Design Matters 20th Anniversary Celebration: Activism, Advocacy, and Designing a Better World

Podcast: Design Matters with Debbie Millman
Episode Date: December 22, 2025
Guests: Gloria Steinem, Anita Hill, Cindy Gallop, Sonya Passi, Dr. Joy Buolamwini
Host: Debbie Millman

Overview

This special 20th anniversary episode of Design Matters is a powerful compilation of conversations with five leading activists and advocates. Debbie Millman revisits memorable moments and key insights from past interviews with Gloria Steinem, Anita Hill, Cindy Gallop, Sonya Passi, and Dr. Joy Buolamwini. Together, they explore how creative activism shapes personal and collective futures, addressing topics from feminism and gender-based violence to algorithmic bias in technology.

Section 1: Gloria Steinem — Feminism, Family, and Origin Stories

Interview Excerpt: 2023
Segment: 05:08–13:45

Key Points

• Formative Family Experiences
  • Steinem discusses her mother’s struggles with depression, addiction, and unfulfilled ambition, and how this influenced her own path.
  • “I wonder how many of us…are living out the unlived lives of their mothers. But I realized that I was too.” (Gloria Steinem, 06:12)
  • Reading and family affection were lifelines.
• Breaking Patterns
  • Steinem reflects on feeling loved as a child, a stabilizing force missing in her parents’ own lives.
  • “Because I did experience, always kindness and respect for who I was as an individual.” (Steinem, 08:11)
• Work Ethic and Escaping Limits
  • Multiple odd jobs: magician’s assistant, lifeguard, salesgirl; pursuit of independence.
  • “I did stand there while he threw knives at me…But it was a way of making money, basically.” (Steinem, 11:48)
• On Not Marrying or Having Kids
  • Lack of happy female role models influenced her choices.
  • “I didn’t see in front of me, besides my mother, many examples of women who had married, had children and were happy.” (Steinem, 10:43)
• Education and Early Empowerment
  • Mother sold their house to pay for college; Steinem relished a newfound freedom and success in student government, despite personal family hardship.

Notable Quotes

• “It could have crushed someone the way you were grown up. You could have followed in your mother’s footsteps very, very easily.” — Debbie Millman (07:00)
• “[Books] help save me.” — Millman reflects, creating a connection between host and guest (09:21)

Section 2: Anita Hill — Speaking Truth, Enduring Change

Interview Excerpt: 2021
Segment: 13:45–22:22

Key Points

• Legacy of the 1991 Senate Hearings
  • Hill recounts testifying against Clarence Thomas—her experience of silencing, victim-blaming, and public skepticism.
  • “So there is this silencing that goes on. There’s a blaming that still goes on where you are told, well, if you hadn’t allowed this to happen, it wouldn’t have happened.” (Anita Hill, 15:25)
• The Culture of Disbelief
  • Society’s message: don’t report abuse; protect the abuser.
  • “All of these things…say that you have to suffer from your own abuse and your suffering isn’t important to the rest of us.” (Hill, 16:29)
• Systemic Barriers to Justice
  • Laws alone aren’t enough; real change is elusive.
  • Story of a first-grade girl punished for reporting assault highlights persistent institutional failures.
• Vital Importance of Believing
  • Hill’s book title, “Believing,” stems from faith in the possibility of societal improvement and self-worth.
  • “But mostly what’s important is that we keep believing that we can do better, that we deserve better…” (Hill, 21:25)

Notable Quotes

• “You were treated as if you were on trial at that time. You were accused of lying, you received death threats. You still managed to keep your composure in a way that I’ve never seen anybody be able to do other than maybe Christine Blasey Ford.” — Debbie Millman (13:45)
• “Well, it’s been 30 years, I’m still talking about it. So I guess, you know, that deal, it’s like got extended, let’s just say.” — Anita Hill, on the ongoing nature of her activism (18:41)

Section 3: Cindy Gallup — Disrupting Sexual Shame

Interview Excerpt: 2016
Segment: 22:22–30:50

Key Points

• Origins of MakeLoveNotPorn
  • Personal experiences with younger men revealed “porn as sex education” due to lack of open societal dialogue about sex.
  • “I realized I’d uncovered a huge global social issue.” (Cindy Gallup, 23:56)
• Why We Don’t Talk About Sex
  • Repression from religion, patriarchy, and social resistance to innovation.
  • “You need people like me who will not stop no matter what.” (Gallup, 24:32)
• Promoting Authenticity in Intimacy
  • MakeLoveNotPorn is a “social sex platform”—real sex, not performance.
  • “Our mission…is to help make it easier for the world to talk about sex.” (Gallup, 25:24)
  • Encourage parents, educators, and partners to engage in honest conversations.
• Changing Sexual Values
  • Open dialogue is essential to ending shame, harassment, and abuse—instilling empathy, generosity, and honesty as sexual values.
  • “In a world where grabbing women by the pussy is presidentially endorsed…the reason for opening up around sex…is to encourage good sexual values.” (Gallup, 28:49)

