AI's Game-Changing Role in Financial Planning | Lucas Winthrop DSH #1208

Summary

Digital Social Hour: AI's Game-Changing Role in Financial Planning | Summary

Episode Overview In episode #1208 of Digital Social Hour, host Sean Kelly engages in an insightful conversation with Lucas Winthrop from Winthrop Wealth. The episode delves into the transformative impact of Artificial Intelligence (AI) on financial planning, exploring themes such as optimization and preservation of wealth, the integration of technology in financial advisory services, cryptocurrency trends, and the evolving dynamics of client-advisor relationships.

---

1. Introduction to Wealth Management

[01:00 - 02:16]

Sean Kelly opens the discussion by highlighting the dual aspects of wealth management: making money and, crucially, maintaining or increasing it. Lucas emphasizes the importance of optimization and preservation in financial planning.

Lucas [01:35]: "Right? That's it, that's the key."

He outlines Winthrop Wealth's client qualifications, noting a soft minimum of $2 million in investable assets. This threshold ensures the firm can provide specialized, high-quality services to high-net-worth individuals, many of whom have significant portions of their wealth tied up in businesses.

Lucas [02:16]: "We want to be able to get shit done together. We want to have a productive relationship. We want to be engaged."

---

2. The Complexity of High Net Worth and Illiquidity

[02:37 - 03:47]

The conversation shifts to the challenges faced by high-net-worth individuals, particularly the illiquidity of assets. Lucas discusses the importance of strategic planning to manage assets that are not easily convertible to cash, emphasizing tax and estate planning to mitigate potential losses.

Lucas [02:49]: "Don't spend it until it's liquid."

He highlights scenarios where substantial net worth is tied to business equity, stressing the necessity of proactive financial strategies to protect and grow such assets.

---

3. Navigating Regulatory Changes and Trade Concerns

[03:53 - 05:26]

Sean brings up impending regulatory changes under the new administration, specifically referencing the Tax Cuts and Jobs Act of 2017, which is set to sunset at the end of 2025. Lucas expresses uncertainty about the future but remains optimistic that the current favorable tax environment might continue under President Trump’s administration.

Lucas [03:58]: "Proper planning along the way is super important."

The discussion also touches on trade wars and tariffs, with Lucas advising clients to focus on proactive financial planning rather than reacting to economic and geopolitical fluctuations.

---

4. Strategic Financial Planning and Client Reactions

[07:11 - 08:26]

Lucas emphasizes the importance of having a well-thought-out financial plan to avoid reactive decision-making during market volatility. He contrasts the anxiety-driven reactions of clients without a plan to the stability offered by a comprehensive strategy.

Lucas [07:19]: "If you had a plan in place... I don't have a plan. I watch my portfolio every day. Every fluctuation... giving me some type of emotional response anxiety."

He advocates for long-term, dynamic planning that can adapt to changing circumstances, ensuring clients remain focused on their financial goals despite market noise.

---

5. The Role of AI in Financial Planning

[12:45 - 19:31]

A significant portion of the episode explores how Artificial Intelligence is revolutionizing financial planning. Lucas discusses AI's capabilities in enhancing forecast accuracy, automating complex calculations, and providing rapid insights that were previously time-consuming.

Lucas [18:10]: "AI... it's making us more accurate in the way that we're able to forecast."

He notes that AI enables financial advisors to offer more personalized and timely advice, transforming traditional financial planning practices. The integration of machine learning allows for more sophisticated goal setting, cash flow management, and investment strategies.

Lucas [18:10]: "It's helped us get to that next level of something that might have taken a month to do can now be done very quickly."

However, Lucas also cautions about the regulatory challenges AI faces in the financial sector, emphasizing the need for robust oversight to ensure ethical and effective application.

---

6. Cryptocurrency: Opportunities and Risks

[19:27 - 25:18]

The dialogue naturally progresses to the topic of cryptocurrency, where Lucas shares his perspectives on both its potential and inherent risks. He categorizes most cryptocurrencies, particularly meme coins, as highly volatile and akin to gambling due to their momentum-driven values and lack of tangible backing.

Lucas [20:17]: "Meme coins are crazy... it's the wild west."

Despite the volatility, Lucas acknowledges the foundational applications of cryptocurrency, especially in money movement and currency conversion, which offer remarkable speed and efficiency compared to traditional banking systems. He foresees significant developments in this space as regulatory frameworks evolve.

Lucas [23:43]: "If we're able to get those rockets up there and go mine these stars... a lot of goods."

