Lessons from 54 Wins: Denny Hamlin’s Career Secrets | Denny Hamlin DSH #1974

Summary

Digital Social Hour: Episode #1974 – Lessons from 54 Wins: Denny Hamlin’s Career Secrets

Release Date: March 28, 2025

In this engaging episode of Digital Social Hour, host Sean Kelly sits down with NASCAR superstar Denny Hamlin to delve into the intricacies of Hamlin’s illustrious racing career, the physical and mental challenges he faces, his transition into team ownership, and his perspectives on the evolving landscape of NASCAR. The conversation is rich with insights, personal anecdotes, and candid reflections, offering listeners a comprehensive look into the life of one of NASCAR’s most accomplished drivers.

---

Season Insights and Current Performance

Hamlin begins by discussing his current racing season, emphasizing the lengthy and grueling nature of NASCAR's schedule.

"We're racing for nine months." [00:34]

He highlights the extended season from February to November, noting the physical and mental demands it places on drivers. Despite being early in the season, Hamlin remains optimistic, typically finding his stride during the summer months.

"It's early in the season. We got 38 weeks. This is week five. So we got quite a bit of time left." [00:34]

Contemplating Retirement and Physical Strain

A significant portion of the conversation centers on Hamlin’s thoughts about retirement. Despite his passion for racing, he acknowledges the inevitable decline that comes with age and the physical toll of the sport.

"When I decide to retire, it's when I know that I am going. I have to travel somewhere, and I know I can't win." [01:21]

Hamlin openly discusses his concerns about aging, particularly the challenges related to reaction time and vision, which are crucial in racing. He mentions maintaining excellent vision since childhood but is aware that physical decline will eventually impact his performance.

"I think one of the things that forces NASCAR drivers out is vision at times, but my vision is still 2010." [02:18]

Physical Injuries and Health Management

The demanding nature of NASCAR racing has led Hamlin to endure numerous injuries over his 20-year career. He candidly shares his struggles with back issues, shoulder surgeries, and the long-term impacts of racing-related injuries.

"I've got back issues from being in a race car. I've actually broken my spine in a wreck." [03:04]

He details the degenerative disc issues that cause chronic back pain, a common ailment among drivers. Additionally, Hamlin recounts multiple shoulder surgeries, including a particularly severe rotator cuff injury that required a year-long recovery.

"When you talk about retirement, like, how long can my body go? I’m really, really beaten up in a lot of places." [07:43]

Off-Track Interests and Recreational Activities

Beyond racing, Hamlin is passionate about basketball, though his numerous injuries, including torn ACLs, keep him from playing professionally. He humorously compares his recreational play to being an "average mid-40-year-old," underscoring the physical limitations imposed by his racing career.

"I have a league that’s run out of my house. I have an indoor basketball court down in my basement." [08:31]

Despite his injuries, Hamlin continues to engage in recreational basketball, finding joy and camaraderie in the sport.

Transition to Team Ownership

A pivotal moment in the episode is Hamlin’s transition from driver to team owner with the establishment of 2311 Racing alongside Michael, a former basketball player turned NASCAR driver. This move was partly influenced by the COVID-19 pandemic, which disrupted many racing teams and opened opportunities for ownership.

"I saw an opportunity to pick up the pieces after COVID-19 wiped out one of the teams." [21:02]

Hamlin expresses a strong preference for driving over ownership, emphasizing his lifelong dream and commitment to achieving more personal accolades on the track.

"Right now, it’s driver for me just because, ever since I was a kid, I never dreamt to be a team owner. I dreamt to be a driver." [22:02]

Rivalries and Fan Engagement

Hamlin touches on the intense rivalries that develop in NASCAR, explaining how continuous competition can blur personal relationships. Despite the competitive tensions on the track, drivers often interact amicably off-track, especially within the shared spaces of the motorhome lot.

"We race against each other 38 weekends a year, but when you get back, our kids are hanging out." [24:03]

He candidly discusses his reputation as a "villain" within the sport, a persona he has embraced without adversely affecting his career. Rather than shying away from controversy, Hamlin leverages it to maintain visibility and engagement with fans.

"I've taken on that heel, the villain role within NASCAR over the last few years." [25:25]

Career Highlights and Memorable Wins

Reflecting on his career, Hamlin recounts his most cherished victories, particularly his first Daytona 500 win in 2016. This race stands out as the closest finish in NASCAR history, exemplifying his skill and resilience.

