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Digital Social Hour
Dr. Trish Leigh: Why Young Men Are Getting Performance Issues So Fast | DSH #1787
00:33:55
P*** didn’t used to be like this. Now it’s 100 tabs at once, endless novelty, and a dopamine loop that’s quietly breaking a generation of men. In this episode, Sean sits down with returning guest Dr. Trish Lee (author of Mind Over Explicit Matter) to talk about what she’s seeing on the front lines: p*-induced performance issues**, “edging” behavior, dopamine dependency, relationship breakdown, and why so many young men are ending up on TRT without asking the real question: what’s driving the dysfunction? They also go deeper than p***: social media, paid-content platforms, dating apps, “simp culture,” toxic masculinity, and how the algorithm rewards hyper-s****l content + drama while real life starts feeling “boring.” Most importantly: Dr. Trish lays out how dopamine regulation is fixable (neuroplasticity), what a “digital dopamine detox” actually looks like, and why healthy masculinity isn’t loud… it’s regulated. What you’ll learn 👇 ✅ Why “edging” can be one of the most damag...
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- [00:00]
A
Now, with the click of a button, you can get any genre, any type of person, any acts. You can get 100 of them at one time. 100 tabs, 200 tabs. And people do that. Edging, it's called where people go from tab to tab to tab to tab and edging. You know this term?
- [00:16]
B
I heard of it, but I didn't know if people did it with porn.
- [00:18]
A
Oh, yeah, it is rough. That is, people who edge are the worst off of the people that I see. Some of them are non functional, honestly, like nonfunctional in society. Can't get the job they want. Definitely can't get the relationship they want. Their brains feel like mush, Depressed and anxious at all times. Edging basically is. You keep looking for that video, that person, that scene, to finally have an orgasm too. But the whole time they're flooding their brain in dopamine. Very high levels of dopamine. And that desensitizes the D2 receptors in the brain.
- [00:56]
B
Okay, guys, returning guest. It's been a while. She's been crushing it in the social media scene. Dr. Trish just did a jubilee video, Right?
- [01:02]
A
Yeah. Yeah.
- [01:03]
B
How'd that go?
- [01:04]
A
It went great, I think, at least.
- [01:06]
B
Middle ground, right?
- [01:07]
A
Middle ground, yeah, it was very. I really appreciated that they allowed the conversation to unfold and, you know, find the middle ground. So I thought that was cool.
- [01:16]
B
What was your goal going into that?
- [01:18]
A
My goal was to stay in peace and to be intentional and to, you know, make good points, but not attack anybody and to hold the temperature of the room. And I think I did it well.
- [01:29]
B
Done because I know a lot of people have an emotional connection to porn, so when you tell them to stop watching it, they get mad. Right?
- [01:35]
A
Yeah. And especially porn performers, you know, it. It, you know, insults the lifestyle that they're living. So to have empathy for that, but also to try to make some points about what's healthy versus unhealthy for people.
- [01:48]
B
Yeah.
- [01:49]
A
You know.
- [01:49]
B
So has there been any new information since the last time we saw each other? New studies or anything that are.
- [01:53]
A
Yeah, there's a lot going on. There's always new studies. There's so many studies. So my book came out. It's called Mind Over Explicit Matter. The important part of that is it had over 400 studies in it. And the publisher actually made me take some studies out. They're like, you don't have to cite that. You know what I'm like. But I want the world to know. Everything in this book has science behind it. There's so much so much science. I just got done doing a study of 201 brains that are addicted to pornography. Those are people, men, 201 people who have porn horn induced erectile dysfunction. My goal, which I'm in the midst of doing, is getting it into the scientific literature. And there's a lot of FMRI studies that are out there, but none using EEG with such a big study. So that's cool findings.
- [02:43]
B
Wow. So if you're addicted, there's a good chance you could develop erectile dysfunction.
- [02:47]
A
Oh yeah, it's the number one pain point erectile dysfunction. Has there actually one. Speaking of studies, one study shows that over 70% of men who have erectile dysfunction under the age of 40 were big time porn users.
