitty]

Right.

[Joe Rome]

And so that turned out to be correct. But let's.

[Antonia]

Oh, and the other thing that she does have a diss track, which is actually romantic, and it's about Charli XCX as a Charli XCX lover. I can't lie. She was kind of ate up in this song. I do like, actually romantic. It's another kind of dirty song. She. Oh, yeah, she's very funny.

[Joe Rome]

She has a line that. That it gets her.

[Antonia]

Well, we don't have to say the line. Oh, it's fine. It's fine.

[Joe Rome]

Wait, are you trying.

[Antonia]

It just makes me sad. It just makes me sad.

[Joe Rome]

Do you. Are you trying to silence Taylor's raunchiness In. In. In actual.

[Antonia]

I'm trying to silence your raunchiness. Your raunchiness. You're too old to be raunchy. People over the age of 60. Don't get horny.

[Joe Rome]

Oh, now you're getting ageist. I see. Now you're getting ageist on it. So. So boomers can't be running freaking thyroid medicine. I know, I know. No one wants to hear that. Their parents. I get it.

[Kitty]

All right.

[Antonia]

Unless you have Hashimoto's shout out to my Hashimoto friends.

[Joe Rome]

Your mother and I had sex only once. Only once in our entire marriage. Yes, Just the time for you.

[Antonia]

That was not enjoyed by either of you. You guys hated.

[Joe Rome]

It was not enjoyed. We were drunk out of our minds.

[Antonia]

Drunk out of our minds. Oh, wow. It was like 1984. The wife in 1984 who hated saw the Sex is Mechanical. You guys didn't like it. And actually what happened was that you donated your sperm, she donated her egg, and I was grown in a lab. No sex was had.

[Joe Rome]

All righty. So I think we've. We beat that particular extended metaphor to death. That's fine. That's beautiful. What other songs? Let's. I. So we. Yeah. Elizabeth. I like Elizabeth Taylor, and I think that, you know, she's always trying to find a story about a strong woman, a very talented woman, a successful woman, who had a hard time because of critics and the paparazzi and maybe some of her own choices. I mean, look, we're talking about a woman who was married eight times to seven. Or is it eight? No, what is a lot?

[Antonia]

It was like seven times to six people or something like that.

[Joe Rome]

Eight times to seven people. She married Richard Burton twice. And yeah, what? There was a scandalous. Yes, she did go out with a married man. And look, you know.

[Antonia]

Okay, but, like, what are you supposed to do, like, and stuff.

[Joe Rome]

By the way, that's hardly even. It's not scandalous today, right? I mean, geez, people show up in. In concerts with someone else's wife.

[Kitty]

Right?

[Joe Rome]

Or someone else's husband, you know, so look, anyway, but it's a great song. And I think Liz Taylor, you know, for people, my generation, she was one of the original, you know, monster superstars. A great beauty, a great talented actress, you know, for. Made some famous movies when she was young. She was also a child star. I think that's why the other reason Taylor likes her story, because she became famous very young and a breakout in the. In the movie National Velvet.

[Antonia]

I wouldn't have Guessed that.

[Joe Rome]

The horse race. The horse race. National Velvet.

[Antonia]

You should put it on your wish list.

[Joe Rome]

Oh, wish list. Which was also a surprise song.

[Antonia]

You know, I can't lie to you. I. I just didn't relate to it. I mean, like, it just kind of made me sad. Like, I mean, it really did. But that's just because. I mean, the reason Wood did make me sad is because it was iconic. But. Tbh. Maybe it's just because I'm too single. But whatever. Ladies, gentlemen, hit me up. Whatever.

[Joe Rome]

Taylor has been singing about her failed relationships for a very long time.

[Antonia]

Very long time. And this makes me feel better about.

[Joe Rome]

Myself because maybe it's like, you know.

[Antonia]

I've been in so many situationships, guys. Give me a real one. Give me a real one. Anyway, whatever.

[Joe Rome]

Wait, you've been in a lot of situationships.

[Antonia]

Yeah.

[Joe Rome]

This is news. We'll talk about this offline. My daughter.

[Antonia]

I'll tell you later.

[Kitty]

But.

[Antonia]

But look, yeah, college is crazy, you guys.

[Joe Rome]

I don't. I don't think anybody. You know, I don't want to say someone deserves happiness. We all deserve happiness.

[Antonia]

I think. Yeah, everybody.

[Joe Rome]

But Taylor's been through it, right? And maybe she's made bad choices.