"2016 Daytona 500. That's my very first Daytona 500 win, and it was in the closest finish in NASCAR history." [34:57]

He describes the strategic maneuvers and split-second decisions that led to his victory, highlighting the mental and physical agility required to secure such a win.

"How I won it was just amazing. I fell back to fourth or fifth on the final lap and then found a way to weave through the cars." [35:12]

Sponsorship Challenges and Financial Aspects

A critical discussion point is the financial burden of racing, including the high costs associated with team operations and sponsorship acquisition. Hamlin explains the complexities of securing sponsorships, particularly when NASCAR’s branding and partnerships limit team-specific sponsorship opportunities.

"A NASCAR car is $18 million a year. That's per car. That's insane." [26:35]

He emphasizes the proactive efforts required to attract and retain sponsors, noting the challenges posed by exclusive deals between NASCAR and major sponsors like Goodyear.

"We have to come up with a dramatic amount of sponsorship just to break even every year." [31:10]

Future of NASCAR and Electric Vehicles

Looking ahead, Hamlin shares his skepticism about the transition to electric vehicles in NASCAR. He believes that the traditional sound and visceral experience of racing would be lost, potentially alienating long-time fans.

"NASCAR fans are the ones that have been around for a very long time and even the new ones... they like to hear sound." [32:12]

He acknowledges the technical challenges of adapting high-performance electric cars to NASCAR's racing format, questioning the feasibility of maintaining the sport’s essence amidst such changes.

Engagement with Fans and Personal Branding

Hamlin actively engages with his fanbase through various platforms, including his podcast, "Action is Detrimental." He discusses the importance of authentic interaction with fans and the balance between maintaining a competitive edge and fostering a positive public image.

"I started my podcast just a few years ago, 'Action is Detrimental,' and ever since then, the core fan base has followed us." [28:40]

He reflects on the delicate balance athletes must maintain between personal expression and professional branding, especially in a sport heavily reliant on sponsorships and public perception.

Closing Thoughts and Future Aspirations

As the episode concludes, Hamlin reiterates his dedication to driving while acknowledging his responsibilities as a team owner. He expresses a desire to continue winning races and ultimately securing a championship title, both as a driver and, potentially, as an owner.

"My perfect scenario every weekend is I win and my team cars finished 2, 3, 4." [22:02]

He looks forward to further expanding NASCAR's reach globally, aiming to enhance the sport’s appeal and sustainability for future generations.

---

Notable Quotes

• "We're racing for nine months." [00:34]
• "When I decide to retire, it's when I know that I am going. I have to travel somewhere, and I know I can't win." [01:21]
• "I've got back issues from being in a race car. I've actually broken my spine in a wreck." [03:04]
• "Right now, it’s driver for me just because, ever since I was a kid, I never dreamt to be a team owner. I dreamt to be a driver." [22:02]
• "I've taken on that heel, the villain role within NASCAR over the last few years." [25:25]
• "2016 Daytona 500. That's my very first Daytona 500 win, and it was in the closest finish in NASCAR history." [34:57]
• "We have to come up with a dramatic amount of sponsorship just to break even every year." [31:10]
• "NASCAR fans are the ones that have been around for a very long time and even the new ones... they like to hear sound." [32:12]
• "My perfect scenario every weekend is I win and my team cars finished 2, 3, 4." [22:02]

---

Conclusion

This episode of Digital Social Hour offers an in-depth exploration of Denny Hamlin’s career, personal challenges, and evolving role within NASCAR. Through candid discussions and reflective insights, listeners gain a nuanced understanding of the dedication, resilience, and strategic thinking required to excel in the high-stakes world of professional racing. Whether you’re a racing enthusiast or simply curious about the life of a top athlete, this episode provides valuable lessons and inspiring stories from one of NASCAR’s most respected figures.

---

For more insights and detailed discussions, tune in to Denny Hamlin’s podcast, "Action is Detrimental," available on all major podcast platforms every Monday afternoon.

Transcript

[A]

Pretty early when you're looking to make a change. And, you know, Tyler Redick, who went to the championship race last year for us, we signed him two years before his deal was even up. And so he ended up. The team he was with got pissed off, kicked him out early. So we actually got him a year early, but we had to pay them for that.