- [03:05]
B
Damn, that's so high.
- [03:06]
A
Yeah, very high, Very high percent. We are going to have a generation of men with sexual arousal dysfunction. And I know people think it's hyperbole, but it's not. You know, I talk to 18 year olds, 20 year olds, full blown ed from porn. But the good news is, you know, neuroplasticity, you can heal your brain and bring it back. But that's going to be the biggest wake up call for people. I liken it to the smoking industry. Smoking industry. There was, you know, big tobacco saying that, you know, smoking's fine, it helps you relax, which it does, but you know, they were withholding the information that it's highly addictive, causes cancer and that secondhand smoke is real. So I want people to know that porn is highly addictive. That's not really debated anymore. Erectile dysfunction is the number one thing that will come to pass if you continue watching porn and it affects your relationships.
- [04:04]
B
Absolutely. Is this mainly a male issue?
- [04:06]
A
Yes. And it's on the rise with women, but it's predominantly male.
- [04:12]
B
Wow, I wonder what the numbers are. I've heard some crazy stats on how many guys watch it.
- [04:16]
A
Yeah, the numbers are, they're huge considering. Those are the people admitting it. Those are the people who are willing to, you know, go to a study and, or survey and say that, yeah, I watch porn. Which still the vast majority of people aren't in, you know, that place where they're willing to put it out there.
- [04:33]
B
You think most people can't control their addiction towards it?
- [04:36]
A
No, they cannot. I know they can't. You know, I work with thousands of people personally, plus I have my YouTube channel where there's millions of people interacting. It's a dopamine dependency. So once you get past a certain point, it's compulsive use. So once you get past that, you need to consume it to not feel bad. It's no longer a habit to feel good.
- [05:00]
B
Yeah. I feel like our generation, since it became videos because our parents used the magazines, I guess it wasn't as bad, I don't know. But now it's so easy to get it.
- [05:09]
A
Yeah. You know, I mean, magazines, they're 1D, right? They're 1D. They're one dimensional. And there's like, you know, there were nine people in it. Now you can, with the click of a button, you can get any genre, any type of person, any axe. You can. You can get a hundred of them at one time. 100 tabs, 200 tabs. And people do that, you know, edging, it's called where people will go from tab to tab to tab to tab. And what? Edging. You know this term?
- [05:36]
B
I heard of it, but I didn't know people did it with porn.
- [05:38]
A
Oh, yeah, it is rough. That is, people who edge are the. The worst off of the people that I see. Some of them are non functional, honestly. Like non functional in society. Can't get the job they want. Can't. Definitely can't get the relationship they want. Their brains feel like mush, you know, depressed and anxious at all times. Edging, basically, as you keep looking for that video, that person, that scene, to finally have an orgasm too. But the whole time they're flooding their brain in dopamine, very high levels of dopamine. And that desensitizes the D2 receptors in the brain.
- [06:19]
B
So are you against porn or masturbation or both?
- [06:22]
A
Like, well, let me be clear. I'm not against anything. Just to be really clear, like, I didn't decide one day, oh, I'm against this. Like, like this isn't a moral thing. This isn't an opinion thing. I'm highly concerned for sure. Like, this fell into my lap and I'm like. My mind was literally blown away that I really believe society as we know it is going to take a huge hit. So I'm very concerned about porn and masturbation.
- [06:49]
B
Yeah. So even masturbation without porn.
- [06:52]
A
Yes. But let me give you a butt with that one. Compulsive masturbation without porn. More specifically for people who have consumed porn.
- [07:03]
B
Okay.
- [07:03]
A
Because you're not really going to find a person who didn't. It's not compulsive. Like a person who's masturbated three times in their life. I'm not concerned about that person. Right. You know what I mean? But the Person who used to watch porn. And again, you know, I work with thousands of them. They used to watch porn. They get over that hurdle. They can't stop masturbating. You know, and there's a lot of people. I think masturbation's actually a greater concern than porn, but porn is the impetus for it. You know, they go hand in hand.
