How AI Is Changing Marketing & Funnels Forever | Russell Brunson DSH #1252

Summary

Digital Social Hour Episode Summary: "How AI Is Changing Marketing & Funnels Forever | Russell Brunson DSH #1252"

Release Date: March 20, 2025
Host: Sean Kelly
Guest: Russell Brunson

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1. Introduction to the Episode

In this episode of Digital Social Hour, host Sean Kelly engages in an in-depth conversation with Russell Brunson, a renowned entrepreneur and marketing expert. The discussion traverses Russell's diverse interests, including his passion for rare book collecting, the evolving landscape of marketing events, the transformative role of AI in marketing and funnels, and personal insights on leadership and overcoming fears.

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2. Russell Brunson’s Passion for Rare Book Collecting

Russell Brunson shares his journey into the world of rare book collecting, highlighting how his interest began with a significant acquisition of Napoleon Hill's pre-first edition of "Laws of Success."

• Early Beginnings:
  Russell recounts purchasing a rare, signed copy of Napoleon Hill's Law of Success from a dedicated collector. This pivotal moment ignited his passion for book collecting.
  “...we flew out there and just bought his entire 20 years of collecting and brought it home.” (00:20)

• Building a Collection and Museum Vision:
  Over the past few years, Russell has amassed approximately 18,000 first edition books and manuscripts, alongside paintings from various authors. He envisions creating a museum to showcase these treasures, aiming to blend his interests in personal development and historical literature.
  “It's been the most fun treasure hunting thing in the world.” (08:10)

• Investment and Monetization:
  Beyond passion, Russell emphasizes the investment aspect of his collection. He notes that rare books have outperformed the S&P by approximately seven times. Additionally, his venture Secrets of Success repurchases public domain personal development books, generating $2-3 million annually, which funds his ongoing collection.
  “It's funding the addiction. So that's how I'm looking at it.” (08:19)

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3. The Evolving Landscape of Marketing Events

Russell discusses the shifting dynamics of marketing events, addressing the decline of traditional in-person gatherings in favor of virtual alternatives.

• Transition to Virtual Events:
  With major events like Grant’s Funnel Hacking Live and Tony Robbins' gatherings ceasing, there’s a noticeable shift towards virtual platforms. Russell explains the logistical and financial advantages of virtual events, such as reduced planning time and no need for physical venues.
  “We'll make as much or more from a virtual event where I don't have to leave my house.” (01:52)

• Challenges of Event Saturation:
  The market has become saturated with similar event formats, leading Russell to seek innovative approaches to stand out.
  “A lot of people modeled how we've done ours. Now they all look very similar and it's just kind of interesting.” (02:34)

• Future of Events:
  Despite the current trend towards virtuality, Russell anticipates the resurgence of large-scale events once the market stabilizes, although he personally seeks a break before embarking on new event ventures.
  “I need a break for a couple years.” (02:54)

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4. AI’s Transformative Role in Marketing and Funnels

A significant portion of the conversation delves into how Artificial Intelligence (AI) is revolutionizing marketing strategies and funnel creation.

• Rapid Development with AI:
  Russell highlights the astonishing speed at which AI can develop applications, noting that one of his developers built 18 new apps in two days using AI tools. This acceleration is transforming how businesses create and scale their marketing funnels.
  “He built 18 new apps for our platform just using AI.” (03:20)

• Impact on Content Creation:
  While AI offers immense efficiency, Russell expresses concerns about its influence on creative processes, such as book writing. He fears that relying too heavily on AI might erode the personal touch and emotional depth that human authors bring to their work.
  “There's like a balancing like this is going to ruin a part of my life I really enjoy versus... bleeding over it.” (03:55)

• Practical Applications and Limitations:
  The discussion touches on various AI applications, including summarizing audiobooks, health improvements, and enhancing marketing strategies. However, Russell emphasizes that certain aspects, particularly creative endeavors, still require human ingenuity and personal involvement.
  “It's like, this is awesome. This way it works. This is how it works. How I can make it work for me.” (16:23)

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5. Mastering the Art of Selling Online

Russell delves into his primary focus: teaching individuals how to sell online effectively, which he identifies as a critical component often overlooked in marketing education.

• Selling vs. Funnels:
  While funnels automate the marketing process, Russell argues that the actual skill of selling "one to many" is what truly drives success. His monthly virtual events, such as Selling Online, aim to teach these essential selling techniques.
  “The piece that most people are really bad at... is actually selling.” (13:54)

• Student Success Stories:
  Highlighting the achievements of his students, Russell shares the story of Eileen, who transitioned from driving Uber to earning $1 million from her bedroom. This exemplifies the effectiveness of his teaching methodology.
  “She's selling from her bedroom, making a million dollars. Like, that's incredible.” (14:38)

• Keys to Success:
  Russell emphasizes that passion and a love for the marketing process are paramount. Students who transcend the mere desire to make money and instead immerse themselves in understanding and mastering marketing principles achieve the most significant success.
  “The ones who fall in love with the process... have the most success.” (15:32)

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6. Overcoming Personal Fears and Leadership Challenges

Russell provides a candid look into his personal fears and the challenges of balancing business with family life, offering valuable insights for aspiring entrepreneurs.

• Fear of Failing and Impact on Dreams:
  Drawing from his wrestling background, Russell discusses how failure taught him resilience. He recounts losing his first wrestling match but using that setback to refine his skills, ultimately winning state championships.
  “If you fail, you're not a failure. The dream's not dead if you fail.” (29:22)

• Balancing Family and Business:
  As a father of five, Russell shares the emotional challenges of ensuring his children make good decisions as they grow independent. He underscores the importance of having a supportive partner to navigate the complexities of entrepreneurship while maintaining family bonds.
  “My biggest fears now are just my kids, like making. Helping them make good decisions.” (34:29)

• ADHD and Autism as Strengths:
  Discussing neurodiversity, Russell highlights how ADHD and autism can be leveraged as superpowers in business. He shares his own strategies for managing ADHD, such as using a treadmill desk and binaural beats to maintain focus.
  “It's like a superpower. Yes. It can do really bad things. But like society... they're superheroes.” (39:14)

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7. Building Effective Teams and Leadership

Russell emphasizes the critical role of team-building in scaling a business, advocating for surrounding oneself with passionate and competent individuals.

• From All-Star to Coach:
  Realizing the limitations of being an all-in-one entrepreneur, Russell transitioned to a coaching role, empowering a team of A-players to drive the business forward. This shift allowed ClickFunnels to scale exponentially.
  “I can't be the all star. I have to become a coach.” (44:32)

• Hiring Passionate Individuals:
  Russell stresses the importance of hiring individuals who are obsessed with their craft, regardless of their formal education or background. He contrasts structured thinkers with passionate 'hackers' who bring creativity and drive to the team.
  “It's like... how do you find the person who's, like, the most obsessed with the thing and, like, bring those people into your world?” (46:19)

• Overcoming Ego in Leadership:
  Acknowledging his own struggles with ego, Russell discusses the necessity of letting go to allow team members to excel in their areas of expertise. This humility is pivotal for fostering a collaborative and innovative work environment.
  “Put the ego down to like, okay, my job is not so much just to steal the ball... it's like, how do I coach them and guide them.” (45:00)

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8. Final Thoughts and Future Directions

As the conversation wraps up, Russell shares his forward-looking strategies and invites listeners to engage with his upcoming virtual events focused on selling online.

• Embracing Continuous Learning and Adaptation:
  Russell underscores the importance of continually evolving marketing strategies, especially in the fast-paced AI landscape.
  “Everything is changing, but when you understand the art of it, you can adapt.” (General Theme)

• Invitation to Join Virtual Events:
  Concluding the episode, Russell invites listeners to participate in his monthly Selling Online virtual events, emphasizing their value in mastering online sales techniques.
  “If anyone wants to learn how to sell online... join our virtual event.” (50:16)

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Notable Quotes with Attribution and Timestamps

• Russell Brunson: “I have to have. So eventually I went to buy that...” (00:20)
• Russell Brunson: “It's been the most fun treasure hunting thing in the world.” (08:10)
• Russell Brunson: “We'll make as much or more from a virtual event where I don't have to leave my house.” (01:52)
• Russell Brunson: “He built 18 new apps for our platform just using AI.” (03:20)
• Russell Brunson: “The ones who fall in love with the process... have the most success.” (15:32)
• Russell Brunson: “If you fail, you're not a failure. The dream's not dead if you fail.” (29:22)
• Russell Brunson: “It's like a superpower. Yes. It can do really bad things. But like society... they're superheroes.” (39:14)
• Russell Brunson: “I can't be the all star. I have to become a coach.” (44:32)
• Russell Brunson: “Everything is changing, but when you understand the art of it, you can adapt.” (General Theme)
• Russell Brunson: “If anyone wants to learn how to sell online... join our virtual event.” (50:16)

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Conclusion

This episode of Digital Social Hour provides a comprehensive look into Russell Brunson's multifaceted life, his insights on the integration of AI in marketing, and the essential principles of effective selling and team-building. Whether you're an aspiring entrepreneur or a seasoned marketer, Russell's experiences and advice offer valuable lessons on navigating the ever-evolving landscape of digital marketing and personal growth.