[B]

Interesting. All right, guys, Denny Hemlin out here in Vegas. Got a race tomorrow. Thanks for stopping in, man.

[A]

Yeah, appreciate you having me. Yeah.

[B]

How are things in your world so far this year?

[A]

It's going good. You know, we're just a couple races in, but, you know, it's early in the season. We got 38 weeks. We're. This is week five. So we. We got quite a bit of time left. And usually I don't hit my stride, typically till the summer months of the season.

[B]

Wow, that's a long season. That might be the longest of any pro sport, right?

[A]

Yeah, it is, actually. Yeah. So we go from, essentially, Valentine's Day, actually before that, now February 1st to the 1st week of November. So essentially we get most of November off, December off in January, and then we're back at it.

[B]

That's crazy.

[A]

When I say off, like, that's a very loose term because we still have tons of obligations, photo shoots and media shoots and sponsorship shoots that we got to do in the off season. So, yeah, three months off. That's it. We're racing for nine months.

[B]

That's nuts. That's a lot of traveling. Do you ever get burnt out?

[A]

Absolutely. I mean, this is my 20th year, 20th year doing this. But I still love it because I can still win. And like I've said many times, like, when I decide to retire, it's when I know that I am going. I have to travel somewhere, and I know I can't win. If I know I can't win, I'm out.

[B]

Have you ever thought about retirement?

[A]

Oh, yeah. I think about it all the time. I'm more paranoid about when is that light switch gonna go off? Where I don't have the skill set that it takes to compete against the young guys anymore. Right. Like, I still feel at my age, and results would show that I am still on top of my game, but I know that one day, Father Time's undefeated and I'm not gonna be able to do it. Is good. And I'm just. I worry about waking up and that being the day.

[B]

Yeah. Yeah. Cause a big thing in your sport is reaction time, right? Correct. And as you age, your brain slows down.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

Have you noticed that you've lost a.

[A]

Little step from reaction standpoint? I don't think so. I think I'm pretty sharp still on that. I think one of the things that forces NASCAR drivers out is vision at times, but my vision is still 2010.

[B]

Oh, wow.

[A]

Same as it's been ever since I was a kid.

[B]

I wish I had that.

[A]

It's really, really good. I still have that. But, I mean, I'm sure I'm slower than I was 10 years ago. Yeah. But it's not enough. That's hindering me on the racetrack.

[B]

I never even thought about that vision being a factor for people aging out. That is interesting. Yep. Yeah. Because I'm, like, 2200. I'm, like, legally blind.

[A]

Oh, wow. Wow.

[B]

I'm thinking about Lasik, man. 2010.

[A]

Have you ever changed? Have you done it or.

[B]

No. Lasik scares me, dude.

[A]

Have you looked a lot of people? Yeah, I know a lot of friends that. I'm like, you know, why don't you just get it? You know? And they're just like. I just. The fact that they're gonna laser and take off a. The skin of my eye, I just. It scares me.

[B]

I'm gonna wait till some AI comes out or something.

[A]

I just figured by now, though, that certainly the doctors have all got this thing down to a science where, like, the success rate's gotta be.

[B]

Success rate is high, but then you hear stories of later on how they lose their eyesight again, like, 10, 20 years after, and then what are you gonna do, you know, like, irreparable. Like, your vision keeps getting worse and worse, but then you can't keep lasering it off, so.

[A]

Oh, yeah. Okay.

[B]

So it's not a permanent fix.

[A]

Yeah. So I.

[B]

Because my mom got Lasik when she was my age, and she's losing her vision again.

[A]

See, that's. You know, me, I'm more looking up, like, back issues. I have tremendous amount of back issues being in a race car. Like, I'm. I've been in. I've actually broke my spine 13 in a. In a wreck. So I. I do more research on, like, what can fix my back and, you know, the things I need to do for that. So it's interesting to hear that. Like, I think it's very simple. Oh, you just get lasiks and it's fixed. And you're like, no. When you do real research, it's, like, all kinds of things that, like, you. You don't know. And I've had many doctors tell me when it comes to like my back, they're like, yeah, we think we can fix it, but you're still racing. So do you want to take the 2% chance that, like your career is done, you know, wait until you're at least retired and then come in here and, and get some work done?

