Instagram's Hidden Algorithm: 8M Follower Account Reveals All | Gina Tash DSH #981

Summary

Digital Social Hour: Instagram's Hidden Algorithm – 8M Follower Account Reveals All | Gina Tash DSH #981

Release Date: December 15, 2024

In episode #981 of Digital Social Hour, host Sean Kelly delves deep into the intricacies of Instagram's evolving algorithm with Gina Tash, the influential voice behind the sprawling digital media company, My Therapist Says. With an impressive following of 8 million, Gina offers invaluable insights into social media growth, personal branding, and the challenges faced by both burgeoning and established influencers in the competitive landscape of travel and fashion.

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Navigating Instagram's Ever-Changing Algorithm

The conversation kicks off with Gina addressing the unpredictable nature of gaining views and followers on Instagram. Reflecting on past strategies, she notes, “[00:04] And you never know when something's gonna hit. The formula used to be, like, a few months ago or, like, a year ago… but for bigger creators like us, it's hard. You never know anymore.” This uncertainty highlights the volatile environment creators must navigate, especially as Instagram continuously tweaks its algorithm.

Gina laments the recent updates, emphasizing how they complicate content visibility: “[01:06] Instagram makes things very difficult… everything they're changing, there is a new challenge… I personally miss the chronological order.” She underscores the frustration among creators, particularly smaller ones, who struggle to maintain their reach amidst these shifts. Sean shares his own experience, stating, “[02:23] My reach is down 70% in the past 60 days. It's nuts.” This mutual frustration sets the stage for a candid discussion on the broader impacts of algorithm changes on content dissemination.

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The Genesis and Growth of My Therapist Says

Gina provides a captivating backstory of how My Therapist Says transformed from a casual Instagram account into a digital media powerhouse: “[04:44] It started out as a really big Instagram account in like, the very beginning of Instagram, like 10 years ago.” Collaborating with her sisters and a best friend, the account began by sharing relatable and humorous content tailored to young women, quickly going viral within a month.

Without relying on paid advertisements, Gina attributes their rapid growth to organic engagement: “[05:47] No, we've never done it on our own actual stuff.” This organic strategy contrasts sharply with current trends where many creators feel compelled to invest in paid promotions to sustain visibility.

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Monetizing an Influential Platform

A significant portion of the dialogue centers on how Gina successfully monetizes her vast follower base. She explains, “[07:49] We monetize by creating viral marketing content for big brands… we are now acting as a creative agency.” By leveraging their deep understanding of audience preferences, My Therapist Says crafts compelling campaigns for major clients like Netflix and Hulu, ensuring high engagement and return on investment.

Gina highlights the shift from traditional advertising to influencer-driven promotions: “[09:33] How are you gonna be shown, like, an ad for something if you're not partaking in the old school media… we're all so easily influenced… Access your consumer now through social media.” This adaptation underscores the critical role influencers play in modern marketing strategies, where authenticity and relatability drive consumer trust and purchasing decisions.

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Content Strategy and Achieving Virality

Discussing content dynamics, Gina shares insights into what drives virality on Instagram: “[13:17] Actually, lately, like, it used to be reels a while ago. Now lately we find that static images do really, really well.” While reels were once the linchpin for growth, Gina notes a paradigm shift towards static and text-based content, reflecting evolving user preferences.

She emphasizes the importance of consistency and volume in posting: “[14:28] We post like six times a day… The more we post, the better it does.” By maintaining high activity levels, My Therapist Says ensures sustained engagement and maximizes the potential for content to go viral, often achieving view counts upwards of 20 million: “[14:32] Some of our posts do way more than that.”

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Balancing Personal Branding with Corporate Identity

Gina discusses the strategic decision to separate personal branding from the corporate identity of My Therapist Says: “[11:12] It was very intentional… we wanted people to relate to our content and our message…” This delineation allows the company to function as a cohesive entity, focusing on delivering quality content without the unpredictability of personal opinions impacting the brand.

However, she acknowledges the growing importance of personal branding: “[24:41] So, yes, I'm heavily focused on my personal brand now and… embarks into sharing more of myself because I’m sure you can relate.” Balancing these two aspects is crucial for maintaining the integrity and reach of both personal and corporate endeavors.

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The Realities of Travel and Food Influencing

Transitioning to lifestyle topics, Gina offers an honest portrayal of the demands of travel and food influencing: “[17:17] Every time we travel for work… you still have to film everything you do… it's still a real job.” While the perks of such a lifestyle are enticing, including complimentary accommodations and exclusive experiences, the constant content creation and high expectations can be taxing.

Gina also delves into the power influencers hold in shaping consumer behavior: “[19:26] It's a beautiful power and a huge responsibility to be able to make a place or product go viral.” This responsibility is balanced with a selective approach to sponsored content, ensuring that only authentic and resonant partnerships are pursued to maintain audience trust.