The conversation also touches on how institutional investments are beginning to infiltrate the crypto market, potentially stabilizing it but also introducing new dynamics and regulatory considerations.

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7. Technological Advancements and Client Education

[25:22 - 31:15]

Lucas highlights the pivotal role of technology in democratizing financial knowledge. Tools and resources available online, such as YouTube tutorials and financial planning software, empower clients to educate themselves without the need for formal education.

Lucas [12:45]: "I can go on YouTube and learn about it. I can go and access these materials online."

He further discusses how technology facilitates specialization within financial advisory teams, allowing advisors to focus on relationship management while subject matter experts handle complex financial strategies. This collaborative approach enhances the overall quality of service provided to clients.

Lucas [15:21]: "It's 100% about the team that you surround yourself with."

The episode also touches on the evolving nature of workforce demographics in financial services, addressing the challenges and benefits of younger advisors entering a traditionally experience-centric industry.

---

8. Future Trends: Longevity and Space Exploration

[31:15 - 32:21]

In a forward-looking segment, Lucas and Sean explore emerging trends such as the longevity market and space exploration mining. Lucas speculates on how advancements in biohacking and manufacturing innovations could influence economic factors like inflation and commodity values.

Lucas [29:42]: "The cost to go and mine... it's super high."

They discuss the potential economic impact of mining resources from asteroids, considering both the availability of massive gold reserves and the high costs of space operations. These futuristic topics underscore the interconnectedness of technological progress and financial planning.

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9. Conclusion and Contact Information

[32:00 - 32:25]

As the episode concludes, Lucas shares his contact information, encouraging listeners to connect with him via LinkedIn, email, or social media platforms to discuss financial planning needs.

Lucas [32:04]: "They can hit me up on LinkedIn, email address, website, springtherbolt.com Instagram with the quelf."

Sean Kelly wraps up by inviting listeners to reach out and stay connected for future insights and discussions.

---

Notable Quotes with Timestamps

• Lucas [01:35]: "Right? That's it, that's the key."
• Lucas [02:16]: "We want to be able to get shit done together. We want to have a productive relationship. We want to be engaged."
• Lucas [07:19]: "If you had a plan in place... I don't have a plan. I watch my portfolio every day. Every fluctuation... giving me some type of emotional response anxiety."
• Lucas [12:45]: "I can go on YouTube and learn about it. I can go and access these materials online."
• Lucas [18:10]: "AI... it's making us more accurate in the way that we're able to forecast."
• Lucas [20:17]: "Meme coins are crazy... it's the wild west."
• Lucas [15:21]: "It's 100% about the team that you surround yourself with."
• Lucas [25:22]: "If we're able to get those rockets up there and go mine these stars... a lot of goods."
• Lucas [32:04]: "They can hit me up on LinkedIn, email address, website, springtherbolt.com Instagram with the quelf."

---

Final Thoughts This episode of Digital Social Hour offers a comprehensive look into the evolving landscape of financial planning, underscored by technological advancements like AI and the burgeoning realm of cryptocurrency. Lucas Winthrop provides valuable insights into managing complex financial portfolios, highlighting the necessity of adaptive strategies in a rapidly changing economic environment. Listeners gain a deeper understanding of how technology and innovative financial instruments are reshaping wealth management, making this episode a must-listen for those interested in the future of financial planning.

Transcript

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[Lucas]

Just the speed to get educated is so much quicker and it's kind of, I mean that's every industry, right? Yeah, but specifically for our industry, what it's done is that I think it's made it easier for people to come in and if you have the right mentality, if you connect with people and you're good on the relationship side, you can kind of piece together those, those different things.

[Podcast Host]

But foreign guys, we got Lucas from Winthrop wealth here today. We're going to talk about making money and keeping money.

[Lucas]

Right? That's it, that's the key.

[Podcast Host]

Because a lot of people can make money, but what you specialize in is kind of maintaining that or making even more off it. Right.

[Lucas]

Optimization and preservation.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah. Because you deal with high net worth individuals, right?

[Lucas]

I do. But it's all about helping them live life to the fullest. And as you add more complexity, sometimes that's harder to do.

[Podcast Host]

Right. What are the qualifications to work with you?

[Lucas]

It really depends. Like we have a soft minimum of about 2 million. So that means $2 million of investable assets kind of gets you in the door. And that's where kind of makes sense for us from a cost perspective. Because our expenses are high, we have subject matter experts that are coming into the relationship. So about 2 million is kind of our soft minimum. But we have a lot of discretion to work with pretty much anyone who we believe to be a good fit.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Lucas]

And that's the most important thing, Right. Like, we want to be able to get shit done together. We want to have a productive relationship. We want to be engaged. Because at the end of the day, if we can't help you and you don't take the advice, then what are we doing?