[B]

Yeah. Back pain is one of the most difficult pains to fix, I heard.

[A]

Yeah, it's just, it's been nagging for me. My disc are degenerative so, you know, a lot of the fluid out of the disc dissipated, so it's just kind of bone on bone. And if you think about how we drive in a race car, like, you know, we.

[B]

Hey, guys.

[C]

Shout out to today's sponsor, Kinsta. Running an online business is already a challenge. Your website hosting shouldn't make it harder. And I've been there dealing with slow load times, confusing dashboards and unreliable support. That's why I switched over to Kinsta and it's been a game changer for my brand since moving to Kinsta. My site loads faster, runs smoother, and I don't have to stress about downtime. Their intuitive dashboard makes managing everything simple. And their 247 expert support means I always have real people whenever to help.

[A]

When I need it.

[C]

Kinsta is built for performance with blazing fast speeds, enterprise level security and 37 global data centers to ensure your site reaches audiences quickly. They also handle free migrations, so switching is effortless. And if you ever get a traffic spike, Kinsta automatically scales to keep your site online when it matters most. I'm not the only one who trust Kinsta. TripAdvisor, NASA. Indeed. And over 120,000 businesses rely on Kinsta for their WordPress hosting. So if you want hosting that works, just make the switch to Kinsta today. Get your first month free. They'll even handle the migration for you. Just visit kinsta.comDSH to get started. That's K-I-N-S-T A.comDSH we are.

[A]

Imagine sitting in a seat. You pull the straps down so it essentially compresses your spine anyway. And then we're running in on race cars that have very little suspension at all. So, you know the fastest way to make our cars go around the racetrack is to put them the lowest to the ground. Well, if it's low to the ground, the suspension has to be really, really rigid and so it just constantly beats on your spine and it has for 20 years and it's taken its toll.

[B]

So a lot of drivers probably struggle with back pain.

[A]

They do, yeah. Most. Most of the injuries you find with drivers are back pain and shoulder pain. Yeah. I social media at least three or four drivers getting like, shoulder surgery every single year.

[B]

Holy crap. Have you had to get shoulder surgery?

[A]

I have. I've had two on the left side, one on the right side.

[B]

Yeah. Surgery like a last resort for you. Are you trying to treat it naturally? For the most part.

[A]

For the most part, yeah. But, you know, I ran two seasons ago with my rotator cuff just kind of torn off the bone. I didn't realize it was that bad. We thought it was just going to be kind of a little cleanup. Microscopic thing. And he went in, when he went in there in December, he said, you know, you'll probably be a two week recovery and you're good. And it turned out to be a year. He opened me up and he was like, what did you do since our last scan? Like, he's like destroyed it. So. Yeah, that's. That's the biggest thing. It's like, too. I think about when you talk about retirement, like, how long can my body go? Like, I'm really, really beaten up in a lot of places. So that's going to be a factor.

[B]

Yeah. Because you see these pro athletes, they retire and then some of them can barely walk. 10, 20 years after.

[A]

You'll see, when I leave here and I stand up, it takes me like 20, 30 steps to like, really get my gait back.

[B]

Holy crap. Is that bad already? You haven't even retired yet.

[A]

No, no, no.

[B]

We got to get you some stem cells or something. I know, dude. Yeah. Ronnie Coleman, like, he can't even walk. It's sad, man.

[A]

Yeah. You see so many of these NBA players, right? And they. You can see, like their bodies hunch forward, right. They kind of walk. It looks like one leg is like stiffer than the other. That's how I feel when I walk. Is that on my right side? My. I can't bend as good as I can on my left. But it's because, you know, the disc. I have issues on that side.

[B]

Yeah, basketball's tough on the knees.

[A]

No doubt. I've actually torn both ACLs in basketball.

[B]

Oh, really?

[A]

I love playing recreational basketball. So I have actually a league that are run out of my house. I have an indoor basketball court down in my basement.

[B]

That's sick.

[A]

We have seven teams. We do a draft every year. We actually start our season this Thursday.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

But I tore both ACLs. One in 2010, one in 2014 playing brick basketball.

[B]

So if you weren't racing, you'd be in the NBA?