[Kitty]

Right?

[Joe Rome]

She did. The whole point of anti here was, hey, you know, I have this thing where I get older but just never wiser. So she acknowledges not every choice has been great. But anyway, and you know, yeah, Kelsey. Features. Features. I mean, even the podcast is name checked. Right In Wood.

[Kitty]

Right.

[Joe Rome]

New heights.

[Kitty]

Right.

[Joe Rome]

And by the way, remember, everyone, we are newer heights and newest.

[Antonia]

We are newest heights and newer heights. That's us. Yes, yes.

[Joe Rome]

But yeah, and. And yeah, so. So you had issues with.

[Antonia]

Eldest daughter.

[Joe Rome]

Yeah, well, no, the song we were just talking about, which was, oh, Wish list.

[Antonia]

It's just because I'm not, you know, like, I'm. She talks a lot about being afraid that when she becomes happy, the well will run dry, so to speak, of, you know, like, creativity. I think that. I think that just like, I don't know.

[Joe Rome]

We'll see.

[Antonia]

I mean, it just didn't wow me, you know, I mean, I think that she hasn't. The well hasn't run dry, but the song is just not for me, you know, not everything has to be for young people.

[Joe Rome]

Absolutely.

[Antonia]

I get it.

[Joe Rome]

And what about since we talked about Wood and we talked about wish list, so let's do eldest daughter. Yeah, let's.

[Kitty]

Let's.

[Antonia]

Let's talk briefly about eldest daughter.

[Joe Rome]

You are the eldest daughter. You're also the youngest daughter. I Am the youngest.

[Antonia]

And I'm sure, I think that. Here's the thing, everyone, every joke's just trolling and memes. Every single hot take is cold as ice, you know? Ah, here's the thing. I. I think nobody. I think. I think we can't know what it's like, what it has to be like to, like, constantly, like, go on the Internet and see yourself bashed and bashed and bashed and bashed. And it's not even because you're, like, problematic. It's not even because. Well, there are criticisms of her private jet use, which I do agree with. But the other thing, I mean, like, seriously, like, it's not because you're doing anything wrong. It's just because you're making your art and people just hate your art and they hate you because you're popular. That has to be hard. Here's the thing. If I were Taylor Swift, would I have used this lyricism? No, I would not have. I was a little bit underwhelmed. The other thing is that not to be the Wokler. She is a billionaire. You know, she's very rich. She can do whatever she wants. I mean, this is what this album is. She's doing what she wants, and that's beautiful, and she's very talented. The other thing is that, you know, she. I think. I think when you have that much money, it feels just a little bit out of touch to say that, you know, that she's like, never going to leave you. It's like an attempt to be. To connect with people, right? It's an attempt to say, like, I'm never going to leave you, but she's kind of already left the realm of normal people, and she's long since left. And that's what the life of a showgirl is. And she, I don't think, is trying to hide that, but I do think that. I don't think she is out of touch or tone deaf. There's no point in criticizing her because she's still gonna be so rich at the end of the day that it won't matter. And I mean, the point in criticizing is then therefore, to focus on the lyrics, to really dissect, to pick apart. So that's why I think that it is more worthwhile to talk about the lyrics in a very academic way, because I think that if you're doing it in any other way, there's just no point in doing it other than to make your voice heard, you know, not contributing anything meaningful to society.

[Joe Rome]

And I also think it's important, which I think is harder to do in the one day hot takes. I have to listen to one of her songs 50 times to really understand.

[Antonia]

And he does.

[Joe Rome]

And I do. And I do. And that's how this podcast came about.

[Antonia]

So, ladies, ladies, please, please take him away from his computer. Take him away from Spotify. He needs to go outside.

[Joe Rome]

It's. It's because she is very careful with her word choice and a lot of it's ironic. And so you see, critics will quote a line as if this is what Taylor Swift believes, which is just as crazy as quoting Shakespeare and saying this is what Shakespeare believes. No, he didn't.

[Antonia]

Or even quoting his. His sonnets is a better example because then it seem like perhaps it's what he means. He does not.

[Joe Rome]

And so you have to. Let's be. You know, the interesting tension in this album is on the one hand, she does complain about having the bad things that happen when you become famous.

[Antonia]

Sure.

[Joe Rome]

On the other hand, she also acknowledges in Elizabeth Taylor and in Life of a Showgirl that that comes with the territory. It's not her.

[Kitty]

Right.

[Joe Rome]

She's not the first person to go through this. If you make the choice to be a showgirl.

