Erik Huberman: Why Most People Don’t Want to Work Hard Anymore... | DSH #1705

Summary

Digital Social Hour: Erik Huberman — Why Most People Don’t Want to Work Hard Anymore (DSH #1705)

Podcast: Digital Social Hour
Host: Sean Kelly
Guest: Erik Huberman (Founder & CEO of Hawk Media)
Date: December 25, 2025
Episode Theme:
A candid, wide-ranging discussion on generational attitudes toward work, building company culture, marketing wisdom from running Hawk Media, the role of in-person work, entrepreneurship, health trends, and the importance of authentic leadership.

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Main Theme / Episode Overview

This episode features Erik Huberman, a serial entrepreneur and founder of Hawk Media, delving into the shifting work ethics of newer generations, the value of in-person collaboration, and evolving approaches to marketing. Host Sean Kelly and Erik discuss why “most people don’t want to work hard anymore,” explore how Hawk Media has grown while maintaining culture, the crucial role of trust in business, and what truly drives success in modern entrepreneurship.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Generational Shift in Attitudes Toward Work

• Erik’s Perspective: He notes a clear departure from the traditional “work hard, build a life” ethos towards a strong emphasis on “work-life balance” among younger generations.
  • "I was taught... work really hard and you'll build a great life for yourself... now, I feel like the general consensus amongst the next generation is not that. It's an overemphasis on work-life balance." — Erik Huberman [00:00–00:10, 05:09–05:30]
• Consequence: Hawk Media now prefers to hire people with some prior work experience, letting others “learn to work somewhere else first.”

2. Changing Educational Value & Career Development

• Both Sean and Erik reflect on the diminishing ROI of a college marketing degree for learning practical skills.
• Erik’s Hiring Rule: College experience is less important than skill and demonstrated aptitude.
  • “I would say… I’m usually hiring people that are a few years out... I’m looking for people that are skilled.” — Erik Huberman [04:40–05:01]

3. Work Ethic, Burnout, and Motivation

• A viral Twitter poll (cited by Erik) showed 98.2% of respondents would prefer to work fewer hours for less money rather than work 70 hours/week for more.
  • “Every entrepreneur I know would do the 70 hours… What percentage of people do you think pick 25 hours?” … “It was 98.2%.” — Erik Huberman [06:20–06:57]
• Erik empathizes with burnout but underlines that passion, seeing growth and momentum, and discipline are essential to sustaining high effort.
  • “You do have to work hard enough to get to that point of momentum.” — Erik Huberman [08:42]

4. Company Culture: In-Office vs. Remote & Hiring Philosophy

• In-Person Policy: Hawk Media is “all in” on in-office culture for core staff in LA, favoring synergy and osmosis over remote work.
  • “The core of the business needs to be all in office. There’s just too much osmosis and synergy.” — Erik Huberman [13:45–14:00]
• Improved Morale: Their employee Net Promoter Score (NPS) rose significantly with the shift back to in-person, attributed to human interaction reducing stress and boosting company connection.
  • “In office has increased our NPS score… people love working at Hawk much more than when they’re remote.” — Erik Huberman [15:56]
• Culture Fit > People Pleasing: Focus on the best performers and their alignment with the mission, rather than trying to please every detractor.
  • "When you placate to the people that aren't aligned, you start alienating the people that are." — Erik Huberman [17:25–17:28]

5. Firing, Growth, and Expansion

• “Fire fast” is key: holding onto misaligned or underperforming employees helps neither party.
• Hawk Media is rapidly hiring and acquiring, but only for in-office LA roles (with exceptions for acquisitions).

6. Marketing Framework, Philosophy, and Best Practices

• Hawk’s Marketing Framework: “Awareness, Nurturing, and Trust” — applicable across industries.
  • “75% of people won’t buy from a company they don’t inherently trust. The other 25% are early adopters.” — Erik Huberman [02:20–02:25]
• Dismissal of most academic marketing curriculums; practical experience and repeatable frameworks win.
  • "The perception of marketing versus the reality is very different." — Erik Huberman [03:38]
• Trust Over Everything: Building trust is critical — most people are “waiting for someone else to try that berry,” i.e., want proof before taking the plunge.

7. Building a Name-Brand Agency for SMBs

• Most large agencies only want Fortune 2000 companies; Hawk aims to be the “name brand” serving smaller businesses too.
  • “Our mission is to be the best at what we do, but easy to work with. Hawk Media will work with SMBs. We’re not pretentious.” — Erik Huberman [21:25–21:53]

8. Events & Networking

• Events are the best sales channel for Hawk Media — better ROI than many standard trade shows.
  • “Events, to me, are the greatest sales tool of all time.” — Erik Huberman [24:31–24:35]
• Hawkfest: Their annual themed networking and learning festival combining fun, content, and connections.

9. Celebrity and Influencer CPG Brands

• Cautions against inauthentic celebrity “face-on-a-brand” deals; success comes from deep involvement and passion (e.g., George Clooney’s Casamigos dinners, Ryan Reynolds’ Mint/Aviation campaigns).
  • “It's about leveraging that [celebrity] in the ways that are hugely impactful, not just, 'here's your face, go.'” — Erik Huberman [30:06]

10. Trends in Health, Wellness, and Longevity

• Huge consumer appetite for health data and longevity tools (Prenuvo, blood panels, wearables). Erik’s experience after his father’s death reflects a desire for proactive management.
  • "Why wouldn’t you take advantage of these tools so that you can get ahead of anything wrong?... Ignorance is bliss, until it catches up." — Erik Huberman [33:05–33:18]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On work ethic generational divide:
  • “There is an overemphasis on work-life balance versus working like most won’t, so you can live like most can’t.” — Erik Huberman [00:10]
• On hiring and experience:
  • “We’re now letting people have a job or two before they come here. Go learn how to work somewhere else, and then come here when you understand what it is to work.” — Erik Huberman [06:01]
• On trust in marketing:
  • “75% of people won’t buy from a company they don’t inherently trust.” — Erik Huberman [02:20]
• On event networking:
  • “Build trust, again, it goes back to trust. If you’re sending me a random cold email, I’m probably not going to answer it. If we met at an event, I remember you...” — Erik Huberman [24:17–24:30]
• On company culture:
  • “You don’t want to placate to everyone... When you chase all the people that are negative, you actually serve the wrong person.” — Erik Huberman [16:53–17:07]
• On health and longevity:
  • “I lost my dad to colon cancer… Ignorance is bliss until it catches up and you're too late.” — Erik Huberman [32:53–33:18]
• On celebrity brands:
  • “If you’re going to do it and the celebrity is going to really do it... it’s great. If you’re not, don’t waste your time.” — Erik Huberman [30:21]
• On discipline and momentum:
  • “You do have to work hard enough to get to that point of momentum. And then once it picks up, it’s really easy to find more and more energy.” — Erik Huberman [08:42–08:49]