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Mental Health and Personal Challenges

The conversation takes a personal turn as Gina opens up about her struggles with anxiety: “[27:26] That's why my therapist says, yeah, that makes sense.” She contrasts her experience with Sean’s, revealing the nuanced ways mental health impacts creators in the digital age. This vulnerability adds depth to the discussion, highlighting the importance of mental well-being amidst the pressures of maintaining a massive online presence.

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Future Endeavors and Final Thoughts

As the episode winds down, Gina shares her aspirations and future plans, hinting at further expansion of her personal brand and ongoing projects like her vlog channel: “[24:41] I'm just trying to figure out where I want to take my own career next.” Sean reinforces the significance of personal branding, declaring, “[25:45] Personal brand is so important… it's the best move I've ever made.”

In closing, Gina provides listeners with ways to connect and follow her work: “[29:48] We are at My Therapist Says and I'm at Gina's Hash.” This invitation encourages engagement beyond the podcast, fostering a community around shared interests in social media mastery and personal growth.

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Key Takeaways:

• Algorithm Fluidity: Instagram’s constant algorithm changes pose challenges, especially for larger creators who no longer experience predictable growth.

• Organic Growth Success: Building a substantial following organically is achievable with authentic, relatable content and consistency.

• Monetization Strategies: Leveraging influencer status to act as a creative agency fosters sustainable income through brand partnerships.

• Content Evolution: Adapting to content trends, such as the shift from reels to static images, is crucial for maintaining engagement.

• Balancing Branding: Separating personal and corporate identities allows for strategic content management and mitigates risks associated with personal opinions.

• Influencer Responsibility: The influence wielded by social media personalities significantly impacts consumer behavior and brand success.

• Mental Health Awareness: Addressing personal challenges like anxiety is essential for long-term sustainability and authenticity in the digital space.

• Future Growth: Continuous evolution and exploration of new content forms, such as vlogging, are vital for sustained relevance and personal fulfillment.

Gina Tash’s insights provide a comprehensive roadmap for influencers and entrepreneurs navigating the complexities of social media, emphasizing resilience, adaptability, and authenticity as key drivers of success.

Transcript

[A]

People keep asking me how to get views and stuff. I really don't have a formula for that.

[B]

And you never know when something's gonna hit. The formula used to be, like, a few months ago or, like, a year ago, I guess, when they. Since they introduced reels, it was like, as long as you keep making reels, you'll grow. Especially for smaller creators, that's a great way to go viral. Like, you'll see someone with, like, you know, 3,000 followers, and then they'll have a reel that made, like, 2 million. But for bigger creators like us, it's hard. You never know anymore.

[A]

All right, guys, Gina Tosh here. Today we're going to talk social media growth, personal branding, and being an influencer in the travel and fashion space. Thanks for coming on.

[B]

Thank you. Happy to be here.

[A]

Absolutely. When I saw your page, I was like, I didn't even know you ran that page, first of all. But 8 million followers is really impressive.

[B]

Thank you. It's been a long time.

[A]

A long time. Yeah. People don't realize that they see my page. I've been doing it for eight years. Wow.

[B]

Wow. Really?

[A]

How'd you grow so quick? You probably get that all the time, too.

[B]

Exactly. Yeah. We've been doing it for 10 years.

[A]

Exactly. And it's gotten a lot harder to grow recently.

[B]

Oh, tell me about it.

[A]

The new updates are terrible. I'd love for you to explain what's going on there.

[B]

Well, you know, Instagram makes things very difficult, so you would think that they would want their creators or their best creators to stay on their platform and not migrate to things like TikTok or YouTube shorts or whatever. But they keep changing the algorithm, and with every change, there is a new challenge and people trying to figure it out and see what works. Like, one few months they're pushing reels, the next few months they're pushing stories. And then it just. Like, a lot of people are complaining so much, and especially smaller creators. Nobody's content's being seen the way it's meant to be seen. I mean, I personally miss the chronological order. The timeline was. Tell me about it. I don't know why they would get rid of it. I love Instagram. That's my favorite platform. And. And that's the reason why we started on Instagram. So to me, now, it's so confusing. Like, I follow even the people that I follow, like, personally, like influencers or whoever. I want to see whose content I want to see. I don't see them. They don't show up. And I interact with Their content all the time. And I don't see their content. I have to go on my search bar and search for that person every day if I want to see their content.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

And that makes things significantly more difficult. And as a creator, it's very frustrating, I think especially if you're a smaller creator. It's so much harder now to get that reach a hundred percent.

[A]

My reach is down 70% in the past 60 days. It's nuts. Like every vehicle just dropped 5, 10%.

[B]

Right. It's crazy. It's not how it used to be. I was just like talking about it earlier today to someone like a brand reached out. And they were always like, reach out to ask for your updated stats. And I just saw the last email we sent them and like where the stats were and it's just a little crazy.

[A]

Dude, the drop offs are crazy. And I'm wondering if it's partially cause of all the politics. Oh, well, they're pushing that everywhere.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And maybe they're just filtering out other content.