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Lucas]

So. Yeah. But I'd say most of our clients are business owners, so typically what we see is that a lot of their net worth is tied up in their business.

[Podcast Host]

Right.

[Lucas]

So high net worth, low liquidity.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah. That's the thing with net worth. Right. Because some people say they're worth like a billion dollars, but it's all in equity on paper, and their liquid net worth is actually nowhere near that.

[Lucas]

Yeah. Don't spend it until it's liquid.

[Podcast Host]

Right? Yeah, yeah. I kind of battle with it because I think liquid net worth is pretty important. You know, people say these crazy numbers, but they can't buy you buy a house or whatever.

[Lucas]

No, you can't buy a house. And you really can't do much with anything that's illiquid. Right. It sits there. But the interesting part about illiquidity, Right. It's still part of your net worth, and so it sits near estate. So the proper planning. Super important to make sure that. Okay, if you're worth a billion dollars. Right. But let's say your liquidity is less than 10%. Well, you have this huge amount of net worth that you technically can't access. Right, Right. But you can do some planning from a tax perspective and an estate perspective to maybe shift some of that out of your estate, use some of your gift gifting exemptions. And a big key for a lot of, I'd say, business owners, especially if you're starting a business, let's say the valuation is potentially low today but has potential to be high tomorrow, is how do we get some of that growth out of your estate?

[Podcast Host]

Absolutely.

[Lucas]

I don't want to give it to the government, and I know you probably don't either. I'd say they're not the best fiduciary of your assets.

[Podcast Host]

There's about to be a lot of changes. Right. With the new administration. So I'm sure you're getting ready for a bunch of stuff.

[Lucas]

Yeah, it's always, you know, there's a lot of noise. I don't think it's anything we haven't seen before, but you never really know until the documents are signed and there's laws in place. One of the big ones was the tax cuts and jobs act, which in 2017, that was part of Trump's administration back in 2017, that was due to sunset at the end of this year, end of 2025. So what does that mean? That means that essentially tax rates were going to go back up and the estate exemptions were supposed to go back down. There's still no perfect 100% clarity on the answer there. But we think that now that Trump's back in office, we'll probably see that extended, which means that hopefully we'll maintain this lower tax rate environment and the exemptions don't get slashed in half because, you know, you've seen everything with inflation and continued growth, those exemptions, like they might sound large now, but they could go away tomorrow. And so proper planning along the way is super important. Absolutely.

[Podcast Host]

Does any of the tariff stuff concern you? Apparently we're in a trade war now with Canada as of yesterday.

[Lucas]

I think we're always in a trade war with somebody. Tariffs, not so much. I mean, it's interesting. Right. So we look at economic data is backwards looking and market data is forward looking. Right. So it's discounting mechanism. I don't really know. And I think that there's so many people who tell you, oh, this is exactly what happens when tariffs come on board. But we look at the last administration and they didn't like tariffs but didn't get rid of a lot of them. Right, Right.

[Podcast Host]

So that's what people don't realize, though. They just associate terrorists with Trump.

[Lucas]

Yeah, but they kept a lot of the terrorists during the last administration. Right. You just didn't hear about it. So I think the whole idea here is you focus on what you can control. Like we can't control if Trump's going to go and put more tariffs on China, Russia or whatever. Right. But what we can focus on is how we respond to what's happening in the economy, geopolitical events, how are we responding to that? And the only way you can respond to that is if you are proactively planning. Right. So instead of reacting, and this is what we talk about, like your favorite.

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[Lucas]

A lot with our clients is if you're reacting, it's because you don't have a plan in place. Like the reaction is that oh shit moment.

[Podcast Host]

Right?

[Lucas]

Right. But if you had a plan in place and they sat down with you and they said, or somebody sat down with you and showed you, like, okay, here's your best case scenario, your worst case scenario, and here's kind of like the median case. So we know that if the market's going to take a dump and it's going to sell off 25%, we're going to be in a recession for a period of time or whatever. Right. That if I told you everything's going to be okay for you, are you going to be that worried versus I don't have a plan. I watch my portfolio every day. Every fluctuation up or down is giving me some type of emotional response anxiety. And I'm reacting to it. And so I turn on CNBC and I hear some warmongering person talk about how the world's going to fall apart and we're all screwed.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Lucas]

And they're trying to elicit some reaction to you from you. The reality is it's mostly noise.