[Kitty]

Right.

[Joe Rome]

The point of life of a showgirl is if you choose that life. You were warned.

[Kitty]

Right?

[Joe Rome]

That's the point.

[Kitty]

Right.

[Joe Rome]

Kitty.

[Kitty]

Right.

[Joe Rome]

Warns her that, guess what? You don't know what it's like. It's really effing rough. So I do think. And I, you know, so anyway, yeah, I think these are important songs to talk about. And look, I happy, you know, be the first person to acknowledge that no one's going to put out an album, including Taylor, in which every song works.

[Kitty]

Right.

[Joe Rome]

And. And this. But, you know, I think people are going to get judged at the end of the day when you ask how do we think about the Beatles?

[Kitty]

Right.

[Joe Rome]

Or how do we think about Bob Dylan?

[Kitty]

Right.

[Joe Rome]

I don't think a lot of people spend a lot of time thinking about the songs that didn't work.

[Kitty]

Right.

[Joe Rome]

You, you list these, right?

[Antonia]

I mean, that's a good point. That is a good point.

[Joe Rome]

Yeah. And I think. And by the way, in Life of a Showgirl and is really about immortality, right. And the immortality comes from how many great songs did you do.

[Kitty]

Right.

[Joe Rome]

And Taylor has become very prolific. I think that's another thing. I mean, she did this album while she was doing the grueling Eras tour.

[Kitty]

Right.

[Joe Rome]

So, yes, I think anybody who decides on I'm going to put out a lot of content, obviously they're not all going to be winners. And, you know, but I'm. I think that there are a lot of great songs on this. Which ones haven't we hit? Oh, Father Figure. I just want to mention, you know, Father Figure, which was a interpolation of George Michaels.

[Kitty]

Right.

[Joe Rome]

But none of the same lyrics.

[Antonia]

Sorry.

[Kitty]

Right.

[Antonia]

Yeah, right.

[Joe Rome]

None of the same lyrics. And by the way, in. In the movie, which we might talk about more next week, because the movie launches the music video for Fate of Ophelia. She gives an intro to each song where she talks about it. And, you know, remember when we were talking, when we talked about Father Figure, I said, oh, that's great alliteration.

[Kitty]

Right?

[Joe Rome]

Well, when she talks about it, she says, oh, I have always loved alliteration. She says, father Figure. I just loved the. That title from George Michael because it has alliteration. And a lot of these songs.

[Kitty]

Right.

[Joe Rome]

Have alliteration.

[Kitty]

Right.

[Joe Rome]

Father Figure has the F alliteration. So does Fate of Ophelia.

[Kitty]

Right?

[Joe Rome]

Three Fs. So there's sort of. There's sort of a running theme of Fs.

[Antonia]

Wait, wait, wait. Hold on. I'm curious. You said that there was a hidden 13 in the fate of Ophelia when you texted me a few days ago. What was that?

[Joe Rome]

There's a hidden 13. Thirteen in. Where? She says a hundred.

[Antonia]

Yeah. Keep it 100. On the land. The sea. Yeah.

[Kitty]

Right.

[Joe Rome]

Well, 100 is Travis Kelsey's number, which is 87. Plus her number favorite number, which is 13. You didn't know that? You didn't know the. The reason she says 100 is because it's 87.

[Antonia]

No, a hundred is a saying. Like I keep it 100, like 100%. Right.

[Joe Rome]

But she says she keeps it 100.

[Antonia]

Yeah, right.

[Joe Rome]

Because it's 87 plus 30.

[Antonia]

That's crazy. What the hell?

[Joe Rome]

Yes. And to go. And by the way, this is the point of debate between my daughter and I. Well, what you want. Which is. During the podcast with Travis, it turns out that Travis's brother loves the number 13.

[Antonia]

Right. And.

[Joe Rome]

And Taylor loves the number 13. And so she thought, oh, that's a commonality we have. And that she called Triskadeka and Trixa. Decophilia is an unusual word. Triska. Decophilia is the love of the number 13 happens to coincidentally be one of the only words that has the word Ophelia in it.

[Kitty]

Right.

[Joe Rome]

Is that an accident? Does Taylor not know that the word she used, Triscadia.

[Antonia]

Do you see that? He needs to go outside. Do you see that? You guys need to come and date him or, like, befriend him, take him away.

[Joe Rome]

I am dying to ask Taylor. I don't. We've had this discussion before anyway, so.

[Antonia]

Father figure, all in jest, all in just love you.

