607 UNC vs 10 Skeptics (HEATED DEBATE) Outnumbered #5 | DSH #2059

Summary

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Digital Social Hour: "607 UNC vs 10 Skeptics (HEATED DEBATE) Outnumbered #5 | DSH #2059"

Host: Sean Kelly | Date: July 11, 2026

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Episode Overview

This episode of Digital Social Hour features a raucous, multi-guest debate on some of the most polarizing topics in culture and history. The central figure, Ankon ("607 Unc"), faces off against a panel that includes a historian, Christian debater, investigative journalist, Bible scholar, spiritual theorist, and a femininity coach. Topics range from the “prison planet” theory to the literal existence of Jesus, the matrix-like nature of reality, race and reparations, gender roles, the origins of humanity, and the relationship between faith and reality. The conversation is raw, often chaotic, sprinkled with sharp humor, heated moments, and a refusal from all parties to accept easy answers.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Is Earth a Prison Planet? (00:04–17:00; revisited throughout)

• Ankon’s View: Earth is a prison, evidenced by life’s restrictions, borders, rules, and limitations on freedom.
  • "No one watching this in America can leave America without a passport. Tell me you’re not in prison." — Ankon (00:08, 15:09)
  • Rules, possessions, even one’s body, are temporary and owned "by the prison."
  • Host/Panel Pushback: Rules alone don’t make a prison; daycares and relationships have restrictions without being prisons.
  • Concept of “getting out” is meaningless: “If this was a location, someone could go above the universe and find it. But no one can—because there’s no outside.” (05:14)
  • Perception vs. Reality: Multiple realities exist simultaneously; you only experience one based on your perception and decisions.
  • Philosophical turn: “There is no right or wrong. Right or wrong is determined by the person. Whatever's good for me is right.” — Ankon (02:10)

2. The Matrix Analogy, Simulation, and Consciousness (07:49, 39:39, 52:12, 67:09)

• Multiple Worlds Theory: Ankon asserts we’re living in layered realities—“metaverses” inside metaverses and our perceptions shape what is real.
• “I suggest that you’re playing every character here right now. I suggest no one here outside of you.” — Ankon (07:49)
• Consciousness: “Everything exists only in your mind, whatever you think it is. Jesus consciousness is available to you, but only when you accept it and put it in you.” (60:16+)
• Simulation Prompt: The debate around whether participants actually agree to the simulation prompt or if it’s just a projection. Ankon: “Those are just your thoughts. They’re not mine.” (49:47-50:14)

3. Jesus: Historical Figure or Myth? (20:24–46:00; threaded throughout)

• Positions Represented:
  • Historian: “Jesus never lived. Jesus is a mythological figure... There is no physical or textual evidence for a literal historical Jesus Christ.” (20:20, 25:59)
  • Christian Debater: “There’s over 25,000 manuscripts that prove the existence of Jesus. There’s more proof for Jesus than there is for Julius Caesar.” (00:23, 22:46)
    • Relies on biblical and extra-biblical sources like Tacitus—promptly challenged on historicity and dating.
  • Historian’s Analogy: “Peter Parker, Spider-Man, is in more manuscripts than Jesus, but that doesn’t make him historical.” (39:46)
  • Evidence Dispute: The Shroud of Turin, Apostle martyrdom stories, and exorcism anecdotes are repeatedly brought up and debunked or problematized by the historian.
• Faith vs. Fact: Recurrent theme of absence of empirical evidence but enduring “faith” inspired by the narrative of Jesus.
  • “Part of faith, part of history is that you’re not going to have empirical proof.”—Investigative Journalist (160:13)
• Myth vs. Meaning: Historian concedes the myth’s value—“If the story helps you live as a decent human being, do it all day long. But don’t shoehorn it into literal history.” (164:41)

4. Interplay of Race, Reparations, and Origins (138:51–147:50)

• Reparations Debate:
  • Call for reparations for historic injustices not just for Black Americans but for all harmed groups.
  • “Everybody that had a slave, then white, received reparations for their land and things like that.”—Ankon (139:40)
• Ankon’s Reframing: “I don’t want reparations. I want America. Unravel history and stop giving me his story.” (140:37)
• White Identity: What does it mean to be “white”? Complex exchanged with investigative journalist over ancestry and historic suffering.
• Origins Paradox: “No one knows where the white man or black man is from. They’ll tell you, you’re from Africa, but when you go there, they say you’re not.” — Ankon (12:34)
• Slavery Skepticism: Ankon argues that the real horror is being a “prisoner of war,” diminishing the established slave trade narrative. “Slavery never existed. Prove it. Where’s a slave ship?” (142:38)

5. Gender, Femininity, Masculinity, Love, and the Bible (70:00–108:47)

• Femininity Coach vs. Bible Scholar & Ankon:
  • The definition of femininity, the relation between submission and love, and how biology/gender relate to biblical and social narratives.
  • “I teach women that they shouldn’t be men.” — Femininity Coach (89:20)
  • Bible Scholar: Points out how biblical programming influences ideas of submission and gender.
  • Ankon: Argues duality and the perfection inside each person: “I’m both masculine and feminine... Once you tell a woman to submit to you, that’s saying you’re above her.” (94:48–95:32)
  • Discussion of whether real love is conditional, earned, or absolute—“If you love somebody, love never leaves. If it leaves, it never was love.” (100:06)
• Genesis Debates:
  • Original sin, Eve’s role, and whether knowledge in the garden was “sex” or something else.
  • Debate over literal vs. metaphorical reading of Genesis and Jesus potentially being the “serpent” (112:30+).
  • “Jesus is the serpent in the garden of Genesis 3”—Bible Scholar. “That’s an exo facto way to break it down... but there’s no text that supports that.”—Christian Debater (125:22)

6. Race, Creation, and Hair (11:31, 12:34, 11:48+)

• Provocative Claims: Ankon asserts that “white people” were genetically created and lack true origin, with hair being analogous to animal fur, leading to a heated back-and-forth about genetics and origin.
  • “You mix with dog, pig, and monkeys even. Right now, you can’t go across the border... Tell me you’re not in prison.” (00:02)
  • Repetition of the “hair” argument to draw a racial line and stoke debate.

7. The Bible, Gnosticism, and “Jesus as the Serpent” (112:30–138:10)

• Bible Scholar vs. Christian Debater: Exchanges over whether the serpent represents Jesus, if “sex” was the original sin, the nature of Elohim, and the purpose of the fall from Eden.
• Frequent shifts between literalism and metaphor, leaving little resolved but much debated.

8. Closing: Fact, Faith, and the Value of Debate (174:01–188:47)

• Historian: Emphasizes the fabricated and layered nature of much of Christian tradition, but acknowledges the narrative’s social power and change-making ability.
  • “If it works for you...do it. But when we try to find a historical tether to Jesus Christ, we struggle.” (188:14)
• Investigative Journalist: Faith and experience matter more than external evidence.
  • “There’s a core in this. You could be evil, you could be good. The word of Christ is good... Everything in this constructed world is an inversion of that.” (189:54)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On reality and dreaming:
  • “What’s the difference between this reality and the reality in your mind? I suggest this whole reality comes from you.” — Ankon (07:49)
• Heated exchanges on historicity:
  • “Give me one manuscript...Name one.” — Historian (25:17)
  • “Peter Parker, Spider-Man, is a part of history too—over 25,000 interpretations.” — Historian (39:54)
• On love’s nature:
  • “If you love somebody, love never leaves. The moment it leaves, it never was love.” – Ankon (100:06)
  • “For children it’s different.” – Femininity Coach (99:10)
• On Christianity’s double-edged sword:
  • “Christianity... Some of the most heinous things happened with people who wore a cross and said Jesus.” — Historian (181:52)
• Comic Relief and Edge:
  • “Anybody that ever ate McDonald’s ever ate a person.” — Ankon (149:09)
  • “No, there ain’t no mcHuman. There’s no ten piece mcHuman...” — Sean Kelly (149:28)

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Timestamps for Key Segments

| Timestamp | Segment / Topic | |---------------|------------------------------------------------| | 00:04–09:23 | Is Earth a Prison Planet? Philosophy & Perception | | 09:23–17:00 | Rules, Ownership, Reality, Right/Wrong | | 20:20–46:00 | Jesus: Historical Figure or Myth? Historicity Debate | | 49:47–52:11 | Simulations, Prompts, and Perception of Reality| | 70:00–108:47 | Gender, Femininity, Love, Bible & Genesis Debates| | 138:51–147:50 | Reparations, Race, and Origin Arguments | | 149:09–151:12 | McDonald’s, Human Meat, Slavery and Mind-Prisons | | 174:01–188:47 | Fact, Faith & The Meaning of Debate |

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Takeaways

• The episode offers no easy answers or consensus; instead, it leans into discord, challenging listeners to question their foundational beliefs.
• The core theme is the mutability of reality—what’s real is often what you believe, and every system (religious, political, racial, gendered) is subject to manipulation and subjective experience.
• The recurring motif: seeking truth is a journey into paradox—fact and belief, love and control, myth and history, all blur under scrutiny.

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Additional Highlights

• Storytelling Interlude: The Monkey/Banana/Ladder experiment (16:07), used as an allegory for social conditioning and tradition.
• Composite Worldviews: Christianity, Kemetism (ancient Egyptian spirituality), Gnosticism, and Hermeticism all receive mentions and comparisons.
• AI Fact-Checker: A running joke and commentary on the limits of “objective” knowledge.

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Episode Tone & Language

• Tone: Bold, provocative, confrontational, sometimes irreverent, always unfiltered.
• Language: Raw, vernacular, alternately academic and streetwise.
• Several moments of levity and tension showcase a refusal to retreat from potentially controversial or uncomfortable territory.

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This episode is for listeners prepared to wrestle with difficult ideas, unpack complex cultural baggage, and challenge both inherited traditions and new mythologies.

Transcript

[Ankon]

If that's hair, what's this?

[Sean Kelly]

Uglier hair?

[Ankon]

No, not uglier hair. What you have is probably the same thing a dog has because you mix with dog, pig and monkeys even. Right now, you can't go across the border. You can't leave America without a passport. So right now, no one watching this is in America can leave America without a passport. Tell me you're not in prison.

[Sean Kelly]

That's some governmental boundary.

[Ankon]

Yeah, it's prison.

[Historian]

Jesus never lived. Jesus is a mythological figure.

[Christian Debater]

No. There's over 25,000 manuscripts that prove the existence of Jesus. There's more proof on the existence of Jesus than there's proof on the history of Julius Caesar.

[Historian]

Name one of those men. Manuscript.

[Investigative Journalist]

There's a lot of white people that have actually gone through historic injustices like black people have, for different reasons. My ancestors were straight up. 75% of them were murdered.

[Ankon]

You're white. You were genetically created. You are human. You were created to work. You were created to say everything that you created. I wasn't created to follow what you're saying. That was not for me. I'm the creator of what you're saying. I taught you everything you know.

[Host]

Okay, guys, got another one on ten debate for y' all today. We got 607 unconverse 10. First prompt is that Earth is a prison planet. Do you disagree with that prompt?

[Sean Kelly]

I disagree with that prompt.

[Ankon]

Hold on. I disagree with the whole system. No, no, for real, what you doing? Because you said there's something here is going to determine whether something is right or wrong. That what you said, right. When I say it's fact checker is a fact checker. It's gonna determine whether something right or wrong.

[Host]

We got an AI fact checker right

[Ankon]

now, but that can't be correct. Point to your right. Who right? Right. See, I don't think you understand. Right is only your perception. You point that way, I point that way. But it's both considered right. There is no left or right now. I'm keeping it real. You never left nowhere left or right. It exists only in your mind. Because if you could point right and I could point right, then none of this shit can be right. Because both of our rights was different.

[Sean Kelly]

How are you setting it up to make you unbeata?

[Ankon]

Rights was different. Point to the right. So who's right?

[Sean Kelly]

Me.

[Ankon]

Right? It's impossible because right itself is a perception. So AI cannot determine what's right or wrong. He can't do that.

[Sean Kelly]

Can you?

[Ankon]

There is no right or wrong. See, right or wrong is Determined by the person. Right. Whatever is good for me is right. Right. And whatever is, you know, bad for me, whatever hurt me is considered bad.

[Sean Kelly]

But you could look at that a hundred different ways. Something could be good for you in the moment. Something could be good for you overall. Something could be good for your soul.

[Ankon]

There you go again. Look is different. How do I look? Do I look with my eyes?

[Sean Kelly]

Goofy?

[Ankon]

How do I look with my eyes? Yeah, I think. Do I look with my eyes? Yes or no?

[Sean Kelly]

Yes, but you had a third eye.

[Ankon]

Okay, so when I'm asleep, what's watching my dream?

[Sean Kelly]

What's watching your dream?

[Bible Scholar]

Yeah.

[Ankon]

Cause I can see it.

[Sean Kelly]

Your subconscious, your eyes send signals to your brain, and then that interprets things. So you can just interpret them without seeing them.

[Ankon]

Who told you this?

[Sean Kelly]

I mean, I don't know.

[Ankon]

Someone with a white coat. What's going on? Can you give me somebody? I don't know?

[Sean Kelly]

All right, hold on. Okay. The Earth is a prison planet.

[Ankon]

Correct.

[Sean Kelly]

Who. Who started it?

[Ankon]

Have you ever been to prison?

[Sean Kelly]

Yeah, I guess I live there. This is a prison planet.

[Ankon]

No, no, it's things that happen at prison that everybody here familiar with. If you have been to prison, prison have a warden, right?

[Sean Kelly]

Right.

[Ankon]

Prison have places where you can go.

[Sean Kelly]

Who's the warden of Earth?

[Ankon]

Well, on Earth, I don't know. But of United States, you have to say Trump. All right? And on Earth is a lot of different gods, so it's like, kind of, like confusing.

[Sean Kelly]

But it's not just America that's a prison, right? You're saying this.

[Ankon]

The whole Earth, the whole world's a prison, right? Because what do a prison got? A prison got rules. It tell you what you can and what you cannot do. Right? And if you do something wrong in prison, it have a prison inside the prison, right? You got. Got a hole, solitary, right? So somebody always telling you what to do.

[Sean Kelly]

But just because you have rules doesn't make it a prison, right?

[Ankon]

Why would you have rules?

[Sean Kelly]

Well, I mean, daycare has rules. It's not a prison.

[Ankon]

It's a real. It's a prison for the babies. The babies don't like it when the babies get. There's a prison, it's not prison. Do the babies want to be there? Are they held up against their will? Okay, right. A prison is a place where you held against your will and you can't get out. Get out of Earth, leave now, get out.

[Sean Kelly]

I mean, I can't. I can't just stop my heart from beating, but it doesn't mean that we're

[Ankon]

Even if your fucking heart stopped beating, you still can't get out. That's. That's the trick.

[Sean Kelly]

How do we get in? How'd I get in? What I do? What I do so bad to get put in?

[Ankon]

Just human perception. So you think that everything has a beginning, everything has a start from some point, right? That's just human perception, human possession. Believe in origins and everything start from some point. And everything exists solely in one thing. But even cells exist and they are fake. They got synthetic cells right now that go into the body and can live in your body like normal cells and kill bad cells. But they're synthetic, they're not real. But they put them inside your body. So is your body real or fake?

[Sean Kelly]

My body's real.

[Ankon]

Then how could synthetic cells run your body?

[Sean Kelly]

I mean, they can run, they can be. They're symbiote. I don't fucking know, man. There's no synthetic cel.

[Ankon]

That's your mic.

[Sean Kelly]

This is Sean Kelly's mic that he's so graciously letting me use to talk shit to you.

[Ankon]

You got a house?

[Sean Kelly]

Yeah.

[Ankon]

That's your house?

[Sean Kelly]

I mean, yeah. Government owners. You got a car? Yeah.

[Ankon]

That's your car?

[Sean Kelly]

Yes.

[Ankon]

You call it my car?

[Sean Kelly]

I do.

[Ankon]

It's just a possession. You can lose it at any moment. Like your body is just a possession. Right. You don't own shit here. Cause this is a prison. Everything is owned by the prison.

[Sean Kelly]

We got put here.

[Ankon]

Then it's no here. What did I do to it? There's no here. Listen, if it was a here, then you would have a location. You could say we. Where we at? No, there's no location because. Can you tell me where we at? No one can tell me where we at. Right? It's not a location. This is not a location. Right. If this was a location, then somebody can go above the, you know, the universe and look down and say, we're here. But no one can do that. No one can tell you the coordinates of Earth. Cause no one knows. Because I'm telling you, it's not a location. Right. There's no way you can get through it through miles. Right? It's determined by your decision. We live in multiple realities all at the same time.

[Sean Kelly]

What happened? Back from evolution? Cavemen, they're all in Prison Planet as well.

[Host]

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[Ankon]

What do you mean it's still happening? Now, listen, even when you look at the star, you see in the star dead. So every planet that you see, you see dead according to your human eyes. If you're using your human eyes. So your human eyes are flawed.

[Sean Kelly]

It's no. It just takes a light while to get here.

[Ankon]

Then it's flawed. If you're not. If you can't see it as the now, then it's flawed. Then your human eyes are flawed. Right, but you believe in a God or something like that? Yeah, the Bible. Yeah, well, the Bible said that we in a prison planet. Because the Bible talks about the firmament.

[Sean Kelly]

The Bible says all kind of shit. That's bonkers.

[Ankon]

But you said you believed in it, so why would you? I mean, sure, if belief is what man thinks is true. So of course you don't know.

[Sean Kelly]

Okay?

[Ankon]

There's no way you can know if you hold belief.

[Sean Kelly]

You've had your dick sucked.

[Ankon]

Listen, I don't. I'm not. Do you want to suck my dick?

[Sean Kelly]

No. Have you ever, on a hot day, had, like a cold glass of iced tea after you've been sweating. Sweating all day?

[Ankon]

Listen, I'm gonna say this.

[Sean Kelly]

This just don't feel like.

[Ankon]

I don't really want to talk. Iced tea is a mistake. See, iced tea was created like this. They came over with hot tea. Listen, they came over with hot tea and it was so hot. And he made it by mistake. Iced tea is a mistake. It was hot tea first. Not for real. It's a mistake. So a lot of times mistakes be good for people, right? Did your AI fact check that? I guarantee you, though. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's a mistake, right? AI know that. Because AI can. They can watch this history. They can kind of like see what's going on.

[Sean Kelly]

But I couldn't taste.

[Spiritual Theorist]

Shit.

[Ankon]

It's a mistake. What is taste? You can't taste in your dream.

[Sean Kelly]

What is the dream thing? We're not in a dream, are we?

[Ankon]

Is this a dream? You tell me. What's the difference between this reality and the reality in your mind? I Suggest this whole reality come for you. I suggest that you playing every character here right now. I suggest no one here outside of you.

[Sean Kelly]

I'm creating all these characters.

[Christian Debater]

Yeah.

[Ankon]

Listen, right now. Sean, say something.

[Host]

Yo.

[Ankon]

Now you say what he just said in your. In your head, in his voice.

[Sean Kelly]

Hold on. What am I doing?

[Ankon]

You say what he just said in your head in his voice.

[Sean Kelly]

Not out loud, though.

[Ankon]

No, in your head, in his voice.

[Christian Debater]

Okay.

[Ankon]

Did it work?

[Sean Kelly]

What do you mean, did it work?

[Ankon]

Did you hear his voice in your head?

[Sean Kelly]

Yeah.

[Ankon]

You created his voice.

[Sean Kelly]

I mean, I remembered it.

[Ankon]

You created it from the start.

[Sean Kelly]

But if I didn't hear it, I could have done.

[Ankon]

No, look, from the start, you created it. You couldn't hear it unless you created it, right? But you don't see that. You think that this Earth exists with just you solely, but you don't exist inside your body. Right now. You know where I'm at.

[Historian]

I don't think.

[Ankon]

Do you know where I'm at right now? Do you know I'm at? I'm everywhere. I'm everywhere. Everywhere. Here is me now, right? Because I can't see my face.

[Sean Kelly]

But I've created you.

[Ankon]

Oh, no, no. I'm everywhere. I'm everywhere. I can't. I can't be created on the screen.

[Sean Kelly]

So you can see them on the screens?

[Ankon]

Oh, no, see, I don't think. I'm saying the screen is a different reality. They tell you that's virtual. Real kind of reality. Is that what they call a metaverse? Metaverse? That's a different kind of. That's a different. That's a different world. See, we live in worlds inside of worlds inside of worlds. So I don't think you understand. You think you just live in one. But it's multiple realities, right? You gotta know how to live in all of them. I take you to the hood, they gonna think you. The doping or police. There's no other choice for you. I'm keeping it real. There's no other choice. Like they can't determine, I guess. No, no. You either one or the other. Because based on their perception, that's all you can be.

[Sean Kelly]

So what happens at death, then? If in the prison plan, there is no death. So we're stuck in prison forever.

[Ankon]

We stuck inside what they call. How can I say it? Should I tell them? No, we stuck inside God? Well, if that what you want to call it. Or the energy. We stuck inside what you call God. Some people call it Allah, Jesus, Buddhist, Confusa. They got different names for it. But we stuck Inside it, Wherever the fuck it is.

[Sean Kelly]

But we're stuck.

[Ankon]

Yeah, stuck.

[Sean Kelly]

Because then what's outside of that? What is outside of the prison planet?

[Ankon]

There's nothing outside of this. Listen, all right, so. So it tell you this. It say when. When they say in the Bible, God created heaven. It say he created heaven and he stayed in heaven. It say he created this and he stayed here. It never said he's outside of this. It's no outside of the universe. Everybody tell you this. There's no outside of the universe. You can't go outside of it because there's no outside. It's only inside.

[Sean Kelly]

So is Mars a prison planet? Like, is everything prison?

[Ankon]

What do you mean?

[Sean Kelly]

I'm saying, do you believe in other planets or that's too.

[Ankon]

I'm say this only time. You don't worry about that. Listen, the planet's going to determine where you from, right? Then they got zodiac signs. So the planet going to tell me from. Okay, cool, you from Mars then. You know how you act according to the zodiac sign? What's that white name to do all that shit? Bring him back. Yeah, bring that nigga back. He'll tell you about the planets and shit. I'm gonna tell you about you.

[Sean Kelly]

That's your boy.

[Ankon]

Yeah, I ain't none of my boy. I don't got no boy. Everything is me. I don't think you understand right, but we stuck inside of prison because you can't get out.

[Sean Kelly]

And the warden is Trump.

[Ankon]

Well right now. But I'm gonna tell you this. A lot of people suggest that it's like 13 families that's running everything, but I suggest that it's the original. I'm gonna say this. A lot of people ain't gonna like this, but I'm gonna say this. It's the original black man. The black man don't know who the fuck he is. He don't know, like, the black man from Africa, where you from. They know they was here, but they know they. They got here. Because we know that we gave Indians certain shit while the Indians was here. So we know that we popped up here, but we don't know where the fuck we came from. But they're gonna say, you came from Africa. They're gonna take me to Africa. They're gonna say, oh, shit, this nigga not African. So what the fuck is this nigga? Where the fuck did he come from? Right?

[Sean Kelly]

Do you ever done, like, genealogy, theancestry.com? and where are your people from? You can look it up.

[Ankon]

Show me your hair.

[Sean Kelly]

My hair? Yeah, I Don't even know what that means.

[Ankon]

Show me your hair.

[Sean Kelly]

I think you're.

[Ankon]

Show me your hair.

[Sean Kelly]

Eyes don't work and nothing's real. It's.

[Ankon]

Here, you want a piece of.

[Sean Kelly]

Pull a piece of.

[Femininity Coach]

Out.

[Ankon]

Okay, so what's this? If that's hair, what's this uglier hair? No, it's not ugly hair. What? Listen. No, no. Say what? What. What you have is probably the same thing a dog have. What? No, I'm keeping real. It's not hair yet the same thing a dog have. Because you. You mix with dog, pig and monkeys.

[Sean Kelly]

Me?

[Ankon]

Yeah, bro, you. You a human.

[Sean Kelly]

And you're not.

[Ankon]

You were created to work. I'm with a dog. Wait, what am I? I don't think you get it.

[Sean Kelly]

Said I'm a dog, a pig and a monkey.

[Ankon]

Yeah, that's what I'm. Mama. That's what you are. They look, they signed, looked your genes up. AI fact checking this.

[Sean Kelly]

If AI tells me don't eat big.

[Ankon]

Listen, I don't give you 100. Listen, but I am not. Listen, I'll say this, but let me say this. Something about you. You, that. But you don't have no land here. See, look, it's something strange about me and you, because me and you both don't have a land here. We take. Take. Take everything. Here you go. Take shit, replace shit. But where the fuck are you from? Is it a white land? Right, Listen, we have a German shepherd. I'm gonna tell you where the fuck a German shepherd is from. The fucking dog is from fucking Germany. Where the fuck the white man from? We don't know where the. The black man from. We don't know, all right? We don't know. Black people are from Africa.

[Sean Kelly]

And then white people from.

[Ankon]

No, no, no, take me to Africa. They're gonna tell me I'm not from there. Because Africa was broke up. Listen, Africa. This. Africa was broken. Africa was broke up by you guys. Y' all broke Africa down in sex. Y'. All. Y' all named it based on trade, based on what y' all was getting from each particular part. Africans never called themselves Nigerians and like that. You guys did that, right? They didn't do that.

[Sean Kelly]

Right?

[Ankon]

That came from you, right? Because. Yeah, yeah, you. You're kind of. Your kind.

[Sean Kelly]

You said the black people are the ones running the show.

[Ankon]

Listen, I'm gonna say this. Black people, 12 families. I'm saying this.

[Sean Kelly]

Yeah, yeah.

[Ankon]

No, no, no, no. Them, the white families that the black people control. I don't think you understand.

[Sean Kelly]

So the black People are controlling the white families. You're saying.

[Ankon]

Of course it's not.

[Sean Kelly]

Of course.

[Ankon]

I'm telling you for real.

[Christian Debater]

I mean, I believe that you believe it, but don't.

[Ankon]

No, there's no belief. I'm telling you what I know is true. Because everybody know this. You gonna go different places. They gonna say these people on these lands just disappeared. They just disappeared. These people just disappeared. The crazy ass Hebrew Israelites, they think it's them. I asked the Israelites, they say they just chose the people. They think that the people that everybody looking for is them. That's what they think. But it's the people that have been lost, have been tricked. Because the worst thing they can do is take something from you, hide it from you. And the whole time is stealing you, right? So the whole time they hid it from me, but the whole time it was still stuck in me. That's why I don't read now, because I don't even read. The priest was trying to make me read. Tell this nigga, don't try to do it no more because I don't read. No, for real, I won't read.

[Spiritual Theorist]

I read.

[Ankon]

I read people and I read energy, right? And I read frequencies and shit. I don't read books.

[Historian]

Do you believe that?

[Sean Kelly]

You're in the shit.

[Ankon]

Stop playing. I don't believe shit.

[Sean Kelly]

What do you mean?

[Ankon]

I'm saying, are you in the prison planet?

[Sean Kelly]

I have a word of that.

[Ankon]

I'm telling you this, you probably are. I'm here having an experience, right? So I'm having an experience. I'm having a human experience here, right? Because when I. When I. This body supposedly died, whatever inside of me is going to move past the body, right? So this is like a video game. I'm playing it, right? But people don't understand how to play. So that's why people hearing, they complaining, right? And they don't want to accept it as a prison. I knew a lot of niggas in prison would never accept that they was in prison, right? They wouldn't accept it. They thought they was in the streets. So they saw a fags. Yeah, they thought they was in the streets. Yeah. They wouldn't accept that they was in prison. You ain't supposed to do this, but they bending over. Okay, okay. You would have got. All right, hold up.

[Sean Kelly]

First off, no, okay, I'm not getting bent over and all right? If this is a prison planet, there's everyone. Every baby who, every new baby who's born, is that. That's what it is. They're in prison for their entire. Their energy is stuck in this realm forever.

[Ankon]

Listen, it's two things that happen every time. Everybody knows if you watch this, you did this, and stop lying. Every time you went to jail, you cry. Every time you're born, you cry, right? It's like the same reaction. I'm telling you, I don't think you

[Sean Kelly]

understand, but I stubbed my toe and I cried. Don't mean I'm in prison.