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Important Segment Timestamps

• Introduction & Book Inspiration: 00:45–02:10
• Marketing Framework (Awareness, Nurture, Trust): 02:10–03:05
• Marketing in Education & Early Careers: 03:05–04:40
• Hiring Philosophy & College Experience: 04:40–06:09
• Millennial & Gen Z Work Attitude: 06:09–07:22
• Burnout and Energy Momentum: 07:22–08:49
• Schedule, Calendar, & Work-Life Balance: 09:14–10:43
• Firing and Employee Alignment: 12:46–13:24, 16:53–17:38
• Remote vs. In-Person Work & Productivity: 13:45–16:11
• Measuring Employee Happiness (NPS Score): 16:30–16:39
• Events & Hawkfest: 22:39–24:35
• Celebrity & Influencer Brands: 28:43–31:17
• Wellness & Health Trends: 31:54–34:08

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Structure and Tone

The episode is lively, unfiltered, and fast-paced, filled with candid takes and actionable wisdom. Erik Huberman speaks directly and often bluntly, emphasizing personal discipline, honest assessment, and authenticity in leadership and business.

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Utility for Listeners

Those interested in entrepreneurship, modern work culture, agency growth, marketing strategy, and the intersection of personal and professional discipline will find Erik’s insights both validating and challenging. The dialogue is especially valuable for anyone leading teams, hiring, or aspiring to build enduring, people-centric businesses.

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Contact / Links:

• Erik Huberman: /erikhuberman on all socials
• Hawk Media: hawkmedia.com

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Summary prepared for podcast listeners and business leaders seeking the actionable essence of DSH #1705 with Erik Huberman.

Transcript

[Eric Huberman]

I was taught, and most of the.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

People I know were taught, work really hard and you'll build a great life for yourself.

[Eric Huberman]

And now I feel like the general.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Consensus amongst the next generation is not that it's an overemphasis on work life balance.

[Eric Huberman]

And I'm sure a lot of people.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Disagree with me, but I think there is an overemphasis on work life balance versus working like most won't. So you can live like most can't, which is more what I subscribe to.

[Eric Huberman]

And so you see that with kids.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Coming out of college that they don't.

[Eric Huberman]

Want to work that hard. They're doing it to check the bill.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

To pay the bills, and not necessarily to create something of themselves, to build something of themselves. And so being the one that has to give them bad news that work is hard is not really the position I want to put ourselves in. And so we're now letting people have a job or two before they come back.

[Podcast Host / Sponsor Announcer]

All right, guys, Eric Huberman back on the show.

[Guest / Interviewer]

I can't believe it's been two years, man.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Yeah, time flies. That was nuts.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Yeah, we went pretty viral on that first one.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Yeah. And you're in a different room, different building. Yeah, Upgrading here.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Had a level up, man. Now you're an author, too.

[Eric Huberman]

Yeah, exactly.

[Guest / Interviewer]

What was the inspiration for this book?

[Eric Huberman]

You know, it was thankfully just a friend of a friend that was a book marketer. I was at a party, and he's like, hey, have you thought of writing a book? And I actually had worked on a book before that I didn't like how it turned out, so I never ended up publishing it. And I was like, yeah, I've thought about it. And we just sat there chatting about it. And I'd done a ton of speaking on marketing, and frankly, with that point.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

We had probably marketed 3,000 brands, actually. We had. That's, I think, on the COVID of the book.

[Eric Huberman]

And we. And I realize there's a lot of.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Consistencies amongst all of these companies and what made them successful.

[Eric Huberman]

And so I was like, yeah, I.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Kind of have this marketing framework we're running constantly that's working really well and synthesizing that and simplifying it so that people can actually understand sort of the basic modern marketing, one on one, would probably be what I'd do.

[Eric Huberman]

And he's like, well, let's do it.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

And honestly taught me a method to writing the book that made it really easy to put together.

[Eric Huberman]

And then I'd say the hard part was marketing it.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

And thankfully, it became a bestseller. It's now taught at Columbia, NYU and soon to be my alma mater, University of Arizona.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Let's go.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

First two happened organically and then I reached out to my alma mater and said, hey guys, what the hell, let's get this going.

[Eric Huberman]

But yeah, it's gone really well.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

We give it to all our employees, our clients. Like it's just, you know, our, the way we look at modern marketing and what we think about it.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Was there a marketing framework that worked across all industries?

[Eric Huberman]

Yeah, it's really. And the framework's just awareness, nurturing and trust. So how do you let new people.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Know that your business actually exists?

[Eric Huberman]

Then what do you do with that.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Awareness that actually turns them into customers? And then how do you create trust which 75% of people won't buy from a company they don't inherently Trust? The other 25% called early adopters.

[Eric Huberman]

So how do you reach the rest of them?

[Co-host / Business Partner]

How do you build that trust? Through third party validation and creating a brand. And so it's all those details on how you build a successful marketing campaign.

[Eric Huberman]

Stand it up.

[Guest / Interviewer]

I never realized how important trust was.75% you said.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

That's an Edelman study.

[Guest / Interviewer]

That's really high. Yeah, people have to trust the brands these days.

[Eric Huberman]

Yeah, no, and it's not even these days. It's just, you know, people, human nature is to frankly usually wait for someone.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Else to try that berry. So, you know, it's not poisonous how people kind of work.

[Eric Huberman]

And so again, there's those hard chargers.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

That are going to go figure it out themselves. You know, we all have those friends that buy the are the first to buy that new car, first to buy that new gadget, and they exist. Most people are waiting to see how everyone else likes it.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Marketing is interesting, man, because I went to college for it and I feel like they don't teach it effectively there.

[Eric Huberman]

No, I went to college for it too. And thankfully now I'm on the University.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Arizona marketing board and they're doing some great things there.

[Eric Huberman]

But yeah, I mean, when I was.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

In college, I was a management major.

[Eric Huberman]

And I used to make fun of.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Marketing majors being like, what do you guys do?

[Eric Huberman]

Draw pictures all day?

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Like, I don't understand what this marketing thing is.

[Eric Huberman]

So, you know, kind of goes to show, you never know.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

My favorite professor was one of my marketing professors was actually a chemistry major. So like what you do in college and what you end up doing don't always equate.

[Eric Huberman]

But yeah, it's the, the perception of.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Marketing versus the reality is very different.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Yeah, I Just don't see the ROI as a student paying 20k a year to learn marketing at a university right now.