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Transcript

[Russell Brunson]

Found this piece on, on ebay was, it was Napoleon Hill. Before he wrote Think and Grow Rich, he wrote a book called Laws Law of Success. It was like a 16 book set and you can buy a first edition for like five grand. But there was a set that was a pre first edition. Three years before he wrote the first edition. He wrote it. It's kind of like, you know, authors write a book now they, they print a galley copy. They'll send their friends and people.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah.

[Russell Brunson]

So he wrote a galley copy of Lost Success three years before he published it. He sent it to like the President United States, the Queen of England and Andrew Carnegie and stuff. Anyway, there's only one known copy that's complete and he had it signed. It was on eBay for 1.5 million. I was like, oh, that would be. Anyway, so I, I didn't buy it for a long time. I was buying every other rare thing I could find, but that one just kept mocking me. I was like, I have to have. So eventually I went to buy that and the collector who had it, he'd been collecting Napoleon Hilstor for 20 years. And so I told him I'll just buy everything. So I flew out there and just bought his entire 20 years of collecting and brought it home. And that kind of like started my, the seed of my, my book collecting and, and then last two and a half, three years, about 18, 000 first edition books and manuscripts and wow. And paintings from authors. Anyway, just, it's been the most fun treasure hunting thing in the world.

[Unknown Host]

All right guys, Russell Brunson here today getting ready for his last funnel hacking live ever. Man, thanks for coming on.

[Russell Brunson]

Thanks for having me. I'm excited.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah, that number 10.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah, it's crazy. We started 10 years ago as like it was gonna be a one time event with our community and then it's become this huge crazy, you know, industry wide event which is fun.

[Unknown Host]

How many were at the first one?

[Russell Brunson]

Very first one we had 600 people and this one will have a little over 5,000. Wow.

[Unknown Host]

So 10x.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

It's interesting to see because Grant's calling it quits too.

[Russell Brunson]

I know, it's crazy. All the, the big events are going to be done and TNC got shut down which is a big one in our industry. So yeah, it's going to be next year. It'll be interesting to see who tries to step in and take the void.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah. I'm wondering what's going on in the event space. A lot of people seem to be going virtual.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

Tony Robbins, Right, Tony, Done.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah, we. Same thing. It's interesting because we'll make as much or more from a virtual event where I don't have to leave my house. There's these huge events that take us, you know, almost entire year to plan and put together and hotels and all that kind of stuff and so, yeah, I'm sure we'll do big events again in the future. I'm just. I need a break for a couple years.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah, I think there's a time and place for them. I think people got a little too, like, like, gun friendly with them. There was an event every week for like five years straight, so people got burnt out. You know, all these masterminds and everything.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah, for sure. It. It exploded in the last. Yeah, five or six years. It's been really crazy.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah. Well, I think after co ended, people wanted to go to events, but then it just got. So I get invited to so many events, it's nuts. You got to pick and choose your battles.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah. And that looks similar too. Like when we started ours originally, I felt like it was. It was different, it was unique. And now a lot of people modeled how we've done ours. Now they all look very similar and it's just kind of interesting. So I'm like, I want to. I want to reset and figure out a new way to do it that no one's doing, but I need some space to figure out what's new, you know?

[Unknown Host]

Right. Well, you've always been good at kind of carving the path. Right click. Funnels was very innovative when it came out.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

I think you were the first to do that sort of structure.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah, for sure.

[Unknown Host]

With funnels.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah. Prior we were all. The people who were doing funnels are all hand building them at the time. And so it wasn't. I don't think there were a lot of people who were talking about trying to build something like that. It was almost like everyone was racing towards building something and then we were the ones that got it done and executed on it. And yeah, for six or seven years we were just us. Before people started kind of copying us.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah. And now you're seeing it with the AI industry. Right. People that were working on it for five years before the boom are just cashing in right now.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah. AI so fast. We have one of our developers who built, in the last two days, built 18 new apps for our platform just using AI. He's like, you used to have to coast up to now I just told the. Tell the prompts and then it pops it out and you can just like he said, busting out apps so fast. Like apps that were entirely brands and businesses, they can, they can rewrite in, in an hour. It's insane, dude.

[Unknown Host]

It's nuts. I'm learning the fastest I've ever learned.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

Because of AI.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

I mean it's unreal. I'm summarizing audiobooks, I'm like getting these health tests. I'm asking AI to improve my health.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

There's so many uses.

[Russell Brunson]

Tells you everything. Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

Dude, it's insane. Are you using it pretty frequently?

[Russell Brunson]

We're using it for a lot of things. I also though, like part of me is like I'm nervous because I, I really enjoy reading books and I really enjoy. You know what I mean? So it's like I, there's like the balancing like this is going to ruin a part of my life I really enjoy versus you know, even like writing like I, I write books and it's a lot of work and now every night I was writing books. AI and it's like, God, you're losing like half of the, the art of writing a book is, you know, bleeding over it for.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah, I don't think it's fully there yet for writing books because that personal touch, that emotional connection with books is special.

[Russell Brunson]

I know for me and I would write my books. It's weird because you're in like, you're so deep in the writing process for so long that like you start seeing these connections start appearing that when I'm starting the book, I don't know these things and when you're in the middle of the book like these things are showing up, you're like, oh, that makes sense here. And I think if you're not in it writing it like you, you lose out on like half of the, Half the creativity.

[Unknown Host]

No, that's a good point. I mean you've written some books so you can speak from experience.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

It's a different perspective. I know you collect ancient books too, right? Yeah, I wanted to talk about that. Yeah, I'm a big collector.

[Russell Brunson]

Are you really?

[Unknown Host]

Yeah.

[Russell Brunson]

Books or other stuff?

[Unknown Host]

Just in general.

[Russell Brunson]

Okay.

[Unknown Host]

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[Russell Brunson]

That's amazing.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah. I want to learn how you got into ancient books. That's a unique sort of collection.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah. Let me tell you.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah.

[Russell Brunson]

So it started. So I'm a, I'm a Mormon. And I went on my mission 20 plus years ago to New Jersey and I met this lady who made her living. She was buying old books on ebay and flipping them on other auction sites. And I remember she showed me a first edition Book of Mormon and it was like $80,000 on, on eBay. This is 20 years ago. So then fast forward to like, you know, seven or eight years ago. I got some money and I go to ebay, I type in first edition Book of Mormon. I see one for sale. I was like, oh man, that would be cool. So I bought my very first one and I got it and it was just, it's cool. So they printed 5,000 of them. There's only about 350 known copies in the world. So it's one of 350. And I got it and it, that like started, it started like the itch for me and I was like, what else is interesting? So I started buying more religious books. And then I had this idea. I wanted to build like a museum or I wanted to show people what I was collecting. So I started building this museum and I'm like, it'd be cool to have different sections for different things that I'm passionate about. And so I started looking like, well, in the, in the business space, what are the old books? In the personal development space. And, and I found this piece on, on ebay. Was, it was Napoleon Hill before he wrote Think and Grow Rich, he wrote a book called Laws. Law of Success was like a 16 book set and you can buy a first edition for like five grand. But there was a, a, a set that was a pre. First Edition. Three years before he wrote the first edition. He wrote it. It's kind of like, you know, authors write a book now and they. They print a galley copy. They'll send their friends and people.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah.

[Russell Brunson]

So he wrote a galley copy of Law Success three years before he published it. He sent it to like the President United States and the Queen of England and Andrew Carnegie and stuff. Anyway, there's only one known copy that's complete, and he had it signed. It was on eBay for 1.5 million. I was like, oh, that, that would be. Anyway, so I. I didn't buy it for a long time. I was buying every other rare thing I could find, but that one just kept mocking me. I was like, I have to have. So eventually I went to buy that, and the collector who had it, he'd been collecting Napoleon Hill for 20 years. And so I told him, I'll just buy everything you have. And so I flew out there and just bought his entire 20 years of collecting and brought it home. And that kind of like started my. The seed of my. My book collecting. And. And then the last two and a half, three years, about 18,000 first edition books and manuscripts and.

[Unknown Host]

Wow.

[Russell Brunson]

And paintings from authors. Anyway, just. It's been the most fun treasure hunting thing in the world.