[Ankon]

I don't think you understand. Right. Get out. I mean, get out. You can go so far. Even right now, you can't go across the border. You can't leave America without a passport, right? So right now, no one watching this is in America can leave America without a passport. Tell me you're not in prison.

[Sean Kelly]

That's some governmental boundary bullshit.

[Ankon]

It's prison. It's prison. This is prison. You cannot get out. And you cannot justify the fact that we all in prison. The only way to get out is in. Right?

[Sean Kelly]

You go within.

[Ankon]

When you don't accept everything without. You go within. Because it's one thing that's kind of like in everything. A lot of people don't know this. It's one thing that's in everything. There's only one thing that's in everything. In happiness and pain and sadness. And there's only one thing. Peace.

[Christian Debater]

Peace.

[Ankon]

Yeah. Peace is in the bottom of everything. Because that's the only thing that's in everything. So if you find that peace, then you become free. Free is peace, right? But a lot of times. I'm from the Streets gang. We confuse peace with boredom. Man, nigga, I'm bored as a bitch. Stop playing with. I need something to move.

[Sean Kelly]

Addicted to the chaos.

[Ankon]

Exactly. We addicted to it by. Let me tell you a story, right? A lot of people watching this. They probably don't understand this story. But if you understand the story, then you're gonna understand how everything I say is true, Right? No, for real. It was five monkeys, right? There's five monkeys. They locked them down in the cave, right? They took. What's that name of that thing that got little steps on it? No, not an elevator. That's got to move that. What's that thing? A ladder. Yeah, yeah. They took a ladder right there, right? It took a ladder. They put a ladder there, and then at the top of the ladder, they took some bananas there, right? Okay. And so the monkeys are climbing for the bananas. They sprayed them with water. Sprayed that bitch down. They sprayed him down. Every time they went up, they sprayed them down. Boom. So now the Monkey said, look, don't go for that base in the head. So one monkey grabbed for it. They went and grabbed him. They sprayed him.

[Christian Debater]

Down.

[Ankon]

He went down. Listen. So now every time one grab him, they ain't got to spray him. The other monkeys was fighting him. They replaced all the monkeys one by one by one by one. Now they got brand new monkeys in there. None of them never been hit by water, but none of them touched a banana.

[Sean Kelly]

And they don't even know why.

[Ankon]

They don't know why. And that's what's going on here, right? See, people don't ask questions. Listen, I'm gonna say this. If you got a belief, if some you gotta ask, why did they give it to? Where did it come from and what the fuck they're trying to get me to do? Because every belief, every stipulation that you got was for somebody else and not for you, unless you gave it to you.

[Sean Kelly]

Well, you say you don't read.

[Ankon]

I read people.

[Sean Kelly]

So you get downloads.

[Ankon]

I read downloads. A computer. I read people. Listen, listen, I'mma say this. You probably don't understand this, but you probably do understand this, but if you ever been to the Streets gang, I'm from the Trenches gang, and I can have five, six niggas with me. We walk in the room, it's time to rob this bitch. We speaking, we speaking, we speaking, we speaking. Before you know it, the up on you and you on the ground.

[Historian]

How the.

[Ankon]

I ain't hear nothing. Oh, you ain't hear nothing? Because this don't have to be moving.

[Sean Kelly]

There's a lot of communication happening without.

[Ankon]

Yeah, of course. A lot of the. The information. Listen, most of the communication in the world is non verbal.

[Sean Kelly]

Yes.

[Ankon]

Right. Because listen, it happened in the mind.

[Sean Kelly]

First true thing you said all day.

[Ankon]

Okay? Everything I said, it don't matter. Everything I said is true and false at the same time. Because in every lie, it's the truth in it. And every truth is a lie in it.

[Host]

Let's wrap this up.

[Investigative Journalist]

Yeah.

[Ankon]

All right.

[Sean Kelly]

Well, you're wrong. Good luck with that.

[Host]

If you learned anything from this episode or got any value at all, please share this episode with a friend. It helps us grow the channel, it helps us grow the podcast, and it means a lot to us. Thank you so much.

[Ankon]

I'm not going to do this. I'm not going to do this. I mean, this don't make sense.

[Investigative Journalist]

This guy. Yeah.

[Host]

All right.

[Ankon]

Everything. No, no. Let's go. Let's go. Yeah. So you. You were white, and I like you. I'm saying it don't make sense. Because you probably gonna say the same thing I'm saying. I don't think you're gonna disagree with me sometime on some things. But most of the things, hey, if I agree with, I'm just gonna be quiet. Cause my mama told me she ain't got nothing good to say. Don't say nothing at all. Oh, well, you believe in Jesus? I believe there's somebody up there. Do you believe in Jesus? I don't believe in nobody I ain't never met before.

[Host]

So now you do or don't believe in Jesus?

[Ankon]

I believe. I believe. I believe. I believe my grandma believed in Jesus. No, you said something about good. So you told me you believe in Jesus. And I was going to ask you, was Jesus good? A lot of people watching this, they're going to say, yeah, that Jesus was good. But how? Because Jesus was running around telling people stuff that they should do. People didn't like Jesus for the stuff that he was doing. So Jesus could never have been good. But that was human. But he was never good. And humans ain't good. That's what I'm saying. So a lot of people say, oh man, Jesus was good. I got to be good like Jesus. Nigga, Jesus was never fucking good. Right? So I just wanted to say that. Cause when you say, well, a lot of people like Jesus. Cause they drink wine. So a wine head like Jesus, I mean, is it wine or blood? You be the guest, you be the. I mean, if it was blood, you gotta understand they got the stem cells in there trying to keep their self young. So blood make more sense than wine? Yes, it would. Yeah, blood make more sense than wine. So I'd rather drink some young blood. I ain't drinking no blood. Just get it pumped in you then. I ain't drinking blood. It's plasma. Well, I got blood in me already. Well, listen, listen. I don't think you understand. If you get the plasma pumped in your body right now, it can reverse your. Don't you want to be young again? I'm already the oldest. Y n. But that's how. Listen, this is how people remain young. See, you don't never have to get old again. All you gotta do is keep some young kids around with younger plasma and keep putting it in your body and you're gonna remain young.

[Host]

Adrenochrome.

[Ankon]

The body was not invented to die. There were a lot of people I hate. People say, I was born to die. You should do something about that. Cause the body wasn't invented to die. Death was invented. So what's age then? There's no such thing as age. Okay, so you saying people don't die. So how old do you think I am? You think I'm old? You think I'm young, You think I'm middle? I think you don't have an age. I think to try to put an age on you'll be pointless because you don't have a beginning or end. I do have a beginning. No, I begun with my mama. Nah, that what you assume. Which time? The time after my daddy bust that nut in him? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, that what you assume. I don't assume. Cause when I assume, I make an ass of you and me. And I ain't trying to make an ass nowhere near you because you don't play with no asses. I mean, it just depends on where you at you're gonna play with ass and not in the penitentiary. It's good to play with ass, just depend on where you at. No, I've been to the penitentiary and I ain't played with no ass. But somebody that was it existed.

[Sean Kelly]

Quite sure.

[Ankon]

What's your questions though? What this sounds like?

[Host]

Y' all agree on a lot?

[Ankon]

Yeah, we agree a lot. I know him.

[Host]

Thanks for watching to the end, guys. Please comment below your thoughts on the episode. If you agree. If you disagree, I'd love to hear. I read every single comment. Means a lot to me. Thank you so much. You said you believe in Jesus, right? You don't think he died or you do?

[Christian Debater]

No. Jesus, he died, but he came back. He went to hell and that's when he returned back to Earth.

[Ankon]

But I'm saying Jesus in the flesh. Jesus, Yahshua, Horus, whatever you want to call him in whichever life you want to call him. But everything that he can say about Jesus life, I got somebody here that can take it further back.

[Host]

Do you want to bring him on?

[Ankon]

He come right here. Whatever he can say, he's going to take it right back.

[Host]

Let's get it.

[Ankon]

So I'm gonna get out the way.

[Historian]

Peace, brother.

[Christian Debater]

How you doing, peace brother? I'm doing good, man.

[Historian]

So you said you believe that Jesus died and went to hell and came back?

[Christian Debater]

Yes, sir.

[Historian]

What if I told you that that's a new story?

[Christian Debater]

And what do you mean by that?

[Historian]

What if I told you that there's a story about how one will die, go into the underworld and come back as a resurrected being? You would say that's Jesus right now

[Christian Debater]

you're referring to kismet. History, kismet Kismet. Sorry?

[Historian]

Kismet.

[Christian Debater]

Go ahead, I think.

[Historian]

Kemet.

[Christian Debater]

Kemet. There we go.

[Historian]

Right?

[Christian Debater]

Yes, sir.

[Historian]

What I'm going to say to you. Let's cut to the chase.

[Christian Debater]

Yes, sir.

[Historian]

Jesus. Some people say that Jesus never died. And I would agree with that because Jesus never lived.

[Christian Debater]

Jesus did.

[Femininity Coach]

Definitely.

[Historian]

Jesus is a mythological figure.

[Christian Debater]

No. There's over 25000 manuscripts that prove the existence of Jesus. There's more proof on Jesus manuscripts. There's more proof on the existence of Jesus than there's proof on the history of Julius Caesar.

[Historian]

Name one of those manuscripts.

[Christian Debater]

I can tell you that Tacticus was a. This Tacticus Tacitus. How would you spell.

[Historian]

No, I'm a historian.

[Christian Debater]

Okay, go ahead. So the Roman historian.

[Historian]

Disagree, just not.

[Christian Debater]

I'm just telling you. I'm saying the Roman historian.

[Historian]

Yes.

[Christian Debater]

Proved that Pilate was the one behind the execution of. Did he do that?

[Historian]

How do you do that?

[Christian Debater]

Yes, he did. He wrote it. He followed the history up with it, what year it was document.

[Historian]

Right. That's.

[Christian Debater]

This is in around 500 A.D. okay,

[Historian]

and what year would you attest to Jesus living?

[Christian Debater]

That was 20, 26 years ago based off of American history.

[Historian]

Wait, let's give us your ad again. Come on now, go ahead.

[Christian Debater]

So for his death. His death is 33 AD and that's recorded with the red moon, and that has been proven as well.

[Historian]

So you're arguing that someone that wrote something nearly 500 years later is the person that you want to cite for historicity, Is that what you're saying?

[Christian Debater]

So who are you going to cite for history that hasn't lived thousands of years as well? History is still facts at some point, even if it's recorded later on in time. Just because it's had prolonged time doesn't mean that it's not true.

[Historian]

Okay. I knew your great great grandfather. You believe me?

[Christian Debater]

No.

[Historian]

Why don't you believe me?

[Christian Debater]

Because you weren't living at the same.

[Historian]

Oh, wait a minute, brother. Are you on my side or are you on your side?

[Christian Debater]

But you said you're a historian, so what's the point of studying.

[Historian]

Just validated, Tacitus, go ahead. No, so you're.

[Christian Debater]

So who is your historians that you

[Historian]

look up another shovel?

[Christian Debater]

I'm just telling you.

[Historian]

Tell me you.

[Christian Debater]

So you're a historian. You're a historian and you're tearing apart history. For what reason?

[Historian]

No, I'm not tearing apart history. I'm giving you a corrective analysis of history.

[Christian Debater]

So please go ahead and start your.

[Historian]

I'm telling you that just as you told us, Tacitus did not live during the time of Jesus.

[Christian Debater]

That's correct.

[Historian]

And so you're saying that he should be used as a citation for his historicity. But if you're claiming, by the way, it wasn't 500 years, he got that date wrong.

[Christian Debater]

But we're gonna go with date, was it? No, go ahead.

[Historian]

No, no, we're gonna go with your wrong.

[Christian Debater]

I would like to know which one is digging.

[Historian]

Give them a bulldozer.

[Christian Debater]

I'm giving you the bulldozer. I'm giving you the keys. I'd like to know. I appreciate it.

[Ankon]

I'm not.

[Christian Debater]

So thank you. I'd like to know the correct time.

[Historian]

Are you sure you want another one?

[Christian Debater]

So I would like to know the correct time. If you do genuinely know, just say to you. Because I don't want it to just be something that's a. A statement.

[Historian]

Well, let me say this.

[Christian Debater]

Go ahead.

[Historian]

You said there were over 25,000 manuscripts proving the historicity of Jesus.

[Christian Debater]

Correct.

[Historian]

I asked you to name one and you invalidated it. Name another.

[Christian Debater]

I didn't invalidate it.

[Historian]

You just said that. I'm telling you that you don't believe that I knew your great, great grandfather because I didn't. I didn't live during his time because

[Christian Debater]

you don't have any knowledge of my great grandfather. So go ahead, please tell me, how

[Historian]

do you know that? I don't.

[Christian Debater]

I would like to see if you do.

[Historian]

Your reason is because you said I

[Christian Debater]

didn't live during his time.

[Historian]

Tacitus did live during Jesus.

[Christian Debater]

But your angle of. To have a debate by just prompting yourself to say that everything I'm saying is wrong.

[Historian]

Give us another. 1000 is a large number Asking you.

[Christian Debater]

I'm asking you to go ahead and tell me your basis of knowledge, what I'm saying, instead of just discrediting everything I'm saying. Because how about.

[Historian]

I, I'll. I'll cut to the chase.

[Christian Debater]

Yeah, sure.

[Historian]

Let's be very clear. We have no physical evidence and no textual evidence for a literal historical Jesus Christ. And to go further. Wait, hold on, hold on, hold on.

[Christian Debater]

Okay, go ahead. I was going to say that he came in the flesh and.

[Historian]

Let's go further. Wait, wait, wait. Let's go further, let's go further. Let's also recognize that much of that Jesus story is present in an earlier tradition.

[Bible Scholar]

Yeah.

[Historian]

The deity of resurrection was a deity that people worshiped, recognized for thousands of years before there was ever a Jesus.

[Christian Debater]

And how do you believe that to be true?

[Historian]

Well, I mean, I'll take you on my next trip to Kemet. So you can see the artifacts.

[Christian Debater]

Well, I'm just asking, I would like to know how do you believe those artifacts weren't there?

[Historian]

I just told you that you weren't

[Christian Debater]

there when they were made. That could have been mad. Me, that could have been mad.

[Historian]

What's an artifact?

[Christian Debater]

Something. Something that was found from the previous dated time.

[Historian]

From that period?

[Christian Debater]

Yeah.

[Historian]

Okay. What is the artifact that.

[Christian Debater]

Have you ever heard of falsified fossils?

[Historian]

Are you attempting to argue that the artifacts that we find can be altered? That are not questioned by any reputable scholar, any archaeologists are falsified because. What's your name again?

[Christian Debater]

Ro.

[Historian]

Because Ro said so.

[Christian Debater]

No, I'm not saying because Rose said so. I feel. See that's the.

[Historian]

I'm saying to you that for this, for. For all of these, all of the information I'm giving you and I'm going to tell you that before there was ever a Jesus, before there was ever

[Christian Debater]

a Yeshua, before there was Yeshua, the

[Historian]

pieces of his cross, yes, in existence,

[Christian Debater]

they're spread out amongst the people.

[Historian]

Okay?

[Christian Debater]

That was the plan. Spread out amongst the people. Because Christianity wasn't to be a man made thing, it was to follow Christ himself.

[Historian]

So you believe who put the cross up?

[Christian Debater]

Jesus carried his own cross up.

[Historian]

No, no, I didn't ask you who carried it. I said who put it up?

[Christian Debater]

Some of the Romans that were working in the pipe.

[Historian]

You're suggesting that the Roman centurions gave it out to people like favors at a birthday party?

[Christian Debater]

No, I'm not saying that this was a sacrifice. This was a.

[Historian]

Do you think that they have pieces?

[Christian Debater]

This was a sacrifice. This was a sacrificial ritual that they had. They had members that went up to the cross after he died, when he was taken down and he was put inside of the tomb.

[Historian]

I know you don't know me, but usually this is the moment when I put up a sign that says source. Imagine it says source here. What's your source for that? The Bible says that they gave out the cross.

[Christian Debater]

No, I'm saying the pieces of the cross were spread out.

[Historian]

And that's in the Bible.

[Christian Debater]

Sure.

[Investigative Journalist]

Go.

[Historian]

What passage is that from?

[Christian Debater]

I. I'm trying to tell you. From John 20:24. Jesus came back. When he returned and that's when Thomas was questioning his existence, if he was really there or not. And Jesus told him, peace be with you. Hold on, hold on. He said, peace be with you. And that's when he invited him to reach his finger inside the hole in his hand.

[Historian]

I hope this AI is putting up.

[Host]

Oh, it's popping off right now.

[Christian Debater]

Did it?

[Historian]

I hope it's putting up. 2024.

[Christian Debater]

2024. Second, please.

[Historian]

2024 says they gave out pieces of the cross.

[Christian Debater]

I did not say that again. I'm telling you about Jesus's existence when he returned. After that, the disciples made their agreements of what they were going to collect from the death site of Jesus, and that's what they passed on.

[Historian]

Here's another question.

[Investigative Journalist]

Here's another question.

[Christian Debater]

Which one?

[Host]

John 20. You said John 20:20 or John 20:24 is what I picked up? John 20:20.

[Historian]

Oh, yeah.

[Christian Debater]

I said John 20:24. When Thomas was questioning Jesus, they gave

[Historian]

out pieces of the cross.

[Christian Debater]

No, I'm telling you the steps of

[Historian]

your source, okay, of how the cross was given out to people.

[Christian Debater]

My source for that is because of the pieces that have been retrieved that people still hold on to that have been carbon dated.

[Historian]

Did you know that? Did you know that there are 20, that there are over 31 churches in Europe that say that they have the holy preppers. Do you know what the holy purpose is?

[Christian Debater]

No.

[Sean Kelly]

Ooh.

[Historian]

Who knows what the holy purpose is? The foreskin of Jesus. Do you believe that they have the foreskin of Jesus?

[Christian Debater]

No, I do not believe.

[Historian]

You don't believe it, but they have it.

[Christian Debater]

I believe they have the foreskin, but they have it. But that's not my reputable source that I'm going, oh, that's not a reputable source? That is disgusting.

[Historian]

You better tell the leaders of those churches.

[Christian Debater]

I will tell the leaders. That is disgusting.

[Historian]

It is a holy relic.

[Christian Debater]

Okay, so where's your stance on Jesus?

[Historian]

I gave you a very clear stance.

[Christian Debater]

Go for it.

[Historian]

Jesus never died because Jesus never lived. So you're saying mythological figure, but you're

[Christian Debater]

saying that the figure that was speaked about before previously, before Jesus, that also resurrected and went to hell, you're saying

[Historian]

that that figure is also a mythological figure.

[Christian Debater]

So, okay, I'm just arguing to see

[Historian]

if you, some of you may know this name is Osiris. I am not saying that Osar or Osiris was a literal, physical person. This is a mythological figure. And that story that you know as Jesus is an echo of an earlier story.

[Christian Debater]

Correct.

[Historian]

And the reason why you don't know truly the story of Asar is because the early Christians destroyed it.

[Christian Debater]

I do know of the stories of Osiris. I do know the stories of Amun Ra. I have looked into the Book of Enoch. So I am in agreeance the book

[Historian]

of Enoch has the story of Osiris.

[Christian Debater]

No, I'm not saying that this is just another side. I'm just saying this as a side. As a side note, just in case. If that's where you're going to go next.

[Historian]

No, I wasn't going to Enoch in.

[Christian Debater]

Just in case. Okay, okay, I'm taking.

[Historian]

I'm gonna give you some credit.

[Christian Debater]

Hold on.

[Historian]

Reading Enoch, by the way.

[Christian Debater]

So.

[Historian]

But.

[Christian Debater]

Okay, so I'm.

[Historian]

Because it's not in your canon.

[Christian Debater]

So I'm. Of course. But what I'm saying is I follow Christ in the sense of following the purposes and the practices that he spoke of, not following the entire book of Christianity.

[Historian]

Okay.

[Christian Debater]

That's what I was being clear of in the beginning.

[Historian]

That's good.

[Christian Debater]

So that's where I'm coming from on my practice.

[Historian]

So you agree with me that Jesus is a mythological character.

[Christian Debater]

I do not believe in mythological character.

[Historian]

He made a left. Get this man a gps.

[Christian Debater]

Not a mythological.

[Historian]

Why?

[Christian Debater]

I did not say that. Jesus Christ lives in the character. Jesus Christ lived in the flesh.

[Historian]

Okay?

[Christian Debater]

And that's why when you use his name to wrap up any of your words, it's a spiritual protection and guidance from any of the dark energies that are around you. Excuse me.

[Ankon]

Take me to a grave site.

[Christian Debater]

He was at the tomb and he walked. That's why he doesn't have a grave site. He's not dead. He still exists. And that's why he told you that you have that channeling. You have the power to go ahead and channel Jesus inside.

[Historian]

His body ascended into heaven.

[Ankon]

I didn't ask you to get upset. I asked you to take me to.

[Christian Debater]

I didn't get upset.

[Ankon]

I want to go see it.

[Christian Debater]

He's dead.

[Ankon]

He's not dead. He left the tomb.

[Christian Debater]

He left the tomb.

[Ankon]

Take me to the tomb.

[Christian Debater]

But he left the tomb.

[Ankon]

Where is it? I'm going to go put flowers there in remembrance. Because my grandfather is dead. We know that he lives, so we'll go to. I can go put in some roses on there.

[Christian Debater]

But how do you know he's in there?

[Ankon]

You can't take me there.

[Christian Debater]

But you don't know he's in there.

[Ankon]

How do you know?

[Christian Debater]

How do you know your grandfather's in that grave?

[Historian]

They could open the grave. But people open graves all the time.

[Christian Debater]

And a lot of times bodies aren't inside of there, are they?

[Historian]

I don't know about a lot of times. Most times the bodies are still there.

[Christian Debater]

How many times are they really opening these grave sites?

[Historian]

What do you Mean, people get exhumed all the time.

[Christian Debater]

But you're saying that they're opening them and there's always a body inside there?

[Historian]

No, I didn't say there was always.

[Christian Debater]

I said.

[Historian]

Okay, most of the time, those bodies.

[Christian Debater]

Most of the time, there's also grave robbers, and they've also found out that they're harvesting organs.

[Historian]

Most of the time, there are grave robbers.

[Christian Debater]

Go ahead. Yes, boy.

[Historian]

You need some sources.

[Christian Debater]

Oh, man. Okay.

[Historian]

Most of the time, family, you better get to the cemetery immediately, okay, because this brother just said that your grandpappy's body is missing.

[Christian Debater]

That's. You better get over there. And if they find out that they are missing, then what? This is part of the problem.

[Historian]

Maybe they'll call them Jesus because his body isn't here either.

[Christian Debater]

Oh, okay.

[Historian]

Unless you believe in the holy purpose.

[Christian Debater]

But Jesus did walk afterwards. Did we see that Bible verse?

[Historian]

Did Jesus walk afterwards?

[Christian Debater]

Yes. For John 20:24, did we see a question.

[Historian]

When was John written?

[Christian Debater]

John was written hundreds of years after Jesus.

[Historian]

Okay. And was it originally called the Book of John or called something else?

[Christian Debater]

It was not originally called the Book of John.

[Historian]

That's in the King James, an anonymous book from a later period as a source for historicity.

[Christian Debater]

But we don't have any accurate sources. But no, what I'm saying. For all history.

[Historian]

No, not true. For all history, not true.

[Christian Debater]

Because what are you basing it off of? There's always translations. Everything.

[Historian]

Me.

[Christian Debater]

Everything has to be.

[Historian]

Come with me to Kemet and I will show you hundreds of bodies that have been studied of people who were buried.

[Christian Debater]

But how do you know that the information is accurate?

[Historian]

We know who they are. We even have bodies of their relatives, their ancestors. We have tombs. We have all of the material culture that exists. None of this we have for Jesus.

[Christian Debater]

But how do you know that those names are correct? How do you know that the history.

[Historian]

There were early Christians that also argue what I am arguing, that Jesus was not a literal character. And unfortunately, they actually were laughing at the people who were doing the historical orthodoxy. They were saying they have no idea what they're talking about. And then they realized they were being wiped out. You are actually following the tradition of very powerful Europeans who sought to make this story literal.

[Christian Debater]

But this story was also taken literal in Chinese culture, in African culture, there's different depictions of Jesus of multiple races. But I'm saying there's different depictions of Jesus in multiple races. You can go ahead and you can find the depictions.

[Historian]

When did Jesus get to China?

[Christian Debater]

It's not just white Jesus. You Guys have this thing against white Jesus. There's different. No.

[Historian]

I knew your dark great grandfather.

[Christian Debater]

I knew of a darker skin.

[Historian]

I knew your great great grandfather.

[Investigative Journalist]

We used to shoot dice on the corner.

[Christian Debater]

Exist. I don't understand why. Because of the fact that you guys

[Ankon]

are against white Jesus.

[Christian Debater]

Thank you. Thank you.

[Historian]

I want to be very clear. I want to be very clear. If you were aware of the traditions that are earlier than Yeshua.

[Christian Debater]

Yeah.

[Historian]

And then you looked at the. The clear paucity of evidence, incredible evidence for Jesus that it possibly happened multiple times. Wait a minute. And then you looked at the fact that the early Christian church sought to destroy the cometic tradition. You would begin to say, something smells fishy and it would not have been the fishes multiplied by your Savior. You need to understand, was that blasphemous?

[Christian Debater]

Yeah, that is blasphemous.

[Historian]

Okay, what is blasphemy?

[Christian Debater]

You're saying it in a sense to mock and disrespect.

[Historian]

No, I'm not mocking. I'm not mocking, but I'm saying that's mythological is what I'm saying.

[Christian Debater]

I just feel like you, you have a very preset, predetermined mindset.

[Historian]

Okay.

[Christian Debater]

And I'm not in disagreeance with it. What I'm saying to you is if you're saying that it's falsified because it might have happened in different occasions and history.

[Historian]

No, that's not what I said.

[Christian Debater]

Okay. So I'm trying to clear it up. So if you're saying that this happened previously before Christ, so it doesn't mean that it had to be true because there's also history that Osiris went through the same resurrection process. Does that not mean that the resurrection process happens multiple times in existence of earth? That means that Simeon Toko can be another form of Jesus Christ. There can be other Jesus Christ that come in multiple fashions. It does not mean solely that that was the only time. Would you be in agreement to that

[Historian]

or not slowly coming to the light?

[Christian Debater]

This is my point. I've been trying to.

[Historian]

You are Jesus and you are a sar. But neither of them are literal. Neither of them are historical.

[Christian Debater]

So why?

[Historian]

How is it not historical if it's not saying?

[Christian Debater]

We're covering it now. This is a part of history.

[Historian]

I'm not saying that you can't actually say that you are a follower of Jesus or a follower of a Tsar. I'm just saying when you try to make it a historical story, you do that with overwhelming religious bias. And when you look at the historical analysis, there was no Jesus.

[Christian Debater]

But if there are is different coverage that's beyond history from the Bible. Does that still not count as history if other people are reporting and covering and talking about Jesus? We're in the year 2026 AD Anno Domini. Hold on, hold on one second. We're in 2026 A.D. this is. We're all in agreeance to this. If we're not in 2026, what year are we in? Wait, can you tell me what year, what year is China in?

[Historian]

Wait, let's, let's.

[Christian Debater]

But, but that's still.

[Ankon]

But let's see.

[Christian Debater]

Right? Is it still A.D. is it still not Anno Domini de GC Christi?

[Ankon]

It's 13 months actually. So you got to go by the correct calendar. Right, so you're going by 12 months.

[Christian Debater]

Sure. There's no 12 month cycle, but it's still AD, right?

[Ankon]

No, it's 1446. It's a year.

[Christian Debater]

1446. Where'd you get that from?

[Ankon]

Yeah, you gotta take away the time they stole. You gotta take away the fact that it's actually 13 months. So take away all of that. Right, and then we take away the time they stole. When they replace history, you're gonna come

[Christian Debater]

up to the same, same year of 1446. I, please would like to see the math on that.

[Investigative Journalist]

But.

[Historian]

Well, I'm gonna tell you something interesting. All of the texts that you're referencing, none of them actually were written at the time that Jesus existed. And many of them, we have earlier versions of them that are different than the versions we read now. And there were entire books that were left out of the canon. The Bible that you read.