- [07:32]
B
You saw the clip of my friend Jeremy four times a day.
- [07:35]
A
Yeah. No, there's.
- [07:36]
B
That would drain me totally.
- [07:38]
A
That's what. Well, you know, about the only fans, performers who had sex with 10, 57 people. She was on. Yeah, she was on. And I'm like, that sounds exhausting. You know what I mean? That just sounds totally exhausting. And, you know, who really wants? Wants. Like, let's talk about wants. Who wants to masturbate four times a day? People don't. When they get quiet with themselves and they think they have to do it, they really do. They have to get a little dopamine hit to get through the next hour, the next two hours, the next day. And if you are masturbating four times a day, your brain is very dysregulated and it has high levels of brain dysfunction.
- [08:22]
B
Wow.
- [08:23]
A
And that's what I've seen in my study.
- [08:25]
B
Does that mess up their body producing dopamine in other areas of life?
- [08:28]
A
Yeah. And testosterone, right?
- [08:31]
B
Yeah.
- [08:31]
A
Your brain controls. It's the supercomputer. It controls your mind and your body. Testosterone is first made in the brain, in an axis in the brain, which then goes down to the genitals. And, you know, it's all connected, but your brain's running the show. So it basically confuses most of the neurochemicals and the hormones in a person's body. So people get significant physical and psychological and cognitive thinking issues.
- [08:57]
B
Yeah. I'd be curious to see a testosterone test with people addicted versus not.
- [09:01]
A
I've seen it. Some of my clients, they, you know, they're curious. Well, many of my clients are on testosterone replacement. And, you know, for any of your viewers who are on testosterone replacement without considering their porn use, like, think again. You have to. You have to think to yourself, you know, why am I on testosterone? It's normalized right now. But, you know, if you consume porn, it's definitely a factor. But many of my clients will have their testosterone tested before they work with me and after. And it regulates, and they feel a lot better.
- [09:32]
B
I bet. I met someone last week at an event, 29 years old on TRT. I was like, oh, my gosh.
- [09:37]
A
Yeah. Why you Know, so much of this is logical if you just take a step back and go, why is this happening to me? Or why is this happening to my friends or to society? Like, you know, why do young men need testosterone, replacement porn, but also social media and only fans, and they're all super normal stimuli. They give your brain too much dopamine.
- [10:00]
B
I can't even scroll on Instagram without seeing half naked girls.
- [10:03]
A
Yeah, that's. It's completely hypersexualized for most people. And it's, you know, it's a commodity, it's consumerism now. It's transactional. I'm working on my next book and that's what the whole thing is on. And I've already started to do the deep dive into the research on how social media is affecting, you know, not only people's brains, but mostly their relationships.
- [10:28]
B
Wow. Well, it's definitely shortening attention spans.
- [10:30]
A
Oh yeah. It's down to, you know, under seven seconds. Goldfish have, you know, goldfish, where they used to be kind of their famed acclaim was they had a short attention span. Now humans have shorter one. Right.
- [10:42]
B
Crazy, right? How do you think it's affecting relationships, social media?
- [10:46]
A
Well, that is exactly the through line of what I want people to really consider. And before I share that with you, the number one thing that men say to me when they work with me is they want either a relationship or they want their relationship back. Because usually it's destroyed.
- [11:02]
B
Yeah.
- [11:02]
A
So like, that's why this conversation about relationships is so important, because it gets so distorted on social media. But, you know, what's happening is the dopamine associated with the people that are being viewed, you know, begins to take precedence over the lower amount of dopamine in your, your real life relationship. But if you weren't on social media getting those high levels of dopamine, your relationship and your sex life would be the highest dopamine producing activity, especially sexual one, that you had. So your brain would keep craving your partner, not the people that you're consuming. You don't know them, you don't have a real relationship. But people begin to think they do, partially because their brains become so dysregulated, so the thought processes become so distorted, but mostly because that's where the dopamine is.
- [11:55]
B
That's a good point. It's damn addicting. Just scrolling on social media and I'd rather do that than most things in real life.