[Unknown Host]

Is it a passion thing or is it a investment or both?

[Russell Brunson]

So it would be an investment because books actually beat the S and P, like 7x or something like that.

[Unknown Host]

Wow.

[Russell Brunson]

But I'm also kind of a hoarder. I don't think I'll ever. So it's like. It's not actually. It's more just I'm obsessed with them.

[Unknown Host]

You're gonna pass it down to your kids.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah. And what's cool is like the personal development books, a lot of them are in the public domain. So now we're republishing a lot of them, you know, and we have a new brand. It's called Secrets of Success. We're republishing these books. And so, I mean, that. That business is doing two or three million bucks right now, just republishing these old books.

[Unknown Host]

Really?

[Russell Brunson]

So it's funding the addiction. So that's how I'm looking at it. It's like, okay, this helps kind of pay for me to buy more books and keeps them going.

[Unknown Host]

You can monetize it. You're not taking a full L on it.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

Wow. I can't believe stuff is listed on ebay for a million dollars.

[Russell Brunson]

Oh, yeah.

[Unknown Host]

And people buy it.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah, crazy people do.

[Unknown Host]

That is crazy.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

You Think it'd be, like, a scam or something.

[Russell Brunson]

I know. That's why, like, I reached out to him. I'm like, I have to make sure this is real. Yeah. Because I'm not going to wire him a million and a half. That scene. So we flew out there first to see it all, and then I was like, oh, dang, that's amazing.

[Unknown Host]

That must be your most expensive hobby, I'd imagine.

[Russell Brunson]

Oh, for sure. Yeah. And then it's funny because, like, there's that one. And then in the. In the Mormon books, there's. There's one book that's, like, the most rare. It's called the Book of Commandments. And when I first started collecting these collectors were like, if you ever see one in your life, you'll count yourself lucky. I want to buy one. Like, you'll never buy one. Anyway, there's nine copies on the planet. Most of them, like one at Stanford, one at Harvard. Like, they're all, like, in. In institutions. And anyway, 1. One of the institutions came up for sale, and I bought it. So it's like. That was another one. That one's a $1.5 million. Holy. And I have the only one that's in private hands right now. And, like, the coolest. So it becomes, like, fun because it's. There's a story and you can show people and. Yeah. So I love it.

[Unknown Host]

That is nuts, dude. You need good insurance on that. What's the most expensive book in the world? Do you know?

[Russell Brunson]

Oh, there's some that are insane. Yeah. Like, you get, like, a Gutenberg, you know, I don't think one sold since the 80s, but yeah, that'd be 80, 90 million. Holy. If it was to come to market, which no one will get rid of.

[Unknown Host]

Is that because there's only, like, three of them or something?

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

Wow.

[Russell Brunson]

First one's off the first printing presses, you know, and. Yeah, there's. It's insane. There's no top. There's. There's old manuscripts and old Bibles and old Torahs and stuff like that. They're just ridiculous.

[Unknown Host]

You could get crazy with it.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah, you can. You can go as deep as you want.

[Unknown Host]

That's nice. Yeah.

[Russell Brunson]

I gotta make more money, so I get more books.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah. It's interesting because I know you're not really, like, materialistic. Right. You're not buying, like, cars and watches and stuff. Stuff.

[Russell Brunson]

I do have a couple nice watches, but, yeah, not too much. Yeah. Yeah. My wife and I are pretty humble. Like, especially my wife. She's. She's very Much like, she's amazing. She's not into all the. The crazy stuff, you know, and so, yes, we had extra money, and, like, I don't know what to do with it. And we invest some. We, you know, we do some charity stuff. But it was just, like, when these books start coming around, it's like, I think there's. I don't know, they're really fun for me, and it's just a cool place to put your money. That and for me, it's like we're building a museum. Because I love. I love storytelling so people can come and, like, I just want to, like, show people and tell the stories on books and the authors and who they were and why they actually matter, and.

[Unknown Host]

I love that, man. Yeah, I know you really value family. I mean, you live in Idaho with all your money, you know, you could have chosen anywhere. So that shows to me you really value family.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah, I love that, man.

[Unknown Host]

Five kids.

[Russell Brunson]

Yep. Five kids now. And. Yeah, it's crazy.

[Unknown Host]

Has that been the toughest balance for you with business? Family?

[Russell Brunson]

Family, yeah, for sure. I mean, it's. It's tough because when we start having kids, like, consciously, I was like, I want to make sure that I'm a present dad. Like, I know a lot of people who are their dads, but they're not present. You know, I want to figure out how to be present. So that's been the balance. Like, how do I do what we're doing in business, but also, like, make sure I'm there for the practices and the games and the matches and the recitals and that kind of stuff, you know? Yeah. So it's been. It's been neat, though. The kids are. The kids are awesome. And it's fun because now the kids, like, they come to our events, and so we have a big event this weekend, so the kids will be there, and they just love being part of it. And you've been behind the scenes and backstage and meeting all the speakers and stuff. It's really fun.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah. They're going to learn a lot. A lot more than public school.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

Hanging around you. You send them to public school? Actually.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

Oh, you do?

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

Wow.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah. It's funny. Yeah. Because all their friends go there, and we told him since the very beginning, I'm like, I don't really, you know, make school's good socially. You got to learn how to read, got to learn to be with people and be around people, but, you know.

[Unknown Host]

Can only control so much because I know your. Your sons play sports, too. Right. So you Kind of need to send them to school for sure.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

Are they all still wrestling too?

[Russell Brunson]

So my, my twin boys just graduated, so they're done competing now and then. My daughter is a soccer player. My next son's a soccer player. So we're in the soccer soccer season of our life right now.

[Unknown Host]

Soccer's a good one. I attribute a lot of my success to sports, the mental side of things.

[Russell Brunson]

What sports did you play? What are your favorite?

[Unknown Host]

I played soccer. That was a good one. I was a big runner though. And that's a sport I really attribute my mental fortitude. Cause distance running is hard, man.

[Russell Brunson]

You doing cross country or. Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

You had to run 10 miles a day.

[Russell Brunson]

Dang.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah. You ever run distance like that before?

[Russell Brunson]

I'm a wrestler. We just short distances.

[Unknown Host]

Well, wrestlers gotta run a little bit, right?

[Russell Brunson]

We ran a lot, but it wasn't never like 10 mile.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah, it wasn't a fast pace, but still you gotta run to stay in shape. Yeah. Running is no joke. I think that's one of the hardest sports, personally. Like triathlons and stuff. Ironman's such a mental battle, I assume.

[Russell Brunson]

Right to that long.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah. That's why I respect Goggins. I mean that dude is different. Has he ever spoken at one of your events?

[Russell Brunson]

He hasn't yet.

[Unknown Host]

Oh no, he's show. No, he's super picky.

[Russell Brunson]

Is he very picky?

[Unknown Host]

I mean, once you get on Brogan, you know.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah. You can choose what you want.

[Unknown Host]

It's only downhill from there. I'm sure he gets asked every day to go on a podcast. I'm sure you do too.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

You know, you're probably picky. Your time's very valuable. I appreciate you coming on.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

What's going to be your. Your main focus this year now that you're parting ways from events?

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah. So we, we started a new virtual event this back five or six months ago. It's called selling online by selling online.com, which is a great domain, but it's teaching people how to do because obviously in my world I teach people how to build funnels and how to all sorts of stuff. But the piece that most people are really bad at because the funnel stuff's easy for some to learn, like, oh, I need these different pages but I think they're really bad at is actually selling. And so we started teaching selling a line event and we do it once a month right now and we bring people in, I teach them, we call one to many selling. How do you, how do you sell from a platform? Or from your funnel or from whatever that is. And so that's really our big focus. We had 3,700 people went through the event last month, and we're just trying to get the spot where I want five or six thousand people every month going through that event.

[Unknown Host]

Nice.

[Russell Brunson]

Because that's, like, the missing piece. They can figure that piece out. Then funnels become easy. Traffic becomes. All the other things become easy when you learn, like, how to actually sell.

[Unknown Host]

Absolutely. Well, I met one of your students today who came on the show, Eileen. And she is crushing it.

[Russell Brunson]

She's amazing, huh?

[Unknown Host]

I mean, she's selling from her bedroom, making a million dollars. Like, that's incredible.

[Russell Brunson]

She's insane. It's crazy because, like, she came into our world, like, three or four years ago. Her and her husband were driving Uber, and they came to one of our events.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah.

[Russell Brunson]

And just for her, just clicked. And then she came back, and she's a great speaker anyway, but she didn't have the structure of, like, how do you speak to sell? And as soon as you figure that out, then it was just like, off to the races. Like, it was fascinating to watch how fast she grew her business when she knew the structure of how to do it. Right.