[Christian Debater]

That's correct.

[Investigative Journalist]

Don't you.

[Historian]

Aren't you at the point, at this point where you don't trust the institution that gave you that book?

[Christian Debater]

Of course.

[Ankon]

Okay, good.

[Investigative Journalist]

Of course.

[Historian]

So then why are you citing the book that they gave you as proof?

[Christian Debater]

You asked me the source and that's the source.

[Historian]

Here's the question.

[Christian Debater]

That's the physical source. Now, if you'd like to know my spiritual source, why are you.

[Historian]

No, I'm not asking for your spiritual source. Right, so I gave you the matter.

[Christian Debater]

But I gave you the. But I gave you the physical source.

[Historian]

I'm saying that that source is not a good historical source. That's what I'm saying to you. It wasn't written during the time that Jesus lived. It certainly wasn't written by someone named John.

[Christian Debater]

Of course not. These names were interpreted later on.

[Historian]

Why are you using them as a historical source?

[Christian Debater]

You asked Me, because it's still written in a part of history.

[Historian]

How many comics do you think they are of Peter Parker? Spider man? More than 25,000.

[Christian Debater]

There are multiple interpretations of Peter Parker.

[Historian]

Peter Parker. Spider man is a historical character. Then.

[Christian Debater]

Yeah, he is a part of history because he does exist. No, no, no, no, no. Does he not exist?

[Historian]

We're talking do the comics not literal, historical.

[Christian Debater]

If you can say a physical date for the creation of Peter Parker, he exists. So then you believe that we have a hold on. This is a form of a demigod. This is a form of a demigod as well. I know they call Jesus as a demigod. No, I said Zeus. You're a demigod. You're asking me about Zeus?

[Historian]

Oh, it seems like he has to go back and learn Greek history.

[Christian Debater]

No, I understand that Hercules is deemed a demigod, but I'm saying a demigod in the sense of the fall.

[Historian]

You believe that Zeus exists?

[Christian Debater]

The fallen angels that came down to Earth that had sex with humans and they were fallen angels.

[Historian]

You mixing a lot of stuff together.

[Christian Debater]

No, this is talked about inside the Bible as well. And this is where we have these

[Historian]

demigods for information around.

[Christian Debater]

So you believe that, but I'm saying that Zeus exists. You see different history.

[Historian]

He's a literal historical figure. That's what you're saying?

[Christian Debater]

Sure, go ahead. Yes, you do? Yes. I don't think he can shoot.

[Historian]

I'm telling you, it's not Sunday. But they're not gonna let you back in church on Sunday.

[Christian Debater]

Go.

[Historian]

You're there. Not gonna let you in.

[Christian Debater]

Different religions overlap at once.

[Ankon]

No, no.

[Christian Debater]

I would like to know his sources.

[Ankon]

You, you. If you just twitch it right now. You know everything he's saying. You just on that side. So you're trying to go against it

[Historian]

when you religious bias.

[Christian Debater]

I feel you.

[Ankon]

Because you're not a Christian.

[Christian Debater]

I follow Christ. I'm not a Christian in the sense of going to the church. I follow Christian Christianity is following Jesus Christ. No, I'm not agnostic. I believe in following Christians of Christ.

[Historian]

He said a bunch of things that I follow. A bunch of things that wouldn't be accepted in the modern church.

[Christian Debater]

I understand that and that's why I have issues with the pastors in the modern church.

[Historian]

I have issues with them lying about a historical figure that is a mythological figure.

[Christian Debater]

No.

[Historian]

Okay, so that's probably the.

[Christian Debater]

I have issues with making profit on the name of God in the name of Jesus. I have issues with making a mockery of it. And I Have issues that they're going ahead and they're perpetrating and pushing through different verses like in Leviticus that tell you about being a good slave. I don't go hand in hand with those. I know that that's from the manipulation of the book that's been indoctrinated across the land. I have.

[Historian]

That's a good start. That's a good start.

[Christian Debater]

I'm saying I am a follower of Christ.

[Historian]

Okay. But you can be a follower of Christ. We're talking about.

[Christian Debater]

So that is a Christian.

[Historian]

We're talking about whether Christ was a literal, historical, living person. So that's what we're talking about.

[Christian Debater]

So let me.

[Ankon]

I'm not contest.

[Historian]

I'm not saying you can't be a follower.

[Christian Debater]

Okay.

[Historian]

I would never say that.

[Christian Debater]

So thank you. I'm just saying we're back on the Bible.

[Historian]

Jesus didn't die because he never lived. Are you forgetting the prompt?

[Christian Debater]

I know I'm not forgetting the prompt. I'm back to you. Okay, so they recorded for 33 AD that there was a sun moon, there was a blood moon. They recently just released this information.

[Investigative Journalist]

Okay.

[Christian Debater]

That there was a confirmed blood moon that was talked about on the night of the crucification of Jesus Christ. Okay. That was a part of a satanic ritual. Jesus Christ was killed for a satanic ritual.

[Historian]

Where you get that from?

[Investigative Journalist]

Whoa, you're going.

[Historian]

He's going even farther afield than I am. They are not going to let you

[Christian Debater]

get into church on Sunday. That's fine.

[Historian]

Come to the crime. We'll let you in. We'll let you in.

[Christian Debater]

Look, man, I like you and I don't have no issue with. But I do understand where you stand on this. But I'm telling you that you can fact check that as well for 33.

[Historian]

So you're suggesting that if there was a blood moon.

[Christian Debater]

Yes, that was discussed.

[Historian]

That that means that Jesus literally was crucified at that time?

[Christian Debater]

Yes.

[Historian]

Do you know that when you read. Wait, wait, wait, listen. When you read comic books about Peter Parker, Spider man, they often use historical events. I have a cover of Peter Parker meeting Barack Obama. I think we both agree that Barack Obama is a literal figure, right?

[Christian Debater]

Correct.

[Historian]

So does that mean that Spider man is a literal figure? Someone that actually lived?

[Christian Debater]

Do you agree that Pilate was a literal figure?

[Historian]

I think that we have proof now that Pilate was a literal figure.

[Christian Debater]

Okay. But he interacted with Jesus Christ and he was the one behind the execution.

[Historian]

So then you believe that Peter Parker. Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait.

[Christian Debater]

Wait, wait.

[Historian]

So then you're saying you believe that Peter Parker, Spider man is literally someone who lived.

[Christian Debater]

Did Peter Parker in real life not meet Barack Obama in real.

[Historian]

What do you mean?

[Sean Kelly]

Tom Holland.

[Christian Debater]

Tom Holland, the actor, did. So he still met Barack Obama. He did.

[Investigative Journalist]

Did he?

[Historian]

Did he. Did he play Jesus too?

[Christian Debater]

He didn't, but in the sense of your question. But Spider man did meet Barack Obama in that sense.

[Historian]

So that means you believe that Peter

[Christian Debater]

Parker does not mean that art and history cannot exist in one. What I'm saying these comments can also be the same depiction of something that is.

[Historian]

I think that you're losing point. The point that we're not.

[Christian Debater]

Jesus Christ did. Yes, go ahead.

[Historian]

The point that we are making is that Jesus Christ was not a literal, figurative a literal, physical person. That's the point we're making. Is there. Is there a mythological story about him? Of course there is. Of course there is. And I even think there's wisdom to be learned by his story. But when we try to make that story literal, historical, we have problems.

[Christian Debater]

So what proof do you have that disproves that Jesus exists?

[Historian]

I just told you. I just told you.

[Christian Debater]

Just because you haven't found anything, the

[Historian]

first thing is you don't find anything.

[Bible Scholar]

That means.

[Ankon]

Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait.

[Historian]

It's not just not finding things. It's also looking at the fact that much of his story was told in an earlier tradition. And then the people that told you that there was a literal Jesus sought to wipe out that tradition.

[Christian Debater]

I understand.

[Historian]

So right off the bat you should say something is fishy here.

[Christian Debater]

I understand what you're saying, but the absence of evidence is not the evidence of abstinence. Something can still be there.

[Host]

Okay, let's move on. Way to the end, guys. Please hit like and subscribe. It helps us grow the show and helps us get bigger guests. Thank you so much.

[Spiritual Theorist]

If you said that beings here are intaking blood or taking life force energy from, let's just say the youth or to stay around longer, right? You said Earth is a prison planet, so why they not trying to die?

[Ankon]

I'm gonna ask you a question. You said a lot of things. I know niggas in prison that don't want to get out, but you said something about. Repeat your question.

[Spiritual Theorist]

Why are they usurping? Why do they need blood to live longer if this is a prison planet and they want to die?

[Ankon]

You said nobody said nobody want to die. You say it's not possible.

[Spiritual Theorist]

No, I'm asking why they not trying to get up out of Here, like this. If you look at the.

[Ankon]

Why you have.

[Spiritual Theorist]

Hold on, hold on. If you look at like, let's just say Egyptians, right? Just so everybody understand what I'm saying. If you look at Egyptians, they studied how to die and not come back, right?

[Ankon]

I don't think you get it.

[Spiritual Theorist]

Why is being stuck in a corner. Stay here longer.

[Ankon]

No one studied how to die. That thing that you just said was kind of like straight transcend whatever it was. Exactly. So nobody studied how to die. See, a lot of people think that they was born dying, but then that's because they dead. Listen, I'm gonna say this. What I was talking about was stem cells gang that's inside of like a PC. Not talking about stem cells, that's inside of your blood that they use in order to keep youth in the body. See, you're trying to confuse a lot of different things. You're trying to confuse the spiritual reality with the physical reality, right? I'm talking about this reality as far as the physical reality, right? Now they taking synthetic gang, synthetic cells and putting them inside your body, right? They creating foods, bioengineered ingredients.

[Christian Debater]

When you look at the back of

[Spiritual Theorist]

your lays, I'm talking about that steak, strawberry.

[Ankon]

Yeah, I'm talking about that. I'm not talking about what you think I'm talking about. I'm talking about actual way so your body won't age.

[Spiritual Theorist]

If they want to live longer, they gonna keep drinking the blood, right? They gonna keep usurping. We in Babylon, right? Everybody can agree on that. We in a modern day Babylon.

[Ankon]

Who said that? You said that. I said that I say right now, See, listen, because I'm gonna tell you

[Spiritual Theorist]

why we in a modern day Babylon. You look at the flag, right? The LTT flag. I'm just gonna say that y' all understand what I'm saying, right? It's flipped upside down because the chakra colors at the bottom. So you see the purple crown frequency is sitting at the bottom, right? And the red root chakra is at the top, right? What run the land right now. Degeneracy, debauchery, et cetera, et cetera, you know what I'm saying?

[Ankon]

To say all of that, you had to think about it right now to say all that. You just said you had to think about it right now.

[Spiritual Theorist]

I had to think about it or pull it from my memory?

[Ankon]

You had to say it right now. It only existed right now. There's no way even right now if you gonna say, okay, cool. Something gonna happen in the future when you get to the Future. It's gonna only be right now. All we have is right now.

[Spiritual Theorist]

We talking about right now. We in Babylon, but you Pride month right now.

[Ankon]

But you're using things from different realities that's also happening. That don't have nothing to do with

[Spiritual Theorist]

the we in the multiverse.

[Ankon]

But. But you're here right now. That cannot help you right now.

[Spiritual Theorist]

See why I can't.

[Ankon]

Because listen, I'm say this information can't help you right now. Only thing that can help you right now is information could always help you

[Spiritual Theorist]

if it's being applied.

[Ankon]

Only thing that can help you right now is the fact you understand yourself and learn how to deal with you. Right? Because a lot of people want to worry about information. But information can't help you. I know a lot of niggas that think they smart. They read a whole lot of books. It don't help.

[Spiritual Theorist]

It don't help.

[Ankon]

Listen, the only thing that's going to help you is to take control of you. To understand that it's only you and information can't help you. Right? Listen, a lot of people assume that information is good. But they're going to pass information. You're going to forget you. All I'm going to say is this only thing that we both can prove right now. That we're sitting across from each other in this moment.

[Spiritual Theorist]

Yeah.

[Ankon]

Anything else that you saying? We can't even say that it happened. Only by another man who made the prompts. What's a prompt?

[Spiritual Theorist]

You planned to lose?

[Ankon]

No, I'm asking you what's a prompt? Explain to me what a prop is.

[Spiritual Theorist]

A prop is a set of questions.

[Ankon]

Now ask your question again.

[Spiritual Theorist]

What is a prompt?

[Ankon]

The question is the answer, right? I don't think you understand because a lot of people say a lot of things. But once you say it, you already told yourself the answer. Because everything exists inside you.

[Spiritual Theorist]

I'm a prompt. It say that you agree that we live in Assimilation Planet. Right? We live in a simulation. Earth. Simulation 607 unc. The character agreed to Assimilation Planet.

[Ankon]

I said it. Who told you? Did you hear? Come on. My mouth. He's written on the paper. Did you see or hear me say it? Listen, he just sat here and said that Jesus was here. And nobody can understand and validate that. There's no hist paper. Don't that paper suggests that I said that. It don't mean that I said even

[Spiritual Theorist]

use Js in the Alphabet.

[Ankon]

He said that. He put that there. Them are his thoughts. Them are not mine. So we are here having the conversation.

[Spiritual Theorist]

So did you agree to when you sat down and spoke with me?

[Ankon]

No, no, no, no. I didn't agree. I agreed to sit down.

[Spiritual Theorist]

You agree with the prompts?

[Ankon]

No, no, I agreed to sit.

[Spiritual Theorist]

You made a spiritual contract. You sat down.

[Ankon]

I agree to sit.

[Sean Kelly]

Sit down.

[Spiritual Theorist]

Okay.

[Ankon]

All right. And I'm agreements to this conversation, right? I have not heard a topic.

[Spiritual Theorist]

Okay, so let me see that prompt, bro. My first claim, 607 UNC versus 10. It said. This is why I said 607 UNK. Because I read it said my. It didn't say first claim. Is that. It says my first claim. Unless he even spoofed you or jugged you or what is called defrauded your mind. It says, my first claim is that Earth is a prison planet, right? So why is there beings here usurping blood to stay here longer? It can't be that fucked up.

[Ankon]

I'll say this, listen, I'm gonna say this again. Me, for me. I know niggas that's better in prison, right? They go to prison. No, I'm free. They go to prison. And they better in prison. Because no matter where you go, it's a prison relationship with prison, right? You gonna relationship and it's get. But you can be in a relationship

[Spiritual Theorist]

and be free in your mind.

[Ankon]

But not at 3 o' clock in the morning. Even if you ain't doing that, you gonna go start tripping. Cause this girl gonna be tripping. The thought go on your mind. Cause she gon doing something else. You are in her prison. Trust is a prison.

[Spiritual Theorist]

So if I end that relationship, where the prison stand, I'm free now.

[Ankon]

There you go. Freedom is peace. Relationships is prison. Because I'm telling you about relationship. Because it's trust, right? You say trust is good. Everybody like, man, I want to trust everybody. I can't do that trust. Because I only trust the fact that whatever you do, I trust in the fact that I'm gonna be okay with it, right? And whatever decision you make is good for you, I can't make.

[Spiritual Theorist]

But you was able to access peace or freedom, right? So why I can't access freedom on earth?

[Ankon]

It's kind of crazy. Because what journey? Because like again, if left and right is different, I suggest that nothing is ever moving. That is never a journey. I suggest everything is at a standstill and everything's happening in the mind. That's what I suggest, right? Because I don't think nobody can prove that anything is moving. Cause right now they say the earth moving, but you got other people that Prove that it's not. Right now you got people saying the Earth is flat. You got other people that prove that it's not.

[Spiritual Theorist]

But it don't matter.

[Ankon]

No, because it's. No. Earth is not a location. So I think everybody get it wrong when they try to make it a location and try to make it a shape. Earth is a shapeshifter.

[Christian Debater]

So you think.

[Spiritual Theorist]

Do you think it's like an architect of the Matrix?

[Ankon]

Earth is a shapeshifter. It changed with the thoughts.

[Spiritual Theorist]

But the reason why I asked you do you think it's an architect of the Matrix? Because who's setting up a simulation? A programmer.

[Ankon]

Oh, no. Who the fuck is that? Everybody think that because it's a program that they gotta have a programmer. That what you suggest. But the way it's no programmer, but if you want to call it a programmer, we've got to call that programmer God. But. But it's not. But it's not a God. It's not a creator. Listen, whatever you want to call it. God, creator, but it's God.

[Spiritual Theorist]

It's guys that practices. It's guys that run on this planet. That's okay, right?

[Ankon]

Listen, everything is God because, listen, everything exists inside of God. So you, if you take one, let me say this.

[Spiritual Theorist]

I think of God as generator operator, destroyer of my realm. When I think of the word God,

[Ankon]

right, then that's God, but the creator.

[Spiritual Theorist]

I didn't create my heartbeat. I didn't create my heart. I didn't create none of how my body is right? Who. Who designed this? Who? Okay. Somebody designed this table, right? Who designed these human suits?

[Ankon]

That's what caused a lot of stress. See, a lot of people think that. Listen, I'm gonna say this right now. If people walked outside and it was a million dollars on a doorstep, they're gonna just spend it. They're gonna enjoy it. They're not gonna say who sent me this money. They're not gonna spend all time and they're like, who sent me this money? See, that's the problem them human perception is to want to know too much, you hear? To observe this reality, right? You're here to enjoy this reality, right? You hear to feel emotions. Both. Fear, pain, all of them. You're here to feel, but you're not here to live in anything.

[Spiritual Theorist]

I'm not supposed to overstand?

[Ankon]

No, you like when you say.

[Spiritual Theorist]

Okay, so my. I grew up in like. I'm not noi or nothing, but my dad taught me like one through nine. Knowledge, wisdom, understanding, you know, all that. Noi, type of information because he came up off that too.

[Ankon]

Right.

[Spiritual Theorist]

But what I'm trying to say is I had a brain fart.

[Ankon]

I ain't gonna lie. No, no, you. You never brain farts. What you just happened is you just switch realities. Right. A lot of people understand it, and it go on in your mind. We switch realities all day. Right. Meant to be said, it probably was, but you just switched realities. Right. But it was said in a different reality. Right. But listen, people don't understand that. A lot of people want this just to be one thing, but if it'd just be one thing, then it'd just be a boring as fuck.

[Christian Debater]

Yeah.

[Ankon]

You can't stay here so long. A lot of people want to say that this is infinite. No, it's not infinite. It's infinite possibilities. Right? A lot of things can happen here infinite amount of times. That's all I'm saying.

[Host]

Thanks for staying all the way to the end, guys. It means a lot to me. If you could please leave a review on Apple. That helps us climb the charts, it helps us get way more guests, and it helps us continue growing the podcast and the team. So it would mean a lot to me if you left a review on Apple or wherever else you're listening. Thanks so much. One of the top debaters on the 1 on 10 series. Thanks for coming, bro.

[Investigative Journalist]

Anytime, brother. How you doing?

[Host]

I'm good. What do you disagree with Ankon?

[Investigative Journalist]

Well, I was reacting to the last prompt about Jesus not being a real person. And I think there's a lot of historical evidence that Jesus actually having existed. I don't know about the 25,000 documents and stuff.

[Host]

It said about 8,000 on the AI.

[Investigative Journalist]

8,000. But, like, you have, like the shroud of tin, for example, you know, where you have something that is a nuclear fusion that happens with this man's body. So it literally prints on the actual fabric, which I don't think there's ever been a human in history that has gone through nuclear fusion. And we're talking about a photocopy from 2000 years ago of this man's body.

[Ankon]

It had the face on there.

[Investigative Journalist]

It had the face. It had the wounds.

[Ankon]

Let me ask one question. The face that was on there. I know what you're talking about. That face looked just like the face that was painted of Jesus. That was not Jesus. That was the face that looked like yours. Right? Because that's the face they put next to it. But that's not Jesus. So whoever that was, it was not Jesus. And that is proven that Jesus didn't have your face because how is that proven? History. They just proved it because where he was from, where he grew up at, and it was hot as hell over there. How the fuck can he be pale? It doesn't make sense.

[Investigative Journalist]

I mean, my ancestors are from places that are Caucasian.

[Ankon]

Her award her of wool. Sorry, I didn't say her of wool.

[Investigative Journalist]

What is that hair?

[Ankon]

Wool. That what Jesus had. Okay, do you have her of wool?

[Investigative Journalist]

What is.

[Ankon]

Do you even have her at all?

[Investigative Journalist]

Oh, I don't actually have them, but.

[Ankon]

No, you don't. I don't understand. So listen, I'm just saying, according to the fact that.

[Investigative Journalist]

What is hair?

[Ankon]

Listen, according to what you said, you believe that Jesus existed. The Bible also gave a description. They told you how Jesus looked. And the blanket that you suggest was Jesus, that also put a face in front of it. The face in front of it was different than the way they described Jesus in your Bible. So who was under that blanket?

[Investigative Journalist]

Well, the question to me is, what's the coincidence that literally 2,000 years ago, right around the time that this dude dies, where he's resurrected, there's an actual.

[Ankon]

You didn't answer the question. Why is the face different?

[Host]

Different.

[Investigative Journalist]

See, but you're already coming to the conclusion that the.

[Ankon]

No, no.

[Historian]

Why?

[Ankon]

No, they took the picture of the face. That's what they did. That's why everybody comes to conclusion. They took the picture of Jesus painting. That was painting, but that was not Jesus. And they took the blanket and they put them together. Listen, the picture with the blonde hair and the blue eyes.

[Investigative Journalist]

But that's not what the shot of turn.

[Ankon]

But that's the one that they put together. That's the one they put together.

[Investigative Journalist]

Arabic looking.

[Ankon]

No, they did not. They showed that same Jesus. Pull it up.

[Investigative Journalist]

Says the shot of turn is very ethnic looking.

[Ankon]

But it's gonna be. It's gonna be a. It's gonna show a white Jesus. I say Chinese people are white too, but the white people won't accept them. Right? Listen, I say that everything pale is white. Right? Everything that don't have hair is white. And everything that don't have hair is human. And it's different for me.

[Christian Debater]

So say right here.

[Ankon]

Yeah, that's not Jesus. I mean, that's the fake Jesus.

[Investigative Journalist]

But like, how does that. How does that line.

[Ankon]

Because that's the fake. Look, look, look. Look at the face. That's the fake one. That's on everything. That's not Jesus. So how can you say that, that that's your proof? I'm seeing get the out of here. But that's the. That's the. Listen, listen.

[Investigative Journalist]

It's not a white man. That's a. There's.

[Ankon]

Do me one favor. Do me one favor. Yeah, do more favor, right? And I'm gonna say this. I'm not telling you that Jesus did not exist. So let's start. Everything that you learn from Jesus, accept it, it's real, right? But what you're trying to describe right now and suggest cannot be accurate. And you got to look at the facts, because that face, right, is a painted face. That is a painted face that do not describe the way it was written in the Bible. And if you describe the way it's written in the Bible and put it beside that face, you will have a difference.

[Investigative Journalist]

So what is that? What is that from 2,000 years ago?

[Ankon]

You got to tell me. I ain't do it.

[Christian Debater]

Right?

[Ankon]

It's not Jesus. Right? It's not Jesus.

[Investigative Journalist]

It's been carbon dated. It's right around the time of the resurrection.

[Host]

It says 1260-1390.

[Ankon]

Listen, the point that doesn't. Listen, look, that doesn't matter. All that. Y' all worrying about the wrong, the only thing that mattered. That's a different face.

[Investigative Journalist]

That's all that matters. Let me ask you this.

[Ankon]

What matters is the face is different, gang. So different. Listen.

[Investigative Journalist]

Different from the perception.

[Ankon]

No, no. No difference between the perception of what they say and who they say is Jesus. When they put that there, they've altered

[Investigative Journalist]

the Bible, that they altered it to make him look a lot more Caucasian than he actually was. Because that man looks like an Arabic Italian. He doesn't look like a white person.

[Ankon]

I'm gonna say it again. White is white, no matter how you put it. But I'm saying that face. Listen, that face is the same painted face that everybody in the world. No.

[Historian]

Now.

[Ankon]

Was a fake picture. So that itself. Who the fuck is that?

[Christian Debater]

Right?

[Ankon]

That's all I'm saying. I'm gonna say this. You gotta understand this. The things that Jesus taught. Like, I don't want people serious. Oh, man. I believe in the things that Jesus taught, right? Jesus taught the kingdom heaven within. Jesus said what I do, all men can do, right? Jesus did not say pray to me. Jesus didn't want to do shit for his mama.

[Christian Debater]

Yeah, right.

[Ankon]

I'm keeping it real. So you gotta understand this. So if you want Jesus, I'm gonna take you to him. But the problem is, it's up your ass.

[Bible Scholar]

Yes.

[Ankon]

Inside you. Right?

[Investigative Journalist]

Well, it's in your kingdom of God is within you. I Don't know. Yeah.

[Ankon]

You ain't never heard the past. You ain't never heard the pastor. You ain't never heard the pastor when Jesus came in me. That's all the past is talking about.

[Investigative Journalist]

All right?

[Ankon]

Jesus coming in them.

[Investigative Journalist]

Your guy was.

[Ankon]

Hallelujah. Thank you, Lord.

[Investigative Journalist]

He's a historical figure. He doesn't really exist.

[Ankon]

No, I'm saying. I'm saying, I'm saying. I'm saying this. I'm saying this. Everything. Do me a favor. I can show you where everything at right now. Everything exists only one place. Even if you close your eyes, it's still there. Everything exists in your mind, whatever you think it is. Right? Jesus consciousness is available to you, but only when you accept it and put it in you. When you take in the sage, say, jesus, help me, and you put it outward, it do no good for you. Right? Because you're begging. I'm not begging for right. Because you gotta understand the universe don't work that way. Because, like, it doesn't matter if you pray a million times. If you go outside and don't look both ways, you're gonna get hit by a car. Prayer won't stop that. Awareness will, right? So everybody is worrying about the wrong thing. Life is about awareness. It ain't about no fucking prayer. You can pray all you want, right? But the fact is you have to be aware and listen if you want there to be Jesus in your mind. All I'm gonna tell you is follow him then.

[Investigative Journalist]

I mean, I don't even care what Jesus looks like. I'm just saying, like, follow him then.

[Ankon]

Listen, we could debate. We could debate about what it looked like. Follow him.

[Investigative Journalist]

Let me ask you this, because your friend was saying that this is not a real person, Jesus, right? Do you agree with that?

[Ankon]

No, he said it's you. Right?

[Investigative Journalist]

Listen, did he physically exist 2000 years ago, is my question.

[Host]

All right.

[Ankon]

Did humans physically exist 2,000 years ago?

[Investigative Journalist]

Yeah.

[Ankon]

Then I suggest. Yes.

[Investigative Journalist]

So I think there was a real Jesus.

[Ankon]

I suggest that Jesus is consciousness. I suggest that everything is Jesus. Right?

[Investigative Journalist]

But did you. Do you think that there was a man that came, like, was crucified, came back to life 2000 years ago? Do you believe in that?

[Ankon]

I believe a lot. I believe a lot of men died, right? I believe crucifixion was the thing that a lot of people did. And I believe that everybody died. Was a man. If you say it was a man. And I believe that everybody had Jesus in them.

[Investigative Journalist]

Jesus came back to life. Do you think. Do you think. Think Jesus Defeated death.

[Ankon]

I think that everybody defeat Death because I think nothing dies.

[Investigative Journalist]

No, no, there's no. Who's defeated Death?

[Ankon]

Everybody.

[Investigative Journalist]

One figure, that's Everybody.

[Ankon]

Everybody. That's a lot. Did you know that? Did you know they got defeated by they. They defeated death like this. So they was in a tomb in Egypt one time and they saw a bug and this bug had ate a plant and it died. And it died and it came back alive in three days. And then after they did that, they made the chemical out of that same and then they died and came back up in three days. Hold up, hold up, hold up. They saw it. They recorded it. They saw it. He died, came back up. Listen, Noah was a female. It was a woman. She died, came back up three days. And when she came back, she was enlightened. It was the resurrection, right? So resurrection happened before Jesus, right? Listen, it's good to die on purpose, right? Listen, I don't think you understand, gang. When you dream, you be in a different reality, but when you die, it's kind of like different, right? But that's the thing, that's a sport, that what people do, that what you did to be enlightened, right? Now it's certain traditions and certain monks that you can't actually get unless you die. Meaning that you astral project, meaning that you take your soul out of your body and you able to look at it. That means you're dead. That it's several levels to this. And I don't think you understand. It's different levels of consciousness, right? And Jesus is a level of consciousness? I'm not saying that, but I'm saying they harness the power of Jesus, right? And wherever Jesus go, the collection play follow. And you paying for a subscription to Jesus? You paying for a subscription to Jesus, gang?