- [12:01]
A
Yeah. And then what is that? What does that end up doing to, you know, people? It makes them not build companies, not do the work, the delayed gratification of being on purpose and having a passion. Anything worthwhile takes constant effort. That is rewarding, but not compared to the dopamine hits you get, luckily.
- [12:24]
B
So I do it in a specific way. I designate time to do it at the end of the day. So I'm not scrolling during the day, I'm doing it at night. And I'm doing it for research purposes. I'm looking for viral people. I think that's how I found you, honestly. So.
- [12:36]
A
But that's intention, right? And you feel the hits anyways, but it's still intention.
- [12:40]
B
Most people are just scrolling for fun, though.
- [12:42]
A
They are. And they. They look up and they've been doing it for two hours.
- [12:45]
B
Yeah.
- [12:46]
A
You know, my son's 21 and he's really cool. He and his friends are cool. They all have different types of, like, you know, screen apps to help them. Like his. He can only go on for five minutes five times a day.
- [12:58]
B
Oh, yeah, I used to do that for. For certain games. The games are addicting too.
- [13:02]
A
Yeah. You know.
- [13:03]
B
Yeah, that's cool. Resetting the dopamine system. Is that, Is that possible?
- [13:08]
A
Yeah, absolutely. You know, and that's the beauty of neuroplasticity. But it requires, you know, intention. What it requires is no longer desensitizing from high levels of dopamine. So that means no porn, no masturbation, you know, limiting your social media to motivation and intention. No onlyfans, no dating apps. You know, I have. I feel the need to name them all because people go, okay, no porn. But then there's more married men on dating apps and on OnlyFans than unmarried men.
- [13:39]
B
What?
- [13:39]
A
Like, why you there, friend? You're there for the dopamine hits. You really have to think to yourself, why am I doing this? It's for dopamine. So you're married. Get off those things and connect your brain back to your life. And then. So it's a. It's a digital dopamine detox. And then I like people to dopamine stack in their real life. But my work becomes pivotal. And in my book, I describe all the steps that people can do at home in a similar way. But my work, I use advanced technology. I can see how a person's brain is performing. I can see the dysfunction, the areas and the levels. It's mind blowing for people. Yeah, it's really cool. People love it. It's called a brain map.
- [14:21]
B
Really?
- [14:21]
A
Yeah.
- [14:22]
B
You hooked up to a machine when you do that?
- [14:23]
A
No, it's all at home now. So there's hardware that people can purchase for when people use my Link. It's like $200, totally affordable for most people. Then I have my own app, Dr. Trish Lee, and it's a white label app for the largest neurofeedback company in the world that I've been working with. I have a very tight collaborative relationship for over a decade.
- [14:44]
B
Nice.
- [14:45]
A
So, yeah, so it's really cool. So I can see how a person's brain performs then. I've mastered the protocols for porn addiction and dopamine dependency. Actually, I've created them, then I've mastered them. Most people don't even know about this. And actually the tech needs updating because of the limited knowledge in this realm. But long story short, I can use the technology to have a person engage in brain workouts. It's all natural. Just like if you're gonna get your body fit, you gotta work out. Right. You want a fit body, you gotta eat well. You have to work out and you have to stay the course. So that's what my work does. It takes a person's brain from the level of dysfunction that they're at, and it begins reducing it immediately. And the goal is to get to the optimized brain pattern. But even if you start reducing it a little now, you don't have to go on social media now. You can stay away from porn now. You find your partner more attractive. You know all those things.
- [15:39]
B
That is so cool. And what's the typical timeframe from like addict to normal?
- [15:44]
A
Four months is my program.
- [15:45]
B
Four months.
- [15:46]
A
Yeah. And it's four months on purpose, obviously. I wouldn't have people sign up if four months later you weren't better. Right?
- [15:51]
B
Yeah. So that's on average 50 minutes a day for four months.
- [15:54]
A
Yeah. Usually people, I have them do 30 minute sessions. And I will tell you, all the people with Ed, they do double sessions a day, but that's an hour. And if you were watching porn, you probably have an extra hour on top of that to do other things. You know what I mean?