[Podcast Host]

Right?

[Lucas]

Right. The markets are pretty efficient over time. And so if you're a long term investor, what it comes down to is how are you planning along the way? How are we building a dynamic plan that we can respond and not react to what's happening in those variables that we cannot control?

[Podcast Host]

Yeah. How far out are you planning out? Because I feel like stuff changes so fast these days and you hear about these spreadsheet warriors that say, like oh, by the time you're 65, you'll have 10 million in the bank.

[Lucas]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

Is that even worth planning that far ahead?

[Lucas]

I think it depends. Like it's so unique to you as an individual, depending on the makeup of your financial life and just what's happening in your life in general. But I'd say we're really focused on three to five years of planning. And the reason why is you tend to have major shifts and changes in what you want every three to five years. And so let's just take an example of I'm 34, I'm not married. Right. I don't have kids. But if I met someone tomorrow and I dated and got married in three years and started a family, next five, well, what I want today is going to look very different in three to five years. If that scenario played out.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Lucas]

Right. Same thing with right now. If I was to start a business, if that business is going to be sold in five years, well, my priorities have changed, they've shifted. Right. My financial life or my financial makeup looks a little different. And so to five years is really what we like to focus on, on the shorter end of the stick. Now we can project that out as far as our clients want them to or they want to see it, but the reality is it becomes more linear. Right. So linear projections over a 20, 30 year period, it's just how realistic is that? Right, right. There's so many factors that go into that type of planning to that can make such a significant shift over a 20, 30 year period. And so if we focus on three and five years, like that's where we can really be productive.

[Podcast Host]

I agree.

[Lucas]

And we can be more dynamic, we can be more responsive.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah. I've heard some high level people even goal is down to one year.

[Lucas]

Yeah. I mean, look, six months, one year. It depends on how many, like how fast things are moving in your life.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah. An AI industry, for example.

[Lucas]

AI, yeah. So planning, like I'd say most of what we're doing, if it's on the business or kind of individual planning side of things, it's probably at the low end one year. But one to three years is really the sweet spot. And then that five years would be kind of, you know, okay, we're, we're taking a little bit of a, you know, a gamble and going out a little further. But the only reason we do that is we're forecasting out and we're looking at, okay, how is that going to impact the tax side of things, whether individually or on your business? And then the same thing on the estate. So you kind of want to get an idea of what it could look like. But one to three years is really where we can get shit done.

[Podcast Host]

Makes sense.

[Lucas]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

So less than 10% of people in your space are under the age of 35.

[Lucas]

That's.

[Podcast Host]

Do you see that changing the future? Do you feel like part of that's a trust thing? Because of age comes more wisdom.

[Lucas]

People think it's interesting. So I will say I'm 34 and I think I mentioned that my brother who I work with is 36, so two years older. We've been age discriminated against since we started. Right. We. I started in this industry when I was 22, 23 years old.

[Podcast Host]

That's young.

[Lucas]

Yeah. And my brother about the same, maybe two years after me. But we were going to conferences and we were doing all this cool stuff and we're trying to build our platform and people, you know, you have, there's a lot of ego with advisors in our industry. Tons of ego. If you ask my brother Max and I, what we're in the business of, we're in the business of killing advisor egos. Because once you kill advisor egos, you can get down to like the brass tacks of how do we help people, how do we help them live life to the fullest. Right, right. But anyway, so starting out young, like we got a lot of kind of age discrimination just because we were young. And typically this industry prides himself on experience. I've been doing this for 30 years. What do you know? You've only done it for 10. Right. I don't think that, obviously I do think that there is something to be said about experience. I think experience is absolutely important. We have a multi generational team, so we bring that experience in house across different ages. But at the end of the day it's about how are you able to help the end client. And with technology we've been able to bridge some of that experience gap a lot quicker. Right. So if you've been doing this industry for 30, 40 years. Well, the technology in our industry has only really been really good for the last decade. So I. Perfect timing for me when I came in, right.

[Podcast Host]

You say technology, what are you referencing with that?