[Investigative Journalist]

I don't know. That's, that's, that's. That's a corruption.

[Ankon]

It's a description.

[Investigative Journalist]

Let me ask you this though, like why, why did. Why do we hear that this man had 12 to 16 disciples? We know he had disciples. We know the disciples traveled all around the Middle east and Near East. We know that, for example, St. Bartholomew landed around the Caucus Mountains, right? The dude got skinned alive because he was a Christian. While he's getting skinned alive, this man is singing him St. Bartholomew, one of the disciples of Jesus. So while this man is getting skinned alive, he's singing hymns to God. So to me, there's something supernatural about that. It ain't like some, you know, person who told you that story, that's a real story.

[Ankon]

Who told you?

[Investigative Journalist]

Look it up.

[Ankon]

I said who told you that?

[Investigative Journalist]

I mean, I've read it in history books. I'm of our.

[Ankon]

In what book?

[Investigative Journalist]

This is the whole story became Christian.

[Ankon]

Okay, and what book and what book did you read it?

[Investigative Journalist]

I mean, these are like manuscripts, Armenian manuscripts. You can look them up. Dude, Google it. Saint Bartholomew.

[Ankon]

No, I'm not asking Google, I'm asking you. And what book did you use it.

[Investigative Journalist]

These are Armenian manuscripts from old Armenian monks that were around. I mean these, this is an ancient culture. So these people are around while this was going on. They have actual testimonials about the same Bartholomew guy literally getting skinned alive.

[Ankon]

Is every book fat? What? What makes a book fat?

[Investigative Journalist]

I mean we could, we could use that standard on everything because we weren't there.

[Ankon]

Like you said. What you. Hold on, go back. You can use that standard on everything. You wasn't there 2,000 years ago. So why the do it matter now?

[Investigative Journalist]

I mean, what to me is like when you have 12 individuals that are. Were ready to be killed and tortured in the most heinous ways.

[Ankon]

That's a lie. Jesus said before the clock crow twice, you would deny me three times. And they denied him. Nobody was ready to die for Jesus, right? The disciples would be ready for die for Jesus. Disciples ran in, hid. No, but then they all ran in here.

[Investigative Journalist]

But then the disciples went around preaching and they all got killed because they were preaching.

[Ankon]

I knew a lot of, I knew a lot of that. Do it in the hood when a gunfire run off, they go back outside when it was drama time. The disciples, that you call disciples, they ran, man. And Jesus knew that they was gonna run according to Jesus.

[Investigative Journalist]

Then he was resurrected.

[Ankon]

Well, showed him that he defeated.

[Investigative Journalist]

If you did that. You ever heard conviction to die for their cause and you don't die for nothing.

[Ankon]

You ever heard, you ever heard of Gnostics?

[Investigative Journalist]

Yeah, of course.

[Ankon]

They got a different story of Jesus resurrection and Jesus being killed. They said Jesus never died. Right. And listen, I'm just saying I don't think you understand. So it's a lot of different stories, a lot of different things you can say. But I think the only thing that matter here today is know you you right? So I think we can all sit here and say, okay, Jesus has some good stories. You think Jesus has a good stories, take them and put it into you. But nothing gonna help you unless you decide to take it right now and move that way right now.

[Investigative Journalist]

No, I believe that. I mean, kingdom of God is within you.

[Ankon]

Yeah, exactly. Jesus never asked nobody to Worship him, ask nobody to pray for him. Never asked none of that.

[Investigative Journalist]

I agree with that.

[Ankon]

Right. So I'm just saying. So when they do that, that's for separation and control, right? The church do that for control. They do it for separation. I'm not saying you shouldn't and believe in Jesus. Everybody should have belief because belief is first believe what man thinks, it's true. But once you believe in Jesus and you truly believe in Jesus, you're gonna understand that that's a myth. But, but that's not going to stop you from understanding that the consciousness is here and that you can tap into it. That ain't gonna stop you from understanding that.

[Investigative Journalist]

I think. Could I segue real quickly?

[Host]

Yeah.

[Investigative Journalist]

The other prompt that like I think ties in with this is are we in a prison planet? I think the answer of that is yes. I think Jesus, Jesus was brought down almost like a kneel from the Matrix. I hate to give a pop culture reference to basically show us that this is all bs. Everything, it's all, you know.

[Ankon]

You know, the problem is with, with Christians and Muslims and even with Rosets out here, they all want to take bits and pieces of everything to try to justify what they believe. Because that's what the brain do. See what the brain do. The brain. Hold up, listen. The brain is going to put together every piece it can to prove you that what you thinking is correct. That's what your brain is programmed, Right? That's your brain itself. See, right now he is getting information from everywhere. He's talking about Jesus existed. But he's going to prove something from over here as a fact. But if you take that, take everything with it and that's also going to prove that he didn't. But he did. But he didn't. So look what I'm saying. But the Matrix, they talking about a movie. So they're going to put Jesus in the movie. So if you could put. So if you could put Jesus in the movie, then Jesus in the movie got to be the same game.

[Investigative Journalist]

No, no.

[Ankon]

Right.

[Christian Debater]

How can you do it?

[Investigative Journalist]

The whole point of the Bible is that this is. We're in the. We're in the. Satan's playing ground. That's what the Bible says. We're in Satan's playing ground. So when you look at something like the Matrix and it's telling you how everything is a fabrication, everything is made to corrupt, everything is made to steal the rules. And you look at our Federal Reserve, that's what that is. That is a complex plan to basically

[Ankon]

make us all so, so the plan.

[Investigative Journalist]

So, and when Jesus came and then you told us. Look man, this is all Matrix.

[Ankon]

Hold up, go back, go back. You said the plan here is to make us all the slaves. So everything here is to make us a slaves.

[Investigative Journalist]

Yeah, 100%.

[Ankon]

How did you hear about Jesus?

[Investigative Journalist]

What do you mean how did I hear?

[Ankon]

How did you hear about it?

[Sean Kelly]

Well,

[Ankon]

how did you hear about it?

[Investigative Journalist]

I mean through family tradition.

[Ankon]

How do they hear about it?

[Investigative Journalist]

My grandma.

[Ankon]

From here?

[Investigative Journalist]

Yeah.

[Ankon]

From the prison.

[Investigative Journalist]

From the prison.

[Ankon]

Everything inside prison is the prison.

[Investigative Journalist]

Because the human you say I'm not excusing. That's what we're trying to do.

[Ankon]

You said that it's a prison. Yeah, right. And, and you said that you heard something from a prison. So you just said everything that you said and agree with everything I said. So why you not sitting over here with me? Come over, sit on my lap.

[Investigative Journalist]

I, I agree with you, except I, I think Jesus was a real person. I think Geo, Jesus was a Neo that came here to teach us that this is all bs, to tell us that the kingdom of God is within us. To break down these walls that humans create to cause constant friction. And that's why.

[Ankon]

Well, well, well. That's crazy, because I'm Jesus. You ain't know that you send across from Jesus. I'm keeping it real. Yeah, right, because people don't understand it. Ask in the hood what I do with some water, some baking soda, right? Ask them in the hood what I do. No, I'm real. Listen, listen. When I'm in the hood, I'm known for creating miracles. I'm Jesus in the hood, right? No, I could turn, I could turn. I could turn one fish to 500 it too. I'm keep real. I can turn. Listen, I'm keeping it real. Everything Jesus did, I can do. But listen, I'm a fisherman of men now. It's a difference. But I can survive there. I can survive everything. I can. I can do miracles. I can do all the things that Jesus did. It's nothing that Jesus did that I couldn't do. Right, but that's what I'm telling you. But you possess the same power. But you want to keep on giving the power to Jesus? So be it then.

[Investigative Journalist]

No, that's not what I think. The kingdom of God is within us, but I think these bodies are not.

[Ankon]

So why does it matter?

[Investigative Journalist]

Because we can't ever, we can't ever become like Jesus. We just can't.

[Ankon]

So listen, so how could you say you believe in Jesus? Jesus said what I Do all men can do.

[Investigative Journalist]

He was. He was with no sin. So already I'm behind the people. Jesus said I probably screwed up a lot.

[Ankon]

Jesus said, what's saying Lie, right? I could prove to everybody because everybody said Jesus didn't sin, but I could prove to everybody. Jesus saying what Jesus tell you is saying liar. Jesus described you what a sin lie at. Jesus said the sin lie in what the thought. Right, Right. Jesus was tested by who? The devil with bad thoughts. Right? That was sinning. Jesus was a sinner too. Right? Because Jesus described you what a sin was. He said after the thought, the moment he was tempted by the devil, he was sinning.

[Investigative Journalist]

Okay, okay, okay, okay. He wasn't tempted though. He still.

[Ankon]

He was tempted because he told him to do it. He, He, He. He knew that it was there. The moment that you know that it's there, you know that the sin there. You know that there is in your mind sin, then you're doing it because that what Jesus suggested. And he said throw the first rock, right? So if you're without, you gotta.

[Host]

Yeah, yeah.

[Ankon]

Because no one is without saying. Not even Jesus.

[Host]

Okay.

[Ankon]

And he documented his sin.

[Host]

Final point then, man.

[Investigative Journalist]

I don't know if I have one, dude. I just think. I just think Jesus was a real. Like, he was Jesus. And I get what you're.

[Ankon]

Jesus was a real sinner like all the rest of us. If he existed.

[Investigative Journalist]

These were other. These were other like you heard other Jesus like characters I've heard about in ancient Egypt, how there was. I still don't think that negates the fact that Jesus was.

[Ankon]

Yeah.

[Investigative Journalist]

And I do believe that the shrouded terrain was sent.

[Ankon]

Let's do me a favor.

[Investigative Journalist]

We can't deny it.

[Ankon]

All right. All right. Do me a favor. Go run tell the church that Jesus sinned too. Because he told. Told the church what a sin was. So he done it too. Right. And what he do all men can do. So just like he could sin, he could be saved. You could be born again. So what Jesus said. I just asked for you to be born again.

[Host]

All right. If you learned anything from this episode or got any value at all, please share this episode with a friend. It helps us grow the channel. It helps us grow the podcast, and it means a lot to us. Thank you so much. First ladies on the show on the one on ten series. Thank you for coming. Being brave.

[Bible Scholar]

Awesome.

[Host]

You wanted to do the first prompt.

[Femininity Coach]

I did.

[Host]

Okay. The Prison Planet one.

[Femininity Coach]

I did.

[Host]

Are you cool with that?

[Bible Scholar]

Oh, yeah. I'll do it on. And then I Wanted to talk about Jesus being the serpent in the guardian Genesis.

[Host]

Yeah, bring that up. Go ahead and start it off.

[Femininity Coach]

So the first prompt is that Earth is a prison planet.

[Host]

And I disagree. You disagree with that? Yeah. Why do you disagree with that?

[Femininity Coach]

Well, I've never been to prison, but.

[Host]

Could you speak louder too?

[Femininity Coach]

Yes, absolutely. So I've never been to prison, but as I understand, you must be sentenced for a crime. So I would want to know, if this is a prison planet, what is. Is the crime that we're sent here?

[Bible Scholar]

Well, like Anka explained it, it's not always that you're having a crime, but you do know that the Bible, because you're a Christian, right?

[Femininity Coach]

I am.

[Bible Scholar]

The Bible tells you that you're born in sin.

[Femininity Coach]

We are.

[Bible Scholar]

So to ask me, what is the sin?

[Femininity Coach]

You're already.

[Bible Scholar]

You should already know. But I don't subscribe to that. Just if we're going to stick in the Bible. The Bible says that you already are sinner when you're born.

[Femininity Coach]

Yes. That's why we need.

[Bible Scholar]

And the Bible tells you that. So. So you answer that question. What is your original sin?

[Femininity Coach]

Well, the original sin came from Adam when Adam and Eve disobeyed God.

[Bible Scholar]

To be honest, I'm glad you brought that up, because Adam and Eve never disobeyed God.

[Femininity Coach]

I understand that's what you think.

[Bible Scholar]

They disobeyed Elohim. That was not God. That was a council of gods or spirits.

[Femininity Coach]

And that. That's fair. And that's fine. You can call him whatever you want to call him.

[Bible Scholar]

So you agreed that wasn't God.

[Femininity Coach]

I don't agree.

[Bible Scholar]

What I'm saying, can you prove that wasn't God? Because I can't.

[Femininity Coach]

I can't prove it and neither can you.

[Bible Scholar]

Oh, yes, I can, actually. In the. In the Hebrew, Elohim is plural for gods. That means there's more than one. That. That leans toward my position that it is a council, not just one. So I prove it that way. And it can also prove that God isn't supposed to lie. But the Elohim did lie in Genesis. Three, actually. In the Genesis. Yes, three. They said, don't eat the fruit, and if you eat it, you'll die.

[Femininity Coach]

Right.

[Bible Scholar]

Adam and Eve didn't die when they ate it. So God can't lie.

[Femininity Coach]

They didn't die immediately, but they did die eventually.

[Bible Scholar]

So do you know in the scripture that it actually says in the day you eat it, in the moment you eat it? Do I need that to too?

[Femininity Coach]

No, I think your voice is loud

[Bible Scholar]

enough oh, my voice. I'm an orbiter. So loud. Could. You could use that. But anyway, the Bible says when you eat it in the moment, you eat it. That's the scripture. You will die. Not later, it doesn't say. Christians have been taught that so you can understand and cope with the lie that's been told to you. That the serpent is evil. So it says you'll die immediately. And at the end of that chapter, the Elohim turned to each other. You know what they say?

[Femininity Coach]

No. Oh, wow.

[Bible Scholar]

They ate it. Now they're gonna be like us. Wait, I thought you said they were gonna die. Now they're gonna be like you. God. So really you just told them you didn't want them to eat it because you didn't want them to be gods?

[Femininity Coach]

Well, I believe that God created us in his image. And he said when he created male and female, it was to reflect Him. We can debate this all day. I don't think you can prove it. Nor can I prove it, because neither of us were there. And that's why it's called.

[Bible Scholar]

Well, wait a minute. I thought you believe in the Bible.

[Femininity Coach]

I do. May I finish?

[Ankon]

Sure.

[Femininity Coach]

Okay. That's why it's called faith. And I had the same questions when I was coming up. If we had all of the answers, we wouldn't need to believe. All of us choose what our faith is. I do believe in the Bible. I do have questions about the Bible. I respect that there were faith faiths before Jesus came. But for me and for my house and for what I what works for me, I believe to follow Christ. Yes, there are discrepancies. Yes, there are things that are painful to read, especially in the Old Testament, but it doesn't mean that for me, it's not true.

[Bible Scholar]

Okay, well, you went into a lot

[Femininity Coach]

of your beliefs, but that's what faith is.

[Bible Scholar]

Yeah, I don't want to go into faith. I want to talk about the Bible.

[Femininity Coach]

I'm not a Bible scholar.

[Bible Scholar]

Okay, then you agree that the Elohim were not God?

[Femininity Coach]

I never said that. I said I believe in the God of the Bible. I understand that you have facts that you really want to prove, but we could do this all day and all night. For me, the life that we are given, the time that we are here on this earth, is to make it better. To use the gifts and talents that we were given. Whatever you believe is to leave this place better than you found it. For me, I promote marriage and family, and I think that's what's a priority. I believe God Told us to, to go forth and multiply and to take dominion of the Earth and to use the resources that he's given us to make it better. So you can spend your life debating biblical facts and that's totally fine. I choose to do otherwise.

[Bible Scholar]

Okay, well, I'm here to actually debate and tell the truth. So let me get back to the prison planet thing.

[Femininity Coach]

Okay.

[Bible Scholar]

You on one hand say you don't think it's a prison planet, right? Because you said you need to a sentence to get into prison.

[Femininity Coach]

As I understand it, when you go to prison, you are convicted of a crime and you are sinning of your time.

[Bible Scholar]

Original sin.

[Femininity Coach]

Yes, the original sin. But when God first created the earth and he created Adam and Eve and humans, he said it was beautiful and he was pleased with his creation. After our choice of sin, then we now have the, the sin and the consequences that come from that. But, but we were not born with sin.

[Bible Scholar]

So you don't agree with the Bible?

[Femininity Coach]

I do agree with the Bible, yes. I have questions about certain things, but I don't believe that prison. I don't believe the earth is a prison. I believe that the life that we have and the earth is what you make of it. You can choose to live a miserable life. You can be in prison in your mind. I choose to look at the blessings that we have, the bountiful goodness that we have, the forgiveness that we have, the grace that we have, have the beauty all of all around us. I really think it's up to you to decide. And that's what I choose.

[Bible Scholar]

Do you think atheists don't look at the beauty and look at the.

[Femininity Coach]

No, absolutely. As far as I know. And I'm not a.

[Bible Scholar]

So it's not exclusive to Christians?

[Femininity Coach]

Absolutely not. And I said that I know that there are several faiths that came before Jesus was here and I respect everybody else's faith. As I understand it, I'm not a religious scholar, but atheists don't believe in the God of the Bible. But you can look at the majesty all around you. You can look at the ocean, you can look at the mountains. You could look at a beautiful flower colors, and you can appreciate that beauty. Okay, Absolutely.

[Bible Scholar]

Well, this isn't really. If you don't debate and you're telling me about all these beautiful things, I don't. Maybe you're not the person I should be talking to because I want to speak to someone who actually would be able to dispute the information that I'm, that I'm presenting. You're not really Disputing anything that I'm saying.

[Femininity Coach]

I'm not trying to convince you.

[Bible Scholar]

That's why it's a choice. Well, that's why I would love you for that. I would to love. Like to speak to someone who wants to dispute the facts that I'm bringing out. If there's anybody else who could.

[Host]

Do you want to make a final statement?

[Femininity Coach]

Yeah. My final statement is that I believe in the God of the Bible. I am a Christian. It is a choice. It is faith. We don't have all the answers, but I believe in promoting marriage and family. And that's why I'm here. And I believe that's what we're supposed to do.

[Bible Scholar]

That's awesome. Is there any Christian here that believes that Jesus is not the serpent in the garden of Genesis 3? Well, you don't. You're not debating me though. You're being super sweet and like, telling me about your feelings about babies and puppies. I want to talk to someone about who will say, yeah, Jesus. Because do you know Jesus? I wanted to talk about Jesus being the serpent in the garden.

[Femininity Coach]

We could have the conversation.

[Bible Scholar]

But did Christ lie at all ever?

[Femininity Coach]

No. The word says that Christ was sinless and that is why he took on our sins. If you believe, I understand that you don't.

[Bible Scholar]

I do believe. Actually, I do. I believe that Jesus is the serpent in the garden. I believe that Jesus is the historicity of Christ. But I know that there are lies being told to you, so you can believe. Otherwise, why would a serpent be evil? How can a serpent even talk?

[Femininity Coach]

I believe in the polarity. For good, there's evil, for up, there's down. For bad, there's good. All right? Right. I don't believe that Jesus is the serpent. The serpent is Satan. Maybe it's a representation. Maybe it's not Satan incarnate, but it is a representation of evil to tempt the woman who then disobeyed God. I do believe that that actually happened.

[Bible Scholar]

Let me explain. Let me explain this to you.

[Ankon]

You can't disobey God.

[Femininity Coach]

I disagree.

[Ankon]

You can't dissipate, can't disobey any. Anything. You are beautiful. Right?

[Femininity Coach]

Well, thank you. I'm not perfect.

[Ankon]

It was God, right? And God was a masculine energy. Feminine existent energy just existed. Just because God was there. You was always there. You are the wisdom, right? You are the light of the world. Everything come from you. But this one thing they did with history. They removed you. Right? Now, everybody that was taught, everybody watching this right now was taught by a woman, right? But in every book, a man that's doing the teaching and the telling. So you're defending man history. She's trying to tell you about yours, right? Because what's inside of you is something way more special than that story. Right? They even track origins around. They do it the wrong way because they track it by men. But men have put you in prison. They have gave you their name. Because to track true origins, they gotta track it from a woman. Because if I have sex with a woman, you don't know if that's my baby. But you know that's baby came from that woman.

[Femininity Coach]

I disagree with you.

[Ankon]

The baby came from the woman. You have a baby right now.

[Femininity Coach]

Yes, I have two sons. That is true. But what if I choose to give my name to my husband?

[Ankon]

But we know the baby. I'm telling you about how they track things. We know for a fact it came from you, right? Now they track back origins right now from the woman DNA, not the man.

[Femininity Coach]

I understand that. However, I am pro masculine and feminine. I don't believe that women are better.

[Bible Scholar]

Of course.

[Ankon]

Woe, man, you woman. That's the connection of both, right? That's connected. Of the masculine, of the feminine.

[Femininity Coach]

Right.

[Ankon]

That's the true essence of what we are.

[Femininity Coach]

Yes, but you said that women are divine and we're perfect.

[Ankon]

That's what we are.

[Femininity Coach]

I disagree.

[Bible Scholar]

I didn't disagree that women are divine and perfect.

[Femininity Coach]

Yes, ma', am. I disagree that.

[Bible Scholar]

But you think. You think that. That Jesus is divine and perfect.

[Femininity Coach]

As a man, I believe Jesus is divine and perfect because he was the son of God, not because he was a man.

[Bible Scholar]

Do you know women were. The woman was the first existence. The feminine was the first existence.

[Femininity Coach]

I disagree.

[Bible Scholar]

Okay, well, you're a woman.

[Femininity Coach]

Yes,

[Ankon]

Adam. Did it say in the Bible that Adam didn't have a belly button?

[Femininity Coach]

I don't think that's in the Bible.

[Ankon]

Did it say. It just said.

[Femininity Coach]

It did not say it.

[Ankon]

Okay, if it didn't say that, then just how you know that Adam came from a woman? Because everything came from a woman. Got a belly button. Listen, you agree with everything. Everybody right now that came here can show you one of these. I understand that everybody can show you one of these.

[Femininity Coach]

Please don't shout. Right, I understand. However, right.

[Ankon]

Everybody got one of those. So listen, so if Adam had one of those. Yes, he came from woman. Everything came from you. And you are beautiful. Find one thing in his existence right now that we can see that didn't come out of woman. Anything in nature.

[Femininity Coach]

Men are here.

[Ankon]

No. Name one Thing in nature, in his history right now that didn't come out of female. Name one thing here now.

[Femininity Coach]

Creation. This.

[Ankon]

No, no. Name one thing here now that didn't come out of female.

[Femininity Coach]

I'm not sure if I'm understanding.

[Ankon]

Let me rephrase. Let me rephrase it.

[Femininity Coach]

Okay.

[Ankon]

Name one baby born.

[Femininity Coach]

Oh, well, of course.

[Ankon]

Hold up. Name one baby born, didn't come out of. Of a woman.

[Femininity Coach]

Of course.

[Ankon]

Okay, now name one animal that was born that didn't come out of women. Hold up, hold up, hold up, hold up, hold up.

[Bible Scholar]

Up. Hold up.

[Ankon]

So woman created and brought everything into

[Femininity Coach]

this existence with the man's seed. If I.

[Ankon]

No women could do it without a man's seed. Listen, Jesus. Jesus was born. Jesus was born without a man's seed. He just say, hold up. You just say the Holy Spirit was a man. The Holy Spirit was a man. Because it entered Mary, right?

[Spiritual Theorist]

Hold up.

[Ankon]

It entered Mary. Yes, Right. The entered means something, right? I don't think you get it right. But you, you gotta understand what you're trying to do. You're trying to take something away from you, but I'm telling you that you are everything. Nothing exists without you.

[Femininity Coach]

I think that's the problem that we have now is telling women that they're everything. That's why.

[Ankon]

No, no, men ain't doing that. Me. And telling women everything based on attachments, based on they need them. I'm telling you so you can be free. I don't want to be attached to you.

[Femininity Coach]

I am.

[Ankon]

Matter of fact, when you leave, I'm never gonna think of you again.

[Femininity Coach]

I understand that. And I won't remember you. I don't even know who you are.

[Ankon]

You do know. You to. You're going to say you don't know who I am right now. I guarantee you my voice going to be stuck with you forever. And I guarantee you you invented my voice.

[Femininity Coach]

I didn't invent anything.

[Ankon]

Close your eyes right now. Now I'mma say something. I'mma say I love you, right? I'mma say. I'm going say I love you right.

[Femininity Coach]

Okay, now.

[Ankon]

Now hear that same thing I just said in your mind.

[Femininity Coach]

Of course I can repeat.

[Ankon]

Can you hear it in my voice?

[Femininity Coach]

Unfortunately, yes.

[Sean Kelly]

Yeah.

[Ankon]

Okay. All right, listen. So, so, so, so, so where did my voice come from? It came from you. Hold up, hold up, hold up, hold up, hold up, hold up. You just said you heard it in your own head. And everything exists in your head. Everything out here come from your head.

[Femininity Coach]

Now, everything exists in you. You're wrong.

[Ankon]

Name one thing I heard didn't come from your head. Name one thing I heard that wasn't a thought.

[Femininity Coach]

Would you like me.

[Ankon]

Name one thing that a thought.

[Femininity Coach]

Would you like me to answer one

[Ankon]

thing that's not a thought, and I'll be done.

[Femininity Coach]

Okay. This table. It started as a thought.

[Ankon]

Okay? Okay. So the thought is the cause of it all. Listen, and inside. Let me tell you something else, okay? This inside of thought.

[Femininity Coach]

Yeah.

[Ankon]

That's where you find perfection, right? Because right now I disagree.

[Femininity Coach]

People think imperfect things all the time.

[Ankon]

Think about a circle in your mind. Think of a square in your mind. Think of a triangle in your mind. Think of building a building in your mind. Anything you think in your mind, you can do it perfectly, right? Oh, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. You can do it perfectly. Perfection exists inside of you, right? And so what I'm trying to tell you is that the moment you put it out here, it becomes a problem. But inside of you, you perfection exists, right? And I just want to say that. I just want to say that you're a beautiful woman and that.

[Femininity Coach]

Well, thank you for the.

[Ankon]

You should understand that.

[Femininity Coach]

I think that's interesting that you think I'm too sweet and you don't want

[Bible Scholar]

to be here people who are not as nice and sweet as you.

[Femininity Coach]

I think that's a problem. That is a good thing. If I may just respond to what Mr. Unc said as far as creation. I just want to say, because I believe in the Bible and again, because it is a choice and because it is his faith, God created the first man and the first woman and the first of each species.

[Ankon]

I just asked you if God created the first man, did it have a belly button? If it had a belly button, then God didn't create it. It came out of woman.

[Femininity Coach]

Okay? I don't know and neither do you. I do know you saw Adam's belly.

[Ankon]

Listen, because that'd be something that they will have to tell you. That would be something.

[Femininity Coach]

No, they don't.

[Ankon]

They describe what Jesus looked like. They described everything else. That'll be something that they have.

[Femininity Coach]

But every church that you go to has a different representation of.

[Ankon]

Well, science has got another thing happen. Do you know what happened to a baby Right now you're a woman, but did you know? And in about four weeks that was inside your belly is actually a fish.

[Femininity Coach]

No, you're wrong.

[Ankon]

The eyes is on the side of the head like this. Listen, listen, listen. Listen to me. The eyes on the side of the head like this. I understand what you're Saying inside water. Right? It's inside of water. Right.

[Femininity Coach]

But it's not.

[Ankon]

Listen. And everything on earth right now started from a fish. But it was a jawless fish.

[Femininity Coach]

I disagree.

[Ankon]

It was a jawless fish. Everything started from a jawless fish.

[Femininity Coach]

We disagree.

[Ankon]

Oh, okay. We disagree. Even AI gonna say this right? Because this shit's the truth. Right? It's called.

[Femininity Coach]

Please don't.

[Investigative Journalist]

Science.

[Femininity Coach]

No, I understand science. I understand an evolution.

[Bible Scholar]

What we're talking about is. Okay. Actually, you're a very nice lady.