[A]

No, no, I'm terrible. I mean when I say I'm terrible, I'm average for a, you know, mid 40 year old guy who likes to play rec ball. But you know, in our draft, I mean I'm a fourth rounder, so. So like, you know, I'm not, I'm not. I used to be quite a bit higher, but all the injuries and getting older, like I'm not as good as I used to. I'm an outside shooter now.

[B]

Have you ever scored against mj?

[A]

Good question. I don't think so, no. I went to a camp of his in Charlotte once. It was the crowd, it might have been one of those moments where the crowd asked him if he could still dunk and he turned around and he did.

[B]

I think I've seen that video actually.

[A]

And so I went to a camp but never, never played basketball with him.

[B]

That's a once in a lifetime experience. Been to play against him.

[A]

His passion has switched to racing now really obviously. We started this race team with him by five years ago, 2311 Racing. And you know, he, he said many times that like, this fills my bucket. You know, we're.

[B]

What's up guys? Shout out to RX Sugar, one of my favorite snack brands that about to try a flavor I've never had before. Vanilla cream. Let's see what we got here. That's solid. Hello, Vanilla. It's my favorite ice cream flavor. Definitely check them out guys.

[A]

Rxug basketball did for much of my life, you know, the, the racing aspect and the competition and the cars is what you know. His dad got him into it when he's, when he was a kid. His, his father used to take him and his brothers and sisters to NASCAR races when they were younger. And he said he just loved the sport and started watching it every Sunday. And that's essentially how we met is I met him at a Charlotte Hornets game. I had courtside seats. I'm leaving to go to the restroom. At halftime he had his security guys come grab me. He said, hey, Michael would like to meet you. And from that point on, he got my number, started asking me all these questions about nascar and I'm like, wait a minute, what, what? You watch nascar? He's like, dude, I never miss. Every Sunday I, I'm sitting in front of a TV watching nascar.

[B]

A surreal man. Yeah, you get to teach him some stuff about driving.

[A]

So yeah, he actually had one time where he, he wanted to get in the real simulator. Right. Like he obviously has a passion for fast cars, right? Yeah, you Know, he drives all kinds of great cars, and. But he wanted to get in the Toyota simulator that actually we drive to get ready to race in. So we're not allowed to test at any racetracks in real life anymore. So what we do is we took that to simulation, just like a flight simulator for a pilot or what have you. And he got in it, and he probably lasted 10 minutes. And he was like.

[B]

It was out of my eyes.

[A]

He's like, it's making me shake.

[B]

Like.

[A]

Like it just. And they had to retrofit him to get in there in the first place, but they did, and he had a blast. But, you know, we took him to a pretty easy track, and he was like, no, it's. I got a newfound respect for what y'all do.

[B]

People don't know how hard it is unless they actually get it, get out there on the road.

[A]

There's no question. I mean, there's no way a normal person could drive a nascar. First of all, not as fast as we can, but sustain the GS, the temperature, all that stuff, it would just be too much.

[B]

Yeah, I just found out the temperature right before this episode. I did not know it gets to 140 in that car.

[A]

Yeah, it can get on hot, hot days. Upper. You know, upper 100 and 30s, for sure. And it can sustain that for three and a half, four hours, which is insane. It's. You know, it's just. Imagine going in a sauna, right? And. And it's all you can think about is trying to get out. No, I mean, we can't. We can't. We're in there for multiple hours. So hydration, of course, is the biggest thing for us every weekend, because I.

[B]

Hit my red light sauna, 150 for, like, 30 minutes, and I am drenched in sweat. So three hours at 1:40, 1:30. 1:40. That's. That's no joke.

[A]

It's just, I think, you know, my body's just been so trained to do it now. That's why I say, you know, if. If one of my friends wanted to get in a car, they last 10 minutes. So hot. But I just think over the course of my life, my body has gotten used to being in that type of environment.

[B]

Early on, did you get lightheaded and in that environment?

[A]

Yeah, I mean, it was tough when I first. First started, you know, but the races were so much shorter now, you know, so NASCAR races are probably the longest of stock car races, being three and a half hours. But when you're coming up through the ranks, you know, you're running 30, 40 lap races, not 300, 400 like we're running in NASCAR. So you kind of get eased into it by only being in there for 30 minutes or, you know, 40 minutes, and then, you know, and on and on. But it's. It's a very interesting thing. You know, what. What people see every Sunday is cars going around in circles, but they have no idea is what makes that driver a little bit faster than that driver or that car a little bit better than that car. And it's hundreds of people, tons of engineers. It's just. It's a huge undertaking, and the sport is way more technical than what it gets credit for.