[B]

Well, I think Instagram really has become a more. People have become less patient and more angry on all social media accounts. Like in the recent, like last like nine to 10 months since all these, like, political issues have started and it's election year and this and that. So I do feel like a lot of people are staying off social media maybe and not engaging as much or only being shown certain type of content and not being shown like unrelated content. So I could definitely see there's a, there's a different, There's a change, there's a shift.

[A]

Yeah, it's weird time. People keep asking me how to get views and stuff. I really don't have a formula for that other than like make good content.

[B]

Right. And you never know when something's gonna hit. Like before the formula used to be like a few months ago or like a year ago, I guess when they. Since they introduced reels, it was like, as long as you keep making reels, you'll grow. That's kind of still the case, I think, especially for smaller creators. That's a great way to go viral to be seen. Like, you'll see someone with like, you know, 3,000 followers and then they'll have a reel that made like 2 million, had 2 million views. So that's still a great way to do it. But for bigger creators like us, it's hard. You never know anymore. Like, we'll create reels and the content will be the same. Or sometimes we'll post like the same content that we posted. Like Five months ago, they did exceptionally well. We'll bring it back again with like a, you know, similar caption or whatever. It won't be significantly different, but it'll do very different. Right, so there's no way to tell anymore? No, it's really hard to tell. But, you know, that's kind of what we specialize in, being able to tell if something's gonna do well within the first few seconds of posting. Right. I'm sure you can tell when you post something. You're like, oh, this is gonna do well right away. Like, that's how we are. So it makes it easier to edit, but. But now it's like more effort.

[A]

Right. What was the origin of the page you made? What's it called? And talk to everyone about it.

[B]

I'm the co founder of My Therapist says and My Therapist says is an online, I guess, digital media company at this point. We have 11 media properties. It started out as a really big Instagram account in like, the very beginning of Instagram, like 10 years ago. And I own that with my sisters and our best friend. And we kind of just started very organically. We thought we were really funny, so we just wanted to, you know, our group chat was really fun. So eventually we were like, why don't we just put this stuff anonymously on Instagram and see if it does well? Because there were like a couple meme accounts on Instagram at that time. And we were like, we're just as funny, if not funnier. And there wasn't a lot of, like, stuff kind of pertaining to young women and relatable to young women. So we just kind of wanted to put stuff out there that we ourselves wanted to see. So we just started putting stuff on and it went viral within like a month. Yeah.

[A]

That quick?

[B]

Yeah, no, we grew really quickly. Like, we grow like a million followers a year.

[A]

Holy crap. Yeah, that's really quick. No paid ads on that. Just all organic.

[B]

No. Yeah.

[A]

Now I feel like you have to run paid ads. You know what I mean?

[B]

I've never tried. Really. Like, we'll have brands who are like, you know, hey, can you create this content for us? Can we like, you know, obviously buy sponsorship on your page and then they will put like the paid ads behind this certain ad. Yeah, but it's like, you know, it's an ad.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So we've never done it on our own actual stuff.

[A]

Interesting. Yeah. I feel like especially on YouTube now. It's so hard to get views on YouTube if you're not running paid. It's Just like, you're gonna be stagnant.

[B]

Didn't they just introduce paid apps?

[A]

Yeah, they've gotten way more expensive, too. They already doubled in price since I started. Yeah, it's crazy.

[B]

I heard that was a way to go now on YouTube.

[A]

I mean, it's helped me gain a lot of subscribers and views.

[B]

That's what we've been doing. Me and my boyfriend recently launched a vlog channel and we were playing around with the advertisement on YouTube.

[A]

Yeah, I saw that channel.

[B]

Yeah, it's doing really well because of the advertisement.

[A]

Yeah. You guys are at 100k almost subscribers.

[B]

And it's very new. And that's because Scott was just playing around with the advertisement. I was like, what's happening, babe? He's like, YouTube advertising, let's go. Yeah.

[A]

And you guys just moved to Miami. Congrats.

[B]

Yes, thank you.

[A]

That's a big move.

[B]

Yeah. Well, no, we moved from Fort Lauderdale just now, and that's not a huge move, but we did move from Canada to Miami three years ago.

[A]

Okay. That's a big move.

[B]

That was a big move.

[A]

I didn't know Scott was from Canada. Shout out to Scott Clary. He was just on the pod yesterday. Where were you in Canada? Toronto.

[B]

Toronto.

[A]

Big Toronto. I haven't been up there yet.

[B]

Really? Yeah, I mean, like, that's. It's like a little New York. It's super fun, but, I mean, there's not enough there to do, I think, for people in the creative space. And it's just better for business to be in the U.S. yeah. And, you know, 99% of our business in the U.S. right.

[A]

And let's talk about monetizing the account with the following, because that's something people. Actually, a lot of people I know with followers don't make money, Right? Yeah.

[B]

Really?

[A]

Yeah, they. They don't. They're either broke or they struggle to make money. But you've been able to turn this into a real business.

[B]

Well, that's because Instagram is probably the only platform that doesn't actually pay you to post.

[A]

Right.