[Femininity Coach]

Thank you. I teach femininity.

[Investigative Journalist]

Are.

[Bible Scholar]

Oh, do you teach femininity?

[Femininity Coach]

I do.

[Bible Scholar]

How can you. Why do you have to teach femininity?

[Femininity Coach]

Because women have lost it today.

[Bible Scholar]

How did they lose it?

[Femininity Coach]

Because they're trying to compete with men as men, and we've lost our femininity.

[Bible Scholar]

Do you think femininity is just talking like this?

[Femininity Coach]

Absolutely not. That's not me at all.

[Bible Scholar]

No. When you say that women have been fierce. There's. You're African.

[Femininity Coach]

I am.

[Bible Scholar]

Do you know they're fierce African warrior.

[Femininity Coach]

Absolutely. But they're still feminine.

[Bible Scholar]

How are they feminine when they were slicing people's heads off, ripping them them apart? You know what you're saying? You teach femininity. I didn't gamble and say that. You teach them not to do those things.

[Femininity Coach]

Well, people do what they have to do in the time that they live to survive. There was a time when we had to grow our own crops and slaughter our animals. We don't do that anymore.

[Bible Scholar]

They don't have to survive today.

[Femininity Coach]

I didn't say that. What? I said that.

[Bible Scholar]

You said women lost it today.

[Femininity Coach]

I said women lost their femininity. Please don't speak for me.

[Bible Scholar]

No, you said women lost their femininity today. And I said, you're from Africa.

[Femininity Coach]

I am warriors. Women were had to do it back then. Not only day.

[Bible Scholar]

You said they don't. They don't have to do it now. They don't have to survive women.

[Femininity Coach]

What I said is we all did what we had to survive in the time that we were living. If I may finish.

[Bible Scholar]

No, you can finish. I'm asking you, do they do it today?

[Femininity Coach]

Yes.

[Bible Scholar]

So you teach femininity?

[Femininity Coach]

I do.

[Bible Scholar]

Teach women that they should be sweet and kind or be warriors.

[Femininity Coach]

I teach women that they shouldn't be men.

[Bible Scholar]

Wait a minute. It. Do you teach them be sweet and kind or do you teach them to be warriors?

[Femininity Coach]

If you want to be a woman fights a man. I wasn't finished.

[Bible Scholar]

Ask you.

[Femininity Coach]

I got.

[Bible Scholar]

Because Nice. Niceness. Throw me off.

[Femininity Coach]

Yeah. Struggling that you're bothered by it because

[Bible Scholar]

you said you teach femininity. A woman is fighting.

[Femininity Coach]

Women say that's manly or it is. It's very masculine.

[Bible Scholar]

Manly. It is our warriors today. And they don't have to survive today, but in the past when they were warriors. It's okay.

[Femininity Coach]

Okay. If I may answer you again. We all do what we have to do to survive. There was a time when we had to grow our own crops and slaughter our own animals. I don't know if you're a mother. I'll speak for myself.

[Bible Scholar]

I have two boys. I'm talking about warriors, not farmers, not husbandry warriors.

[Femininity Coach]

If I may answer.

[Sean Kelly]

Sure.

[Bible Scholar]

Answer please. I'm waiting.

[Femininity Coach]

I consider myself a very kind and non violent person. However, cross me about my boys, it'll be a very different story. So if you're in whatever I have to. Not in that moment.

[Bible Scholar]

Masculine to fight.

[Femininity Coach]

Absolutely.

[Bible Scholar]

Oh, so women can't fight.

[Femininity Coach]

I never said that. I never said that.

[Bible Scholar]

You did. There were women feeling to fight.

[Femininity Coach]

It is masculine to fight.

[Bible Scholar]

Women can't fight or they're manly.

[Femininity Coach]

You can be a woman and have masculine moments. I'll give you an example. I'm a boy, mom. There are times when I have to say, hey, get over here. Manly in that moment, yes.

[Bible Scholar]

But when I'm with teaching femininity. If you're manly.

[Femininity Coach]

Because my man will not be man

[Bible Scholar]

when you need to.

[Femininity Coach]

And so can you. No, absolutely. What I'm saying is the women who come to me want to be in a relationship with a masculine man. A masculine man requires a feminine woman, full stop. All right. So if you want to be with the masculine man, oftentimes women today do not realize how masculine they have become. I'll give you another real world example. I'm a former executive. When you have to lead people and manage budgets and. And do all these things with millions, you take on that masculine energy and you don't know sometimes how to turn it off and be nice and sweet. When you're in a nurturing mode, when you're with your husband, who's the governor of that?

[Bible Scholar]

Who decides? You. Because you're a femininity coach. So you decide that when women are ready to be manly, they can be manly. You're calling it man. You call it manly. To be assertive. You call it man.

[Femininity Coach]

It is.

[Bible Scholar]

Let's see. See. So you can decide because you're for me. But you're. You're. There are so many women. There's people.

[Femininity Coach]

And not everybody is my student.

[Bible Scholar]

How do you get to be an authority on who's feminine and who's not.

[Femininity Coach]

I'm not the authority for everyone femininity coach. I am. When women come to me.

[Bible Scholar]

Sorry to you.

[Femininity Coach]

No, you shouldn't. Because they want what I have. She listen to you. Thank you.

[Bible Scholar]

She said it. No, I said you don't know anything about femininity. Cuz femininity isn't being nice. And guess what? Femininity is about fighting.

[Femininity Coach]

Fighting because I disagree.

[Bible Scholar]

Because guess what? Females lions fight to the death while the, while the male sits back. Women and mothers like you said, fight for their children. You said it's manly to fight. It is not. Which one is it?

[Femininity Coach]

Nobody is feminine 100 of the time. And if a man, if a man loses a family member and he is heartbroken and crying, that is not a masculine moment. That is.

[Bible Scholar]

I think we need to redefine all. We need to redefine that crying is not not being masculine. We need to redefine that being fighting isn't. Isn't not being feminine. That's the problem.

[Femininity Coach]

You can do social thing. You can define it however you want to. All I'm saying is there is a natural biology.

[Bible Scholar]

Is it.

[Femininity Coach]

Is it wrong for your.

[Bible Scholar]

Is it wrong for your sons to cry if they.

[Femininity Coach]

Absolutely not.

[Bible Scholar]

Turtle dies. Absolutely not. Is it wrong if your son gets hit by another person? He cries and they say you're a. That's absolutely by your standards. He's being feminine. Crying.

[Femininity Coach]

If he's a boy, that's expected. If he's a man, absolutely not. He'll defend.

[Bible Scholar]

Man gets punched in the face and it's.

[Femininity Coach]

He's going to punch you back.

[Bible Scholar]

So wait, men can't cry.

[Femininity Coach]

I never said that. Are you listening? No, I said we are not masculine 100% of the time and we are not feminine 100% of the time. Whoever, whatever outcome the woman wants. The women that come to me because you said I shouldn't be the authority. I am not the authority. I am just a mom on the Internet, right? But women come to me because they want what I have. They see something in me that they do not see in somebody like you. And they say, you know what, Maggie? I would love to have a relationship like yours. I would love to be able to communicate like you. I would like to be able to keep my composure like you. I would love to be able to have respect of men that do not know me. How can I do that? I see.

[Ankon]

Give them everything you got. Got then. Because the only way you can do it because no Matter what you do. Hold up. You just said they come to you and they say they love everything that you got. So if you want to help them, give them everything that you got.

[Femininity Coach]

I do.

[Ankon]

Hold up. No, give them everything. You should have nothing left for yourself.

[Femininity Coach]

No, that's not true.

[Ankon]

Yeah, if you gave them everything, if they like everything that you like. If I like your shirt and you give me your shirt, you have no other shirt, right? Right. If you gave me a shirt right now, you'll be shirtless.

[Femininity Coach]

That is true.

[Ankon]

So that's what I'm saying. So what I'm saying is that you are fighting for things and it's also of a talk. You're beautiful, I love you. I love everything you said. I'm going say this. I cry all the time. I cry before I started.

[Bible Scholar]

You're masc.

[Ankon]

But I'm masculine and femininity, they exist together.

[Femininity Coach]

Yes, it's pol. It's called polarity. We do agree, right?

[Ankon]

I don't want a woman. A lot of men want a submissive woman. I don't want a submissive woman.

[Host]

I want.

[Femininity Coach]

You're not a masculine man.

[Ankon]

Listen, let me say this, Let me say this. Let me tell you this. I. I'm. I'm something that you probably don't understand, right? A master is going to tell you what to do. They're going to attach you, they're going to try to hold you down. Listen to me, hold up. Listen to me. Listen to me. I exist in both. I'm both masculine and feminine, right? Because I understand the duality of both. I understand that my mind have a left and a right side. I activate them both, right? So I'm going to say this. I'm not here here to tell you what you should do, right? I'm not going to divine what's masculinity to you and what is not. But I don't want to submissive woman. Because once you tell a woman to submit to you, that's me telling the woman that I'm above her. I'm not above no woman. I hold up. If that's the case, when a child come out, then the mother should automatically submit to the child. If the child is a male. Hold up. Because you're suggesting that I am above you, right? That you look, listen, I'm gonna say this. You're in prison. And listen, I'm say this.

[Femininity Coach]

I'm happy.

[Ankon]

Listen to me, you're in prison. Your man is fine what you do. And that's a life that you shouldn't want. To live because you listen. You have been programmed to believe that submitting is something that you want to do. But in reality, in your mind, right now, right now, right now. I know what you're doing right now. You're wearing what they call a mask. Right now. You're doing this.

[Femininity Coach]

Then who You. Then who's the real me?

[Ankon]

Oh, I could just. Actual husband. He'll tell you when you mad.

[Bible Scholar]

Yeah.

[Investigative Journalist]

Yeah.

[Ankon]

That's what you do. And that's who the you is. And you want to seriously act like that's not who the. Shut the up. Talking while I'm talking. Don't you talk again. Why the are you talking?

[Femininity Coach]

No, why are you talking? Because. Are you gonna be disrespectful? I was respectful.

[Ankon]

There you go. It's not about respect. It's the fact that you holding it. No, you're still holding in because it's called yourself. No, no, you should set up yourself. No, you're bottling it in. When you leave, know you're gonna say that. Ain't there yelling at me. He's doing all this.

[Femininity Coach]

I don't have to say it because you made an.

[Bible Scholar]

You made a great point.

[Femininity Coach]

You made.

[Bible Scholar]

You're not being yourself. You don't know me.

[Femininity Coach]

No, you don't know me at all.

[Bible Scholar]

You're a human being. And I know that you're. The way you're reacting to someone, doing that is not natural.

[Femininity Coach]

It's called composure.

[Bible Scholar]

No, it's called you're being.

[Ankon]

Shaking.

[Bible Scholar]

Shaking, ma'. Am. Who is shaking? Oh, she's shaking you.

[Ankon]

I'm sorry that you're angry a minute.

[Femininity Coach]

I am not angry because I don't respect you. I don't respect you.

[Ankon]

Go where you respect it. You can't get respect.

[Femininity Coach]

Listen, you can shout at me, but I don't even know you. You shouted at me and you slammed the table.

[Ankon]

You say, listen. You disrespected me. Since you've been here, you say I would.

[Femininity Coach]

How did I disagree? Oh, yeah. I said you're not a masculine man. Up.

[Ankon]

Everything that you said was disrespect, but you listen. Everything I said to you was polite, was giving you nothing but love, Right? But the moment I said something you didn't like, you're gonna say the disrespect, but you never acknowledge what I said. Something good to you.

[Femininity Coach]

But you said.

[Ankon]

You never announced it.

[Bible Scholar]

Hold up.

[Femininity Coach]

Stop.

[Ankon]

Hold up.

[Bible Scholar]

You never.

[Ankon]

You never acknowledge when I said something good to you, but the moment I say something you don't like, you acknowledge that. But that's how people is in the world they acknowledge was bad. They never acknowledge what they configure is good.

[Femininity Coach]

Okay, may I speak?

[Ankon]

Why?

[Bible Scholar]

Because.

[Ankon]

Why? Why should I allow you to speak when you won't even accept my kindness?

[Femininity Coach]

I did. When you gave me the compliment. I said thank you, but you told me you loved me. And I said, you don't even know.

[Ankon]

Find love. Love is both. Listen, I'm say this. You don't think you know love. I don't know. I know you don't know love because love is.

[Femininity Coach]

I am so loved.

[Ankon]

If you were so loved, then. Then everybody you love, you never was mad at.

[Femininity Coach]

That's not true.

[Ankon]

So love is mad is an emotion. So love exists. And all the emotions I love. So you can't determine whether I love you or not. You can't determine that.

[Femininity Coach]

If I may speak. I think when you love somebody, you're actually madder at them than someone you don't love. Take your children, right? If your children disobey you, if you see a kid acting out in the store, falling out, you're like, well, there they go. But if you see your kid misbehaving, you're even angrier because you want a better outcome for them.

[Ankon]

Because if I see my kid fall, I'm not gonna think that you're trying to make me in your reality. This is what I'm saying. Saying love is unconditional. It. No matter what you do to me, no matter. Listen. No matter what you do to me, no matter what I do to you, love will still be there, right?

[Sean Kelly]

That's.

[Ankon]

That's true love. That's true love, right? Fake love. Become determined by. You do this, I give you love. You do this, I give you this, right? That's fake. Real love exists inside of everything. If it's real love, I agree.

[Femininity Coach]

But I do think it has to be earned and I think it has to. Has to be maintained.

[Ankon]

I ain't earning no love from nobody. That's fine because like, if you got to earn it, you going to have to continue earning it.

[Bible Scholar]

Newborn have to earn love when it comes out of your womb.

[Femininity Coach]

For children, it's different.

[Bible Scholar]

However, you see how you have. Different. Different.

[Femininity Coach]

No, but. Well, thank you. I appreciate the compliment. I was just going to say this. I focus on. Okay. I focus on relationships, children aside, right? Because they come how they come, right? That's just again my faith, the purity of an. Of a baby being born. Let's talk about relationships because that's something that I'm passionate about. I Can love my man, but if he doesn't continue to do the things that make me love him, that love is going to fade. We have to. That's why it's called keeping the. Keeping the home fires burning. I think as women, that is our responsibility. That's part of our nurturing a relationship is not just going to be beautiful and bright just because I told you one time that I love you. If I'm not doing those loving things, you're gonna feel slighted from me. And over time, that love will fade. How many times have we heard people say we fell out of love? Or it's just not there anymore because we didn't put the work in to maintain it?

[Ankon]

They never loved you in the first place. Cause you said. Listen, listen. If you. I'm saying. I'm say this, okay? If you love somebody.

[Femininity Coach]

Yes.

[Ankon]

Love never leaves.

[Femininity Coach]

That's true.

[Ankon]

The moment it leaves, it never was love. So I'm gonna say this, right? People confuse love with attachments. Meaning that if you sit here, if you do everything I tell you to do, then I can give you my love. But the moment you leave, that love disappears. The moment you disobey me, that love disappears. So that, I believe, is not love. The true love that you said, that we both agree on, all of us, that when the baby came in, they got that love.

[Host]

That's true.

[Ankon]

So I say that when you love somebody, it should be that love. And if it's not that love, then it's not love at all.

[Femininity Coach]

That's fair. I agree with you. And even the Bible that neither of you agree with has different.

[Ankon]

I never say I ain't agree with the Bible.

[Femininity Coach]

Okay, My. My m. My mistake, then.

[Ankon]

I agree.

[Femininity Coach]

I believe it's Greek, and I'm not a Bible scholar, but I believe it's Greek that has different words for different types of love. Right, Roman? Right. So there's.

[Bible Scholar]

There's. There's agape love, right? And then we have philo love.

[Femininity Coach]

Right? Brotherly.

[Bible Scholar]

So this is the thing I'm trying to understand with you, okay? Are you. You do femininity coaching?

[Femininity Coach]

Yes.

[Bible Scholar]

You. You say, well, if my husband keeps on doing everything, fine, that's great, but if he stops loving me, do you stop submitting or what do you.

[Femininity Coach]

Do?

[Bible Scholar]

You just go and start, I think, submission, everything.

[Femininity Coach]

I think submission is a choice. What I'm saying is that when you love someone, when you're in a relationship, you have to nurture that. Take any relationship. We'll put love, relationships to the side. You can't Be a good employee and not show up. You can't be a good mother, sister, friend. You have to continue to do the things that bring that relationship closer. So yes, if your husband stops doing the things. If your wife stops sleeping with you.

[Bible Scholar]

I want to go back to the mother thing.

[Ankon]

She watching this? I haven't slept with her about 13 months. To this day, she slept, still will not leave. This is true.

[Femininity Coach]

I believe you.

[Bible Scholar]

Oh, I know that's true.

[Investigative Journalist]

This is true.

[Femininity Coach]

I believe you.

[Ankon]

I'm saying this was a choice that I made.

[Femininity Coach]

I understand the choice that I made.

[Ankon]

Don't say I don't love someone because I don't want to stick my dick in them.

[Femininity Coach]

Can you speak to me without swearing?

[Ankon]

Here's the thing, right? I could speak to you without swearing if you could speak to me as you.

[Femininity Coach]

I don't know what you mean by that.

[Christian Debater]

You.

[Ankon]

Before you decide you to become a femininity coach and decided that you knew everything.

[Femininity Coach]

Oh, when I was. I never said I know everything. I took my own courses like you

[Ankon]

was before you start speaking like that

[Femininity Coach]

and well, that cost me my. My marriage.

[Ankon]

Here's the thing that didn't cost your marriage. Your husband left you because he didn't see who you was. Listen, I'm tell you if you lost, you never lost, right? Because you are whole. I'm sorry, I don't want to cuss cuz you say. Don't cuss the pr. I'll say this. You were beautiful. You never lost nothing. Nothing. Never cost you nothing.

[Femininity Coach]

But how do you know if you weren't there?

[Ankon]

You are beautiful. Listen, because everything. Listen, I'm saying this. Anything that come from you is beautiful. Yes, you probably made mistakes. Everything make mistakes. But if somebody.

[Femininity Coach]

No, I'm a sinner. I'm a hopeless sinner.

[Ankon]

No, you're not. You're not sinner is a sine wave. You was born in a wave of energy, right? The words have been changed and things are different.

[Femininity Coach]

I have. I have made mistakes.

[Ankon]

You submissing, you submitting to a God, you submitting to a man, you living your like submitting.

[Femininity Coach]

And I am so happy because men are leaders.

[Bible Scholar]

Say this. When you sat down, you said why? Why are we in a prison if we didn't do any. Any crime? But you admit to being sinner, right? And sin is a crime. So that's why you're in a prison planet. Well, you want to go by that?

[Femininity Coach]

Okay.

[Bible Scholar]

Being in a prison planet isn't just about sin though. There's nothing inside of. He said there's nothing inside of that body.

[Femininity Coach]

Oh my doctor would beg to disagree, but okay.

[Bible Scholar]

I mean, I mean there's. If you're not a Bible scholar, I'm usually, you know, wanting to talk to people who know a little bit more about the language and the, the actual Bible.

[Femininity Coach]

But how is that helping you debating?

[Bible Scholar]

Oh, it helps a lot because I can I uncover the esoteric of the Bible. People have been taught that Jesus is a serpent, that the serpent's evil. When you tell people no, the serpent isn't evil. The whole you start.

[Femininity Coach]

I never said that. Oh, I'm so you're talking about yourself.

[Bible Scholar]

Programs, okay? The programs that tell you that you have to keep sitting here and talking like this. Would you believe because the Bible tells you you're supposed to submit, you're weaker, you're lower, you do what men say. So if you knew that there were certain things in the Bible that programmed your mind to not be naturally yourself, I would help you. So me showing people that Jesus is the serpent in the garden of Genesis 3 helps people say oh, I'm breaking the. Just like in the Matrix. Once you saw that one thing, Neo started breaking the program.

[Femininity Coach]

I disagree with you.

[Bible Scholar]

What would actually be helping you disagree with me?

[Femininity Coach]

Well, what would be helpful?

[Bible Scholar]

Give me a reason. Why you just wait. Why?

[Femininity Coach]

I love watching dishes.

[Bible Scholar]

Why do you disagree?

[Femininity Coach]

What would be helpful is if you didn't mock me. All right.

[Bible Scholar]

When you try passive aggressive.

[Femininity Coach]

No, I'm being honest with you. Okay. You can, you can believe whatever you want to.

[Bible Scholar]

I don't know how I ever mocked you.

[Femininity Coach]

Go ahead. When you.

[Bible Scholar]

I'm trying to be super nice nice with you because you seem very sweet.

[Femininity Coach]

I am. Here's the thing. I think you're projecting because now I'm projecting. Yeah. If I may finish. When this man yelled at me and I did not react in kind, you could not believe that because you could not see yourself being shouted at and maintaining your composure. So when you look at me doing that.

[Bible Scholar]

Now you're projecting.

[Femininity Coach]

Okay, okay. You are telling me that I'm not my true self because I'm feminine and because I'm sweet. Would you believe that I'm happier this way? When I was a boss babe.

[Bible Scholar]

Feminine. I don't. I know femininity. You're not being feminine.

[Femininity Coach]

I would ask the masculine.

[Bible Scholar]

You're being a. And you're pretending you're a pretender. Cuz you've been taught. Femininity is talking like this pearls saying I am not going to do that. That's not Feminine. Feminine is. This is.

[Femininity Coach]

You know, femininity is supporting.

[Bible Scholar]

Let me get this out.

[Femininity Coach]

Okay.

[Bible Scholar]

You've had a child.

[Femininity Coach]

Yes.

[Bible Scholar]

Two children.

[Femininity Coach]

Yes.

[Bible Scholar]

That's one of the most painful experiences in life.

[Femininity Coach]

And beautiful.

[Bible Scholar]

Act it big. We just came here. We're together.

[Femininity Coach]

Okay?

[Bible Scholar]

It's beautiful. But guess what? It's fierce. It's violence. It's pain.

[Femininity Coach]

There's blood and it's in the Bible.

[Bible Scholar]

Say that's not feminine.

[Femininity Coach]

I never said that. Didn't I just say that?

[Bible Scholar]

Having a contraction. I'm fine.

[Femininity Coach]

I don't remember you being there.

[Bible Scholar]

You're not feminine. You. But you said you're making. We need to focus on what is feminine. Feminine is the beginning. It's the fierceness. It's. It's the darkness. Hold.

[Femininity Coach]

I think you're talking about being a feminist.

[Bible Scholar]

Darkness only.

[Femininity Coach]

If I may respond. Okay.

[Bible Scholar]

It's the darkness in the water. Life. It's not just the womb. We can look at the microcosm of the womb. The waters in the womb. I know you confused. That's why you're looking around. Listen to me, though. I'm here with you. I love you. I do. Because I want you to know. The womb is a darkness in the water. Life began in the darkness of the water. Your Bible says life began in darkness. That's the water that's not sitting here and going. It's scary.

[Femininity Coach]

Please don't mock me.

[Bible Scholar]

No, I have to. It's scary.

[Femininity Coach]

No, you don't.

[Bible Scholar]

You can make your point without disrespecting very volatile chaos.

[Femininity Coach]

Why are you so scared?

[Bible Scholar]

No, no. I'm trying to tell you. It's feminine. Feminine is that. That is the core of femininity.

[Femininity Coach]

I disagree.

[Bible Scholar]

Isn't. I'm just going to mute out now. Femininity is roaring. That roaring that he did.

[Femininity Coach]

I disagree.

[Bible Scholar]

Feminine side. That.

[Femininity Coach]

No, that's an emotional man having an outburst.

[Bible Scholar]

My friend. My friend. The. The part that you're hearing when a woman is having. Giving birth, she's yelling. Absolutely.

[Femininity Coach]

I was there.

[Bible Scholar]

So you equate that with masculine.

[Femininity Coach]

No, that's not what I said at all.

[Bible Scholar]

Having. Masculine.

[Femininity Coach]

Okay, I'll wait when you're finished.

[Bible Scholar]

Yes.

[Investigative Journalist]

I need you to.

[Bible Scholar]

I need you not to just listen. I heard it.

[Ankon]

That real voice.

[Investigative Journalist]

You said. Hold up.

[Ankon]

Your real voice came. Please do it again. Your real voice just came out and we all heard it.

[Femininity Coach]

I'm waiting to.

[Ankon]

No, I know. I've been waiting for that voice for a long time. And I finally heard you. I love you and y' all never Cuss again.

[Femininity Coach]

Thank you.

[Ankon]

I heard you. Now, I've been here trying to figure out who you was. And I heard that voice. Okay, Only for a quick. There I go again.

[Femininity Coach]

Okay, but here's the thing. I said in the very beginning, there are times when.

[Ankon]

Give me that voice again, please.

[Femininity Coach]

I don't. I'm sorry I missed it. But what I'm saying, because you've been.

[Ankon]

Listen, you missed it because you have bottled you up, right? You bottles you up. That voice has just came outside of you. That's you.

[Spiritual Theorist]

Could you.

[Femininity Coach]

How about that?

[Historian]

Please Let me.

[Femininity Coach]

Have you ever gotten feedback that someone didn't like something and you wanted to be better for that someone and so you improved yourself?

[Ankon]

You can't prove yourself. That's what I'm saying. Let me tell you something. You can't approve yourself. When you came in this world, you was perfect.

[Femininity Coach]

I disagree.

[Ankon]

Listen, because you came in this world, you're gonna die the same way you came. Listen. Nameless. No one's gonna remember you.

[Femininity Coach]

I disagree. I have a legacy. What's yours?

[Ankon]

I'm gonna tell you this, all right? You don't have a legacy.

[Femininity Coach]

You don't know that.

[Ankon]

I'm gonna tell you how I know.

[Femininity Coach]

I never said that.

[Ankon]

I said, what is your to you? Right?

[Femininity Coach]

Okay.

[Ankon]

Because right now, in this history, everybody watching this, they're going to say who they grandma is. They're going to say their great grandma is. They can't say who they great, great, great grandma is. They forget. People can't even tell you. We argue a lot about Jesus. There's only a few people that we remember. No one's going to remember you. The only thing.

[Femininity Coach]

I disagree.

[Ankon]

Listen, no one's going to remember you. The only thing that matter is.

[Femininity Coach]

Maybe you don't want anybody to remember. I do.

[Ankon]

I want everybody to remember you. Listen, I want everybody to remember you. You attack attached to something. You attached to doing something. That's not going to work. You. When you get to the.

[Femininity Coach]

I think it is working.

[Ankon]

How is it going to work when no one's going to remember you? No, if you die right now, he's gonna go get some more.

[Femininity Coach]

I thought you said you weren't gonna say.

[Ankon]

I said if you die. If he. If you die is not a square word.

[Femininity Coach]

Yeah, but do you have any.

[Ankon]

Not a square word.

[Bible Scholar]

Do you.

[Femininity Coach]

A square vagina. Do you have any other use of the English language?

[Ankon]

Sex?

[Bible Scholar]

Yes.

[Ankon]

Right? No. No. A masculine man. Man don't run around just getting sex. That's.

[Femininity Coach]

But you said if I die.

[Ankon]

No, it don't matter. It don't matter because I'm going say this.

[Femininity Coach]

Yes, I'm g. Say.

[Ankon]

I'm g. Say this. I'm going say this to you. And I'm not going to argue with you. I'm just going to say this.

[Femininity Coach]

I'm not arguing.

[Ankon]

I'm going say this. Whatever happened in your first relationship, right to where he told you, right. You talk too much or you talk too much or you talk back, and he made you think that you wasn't acting the way a man. A woman should act. I'm gonna tell you, that wasn't a man because. Listen, listen. A man can accept a person opinion, a person's mind. A man can sit down and have a conversation with a woman.

[Femininity Coach]

We've been doing that here. And I believe that I've been very effective communicating without shouting, without swearing. I did want to take a moment because you told me I wasn't feminine, and there's a lot of men in the room.

[Ankon]

You are feminine.

[Femininity Coach]

Can I please.

[Ankon]

You too feminine.

[Bible Scholar]

Now it makes sense. I didn't know you were this femininity.

[Ankon]

You too feminine.

[Femininity Coach]

You're too feminine because you're not masculine.

[Ankon]

No, you're too feminine because. Don't know. Listen. Because half the men. Listen, the men out here right now.