[Unknown Host]

I always wonder what separates those top students from the rest. Have you figured that out yet? Because it can't just be work ethic.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah, I think I thought a lot about that, because it's all. With some people coming through our door every day, it's like, how. Like, how come these guys are killing. These guys aren't.

[Unknown Host]

Right.

[Russell Brunson]

And the. The one common thread I've seen between people who are successful is like. And the ones that aren't, the ones that aren't are the ones who come in because they're trying to figure out how to make money. And for some, like, those ones always struggle. The ones who come in. And then they usually come in initially because I want to make money. But the ones who fall in love with, like, understanding the art of it, those ones have success when they're like, whoa, this is cool. Like, this is how it works. And they start geeking out about that because there's. There's the nuances of the thing, Right. And you have to, like, you have to take something but adapt it for you and for your personality and your audience and stuff like that. And the ones who love it and become obsessed with those ones have the most success. And the ones that struggle are ones who are like, I'm trying to make money. It's not working. Why is it not working. It's just like you got to fall in love with the process. And then when you do that.

[Unknown Host]

Right.

[Russell Brunson]

For me, when I. When I started falling in love with the marketing and with learning these things, then it. Then everything changed for me. You know, I love that. And then.

[Unknown Host]

Because plus, what works in the past doesn't work in the future.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah. Like, you get you had a pattern for what worked in the past, but then you have to figure out, like, what are. Like, I was thinking about this with the house, right. You have a framework of a house, and it's like the structure, but, like, what you have to bring is the art. Like, you have to design and the decor and the painting. Like, you know, it's like, I can give you the structure, but you got to bring your own personality. And if you don't understand it, if you're just trying to, like, make money, it doesn't work. Right.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah.

[Russell Brunson]

You understand. Okay. This is awesome. This way it works. This is how it works. How I can make it work for me, like, that's the. That's the big change.

[Unknown Host]

Agreed. There's also a lot of just bad coaching, I think.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

Because you go on Facebook, people are saying webinars are dead. Right. I got buddies making millions a week off webinars.

[Russell Brunson]

I know.

[Unknown Host]

You know?

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

So there's just bad advice everywhere. So I think filtering is important.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah. Well, I think it's funny too, because I see it all the time. Like, funnels are dead. And then you click on the link in the ad and takes you through, like one of our clickfunnels. Funnels. Well, yeah, it's. Apparently it's dead. Yeah. But it's still working. Or webinars. Yeah. Like, I remember 20 years ago when I first got in this game, I remember seeing people talking about email. Like there's a guy had a book called the death of Email. Email is dead. And I was like, oh, no. Like it's those 20 years ago. I'm like, email still, today is still our most profitable revenue source by far.

[Unknown Host]

Me. Cold emails and crushing for me.

[Russell Brunson]

Oh, cold emails.

[Unknown Host]

Cold. Yeah.

[Russell Brunson]

That's interesting.

[Unknown Host]

I get a lot of guests, a lot of sponsors, a lot of people at my events. I do in person events. And it's all cold email.

[Russell Brunson]

Interesting.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah. We've been dominating, huh?

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah, that's interesting.

[Unknown Host]

Shout out to instantly. AI. They don't sponsor, but yeah, I use.

[Russell Brunson]

They should, though.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah, they should. I'm giving them a lot of promo right now. You don't do cold email that much though.

[Russell Brunson]

No, we do all really warm audits.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah, well warm's even better.

[Russell Brunson]

But all of our email comes off. We drive traffic, get them to opt into something and then all email comes from. From that.

[Unknown Host]

Okay. Yeah. Because you're running a ton of ads, right?

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

So you're just collecting emails non stop.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

I remember when SMS was going to be the next thing. Is that still hot?

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah, but it's different. I think, I think everyone thought it was going to be email times 100, you know.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah. With the open rates.

[Russell Brunson]

But like I noticed now with myself like I can get 50 emails in a day. It doesn't bother me if I get five texts in a day. I'm like annoyed. I mean facts and so it's weird. So I, I think that, I think there's a window where you can do it but I don't think number of people having success with it as an actual. I mean I think you can use like for me like I use right now when I'm doing something like oh, I'm going live like come over here and then I push them somewhere where it's like pushing something entertaining or exciting that works. But I can't just sell off or email. I can be like, hey, here's a new offer, go buy the thing and people will go buy and off text. Like just the. I don't know, something's different about it where at least for me I have not noticed sales increase that much. The barrier is just weird.

[Unknown Host]

I agree. I don't think I've ever bought off a text.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah. But off of similar, even social similar. Like, like if I just on a real or something I'm promoting something. Hardly does anything say if I push there I'm getting them to email somewhere else then email, you know.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah. I wonder if it's because on email a lot of people open it on desktop. Maybe that's why. And on your phone you're not, I.

[Russell Brunson]

Don'T know, harder to buy or.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah, maybe there's more friction.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

That's why you make click funnels. So much friction everywhere. I used to use click funnels every day, man.

[Russell Brunson]

Oh yeah.

[Unknown Host]

So with my networking events we started on click funnels. It was so easy to compare to Eventbrite. Yeah, Eventbrite's like kind of old school. I don't know if you used to use it but I think we did.

[Russell Brunson]

Way we connected two click funnels to be able to do the event management. Back end, be at the front end was a nightmare to make it work.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah. Now there's A new event app, I think. Have you seen it? Luma or something? It's really good, man.

[Russell Brunson]

Luma?

[Unknown Host]

Yeah, Lu Ma. Phenomenal. Yeah.

[Russell Brunson]

Never heard of it.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah, but I mean, with. With your events, you probably want to own all the data, so you wouldn't use something like that. Dude, are you still at the office? I saw you on an interview. Are you still at the office till 5am Every day?

[Russell Brunson]

No, not normally.

[Unknown Host]

Okay.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah, my normal. I'm usually there from like 9 to 5. Try to do like. Okay.

[Unknown Host]

Because I saw you talking on some interview. You were working till 4 to 5am.

[Russell Brunson]

If we're leading up to like an event like this or something crazy, there'll be some of that kind of stuff. But yeah, I've tried. I've tried to break my life up where I've got family time in the morning and the nights, and then when I'm in business, I can do business time. But I try not to. To bleed over that. Unless, again, unless event like this is coming up where, you know, I have 11 presentations over the next five days. So I was like, leading up to it, killing myself to get all this stuff done, you know. But after post event, then it goes back to normal.

[Unknown Host]

You're doing 11 yourself?

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

Holy crap.

[Russell Brunson]

I did. Because I used to go to. To tnc and I loved. I don't feel Ryan and Perry, but yeah, they're my favorite. And you, the vet, used to be just those two speaking. And then as they got bigger, they riding more speakers, more speakers. And eventually it was like they each did one speech and they had all these other speakers and I quit going. So I launched mine. I was like, the reason why I went is I wanted to hear Ryan and Perry talk. And I was like, if I. If I pull myself out like they did, then. Then my people will stop showing up. And so back then, I committed to do that. But usually I. Usually I do six, six or seven each event, but this is our last one. And so I had like. I had more stuff I wanted to say, so I kept putting them like, oh, I don't talk about this. Oh, and this. Oh, I got. I got to make sure they know this. And so I was kind of like putting all the last pieces.

[Unknown Host]

You're doing four a day. That's insane.

[Russell Brunson]

It'll be a little crazy, but yeah, that'll be awesome.

[Unknown Host]

I love it, man. Yeah, it's a balance. You can't have too many speakers.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

A lot of people are there for you, right?

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

And for click funnels.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah. Most of Our other speakers are people who came into our world. And so like, when I create the event, I try choreographic where it's like, I'm teaching a principle. And it's like, now here's three different people who, like Eileen, for example, like, she one of the best speakers ever. So I'm teaching, I'm talking about creating your one to many presentation. And she's got this really cool thing, I don't know if she talked about called bits, where it's like how she tells her story based on, like, on the, the church she used to go to and how they do stuff. It's like, so she'll speak about like storytelling and things like that inside of it. And so it's kind of fun because it's like, I can introduce the concept and here's our students who are doing it in different ways and showing different insights so people can, like, they don't just see, like, here's how Russell does it, but here's how other people. Yeah, that's for angles. It's really cool. And that's like, wow, what's your, what's your version? How can you do, you know, your own thing?

[Unknown Host]

Yeah, that's brilliant. Because people like seeing different ways on how people got there, right?

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

Because you got your own way. But maybe people, people can't relate to that.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah, some people try to be me and I'm like, I'm weird. Like, you know what I mean? Like, people like, they try to be like Tony Robbins or like me or like someone else, it's like, no, like, like figure out your version of this. Like, here's again, here's the structure, the framework. But you got to put your own art and your own twist into it to make it you 100.