[Eric Huberman]

Yeah, I mean, and I, you know, we could go deep on the education side of things. It depends on the person because. Cause I don't think the actual degree matters. I think completing the education is what matters. And I think the more technical probably.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

The better, which is something I didn't do.

[Eric Huberman]

I went with business. But I also think a lot of.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

People, including myself, need that time to grow up.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Okay.

[Eric Huberman]

Going from.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

I went to college at 17, graduated at 21.

[Guest / Interviewer]

That's young.

[Podcast Host / Sponsor Announcer]

Yeah.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

And I grew up in a small town, you know, social skills weren't really there. I had 11 kids in my graduating class.

[Eric Huberman]

And so getting to go out to.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

University of Arizona and get thrown into an 8,000 person freshman class and just sink or swim, go figure it out. Go figure out how to be a human being while keeping up with your studies and having to be self reliant for the first time, I think is something important.

[Eric Huberman]

There are kids and a lot of.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Kids that can jump right into, you know, work and go. And there's a lot of people that really need that extra four years to grow up.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Interesting take. So as someone that hires hundreds of people, you care about the college experience for on the resume?

[Eric Huberman]

No, honestly, I would say it's because I'm usually hiring people. Excuse me? I'm usually hiring people that are a.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Few years out of that, that have already shown that they've worked at certain companies, they have a certain aptitude, and I'm looking for people that are skilled.

[Eric Huberman]

So we're not generally hiring people fresh.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Out of high school or fresh out of college.

[Eric Huberman]

Got it. There was a time when we did. Honestly, this could be an interesting take, but I've just learned that we've gotten to a point where I don't want.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

To be the person that teaches kids how to work.

[Eric Huberman]

There's a hard generational shift that's happened where I was taught and most of.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

The people I know were taught that work really hard and you'll build a great life for yourself.

[Eric Huberman]

And now I feel like the general.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Consensus amongst the next generation is not that it's an over emphasis on work life balance. And again, I'm sure a lot of people disagree with me, but I think there is an overemphasis on work life balance versus working like most won't. So you can live like most can't. Which is more what I see.

[Eric Huberman]

Subscribe to and so you see that.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

With kids coming out of college that.

[Eric Huberman]

They don't want to work that hard. They're doing it to check the bill.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

To pay the bills, and not necessarily to create something of themselves, to build something of themselves. And so being the one that has to give them the bad news that work is hard is not really the position I want to put ourselves in. And so we're now letting people have a job or two before they come to us. Go learn how to work somewhere else, and then come here when you understand.

[Eric Huberman]

What it is to work, when you.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Want to get rewarded for it.

[Guest / Interviewer]

I'm fascinated by that. I can't relate. I've always worked hard as fuck. But, yeah, my generation, I agree, is lazier.

[Eric Huberman]

And I think every generation says that. So I feel kind of like an old guy saying it, But I just see more of, like, the digital rhetoric. There was a survey done on Twitter.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

That I saw tens of thousand people.

[Eric Huberman]

Answered, and it was, would you rather work 25 hours a week and make.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

125 grand a year or 70 hours a week and make 300 grand a year?

[Eric Huberman]

To do the math, it's about 90.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Bucks an hour for the 25 hours or 80 bucks an hour for the 70 hours.

[Eric Huberman]

So there's an argument to be made.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

That you're making more per hour, 25 hours to do that.

[Eric Huberman]

But let's assume that's all the money you can make.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

You're not allowed to have a side hustle or anything like that.

[Eric Huberman]

Every entrepreneur I know would do the.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

70 hours, no brainer, how to make 300 grand.

[Eric Huberman]

What percentage of people do you think.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Pick 25 hours out of my generation?

[Eric Huberman]

It's just Anyone.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Oh, anyone.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

It was an open survey.

[Guest / Interviewer]

You're making it seem like it's high. So I'm gonna go 80.

[Eric Huberman]

Yeah. I thought it'd be 70. It was 98.2%.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Holy crap.

[Eric Huberman]

So when you see that and then you hear, you know, rhetoric around, like, the 1% and the wealthy and other.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

It's like, yeah, it's the 1.8% that.

[Eric Huberman]

Actually like the, like, hard work and.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Want to, you know, maximize what they can achieve.

[Eric Huberman]

And so knowing that it's. I'm not trying to dunk on the 98.2%. That's fine.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

But just know where you are and know that the 1.8% are probably going to be more successful, because hard work really does drive a level of success.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Yeah. Of probably put 70, 80 hours a week for 10 years straight at this point. But I never get burnout.

[Eric Huberman]

Yeah. And I've had moments where it's like, you know, when you're not getting the feedback cycle, like, when it's not succeeding, it is really hard to push through. But that's when discipline kicks in.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

You have to just keep going.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Yeah, I. People just assume when they hear these hours, they're like, how do you not get burnt out? How do you not get sick of it? But we're just so passionate, I think.

[Eric Huberman]

And I think it's also, again, that feedback. You've had success, you've seen growth, you see the. The fruits of your labor. So it's easy to find the energy to keep going when things are going well. And so, you know, we dealt with a bit, you know, a hiccup between.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Into some internal stuff at Hawk, as.

[Eric Huberman]

Well as just industry headwinds, like 22, 23. And so I learned what it was.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

To all of a sudden go from, like, this rocket ship to some hard times or what felt like hard times.

[Eric Huberman]

And, you know, the broad scheme of.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Things, not that hard, but it felt.

[Eric Huberman]

Like that way to me. And that's when it gets a lot.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Harder to jump out of bed in the morning to work as hard as you are. Like, it is harder to maintain during those periods.

[Eric Huberman]

So I have a lot of empathy for people that deal with that burnout side.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Right.

[Eric Huberman]

But I think it's important to know, like, when you see guys like, and.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

I love Rob Dyrdek. He's a friend. He's awesome.

[Eric Huberman]

Or Mark Wahlberg, they, you know, up at 4am, do their workout, you know, have this whole routine, work 10 hours every single day and 12 hours and just nonstop. I can tell you from experience, it's easy to find that energy when things are.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

When you have momentum, when things are going well.

[Eric Huberman]

And so it's not necessarily that you're built different or I don't know if I'm built different. I think you just. You do have to work hard enough to get to that point of momentum.

[Guest / Interviewer]

And.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

And then once it picks up, it is really easy to find more and more energy.

[Guest / Interviewer]

I feel that. I definitely feel that Rob Dyrdek's schedule is.

[Eric Huberman]

It's insane.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Eric Huberman]

Every five minutes, if there's a guy that will earn his success in every bit of it and, like, is a salt of the earth guy and love that guy and. But he works.