[Lucas]

I think just in general. So it'd be everything from financial planning, technology, the investment management, kind of screening. Like good example would be you used to have to talk to somebody who worked for a mutual fund company. Right. To be able to get all the data, all the statistics, all the different analytical information that you wanted to know if that was a fund that you want to invest right now at that. About 10 years ago, maybe even 15 years ago, it was really primarily a relationship business. Right. Oh, I have my wholesaler. They come to the office, they'd meet with me, they'd tell me why their fund is so amazing. They introduced me to their portfolio managers. And then now that's just become so accessible online. Right. Like, the tools have gotten so good and providing all the information, so you don't necessarily need to meet with those people anymore to get the information that you did back then. And so I think just the speed and accessibility to information and shifts and changes in what we're doing, whether it's from tax planning or investment management, the information's at your fingertips. And then also being able to use these tools to educate yourself. Right. I. I don't have to go take a course, you know, at a college to learn about a certain financial planning topic. Right. I can go on YouTube and learn about it. I can go and access these materials online. And so I think just the speed to get educated is so much quicker. And it is kind of. I mean, that's every industry, right?

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Lucas]

But specifically for our industry, what it's done is I think it's made it easier for people to come in. And if you have the right mentality, if you connect with people and you're good with. On the relationship side, you can kind of piece together those. Those different things. But at the end of the day, what I say is it's 100% about the team that you surround yourself with. And so personally, I don't consider myself, I'd say I'm not an expert in anything, but I have the expert on my team. Yeah, right. I'm really good at managing relationship. I can understand what you want and I can go get you the answer, and I'll bring that tactical person into the relationship to execute. And so I think that that shift has also started to happen in our industry, where typically it used to be the. Again, we talk about big egos. It was, I'm the guy. Right. I'm your guy. I'm your gal. I'm the person who is your investment person, your financial planner. I own the business and I do all these other things, and that's just not. It doesn't work. It's not realistic anymore. There's too much complexity, regulation for one person to be able to do all those things extremely well.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah, I agree.

[Lucas]

And so you kind of need specialization, and the specialization in a team structure that you can collaborate is essentially where we've focused. And we had some tremendous success in building that kind of cultural collaboration with subject matter expertise, where advisors can be really good relationship managers, but they don't have to know everything about everything they can note. They have to be dangerous enough to talk about it. And, like, if we're having a conversation to say, okay, I think this is the direction that we need to go, but let me pull in my subject matter expert who's going to go really deep.

[Podcast Host]

Right.

[Lucas]

And then you kind of become the person who has to kind of distill that down into something that a client could digest because it can get very technical.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah. Hiring wealth advisors, for me, has been a game changer.

[Lucas]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

I'm part of DO wealth. Have you heard of them?

[Lucas]

Do.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah, Jim, do.

[Lucas]

I don't think I have, no.

[Podcast Host]

They're not, like, a huge one. But what drew me to them was they have a mastermind every quarter, so I get to meet all their other clients, and I'm the youngest one, so, like, I just get to learn like a sponge. Yeah, it's worth it. They help me buy a house. They help me mitigate taxes, and it saved me more than I paid, if that makes sense.

[Lucas]

There you go.

[Podcast Host]

So, like, I pay 72k a year, but they've saved me more than that.

[Lucas]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

So for me, it's like an R.O.I. almost.

[Lucas]

Oh, absolutely.

[Podcast Host]

And some of the connections I made in the mastermind, I mean, have led to huge podcast guests, sponsorships, and future money down the road. So.

[Lucas]

Yeah, that's amazing. I mean, what's really cool about our job, or my job is I get to work with extremely successful people. Right. And you get to kind of see, okay, well, what's made you successful?

[Podcast Host]

Right?

[Lucas]

And everyone has in their own right, you know, their little touch and what their little secret sauce is. But it's funny because when it gets down to, like, the actual. What makes someone successful? They've done three things really well, right? They know how to get work, they know how to do the work, and they get paid. Right.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Lucas]

It's like every business does those three things. And so you take that and then you put it in any industry, and you start to see, okay, well, what outside of that, like, how do they become so successful? And you get to see all these movies. And then for me, what makes it super fun is, like, if I'm talking to you and you're my client and you're struggling with something or you're trying to figure something out. Attack side of Things for the type of business that you're working in. I might have another client who has some very similar situation and we have something that we've done for them that might be interesting to you. And so either maybe connecting you guys so you can talk about it or even trying to say, okay, well, I've seen this movie before. Here's something that might work, that worked for somebody else.

[Podcast Host]

Right. Because you've seen a lot at this point, 10 years in now, right?

[Lucas]

Yeah. So I'm about, well, more than 10 years.

[Podcast Host]

12. Because you said you're 34, started 22.

[Lucas]

Yeah, about 12 years.

[Podcast Host]

Quick math. I love it, man. Are a lot of your clients getting into AI or like any future tech stuff?