[Femininity Coach]

I was gonna ask. Okay, I don't know.

[Ankon]

No, no, no. I'll say. The men that you're looking at in the world, the men in the world, they're not masculine because. Listen, they run around and they doing things. Everybody is both mixed. What I'm saying is that you.

[Femininity Coach]

Yes, we agree with that. Thank you for the compliment.

[Bible Scholar]

Point.

[Femininity Coach]

Final point. Well, it was a pleasure talking to you both, and I appreciate having the

[Bible Scholar]

debate, but Jesus is the serpent in the garden of Genesis 3.

[Femininity Coach]

You can believe whatever you want to. He asked me to make my final point. Okay. Thank you.

[Bible Scholar]

I just wanted to stay in character for you, you know, the. The feminist masculine lady.

[Femininity Coach]

You're doing a perfect job.

[Historian]

I know.

[Bible Scholar]

I thought you. I knew you thought that.

[Femininity Coach]

Yes, absolutely. Okay, so my. My final thought is, faith is something that we choose. We don't have all of the answers. Even the Bible says, I set before you life and death. Choose whatever you want to choose. That's fine. I'm not here to convince you. I believe in a masculine man, a feminine woman, marriage, children and family. I think that's the only thing that's going to keep this planet going. If you choose to believe it's a prison planet, that's fine. I see I see the beauty in every day and I'm grateful for an opportunity to, to, to. To live and enjoy it.

[Host]

Beautiful. All right, thanks for watching to the end, guys. Please comment below your thoughts on the episode.

[Spiritual Theorist]

If you agree.

[Host]

If you disagree, I'd love to hear it. I read every single comment. Means a lot to me. Thank you so much.

[Bible Scholar]

So Jesus is a serpent in the garden of Genesis 3.

[Christian Debater]

Okay, and where. Where are you basing that off of?

[Bible Scholar]

The Elohim said that they should not eat the fruit.

[Christian Debater]

Yes.

[Bible Scholar]

Or they will die.

[Christian Debater]

Yes.

[Bible Scholar]

That was a lie. God can't lie die. The serpent is the only one who led them to the truth. If you look at Christ, he leads us to the truth.

[Christian Debater]

Is Adam and Eve still alive now?

[Bible Scholar]

Yeah. You're. You're part of Adam and Eve?

[Christian Debater]

No. No. But they died, right? Adam and Eve did die. They were going to have eternal life on earth until they ate that apple.

[Bible Scholar]

In the text, though, we're talking about

[Christian Debater]

the Bible in the text. Yeah.

[Bible Scholar]

Not our feelings.

[Christian Debater]

They said you were surely died.

[Bible Scholar]

We did feelings. Now we're going to do the Bible and we're going to do text, right?

[Christian Debater]

Yeah, go ahead.

[Bible Scholar]

I. I'm listening to you reference in the Bible. The text. The Hebrew text says when you eat it, you will die.

[Christian Debater]

You will surely die.

[Bible Scholar]

You will surely die. Not. Hey, in about 900 years, you guys are going to be toast. They're dying, right? They say you're going to die right after you eat it.

[Christian Debater]

That is the interpretation that you're going with and saying that they're going to die immediately. It did not say immediately they were going to live. And there was not going to be anything that was going to cause death to. To them. It's something that broke down their genetic build that they were already blessed with. So when you're saying that it's not a lie and the serpent wasn't the one that told them that. The serpent told them God doesn't want you to eat it because you're going to unlock extra knowledge. They did unlock that extra knowledge.

[Bible Scholar]

Wait, wait, wait. The b. The. The serpent said God doesn't want you to eat it because when you eat it, you will also be gods. It doesn't say unlike unlock certain knowledge. It says you will.

[Christian Debater]

It says the knowledge of good and

[Bible Scholar]

evil and you will. They don't. But it says they don't want you to eat it because you will also be gods. That's what the text says.

[Christian Debater]

No, the text says that you will know and understand the knowledge of good and evil. It didn't say that you will be God.

[Bible Scholar]

Listen, you got to hear what I'm saying.

[Christian Debater]

Okay? I'm listening.

[Bible Scholar]

It says you will unlock the knowledge of good and evil and become gods. You left that part out.

[Christian Debater]

Understood.

[Sean Kelly]

So here.

[Bible Scholar]

So, yeah, they didn't want them to become gods. That's. That's the reason.

[Christian Debater]

Are you familiar with that first sin being sex?

[Bible Scholar]

No. What?

[Christian Debater]

When Adam and Eve. When they. That apple wasn't literal. It was the forbidden fruit.

[Bible Scholar]

Okay?

[Christian Debater]

Now we're the forbidden fruit. The forbidden fruit was sex.

[Bible Scholar]

Wait, that's Gnosticism.

[Christian Debater]

So, wait, no, that's not narcissism.

[Bible Scholar]

Let me tell you why you're wrong. According to the Bible.

[Christian Debater]

I'm listening.

[Bible Scholar]

Because it says, please have sex and. And. And prolonged proliferate. Please have sex and multiply. So you're wrong about that.

[Christian Debater]

They weren't multiplying then.

[Bible Scholar]

Sex was a sin.

[Christian Debater]

They weren't multiplying by sex. They were still multiplying. But look at how Eve was born. She was born from the rib. They didn't have to be born through sex, and they didn't have to be born through that painful experience. That's what their punishment was when they were cast out the Garden of Eden.

[Bible Scholar]

Okay, In Genesis, chapter one, before the rib. The rib deal. Yeah. And. And the lady who's here, she would love that. Because women. Everybody knows women come out of men's rich ribs, right?

[Christian Debater]

But go ahead.

[Bible Scholar]

The chapter one says, hey, you guys, I made you male and female. Now get this place full of people. That would mean that they're reproducing, not because of a rib coming out of some guy's side. And then there's a lady.

[Christian Debater]

So who were the children documented before they left the Garden of Eden?

[Bible Scholar]

Who were the children? What do you mean?

[Christian Debater]

What children did they have? If they were reproducing, who did they give birth to before Genesis chapter one? Before they were cast out of the Garden of Eden?

[Bible Scholar]

In Genesis chapter one, it says multiply.

[Spiritual Theorist]

Right?

[Bible Scholar]

It's a commandment by the. By the Elohim, the creators. What do you mean? Who's the children?

[Christian Debater]

So they didn't multiply yet.

[Bible Scholar]

What? Yes, they did.

[Christian Debater]

So who did?

[Sean Kelly]

They.

[Christian Debater]

Who were their children?

[Bible Scholar]

You do know there were more than one?

[Christian Debater]

If I know there's more than I know. If you're saying Canaan, Abel, I understand that, but they. Cain and Abel came after their knowledge of good and evil.

[Bible Scholar]

And there were people there.

[Christian Debater]

Yes. So those are the people of Clay.

[Bible Scholar]

That there was more than 12 people.

[Christian Debater]

But those Were the people of Clay. Those weren't the people that had the breath of God inside of him.

[Bible Scholar]

People of Cain.

[Christian Debater]

You mean the people of Clay.

[Bible Scholar]

Oh, you're talking about mud.

[Christian Debater]

Yeah.

[Bible Scholar]

Okay, we're getting really far off here.

[Christian Debater]

No, because that's what was. Just go ahead.

[Bible Scholar]

The people of Clay, which is Christ. Right. Christ is a man, flesh and blood, Correct?

[Christian Debater]

Yes, he's flesh and blood.

[Bible Scholar]

So Christ is evil.

[Christian Debater]

No, not evil at all. You're implying that he doesn't have a soul. I didn't say that he doesn't have a soul.

[Bible Scholar]

Am I hearing that? Didn't you say they don't have souls if they're clay?

[Christian Debater]

I didn't say they didn't have souls if they were clay. I said the people of Clay, they were different. They didn't have the breath of God

[Bible Scholar]

as they didn't have souls.

[Christian Debater]

I said they didn't have the breath of God and so on.

[Bible Scholar]

Okay. Does Christ have the breath of God?

[Christian Debater]

Absolutely.

[Bible Scholar]

Was he Clay?

[Ankon]

No.

[Bible Scholar]

Oh. So Christ wasn't made out of flesh and blood material.

[Christian Debater]

He is made of flesh and blood. But the difference that you're missing is the sentience, that consciousness. While we're talking about. I'm not jumping off that.

[Bible Scholar]

That point.

[Christian Debater]

I'm telling you, explain the breath of God.

[Bible Scholar]

You said the people of Clay.

[Christian Debater]

Yes. They did not have clay.

[Bible Scholar]

Just means flesh and blood, material, matter is. Of course you're talking. When we're talking about clay, we're talking about material. So let's.

[Christian Debater]

Right, So I can tell you. Those people of Clay, if you're looking for a reference on that. Those are the Neanderthals. These are the people that didn't have.

[Bible Scholar]

You are everywhere.

[Christian Debater]

I'm telling you, these are the people that didn't have that consciousness. They didn't have that sentience that you and I have. The way that we're aware of life and death when we're talking about that breath of life. That's what Adam had inside of him. That sentience, that connection to God that you still share. This is the evidence of God's existence throughout all of us. It's been since then. And Eve had that same existence. And they were going to procreate and have more children without it being a painful birth. When she decided to be deceptive and participate in the forbidden fruit.

[Femininity Coach]

Fruit.

[Christian Debater]

In consuming the food.

[Bible Scholar]

It wasn't forbidden.

[Christian Debater]

It was. I mean, it was told.

[Bible Scholar]

It wasn't evil. You need to listen.

[Christian Debater]

I didn't say evil. I said forbidden.

[Bible Scholar]

No. What? It was forbidden because the Elohims at the end of chapter two. I mean at the end of chapter three, the Elohim, which wasn't God, it was a council of God, say now they're going to be gods like us. That's why they didn't want them to eat the fruit. Fruit, not because it was evil.

[Christian Debater]

And so what knowledge did they obtain that made them gods like them?

[Bible Scholar]

They understood. How? They understood everything. They understood all the, what you say, forbidden knowledge.

[Christian Debater]

Well, what is the forbidden knowledge?

[Bible Scholar]

All the deep, the deep knowledge that you see in Enoch that's forbidden with all the so called fallen angels.

[Christian Debater]

But that. How would they know that if that happened after Adam and Eve?

[Bible Scholar]

What do you mean how do they know?

[Christian Debater]

Because you're saying that's the forbidden knowledge, like in the Book of Enoch. How would they know that knowledge if it followed after their participation of the forbidden fruit?

[Bible Scholar]

That moment in Enoch is supposed to surpass them, supposed to be at the same time of creation.

[Christian Debater]

So how would eating that fruit give them that knowledge? Based on what you're implying, if it's

[Historian]

supposed to be eating?

[Bible Scholar]

Enoch says the angels taught them how to make swords, how to do makeup, how to do this, how to do that. That's all the knowledge that they weren't supposed to have. But the God said, don't eat it because you know you'll die.

[Christian Debater]

I'm telling you what the forbidden knowledge is. The forbidden knowledge was sex. And that's the act that they did.

[Bible Scholar]

So why is sex, why is sex forbidden?

[Christian Debater]

Because the format of how they had sex, they were supposed to reproduce and they were supposed to have other children. Not in that format. The format that you're mocking about the rib, this was how they gave birth before. That was an act of God.

[Bible Scholar]

So men give birth by having a rib taken out in the. And, and, and, and are you in that time frame? We're not doing science anymore, Right?

[Christian Debater]

Good. No, we could go science.

[Bible Scholar]

So go ahead. I'm wearing science. Did a man ever, a male, ever have a rib removed and then become a human being?

[Christian Debater]

That is not accepted anymore because we're no longer in the Garden of Eden. If we were in the Garden of Eden, we would still be doing it.

[Bible Scholar]

So sex is evil?

[Christian Debater]

Yes, in the practice of how it was done. That's why, that's why the serpent introduced sex to Eve.

[Femininity Coach]

Eve.

[Christian Debater]

And they brought in Adam to introduce it to him and they were cast out the Garden of Eden.

[Bible Scholar]

So sex is evil. So all the prophets throughout the Bible, Moses was born through sex. Elijah, they're just evil. Because their mom and dad decide to.

[Christian Debater]

That's why it's important that we had the sacrifice of Jesus Christ. So that way it's not evil anymore. Is it evil for it's animalistic.

[Bible Scholar]

Why do animals have babies and have pain like horses and.

[Christian Debater]

Yeah, of course.

[Bible Scholar]

And dogs. Did they get cursed with original with the sin of Eve too?

[Christian Debater]

We weren't going to be submitted to the same pains of animals. We were above animals. Now we're at the same level of

[Bible Scholar]

animals to get it too.

[Christian Debater]

No, I'm saying they were already getting that. We are now going through the same pain of animals now. Well, where else would they get that from if they were already. So go ahead.

[Bible Scholar]

It's not true.

[Christian Debater]

But look at how.

[Bible Scholar]

How.

[Christian Debater]

Look at how you'd like to. You'd rather relate with animals instead of being above animals and be the gods.

[Bible Scholar]

Say something. That's why that people having sex to actually live and survive.

[Christian Debater]

When God says before, that's why we're having sex now. Because we're out the garden.

[Bible Scholar]

Before Genesis 3, God said, Be fruitful and multiply. Guys. And he didn't say, guys, get your ribs out. We need to make this. Fill this place up with people. He said, I made you male and female. Be fruitful and multiply. We know that it's reproduction, but you

[Christian Debater]

understand that the design of that garden goes beyond comprehension. That's why it's told the way that it is told. I'm listening.

[Bible Scholar]

These are like. This is like isegesis. But I'm okay with it. I'm rolling with it.

[Christian Debater]

I'm listening.

[Bible Scholar]

So we're all freestyling and flying by the seat of our pants at this moment. Because you're like saying things that never were said in the Bible. There's nothing at all saying that it was sex. There's nothing at all in there.

[Christian Debater]

But I'm saying, so what is the forbidden knowledge?

[Bible Scholar]

No, that's what the Christian.

[Christian Debater]

So I'm asking you what is the forbidden knowledge? I'm telling you what the forbidden knowledge was that was gained from there. And that's why her childbirth was painful. That's why the children that they had from sex, one of them murdered the other ones because they were from. They're born from the knowledge of forbidden. From that forbidden fruit. They're born of the knowledge of good and evil. That's why Cain was good. That's why Abel was evil. Sorry. Abel was good. Cain was evil. And Cain killed his brother. They were fruits from that labor was good.

[Bible Scholar]

No, I'm seeing. You said Abel was good, right?

[Christian Debater]

Abel was good.

[Bible Scholar]

Wasn't able. Born by sex.

[Christian Debater]

Yes, he was. But that's the knowledge of good and evil. The evil was still inside of his brother. Okay, they're good and evil.

[Bible Scholar]

Let me tell you why I say Jesus is. Because this is. Jesus is a serpent in the garden according to the text. Because the Elohim did lie in the text. If you. Because you have fact checkers here. If you look at Genesis 3, they say at the end, they are going to be gods like us. They are going to be gods like us. Before Genesis, before that, they said, hey, you guys are going to die. Which one is it? The lie was that they didn't want them to be gods. I can prove it in the Bible. They are going to be gods like this. Then they said, we better hurry up and get them out of here. I'm paraphrasing. Crazy. We better get them out of here.

[Christian Debater]

By the seat of the se.

[Bible Scholar]

And I love.

[Christian Debater]

Sorry, I'm listening.

[Bible Scholar]

No, no, I just want to get to the core of it. Yeah, that. It's solid.

[Christian Debater]

Yeah.

[Bible Scholar]

They said, now we got to get out of here because now that they have knowledge of good and evil, the gods will be. They'll be able to live forever. So when you understand, when you break constructs, when you.

[Christian Debater]

It says that they'll live forever?

[Bible Scholar]

Yeah, it says lest they. They take hold of the tree of. Of. Of forever life or something like that. The tree of life, life and.

[Christian Debater]

Okay, and that's where the forbidden fruit was.

[Bible Scholar]

No, it was forbidden from them because they didn't want them. Christ says.

[Christian Debater]

Well, I'm saying, you said that they will be gods unless what. What was the stipulation for them being gods?

[Bible Scholar]

They've become gods like us. Knowing good from evil. You have to be able to know good from evil to be a good judge. The name, the word Elohim means judge as well. It means government judge God. So if I'm going to be a good judge, I have to know good from evil. Why would a God, by the way, why would a benevolent God not want you to know good from evil? When don't you tell your children when they're born that's not good, that's good. You want your. Your creation to know good from evil. So there's the point that that's not God anyway and that they lied. But going. I digress. Let me go back to the. What you asked me. They tell them at the end, they say to each other, we got to get them out of here because now that they Know good from evil. They're going to be gods. Christ told us all the time, you are gods. Who hated it. The evil ones, which are the symbolic of the elegant, the Pharisees and the Sadducees, they were the ones that said, oh, why are you teaching them this? Oh, we got to kill this guy. Because the people are getting knowledge. Christ is showing them that they can be gods. Get it? The serpent told them, you can be gods. Christ told them, you can be gods. The Elohim said, don't do that. We don't want you to be gods. The Pharisees said, don't do that. We don't want you to be gods. Jesus is the serpent in the garden. That's a representation.

[Christian Debater]

So that's an exo facto way to break it down. But that doesn't mean that Jesus is the serpent itself. There's no text that supports that. It's just.

[Bible Scholar]

I just gave you text.

[Christian Debater]

No, you're giving me text and you're giving me context.

[Bible Scholar]

No, I'm giving you the actual scriptures in the Bible.

[Christian Debater]

But I'm saying Jesus did say that. But that doesn't mean that he existed during the same time of the Garden of Eden.

[Bible Scholar]

Excuse me, I thought you. Jesus is everlasting, aren't you? But he's.

[Christian Debater]

He's. Yes, but that's the consciousness of Jesus at that time. When he came in the physical flesh. He came in the physical flesh. John 3:16. Or was.

[Bible Scholar]

What does he say in the beginning was the Word. And the word was with God, right?

[Christian Debater]

Correct.

[Bible Scholar]

So I think thought Jesus is there in the beginning.

[Ankon]

Right?

[Christian Debater]

The conscience of Jesus is there in the beginning. But Jesus as the physical man. Jesus in the physical sense existed around before 33, 33 AD. Jesus existed 20, 26 years ago.

[Bible Scholar]

We. He came in different.

[Christian Debater]

But what would. What evidence would give you that that he is that serpent? Specifically, you're using the same words that the serpent did. Does that mean that you're the serpent?

[Bible Scholar]

Wait, I just gave you evidence. Jesus. Wait.

[Christian Debater]

Jesus said. Jesus said that we can do the same things as him and more through God.

[Bible Scholar]

Through God, okay.

[Christian Debater]

He said we can do the same things and more. So it doesn't mean that we can just capitalize. Hold on. But did he say through God, did the serpent say. I'm staying on the point. Jesus said we can do it through God. Did the serpent say that you could do it through God, or did he say you have to do it behind his back?

[Bible Scholar]

Jesus said, said, you can do. You will. You will be gods. Right? You.

[Christian Debater]

He did not say you will be God.

[Bible Scholar]

They didn't tell Jesus. Why are you saying Jesus said aren't?

[Christian Debater]

Jesus said you will be gods.

[Bible Scholar]

Oh, wait, hold on. Jesus says, ye are gods. Doesn't it say that in Psalms 82? That's what Christ said.

[Christian Debater]

But he's not saying you will be. He's already claiming it.

[Bible Scholar]

My point, the God. Stay with the God.

[Christian Debater]

I'm staying with it. Okay.

[Bible Scholar]

I said ye are God. Doesn't it say that in the Bible? And by the way, that he's talking about sons of God.

[Christian Debater]

God, of course.

[Bible Scholar]

In Psalms 82 he's discussing the sons of God, the Elohim, which is. That's like a play on words. But anyway, Christ says ye are gods. Doesn't it say that in your, in your, in your scriptures? In the garden, Christ said, oh, they don't want you to be gods. You guys can be gods. Eat that fruit. Ye are gods. They. They. You. Basically Christ wasn't saying, hey, all you sinners are gods. He says there's a way to become gods.

[Ankon]

God.

[Bible Scholar]

And it is to.

[Christian Debater]

But two different, two different entities. Saying something that the same does not mean it's the same person.

[Bible Scholar]

Oh, it's in, in the understanding of Christ. In the Bible, we know that Christ is everlasting. Christ is always present. Do you not agree with that? As a Christian?

[Christian Debater]

I agree with that.

[Bible Scholar]

Has Christ been around before he was born? In, in, in 20. 20, 26 years ago, roughly. So you agree that Christ was here before? Right.

[Christian Debater]

Now this is where I want to ask you. Are, do you mean physically or spiritually? Was he here before? Spiritually, he was here before and physically he was not here.

[Bible Scholar]

And does spirit manifest into flesh?

[Christian Debater]

It can.

[Bible Scholar]

Oh, it can or does it?

[Christian Debater]

It can't. It doesn't always happen that way. There's some spirits that still exist that have not manifested in the flesh.

[Bible Scholar]

The flesh that is here, is there spirit in it?

[Christian Debater]

That's correct.

[Bible Scholar]

Okay, so.

[Christian Debater]

And that has the breath of God. The breath of God that we were discussing earlier.

[Femininity Coach]

Yes.

[Bible Scholar]

So we've. You. We both agree that Christ always existed. We. And we agree that spirit holds. That flesh holds spirit.

[Christian Debater]

Correct.

[Bible Scholar]

So you understand my concept that Christ was there in a physical and not in a. In a different type of form in the garden. And then in later in the gospel, Christ came as flesh and blood.

[Christian Debater]

So why would you determine that? This snake did not. The serpent did not not reveal himself to be Jesus. He did not reveal himself to be the Savior. The snake did not reveal himself to be the one to Help and heal. Jesus told you he's the Savior.

[Bible Scholar]

So the serpent saying you can be God's.

[Christian Debater]

Jesus did help. I mean, sorry. The serpent did help them. Jesus, when he talked to his.

[Bible Scholar]

The serpent did help them. Wow. I love it. We're doing well. You're making some progress.

[Christian Debater]

I'm telling you. The serpent, the serpent helped them to give them the option to do what they wanted to do do. And that option was still on them. And they still disobeyed. They still disobeyed. And look at the consequences that they had. It's the evidence there that they did not live eternally, that they were supposed to. But Jesus came back to rectify that and told us how we can live eternally.

[Bible Scholar]

Stop right there.

[Christian Debater]

Go ahead.

[Bible Scholar]

When Jesus came, did he say, if you follow this path that I'm showing you, pointing to you will. You will be able to live forever?

[Christian Debater]

He said, through God. God. And that was.

[Bible Scholar]

We got that right.

[Christian Debater]

So that's the path.

[Bible Scholar]

That's. That's not.

[Christian Debater]

The serpent did not tell them through God. That's why I'm telling you the contradiction that he did not tell them through God. He told them through the forbidden fruit.

[Bible Scholar]

The serpent told them through God. Because the serpent is part of the Elohim as well.

[Christian Debater]

When you see how you're playing with the words of it though, like he did, he's distinctly told them through the fruit.

[Bible Scholar]

If we look at what Dr. Mike, the late Dr. Michael Heiser teaches, he doesn't teach Jesus as a serpent, but he talks about the Elohim. He even teaches this. He breaks it down that the Elohim is a type of spiritual. We look at the seraphim, we look at the Nahash in the Bible. Those are type of fiery serpent like beings. Earlier, someone.

[Christian Debater]

But that's all interpretation.

[Bible Scholar]

I want to give you some actual facts.

[Christian Debater]

I'm listening to it, but that's still based off. But you're saying a fire is a serpent. How is a fire a serpent? That doesn't make any sense.

[Bible Scholar]

Trying to tell you.

[Christian Debater]

Okay, I'm listening.

[Bible Scholar]

Well, one. One reason a fire. Fire. Fire can symbolize a serpent is the way.

[Christian Debater]

Symbolize. How is that a fact?

[Bible Scholar]

Okay, okay. Ask me to tell you. Why would Dr. Heiser and others say that a serpent is fire as well? They move like a flame. They're symbolic throughout. Even other texts, ancient texts, serpents were divine. They weren't seen as evil. So Michael Heiser doesn't say Jesus is a serpent, but he does say that it's the Elohim. Who are fiery beings? Beings? In the desert with Moses, when the serpents bit the people, they said they were fiery Nahash. They were actually shining, fiery beings. That is a serpent as well. Because of those beings were type of. You can call them heavenly bodies, you know, watchers, whatever you want to call them. So in the Garden, when you hear serpent, Christ existed as one of the heavenly bodies. Bodies just like Satan existed as a heavenly body. There was no difference, the whole count. Satan is no different than Christ.

[Christian Debater]

So based off of what you're saying, the serpent represents this fiery flame, Right?

[Bible Scholar]

The serpent was a seraphim or a nachosh.

[Christian Debater]

Okay, so let's just go on that basis. Do you understand? But do you understand that the serpent in the Garden of Eden wasn't like that kind of serpent. It was a different serpent. It had legs and it was casted out. It was casted out. The Garden of Eden, where they removed it.

[Bible Scholar]

What text?

[Investigative Journalist]

Yes, please.

[Christian Debater]

This is in Genesis that it was. It was cursed to slither around for the all time after that, Right?

[Bible Scholar]

So it said it has legs.

[Christian Debater]

It was cursed to slither after its punishment.

[Bible Scholar]

I want to get back to before the curse.

[Christian Debater]

Go ahead.

[Bible Scholar]

Where does it say that it has legs?

[Christian Debater]

So why would it have to be cursed to slither afterwards? If you're able to follow context clues, what was it doing before that? If it's slithering afterwards?

[Bible Scholar]

All of us have imaginations.

[Christian Debater]

I'm not saying imaginations and I'm imagining. So why would it now start slithering after the Garden of Eden if it's already been doing that? What alterization happened?

[Bible Scholar]

Okay, that particular verse, are you familiar

[Christian Debater]

that there's an alterization that happened that had to occur for it to have that punishment afterwards?

[Bible Scholar]

When it says you're cursed to. That's very esoteric. When it says you'll be cursed, you'll be lower. Let me ask you a question. Is. Was. Is Christ downtrodden? Is Christ lower in the. In the gospel, or is he a king with glory? And. And is he. Is he rich or is he a popper that hides? And. And he was crucified and he was spit on and hated. Which one is that? Which one was low? Was Christ a king or was he spit on and low?

[Christian Debater]

That is interpretation. No, it is going to be based on interpretation because. Because Christ was king, he was revered. He was rich in favor and he was respected. When he walked through the crowd, out when they grabbed on, he was rich and favored by the people for Passover,

[Bible Scholar]

he said, see that guy with that. That Pitcher of water. Go ask him if we could do Passover at his house. How is he a king?

[Christian Debater]

Okay, but did they not still obey him as if he was a king?

[Bible Scholar]

King material?

[Christian Debater]

No, but. But I'm not speaking on material. You asked me a question. I'm telling you that they did worship him and he was still a king. There were still people bowing down and kissing at his feet the same way that they would a king while he walked through these grounds. They still gave him a chariot ride, died, and he even had a crown. And he had a crown.

[Bible Scholar]

Was he rich?

[Christian Debater]

He had. He had gifts of gold by the three wise men when he was born.

[Bible Scholar]

Was Christ rich?

[Christian Debater]

In the gospel, Christ was rich.

[Bible Scholar]

Okay, Christ was rich. Okay, so let me tell you Christ was not rich. In the gospel, Christ said, even the son of man doesn't have a place to lay his head. He didn't even have a place to live. He was homeless.

[Christian Debater]

Yeah, because why are you saying yeah, he. Home was heaven. Of course he was homeless. We weren't home yet. He was still walking and leading everyone to home.

[Bible Scholar]

I'm going back to what you just did.

[Christian Debater]

I'm listening.

[Bible Scholar]

You said, yes, Christ was rich. And. And I almost said you the L E word, but I don't want to be rude, so I went to the scriptures and I showed you a scripture, not my feelings. It says Christ was homeless.

[Christian Debater]

And then you said, yeah, he was homeless.

[Femininity Coach]

So what?

[Bible Scholar]

So was he rich?

[Christian Debater]

Yes, he's still rich.

[Bible Scholar]

Okay, this is crazy.