[Guest / Interviewer]

I couldn't live like that. I used to hop on calls all the time, thinking it was productive. Now I'm maybe one call a week, dude.

[Eric Huberman]

Yeah.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Like, I just don't think they're productive.

[Eric Huberman]

I think the Most viral social media.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Post I've had was posting my calendar. It's booked every 30 minutes from like 7:30am to probably 10:00pm every day.

[Eric Huberman]

Just calls, calls, meetings. And I put stuff personally on there.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Too, because I have to.

[Eric Huberman]

So, like, even, you know, I've got.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Dinner with my daughter on my calendar.

[Eric Huberman]

Which gets me plenty of judgment, but it's like, I want to make sure that I carve out time for that.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

But then, you know, maximize my time.

[Eric Huberman]

And it works for me. I had plenty of people tell me.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

That my calendar looked nauseating or the.

[Eric Huberman]

Grossest thing they've ever seen, but. But for me, it's a sense of freedom, because then I don't have to.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Spend brain power thinking about what do.

[Eric Huberman]

I need to do next? What do I have to do?

[Co-host / Business Partner]

I know exactly what I'm doing from the moment I leave this podcast studio to through the weekend.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Respect. Oh, so even weekends, you're fully booked.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Yeah.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Wow. So you're working seven days a week.

[Eric Huberman]

Yeah, but again, it's booking. I mean, when I say working seven.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Days a week, there are weekends that.

[Eric Huberman]

I have work full days, but there.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Are a lot of weekends where it's like two hours, three hours, catch up on stuff, that kind of thing. And.

[Eric Huberman]

And it's usually like when my kids.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Are napping or asleep at night and I want to catch up on emails and wife's in private equity, so it's kind of. We both are doing the same kind of thing of balancing a crazy career with family life. And again, when I carve it out and make sure that I schedule this.

[Eric Huberman]

Stuff, like, even if I know while.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

My daughter's napping, I have to run some errands. I'll schedule a call on the drive to run those errands to make sure that I fit everything in.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Respect. Yeah. I'm the same on weekends, couple hours, nothing crazy. Used to be full days, but that wasn't sustainable.

[Eric Huberman]

And when it calls for it, it.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Calls for it, but I don't exactly. I don't think it's sustainable completely.

[Eric Huberman]

Taking time away is important.

[Guest / Interviewer]

So as your wife worked full time since you've been together. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

So it's been. We've been together 11 years.

[Eric Huberman]

Wow.

[Guest / Interviewer]

And you're able to make that work?

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And when I say full time, I mean, she works as hard as I do. She's a senior executive, big private equity fund. That's crushing it. So she's a baller and loves her work.

[Eric Huberman]

And honestly, it's been great because you Know when you're an entrepreneur, your business.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Can be all consuming and, like, you can't get your head off of it. And I have a partner that I can also talk to about work and gets it and understands it and sometimes gives me tough love about it.

[Eric Huberman]

Like, wow, you've complained about this three times.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Why haven't you fired that person yet?

[Eric Huberman]

Like, she gets it. She knows what I'm coming from and.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Can be a great perspective.

[Eric Huberman]

I've even.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

We've stayed bootstrapped at Hawk. We have no investors. But when I've had investor conversations, she'll sometimes be in the other room.

[Eric Huberman]

And I've heard her. She. I've had her yell after getting off an investor call, yeah, that guy's full of shit. Watch out. I'm like, thank you.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Like, women are great at that.

[Eric Huberman]

Oh, yeah, and especially her. She knows the, the business.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

She knows she's an investor. So it's, it's been a great part.

[Podcast Host / Sponsor Announcer]

School Shout out to today's sponsor, Quince. As the weather cools, I'm swapping in the pieces that actually gets the job done that are warm, durable, and buil to last. Quinn delivers every time with wardrobe staples.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

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[Guest / Interviewer]

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[Podcast Host / Sponsor Announcer]

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[Guest / Interviewer]

I struggle with firing too.

[Eric Huberman]

Yeah, it's hard. I have. I'm built with optimism.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Most entrepreneurs are. You have to be optimistic.

[Eric Huberman]

So I always think that I can, you know, improve something or work with someone, make it better. And, you know, usually you just drag.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

It out and create more animosity. So the fire fast, you know, cliche is very valid.

[Guest / Interviewer]

You think it's true?

[Eric Huberman]

Oh, yeah, because it's. I. It's so rare that it works out. And usually what you end up doing is you're doing them A favor by.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Getting them out too, because there's no upside for them anymore. So they're just going to drag out till you both create more resentment for each other. So I think you get to that point, you do want to fire quickly and sometimes.

[Eric Huberman]

Usually my experiences, it's very rare that.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

They push back because they know too.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Yeah.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Are you hiring a lot right now? Going quick?

[Eric Huberman]

Yes.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Yeah. I know you're acquiring companies too, right?

[Eric Huberman]

Yep. Yeah.

[Guest / Interviewer]

You're in a growth phase right now.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Yeah, 100%.

[Eric Huberman]

Yeah, we've grown a lot and it's fun. We actually. And you know, another one of the controversial things, we're fully hiring in office in L. A so acquisitions, you know, some are.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

A lot of them are not based.

[Eric Huberman]

In L. A but any hires directly.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

To Hawk media are all full time in office in L. A in Santa Monica.

[Guest / Interviewer]

So you're not a fan of the remote work?

[Eric Huberman]

Not really. I think you can have a balance.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Where you can have some remote which is working for us with these acquisitions.

[Eric Huberman]

But I think the core of the.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Business needs to be all in office.

[Eric Huberman]

There's just too much osmosis and synergy.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

And things that happen when you're just.

[Eric Huberman]

Sitting around and just small quick conversations.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Like I'll finish a call five minutes early, run down and have like a.

[Eric Huberman]

You know, hey, quick note to my.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Head of growth or my CFO or.

[Eric Huberman]

Someone like, hey, just quick thought, I.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Need you to cover this. Got it on your bike. Cool.

[Eric Huberman]

That the problem with that is maybe that would have been a slack, but.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

I might have not even gotten around to it.

[Eric Huberman]

And then.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

And honestly couldn't have given as much context.

[Eric Huberman]

And then that would have been on.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Our weekly meeting a week later. And one of the topics.

[Eric Huberman]

And it's just like the.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

The overstructured nature of having. Of being remote and still trying to communicate with everyone.

[Eric Huberman]

It just, at least for my business.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

It didn't work very well. We're seeing an insane increase in productivity.

[Eric Huberman]

One of the biggest things too is new people.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

That's why all new hires are in office.