[Lucas]

Yeah, I think. I mean, AI is everywhere. I think it's been around a lot longer than people actually think it has. Well, I know it has. Right. It's just when are we able to interact with it in a. In a way that is meaningful? I think that's probably been over the last few years. And why you've seen AI is, you know, I haven't gone to a conference or, you know, turned on a TV and haven't seen something to do with AI in the last like two, three years. And so, yeah, I think AI in general, it's. We get a lot of questions about it and how it's applied to what we do. For us, I think it's just making us more accurate in the way that we're able to forecast, you know, the machine learning of how are we putting goals into a systematic format and tying that into potentially like cash flow and investment advice. It's just helped us get to that next level of something that might have taken a month to do can now be done very quickly.

[Podcast Host]

Right.

[Lucas]

And so the speed to get answers or do the work has definitely increased. Yeah, I think that's everywhere, right?

[Podcast Host]

It is. It's going to be interesting to see how it enters your space if people start using AI for like, investment advice, stock advice, crypto advice, stuff like that.

[Lucas]

They already are.

[Podcast Host]

Like, I'm hearing about it. Yeah. I haven't seen any mainstream ones, but yeah.

[Lucas]

And the problem is, like, we're in such a regulated industry, and so AI in a regulated industry needs to be really regulated.

[Podcast Host]

Right.

[Lucas]

And right now, like, you know, the. All these large language models, you know, they're looking at certain applications for industry, but most more so at the institutional level where they can keep it in house. But I bet there's someone out there who's going to be a disruptor and comes up with some model that works extremely well for financial planning, especially for Mass Affluent, which is like, I don't need to talk to a person right now. I just want some general advice, and here's all my information. Can you ingest it and give me an answer or some recommendations? Yeah, I think that is a huge application that you'll start seeing probably in the next one to three years.

[Podcast Host]

Or any of your clients asking about crypto.

[Lucas]

Yeah, they'll ask about crypto. It's funny. We talk about, like, the shitcoins, right?

[Podcast Host]

Yeah, the meme coins.

[Lucas]

Meme coins. Shitters. Whatever you want to call. Yeah, Meme coins are crazy. I mean, it's the wild west, right? It's kind of like, go. You might. In my. In some cases, you might want to go to the casino and hit the roulette table. And it's. Yeah, the odds are just as good. Maybe even better sometimes at the casino. I don't know.

[Podcast Host]

Last night. Oh, my go, God, the market tanked last night.

[Lucas]

And so, like, it's. The volatility is crazy, right? And there's no. I mean, it's pure momentum. Most of these meme coins, like, they. The community is where the value is, but the community can blow up in less than 24 hours, right? And so, like, it's. It's. It's a. It is the wild West. I think that you'll probably see some stability in some of the larger, you know, more scalable coins. But the meme coins, like, I just. It's a gamble. I. We get client questions all the time about meme coins. You know, my son, who's 10 years old, like, put a hundred dollars in something and made 10 grand in an hour. That's just. It's a. It's definitely a disruption to what we do, for sure, because you create this. I don't know if you'd call it like, a FOMO effect. It is, but it is a FOMO effect, right? Like, you hear about all your friends who got into some meme coin and made a ton of money. By the time you hear about it, it's too late. Way too late. The old adage in the investment management was, if you hear the shoeshine boys talking about a stock, it's time to sell it. Right? So kind of like that telephone game. I don't know how some of these people. I've done some research. I don't think they sleep.

[Podcast Host]

They don't. If you sleep, you'll lose, usually. Yeah. And I think it's like, 97% of people on pump fund lose money.

[Lucas]

I believe it.

[Podcast Host]

And I know stocks are similar, but it's just crazy with crypto because it happens so much quicker.

[Lucas]

Oh, you was the term being rugged?

[Podcast Host]

Yeah, yeah. Like that won't happen with a regulated stock overnight.

[Lucas]

No. It might go down, but you're not going to blow up the whole company overnight. Right. And if it does, there's an. At least there's some type of like, value. Right. Whether it's a building that the company owns or their equipment. What's the value in a meme coin?

[Podcast Host]

Nothing you could argue that for. Not even just meme coins. For most of crypto.

[Lucas]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

Other than the top five, 10 coins, there's not much value.

[Lucas]

It is a wild west. I do think that it's something that. Here's where I see a massive application for crypto. Right. Money movement. Right. And if they can figure out the regulation, to do this in a, in a regulated way, the speed to be able to move and convert different currencies is insane. Right. Like if I wanted to send $100,000 via wire to, let's say to Greece, right?