[B]

Yeah. How much is it driver versus car?

[A]

Like, good question. I think that's evolved over time. I believe that NASCAR was probably 60% car back in the day, 40% driver, because I used to be able to build trick cars. But over the last few years, they introduced what this called next gen car. It's essentially like a LEGO set, right? Everyone has to buy this same LEGO set. Now, you can put it together any way you want, but we no longer can manufacture our own bodies or chassis or whatever, you know, to save the team's money, they said, okay, here's the LEGO set. Everyone has to buy it, and you can put it together any way you want, but, you know, everyone has to run, race the same car. So now the driver probably means a little bit more just simply because we are all racing essentially the same cars, even though they may look different on the outside. You have a Ford, a Chevy, a Toyota. It's essentially the only difference is the bodies and the engine.

[B]

Wow. I didn't know they made that change. It's interesting. Were you in favor of that change? What did you think?

[A]

Not really.

[B]

You like the customized?

[A]

I do. I think that the ingenuity, like letting these teams use their ingenuitive minds to create an advantage is what makes F1 so, you know, mesmerizing for me. It makes it, you know, fascinating for me to see the technology of it and how it evolves in the aerodynamics. Where to me, like, when you just kind of buy a car out of box, it's like, okay, it's cool, it looks cool. But what. What makes your car cooler than the next?

[B]

Yeah, it was more strategic back in the day. That's interesting. Which race do you think about the most?

[A]

From my career?

[B]

Yeah, from your career.

[A]

2010 Homestead Miami Championship race. I'm leading the championship standings on my way to my very first title, and I just I let the pressure get to me. I let outside get to me too much. It's definitely the one race that I would take back in the sense of, like, I took myself too seriously. In that moment, I felt like I was only four years into my career, and I was racing against a guy, Jimmie Johnson, who had just won three or four championships in a row. It was down to me and him, and it's like I was going to be the guy that unseeds him. Right. And I just remember thinking my style back then was that I used to have fun. I mean, there was definitely a weekend in my younger rookie career where if I raced in Phoenix, I would go to Vegas the night before the race.

[B]

You're a partier.

[A]

Yeah. And I. And I. And then I would come and race the next morning.

[B]

That's some Dennis Rodman stuff. Right?

[A]

I mean, but it was. It's what. It's what kept me loose. It's what kept me, you know, loving it. Right. But I just. Back. So then I get myself in this title hunt, and it's like, okay, no, I need to lock myself in my hotel room, and I need to concentrate on this. And look at that. And I just took it way too seriously. And I didn't race loose, and instead I raced tight, and I made too many mistakes. And he won the title.

[B]

Damn. So mentally, you just weren't there.

[A]

I just. Yeah, I just let the pressure of this situation in the moment get to me, which I just wish I had that to do all over.

[B]

Wow. And that was 14 years ago. You still think about it?

[A]

Yeah, it just. I've had other opportunities to. To win a title, and it's been close. Like, really, really close. Comes down to the last race, the last restart. But that was the one where I thought my car was better than him. I thought I was better than him, especially in that moment. And I just. I felt like I more gave it to him versus him. Winning it.

[B]

Yeah. Chasing a title, it's.

[A]

It's hard.

[B]

Only one guy, right?

[A]

I mean, you know, there's. That's the difficult part about our sport. I think some of the great drivers that we've had in nascar, some of them have never won a title, myself included. I've got more wins than anyone in NASCAR that hasn't won a title, but doesn't mean that, you know, I view myself or my career less than, you know, when they. When they talk about the greats of the sport, they're going to go down the list of the winners who won the most races. Titles, I get it. But there's been people that's won 10 races their whole career, 12 races and won a title. They just had a great race them better than me. And I've won mid-50s. I don't think so. But I think it's all up to who, whose opinions. Yeah, you know, it is.

[B]

That's in every sport though. There'll always be really great players like Charles Barkley in basketball.

[A]

That's, that comes to mind. Right, is there's, there's great ones and, and there's, you can probably mention many NBA players that won four titles and it's like what did.

[B]

They were role players.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

They weren't the guy.