[Eric Huberman]

Having that ability to sit next to.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

People that know what they're doing to get trained by the whole company as opposed to just your manager getting on a daily or weekly training call.

[Eric Huberman]

Things like that. You just get such a faster ramp up and more cultural connection. People are actually like, friendships happen even.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

We've had people get married on the team.

[Eric Huberman]

It's like people connect in person.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

It's what we're biologically built to do.

[Eric Huberman]

And then I was sent a study.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

By a friend that does a lot of workplace studies.

[Eric Huberman]

And it was really interesting because any.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Work you do, even if you love it, increases your cortisol.

[Eric Huberman]

And so you feel stressed out, et cetera. Even if you love your job, you're.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Going to build cortisol.

[Eric Huberman]

Or one of the best ways to.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Bring down cortisol is human interaction.

[Eric Huberman]

So if we're all sitting in our living rooms, working at our kitchen tables.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

And not having any human interaction, you're just getting more and more stressed out. Bring in the mental health crisis. Like, there's all these agoraphobes that don't want to leave their house, don't leave for work, don't have any human interaction.

[Eric Huberman]

Play video games, et cetera, and just sit at home. You end up with a lot of.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Very stressed out, depressed people.

[Eric Huberman]

And even though they, you know, it feels scary or stressful or annoying to.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Commute into an office, it turns out our.

[Eric Huberman]

We see it on our.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

We have an employee MPS score in office has increased our MPS score. All of a sudden, people love working at Hawk much more than they did when they're remote.

[Eric Huberman]

And it's.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

The work is the same. It's the exact same work. It's just like, you know, sometimes they have some donuts on the counter or.

[Eric Huberman]

Something, but it's really.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

They just get to hang out. They go to lunch together.

[Eric Huberman]

You know, when you get off a.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Stressful call, whether it's with a manager or a client or whatever you're doing, or you have a campaign fail, etc.

[Eric Huberman]

You can look to your right and.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Go, God, this is rough. And the person.

[Eric Huberman]

Oh, yeah, no, I know, me too.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

And that little bit of commiserating, bit.

[Eric Huberman]

Of hanging out with other people and diffusing a situation.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Goes a long way.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Respect. What's NPS score? What does that stand for?

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Net promoter score. So it's like, yeah, the likelihood someone's going to recommend working at Hawk to someone else, basically.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Oh, nice. So that's important for you to keep measuring.

[Eric Huberman]

And most people use it with customers.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Where it's, you know, what's the likelihood a customer is going to recommend another customer? But we do it with both.

[Eric Huberman]

We do it with our employees too.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

To see, like, do you like working here? Like, and the whole different, you know, rabbit hole we could go down. But there's a lot of.

[Eric Huberman]

The biggest thing I've learned about creating.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

A place people want to work is you don't want to placate to everyone. That was actually something we did really.

[Eric Huberman]

Wrong, was like anytime someone Had a complaint.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Anytime someone thought something was wrong with.

[Eric Huberman]

The company, we tried to fix it. When you chase all the people that.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Are negative on the situation, you actually are serving the wrong person.

[Eric Huberman]

Because there's people that come and join.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Your company that are very aligned with.

[Eric Huberman]

What your mission is, love what you're.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Doing and want more of it and want to double down on what you're trying to build. And then there's people that come in that aren't aligned, and it's nothing off them. It's cultural differences.

[Eric Huberman]

And so when you placate to the people that aren't aligned, you start alienating.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

The people that are and go, why.

[Eric Huberman]

Do we care about this stuff?

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Like, I care about this mission that I signed up for.

[Eric Huberman]

So we found that doubling down on.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Our best people and really just playing to them and listening to our best.

[Eric Huberman]

Performers and the people that are the.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Biggest complainers that may not fit. Honestly, coaching them out and moving on and saying, this isn't the right place for you has been the best way to build a great culture where it's.

[Eric Huberman]

Like, you build it for what you.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Want to build and what you're trying to accomplish and attract those people. There's almost a Darwinism or evolutionary thing that happens in the company because you naturally end up alienating people that don't fit what you're trying to accomplish. And all of a sudden, you look up and you've got a team of people that are there for what you're trying to do and are all about it, and you've built a much better culture that way.

[Guest / Interviewer]

That's some phenomenal advice, because a lot of people try to people please, and me too.

[Eric Huberman]

Like, I really want to have a.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Company everyone loves to work at.

[Eric Huberman]

But what we realized was there was.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

This vocal minority of people. There's this very specific time in the.

[Eric Huberman]

Company that we started, like, doing everything we could to please them. And then we started losing great people.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

That weren't this complaining group.

[Eric Huberman]

And so finally we just literally shut it down.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Like, we're done with this. We're not doing any of this stuff anymore. We're focused on this is who we are, this is what we're doing.

[Eric Huberman]

I saw, you know, Coinbase did this in a weird way with, when it.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Came to, like, politics.

[Eric Huberman]

We're not involved with anything political.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

This is what we're about.

[Eric Huberman]

And a bunch of people got pissed.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Off and left the company.

[Eric Huberman]

Who's left? All the people that aren't political that. That actually align with that vision.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Wow.

[Eric Huberman]

So, you know, long, long Term, it's a. Even medium term, it's a great move. You might have some short term hiccups.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

When you change a policy like that.

[Eric Huberman]

But then you end up with a group of people. And now in our interviews and everything.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

We'Re like, this is what we're about.

[Eric Huberman]

This is what we're building.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

This is what the culture is like.

[Eric Huberman]

And we try to scare people away. We're intentionally sincerely like, we're like, I try to tell people the ugliest parts.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Of the job and the things they're going to hate.

[Eric Huberman]

Because if that's not. I want you to walk in here.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

And when those things happen, you're like, oh, yeah, we talked about this.

[Eric Huberman]

And then there's no surprises.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

You know exactly what you're not going to like about the company. I have them talk to other employees.

[Eric Huberman]

And what's your least favorite thing here? Like, what do you not like about the business? And what drives you nuts?

[Co-host / Business Partner]

What stresses you out?

[Eric Huberman]

There you go. That's a full window into what you're.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Going to be dealing with. Does that sound scary or does that sound fine?

[Eric Huberman]

And you know, again, the right people, not meaning the right people in general, but the right people for Hawk go.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Yeah, none of that scares me. Let's go.

[Guest / Interviewer]

I love that. Because a lot of employers would hide that information, Right?

[Eric Huberman]

Exactly. And it's just, it's going to come out.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

So it's going to come out now.

[Eric Huberman]

When you've invested in that person and you've put training into that person and you've now spent wasted a bunch of.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Time and they're going to burn out or not like it, or be, you know, a bad apple that spoils the rest of the bunch and starts, you.

