Podcast Summary: Unlocking the Brain with Thanh Lev on Neurotech, AI & Human Potential
Digital Disruption with Geoff Nielson
Episode: Unlocking the Brain: Thanh Lev on Neurotech, AI & Human Potential
Release Date: July 14, 2025
Introduction
In this enlightening episode of Digital Disruption, Jeff Nielson engages in a profound conversation with Thanh Lev, a pioneering expert in Brain-Computer Interface (BCI) technologies. The discussion delves into the advancements in neurotechnology, the interplay between artificial and biological intelligence, and the vast potential these developments hold for individuals and organizations alike.
Current State of Brain-Computer Interface (BCI) in 2025
Thanh Lev opens the dialogue by painting a vivid picture of the BCI landscape in 2025. She emphasizes the dual advancements in both invasive and non-invasive BCI technologies, highlighting the transformative role of Artificial Intelligence (AI) in decoding complex brain signals.
“...we're seeing a lot of interesting conversions now in the BCI space in terms of using some of these new frontier models to decode what was really complex sets of electrical signals.”
[00:48]
She anticipates increased adoption of these technologies in the coming years, forecasting a significant shift in how humans interact with digital and physical environments.
Non-Invasive vs. Invasive BCI Technologies
Jeff probes deeper into the form factors of BCI technologies, distinguishing between non-invasive and invasive methods.
Thanh Lev elaborates on the innovations in non-invasive BCIs, contrasting them with existing invasive solutions like Neuralink. She underscores the breakthrough in form factors, moving from cumbersome EEG caps to sleek, ear-like devices that offer true wireless capabilities.
“...devices like these, which is really very small and very much like what you're wearing in your ears now. But this is going to be the new form factor for everyday consumers.”
[03:00]
This evolution is pivotal in driving mass adoption, making BCI technology accessible and user-friendly for the general populace.
Addressing Backlash and Privacy Concerns
The conversation shifts to the societal apprehensions surrounding BCI technologies, particularly invasive methods that involve implanting devices in the brain.
“...you do have a lot of freedom to say, hey, I want to track my brain to do X, Y, Z. And I'm not comfortable with tracking my brain for Y.”
[05:06]
Thanh Lev advocates for the coexistence of invasive and non-invasive BCIs, stressing the importance of user agency and data ownership. She highlights the significance of building trust and ensuring that individuals retain control over their neurological data.
“Our job is to provide insights to you so that you can better look after your brain. You can protect your brain.”
[20:41]
Co-Evolution of Digital and Biological Intelligence
A pivotal segment of the discussion revolves around the symbiotic relationship between artificial intelligence and human intelligence. Thanh Lev envisions a future where digital and biological intelligences co-evolve, enhancing human capabilities without overshadowing them.
“...the next revolution isn't just simply about technology, it's about intelligence.”
[08:00]
She introduces the concept of "humanistic intelligence," where AI acts as a cognitive copilot, complementing human thought processes and fostering a synergistic growth of both intelligences.
Practical Use Cases of BCI Technology
Thanh Lev shares compelling real-world applications of non-invasive BCI technologies:
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Restoring Lost Functions:
An inspiring story of an individual who regained the ability to drive an F1 car after a traumatic incident, solely through BCI technology."A person was able to... drive an F1 car around a racetrack using just our technology and senses around the car."
[14:13] -
Gaming Enhancements:
A Twitch streamer successfully navigated and conquered complex video games like Elden Ring using a 14-channel non-invasive EEG, showcasing the potential for entertainment and interactive applications."A Twitch streamer... beat the boss character using just our non-invasive EEG."
[14:13] -
Cognitive Health Monitoring:
Tracking cognitive stress and mental activity to detect early signs of cognitive decline, akin to how wearable devices monitor physical health metrics.“...what can we do to intervene? And can we have clinical interventions at that point?”
[59:30]
Privacy and Data Ownership
A significant concern discussed is the privacy of neurological data. Thanh Lev emphasizes that the data belongs to the individual, advocating for a "privacy by design" approach where users have complete control over their information.
“...you have to have agency over your data.”
[20:41]
She assures that data sharing is user-driven, ensuring that sensitive brain data isn't misused or accessed without explicit consent.
“...we need to design privacy by design as a part of the way you're thinking about these systems.”
[25:09]
BCI in the Workplace and Enterprise Applications
The dialogue transitions to the integration of BCI technologies within organizational settings. Thanh Lev outlines two primary applications:
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Workplace Wellness and Safety:
Monitoring cognitive fatigue and stress to prevent burnout and enhance productivity. For example, tracking drivers' attention to avert accidents caused by distraction.“...if you keep working, there will be a point where you will experience cognitive fatigue.”
[32:04] -
Product Intelligence:
Gleaning deeper insights into customer experiences by measuring brain activity to understand emotional responses to products, thereby refining user-centric designs.“...understand how someone is actually experiencing a product, you know, the friction points that exist.”
[43:23]
Leadership, Diversity, and Personal Insights
Beyond technology, Thanh Lev shares her personal journey as an Australian Vietnamese woman in the high-tech realm of California. She highlights the strength derived from diversity and being an "outsider," which fosters unique perspectives and challenges the status quo.
“...the diversity of perspectives, the difference in ideas that come from not being the expert in the room... allows you to really see things differently.”
[50:00]
She underscores the importance of cultivating environments where individuals feel empowered to be their authentic selves, driving innovation and organizational success.
Future Outlook and Closing Thoughts
As the conversation draws to a close, Thanh Lev reflects on the future trajectory of BCI technologies. She envisions a harmonious integration of consumer and clinical applications, aiming to preserve and enhance brain health universally.
“...we're giving people metrics around their stress balance... helping them maintain a cognitively resilient brain for as long as possible.”
[26:38]
Her optimism is palpable as she shares her passion for the field and the meaningful impact BCI technologies can have on humanity.
“...I feel really blessed and grateful that I found something that I can work on that I'm truly passionate about.”
[59:30]
Conclusion
This episode of Digital Disruption offers a comprehensive exploration of the burgeoning field of Brain-Computer Interfaces, shedding light on both the technological advancements and the profound ethical considerations they entail. Thanh Lev's insights underscore the transformative potential of BCI technologies in enhancing human capabilities, safeguarding mental health, and revolutionizing organizational dynamics. As we stand on the cusp of this neurotech revolution, the dialogue invites listeners to ponder the harmonious co-evolution of human and artificial intelligences, heralding a future where technology and humanity thrive symbiotically.