[B]

So not only are they killing our reach, they're also not paying us to post. So, yeah, I mean, obviously we monetize by creating viral marketing content for big brands. And we have obviously 11 media properties, so a lot of them are smaller, more niche. So there'll be different campaigns for different kind of brands. But for our main page, my therapist says we create like the biggest. I guess that's for biggest clients.

[A]

Got it. So a company will approach you wanting to promote a product or service.

[B]

So, you know, like, Netflix will be launching a new TV show or movie or, you know, Hulu or whatever. And then they'll be like, hey, we want to promote this. This is coming out. This is our budget. This is when it's coming out. Like, you know, create some content. Get like early access to view the movie or show whatever, or test out a product. It could be anything, right? And then we take some time to create the content. So it's unique because we are now acting as a creative agency. We're creating the content and the creative and everything. And we also provide the 8.2 million people to view the content. Right. So that's exciting. So we know what works for our audience. We know what content is going to do well. We know the best way to advertise something for a big brand. So that's been working very well for us. And we have. All our clients are returning customers. We've been working on it for a very long time with most of our.

[A]

That means you have a good product, the return.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, exactly. As well.

[A]

These movies, I noticed, are being more and more promoted by social media people. Cause when the new Bad Boys movie came out, Will Smith and the other guy, I forget his name, kept going on podcasts and big Instagram pages and stuff.

[B]

Well, because no one's watching TV anymore, right? Like, you're not watching commercials anymore. How are you gonna be shown, like an ad for something if you're not like, partaking in the old school media or like, you know, you know, reading newspapers or looking at magazines? That's how we used to see things, right? That's how things used to be advertised. But if I see, if I'm scrolling, whatever social media, and I'm like, oh, this person's wearing this. Where'd they get this from? Is it tagged? I immediately go buy it. Like, we're all so easily influenced and that's the only way to kind of access your consumer now through social media. So I feel like brands that are not actually using social media are very much behind and I think doing it wrong 100%.

[A]

Yeah. I've never bought off a billboard, but I bought off TikTok shop.

[B]

Exactly.

[A]

Which is crazy. They're so good at advertising there.

[B]

If like a superstar, a lister, is advertising something, I'm not going to be like, oh, let me buy because she's wearing it. I'll be like, no, she can probably afford something better, like. Or if she, like, you know, like, it doesn't seem as relatable, but if it's someone like me, who just has some followers, and I'm like, oh, she's like, you know, my size. Or like my aesthetic, like, whatever. Or like, I'm more likely to buy. Right. I want to engage with that person because I'm like, you are a lot like me, so if you like it, I might like it too.

[A]

Agreed.

[B]

Or if previous recommendations worked out, then I will just trust all of your recommendations.

[A]

Yeah, it's more relatable.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

How much fashion stuff do you get sent?

[B]

Honestly, not a lot.

[A]

Really?

[B]

Yeah, mostly like makeup, skincare, stuff like that.

[A]

I thought you'd be getting.

[B]

No, that's because we don't put ourselves on our page as much. So I have my personal brand. Like, I have my personal page, and for that I'm doing a lot more of that. But for like our actual media company, we don't really put ourselves on there. It's very like. It's more corporate, kind of.

[A]

Was that by choice?

[B]

Yeah, it was very intentional.

[A]

You wanted to separate the personal brand.

[B]

Yes, so. So it's very intentional. Because having a personal brand, being relatable, being a personality, it does really, really well. Right. So obviously we know like all these big influencers by name. Like, you know, Logan Paul. You might not know all the businesses he owns, but you know him and whatever he touches, like, does well. Right. Or like big people like that. But we kind of wanted to be more of like a company, more of a space for everyone. And we didn't want people to necessarily only be relating to us on a personal level. We wanted people to relate to our content and our message. So we kind of just. And it's been easier for us to kind of do those big sponsorships and big advertisements because we're not necessarily, like, talking about stuff. We're not promoting it ourselves. Right. Whether we use it or not, it's more about just like the experience.

[A]

That's a good point. Yeah. Your personal brand's not on the line, so it's like you get canceled, whatever.

[B]

Like, your opinions don't really reflect on the main company. Right. That's why we don't really, like. We don't go on stories a lot or talk. We don't really do that. That's why we have our separate kind of pages for that kind of stuff. But we've just found that it's worked best for us for the kind of content we post.

[A]

Yeah, that makes sense. Cause what you post is basically a lot of mental help. Self help. Right?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So they just want it to be like, more anonymous.

[B]

Right. Exactly. And also it can be, I guess, triggering for a lot of people that want to see that kind of content to just like, keep seeing, like, certain faces or certain people, you know, And I'm like, you know, we want make it a very, like, inclusive place, and we want to make it a very positive place. So, like, you don't want to go on our story and do a rant because, like, you know, like, this many people are going to see it. It's just like, it's much easier and more comfortable doing it on our own personal pages because that's. We know people are there for us. We know that's what people want to see. On our work pages. That's not what people want to see necessarily. We don't know that. Even if they do, like, you know, it's kind of like a risk to do that.