[Eric Huberman]

Know, a bunch of an uprising. Like, these are all things that happen.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

When you bring on the wrong people.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Now, Hawk, so big now, you're probably working with a lot of international clients, I'd imagine.

[Eric Huberman]

Yeah, we work with a lot of international brands, mostly to bring to the.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

US we do sometimes do campaigns overseas.

[Eric Huberman]

But we've really focused on being the.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Best in the U.S. um, which has been.

[Eric Huberman]

But we do have a team in China.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

We had a team in the uk. We had a team in Canada.

[Eric Huberman]

Um, and so a lot of European.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

And Asian companies hire us when they want to enter the US Market and reach the US consumer.

[Guest / Interviewer]

So you're just mainly focused on the.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

US from the marketing execution side? Yeah. Clients all over the world.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Yeah. Yeah, that's cool. Over 3,000 clients, you said. Right now it's over six holy crap.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Since this came out, you doubled.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Oh, because you're acquiring so many companies.

[Eric Huberman]

And I mean, it's just as time goes on and that's to be clear, historic. So actively I think we have like.

[Guest / Interviewer]

500, still not 6,000. Where does that rank out of all the marketing agencies?

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Honestly, I have no idea. Most don't report those numbers publicly.

[Eric Huberman]

But I. So for our mission, like what we're trying to do at Hawk is I built two brands I was really frustrated with. If you talk about the well known marketing agencies, omni.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Com, WPP Publicis, etc. They only work with a Fortune 2000.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Got it.

[Eric Huberman]

And so there's 90,000 digital agencies in.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

The U.S. 99% of them have no idea what they're doing, don't know how to grow a business.

[Eric Huberman]

I always found it fascinating that businesses hire agencies that can't grow their own.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Business to grow their business.

[Eric Huberman]

Like that makes no sense.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

So maybe you catch one on the upswing.

[Eric Huberman]

But generally, once these agencies become decent.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Size, 100, 150 people, they all go up market. They want to work with the Fortune 2000, they want to have longer contracts, bigger contracts, etc.

[Eric Huberman]

What that means is every SMB is.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Left to fend for themselves in this sea of muck that is the agency world that has no barrier to entry. And so I our mission is to be the best at what we do, but easy to work with. Why can't we be a name brand that everybody knows? Hawk Media, but we will work with SMBs. We're not pretentious. We're not about just shutting out the small guys who can work with the big ones. Now we do work with a lot of Fortune 2000. We work with tons of big brands and some of the big ones in Vegas too.

[Eric Huberman]

And it's been great, but we also.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Still start at like two grand a month. And if a company's just starting out and wants to hire a great marketing team that really can grow them, that's us. And we've now had so many, you know, successful case studies over the past 12 years that name an industry, we've got a playbook for it, and we can run it. And so from a predictable, scalable, repeatable marketing strategy. And you want a team that knows what they're doing. We've become that. And so, you know, for us, it's just getting our name out there and building this, you know, name brand so that every entrepreneur knows they have an ally on the marketing side. And that's really what we've tried to create, which is why the volume happens. But again, a lot of companies don't go for that because they're just trying to go for, you know, they want Nike and Unilever, which are two clients.

[Eric Huberman]

Of Hawks, but they want those two.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

And that's enough to build a, you know, $50 million business off of. So just focus.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Just off a couple of clients.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Yeah.

[Guest / Interviewer]

That's impressive. I saw you announced Hawkfest. Is that the first year you're doing that?

[Eric Huberman]

No, we started that in 2017.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Did it?

[Eric Huberman]

17, 18, 19. Stop with COVID And then the past years, we kind of piggybacked a group.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Called Founder Made, that's no longer in business, but had really big solid events.

[Eric Huberman]

And so then we decided it's time.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

To bring back our version of an.

[Eric Huberman]

Event because got some information or information.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Inspiration from a summit series, which is a great event and great group, where.

[Eric Huberman]

It'S not a typical conference. The idea is to bring a great group of people together, but make it more of like, we have panels and great content.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

I mean, we've got some big celebrity speakers, we've got some of the biggest entrepreneurs in la, like the founder of Zillow, we've got Anthony Anderson coming, Oliver Trevina, a bunch of great people.

[Eric Huberman]

But we have a ton of activations.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

And fun things going on at the same time.

[Eric Huberman]

So it's more about like, come have.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Fun network, meet the other great people in the room. And yes, there's great content too.

[Eric Huberman]

And so we have like a surf.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Simulator, puppy petting zoo, coconut bowling.

[Eric Huberman]

We made it. We always theme it.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

This year it's island themed. So yeah, that's September 25th in Venice. We took over a golf course for this one called Penmar.

[Guest / Interviewer]

You sold me on the puppy petting zoo. That's why. That's the main reason I'll be there.

[Eric Huberman]

And by the way, there's no theme that precludes that. So we did like a magic theme, we did a circus theme, we did a schoolyard theme, we did a jungle theme.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

You can always have the puppy petting zoo. So that's just a go to because you can adopt a puppy at our events, which is fun.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Yeah, events are something. When I first started my entrepreneurship career, I didn't go to events and it's actually a regret of mine. It really changed my perspective on a lot of things.

[Eric Huberman]

Yeah, events are the best place to build connection. Like when my sales team asks, like, how do we go get clients?

[Co-host / Business Partner]

I'm like, go to events and meet people, build trust again, it goes back to trust.

[Eric Huberman]

Like, if you're sending me a random.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Cold email, I'm probably not going to answer it.

[Eric Huberman]

If you're. If we walked up to an event and go.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

And you seem like a normal human being and say, hey what.

[Eric Huberman]

Can I mention this to you?

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Can I talk to you about something? Like sure, let's talk.

[Eric Huberman]

And then when you follow up in an email, then I'm like, oh yeah, I remember you.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Sure.

[Eric Huberman]

And so, yeah, events to me are.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

The greatest sales tool of all time.

[Eric Huberman]

And the probably where I know that.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

There was a question you could ask me about the biggest waste in marketing. I think also our events.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Yeah. If you sponsor exhibit at the wrong one.

[Eric Huberman]

Yeah. I mean, I just think like the trade show culture of like spending 150.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Grand or quarter million dollars on a trade show.

[Eric Huberman]

I'm sure there's ROI on it, but.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

I bet you could do it for a tenth of that cost.

[Eric Huberman]

We've always looked at these trade shows.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

And when we spend the money versus not what we still derive from it, there's ways to do it that aren't as intense from.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Yeah, I'm sure if you just send 10 people instead to just network. A higher ROI than setting up a table, right?