[Christian Debater]

I said he was rich in favor. Did I not say he was rich in favor? He turned away all worldly possessions to prove his real richness.

[Bible Scholar]

Because we're talking about.

[Christian Debater]

So what is. But are you saying materialistically rich? Because are you?

[Bible Scholar]

Yeah, that's what I've been saying all this time. Because you brought up gold.

[Christian Debater]

I already said. But I said he was still gifted gold by the three wise men. Was he not?

[Bible Scholar]

Was he. Did he live in opulence? Did he say, hey, did Jesus have

[Christian Debater]

money and was he popping tags? No, Jesus wasn't popping tags.

[Bible Scholar]

Do is. Do people make fun of Christ more and Christians more than anything any other Abrahamic more than Islam, more than Judaism? Do they really are the Christians perspective as well?

[Christian Debater]

Because Jews will tell you that they're the ones that are being the most.

[Bible Scholar]

So are you, you, you ridiculed throughout the most ridiculed. Right? They're the lowest.

[Christian Debater]

I didn't say, I said. That's all perspective.

[Bible Scholar]

Can you make fun of Christ without getting worrying about somebody doing something to

[Christian Debater]

you, you can absolutely do it.

[Bible Scholar]

We've seen multiple people say blasphemous without getting unalived.

[Spiritual Theorist]

Right there.

[Christian Debater]

There's a gentleman that makes a career of Satan statements about Jesus right behind you.

[Bible Scholar]

So my point is when you look. So my point is when you said, oh, and look, it says he's going to be low in the dirt. Dirt. That's the symbolism. Christ is low in the dirt. Nobody respects Christ. Let's be real. Besides Christians. Everybody makes, oh, the history. It's clear that there's historicity of Christ. But you can still sit with people and they'll tell you, no, there's no historicity of Christ. He's the lowest. Nobody respects Jesus. So that's the point of that. Back to what I was saying.

[Christian Debater]

No, but you're saying that he's the lowest.

[Bible Scholar]

Back to the thing about the serpent. It's not a literal snake. It is according to Dr. Heist, but

[Christian Debater]

you play back and forth between what you want to take literal and what you want to do is symbolism. But you're saying the facts based off of what is literal. And then you say, it's now a metaphor. So I don't know which way to follow how you're handling the conversation.

[Bible Scholar]

It shouldn't be in the Bible if you don't know how to look at metaphors.

[Christian Debater]

But I do. But I'm going off of your words. I'm trying to follow you right now. I'm not f. You're not the Bible. I'm following your words.

[Bible Scholar]

You, you brought, you kept bringing up. That's a little complex. But I did entertain it about the dirt and the lowest dirt. I'm telling you it's not a real snake. It never was a actual snake.

[Christian Debater]

But you just told me about the fire being the symbolism for the snake and that was your proof that you utilized. So if you. But no, if you're utilizing it because of the way that the flames look like a snake.

[Bible Scholar]

Seraphim.

[Christian Debater]

Seraphim. If you're saying for seraphim that the flames look like a snake, I'm going based off of that. That was your proof and evidence.

[Bible Scholar]

Well, that was one.

[Christian Debater]

But you were using that. That was your evidence that the snake there had to be Christ. Now you're saying it's not a snake. So you're agreeing with me.

[Bible Scholar]

No, no, it never was a real literal reptile.

[Ankon]

Correct.

[Christian Debater]

Okay, so what was it?

[Bible Scholar]

Do snakes talk?

[Christian Debater]

No, but. But I'm saying you're the one that was using the basis of the snake and saying Jesus Was a snake there.

[Bible Scholar]

Relic. It's not a real snake.

[Christian Debater]

So what is it then?

[Bible Scholar]

I just told you they were angels.

[Christian Debater]

It was fire.

[Bible Scholar]

They were.

[Christian Debater]

That looked like a snake. No, but it wasn't a snake.

[Bible Scholar]

The Bible based office, remember we're talking about the Bible.

[Christian Debater]

I'm listening, I'm following.

[Bible Scholar]

The Bible says they're seraphim, there are nakash, the Elohim. It doesn't literally say. Excuse me, it doesn't explicitly say the Elohim are seraphim. But if you look at Isaiah, there's guardians around the throne in Isaiah, I believe it's 14. And those are a type of shining fiery beings.

[Christian Debater]

So did it state that was the being in the Garden of Eden?

[Bible Scholar]

Yeah, I'm getting to that. If you deduce that the, the throne, the people of the throne, the sons of God, these divine beings are represented in Isaiah as these serpent like beings, you can say, oh, okay, that makes sense. Sense that this serpent in the garden is not actually a snake. It's an angelic like being.

[Christian Debater]

I can agree to that.

[Bible Scholar]

So that's the problem.

[Christian Debater]

I can agree.

[Host]

Let's wrap it up.

[Christian Debater]

All right, well, thank you. I appreciate your stance on it.

[Ankon]

That popped up true. What did the Bible said about the snake? It wasn't an actual snake.

[Christian Debater]

And that was the first thing that I said, that it wasn't an actual snake. But then we went to that interpretation. But I understand. So I thank you for your time.

[Host]

Thanks for staying all the way to the end, guys. Means a lot, a lot to me if you could please leave a review on Apple that helps us climb the charts. It helps us get way more guests and it helps us continue growing the podcast and the team. So it would mean a lot to me if you left a review on Apple or wherever else you're listening. Thanks so much. Okay, so his final claim them is black people should get reparations. How do you feel about that?

[Investigative Journalist]

You know, I think if black people were to get reparations, everybody else that has gone through historic injustice should also get reparation. So I'd be cool with reparations as long as people that had historic injustice, including like Native America, everybody needs reparations. It's one of those things where if one group gets it, other historic other groups that have gone through historical injustice need to get it in for the sake of fairness.

[Ankon]

So, so, so nobody received reparations?

[Investigative Journalist]

I think it's either or I either.

[Ankon]

I'm saying have anybody receive reparations?

[Investigative Journalist]

I do. All well, you know, though, there's been historically reparations. I think we've seen it with like the Holocaust for example.

[Ankon]

No, I know, I said in slavery, have anybody received reparations? Because you suggested that if one person receive reparation, then everybody else should have. Anybody received it?

[Investigative Journalist]

I don't think anybody has.

[Ankon]

Well, I'm going to tell you a fact, that's a lie. They did receive reparations. Everybody that had a slave, then white, they received reparations for their land and for the things like that. So reparations was given and you suggested that if, if it goes one, it should go for all. So you suggested that black people should get reparations. Not me.

[Investigative Journalist]

I mean There was the 40 acres and a mule thing,

[Ankon]

right now that'd be billions of dollars that they supposed to get. But listen, I'm gonna say this. When it comes to reparations, a lot of people suggest that people should get reparations. But first I think they should tell people where they from. See, what's more important than reparations is where I'm actually from. See, reparations not gonna help me. Money's gonna be here today, gone tomorrow. They give me 40 acres of the mule, they give me 40 million. I'm gonna spin it. It's gonna be gone on. I want to know where the I'm from. I don't give a. About reparations. I want them to unravel history and stop giving me his story. I want that. I don't, I don't give a about reparations because reparations was given to the people that deserved it. And evidently the white people deserved it because the white people got it. You already got reparations.

[Investigative Journalist]

Well, I'm. When you say you all, I mean, I don't know if I consider because

[Ankon]

I mean your ancestors.

[Investigative Journalist]

Well, it's not, it's not my ancestors though. That's the issue with I think just calling people white. Just good because they look white. You know what I mean? Like, cuz it's not like that's certain connotations of what that means. There's a lot of white people that have actually gone through historic injustices like black people have for different reasons. I mean, I know my ancestors were like straight up like 75% of them were murdered because they were Christians. There were Christians in a Muslim area, so. And they lost like 90% of their land. I would love to of that to be resolved because this was like a hundred years ago. It wasn't even that.

[Ankon]

What, what land?

[Investigative Journalist]

Like half of Turkey's Armenia. Half of Turkey's Armenia, dude.

[Ankon]

You mean historic army, but you white.

[Investigative Journalist]

Biblical army, but you white. What is white? What is white, though?

[Ankon]

But you white? When you get. When you get done talking, you're white, right?

[Investigative Journalist]

How. What is white, though?

[Ankon]

What are you?

[Investigative Journalist]

I mean, I'm. I consider myself like Near Eastern caucuses. I'm from the caucus.

[Christian Debater]

When you keep.

[Ankon]

When you. When you get done talking, you're white. You was genetically created, right? You are human. You were created to work, right? You were created to say everything that you created. I wasn't created to follow what you're saying. That was not for me. I'm the creator of what you're saying. I taught you everything you know. Hand that what you don't get, right? You gonna sit here and suggest that you stole it? I say you didn't steal it. I say I gave it to you. The information. Everything in the world I gave you, I gave it all to you.

[Spiritual Theorist]

You.

[Host]

Right?

[Ankon]

I don't think you get it. I don't think you understand.

[Investigative Journalist]

I don't understand that.

[Ankon]

So reparations. Reparations. I. I know it's confusing because everything's confusing. Life is confusing. But you suggested in the beginning it's about reparations. Right, but you suggested that we should not get reparations. But we said we should.

[Investigative Journalist]

I think everybody.

[Ankon]

You said we should if nobody should get reparations. Yeah, exactly. So somebody got it, so everybody should get it. So you already on my side. So you always on my side.

[Investigative Journalist]

Probably, yeah. I mean, if you're talking about how history, historically, white people, when their slaves were taken away, were given.

[Ankon]

It was never slavery. Slavery never existed.

[Investigative Journalist]

You know what I mean?

[Ankon]

I mean, prove it. We're a slave ship. Slavery never existed because Christopher Columbus didn't find America. People was already here, and there wasn't no damn Indians because the Indians already said that we was here and that we gave them something. Right? And what we gave them was weapons, right? I don't think you get that. Right? So your history is wrong. Right? Everything is wrong. I don't want reparations. I want America.

[Investigative Journalist]

I agree with you. I agree with you about discovering where we're all from. Because that's the issue that exists with white people. How, like, just because you look white, you're kind of put in a bucket. That also exists with black people. Because historically, you got the Moors and all that. And, like, people don't talk about that.

[Ankon]

Well, listen, I was. Listen, I'm saying my kind. My kind are different. You, when you talk About Africans. You talk about all those. You heard the story about black people sold black people. Well, black people didn't sell black people. Africans sold me. I don't think you get it. Right. Because we're different, just like you suggested.

[Investigative Journalist]

No, no, I get. I get where you're going every. I do.

[Ankon]

Yeah. Everything is different. Right. But as far as reparations, I don't think you're gonna say this. That cotton, everybody said, okay, picking cotton, but cotton was a major thing that they were selling a lot. Right? You can't find nothing without cotton. Cotton, right? And everybody look at it all because that built America. Right? That helped build this nation. Right? But it ain't something that they suggested. We was already selling cotton.

[Investigative Journalist]

Yeah.

[Ankon]

That's what we was already doing. Right. They came and took over it. Just like right now. If you look at a whole lot of shit that so called black people created, the white man decide how we use it. So, you know, everything is like that in this prison planet.

[Christian Debater]

Cool.

[Investigative Journalist]

Yeah.

[Host]

You want to get up here? Thanks for watching all the way to the end, guys. Please hit like and subscribe. It helps us grow the show and helps us get bigger guests. Thank you so much.

[Ankon]

Oh, my God.

[Host]

There's not many white people here, so

[Ankon]

I don't know why you just lied. See, when you say stuff, I gotta let you know that was a lie. Yes, a lot. Because check. That's true. Because out of black is how you create white.

[Sean Kelly]

White.

[Ankon]

So every black person you see here is white. Because that's how you get it. You cannot get a black person from a white woman. But you can block. Of course.

[Host]

I'm blocked.

[Sean Kelly]

Street through the roof.

[Ankon]

Of course. See, I think.

[Christian Debater]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Ankon]

Y' all separate things. You can say the N word. Yeah, listen, me,

[Christian Debater]

Sean's gonna go him.

[Ankon]

You can say it. You can say it like.

[Sean Kelly]

I didn't say me.

[Ankon]

So he can do the thing. You can say it. Cuz in history, y' all was actually trying to say it. I can't say a word. I think it was nadra. Nadra. Naga. I forgot what it was, but. I know, I know, but they heard that word and. Yeah, Naga. So they was trying to say that. Yeah. So it's okay. It's proper to say. But I think that people that words attach to their emotions. So if you had a word attached to your emotions, that's your fault, right? A word should not attach to your emotion. A word is just a word. That's all it is. But people put words in higher places,

[Sean Kelly]

so you don't think there is white. I mean, so like him. And so it's the, the whole putting all white people in one bucket thing's interesting because he's like trying to be distinct about where when you get pulled over, you're not like, I'm Armenian, you know, it's like sometimes, sometimes you want to get put in that bucket, you know, so let's not act like, you know, everyone wants it. Yeah, yeah. You get pulled over, you're, you're white. The rep. If you're, you're saying that reparations do or don't. I, I don't even understand. I'm saying, what is your position?

[Ankon]

I'm saying that, I'm saying that reparation was given right already. People that had land to the white people. Yes. I'm saying we want the land. That's what I'm saying. I'm saying we don't want reparations. We want the land. If we can't have the land, we don't want anything. And then I don't want the land either.

[Sean Kelly]

Maybe just like some of the land.

[Ankon]

I don't want some.

[Sean Kelly]

I want the good parts.

[Ankon]

No, I want all. I want the good and the bad. I want the land. Because when America first came over here, it was already oppressed. President here, what happened to him? He's on the back of the two dollar bill, right? He was already here. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I don't think you understand the first president, what Abraham Lincoln, right.

[Sean Kelly]

Is a white guy.

[Ankon]

I'm not too sure that Abraham Lincoln was even white.

[Sean Kelly]

All right, well, I mean, if I guess I have no proof of it.

[Ankon]

I'm not sure he was even white. I think history has been whitewashed.

[Sean Kelly]

I mean, that's a fact.

[Ankon]

Well, listen, but I don't think it was done like a lot of people say that it was stolen or it was done like that. I believe, like again, like I suggest, that it's black people doing it and they. And white people doing it for black people.

[Sean Kelly]

So black people are behind the scenes pulling the streets regardless.

[Ankon]

Yeah.

[Sean Kelly]

So you think they were in charge when there was black people being sold for slavery?

[Ankon]

Still in charge and been in charge to this day. Right. Y' all are just a cover up. Welcome. I'm keeping it real. Right. People don't understand. People understand, but they're gonna agree. They're gonna say it was a black Illuminati, it was a white alumni. They're gonna say that everything. They're black, it was white, but they're gonna say everything Started from the black, Right. So what makes you think that you're controlling something? No, you're being controlled because everything that you learned, you learned from a person with melanin in there. Melanin, what's that word?

[Christian Debater]

Melanin?

[Ankon]

Yeah, they had that in them. And they taught you. Right. And then you begin to teach. So what make you think that you got better than the master? You didn't.

[Sean Kelly]

So you don't think that slavery was real?

[Ankon]

Slavery not real. We prison. Oh, war.

[Sean Kelly]

Cause that's so. That's not even a reparation thing. Slavery just didn't exist to you or slavery.

[Ankon]

Slavery was different. See, slavery, A lot of people assumed that slavery was a lot of people fighting. But slavery was attack on this. Yeah, this black people. Bloodline. Bloodline. Because like you can tell. Because.

[Sean Kelly]

What do you mean?

[Ankon]

All the white. White nations. That's why I said they all white because all of them joined together and attacked us. Right? They attack us. You can see they land walks is there. If you go to St. Louis, a whole lot of Italian there. Right. Because they attacked us. Right. You go to different places.

[Sean Kelly]

You're going to attack St. Louis.

[Ankon]

Yeah, of course. All the European nations attacked America because we was here.

[Sean Kelly]

That tracks.

[Ankon]

That's how they took it from us. We fought them for 300 years.

[Sean Kelly]

You were here?

[Ankon]

I mean. Yeah.

[Sean Kelly]

Now you're Indian too?

[Ankon]

No, no, Indian.

[Sean Kelly]

Native American.

[Ankon]

Now that. That's crazy. Indians told you that we was here before them Indians because I told you this Indians had a. A little spear and they gave it to Christopher Columbus before he started balling them and eating them and frying them and eating them. Before he started eating them. They gave him something. Yeah. You know that he did. He did. He ate people. When he was eating them. He was eating them.

[Sean Kelly]

I knew he was a. I ain't eating people.

[Ankon]

He's eating people. Right? Fried them, boiling them, sauteing them.

[Sean Kelly]

Would you eat a person?

[Ankon]

Anybody that ever ate McDonald's ever ate a person.

[Sean Kelly]

You think McDonald's is serving human meat?

[Ankon]

They tested it and it had human meat in it. I'm not, I'm not suggesting anything. They tested it, had human meat in it, and McDonald's said this. McDonald's said that it only got human. Only got human in it because humans touched it. That was McDonald's excuse. McDonald's excuse that humans touch it. So of course human meat is going to detect.

[Sean Kelly]

No, there ain't no mchuman. There's no ten piece mchuman girl. So hold on. How about Burger King? Are they still server serving people?

[Ankon]

Listen, I got a problem. It can't be just because I got a problem. Everybody say they serve. How many. How many billions of burgers do Burger King say they serve? How many billions do McDonald's say they serve? So how many point four.

[Sean Kelly]

No, I'm just kidding.

[Ankon]

How many cows is it?

[Sean Kelly]

I mean, it's a lot.

[Ankon]

How many cows in it?

[Sean Kelly]

But there's a lot.

[Ankon]

No, not that many. There's a lot of cows, but not that many to say that there is.

[Sean Kelly]

There's that. Do you know how. It's not like one cow per hamburger.

[Ankon]

Who are the dead bodies at? The dead cows, the dead bodies, the human bodies. Where they at? Why ain't no more cemeteries getting built? Why is the same number of cemeteries around and everybody keep dying? Because they change it after every 50 years and they take your body. Listen, if you come back in 50 years, that tombstone gonna be gone. You never get the casket. The casket is sold to somebody else. The moment your funeral over. They. They. Yeah, I'm keeping it real.

[Investigative Journalist]

So.

[Femininity Coach]

So.

[Sean Kelly]

So your body. What happens to the body? It gets sold directly to McDonald's and then they liquefy it and put it into the fucking McRib.

[Ankon]

Listen, everything is fake. Even recycling.

[Sean Kelly]

McRib sounds kind of crazy.

[Ankon]

Everything is fake. Did you notice that everybody right now is recycling and recycled bins? And that's fake. We haven't even figured out how to recycle, right? I'm keeping it real. For real. You think I'm playing America, don't even recycle all the recycle bins.

[Sean Kelly]

They haven't figured out enough effective way to do.

[Ankon]

No, if you follow the recycle being, they're gonna go the same place the rest of the trash go all in one spot. So that's fake. Everything is illusion. Everything is fake.

[Sean Kelly]

Yeah, I guess. You see, the trash and the recycling get thrown into the same thing sometimes. And it's like, all right, this must be the same.

[Ankon]

No, it's the same. Everything the same.

[Sean Kelly]

Yeah.

[Ankon]

Yeah.

[Sean Kelly]

All right, well, I mean, I guess if. If slavery was. Didn't even exist.

[Ankon]

We're a prisoner of war. Never existed, right?

[Sean Kelly]

What if someone enslaved you in right this second?

[Ankon]

I mean, that's what I'm saying. The only thing, the only slavery that exists is the same. Slavery is this now slavery of the mind, right? Jesus is a slave people, right? Allah slave people, right? Every religion enslaved people. Jobs enslaved people.

[Sean Kelly]

Oh, so you think people are enslaved to their job?

[Ankon]

People enslaved to anything.

[Sean Kelly]

How about their Partner, too.

[Ankon]

Are your course to your relationship. Your people are slaves to their mother. Because, listen, it's not a slave.

[Sean Kelly]

That's just like a relationship, right?

[Ankon]

I gotta fake it. When I go in the house, I got to pretend to be son.

[Sean Kelly]

You got to pretend to be your mother's son.

[Ankon]

I got right. I. I can't act like. I can't act like I was just acting with my. My female. I can't. I can't. I can't be boyfriend. I got to put on a different face to see my mama. Right? I got to put on a different face to see everybody. That's how the world work. So I decided to stop doing that.

[Host]

Final point.

[Sean Kelly]

Yeah. My final point is I think you're a jam and you need to be protected at all costs. You know? Know. I think that. I think you need to be protected.

[Ankon]

That's all.

[Sean Kelly]

My final point is that I just hope nothing, no harm comes your way. You threatening me, obviously. Nah, I would never do that.

[Host]

Bdgd Vice Lord, if you learned anything from this episode or got any value at all, please share this episode with a friend. It helps us grow the channel, it helps us grow the podcast, and it means a lot to us. Thank you so much. He wanted to talk about the Shroud. Do you guys want me to pull the photo up again?

[Sean Kelly]

Gun.

[Investigative Journalist]

Yeah, sure. But check out the. There's, like, carbon dating that was done that was more recent, where they actually dated it to, like, 2,000 years ago. No, for real. Look it up.

[Host]

What do I look up?

[Investigative Journalist]

They carbon dated it where it's, like, literally right at 2,000 years old.

[Historian]

Well, I heard you mention.

[Investigative Journalist]

And by the way, I don't know if I even believe in carbon dating. I just want to put that out there. It just. Which I don't think negates to what I'm. The point I'm trying to make.

[Historian]

Well, I think that we were talking about the historicity of Jesus.

[Investigative Journalist]

Yeah.

[Historian]

And one of the things that you cited was the Shroud of Turin. I was raised Christian. I remember actually having a book on the Shroud of Turin on as I probably still have it. I have a lot of books. A book on the Shroud of Terran. I was very interested in it. But let's be very clear. In 1988, three different laboratories in different places, including one in Arizona, actually took a small portion of the Shroud of Turin and did independent analysis. All three of those spaces found that the Shroud of Turin dates to somewhere around the 3rd, the 13th or 14th century. So I want to be clear. And then they also looked at the way that it was woven and they said it was typical for the Middle Ages. So let's be clear. The Shroud of Turin, something that was important to my, my thoughts as a Christian, as a young Christian, has been thoroughly debunked.

[Investigative Journalist]

I don't know if it's been thoroughly debunked. Let's agree to disagree on that part because I've seen the carbon dating, I've seen the 1200s version, but I've also seen more recent carbon dating. And I think they just took a sliver of the thread and they said that this was pretty much from that era. But let's not, you know, let's not argue on that. I'll give you a few more points in order to like kind of historically prove that Jesus existed.

[Historian]

Why don't you. Okay, so I'm not going to agree to disagree because I think that when you have folks that are able to do the actual scientific analysis that everybody in the world uses to understand the origin, the source, the material of foreign objects that have some sort of organization origin, you can't carbon stone a rock. This is what we should recognize and understand now.

[Investigative Journalist]

Okay, I want to say something else.

[Historian]

The Shroud of Turin is fake. And I think that it has been debunked. That doesn't mean that in and of itself. It means that Jesus did not exist. That's one thing that has been debunked. It's just a thing you mentioned. That's why I'm bringing it up. But I'd love to know. You also mentioned there were many other sources. I'd love to know what you're referencing.

[Investigative Journalist]

Sources are like the 12 disciples that see this, see this man beat death. And then they, it is such a powerful thing that they witness that. Then they decide not, I don't even know consciously, but they decide that death is nothing. And then you have these 12 disciples going through horrible tortures because they were Christians. They weren't just like killed, they were killed like you know, hanging upside down, crucified. Their, their skin literally tear, torn off their body like flesh literally. Can you know, you see like the guy, guys insides. You know what I mean? So this is like stuff that is the most excruciating pain, the worst kind of death that you could imagine. Yet these 12 disciples walked into that death singing hymns, talking about Jesus. A lot of them are not even feeling the pain while they're being literally killed slowly like William Wallace. There's horrible stories like you Know how they, how they killed William Wallace, cut off his, you know, private parts, all that kind of stuff. Stuff. These are like insanely painful deaths and yet they would not deny Jesus during these tremendously painful deaths. Not only were they not denying Jesus, they were enjoy that they were getting killed. So that to me is like for 12 year, you're a man, I'm a man. What could we see, you and I that could take the pain of being tortured to death away. So that is another, that's another one. Let me give you another example. I think.

[Historian]

Wait, before you do that, let me just. I'm saying something very briefly. Those stories are quite dramatic, but we have no historical evidence that they actually occur.

[Investigative Journalist]

We do, I do.

[Historian]

I want you to tell us about.

[Investigative Journalist]

Well, look, look up like old Armenian monks that were around during that time. And you know, mind you, Armenians are like, you know, 8,000 year old people. Were an ancient people. Look at their writings, look at their manuscripts, what they actually witnessed.

[Historian]

No, we're talking about that. Wait, wait, don't, don't broaden the lens too much. Let's keep the aperture where it was. We're talking. You're mentioning the, the twelve apostles, by the way. Apostles. You should also know that in the Bible we're not always clear about what that number is. Right. We say 12. But there's some people who are like, well, maybe the group is a little larger. Right. There's no definitive list. These are the 12, nobody else. Yeah, let's be clear about that. So I want to also want you to also recognize that 12 as a number is used because of its numerological value.

[Investigative Journalist]

You okay?

[Historian]

And so as we try to look for something that is historically proven as a literal event, even when we try to find these 12 apostles, we struggle. I'd love for you to show me

[Investigative Journalist]

a to of someone from our ancestry, from our history as like, you know, my ancestors are Armenian people. I gave the example of St. Bartholomew. These there's actual manuscripts that exist is that talk about how St Bartholomew, a disciple of Christ who's in the Bible then goes. And I think in the Bible it's like it might be Nicholas or something, but Bartholomew, same person.

[Ankon]

They.

[Investigative Journalist]

He comes to the Armenian Highlands. Nathaniel, he comes to the Armenian Highlands and then he preaches Christianity. Armenia becomes the first Christian nation as a result, in the, in the process of him teaching Armenians Christianity, this guy is basically, you know, skin torn off, tortured to death, you know, sing. And these are things that we hear in my. Amongst my ancestors that made such a powerful Impression. I think man literally was like destroyed.

[Historian]

We hear, we hear these things. It's not just your ancestors. Yeah, lots of folks tell those stories. What I am saying is we don't have any definitive proof that they literally happened. These are stories about individuals who, by the way, after forsaking the Savior, it's interesting that they forsake when he was alive and they could say something. They were like, not me. I don't want that to happen. But then all of a sudden the story is that after his death, after seeing him risen, now all of a sudden they actually go to their death in these painful ways because they are true believers. There is nothing that we can find, tangible, material culture, material sources for any of those things. We have stories of many of the people that we call apostles. Right? They're stories. They're stories. When you go to Alexandria, you'll hear about St. Mark establishing the church there, you'll hear all of these stories. But when you look to find something as definitive proof, there is an extreme paucity of it. And, and I, and listen, I, I'm a cometic priest, right? I don't, I'm not saying that something that's mythological is irrelevant. I certainly wouldn't say that. I'm just saying that when we try to actually shoehorn things that are mythological into a literal historical history, we have lots of problems. And I think that most people who are believers aren't even aware of any of it. They're not aware of any of it. And so that's, that's the challenge that we have. I mean, we.

[Investigative Journalist]

But that's part of faith though. Like you're wanting like imperfect proof. And part of faith, part of history is that you're not going to have empirical proof.

[Historian]

No, wait, now you're saying faith and history.

[Investigative Journalist]

Well, you're looking for an answer to faith through history to say, look, this is empirical proof that is existed. Now, obviously we have a disagreement because I'm talking about the disciples, I'm talking about Christ. Another thing I want to bring up is I was a TV producer, right? So I did a, some ghost hunting shows and I did some exercises, exorcism shows, like actual. With, you know, Catholic priests and all that stuff.

[Ankon]

No, no, no.

[Historian]

That would have been interesting.

[Investigative Journalist]

No, no, come on.

[Historian]

But like, I must bring the camera, right?

[Investigative Journalist]

What's interesting is, and this happened way too many times, it's like in the absence of what happens in those moments, you realize Christ is there. And let me tell you why, because you sit there, you could be like Gandhi you could be like Buddha. You could carry a Buddha statue in front of these, like, you know, demonically possessed individuals, and they will not react. But you say the word, word of name of Christ, you hold the cross up, these things freak out. And this wasn't just like, on one occasion, it kept happening over and over again. Why is it that.