[Joe Rome]

Love you, father figure. We will get into. Very interesting song. Just says, you know, she's singing it. It's. It's a song that's. Was originally sung by a famous man. It's really clearly in her version of it. You know, she has a big dick. I mean, she's right. She's so. It's just a very interesting song.

[Kitty]

What?

[Joe Rome]

And so what is the one after Father? Oh, there's Opalite. We missed Opalite, which is a nice.

[Antonia]

Song, I think I like Opalite. Yeah, I like Opalite. I think it didn't stand out to me immediately, but I do like it. Perhaps it will when I, you know, listen to it more.

[Joe Rome]

I think it's kind of a bop.

[Antonia]

I like it. I do.

[Joe Rome]

It's got a very nice hook.

[Antonia]

Is it a banger? I don't know, but it is a bop.

[Joe Rome]

It is a banger. Yeah. I think these are bangers and bops. And it's a subtle distinction for me.

[Antonia]

I think Elizabeth Taylor's a banger. I can't lie. I do like it well.

[Joe Rome]

And I think that.

[Antonia]

That I think would also a banger. I wish it was longer.

[Joe Rome]

And I think the.

[Antonia]

Oh, my God, the recording failed.

[Joe Rome]

Your computer died, in all honesty.

[Kitty]

Alrighty.

[Antonia]

And for our last. For the last part of the discussion, we're just gonna spend a few minutes on the life of a showgirl.

[Joe Rome]

Yeah, yeah, let's just. I just wanted to. The life of the Showgirl we talked a little bit about.

[Kitty]

Right.

[Joe Rome]

And I think it holds the ultimate meaning to this album. I think ultimately she is trying to write this album the way she writes a song in the sense that the first song is a lot of foreshadow and kind of anticipating what's coming. And Showgirl has a lot going on in it, which I'm not going to reveal today. We're going to. You're gonna have to wait till the last episode to talk about this. But I think the interesting thing is the end of Life of a Showgirl.

[Antonia]

Where she puts the recording, she breaks.

[Joe Rome]

The fourth wall, and she and Sabrina talk to each other as, like, you know, she's thanking everybody for coming.

[Kitty]

Right.

[Joe Rome]

This whole thing has been a show.

[Antonia]

Yeah, right.

[Joe Rome]

She's turning the album into saying, this has been a show.

[Kitty]

Right.

[Joe Rome]

Because she goes meta is what I'm saying. And that makes that song a meta, ironic song. And it has to be understood that way. And, and we need to think of the album a bit in that way. So, you know, I, I, that's why I say it's very hard to do a hot take without really thinking about each of these songs because she said they were all connected.

[Kitty]

Right.

[Joe Rome]

She said that she couldn't on Travis, on, On New Heights. She said, hey, guess what? You know, we could, we did 12 songs. We couldn't have done one more. We couldn't have done less. That there is this perfect puzzle. And so you're gonna have to. Which is what we're gonna do on the podcast. You're gonna have to look at each song and try to understand how does it contribute to an overall meaning. It doesn't mean she succeeded.

[Kitty]

Right.

[Joe Rome]

But at least this is what she said she's trying to do. And you know, I think there's a lot to be uncovered which I have not heard critics talk about yet. And I think people, again, get, get treat a lot of her words literally.

[Antonia]

Yeah.

[Joe Rome]

That she clearly, clearly, you know, we talked about shake it off. Even a simple bop like shake it off. In fact, she doesn't herself shake things off. That was.

[Kitty]

Right.

[Joe Rome]

The whole point of, of the song.

[Antonia]

Right, right.

[Joe Rome]

That was super irony.

[Kitty]

Right.

[Joe Rome]

She's telling all these people, just shake it off. Just shake it off. She's not a person.

[Antonia]

She's not shake. Shaking on us.

[Joe Rome]

She's not a person who shakes things off.

[Kitty]

Right.

[Joe Rome]

So, so let's.

[Antonia]

But we will discuss so much more in the next episodes.

[Joe Rome]

So. Yes. You know, and once again, you know, we appreciate, we really do. We really do. If you, if you do like this.

[Antonia]

Episode, like, and subscribe, I mean, you can't like.

[Joe Rome]

And we will get better. We'll get my daughter a microphone. This is the first time we've used Riverside. And we will get better.

[Antonia]

Yeah, we will get better. And that is dependent on listeners and viewers like you. Thank you.

[Joe Rome]

Thank you.

[Antonia]

Thank you. Peace.