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Yeah, exactly.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Yeah. I don't imagine those produce unless you land a huge client. I don't see the roi.

[Eric Huberman]

And even if you do again, could.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

You have lended that client without spending the 70, 150 grand instead?

[Eric Huberman]

Spend. You know.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Yeah, exactly. Send five people to Vegas for. Let's say it's a Vegas conference. Like send five of your employees to Vegas. They're going to be pumped.

[Eric Huberman]

Let them do whatever they want, take.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

People to dinner, etc.

[Eric Huberman]

You'll spend ten grand, then probably get.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

A lot more out of it.

[Guest / Interviewer]

What's the best marketing campaign you've seen recently?

[Eric Huberman]

Ooh, best marketing. I mean, what's the astronomer getting? Gwyneth Paltrow. Got to give them credit.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Like, that was. What if that was planned?

[Guest / Interviewer]

That'd be nuts.

[Eric Huberman]

I mean, if that was planned.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Oh yeah, that'd be funny. What if I wanted that? Exactly.

[Eric Huberman]

But yeah, I mean, what's it called? Maximum effort. Is that the Ryan Reynolds Agency?

[Co-host / Business Partner]

I think Maximum is it?

[Eric Huberman]

I think that's the name of it. I don't want to butcher it, but I think it's maximum effort. But yeah, I mean they're. I love their niche.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

They are so good at that cultural conversation. What they did with that peloton commercial, girl, everyone remember.

[Guest / Interviewer]

I didn't see that one.

[Eric Huberman]

So they had that commercial that went.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Viral in a bad way because peloton had this girl, like, basically her. I think it was her boyfriend bought her a peloton. It was kind of like this like.

[Eric Huberman]

Oh, look, you're gonna make me work out, like kind of cringe kind of commercial. And they grabbed her and I think they did an aviation gin commercial with.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Her that was like, spot on.

[Eric Huberman]

And like, they really buy into the.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Zeitgeist and do really cool creative campaigns.

[Eric Huberman]

And to me, marketing in general, it's 90% having the pipes in order. All the performance marketing and your email.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Marketing, all those things set up.

[Eric Huberman]

Right. So that you then take 10% and.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Go do those viral things and those really big cultural impactful things and then grab all that attention and get them into your funnel.

[Eric Huberman]

You have to have the funnel and.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Everything built up and running. That's what creates scalable, repeatable marketing, which is super important for business because quick sugar highs from a great viral thing like what Astronomer just did with Gwyneth Paltrow.

[Eric Huberman]

That's great. If they now convert it into business. If they just get a bunch of.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Social media views and then no one ever talks about it again. They were great for a week.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Right.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Saw this with Dollar Shave Club they.

[Eric Huberman]

Got from that video they did originally.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

They did about 50,000 customers on that.

[Eric Huberman]

Platform and it took them another two.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Years to get to 200,000 because they had to figure out, okay, now what?

[Eric Huberman]

And so building those pipes are really important.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

But then I think maximum effort has an incredible perspective on now. How do we get that to just basically put a multiplier on everything.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Are you advising the clients you work with to do a lot of organic and content marketing these days?

[Eric Huberman]

Yeah. So it's a yes and no. The social channels to go viral or.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

To reach organic reach is so hard.

[Eric Huberman]

Back to scalable and repeatable, it's hard to bet on. So I think it's important. What I do encourage every brand to.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Do now is to become their own media company.

[Eric Huberman]

Start creating content, even if it's for.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Your own audience, your own customer base.

[Eric Huberman]

It's so hard to keep your customers now. And customer acquisition costs have gone up, customer attention's gone down because there's so much noise. And so creating a destination where your.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Customers and potential customers can engage above.

[Eric Huberman]

And beyond a purchase decision, which is content and actually, you know, digest things and creating content that serves the same.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Value proposition as your product or service.

[Eric Huberman]

And so let's say you're a running.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Insole company just because I have a friend Building one.

[Eric Huberman]

If you're a running insole company, like creating content around great running trails and.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Even doing running meetups and like being a media company in a business around.

[Eric Huberman]

Running and then people happen to buy.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Your insoles, you're going to get more purchases that way. You're going to get more engagement that way.

[Eric Huberman]

And the biggest one is you're going to get more word of mouth because people are less, much less likely to.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Share a product page of a product they like than share great content from a brand. And so you get a lot more word of mouth, a lot more of the brand spreading when you create great content that people want to share.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Smart. What do you think about these celebrities and influencers getting into CPG products?

[Eric Huberman]

I love it.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

I mean, we're a partner on a lot of them. We, we're an investor in Cali Water with Vanessa Hudgens and Demi Lovato and Oliver Trevena. We're an investor in Moshe with Patrick Schwarzenegger and Maria Shriver.

[Eric Huberman]

I think that you're speaking of media company.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

You've got individuals that are basically media companies now. So that part's done. And then you want your brand next to it now.

[Eric Huberman]

It has to be authentic.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

It has to be done right.

[Eric Huberman]

What I don't think works are a.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Brand starting and going, let's go throw a celebrity name on it. You need them to be actually a part of the business. They have to be passionate. They have to want to make it happen. I watch Oliver work with and Patrick with Moshe and Oliver with Caliwater. They are grinding harder than anyone else. And you saw that with Jessica Alba and Honest Company. See that with Ryan Reynolds with Mint Mobile and aviation, like that's how it's done.

[Eric Huberman]

Even George Clooney. And the interesting thing is we work with Casamigos. So what made them successful wasn't the.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Fact that it was George Clooney's face on it. And then people were like, I have to buy George Clooney tequila.

[Eric Huberman]

Like that. As much as he's a giant celebrity.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

I don't know that people really care that much.

[Eric Huberman]

But what he did was he hosted.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Dinners at his house for all the buyers at all the grocery stores and everyone that he wanted to carry it.

[Eric Huberman]

And so for a buyer that can.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Now get you into every Ralph's or Albertsons or whatever to come to his house and hang out with George Clooney.

[Eric Huberman]

You'Re not gonna say, no, we won't.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Put this on the shelf.

[Guest / Interviewer]

That's so smart.

[Eric Huberman]

Yeah. So when you're Building a celebrity brand or an influencer brand, it's about leveraging that in the ways that are hugely.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Impactful, not just, here's your face, go right.

[Eric Huberman]

And our team also did the branding on Prime.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Obviously they've done an incredible job, but again, they hustled, they worked.

[Eric Huberman]

It wasn't just like, put it on.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Their Instagram and call it a day.

[Eric Huberman]

So it's if. If you're gonna do it and the.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Celebrity is gonna really do it. Because I've seen both. I've also seen celebrities, I won't say.