- [16:08]
B
Yeah. Wow. Ed, you could fix that using neurofeedback. That's interesting.
- [16:12]
A
I have, I've helped people fix themselves, that is, you know, their brain is just waiting for it. Like, people are stuck in a downward spiral and all the dopamine's keeping them there. But if you get intentional, you can upward spiral your life.
- [16:26]
B
Yeah, I'd rather do that than take the pill, whatever it's called.
- [16:28]
A
Yeah.
- [16:29]
B
I'm trying to be natural as possible.
- [16:30]
A
Yeah. And they don't even work if you've desensitized your brain enough. Your brain needs enough arousal to become aroused with medication. Many of the people I work with, it doesn't even work anymore.
- [16:42]
B
Holy crap.
- [16:43]
A
So again, if your viewers, if you take a little blue pill for help and it doesn't work, you have a lot of dysfunction in your brain and it's time to step up.
- [16:53]
B
Are you trying to get parents to spread this to their kids or what's your approach? I guess, yeah.
- [16:58]
A
Well, I work directly with people who have been addicted and who want to, you know, start a new life and build a legacy instead of doom scrolling. But I have founded a nonprofit organization. It's called pornbrain prevention.org so there I'm creating educational programs for parents. I'm actually going to tweak that. I'm in the midst of tweaking it to first of all, take the P word out of it. Can't get very far with the P word these days. You know, every day they're. Which is so ironic. Right.
- [17:25]
B
I can't even say it on YouTube.
- [17:27]
A
Every day the P word gets shut down. Except for more and more people are watching it. It's like a cruel joke. But I'm gonna rename the non profit to cover more of what I was just talking about social media and the interactions because when it comes to kids, that's a big danger. It's informed by porn. So kids are. And kids, kids see porn, they're exposed to it, they get that dopamine flood and their brain's like, give me more of that. But then it's reinforced in the dynamics on social media. So even if kids don't go back to a lot of porn, but going back to the science, science shows the earlier a person is exposed to porn, the greater frequency they start right away, basically, and over their young adulthood. So early exposure equals a bigger problem. But you know what's happening more is now kids go on social media and the back and forth there becomes hyper sexualized and totally toxic.
- [18:21]
B
Yeah, the of stuff, right?
- [18:23]
A
Yeah. Or, or even just kids. Adolescents, 14 year olds. There's studies that show that 75% of girls receive a genital pic. I'm calling it these days unsolicited.
- [18:35]
B
75%, that's actually.
- [18:37]
A
And 70% are asked for a nude.
- [18:40]
B
That's nuts.
- [18:41]
A
So like you're saying teenagers, teenagers, 14 year olds. So now you have kids who want nudes and they're sharing their, you know, their junk with other people. Right. Unsolicited, like so going Back to your question. Like, why would people do this? It's because that's what the training is becoming. It's like, you show me, you know, young women show me and I'll show you. But that's not building relationships. It's very toxic and it's building consumerism.
- [19:08]
B
That's a good segue into sim culture because I have friends that are girls and I'll just. They'll show me their inbox. I can't believe it.
- [19:13]
A
Yeah.
- [19:14]
B
Hundreds of messages and they only have like a couple thousand followers.
- [19:17]
A
Yeah. So think about that. You know, toxic masculinity is what we're dealing with. And I'm not saying that from like, we can go there if you want, like from a middle aged woman perspective. Again, I'm saying that from a neuroscience perspective perspective that online masculinity is, is encouraging. You know, simp culture. Like you said, especially Onlyfans, you pay and you get your name said. That's not real intimacy. And on Jubilee, I had this conversation with the performers, which actually I was more toned down than I was trying, you know, to stay in peace. But, you know, they tried to contend that they're helping people. No, you're taking that person away from real intimacy, from finding a person who can look them in the eye and hold their hand and really love them, not fake love them by saying their name. Distorted intimacy. You know, that's happening. And so now we have a generation of men who are chasing that instead of doing the hard work of finding a partner.