[Historian]

What's the name of Christ?

[Investigative Journalist]

He's a Y. Yeshua.

[Host]

Yeshua.

[Historian]

Oh, wait a minute now. You said it was the name of Christ. Now you're not sure what the name is?

[Investigative Journalist]

No, no, you. I mean, Yeshua. Yeshua.

[Historian]

So you say Yeshua to these demonic individuals.

[Investigative Journalist]

These. When you say Christ. So when you say Christ or you

[Historian]

hold a cross, his name was.

[Investigative Journalist]

Was Christ. It freaks the. It freaks. These demonic name was demonically possessed individuals. Yeah, I mean, his name was Christ. Well, no, when you say that name, it freaks him out.

[Historian]

Is Christ a name or is it a title?

[Investigative Journalist]

It's a. I mean, it's a name. Like, isn't it his name?

[Historian]

No, I don't think anyone, any biblical scholar would say that his name was Jesus Christ. That's just what you yell when you stub your toe. The reality is that Christ is a title. In fact, it even predates states those.

[Investigative Journalist]

Okay, regardless of what it is, why is it that these individuals that are demonically possessed don't react to Buddha? They don't react. You could say Gandhi, Buddha, whatever you want. You say the name of Christ, you hold a cross up, they have a physical reaction. They're. They. Whatever's inside them is rebelling in that. Against that. You see evil come out. So doesn't that tell you that there's something.

[Historian]

These are people who have been connected to, familiar with, with the Christian story. And I really don't believe that the name, a title, by the way, a title that is using vocalized sounds that didn't exist in Aramaic. Didn't exist. I mean, you realize that you're saying. You're saying Christ, but no one would actually say that's the name of Jesus. No one would actually say that. That title didn't predate Jesus, and it probably wasn't pronounced exactly the same way. Isn't that peculiar that someone would respond that way to something that is not strictly connected to Jesus as you're trying to.

[Investigative Journalist]

I mean, I. I don't know the answer. Like, there's a lot of answers I don't have, but I just. I realize that for some reason, this is their. This is the worst thing you could bring upon a demonically possessed individual is the name of Christ, the cross. For some reason they react that. Now do I understand what is the reason? Do I know the details of what happened in history? Okay, that value that I can't, I can't answer that because there's a lot of things that we don't know. But I see from the reaction of these demonically possessed individuals, I see by the reaction of the apostles who were, that were willing to die for the cause. And then there's a shroud of terrain. And for me there's way, there's way too much information out there to validate the fact that Jesus was alive. Including by the way you say, okay, there's no proof. Read some Armenian manuscripts about Saint Bartholomew and his preaching and how many Christians died from what period from, I mean Bartholomew was killed on 69 AD. So anything between anything Byzantine era, which is basically the closest era to Christ. And by the way, when you go into the Byzantine era, you notice that from the proximity of Christ's time, and again, this is written in old Armenian historical literature that there's a. There, there's a lot of miracles happening. Water into wine type type events and then that dies down as the Byzantine era dies down. And if you actually read the Bible, it is in the proximity of Christ that these miracles happen. So what I see during that time in the Byzantine era is a lot of miracles happening, then they die down. We go through a dark ages. Now we're in an era where these miracles are coming back. People are actually seeing these miracles. So does that mean Christ is coming back? I have no idea. I'm not that smart to understand.

[Historian]

I would say that I, in this instance, we have to recognize that one of the reasons why we are told by people who are Christian leaders that we have to have faith is because they know that once you start asking questions, what they're saying unravels. That's the reason why they say, you must have faith. My son. I was raised Christian. I was told that when I'd ask some questions, they'd say, well, this is a crisis of faith. And I wish I was astute enough at the time to say, no, this is a crisis of fact. What you are saying to me is not factual. That's the challenge that I have now. And I don't have any problem whatsoever with you drawing inspiration, solace from a narrative that helps you live as a decent human being. That's not what I'm talking about. If that's what you're going to do, wonderful. Do it all day long. But I'm saying that when we begin to do two things, shoehorn the Christian narrative into a historical, literal narrative, first of all, it doesn't fit in. It causes lots of problems. And then the other thing that Christians end up doing is they look at this, this story, this recent story. Human beings lived for a long time before these stories had many, many books and texts. This recent story, they begin to now tell that story as if it is. Is the history of all humanity. This is a problem. This is a problem. If you want to be Christian, great. But now that you have said this story is literal and it is the salvation of every person on the planet, we have a problem because there are multiplicity of traditions older. There are multiplicity of people in different cultures. We have a problem.

[Investigative Journalist]

Problem.

[Historian]

So you're telling me that a guy with a cow that lives someplace in rural China that has never heard of Jesus, he's going to hell because he didn't.

[Investigative Journalist]

No, that's not, that's not a claim I'm making. What I'm. What I'm saying is also if you look at the way the world is constructed and the, what we're talking about before, we're living in a slave world. And if you look at how the Federal Reserve act is written, for example, that is written to enslave us. Now you counter it with the teachings of the Bible. It's literally an inversion of God, God's word. Right? And that's the trick. That's where you see the through. Through what the evil does to enslave us. You see that it's an inversion of the teachings of Christ saying that the

[Historian]

Federal Reserve is an antichrist.

[Investigative Journalist]

Yeah, yeah. Very clearly, I'm telling you that. Very clearly, I'm telling you that. I'm telling you the medical system is. Is Antichrist. You're talking influence.

[Historian]

You're talking to a descendant of enslaved Africans. The most heinous things that ever happened to human beings happened to people that are in my direct lineage.

[Investigative Journalist]

I could argue the same thing happened to our people. They were literally pregnant women getting their

[Historian]

bellies very aware of the Armenian genocide. And I'm not trying to say that it's not something that more people should know about. I've studied the Armenian genocide and I think that even calling it Armenian genocide causes problems in certain parts of the world. That's real. That's real. I'm not, I'm not even saying that that wasn't.

[Investigative Journalist]

And that's an example of an anti. Antichrist movement, by the way. And this is what I'm the point

[Historian]

I'm trying to make, why is it an example of an Antichrist movement? Sometimes human beings do terrible things to other human beings.

[Investigative Journalist]

Because. Because the teachings of Christ are all about liberty, freedom, our sovereignty as individuals.

[Historian]

Wish that you could have a time machine and go back to tell that to the enslavers who forced my people to practice Christianity. I would love for you to tell them you're a Christian. Why are you doing that to these people? And then why are you forcing them with the Bible? Do you know just a short period ago, you've heard of Georgetown University? Did you know that Georgetown University had a major financial crisis? And in order to remain solvent, what they did is they sold their 272 enslaved people. That's how Georgetown still exists. It's sometimes just referenced as a 272 to. And those people were all Christians. All of those enslaved people were Christians. We have a record of one of those enslaved Christians who had gone to the pastor and said, I, I hear that you're going to sell us. And that pastor said, no, that's not true, my son. And a few weeks later, here he was being put in chains and being sold into the deep South. More arduous slavery. Do you know what he said? Said, you lied to me. Can you at least give me a Bible? He was given none. That's the tradition of Christianity that I am riling against.

[Investigative Journalist]

But that's. You're talking about like, you're talking about flawed humans that are like that are able to make evil out of anything

[Historian]

so unique for us to then say that everything that people have done under the name of Christianity that is evil is flawed.

[Investigative Journalist]

Well, okay, I'll give you another reason why the Christian church. Because you're talking about human structures, right? If you even look at the way the Christian church is right now, where you got to go apply for a 501 to start a church, right? 5:1 non profit. You don't have to. I know.

[Historian]

Yeah, I know you and I know that.

[Investigative Journalist]

But most people, I run a spiritual institute. Most people think that you have to do that. Now what are you doing? When you go and you start, you ask the government for permission to have a church. You're actually. And then you realize, what is that government's agenda? You realize you're literally signing your name to something that's.

[Historian]

You've already, already acknowledged that if you have a spiritual institution, you are not obligated to find file a 501C.

[Investigative Journalist]

You're not. Most people don't know that though. Yeah. 99.9 of people don't know. You could start a church off of an affidavit. You and I obviously know that.

[Historian]

I don't know why you would say most people don't know that. I don't have a 501C3. In fact, I got a 501C3 for a non profit, but not my spirit.

[Investigative Journalist]

You know how, you know most people don't know that 99 of churches are 501c's 1% maybe in the entire country are done off of Africa, David. I don't know most of them. Most of the functioning was our 501c's because you can't even function. The way the system's built is unless you get a 501. If you try to do it off of affidavit the Christian way, the way the Bible tells you to do it, well then you can't even set up a bank account. Most places it's still possible. They just make it a lot harder. They want you to have an ein, you know.

[Historian]

Yeah, well, you have an ein. That's how they're able to track.

[Investigative Journalist]

Well, well then, then you're under that system. You're. And you're under answering to government.

[Historian]

So that means your Social Security number is a demonic device.

[Investigative Journalist]

I think all of it's demonic. I think because the way they do it, if you actually look at the way the government works and how they monetize us as human beings, each one of us have, has a value. Like they collateralize us as humans. They're like, all right, your life value is worth $100 million. Okay, we have 100 million in the bank. That's the way it works.

[Historian]

That's that, you know, that is not how the Federal Reserve work.

[Investigative Journalist]

No, that's how it works.

[Historian]

Listen, I've the, There are a lot of folks who have said that to me and my, my community. I've debunked it 80 trillion times. The Federal Reserve is not raising money on your Social Security number, on your value. It's just not, it's just this is something that you could. And by the way, you notice that it says 99% of churches in the US are 501c3. While they're saying, the AI is saying you're wrong, but I, but I want you. And by the way, look at the Georgetown University. 272 enslaved people. That one is correct.

[Host]

You want to look up what percentage of churches are 501?

[Investigative Journalist]

What percentage of churches are 501cs in the United States.

[Historian]

I just want you to know that you have a lot of beliefs that are connected to things that are completely unprovable. And that's not necessarily a bad thing.

[Investigative Journalist]

I mean, most, because.

[Historian]

But remember, what we're talking about is whether there was a historical, literal person that we could call Jesus Christ. And I'm saying that when you actually look at the evidence, evidence, as I have done for 30 years. 30 plus.

[Investigative Journalist]

All right, so why did 30 plus. Why did the disciples all decide to be massacred and follow this?

[Historian]

I'm telling you, that individual. I'm telling you that's part of the story, dear friend.

[Investigative Journalist]

Okay, so how does that. I'm trying to understand how that comes out.

[Historian]

We have no material because some folks wrote it and it's a powerful story.

[Investigative Journalist]

But let's go back, let's go back in time. 2,000 years, the Roman Empire.

[Historian]

The story is not 2,000 years old, okay?

[Investigative Journalist]

It is not whenever Jesus was supposed to have existed, okay? He, He. They claim he went up against the Roman Empire. Why would the Roman Empire want to create this fictitious thing to control the world back in 0, 30, 40, 50 AD?

[Historian]

Well, let's be clear, the wrong.

[Investigative Journalist]

Because they're trying to kill the Roman Empire.

[Historian]

I don't believe the Roman Empire creates the narrative of Jesus Christ. That's not what I'm saying.

[Sean Kelly]

Saying.

[Investigative Journalist]

Well, that's not what I'm saying either. Saying the Roman Empire was against.

[Historian]

They were early Christians. They were early Christians. Although, you know, I'm going to beat you up on Tacitus a little bit more, you know, because it's one of the things people mentioned. I think you're going to too.

[Investigative Journalist]

Which one? Say that again.

[Historian]

Tacitus. Okay, so I'm not going to beat him up.

[Investigative Journalist]

Okay.

[Historian]

That's for our other friend that spoke. But I, but it's one of the sources that people use. I want to just be clear that when you look at the sources, there's, they're wanting, there's, there's a lot that we don't, that we can't actually prove. And this is the only time that we would use even those sources as a source for historicity. None of them are written during that period. We have anonymous texts that we know have been edited. We can see many of the major narrative, the major life narrative of Jesus occurring in other periods before there was ever a Jesus. We even see.

[Investigative Journalist]

But that's prophecy, though. You could, you could say that's prophecy.

[Historian]

We even see. We even see early Christian. I would love to hear which church would Agree that the narratives of ancient Kemet were prophecy for Christianity. I'd love to see which churches, by the way. There are a few, but they were all black, I just want you to know. But really, the Churchill Black Madonna is one of them. I'm a historian. Listen, I have to stop myself from speaking sometimes. I'll give you lots of sources, but I want you to know that, that when we look at actually trying to find things that can prove that there was someone that did the things that Jesus did, perform these miracles, let's say, with the name Yeshua, we struggle. The best case is the one that comes from the Talmud. And they say there are three. And those descriptions, those aren't. That's not the Jesus you're following. Sometimes people say, we'll say disingenuous continuously. Well, Jesus exists in the Talmud. And they're saying that because they think that the person they're talking to has never read the Talmud. That's usually why they say it. And so the question you have to say is, well, which of the three do you think is Jesus? Because there are three of them. And so there are lots of different ways for us to slice this. I just want to say, when we look at all of these facts, we have to say, even believers have to say, say this is dubious. This is dubious. I'm not talking about your faith. I'm not talking about your belief. If this works for you and makes you a decent person, wonderful. Do it all day long. Twice all day long.

[Investigative Journalist]

It's not only that. It's like, I've seen, like, okay, so my background is in investigative journalism. I've actually studied on how they make our money, how the, how this entire matrix is built. When you see that this is an inversion because the Bible's all about, about Christ and Antichrist. When you realize that this is an inversion of God's message, of the message of Jesus Christ and it is leading to this, it is leading to the same enslavement of the people that Jesus Christ was talking about when he took out the whip and he. He berated the money changers and stuff. This is the world we're living in. We're living in the Antichrist world. Right?

[Historian]

I want you to glance at the screen. Keep looking. Christianity is directly influenced by Kemet a ancient Egypt, and indirectly by mystery traditions supported. I, I just want you to look at that. Sections of the Bible, specifically proverbs, come from comedic texts like the book of Amenemope supported.

[Investigative Journalist]

I'm not saying, I'm not saying. I'M not saying. I'm not saying it wasn't historically influenced. I don't think Christianity just landed and all of a sudden appeared out of nowhere. I think there is historical precedent. I think there's prophecy. I think, you know, people, the mystics, realize that they're. Was something coming.

[Historian]

But how do you call it prophecy when one group of people actually decides that they're going to take liberally from another tradition and then annihilate that tradition?

[Investigative Journalist]

I mean, I don't know if that's something that they did cognitively.

[Historian]

I'm an author. I've written a book, right? If you had found out that Jabari El Sazeh wrote a book and then someone said, wait a minute, this book, word for word, was written by someone else. Well, who's that other person? I don't know. He died and Jabari was. Strangely, he was at the scene of the. Of the murder. You would start saying, wait a minute, something nefarious has occurred.

[Investigative Journalist]

But then you gotta look at humanity and be like, all right, so Napoleon, when he. He made that famous statement of how Jesus Christ was more influential on the world than he could ever be, right? Now when you look at that and you're talking about millions of people that have fallen into this hallucination, is. Are we distrusting humanity so much where we're saying that millions, potentially billions of people are out of their minds? Over 2 billion people, are they out of their mind? Or is there something to this that we might not be able to capture in a literal sense and make it make logical sense in our world, but it is something that nonetheless exists because you got 2 million people that would die for.

[Historian]

I've been. It's not 2 million. It's 2 billion.

[Investigative Journalist]

Sorry, too.

[Historian]

But I want to be clear that I'm someone who was once Christian, right? And some of the most beautiful people that I know are Christian. I'm not even saying that there isn't value in studying many of the. Not all of it. I read the Bible very critically. Not all of it. The misogyny in the Bible is ridiculous. But honestly, when we look at what some really wonderful people have done because. Because those stories have touched their lives, I would be crazy to say you should take it away from them. I'm talking historically now. I think we have to recognize that Christianity came from somewhere.

[Investigative Journalist]

And I agree with that. I agree it came from somewhere as

[Historian]

it came from somewhere. We have to look at where it came from, how it was created, and who sought to author a literal historical tradition, mission that you have to say is the Roman Empire, and it occurs in the third and fourth century. That's what.

[Investigative Journalist]

But the Romans were against Christianity, though, in, in the beginning. I mean, does your time.

[Historian]

I would argue that Christianity would not exist were it not today, were it not for the Roman Empire. The Roman Empire takes this small itinerant thing and makes it essentially this massive tradition. It would not. So when you say the Romans were against Christianity. Christianity, there were some examples of them being against the tradition earlier. But at the same time, you have to say, without the Roman Empire, let's just be clear, what's the largest Christian denomination in the world?

[Investigative Journalist]

Well, Roman and Byzantine. Byzantine Empire carried a lot of the Christian traditions.

[Historian]

Wait, no, you're not answering the question. What's the largest Christian denomination in the world in 2026?

[Host]

Protests.

[Investigative Journalist]

Protestant, probably Roman Catholic.

[Historian]

Roman Catholic, yeah. So let's be very clear that this is what occurred. By the way, look, contradicted, it says

[Host]

largest Christian denomination is the Catholic Church.

[Christian Debater]

Yes,

[Investigative Journalist]

I'm talking, I'm talking. When I say Byzantine, I'm talking about like 302, 300, 400 AD. I'm not talking about modern day, but

[Historian]

the Byzantine Church is part of the Roman Church. You'd realize that, right?

[Investigative Journalist]

Yeah, yeah. I mean, it's a lineage. Yeah, totally.

[Historian]

It's part of the. So you're, you're not describing something different if it was not for Constantine.

[Investigative Journalist]

No, my point is the tradition was carried and was strong enough and it was based upon something real and tangible enough that it made it to 2000. What do you mean?

[Historian]

What do you mean by real intangible? I don't have a problem.

[Investigative Journalist]

Real intangible is like, you know, again, we disagree on this. But real intangible is whatever the 12 disciples saw. Willingness sacrifice one's life for whatever they saw. That to me, is real intangible because people don't walk into death, you know, if they're believing in nothing. Like, you wouldn't. You wouldn't be like, all right, kill me, I'm gonna sing songs now as you're skinning me alive. If you thought that what comes after is not greater than what exists today.

[Historian]

But I, but, but see, what you just said is not about the historicity of Jesus.

[Investigative Journalist]

I mean, I don't know. I'm not talking about the historic city. I'm talking about the real.

[Historian]

But that's what we're talking.

[Investigative Journalist]

I'm talking. I'm talking about the reality of a living Christ existing right this moment.

[Historian]

Now, when you say a living Christ. Yes, Once again, you may be talking about something that is larger than a literal guy that made cabinets and wore sandals with some long.

[Investigative Journalist]

I mean, I don't look at it. This is God we're talking about. There's a manifestation of God.

[Historian]

Well, listen, I'm talking about, I'm really talking about how people use the best teachings of, of the Bible. And there's some amazing teachings of the Bible. Right.

[Investigative Journalist]

I mean, if, if you look at, if you look at what the world was before, the reason we have a semi civilized society right now is because of the Bible. No, because. Because if you, if you go back

[Historian]

in time, I mean, how many millions morality is Christianity? Wait a minute. Come on now. You know you're also talking to the descendants of slaves, right?

[Ankon]

Yeah.

[Historian]

Okay.

[Investigative Journalist]

Yeah. So you know you're talking to this slave too.

[Historian]

But there's no way that you're going to get me to agree that Christianity has been this panacea for the world's ills. Because the reality is that's not what I'm saying. Many of the worst things that have occurred have occurred with people that wore a cross around their neck and said Jesus.

[Investigative Journalist]

Yeah, Crusades. I agree. I mean, used for political purposes. Roman Catholics selling a gateway to heaven. All satanic ideas. Yes, I know, I know the church has been misused for, for corrupt, evil things.

[Historian]

But you're making it sound much more

[Investigative Journalist]

so than good things.

[Historian]

You're making it sound like the world before Christianity was this horrific hellscape. And then Christianity came and now we all agree. I would love for you.

[Investigative Journalist]

That's not what I'm saying. It's still a horrific hellscape. I think it gave us a semblance

[Historian]

of morality, of what the right way was.272 to who? To the 272. Those people that were sold by Georgetown University into more arduous and slavery, enslavement. That institution is still one of the most revered academic institutions in the United States.

[Investigative Journalist]

We just talked about how Christianity has been used for evil a lot. And I agree. So that 272 is a great example.

[Historian]

But then you can't also try to make this sound like Christianity came in the world is better. I don't know.

[Investigative Journalist]

I'm not, I'm. I'm saying, yeah, it is better, but it's like far from. I mean, we're still living in Satan's playground, right? Okay. It's better to the sense of like if you decide to get the message of Christ to get, to improve your life, to improve your Family, to improve your children. You have that option. It's something that you could pick out. I want you to glance at the

[Historian]

screen every now and then.

[Investigative Journalist]

I don't know. To be honest with you, man, AI, I don't know. I don't know if AI is a good like AI. I've searched for, for example, the manuscripts I talked about, Monk manuscripts. I've been to actually Caucuses and I've been to Armenia. I've seen these things. Things you ask AI right now, it'll tell you it doesn't exist. I tell you it exists. I've seen it myself. I've talked to the challenge.

[Historian]

The challenge is that they're not ancient. These are things that people wrote most recently, more recently.

[Investigative Journalist]

Not. Not the stuff I'm talking about. I'm talking. I'm talking about ancient. I mean, I would highly.

[Host]

Those haven't been documented online, so I can't pull it.

[Investigative Journalist]

Yeah, yeah. I mean, it's not like, you know, getting some old Armenian manuscripts from like 1500, 1800 years ago is not going to exist on Chat GPT. It exists, though. I mean, I highly encourage you to go and hang out with some Armenian Orthodox priests and ask them to, hey, what's your. In your traditions? Give me the information you have. What is it?

[Historian]

Listen, I. I do that. Right? I do that. I also have an M. Div. So I enjoy this kind of thing. And I. And I think that some of the folks that are. That are in these traditions, all of them are amazing. Right?

[Sean Kelly]

They're good people.

[Historian]

Right? So I would do that. I would. I would literally do that. But we're talking about historicity now. Okay. I'm not. I don't have my M. Div hat on now. I have my historian hat on now. And so one of the things that I think that we have to just recognize is a great evil was done when these earlier traditions were destroyed. And they were destroyed largely. I wish I could just show you some images now.

[Investigative Journalist]

You're talking about the.

[Historian]

Even the.

[Investigative Journalist]

Them.

[Historian]

Even them. I mean, why did they think they needed.

[Investigative Journalist]

By the way.

[Historian]

Why did some of them think they needed to bury their text in dusty sands in Kemet? Because they began to realize, wait a minute, we're getting wiped out. These texts should still.

[Investigative Journalist]

You know, by the way, I know about this stuff too, because the Gnostics, a lot of them were ancient Armenians. And this. We've actually heard these stories in our. In our culture where when Christianity came. Yeah. They killed a lot of people to cover up what came before that. Because they want to erase that. So I know about this people.

[Historian]

They need to read the book Jesus Wars. Anyone who's seen me on other platforms knows I say it all the time. People nod, almost no one ever reads it. But we need to be aware of how this tradition came into existence. People think that reading the Bible will give them the history of Christianity. It will not. It will not. You have to understand what happened, who did it, why and when. And when you begin to study the historical narrative, you see some things that are really, really disturbing. And this is a real, real concern of mine. And I think you also have to. Let me just finish the sentence. I think you also have to. When you look at some of the texts, even those in Armenia, you'll actually see that those texts are not contemporary to contemporaneous, to create time Christ. And that's the challenge, you know what you're asking. But let me say this. Did, did decent people write something that was supposed to tell people how to live a good life?

[Investigative Journalist]

Sure.

[Historian]

And that's wonderful. We should read them for that purpose. Right. But when we're trying to say this is actually a, a historical narrative and it existed just as we've been told, that's where we get into trouble.

[Investigative Journalist]

I won't argue with you. That's not as, as we've been told old. I, I, because I think a lot of stuff's been, you know, switched around, a lot of lies introduced. My core belief is that, yes, I believe that there was a Jesus Christ. I believe that changed the direction of the world. I believe that this is a living Christ, living figure, and the beating of death. The idea that he was able to beat death, I think is the point of basically telling us that we're in a matrix that is a death matrix. It's all evil. It's all to invert what is right, what is the message of Christ. And you have an avenue there to an afterlife, to living forever like Christ, as long as you realize the matrix we're living in. And if my final point is what, what I've realized is the existence of, of crisis because of the inversion of our laws and how that is their number one goal. Whether it's like the family courts that take away kids, whether it's robbing us of our money in this usury system, everything leads to the opposite of what Christ wanted. If you look at every ill of society right now of what's happening is it is the inversion of Christ.

[Historian]

Some of the people doing it are, are, are some, some of the most pious Christians, at least they say, I

[Investigative Journalist]

mean, but the devil comes in many shapes, brother. You know, you know, you know, that is, somebody could sit up there and be like, I'm Christ, like, I'm Christ, like, and they're a Judas. And there's a lot of deceivers.

[Historian]

Like, I would honestly say there are tons of decisions. Deceivers. I don't know if the answer is Christianity, but I do think that if we were going to link arms and try to fight against some of the evils that, that have happened in this country are still happening, we would agree on, on that. I'm just saying to you, when we try to find a historical tether to the narrative of Jesus Christ, we struggle. The narrative of the disciples, we struggle. And, and I'm going to end with this. For almost 2000 years, when people think of, when people think of resurrection, they think of Jesus. Well, for over 3,000 years, when they thought of resurrection, they use the name Asar.

[Investigative Journalist]

Yeah, yeah.

[Historian]

And so it's, it. We should understand that.

[Investigative Journalist]

By the way, one, one quick point. I want to make sure this could be a cyclical thing too. It could be because if you look at the world, a lot of the things that we're learning now with the floods and all that, how humanity is basically reaches a pinnacle and then it destroys itself and then a new civilization is built. It could be that every cycle is a Christ like character. I don't know. I'm too stupid of a human to know, to know what, what is the reality? I don't think you're stupid. Of the, you know, the different dimensions that, that our eyes don't see. We see 3% of what's out there. Right. But I do think that, my personal opinion, I think there's a core in this that is literally like, you could be evil, you could be good. And that's what, that's what it is. I think all the church, the Christian, the, this that I think it, it puts, when you put titles on stuff, it destroys it. Black, white, whatever. You know what I mean? It creates divisions.

[Ankon]

Right?

[Investigative Journalist]

To me, it's very simple. It's black and white. There's good, there's evil. The word of Christ is good. And then I, what I see, our governments do, the Federal Reserve do, the family law courts do. Everything in this constructed world is an inversion of that.

[Historian]

Everything is evil in this.

[Investigative Journalist]

If you, if, if you have a driver's license, if you actually investigate.

[Historian]

You have a driver's license.

[Investigative Journalist]

I do actually.

[Historian]

Oh, my goodness. You are agreeing with the, with the devil. No, no, no.

[Investigative Journalist]

But I mean, look, everything is evil. I think when you talk about government and what they've constructed, they've constructed. Constructed an evil matrix. I'm not saying everything is evil, okay? I'm saying that the matrix that was created is an inversion of what God wants us to be. That's it. And that is intentional. That is through our money, that is through our familial. That is true. Through our courts. And it's all intentional to basically steal our sovereignty because that's. That's. That's the devil's trick. They want us to make us slaves. They want us to make us physical slaves. They want to make us mental slaves.

[Historian]

Right?

[Investigative Journalist]

And right now, where we are, we're at a pinnacle of mental slavery in human history.

[Christian Debater]

Okay, Okay.

[Investigative Journalist]

I believe.

[Historian]

I think there's a lot for us to agree on, even though there's some things that we don't.

[Host]

That's a lot.

[Investigative Journalist]

We agree on some stuff.

[Historian]

Conversation.

[Investigative Journalist]

Yeah.

[Host]

Thank you, guys. Check out the description. We'll include a link to everyone's social media handles. See you next time. Peace.

[Investigative Journalist]

Thank you.

[Host]

If you learned anything from this episode or got any value at all, please share this episode with a friend. It helps us grow the channel, it helps us grow the podcast, and it means a lot to us. Thank you so much.