Notable Quotes

• “Porn is entertainment. It is society’s job to open up to talking openly and honestly about sex…” — Gallup (27:49)
• “When we open up the dialogue around sex…we end rape culture when we take the shame and embarrassment out of sex…” — Gallup (29:44)

Section 4: Sonia Passi — The Economic Toll of Gender-Based Violence

Interview Excerpt: 2024
Segment: 34:48–44:47

Key Points

• Early Motivations and Role Models
  • Inspired by Sheree Blair and a sense of public service from a young age (“my life is in service of others”) (Passi, 35:29)
• Discovery of Global Gender Violence Crisis
  • Shocking statistic: 1 in 3 women globally experience gender-based violence. Moment of realization: “this was my life’s work.” (Passi, 37:02)
• Law, Policy, and Nonprofits
  • Recognized need to understand legal/policy levers to effect change.
  • Started the Family Violence Appellate Project but chose Morgan Stanley for visa and business education: “nonprofits are businesses” (Passi, 42:42)
• Economic Aspects of Gender-Based Violence
  • Economic abuse is widespread—access to money, credit, financial independence are systematically stripped from victims.
  • “Gender based violence is so economically devastating…it is not something that we are addressing as an economic issue.” (Passi, 43:19)

Notable Quotes

• “Because it was very clear to me that this was a global crisis and should be breaking news every single day, front page of every newspaper.” — Sonia Passi (37:02)
• “Nonprofits are businesses and you need the same business rigor to run them well…” — Passi (42:42)

Section 5: Dr. Joy Buolamwini — Confronting Algorithmic Bias

Interview Excerpt: 2025
Segment: 44:47–57:21

Key Points

• The White Mask Moment at MIT
  • Building a shape-shifting mirror, Buolamwini discovered facial recognition systems worked with a white mask, not her own face.
  • “Here I was at MIT…coding in a white mask at MIT. And so that was when it switched from can I shape shift like a Nazi…to hold up side quest. What is going on here?” (Buolamwini, 45:24)
• Institutional Resistance and Risks
  • Warned not to pursue research into algorithmic bias—fear of career repercussions.
  • “I was highly discouraged from doing this sort of work because it was touching on bias and discrimination.” (Buolamwini, 48:03)
• Gender Shades Project Findings
  • Massive discrepancies in AI recognition—100% accuracy for white men; near 50/50 for dark-skinned women.
  • “IBM, their error gap between their best performing group…lighter males…and their worst…darker females…was around 34%.” (Buolamwini, 53:03)
• Underlying Societal Biases
  • Inclusion in datasets isn’t enough; technology itself can be abused for surveillance and discrimination.
  • “But accurate systems can be abused. And so the analysis had to be not just how well does the technology work? But what kind of technologies do we want in society in the first place?” (Buolamwini, 56:17)

Notable Quotes

• “I wanted to believe that technology could be apolitical.” — Joy Buolamwini (50:45)
• “Even if these systems were perfectly accurate…we have the infrastructure for a surveillance state that tracks your every move.” — Buolamwini (56:17)

Timestamps for Important Segments

• Gloria Steinem: 05:08–13:45
• Anita Hill: 13:45–22:22
• Cindy Gallup: 22:22–30:50
• Sonya Passi: 34:48–44:47
• Joy Buolamwini: 44:47–57:21

Memorable Threads & Quotes

Gloria Steinem

“I didn’t see many examples of women who had married, had children and were happy.” (00:01)

Anita Hill

“What’s important is that we keep believing that we can do better, that we deserve better…” (00:07, 21:25)

Cindy Gallup

“I realized I'd uncovered a huge global social issue.” (00:13, 23:56)

Sonia Passi

“Gender based violence is so economically devastating.” (00:44, 43:19)

Joy Buolamwini

“It was kind of an all hands on deck moment.” (00:48, 50:48)

Conclusion

This 20th anniversary episode is a testament to the power of creative activism and the importance of designing lives—and societies—that are more just, inclusive, and compassionate. With wisdom, candor, and tenacity, each guest demonstrates how individual stories and systemic change are deeply connected. Listeners are left inspired to “talk about making a difference…or do both.”