- [20:15]
B
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- [21:25]
A
And AI, that's exactly it, AI. Girlfriends on the rise. That's. That's why I said if you just take a step back and you think logically, what man wants an AI girlfriend?
- [21:34]
B
None.
- [21:34]
A
Really? None? None. Are they conditioned to want it? Yes. Are they telling themselves the story that that's what they can get? Yes. If they have ed, they can't even try. You know, I talked to tons of men, they have ed. They can't even try to date.
- [21:51]
B
Damn.
- [21:52]
A
But they're not telling people that. They're just caught in, you know, of and all that.
- [21:57]
B
Wow. So it's more common than people think.
- [21:59]
A
Very common.
- [21:59]
B
Ed, what percent? If you had to guess, I. I.
- [22:02]
A
Would say the, you know, I would say the vast majority of young men who consume porn compulsively. More porn, the more this is going to happen to you. I call it sad sexual arousal dysfunction because it might not be full blown Ed, but it's like, you know, okay, you can get an erection while you're watching porn, but now you go to be with a girl and you can't. And actually I can give you a story of someone I just talked to and I had to stop him, lovingly, as you can imagine, because he's like, you know, I've been watching porn since I was 10, he's like 19, I think. So then he tells me that this gorgeous girl wants to have sex with him and he can't get it up. And he, he goes, it didn't work because it was such vanilla sex. And I go, whoa, bro, stop there for a second. Because you've never had a live woman want to get naked with you and it's too vanilla for you. Like, why do you think it's too vanilla? Right? Like, that's the conditioning of. If you've been watching, you know, rainbow sherbet with sprinkles all over it for a decade, then now this gorgeous woman who wants to be with you, she's too vanilla for you. Distortion all over the place.
- [23:15]
B
I have heard that, that the videos, you get used to them. So you got to keep leveling up and get crazier and crazier. Right? Then you're watching three ways and then you're watching all this random stuff.
- [23:23]
A
Yeah, bestiality, you know, and then it becomes normalized. And these are the conversations I'll have with people. They'll go, I'll know the level of dysfunction in their brain by the line of thinking that they have, they'll be like, isn't it okay to. And I'm like, no, why would you ever want. Why would you ever want to be confined in isolation watching, you know, even though you think it's awesome, funky stuff, like you're in your basement watching it. Like you could be out, you know, with friends, finding some gorgeous woman to go home with. Like, that's good for you, you know.
- [23:58]
B
That'S how it used to be.
- [23:59]
A
That's how you. That's how I hope it can be when people start to, you know, wake up to the facts.
- [24:05]
B
Yeah.
- [24:05]
A
And people tell me all the time, they're like, Dr. Trish, I believe you. And I'm like, you don't have to believe me. It's the truth. When things are true, you just have to understand them. Once you understand, I'm like, you finally understand me. You're not believing me. You get it now.
- [24:22]
B
Facts over feelings.
- [24:23]
A
And if they're experiencing it, I don't even have to tell you anything because those people are at home panicking, not knowing what to do, convincing themselves that it'll be fine.
- [24:34]
B
Did you make a video about Andy Elliott?
- [24:36]
A
No, I don't know who that is.
- [24:38]
B
Okay. He's like a masculine guy, similar to Tate, I guess. What do you think of the red pill stuff?
- [24:42]
A
Yeah. So that's the other side, Right? So we have simp culture over here. We have those who are screaming masculinity but clearly don't really like women. So that's why I said, this isn't coming from, you know, the perspective of. From a woman. It's from the perspective shouting from the rooftops to be manly while not being the calmest, focused, sharpest person in the room. I just visited my brother in law. He works for a very large corporation. He's a high level exec. He was actually headhunted to be scooped up by another awesome corporation. But I loved what he said. He's like, I love working for the people. He's like, they're multi billionaires, but you would never know. He goes, they walk into the room and just their sheer presence kindly commands the entire room. That's masculinity, you know, commanding, having the energy that comes off of you. That's neurological regulation. It's self regulation. Like it's a superpower that I want people to be able to tap into.