[Unknown Host]

Because if you're just copying people, you're never gonna make it big. Right. You can only get to a certain level. Just copying. What's been your biggest takeaways from Tony? I know you and him are very close.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah. Man. I've had so many cool experiences with Tony over the years. Like, when I first met him, my wife and I had been married seven years and we were struggling. And like, that was my big first breakthrough with him. I went to that year, went to every Tony event, you know, and he had me speak at one of them. But that was like, I started learning just about like human psychology and about relationships, about all these, like, just stuff I'd never learned about.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah.

[Russell Brunson]

And becoming super aware of stuff. Right. Like, Tony's really good. Like helping you become Very aware of the patterns that you have in your life. And most of us get in these patterns. We have no idea what's happening. And so for my wife and I, we go to this event, all of a sudden, we start seeing the patterns that were, like, destroying our marriage. And it's like, oh. And we became aware of them, like, well, now that we know what they are, we can change them. We can fix it, right? And it changed everything, our relationship. And so that was the first time, was just those kind of things that he helped me with. And then fast forward a decade later, we started doing more business stuff together and more partnerships. And just fun to see the way his brain works, because he's not like the. The architect that's in there trying to do all the details. He's very much like. Like, he builds it. Like, he finds the best people in each space. He's like, I'm gonna take you and you and you and you, and then put them together and, like, even to the spot where he finds the best strategy person in that thing and then plugs them all in. And then he's like, hey, I'll attach my brand to this, and you guys go do the whole thing. And it's so cool to see how fast he's able to leverage things and create opportunities, because he, like the way he connects people. And then just, like, he. He's putting his blessing on it. And then it. It, you know, adding the Tony effect just makes things convert higher.

[Unknown Host]

I love that.

[Russell Brunson]

You know, it's really fascinating watching him move.

[Unknown Host]

I love that he went.

[Russell Brunson]

From my first met him, he had, like, I don't know, 30 companies. Now he's got, like, I don't know, three or 400 companies. That's all about that. Like, just really. He's so good at, like, finding the right people, plugging them all together and then. And like, whenever I've tried to do in the past, my problem is, like, I want to be the strategy guy, and I want to do the funnel. Like, there's pieces I want to keep, and Tony's more like. It feels like he's just like, nope, Put all the people and get someone's really good strategy, and then you guys go figure it out.

[Unknown Host]

Right?

[Russell Brunson]

And then these things blow up by the way he. He structures them.

[Unknown Host]

I mean, people don't realize how hard that is.

[Russell Brunson]

Oh, yeah.

[Unknown Host]

There's already a 90% failure rate on one company. He's doing 300.

[Russell Brunson]

Oh, it's crazy.

[Unknown Host]

Like, when you think about that, it's almost insane.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah. And you think about. I think again, for me, the ones that I have tried that I felt is because I want to weave my own ego into it. And like Tony could. Cuz Tony knows how to do everything. You know, he's like, he's brilliant, right? But he doesn't put his ego into it. He's just like, all right, let's find the best team. And then I trust your guys opinion. Just, you know, it's really cool.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah, ego is a dangerous one, right? Yeah, I always have my battles with it too. I think it's natural. When you just have success, it kind of creeps in a little bit. Then you got to put it in check.

[Russell Brunson]

Oh yeah, for sure.

[Unknown Host]

Have you had trouble with that in the past?

[Russell Brunson]

For sure. In fact, I remember twice my. Maybe three times. Wow. So I had a mentor one time, I had a business. It grown, it crashed and it grew, it again, it crashed. And about time I met, I went to this like this mastermind thing in Mexico and I sit next to the guy and the guy was brilliant. He's, he'd like done all these huge M and A deals and sold business, you know, crazy rich kind of guy. And he starts asking me my story. I'm like, oh. So I'm kind of telling the highlights because that's what we do, you know, like, oh, I did this, this. And he's like, he's like, so have you ever struggled? Like, have you ever? And so finally I was like, yeah. So I told him like the first time my business crashed and how I was kind of in the middle of one right now. And I remember he looked at me, he's like, oh, cool. He's like, I'll work with you. Then I'm like, what do you mean? He's like, I will never work with an entrepreneur who hasn't cycled at least once.

[Unknown Host]

Wow.

[Russell Brunson]

And first off, he called it cycling instead of failing. And I was like, oh, that feels way better. But then he said that, he's like. Because he's like, if you haven't cycled, then you still like, you still believe your own bio. You still drink your own Kool Aid right after you cycle. Once you realize it's not about you and there's always external forces. And I remember him saying, I was like, oh, that's such a cool, A cool reframe for me, you know, and so for me it was like I didn't feel I cycled and I learned a bunch of stuff and I'm coming back. And so I've had probably three Big cycles like that in my business where I've gone up and then down and. Yeah, up and down, but. And usually it feels like all of them are tied to, like, my ego. Eventually though, where it's like I, I get blindsided by something, so I'm like, oh, like I figured this stuff out and then. And then you get humbled.

[Unknown Host]

Same with me, man. I've had two cycles. I'm only 27, and I could have listened to my fiance on both of them because she, she was right.

[Russell Brunson]

You're like, no.

[Unknown Host]

It's crazy how intuitive women are.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

You know, I'm sure your wife has told you not to work with certain.

[Russell Brunson]

People and then that doesn't feel right. Like, what are you talking.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah, yeah, the numbers look good. What are you talking about? And now good woman by your side is game changer.

[Russell Brunson]

Oh, yeah.

[Unknown Host]

I see my, my single friend struggling in that part of their lives. And you know, dating is like a full time job too.

[Russell Brunson]

Oh, I can imagine.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah.

[Russell Brunson]

I'm dating 20 years nowadays. It's way different. When I was dating, when I was dating back in the day, it was way different. Nowadays there's so many. Yeah. All the apps and the things and I can't.

[Unknown Host]

Oh, yeah. It's a lot easier now, but that also makes it harder in a way.

[Russell Brunson]

For sure.

[Unknown Host]

You know, because it's too easy. These girls have so much access. It's. It's like tough being a guy right now, huh? You know? Did you meet her in Idaho?

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

Wife.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah. Better in college and. Or I met her church when I was going to college and.

[Unknown Host]

Beautiful. She stuck with you, man.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

You said the first eight years you guys were broke.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

That's awesome. So she believed in you.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah, she's. She's awesome. She believed me. She also was like, because, you know, starting a business, there's so much risk involved.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah.

[Russell Brunson]

And there's so many times when I've said this before, I'm like, you can only be as successful as your significant other will allow you to be. People get mad me sometimes for saying that's like, what do you mean? Like, they're not in charge of like. I know, but there's, there's like, there were, there were risks that I had to take. And I was like, hey, Colette, I, I think we need to take this risk. And she could have easily, like, scared or like. No. And my wife's, My wife's very fear prone too. Like, she gets very scared. But she would just be like, do you, like, do you feel Good. Like, it's gonna work. I'm like, I think so. She's like, okay, then she. She would, like, give me the blessing to do it. And if it failed, it was never, like, you know, like, you know, with your intimate partner. Like that. That person can build you up and they can destroy you. Like, they know your insecurities more than anyone, you know? Right. And she was just so great at never doing that and just being like, okay, well, what's the next thing? What are you gonna try next? Like. Like, you can figure this out. I'm like, okay, like, giving me that. That stuff, you know? And so, yeah, it's important to pick the right person who's going to be around because, you know, especially building a business, there's so much risk and so much ups and downs emotionally, mentally, Physically, that to. To create something new. Yeah. In the face of, like, all the opposition that comes, like, yeah. The. The right person next to you can make it so much easier.

[Unknown Host]

Damn janitor. I love that, though, because I was so scared of failure when I was younger.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

So scared of how people would perceive it. Now I love it. It's like the opposite, you know, like.

[Russell Brunson]

This is me, a good story.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah. Now it's like, okay, what can I learn from this? Like, this is going to make me even better. Better. But when I was younger, man, I was scared of it.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

So you're so spot on with that. I don't know what it is just like, the fear of being judged. Was that a big thing for you, too, when you were younger?

[Russell Brunson]

Fear, being judged? Fear of being like. I've seen this a lot with my students, too, is. Is like, they have a dream. Right. This is my dream. I want to accomplish this thing. And so they'll think about. They'll read about, listen to podcasts, and they get so excited. But then a lot of them, their biggest fear is, like. And because that keeps them in this loop for, like, years, this learning loop. The fear is not that they're gonna fail. The fear is like, what if I try and I fail and then the dream dies? Like, I'd rather just stay on the sidelines and think about it, because now the dream's still alive. Right.