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Lucas]

Not only do I have to go to the bank physically, right. I have to go to the bank, I have to convert my US Dollars to whatever currency it is that I'm going to be sending. Right. There's a fee for that. It's probably gonna be pretty high. And then when I send the wire, if it's an international wire, it could take a couple days to actually be deposited and arrived in the account.

[Podcast Host]

Sometimes a week.

[Lucas]

Sometimes a week. I did went to Turkey once and it was, it was almost a month.

[Podcast Host]

Jesus.

[Lucas]

Yeah. And you know, they're, they say, well, we've never lost an international wire. I know it's not lost, but it's just in limbo for a month. And so I can open up my wallet on my phone, I can convert from Bitcoin to Ethereum to Solana in a second, and I can send that money wherever I want quickly. And so you look at the speed, the ability to convert currency and transfer money using the cryptocurrency, it's insane. And so everything's going to have to catch up to that at some point. So I do think that there are applications there that are, are going to have significant impact on how we transfer and convert currency.

[Podcast Host]

Agreed. And potentially no capital gains tax on US based crypto companies. That's exciting. Yeah, that's huge.

[Lucas]

That'd be great.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah. There's a lot of day traders and people in crypto. 3.5, I think. What? Trillion market cap right now.

[Lucas]

Yeah. Something crazy.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah. 3.5. It just passed Nvidia, so I believe it's number six overall. They get past gold, too.

[Lucas]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

Pretty nuts. It might hit number one one day.

[Lucas]

I wouldn't be surprised. And again, like, it could also blow up. Right. I don't.

[Podcast Host]

Well, it does blow up. It's just cyclical, so it's hard to predict that. They say every four years, but who knows? But now with institutional money getting into it, I'm sure a lot of funds are getting into crypto now.

[Lucas]

Yeah. I think the. Not only institutional, but I do think that the government. Most governments are sneaky and they have a little. They have a lot of exposure to all these other assets, whether it's for, you know, just participation or whatever other reasons, like they're all involved. Yeah, right.

[Podcast Host]

Do you ever recommend, like, gold or silver to your clients? Small little percent.

[Lucas]

Yeah, I think it's. It's always good to. To hold some gold. Right. It's funny, I get that question. The other day we were sitting upstairs and, you know, the question was like, should I buy gold and should I have the physical gold or should I buy the etf, Right. I think it really depends on what you're trying to accomplish and how it fits into your portfolio. You know, gold historically has been the stable. Right. And I think, honestly, personally, I own the etf. It's easy, it's cheap. But I also have heard some pretty interesting things when it comes to silver. Right. Silver. What I've heard is. So I have a friend who said that he buys a physical commodity. He holds silver. He's got it in safes all over the place. And he says, well, silver. Silver is in every single electronic that's made. Right? We know that. Right. It's a big, big commodity when it comes to especially electronics. And he said that if you look at the silver contracts, people who hold silver but don't have, haven't taken delivery of it. If they were ever to call and take their. Get the physical asset, that this. There's not enough silver that's been mined to be able to produce it.

[Podcast Host]

Whoa, they oversold it.

[Lucas]

This is a theory, right. I don't know if it's real. I haven't done my diligence on it. But I could believe, if you think about it, right. How much silver is being utilized. And if you look at almost every single electronic device that's ever been created has silver, right. You look at the AI graphics chips, the GPUs that they're building, like, silver is like one of the key components. Right. Every tv, every laptop, cell phone. So there's a lot of silver being put into goods that we're manufacturing. But there's also a lot of people who hold silver who don't actually have. Haven't taken physical delivery of the. The assets. So it's just. It's interesting when you think about things like that and say, oh, well, if that's real, then. Then there's a big problem.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Lucas]

Right. And that's what kind of scares me about certain things, like crypto. It's like, okay, like, what do I own? Right. Is it. It's not something physical.

[Podcast Host]

Right. That's why I like to see it. Physically, I'm a fan of like, real estate and actual gold, but at the same time, you can't have a ton of gold because how are you going to transport that?

[Lucas]

So, I mean, you could, right? You could.

[Podcast Host]

It'd be annoying, but. Yeah.

[Lucas]

But walk around with Floyd Mayweather. Yeah. There's a couple states that you can still pay. You should look this.

[Podcast Host]

You could pay in gold in some places.

[Lucas]

Yeah. So there's a couple of states that still accept gold as legal tender.

[Podcast Host]

Really?