[A]

Absolutely. What type of content is your most viral? Is it photos, video, certain length or anything?

[B]

Actually, lately, like, it used to be reels a while ago. Now lately we find that static images do really, really well.

[A]

Really?

[B]

Yeah. Like text, like short texts do really well. Yeah, stories have been doing really well. It's like, you know, like, stories come and go, like, the reach changes. But recently it's been really good. And I mean, we're pretty consistent. So our benchmarks are usually like, you know, we always give people our lowest benchmarks. Like, the content can get, like, you know, 20 million views. We're not gonna promise that. That's. That, you know, that's a special case. And even though it happens all the time with our content because it's so, like, heavily shared and relatable, we really just, like, think in terms of, like, the lowest benchmark. What's the lowest? We do.

[A]

Wow. You've hit 20 million.

[B]

Oh, way more than that.

[A]

Dang. I think my most is 20 something million. Yeah. I haven't hit 20 that often, though.

[B]

Oh, yeah, no, no. Some of our, like, post do, like, way more than that.

[A]

What?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Have you hit 50 million?

[B]

I think so. If I have my phone, I would show you.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

What was the video for? Like, the high viewing ones?

[B]

Honestly, I don't remember.

[A]

Every month post like three times a day, right?

[B]

We post like six times a day.

[A]

Six times a day. I got to step it up.

[B]

I mean, so, yeah, the more we post, the better it does. So that's another key to it.

[A]

Well, you got four, you guys. So that's.

[B]

Yeah, each.

[A]

Each one of you post one a day. You're good.

[B]

No, no, we don't do that. So we have each person responsible for different parts of the business. Ye. So we have someone responsible for posting and she's incredible. And that's our partner, Nicole. And you know, she's very like, has her finger on the pulse of what's trending, what's good, what's gonna do well. And it's. It's rare that we, the rest of us, only if someone else can't do it, then we'll do it. But. But it is four of us.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So it makes it easier. Like if I'm on vacation, I know that they've got it covered and vice versa.

[A]

That's a great feeling.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

There's a lot of people who take a vacation. It's hard and they're worrying about the business.

[B]

Exactly.

[A]

But, you know, nothing will change.

[B]

No, no, I know that someone will run it.

[A]

Right.

[B]

So that's why I love working with my sisters.

[A]

That's cool. Oh, all four of your sisters?

[B]

Well, three of us are. The fourth is our best friend.

[A]

I love it. What's your role in the company?

[B]

So I do mostly operations and finance and just like, you know, business development.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

All the boring stuff.

[B]

Yeah, exactly. All the adulting stuff.

[A]

Yeah. Are you the oldest?

[B]

Yes, I am.

[A]

That makes sense. You got to be the responsible.

[B]

Well, I also have the most business, real life business experience because, you know, we were also young when this started.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So it kind of just grew into a business accidentally. And it got so serious, so big. And like, eventually, like, people started wanting to pay us and this and that. And my sisters were younger and they were just like, whoa, what? Like, you know, you're fresh out of college and brands are throwing money at you and you're like, don't know what to do with it. You don't know how to sign a contract. There's all these things that had to go into it.

[A]

What do you major in college?

[B]

Psychology.

[A]

Oh, okay. That's actually really good for business.

[B]

But I've always been very heavily into, like, media and Internet culture. Like, I guess I grew up in the age of, like, when Internet first came around and like, you know, I had like the first email address. Like, my Gmail is my first name.

[A]

What?

[B]

Yeah, I was like a beta tester on Gmail.

[A]

Gmail dot com.

[B]

Yeah. Like my first real name.

[A]

Do you still have that one?

[B]

Yeah, I do. That's what I use every day for like 100k probably. But because I was literally, I got Gmail before anyone else had access to it. I was a beta tester.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

I Was really nerdy.

[A]

If I could have Sean at Gmail, that'd be the biggest flex.

[B]

Right.

[A]

Possibly thing.

[B]

Exactly.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

So I've been, like, super into it. I've had a blog since I was, like. I don't know, in, like, 10th grade, which was, like, back then, like, no one had blogs. Yeah.

[A]

Damn. So you've always been kind of an in.

[B]

Yeah, I've always been into it.

[A]

You're on MySpace.

[B]

Yeah, yeah. I had, like, you know, I had a bit of following on things. Like, I had a following back then.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So I always say, I wish I kept the blog. I would have been, like, I would have been one of the first fashion bloggers or female bloggers or whatever.

[A]

Yeah, Fashion blogging took off.

[B]

Yeah. Yeah. And then I stopped when it did. Exactly.

[A]

Travel blogging is an amazing lifestyle because they pay for your hotel and flights and food. You just show up.