[Unknown Host]

Wow.

[Russell Brunson]

That was the big, most fascinating thing. So with my students, I've worked a lot with them. It's just helping them understand, like, if you fail, you're not a failure. Like, the dream's not dead if you fail. And in fact, the story I was telling my. That I was talking about during our events, like, my Junior year in high school, I had a goal to be a state champ in wrestling. And all summer long I worked. I was like killing myself working towards 11. I knew I was gonna be a state champ, you know. And then my very first match of the season, I go out there to wrestle and I'm wrestling with a guy who'd taken second state, second place the state the year before. And he beats me. First match, first year. And I was just like crushed. I was like, I suck. I thought I was awesome. Barely not, you know, and then all my teammates are just like, I thought you were gonna be a state champ. I'm like, I know. And then everyone I knew at school, like, you know, it just like, it was so much pain and embarrassing. And then I learned like the greatest lesson from my dad. My dad, he had filmed the match. I remember that night we went home and he didn't sleep the whole night. He watched that, you know, six minute match probably 100 times at night. And like, looking at a diagram and figuring things out. And next morning I woke up to go to school and I'm all, I'm sad and bummed out. And he's like, come over here, Russell. And we go on the carpet and he's like, okay, this is what the kid did. And he started breaking down, like, how I lost. And we started looking at it and we drilled. And like, I remember that day before school, I was kind of annoyed, but we drilled, you know, all the things to get in the right positions. And the next day I went to wrestling practice. And then as soon as practice got done, my dad, like walked in the room after he got off work, walked in the room, I'm like, oh, man. He came in and we drilled it again. And we drilled it. And every single day that entire season, we drilled it, we drilled it, we drilled it. And then the end of the year, four months later, at the state tournament, me and that kid were on the opposite sides of the bracket. And sure enough, we get together in the finals. And right before the finals match, my dad pulls me aside, we go on the mats over to warming up, we drilled it again. I went out there and then I wrestled and I beat him and became the state champ.

[Unknown Host]

Wow.

[Russell Brunson]

And it was the coolest thing. Cause I learned like this lesson that most people don't learn. It's just like failure. If you fail, you're not a failure, right? If you fail, it's like learning. It's like the best source of information you could possibly get. And then it comes back to like from There it's like, you just keep tweaking and changing and tweaking and changing. And so for me, when I got into business, it was the same thing. We launch a funnel or launch a product or launch something. And if it failed again, that's. Most people like, oh, I'm a failure. Or they're too scared to launch because of failure. For me, it's like when we create something now, we create it. We launch as fast as we can. Cause I'm just trying to get the data. Okay, launch it real quick. And so, like, anytime we, like a book funnel or something we put out there, we just go spend a thousand bucks. We spend some money to get some ads and we start looking at the numbers. Like, okay, cool, that looks great. The conversion too low here, too high. You know, we look at the things they make. Rewrite this, tweak this, change, drive some more ads. You know, we keep doing that three or four times. So eventually all numbers are good. And like, now we launch it, then boom, it explodes.

[Unknown Host]

I love that.

[Russell Brunson]

Like, man, you're always successful. I'm like, no, it was because we. We fell really fast. And then we just, like, iterate and tweak, iterate and tweak. And as soon as it works, then we can. Then we can scale.

[Unknown Host]

Your dad was like your first mentor. That's cool, man.

[Russell Brunson]

It was cool to watch that. Because again, my default is I wanted to be bummed out and sad and miserable, which is most of us do if we fail, you know?

[Unknown Host]

Right.

[Russell Brunson]

I just learned from him. It was just like. No, it's just now we know where you're at a position. Let's just fix that.

[Unknown Host]

That was like, beat him. Yeah. It sounds like a make or break moment in your life, because a lot of people, that would have happened to you, right? And they would have folded. Yeah, right. They would have shut down the rest of the season and they would have lost who knows how many matches. But you, you took the opposite route, and you ended up wrestling at a higher level after that, right?

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah, there was some in high school and then wrestling college. And yeah, it was.

[Unknown Host]

Did you want to go pro or did you want to stop in college?

[Russell Brunson]

I, I. So I. In college, I never placed the NCAs. I was ranked in the top 10. And then. And I got done with that and I took a couple years off. And then actually I. I wanted to wrestle in the Olympics. And so it's a little crazy story, but I actually hired the Olympic Greco coach, moved him to Boise, and I hired like, eight guys who were competing for Olympics moved them all to Boise Training Center.

[Unknown Host]

Oh, that's cool.

[Russell Brunson]

I was like, I'm gonna bring all these people here. And we did that for eight or nine months. And then, and then, anyway, the business I was building on the side to fund, the whole thing kind of fell apart. And then I had to let all those guys go and it kind of fell apart. So I, I had a desire to go, but I never, I never got to that level where I could have. Actually, I think if I would have. Could have kept training for a couple years for the next Olympic cycle, maybe had a chance. But, yeah, it fell apart before I was able to go on.

[Unknown Host]

Who do you think the greatest wrestler of all time is?

[Russell Brunson]

Jordan Burroughs.

[Unknown Host]

Oh, that was a fast answer.

[Russell Brunson]

He spoke at our last funnel hacking Live. It was the coolest thing in the world. He just. Last year, it was crazy. It was the weekend before our event was a world tournament. And prior to that, John Smith had. Had won six world titles. He was the most decorated American wrestler of all time. And Jordan had six. And the two weeks before our event, he won it and won the seventh. And he came to our event with the medal and showed everyone and it was, it was pretty cool.

[Unknown Host]

Wow. I've seen his, his videos, actually. Is he still the champ?

[Russell Brunson]

He. He didn't qualify for Olympics this last round and.

[Unknown Host]

Oh, I saw that.

[Russell Brunson]

He.

[Unknown Host]

He barely lost to someone, right?

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah. So we're not sure if he's going to try to go one more cycle or if he's done. I don't think he's announced it yet, so.

[Unknown Host]

I love the Olympics. I can't wait till they're in LA, man.

[Russell Brunson]

Is that the next, next cycle, right?

[Unknown Host]

Yeah. 28.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

US wins every. Every time, baby. It's funny, we got like the best athletes, the best minds. We also got the worst.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

You know, we also got a lot of unhealthy people.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

So it's an interesting country, but you can really make it on your own here. You're proof of that.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah. Country is really interesting right now.

[Unknown Host]

Very interesting. Crazy times, for sure. You mentioned fear earlier, fear of failure. Do you have any fears right now? Anything you're fearful of?

[Russell Brunson]

My biggest fears now are just my kids, like making. Helping them make good decisions there, you know, my twins are 19 and 1. You know, they're both moved out. They're kind of doing their own thing and like, it's. That's been the biggest fears because, like, when they're your kids in your house, like, not that you have control, but at least you have more influence. And when they're out and so you're able to see stuff and you still have little influence, but it's different. And it's like, I don't know. For me, that's my biggest fear. Business side. Like, I, I'm kind of, you know, whatever happens doesn't happen, I'm fine with. But like now it's just something with my kids that's my biggest fear. Just like, man, I want them to make good decisions, have a good life, and not make decisions that are hard to turn back. You know what I mean?

[Unknown Host]

Right.

[Russell Brunson]

I think we all should make failures and screw up, but there's some, you know, there's decisions you can make that are hard to come back from. It's like, how do you guide them and protect them and all those kinds of things when they're not in your house?

[Unknown Host]

Yeah. You sent them off to college.

[Russell Brunson]

One just moved out and he's working right now. And then one went on a mission for our church and so.

[Unknown Host]

Oh, nice.

[Russell Brunson]

And they're twins and. But they're two different directions. Like, both of them have chosen way different paths in life. And so it's just also interesting to watch that and, and to be their biggest fan and to cheer them on, but also like their parent who you're scared to death for them. You know, it's, it's, it's been weird mentally for my wife and I just kind of had to deal with that over the last year. It's been different.

[Unknown Host]

I mean, that's why there's a term called helicopter parent. Have you heard of it? Sounds like you're borderline.

[Russell Brunson]

We watched a good, like, come back.

[Unknown Host]

It's a good thing, I think. I think parents love their kids so much, but sometimes they're too hands on for sure. So you don't want to be that. And you see that with sports, with their kids. They live through their kids in sports and then they lost them.

[Russell Brunson]

I've seen a lot. I had some really good friends that way who were great athletes, but their parents were so on top of them that when they, when they went away, they like rebelled and disappeared.

[Unknown Host]

Right.

[Russell Brunson]

You know, we had the number one recruit in the country when I was at Boise State who came within two weeks of getting there. He disappeared.

[Unknown Host]

Like, damn.

[Russell Brunson]

His, his parents had pushed him and he was, he was amazing. But just when he finally was out from the, under the finger of his parents, he just couldn't handle it.