- [25:48]
B
Yeah.
- [25:49]
A
Where you walk into the room and it's palpable. You've got something amazing going on and people want to be like you. People who Scream. Men who scream from the rooftops, be stronger. We don't need women. We only need them to procreate. Like, maybe that's true, but going back to what I said, men want women, men want women. Like if you and women want men, people want partners. We're pair bonded creatures. This goes back to Darwinism, you know, where high level women and this goes back to red pill, blue pill stuff. High level women, even high level, pair bonded animals, they're selective in the men that they will procreate with. That's a good thing. And if you get into a relationship where you're both, you know, top tier people, you're constantly challenging each other in a positive direction. It's not masculinity. That's aggressive. And you have women on the side. You're that person's woman on the sidelines being objectified and used by them. Right. People don't want that. Most people. I've been married for 23 years and you know, my husband and I have an awesome, fun relationship where we're constantly challenging each other. We don't always agree.
- [27:03]
B
Yeah.
- [27:04]
A
But you know, sometimes I push him to be a better version of himself. He pushes me like, that's what people want.
- [27:11]
B
That's what I do with my fiance too.
- [27:12]
A
Right.
- [27:13]
B
Constantly leveling up. We don't even recognize the people we used to be. Like five years ago, same thing.
- [27:18]
A
I love that, right? Where you look back and you go, you know, look at us back then and you want that growth trajectory over your whole life. That's how you build a legacy. And going back to like, what's healthy masculinity? Healthy masculinity. People want to be leaders. They want to have families that they love and love them. We have five kids. My husband and I have five kids. They're the coolest. Like we hang. They're adult, they're young adults now. Like he and I were saying, you know, we could have like a small little house as long as we have the relationship with these five kids. Like, it's just amazing. But of course we don't want that. We keep leveling up, you know, but you know, that's what healthy masculinity is. It's passion, it's purpose, it's leadership, it's legacy.
- [28:02]
B
Yeah, a lot of misguidance with young guys, with these guys teaching it.
- [28:05]
A
I think, I think so too.
- [28:07]
B
I think there's parts of it I agree with, but a lot of it's like, hide your emotions and don't apologize. You're weak. Don't cry in front of your girl type stuff. Yeah, it's kind of. I don't know if that works.
- [28:15]
A
No. And, you know, porn fits into that because porn is escapism. Something gets tricky. Like, let's give an example of, you know, finances are a stressor for a lot of people, so there's financial stress. And now instead of going to your partner or your wife and go, oh, I'm really struggling with this thing, you just escape into porn. You ignore it. Right? That's. Leaders don't ignore. They approach, they go kick some booty, right? Like, you don't escape into it and just not share your feelings. So you have a problem and you go to your partner and, like, I've got this thing going on, and your partner, your woman steps up to be with you in that vulnerability that is intimacy. Like, without that courage, you can't have the connection.
- [28:56]
B
Right.
- [28:57]
A
So if you're just being aggressive, you know, and that's really what we're talking about when we talk about, you know, these alpha males is it's an aggressor stance. Right. You know, and I think of it going back to, like, communication and interaction. You have passive. Right, Passive communication or passive interactional style. That's the simp culture. You have aggressive. That's the screaming from the rooftops that men rule and women should, you know, be quiet and do what they need to do. But then you have assertion in the middle. That's healthy. Yeah. Learning to assert yourself, but having compassion and empathy for the people around you too.
- [29:36]
B
Yeah, that's the type of leader I want to be. I like what you said about when you walk in a room, you could feel that I want to be that.
- [29:41]
A
You know, it's amazing, right?
- [29:43]
B
Like, certain people, like Tony Robbins, Trump, like, they walk in a room, you feel their energy.
- [29:47]
A
You feel their energy. And like, going back to Jubilee, that was my only goal, is that I set the temperature. Like, having it be filled with more love and less attack. And then when we got done filming, I'm like, they might not air this because there's no attack.
- [30:01]
B
Oh, did they want you to go off on them?