[B]

But it's actually so much harder than it looks. I mean, still amazing. It's still the best job in the world. But every time, like, we travel for work, and every time we're invited to stay somewhere and do something, you still have to, like, you can't just relax. You have to film everything you do. You have to edit, you have to post. There's deliverables. It's still a real job. You're not just getting paid to vacation. But I think the biggest perk of that is, versus, like, actually paying to go on vacation.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Is that you can have a different experience. Influencers will get, like, you know, surprises in the rooms, flowers, balloons, like, all these things that look super cool, and you want to show off to your friends and you're like, oh, my God. Like, it feels like your birthday every day because everyone's treating you special and trying to give you the best experience possible. So that's, I think, the best difference. It's not just getting paid to travel. It's, like, the perks.

[A]

You know what? I feel that, though, because I used to go to restaurants and I used to get the meals Calm.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But it was so much. This sounds kind of entitled, but, like, I would have to take photos every meal, and it got annoying.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So I stopped, like, even telling the restaurant I'm coming because I'd rather just pay because I was spending, like, 30 minutes to an hour posting the photo.

[B]

So I actually make the. I film everything I do regardless. Even if I don't get paid. I just, like, do it for my own lifestyle, like, blog. So like, now I vlog, so I film it regardless. But we do get invited by restaurants like weekly in Miami to, you know, test things out. And I also. It's funny you don't know this. I'm actually a trained chef.

[A]

Oh, really?

[B]

So I'm very passionate about going to restaurants and trying things out.

[A]

Critique.

[B]

Yeah. Food critic probably would be my dream job.

[A]

Female Gordon Ramsay.

[B]

Exactly.

[A]

Damn. Restaurants are a tough business.

[B]

Yeah. I would never actually want to own one or work on one.

[A]

I'm very picky with where I eat.

[B]

Super picky. So that's why I actually like try to go on my own and like give as much of an honest review as possible.

[A]

Yeah, Keith Lee does that.

[B]

You know him?

[A]

Yeah, he changed the game for the food restaurant.

[B]

I heard that. I just recently discovered him because I just recently discovered TikTok.

[A]

Oh, okay, that makes sense. Yeah, he's like impossible to miss if you're on TikTok.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, everyone's talking about him. He just recently went to Toronto and went like a. But made a bunch of like small businesses just like do so well, bro.

[A]

If he shows up and it's a good review there.

[B]

Isn't that power amazing.

[A]

They're full the next week. Yeah, that's an amazing feeling. Being and similar with your page. I'm sure you've changed the business owners.

[B]

Oh, yeah. I mean it's. It's a beautiful power and a huge responsibility to be able to make a place or product go viral. Right. That's why we don't even like post a lot of pr. We don't post things that people send us for free. We're very, very, like selective with what we post.

[A]

That's cool. Yeah. I used to. I used to post like negative reviews, but now I've realized that I just. If I don't like it, I won't.

[B]

Yeah, exactly. If I don't like it, I'm just not going to.

[A]

It's too damaging now. Like it'll actually lose some thousands of.

[B]

Dol hard cuz if someone's living and you're just like had a bad off experience. Whether it's like, you know, bad or not, like maybe I'll leave like anonymous Yelp review.

[A]

You're that person. Yeah, Yelp reviews. I read those when I eat.

[B]

I read those all the time.

[A]

Yeah, Yelp is very honest.

[B]

When you travel, don't you go buy reviews?

[A]

Yeah, I used to read Google, but I feel like a lot of those are fake.

[B]

Oh, I guess people can buy them.

[A]

I don't know. But Yelp and Reddit.

[B]

Yeah, especially.

[A]

Oh my God.

[B]

Savage.

[A]

Yeah. When I'm in a new city, first thing I do when I get there, top 10 restaurants on Reddit.

[B]

That's what we do. First thing we do is, like, even, like, bars to go out. Like, best place. Like, every time. We used to travel before, like, you know, now Instagram has all these. Or like, TikTok, I guess all these travel influencers have all these, like, lists, top 10 must places to go in Rome. And it's like a fun, like, list for you to hit. But before that, it used to be us just going on Yelp, finding those top 10 places and being like, oh, wow, this is actually amazing.

[A]

Well, those top 10 lists, a lot of those guys pay to be there.

[B]

Oh, I didn't know.

[A]

Yeah, so if you Google.

[B]

Oh, like on influencers list or.

[A]

Yeah, just on, like, Google, if you search, like, top 10 restaurants, like, a lot of those lists are paid for.

[B]

No, no, I meant, like, the actual Yelp reviews. Like, the top, like, highest rated places in the city.

[A]

Okay. Yeah, yeah, that'd be harder to fit.

[B]

No, no, those. I know. Yes. Because I've been to some of those. Like, it'll be like a magazine or, like, you know, a blog, and it'll be like, top 10 best places in Miami. And I'm like, these are not great places. I would go.

[A]

Since you're such a foodie, what's the best city in America for eating out?

[B]

Honestly, my favorite is Chicago.

[A]

Really?

[B]

I love the food in Chicago. It's been incredible.

[A]

Like, I haven't heard that answer.

[B]

The culinary scene is incredible.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

And I love LA and New York.

[A]

Yeah, I've heard LA, NY for different reasons.