[Unknown Host]

And just like, yeah, they end up hating the sport. Because there's so much pressure, right?

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

But at the same time you do need some pressure, I think.

[Russell Brunson]

For sure.

[Unknown Host]

I think pressure is important. That's when I perform my best, when my back's against the wall. Yeah, I'm sure you're the same.

[Russell Brunson]

I think it's also like, it's self imposed pressure. Like the pressure you decide that you choose. Like if someone else is choosing the pressure for you. That's when I think you rebel versus, like if it's like I want to do this, then it's. I love the pressure. Like this event's crazy. Like we have, you know, 5, 000 people. We got all this stuff happening. Like the pressure. This event's fun, but we chose it, we decided to do it and we have a goal and an outcome and things we're trying to do with it. And so yeah, I love that kind of pressure.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah. Have you always had high pressure on yourself?

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

Ever since you were a kid?

[Russell Brunson]

Ever since. Ever since I started competing as an athlete. Yeah. I just, I function a lot better under that. Like I struggle as a student where someone to give you a homework assignment, you got two weeks to do it. I'm like, what? It's like I would start the night before, like, you know, three hours before starts. Like, I like that better. It's like I function way better under pressure, pressure and chaos. Which is tough for my team because I think sometimes they're like, Russell's just a ball of chaos. But it's like I, I function better. I think it's like I kind of ADHD brain. So I think what I've discovered with that is like the more inputs that are happening, less stressful. You are like, if there's one focus, it's really hard because it's just like want to bounce all over.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah.

[Russell Brunson]

I had this really weird. I was at some event, I sat next to this guy who was like, he was the number one ADH doctor in the world.

[Unknown Host]

Oh, is that Daniel? Amen.

[Russell Brunson]

It wasn't aiming, it was. I can't remember the guy's name.

[Unknown Host]

Adhd.

[Russell Brunson]

Anyway, but we're talking and he. And, and we're talking about stuff and he told me he's like with someone who's adhd, he's like, he's like, the more inputs, the better. It was fascinating. Like when I write my books, if I sit to computer, try to write, it's a night, it's like my brain's just like, whoa. So right now when I write, I get it. I have a Treadmill, desk. So I get a treadmill. I have these binaural beats on my head and I'm walking and I'm typing and then I can function. I can focus so good.

[Unknown Host]

Wow.

[Russell Brunson]

If I'm sitting there by myself, it's just like I. I can't even do anything.

[Unknown Host]

I'm actually the same way now that you said it.

[Russell Brunson]

Like that isn't interesting.

[Unknown Host]

When I'm watching a podcast, it has to be on 2x speed. I gotta be like working while I'm doing it or driving.

[Russell Brunson]

It's just. Why I don't know if you were the same with a student. They said if you're a student and like you fidget a lot. That's why. Because you're like my hand's gotta be just something if I'm gonna pay attention to the teacher. Cuz it's like I can't non stop.

[Unknown Host]

My leg would switch.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

I actually just got a scan at Amen clinics.

[Russell Brunson]

Oh, is that cool. I wanted that so bad.

[Unknown Host]

You gotta do it. I'll connect you. Yeah, they'll hook you up. And I found out I have adhd.

[Russell Brunson]

Very cool.

[Unknown Host]

So that's.

[Russell Brunson]

Well that's like entrepreneurial. That's amazing. You have a superpower.

[Unknown Host]

It is a skill we think about like it's.

[Russell Brunson]

It's like. I don't know if you watch the X Men, but the X Men is like these people have these insane powers and then the regular humans always want to like, like stifle their power so they can be like everybody else. That's what I feel like with adhd. It's like it's the superpower. Yes. It can go, it can do really bad things. But like society like kids are in school of ADHD and the parents are teaching give them drugs to sit their calm. It's like you're like bearing their superpower. These guys are super. Like they're superheroes. And you're taking that away.

[Unknown Host]

Yep. They tried putting me on drugs in. Yeah. Elementary school. Isn't that terrible?

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah, it's crazy.

[Unknown Host]

I mean that is awful.

[Russell Brunson]

I think almost. Almost. Not all, but most of the hyper successful people I know right now have adhd. Like it's just, it's like a common thread among hyper successful people. And the normal people want to like suppress that. Right.

[Unknown Host]

And it's like interesting.

[Russell Brunson]

It's a superpower if you understand it and you know how to harness it.

[Unknown Host]

Makes you wonder if they know that too and they're intentionally doing it. Right. Could get a little nefarious. Same with autism, though. A lot of my successful friends have autism. Have you seen that too?

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah, yeah. They have a super. Like, that's interesting because you, like, they struggle here, but it's like over inflated successfully here. You know what I mean?

[Unknown Host]

Yeah.

[Russell Brunson]

Like, people like have, like they're missing a leg where they get stronger over here, like, to compensate. It's like. Anyway. Yeah, it's really fascinating.

[Unknown Host]

No, it is interesting, man. But now you can sort of channel it. I feel like autism and ADHD for sure.

[Russell Brunson]

If you understand. Again, if you understand it and you're not under drugs to block it, then it's like, now how do you. Yeah, for me, it's like I struggled in school. When I got in business, I learned how to channel it because it's like, okay, if I. If I take all this and I'm focusing on a thing and yeah, it becomes a superpower. But in school we have to sit there and listen to teacher and regurgitate back and forth. It's like, this is good. This is like everything I'm used to doing. This is the opposite.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah.

[Russell Brunson]

I can't. My brain can't function this way.

[Unknown Host]

You know, it was too slow for me.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

You know, it just felt so. Like I would go crazy in class.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

I was bouncing off the walls. I would ask. Go to the bathroom every single class. I was so bored. Like, weren't you super bored? Ye. But like, yeah. I got terrible grades too.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

And I felt I tied my identity to that. When I was younger, I always thought I was dumb. Yeah.

[Russell Brunson]

The same way.

[Unknown Host]

Same. I thought I was so stupid, I even got voted, like, most likely to fail. Yeah.

[Russell Brunson]

That was one of the things people.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah.

[Russell Brunson]

Like, thanks, teachers. The worst.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah. I got life of the party. Most likely to fail, you know, because I wrapped my identity in poor grades. So let me rebel and drink and party.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

You know, that was my high school mentality.

[Russell Brunson]

Interesting.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah.

[Russell Brunson]

I was saying I always thought I was dumb. And then when I started my business, I was doing a couple things and trying some stuff. And I remember going to an event and someone had seen my stuff, like, oh, you're Russell. I saw your thing. That's so brilliant. And it was the first time anyone ever not told me I was dumb. And I was like, whoa, I'm. Am I smart? And I kept doing some stuff and then. And then. Yeah. People were like, that was really cool the way, the way you said that. And again, I started this input. I'm like, I'm not dumb.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah.

[Russell Brunson]

This is great news. Like, I'm just different. Okay. I'm not dumb. So my identity, I was able to break it from being a dumb kid to this. And like, yeah, it's weird. You said that you attach your identity to. What was it for you that you broke the identity to shift?

[Unknown Host]

I think getting into entrepreneurship, similar to you. So I'm half Asian. So, like, I always thought I was dumb because Asians stereotypically get the best grades. Right. So all my Asian friends were getting like 4.0, like perfect SAT scores. I'm getting like a 2. 7. So that sucked. And then Asians like to compare. So, like, my Asian parents would compare with other Asian parents. So I just felt dumb because of grades. But then getting into business, making some money, that can kind of change your mindset a little bit. I feel like if you give you that confidence that I didn't have.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

And then, yeah, started networking, talking to people, and they were talking to me like I was normal. Asians wouldn't even hang out with me in school, really, because I didn't get good enough grades.

[Russell Brunson]

That's crazy.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah. I blended more in with the. With the athletes, so it was interesting. Man.

[Russell Brunson]

I remember the first time when I was in college, there was this kid that was like the smartest kid in my class. I hated him because he. He was so smart. And then I remember fast forward three or four years later, he came and applied for a job for me. And I was like, hire him. Like, for what? I'm like, I don't care. I just want to be able to tell everybody that that guy now works for me because I was like, for me. So he worked for me for like three or four months and it didn't work out, but I was just like, specifically, I just wanted to be able.

[Unknown Host]

To, like, I love that.

[Russell Brunson]

Tell my mom, like, hey, this kid was like the honor or the valedictorian, and he works for me now.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah. Did you get bullied a lot?

[Russell Brunson]

Not. I was a wrestler, so I didn't get bullied because of that. But I have a lot of friends. I wasn't like, I wasn't socially. I was not the life of the party. I was the awkward kid who was wrestling or even wrestling trips. I go on these, like, when I was a Boise State, we go on these, like 18 hour bus rides to Portland to go wrestle or whatever.