[Lucas]

Yeah. So you can literally go in, I think, gold and silver, and you could shave off a piece of gold. And they had their. The state law requires them to accept it as legal.

[Podcast Host]

10. Wow.

[Lucas]

Now, whether that's true in the establishment. We'll do it. That's another. That's a whole other question. But yeah, there's states that still accept gold and silver as legal tender.

[Podcast Host]

That's interesting. Which is pretty cool. I've also heard the conspiracy theory that there's gold and silver on other planets and asteroids and stuff. So when we eventually get into space, there'll be even more. So it would kind of lower the value, technically.

[Lucas]

Yeah. Well, they talk about these, like, the asteroids that are solid gold. Right. And things that are lurking around our solar system that are just, you know, it's more gold concentrated in one little rock than we've mined in our whole Earth.

[Podcast Host]

Crazy.

[Lucas]

Yeah. So if we're able to, you know, if you able to get those rockets up there and go mine these stars. That's some crazy.

[Podcast Host]

I mean, we're looking closer and closer. That might happen within our lifetime at the rate they're going at him and Bezos.

[Lucas]

Oh, yeah. Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

I mean, it's super impressive.

[Lucas]

Yeah, it's wild. Interesting to think what that would do to just a general value of a lot of goods. Right. If we were able to. I mean, the cost to go mine, it is one thing. Right?

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Lucas]

So you have to factor that in. It's kind of like you look at a lot of. It's cool. I've been here in Park City, and I know you've met some of the longevity folks and you've interviewed a bunch of them. We talk about this idea of longevity market and how are we factoring in our age and living better into. Lost my train of thought.

[Podcast Host]

Longevity market, biohacking, living longer.

[Lucas]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

Inflation, maybe.

[Lucas]

Oh, the cost. Yeah. So the cost. Right. So we talk about the cost of manufacturing, and so just like we were talking about gold, and we have to go up and get it if it's on a star. Right. There's a cost of going and getting it, which means that the manufacturing cost to build those rockets and get up there is super high, which potentially means that the impact it would have on the value of something that we currently have wouldn't be significant to destroy the value.

[Podcast Host]

Right, got it.

[Lucas]

But this whole idea of manufacturing is the longevity market. We look at these biohackers, the million billionaire biohackers that are innovating, and they're doing these things that cost, you know, $100,000 or a million dollars a year that they're spending on their longevity. Right. Well, they're pushing the edge in a good way. Whether you. Some of the things they're doing are contentious or not, that probably are. That's okay. But they're doing it. They're first movers. And so if they're able to continue to do that, what we start to see in the back end is the innovation in the manufacturing of these things. Whether it's a product like a light bed or some type of therapeutic device, it gets better. And when manufacturing gets better, it also drives costs down. Right. Because the first time you manufacture something like manufacturing be super expensive.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah.

[Lucas]

We don't maybe have the. We have to innovate in manufacturing, too, in order to reduce the cost that it takes to produce a product.

[Podcast Host]

Makes sense.

[Lucas]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah. You're seeing that with Brian Johnson. He spent millions a year, but he's gotten it down. So he sells it on his site for a couple hundred bucks.

[Lucas]

Yeah, exactly. Right. So, like, the first person or the first company to do it, like, they're innovating, innovation costs a lot of money. But if they're able to get some type of traction. Right. They're able to start reducing the cost and it becomes more accessible to the general public.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah. You're seeing that with space travel is super expensive to go right now, but they'll probably get it down over time and one day you and I will. It's too expensive for me right now, but I think it's like a million or something. Right?

[Lucas]

I mean, but do you want to go out there?

[Podcast Host]

Let's let some people go first.

[Lucas]

You know, let's just like the people who went down the bottom of the ocean.

[Podcast Host]

I'm like, I would never do that.

[Lucas]

I'm like, that's. I don't want. I'm not. I don't belong down there.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah, that one I don't know. That one's not for me.

[Lucas]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

I'm already worried with all these plane crashes going on. I'm not trying to do anything risky these days.

[Lucas]

I know.

[Podcast Host]

You know?

[Lucas]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

Well, Lucas, it's been core. Where can people learn more about you, get in touch with you?

[Lucas]

Oh, yeah, they can hit me up on LinkedIn, email address, website, springtherbolt.com Instagram with the quelf. Cool. I'm always on the socials and hanging out online, so absolutely happy to talk to anybody.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah, shoot them a message, guys. We'll link your stuff below. Thanks for hopping on.

[Lucas]

Hey, thank you. Absolutely.

[Podcast Host]

Check them out, guys. See you next time.

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