[B]

And that's kind of what I miss here so much. Like, we don't have much like. Like a Chinatown or Koreatown. Like, there's not as much, like, ethnic food in Miami. Like, like, Asian ethnic food or like, other ethnicities. It's very, like, Latin American themed. So Miami's now getting a lot of good food. So all those, like, big restaurants from Miami and la. I'm from. Sorry, LA and New Louisiana. New York. I was gonna say Toronto, because Toronto is the best food are coming here now. So it's getting more exciting now.

[A]

I need me a Chinatown.

[B]

Oh, yeah. I miss that so much.

[A]

Little Italy.

[B]

So they have a lot of good Italian food here. But I am missing the Asian food because Toronto has the best Koreatown and Chinatown.

[A]

Really? Okay, I might want to go there.

[B]

Oh, actually, I don't know why I didn't mention Toronto. Toronto's the best.

[A]

Well, I Said Americ. America, to be fair.

[B]

But yeah. But Toronto food is incredible. Like, it's known for its food.

[A]

Nice. What about internationally?

[B]

Honestly, Vienna.

[A]

Vienna, yeah.

[B]

Surprising. Yeah.

[A]

Never heard that answer too.

[B]

I go to Vienna, like every summer because my family lives there and it is so underrated.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

It has like, I've never had a bad meal in Vienna.

[A]

Holy crap.

[B]

Yeah, like, honestly, Viennese, like, traditional cuisine. Austrian cuisine is not great. So if you go to non traditional restaurants, like, not the little beer pubs or whatever, like, the food is incredible. The best sushi. I've had the best, like, you know, Asian, Italian, like everything. They just have the best of everything. Because Vienna is so small and there's like, not a lot of, like, I guess a shitty restaurant can do. Well, it doesn't last long. So everything that they do have is like, excellent.

[A]

Wow. Noted. I will go there one day. It hasn't been on my list, to.

[B]

Be honest, but it's a must.

[A]

I'm a huge foodie. The main reason I travel is probably for food.

[B]

Food same. To be honest, before we go anywhere, I send Scott like a million rolls of all the foods to eat and he's like, what are you talking about? We're not going to be able to walk out of this place.

[A]

I'm a little nervous for Egypt. I heard the food's not that good there.

[B]

Oh, I haven't been yet.

[A]

Yeah. So I'm a little nervous. But food is super.

[B]

I guess people don't go there for food.

[A]

No.

[B]

Though I do love Middle Eastern food. That's something I really miss here too. But I haven't had a lot of Egyptian food.

[A]

Yeah. I can't even think of what that would look like.

[B]

I guess like a different variation of this. Like shawarma rice.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

It's all kind of similar, but, like, different. A little different.

[A]

If you had to eat the same cuisine the rest of your life every day. What are you picking?

[B]

So either Mexican or Korean.

[A]

Okay. I'm going Japanese. Because you got sushi.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Which would be hard to give up. And then you got the Japanese and.

[B]

They have the actual steakhouses. Oh, you're smart. And then you have all the curries and stuff. Like they have everything.

[A]

They do.

[B]

I love Thai food too.

[A]

Thai food's good, but I feel like I'd get. But it's kind of heavy, you know? Yeah, Japanese.

[B]

Japanese is good.

[A]

It's a good move. But Mexican's a safe play, too.

[B]

Mexican is good.

[A]

I got a lot of different ways.

[B]

You have to have it at least Once a week. So.

[A]

Wow. Is it good out here? Because it sucks in Vegas.

[B]

Really? I assumed Vegas would be good.

[A]

I know, right?

[B]

Because LA and Arizona are amazing.

[A]

I know, it's weird.

[B]

And it's really good here. There's some really, really good spots. I've started, like, a series on tick tock of trying the best tacos in Miami.

[A]

Oh, I love that. What other things are you doing outside of. My therapist says.

[B]

So, yes, I'm heavily focused on my personal brand now and, you know, the vlog channel and just kind of like sharing more of myself because I'm sure you can relate. It's kind of intimidating to go behind, like, your, you know, behind the scenes. Like, first. Putting yourself online in the first place is hard and scary. Like, start putting your first post out there.

[A]

You're like, oh, my God, I was freaking out.

[B]

My friends are gonna make fun of me. Everyone's gonna make fun of me. People gonna think I'm crazy. Like, you know, you feel. Which is why we started anonymously at first. So after that, now we have this whole audience and now it's still scary to put ourselves personally out there. So not because we feel like the reception won't be good, just because it's just intimidating. So it's much easier for me and much more say it's kind of my safe space, my personal page where I have all my friends following me. And then, like, you know, you have like 100,000 other people that are my friends following me. It's like, it's much easier to kind of cultivate that and grow that into something. I'm just trying to figure out where I want to take my own career next.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah. Personal brand is so important. I know a lot of people are scared of starting it, of being judged or how many likes you get, but it's the best move I've ever made.

[B]

I think it is. Because I don't Google people. I just look them up on Instagram.

[A]

Yeah, Instagram's your resume now.