[Unknown Host]

Damn, you didn't fly.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah. Boise State was really poor. Yeah. Before our football team got good. No money as a school. And so all the guys would just sleep the whole ride there. And I Remember, I would go. And this is before. Anyway, before podcasts and stuff. Stuff. But I would go, and there's a couple guys like Arm and Moore and a couple guys who were out teaching marketing stuff. So I would. They do tele seminars. So I download the tele seminar, burn them on CDs, and so I take this big old stack of CDs on these long road trips. I just listen these CDs of these guys, you know, talking. So I remember one of my teammates later, he came up to me, he's like, man, when we used to go on those long trips and you'd be sitting back there listening to your thing while we're all sleeping, he's like, we all thought you were going to kill us or something. He was like, it was so weird. So that was kind of mine. I was never bullied. I was just kind of. I'm sure I was just kind of the weird kid that's kind of off the people. Like, all right, whatever.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah. And now those kids are, like, running the country.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

Like, all the people I used to get made fun of or thought you were different.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

You know, because we're breaking the mold.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

That's funny, though, man. I'd love to see that. I'd love to see your brain scan, too. I can't wait.

[Russell Brunson]

I want to see it, too. Like, I heard about AAN a while ago, and I always wanted to go and just haven't had a chance to. To do it.

[Unknown Host]

I wouldn't be surprised if you had adhd.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

I think one recognizes one.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah, we feel the same.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah.

[Russell Brunson]

That's so cool.

[Unknown Host]

So one of the things I heard you say on a show was if you could go and ask yourself at 25 or go tell yourself something at age 25, what would you say? And you said you wish you would have built a team earlier. That really resonated with me because I've been solo for a while.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

So you said that was one of your biggest regrets.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah, it's. I had this weird epiphany that I can't remember when it was. But you think about, like, when we become entrepreneurs, like, we're almost like, we can be all star. Right? Like, I think about, like, I'm Michael Jordan in my sport. Right. I'm the best. I can do everything. Like, and you have to learn how to do all this stuff. Right? Like, I had to learn how to write, copy and drive traffic and write build pages, you know? So, like, you become an all star, you can do everything. And then even for me, when I first started building a team, it was hard for me because I'd build a team, but then like, they'd be doing something and then for me it was like, I like steal the ball from a dunk on, you know, dunk anyway because, like, like, well, they're doing it, but I can do better, right? You know, and I like, I would build a team by what I wasn't like, empowering them. And I had this realization. I'm like, for me to get to the next level, I can't be the all star. I have to become a coach. If I become a coach and I can like build an all star team, like, that's the transition point. And as we started doing that, it was crazy. In fact, my business partner now, Todd Dickerson, he's one who built ClickFunnels, the first version by himself. And I remember we had this conversation, he read an article or something, it said that like, difference between an A player and a B player. Like an A player can get like 3200 times more done than a B player. Something crazy like that. And he's just like, we just gotta find a whole bunch of A players to surround ourselves with and we'll be able to do what most teams take thousands of people to do, right? And sure enough, we start bringing in the right team. That's when everything just blew up for us. And it was just like, this is crazy. And when I was able to put my ego again, here comes the ego. Put the ego down to like, okay, my job is not so much just to steal the ball from and try dunk. It's like, how do I try to, how do I try to coach them and guide them based on my experience, but let them do their thing, let them figure it out and let them become the A players in each of their individual divisions. And like, we started doing more of that. That's when, yeah, things are blossoming, growing at a rate. Just ridiculous.

[Unknown Host]

It's an interesting dynamic because as a business owner, you want to save on cost, right? So typically hiring, you want to save, but at the same time you don't want to cheap out on.

[Russell Brunson]

It's backward. Yes, it's weird because you always try who's the cheapest person? It's like, well, who's the most expensive? You can do the work of 10 people, right? Like, you know, I see all the time with like developers where it's just like, it's funny, you get like the college graduated developers who, you know, have all the degrees and stuff and And. But they're very structured in their thinking because they went through school. And then you find this, like, hacker who just graduated from high school who, like, you know, is living in a basement with his mom. And he comes in, he just, like, laps these guys. That one dude, because he's so passionate. His whole life's been geeking out on coding and stuff. Like, he can be all these, like, MBAs or whatever, the equivalent of, you know, developers. But it's just. It's just fascinating like that. So it's like, man, how do you find the person who's, like, the most obsessed with the thing and, like, bring those people into your world? That's how you. That's how you see the inexpensive, expensive growth.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah. Do you think that obsession is teachable? I always think about this because people ask me, like, how. Why I work so much. I'm like, is that even teachable?

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah. You know, I don't know. Because it comes back to desire. Right. I think about this a lot because I don't think. I don't think you can teach desire. I. I think. I think desire comes from God. Like, we get planted. Like, we have desires for things. So I think if someone does not have the desire to do something, it's almost impossible to get them to have desire. Like, I. I don't know how to do that. I've tried my kids. If there's something I want, I cannot get them desire. But if someone's got a little bit of desire, I think you can flam that. You can. You can. You can fan that flame and you can help grow it. And so. So I think obsession, if they have a desire already, I think you can turn it into an obsession. But if they don't have that, it's almost impossible.

[Unknown Host]

Agreed. Yeah. Initially mine came from, like, getting bullied, I think, proving people wrong. But then when that happened, I had to find a new desire. Has that happened to you where you've had to shift kind of like your fuel 100?

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah. First me saying that I want to figure out, make money and show everyone that I figured it out. And then I don't know if it's same for you. After that started happening, I was like, it doesn't actually feel like what I thought it was going to feel like.

[Unknown Host]

Right. They don't really care.

[Russell Brunson]

And you get this, like, emptiness and like, huh. And then for me, it was interesting because, like, the next phase was I started seeing the people we were helping and seeing them have success. And then I was like, oh, that. That feels better. In fact, I remember this because, for me, my favorite feeling of all time was, like, I win a wrestling match, I get my hand raised. Like, that was the greatest feeling of all time. And I never thought it'd get better than that. And then my son started wrestling my sons, and one of them. One of my sons, he was really bad this first season. He didn't win a single match the entire season. And every time he got the match crying, it was so hard. And we worked, like, me and him worked so hard, just. And anyway, the very last match of the season, he beat the kid. He won his first match, and he gets off the thing, and he's jumping around. He comes over, and they. The ref raises his hand. He had the biggest smile on his face. And I was like, that feels better than when I won.

[Unknown Host]

Wow.

[Russell Brunson]

And I feel like the same thing with my students. Like, first, like, I was having success make. I'm like, this is amazing. This feels so good. But the first time someone else did and they had success, I was like, whoa, that feels way better. Like, helping them actually feels better. And then that became the next obsession for me. And then that's. That's when I think it changes.

[Unknown Host]

I love that.

[Russell Brunson]

I don't know.

[Unknown Host]

No, I could see that too. Like, even just, like, when I give homeless people food, it feels, like, amazing. Like, better than anything I do for myself. It's such a indescribable feeling. Right.

[Russell Brunson]

Like, the value you get out of that is. Is insane. Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah. Someone needs to figure out what's going on there in the body. It feels amazing. It's, like, addicting when you help other people with nothing in return.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

And I wish more people thought like that. A lot of people are innately selfish. I think in order to survive, it's like a prehistoric mindset. So I could see why. I mean, I was pretty selfish growing up.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah. What was the shift for you?

[Unknown Host]

I think having resources helped, but even if you don't have resources, I think you could still be pretty giving with time and other. Other things.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

But I think death honestly had some close ones pass away and realized, you never know. It's gonna be over.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

Let me start doing some positive stuff.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah. You know, with the time you got. Yeah. It's interesting.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah. Well, Russell, it's been awesome. I can't wait to go to your van. It'll be my first one.

[Russell Brunson]

Yeah.

[Unknown Host]

So I can't wait to come. Anything else you want to close off with here, man?

[Russell Brunson]

I think if. Basically, I'd say if. If anyone wants to learn how to sell online. That's what we do. We help people do that. We have a big event we do once a month teaching people how to sell online. If you guys want to come and hang out to that event, it's a virtual event, but that'll. That's kind of the. The coolest big thing we do all the time. And that. Glad to. Grateful for you. Allow me to be here and. And finally been talking to us for a couple years. I feel like. Yeah, we finally had a chance to. To make it all work.

[Unknown Host]

You were on my dream 100 list, man.

[Russell Brunson]

Oh, yeah.

[Unknown Host]

Let's go.

[Russell Brunson]

That's amazing.

[Unknown Host]

Yeah. I'll link your stuff below. Thanks for watching, guys. I'll see you next time.