[Eric Huberman]

Who, but I have a very well known supermodel that asked me to meet.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

With her and her manager, and her manager is awesome, but sat there with her cell phone in front of her.

[Eric Huberman]

Face like this and said, what was it? It's like, oh, just tell me what product you want to put my face.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

On and just, you know, you can borrow my pictures.

[Eric Huberman]

And she like, literally, like, did this with her hand and like, brushed me off. And I'm like, I mean, you asked me to come out here. Like, that's not going to work.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

And I'm sorry if I'm the only one to tell you that, but, like, if you're passionate about something, I'm here to help. If you're not, then it's, don't waste your time.

[Eric Huberman]

And it's. I've seen that with a lot of people of, like, trying to force a product. Like, oh, maybe we do this or maybe at one other celebrity, it's like, maybe we do ice cream sandwiches or overalls. Like, well, those are two very different things.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

I like both.

[Eric Huberman]

Those could be fun. But like, what are you actually going.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

To wake up every morning and push? Because it's going to be a hard work. And so.

[Eric Huberman]

But when you find that person that.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Wants to put in the work, it's great.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Yeah, I can't wait to think of something for, for this brand. Yeah, I think it'll be there. Maybe glass water. I don't know. It's got to be something I align with for sure.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Yeah. We're investing in Path Water right now.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Oh, yeah, they're already worth a lot. I had the founder on.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Yeah, Shoddy's awesome.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Yeah.

[Eric Huberman]

We did their initial launch on the.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Marketing side and really? Yeah.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Crushed it.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Yeah, they're doing great. And so finally we're ready to jump in with them.

[Guest / Interviewer]

People are sick of plastic water, bro.

[Eric Huberman]

Yep. I mean, the airport LAX has banned it. I think SFOs banned it.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

So, like. And yeah, it's continuing to go I'm still surprised.

[Eric Huberman]

I went to a sporting event the.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Other night at LAFC stadium and they're still serving plastic Aquafina.

[Guest / Interviewer]

I'm like this, they have a deal with coke, so.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Right. But Aquafina makes metal.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Oh, do that.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Yeah.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Oh, that's weird.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Yeah.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Do you see a trend in the health and wellness industry right now?

[Eric Huberman]

Yeah, I think more and more it's getting mainstream.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

I'm really focused on it personally. So I don't know if it's my own bias of like just the friendships I've created in that world and the.

[Eric Huberman]

Interest I have, but I am seeing, I mean, you have companies like Prenuvo.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

That are now crushing. It just raised a ton of money.

[Eric Huberman]

And the idea of people spending over.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Two grand on a full body MRI out of their own pocket because it's non insurance backed, it's like that shows.

[Eric Huberman]

Me if that business is viable, that.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Means there's a lot of money on longevity, which, big surprise. The fountain of youth is easy to monetize.

[Eric Huberman]

But I think, yeah, everybody wants to.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Figure out how to live forever. You've got guys like Brian Johnson screaming really well. We talked to him today because I think he's becoming our event.

[Eric Huberman]

And I've been good friends with Ben.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Greenfield, Andrew Huberman, Dave Asprey and all these guys.

[Eric Huberman]

And so I think there's a balance.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Like those guys have dedicated their life to it, which also means they've spent a lot of time on it.

[Eric Huberman]

And there's. You can kind of like, you know.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Do the 80, 20 rule and spend 20% of their effort, but get 80% of the results.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Eric Huberman]

And yeah, I, you know, I lost my dad to colon cancer four years.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Ago because he never got a colonoscopy.

[Eric Huberman]

And so that the reaction I had.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Was a very conscious, like, I'm just.

[Eric Huberman]

Like, we're at a time now where.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Most people can afford to monitor their health on some level. Even if you're talking about function, health and just getting your biomarkers, why wouldn't you take advantage of these tools so that you can get ahead of anything wrong? And I get it.

[Eric Huberman]

Ignorance is bliss until it catches up.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

And you're too late.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Right.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

And so for me, I'd rather just know everything.

[Eric Huberman]

And now, so I've done colonoscopy at them 38. And so I paid for my own colonoscopy.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

I did prenuvo full body mri. I do blood panels every quarter. I did a full heart scan and stress test. I know I've done more. I wear a whoop every day just to monitor my baseline stuff and found basically nothing, which was great.

[Eric Huberman]

So it's like, cool. I'm totally healthy.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

In another five years, I'll probably go through the full cycle again.

[Eric Huberman]

But at least, like. And God forbid I found something, at.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Least I found it, versus waiting for the symptoms to kick in when a lot of times it's too late, whether it's cancer or something else. Like, now I know this is what is normal in my body, and I have a baseline.

[Eric Huberman]

And to me, like, that's great, because.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Now if something's off in five years, I'll catch it because I know what.

[Eric Huberman]

Baseline looks like and I can get ahead of it.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

And, yeah, I want to be around a long time.

[Eric Huberman]

My dad told me an old story about his friend that, you know, I think is, what, 30 years older than my dad. And when my dad was like, 25.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

And this guy was 55, they'd be out partying and da, da, da. My dad's like, isn't this going to.

[Eric Huberman]

Hurt as you get older?

[Co-host / Business Partner]

And my dad's like.

[Eric Huberman]

And the guy's like, I don't want to. Those later years suck. Like, I'll be dead by him by.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

The time I'm 75. My dad ran into him at 75 in a wheelchair.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Jeez.

[Eric Huberman]

He's like, still feel that way?

[Co-host / Business Partner]

He's like, no, I want every minute I can get.

[Eric Huberman]

So there's very few people, I think.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

You do come to accept it once.

[Eric Huberman]

You'Re really at the end. But very few people get to a.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Point where, like, I just. I'm.

[Eric Huberman]

I'm good.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

I've lived my life.

[Eric Huberman]

Like, there's a lot about robbing your.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Future by taking advantage of your present.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Right.

[Eric Huberman]

And I'd rather be a little more.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Disciplined, be healthier now so that I can have a longer, healthier life. And it's not about quantity. It is quality, too.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Yeah, I love that, man. Eric, where can people find you and find your company and everything?

[Eric Huberman]

Yeah, I mean, I'm easy at or.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Slash Eric Uberman on any social channel. And then hawkmedia.com with me at the end. H A W K E Media.

[Guest / Interviewer]

Awesome. Stay tuned for the debate, guys.

[Co-host / Business Partner]

Yeah, thanks for having me.

[Podcast Host / Sponsor Announcer]

See ya. I hope you guys are enjoying the show. Please don't forget to like and subscribe.

[Guest / Interviewer]

It helps the show a lot with the algorithm. Thank you.