[B]

Yeah, Like, I don't even look at businesses on Google. I literally, if a page. If a business doesn't have Instagram, I'm not interested.

[A]

Yeah, no. Social media has changed the game. My girl watches, like, videos on TikTok on how to cook.

[B]

Right.

[A]

And she just follows a recipe there. She doesn't even look up recipes.

[B]

That's what I'm saying. I don't do that either. Like, I'll see something on TikTok. I mean, obviously TikTok, viral recipes, like, those are the most highest performing videos on YouTube, I think, yeah, all those things. And it's amazing to me because at this point, I feel like there's no excuse for someone to not be able how to cook or not have a few things they can make. Like, people used to be like, oh, I don't cook. I don't know how to. And I'm like, really? There's TikTok. Like, you spend so many hours on TikTok, you can learn. Or there's YouTube. There's like, step by step, guys. Like, it's so easy that even if you're not into it, it makes you into it because it looks so good.

[A]

I used to suck at cooking. I mean, I still do. But TikTok makes it easy because it's so visual. And step by step instructions.

[B]

Exactly. It makes you want to, like, be. Everyone is now a foodie because of TikTok.

[A]

I think. No, I love it TikTok. It got a lot of hate at first, but it's grown on people, I think.

[B]

I hate TikTok.

[A]

You hated it?

[B]

I still do.

[A]

It was. Oh, you still do.

[B]

Yeah. Not because. Mainly because of. It kind of gives me anxiety. The way the whole app is set up. I just feel like everything just always yelling at you. It's jumping up. Like, the user experience for me, from my personality. I don't like. I like how organized and clean like YouTube or Instagram are. Like, there's a button for everything. Like, if you don't want to hear something, you can, like, turn it off. Like, you don't have to just, like, scroll. It's not just one button thing. It's kind of the same issue I had when we switched from Blackberries to iPhones and there was only one button. And I was like, what am I supposed to do with this one button? I need more buttons.

[A]

Sounds like you have anxiety.

[B]

Oh, I do.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

That's why my therapist says, yeah, that makes sense.

[A]

I had terrible anxiety growing up.

[B]

Really?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I never had any growing up.

[A]

Really.

[B]

I really just have it now in specific, like, instances of, like, things that trigger me, and that's like, disorganization or, like, things yelling at me, jumping up at me. Like, I want things to be quiet. Like, loud sounds annoy me.

[A]

You must have the neatest bedroom of all time.

[B]

Oh, yeah. You would think that. I don't.

[A]

Oh, really?

[B]

Scott will be the first to tell you he wishes.

[A]

I thought you were super organized.

[B]

No, I'm not. But I. So I am. But I'm not the one doing it. Like, I don't Want. I'm not the person who, like, sits there and, like, advertises things for fun. Like, I'll do it once and I'll just set it there and I'll maintain it. Or I'll have someone else come and do it. Like, I love hiring an organizer. I love watching those organizing videos, but I don't have the skills to do it myself.

[A]

I don't even know that was a job organizer.

[B]

Oh, my God. Those videos do so what?

[A]

Well, you could just hire people to come over.

[B]

Yeah, they just. It's like a real job now. It's a whole career.

[A]

No way.

[B]

People restart. Like, restocking videos. That's what they're called. Literally. It's like, restock my guest bathroom with me. And it's just like, the craziest shit. So personal organizers do really well because now because of social media, everyone can see inside everyone's house. Right before you used to come over. No one's gonna go through your cupboards or your fridge. No one's gonna, like, it's rude. People are not gonna do that. Now that's a selling point. You show people, oh, look at my fridge. Look how organized. There's organizers in it. Or like, oh, look at my closet. It's like color coded. If now if your house. If every inch of your house is not organized, you're, like, not cool.

[A]

Wow. I'm gonna look into that. I know. Being organized actually lessens your anxiety because of the mental stress on your eyes or whatever.

[B]

I think maybe because social media and, like, so many other things in our daily lives now make people so anxious. And there's, like, so many things to stress about. That having a very organized, clean space I think does really well. The reason why that is such a trend and I think is because people need it.

[A]

Yeah. I am probably the messiest person you've ever met. Oh, my God.

[B]

I'm pretty messy.

[A]

We should have a mess off because I'll send you pictures of my bedroom.

[B]

It's nuts. You can ask Scott. He'll send you some.

[A]

I will have to compare because I think I got you beat because he's super neat.

[B]

Is your girlfriend messy?

[A]

No, she hates it.

[B]

Yeah, Scott is messy. Like, he's so neat.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

And he, like, the only thing about me I think that really bothers.

[A]

Usually the guy's the messy one. Yeah, you would think that's crazy. Well, it's been fun. Where can people find you? Find your personal brand and your business.

[B]

So we are at. My therapist says that's our main thing. And I'm at Gina's hash.

[A]

Awesome. We'll link below. Thanks for coming on, Gina.

[B]

Thank you.

[A]

Yep. Thanks for watching, guys. Check out the links below. See you tomorrow.