Design Better Podcast: Austin Kleon on Building a Sustainable Creative Practice

Episode Date: January 28, 2026
Guest: Austin Kleon, author of "Steal Like an Artist"
Hosts: Eli Woolery & Aarron Walter
Main Theme: The episode explores how to nurture a sustainable, joyful creative practice by embracing limitations, physical tools, playfulness, and “creatureliness”—and why being human is at the core of real creative work, especially in the age of AI.

Overview

Bestselling author Austin Kleon joins Design Better to discuss what it means to cultivate a daily and lasting creative practice. Drawing insights from his books and personal routines, Kleon champions analog materials, the role of the body, constraints, and the value of “making a mess.” The conversation touches on the impact of AI, lessons learned from children, and why boredom and environment matter for creativity.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Truth About Sustainable Creative Practice

• Consistency over Inspiration: Creative work thrives on consistently showing up, not waiting for inspiration.
  • "So much of the time I think it's actually the opposite...you go to the page and you start moving your brush or your pen or your pencil or whatever you have in your hand and the idea appears, the idea comes through the action." (Austin Kleon, 00:00)
• Rejecting Perfect Conditions: Obsessing over perfect tools or spaces is a trap; simple materials and practices are sustainable.
  • Kleon famously relies on “index cards, newspapers, scissors and glue” rather than seeking the latest technology. (00:48)

2. Creativity in Organizations and Teams

• Good Workplaces Breed Creativity: The happiest and most creative employees have reasonable working hours, autonomy, respect, and a balanced life.
  • "The happiest people I find at any company are people who either have reasonable working hours...or are given some time every week to work on whatever weird passion it is." (Austin Kleon, 04:01)
• No Secret Formula: It's about classic, humane conditions—rest, food, space, and time to dream.

3. On "Steal Like an Artist" in the Era of AI

• Human Limitations as the Secret Sauce: The value in creative work isn't just in what influences are taken, but in their processing through a unique human mind and body.
  • “An influence is something going through my mind. You know, it's really that I'm taking it in and it's going through my unique mind, and it's coming out of my body.” (Austin Kleon, 06:38)
• AI vs. Human Creativity:
  • Kleon is unimpressed—and ethically uncomfortable—with AI’s role in creativity, seeing it as removing the hands-on, exploratory joy of making.
  • “Everything that I really, really enjoy [about creative work], down to the very...people like, 'oh, well, you can use AI to do all the grunt work...' And I’m like, but I like that, that’s what makes the work.” (Austin Kleon, 06:38)
  • AI creates the "average of everything," missing the uniqueness that comes from what an individual doesn't know or hasn't experienced.
  • Memorable moment: Kleon's tongue-in-cheek critique of Matthew McConaughey's desire for an AI that stores all his ideas: "It's called a fucking notebook, dude." (Austin Kleon, ~12:20)
• Physicality Over Digital:
  • “The more you can put your body into the work, the better you are. I was pretty anti-screen like 13 years ago and I’m only more so now.” (Austin Kleon, 06:38)

4. Embodied Practices & “Creatureliness”

• The Role of the Body: Creative practice is not just intellectual; it’s physical. Doing things with your hands or body sparks ideas.
  • “You go to the page and you start moving your brush or your pen or your pencil or whatever you have in your hand and the idea appears...the idea comes through the action.” (Austin Kleon, 14:20)
• Primal Value: Activities like running, drawing, building, or even riding a bike connect you to your essential self.
  • “When we're doing these [physical] things, it's like we're fully activated as a creature...I think it's just a matter of feeling like a whole person.” (Austin Kleon, 14:20)
• Recapturing the Childlike State:
  • Citing his upcoming book inspired by his children, Kleon emphasizes that we don’t need to teach kids creativity; adults need to relearn how to play and make a mess. (21:19)
  • "Kids don’t call it art when they’re doing stuff. And I thought, bingo, right? ...what you really need to do is play and see what happens." (Austin Kleon, 21:19)

5. Time, Space, and Materials: The Essentials of Creativity

• Three Ingredients:
  • “You need dedicated time to play...You need a space to make a mess...And [you need] your materials at hand.” (Austin Kleon, 21:19)
• Constraints as Catalysts: Simpler, more constrained materials often lead to richer creative outcomes. Boredom, too, is generative.
  • “Boredom is just something that’s—” (Austin Kleon, 26:25, cut off)
  • Citing John Cleese: “Boundaries of space and boundaries of time, that’s what you need.” (Austin Kleon, 26:11)

6. Thinking Outside the "Brain Box"

• Cognitive Extension:
  • Discussing Annie Murphy Paul's "The Extended Mind," Kleon explains that we think with our bodies, our spaces, and with others—creativity is relational and environmental, not just in our heads.
  • “We actually think with our full bodies...with gesture...motion...our guts...the environment...ideas...the relationships we have.” (Austin Kleon, 17:41)
• Learning from Children: Children learn and create by engaging their whole bodies and exploring freely, a state adults often lose.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On creativity emerging from doing, not thinking:
  "So much of the time I think it's actually the opposite...the idea comes through the action." (Austin Kleon, 00:00)

• On the secret to organizational creativity:
  "It's just run like a good worker-friendly company. That's usually where I see the happiest, most creative people..." (Austin Kleon, 04:01)

• On AI and creative work:
  “I'm really not impressed with AI in any way. What's least impressive to me about AI is just that it's owned by people who already have so much wealth and power…” (Austin Kleon, 06:38)

• Humorous dig at technology and celebrity hacks:
  "Matt McConaughey...I was just thinking, it's called a fucking notebook, dude. That's like what a notebook is." (Austin Kleon, ~12:20)

• On the importance of hands-on creativity:
  "Pretty early in the book, I'm like, hey, look, you need to like use your body. The more you can put your body into the work, the better you are." (Austin Kleon, 06:38)

• On children as models for creative freedom:
  "Kids don't call it art when they're doing stuff...what you really need to do is play and see what happens." (Austin Kleon, 21:19)

Timestamps of Important Segments

• 00:00 — 00:48: How real creative ideas emerge through action, not waiting for inspiration; importance of consistency and limitations
• 04:01 — 05:50: Lessons from visiting companies: the “boring” key to workplace creativity is humane structure and autonomy
• 06:00 — 13:25: “Steal Like an Artist” and AI—what machines miss and what only humans can do; why Kleon remains staunchly analog (including the hilarious notebook/McConaughey commentary)
• 14:20 — 17:41: Value of embodied practice—why the body matters in creativity; parallels to animal instincts and “creatureliness”
• 17:41 — 20:26: The “extended mind” and thinking beyond the brain; the natural creativity of kids
• 21:19 — 25:44: What Kleon learned from parenting; the power of dedicated time, space, and materials; the case for play over pressure
• 26:11 — 26:25: John Cleese’s wisdom on creativity and boundaries; importance of boredom as incubation space

Tone & Takeaway

The conversation is candid, playful, and deeply human. Kleon’s philosophy stands out in a world obsessed with the new (digital tools, AI, productivity hacks): true, sustaining creativity is grounded in embodiment, play, analog messiness, and everyday conditions that foster human flourishing. There are no hacks—just showing up, with your whole self.

For anyone feeling overwhelmed in their own creative journey, this episode is a reminder: put down the phone, pick up a pen, and—above all—let yourself play.

Quotes and findings have been attributed to original speakers to maintain the authentic tone and insights shared during the episode.