- [30:03]
A
No, they didn't. Like, that wasn't the expectation. But of course, like, you know, that's what they want. The drama, that's what gets the click. So I'm like, maybe I should. Maybe I should have went a little more aggressive. You know, I was trying to stay in that compassionate assertion place.
- [30:17]
B
It's. There's different types of debate some people come from, like, Dr. Mike. I don't know if you know him. Yeah, but I saw him against 20 anti vaxxers and he didn't get mad at all.
- [30:25]
A
That's emotional intelligence, and that's what we're talking about for healthy masculinity. Emotional intelligence is having high levels of self awareness and self regulation. Like somebody can tell you something that makes your blood boil, but in the moment, you can bring that back down. And that's what my work, my work with people does. You get triggered, then you bring it down, you come back in assertively, and then that's social, relationship awareness and management. If you can master those four pillars, you can, you know, rule the world.
- [30:58]
B
Yeah, I've noticed a lot of top CEOs, people that make important decisions have good emotional control and intelligence.
- [31:04]
A
You have to, you know, and that's why. That's why to me, it's tragic with the toxic masculinity that's being promoted by the two extremes. Not very many quote unquote influencers, or they're lower because they don't get as many clicks because they're not as dramatic. You know, are. Are promoting that. And that's. I want people to get off of only fans. Stop following toxic masculinity. Follow those people. Get on the track of the people who are ahead of you on the journey that you want to create for your own life.
- [31:39]
B
Yeah, you got to really cater your feed these days because the algorithm rewards drama.
- [31:43]
A
It really does. Drama, violence, hypersexuality.
- [31:47]
B
Yeah.
- [31:47]
A
My son, who's 18, when my book came out, I had a trailer made and it's pretty cool. So I'm like, seamus, you got to check out this trailer. And he's like, hell no. And I'm like, what do you mean? He's like, if I look at it, my feed, he's like, I have spent so much time curating my feed for exactly what I want. If I look at it, I'm going to be fed all things. Like, I'm like, touche. You don't have to watch, you know.
- [32:09]
B
Yeah. People got to take the time, press. Not interested in all the videos. You're. You're not. And then interested.
- [32:14]
A
Yeah. And I love what he has curated his feed. Like, he's always showing me weird, but like, you know, perfectly on point for the intention of what he's trying to create in his life.
- [32:23]
B
I love it.
- [32:24]
A
Yeah, well. So cool, right?
- [32:25]
B
Yeah. What. What's next for you? Got some debates coming up.
- [32:29]
A
Yeah, I do. I have a bunch of cool things on the docket, you know, More debates, which. That was interesting coming out of the Jubilee experience, because then this way, I feel a little bit more confident in that environment.
- [32:42]
B
Yeah.
- [32:43]
A
You know, because I always like to promote my message, but debating, it's a different thing. But. Yeah. So I've got a bunch of things. I have a documentary coming out that I just filmed not too long ago. A lot of really neat things. My book came out and it debuted at number one in front of your brain on porn by Gary Wilson, which is like the iconic book on porn addiction. So that was really exciting. He passed. A few years ago, kind of when I was hardcore coming on the scene with porn addiction, he passed. And, you know, people in the comments on my YouTube channel, they're like, Pick up the torch, Dr. Trish. And I'm like, all right, got the torch there, friends. But. So that was really cool that the book came out, and his book highlighted porn addiction as a problem because it's older. But mine is a resource to help people get where they need to go, so that's cool, too.
- [33:32]
B
Nice. We'll link it below and stay tuned for debate. You'll be back on the show in the next few months.
- [33:36]
A
Yeah, definitely. I. Let's do it. Because I think the conversation really opens doors for people to think a little deeper on the subject.
- [33:45]
B
Absolutely.
- [33:45]
A
Game on.
- [33:46]
B
Thanks for coming on again.
- [33:47]
A
Yeah, no problem.
- [33:47]
B
Check her out, guys. See you next time. I hope you guys are enjoying the show. Please don't forget to like and subscribe. It helps the show a lot with the algorithm. Thank you.