[A]

They weren't the guy right where we are the guy in our sport. And it's, it's not a one verse, one sport. It's a one verse 35 every week. So I, I, I equate it to the PGA. If you can win 7% of the time, you're, you're fucking hall of Famer.

[B]

Right?

[A]

Right. We're in a losing sport more than we're in a winning sport. So if you can win at that rate, like you're going to win a lot.

[B]

Yeah. Statistically, 3% chance of winning with 36 guys. Right.

[A]

Yeah, it's, it's, it's small. It is small. Now I'm with a really good team and there's, you know, I mean there's 25, 30 good teams now. And that's grown over time, but it's more difficult to win now than ever.

[B]

Damn. Yeah, I could see that. You playing a lot of golf these days?

[A]

I like to. I certainly don't have as much time to play golf as I used to. I used to, you know, before I started the race team with Michael, you know, my weeks, you know, in between the Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, I could do whatever I wanted. Now those days are designated to, I need to, you know, I'm the owner of the team, so I do all the meetings, you know, whether it be from sponsorship, from the social, digital side of things. Everything, competition, I have my hand in everything there. So I have to do that Tuesday through Thursday and then, you know, kind of the Monday and the weekend is all designated to being a driver itself. So it's a very interesting dynamic that I drive for one team and race against the team that I own.

[B]

That is interesting. Has that ever happened before to someone?

[A]

Dale Earnhardt was the last one that did it.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

You know, that's been, you know, 30 years ago almost. So. Yeah, he Was he owned his own team, he drove for Richard Childress racing, and he owned dei. And so this was never part of the plan for me to own a team before I actually retired. But, you know, Covid happened, and it ended up wiping out one of the teams. And I saw an opportunity there to, like, hey, I can pick up the pieces here. As long as I can get the funding, I can get the right people to support me. I. This is something I can do now. And so we made it happen. And, you know, sitting at home for eight weeks straight, being locked in, I was like, man, if this what retirement's like, like, I can't golf every day.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So. So, like, I need to come up with something else to do. And, you know, I knew that my career, you know, I. It's not over, but, like, I can see the light at the end of the tunnel. I need to figure out what I'm going to do beyond just being a race car driver. And I was like, ownership is the right thing for me. So we started this team.

[B]

Do you prefer being an owner or driver?

[A]

Right now, you know, it's driver for me just because, you know, ever since I was a kid, I never dreamt to be a team owner. I dreamt to be a driver. Right. And so all the goals that I want to accomplish essentially are right here in front of me, and I want to accomplish them for myself first, because I've got decades as an owner to accomplish the other goals. I can win a championship as an owner, and that would be very, very gratifying because if you ever watch your kids do anything, you're always more proud of them, are your own accomplishments. So I'm more proud of the driver side of things now, and that's what I really want to accomplish. My perfect scenario every weekend is I win and my team cars finished 2, 3, 4. That would be the perfect scenario. It hasn't happened yet. We have finished 1, 2. But I think I've. They've gotten the better of me more times than I've gotten the better of them head to head.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

That's interesting.

[A]

Yeah. But, you know, I. I'm a driver, so I know talent when I see it, and I've picked guys that I've like that. I'm like, they're gonna be good. And we signed them long term, and now they're.

[B]

Yeah. How tough is that process? Because they probably have other offers. Right. From other teams.

[A]

They do. It's, you know, it's a free market, essentially. I mean, it's, you Know, there's free agency. These drivers have long term contracts, but you know, when they're essentially up, you know, there's a handful of agents within NASCAR that know when the drivers are up. So you start shopping pretty early when you're looking to make a change. And you know Tyler Reddick, who went to the championship race last year for us, we signed him two years before his deal was even up. And so he ended up the team he was with got pissed off, kicked him out early. So we actually got him a year early, but we had to pay them for that.

[B]

Interesting. Now you've had quite a few beefs and rivalries.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

Are you on speaking terms with any of these guys or is the beef still there?

[A]

No, I mean I do, I have drivers that I don't prefer racing with or against, but I mean we race against each other, like I said, 38 weekends a year. So, you know, and it's very difficult to keep a rivalry in NASCAR because we have what they call a motorhome lot. So. So we don't. Many people don't stay at hotels, they have a bus at the racetrack. So then you got, the girlfriends are hanging out and the families are hanging out and our kids hang out. It's like, it's hard to keep it totally separate.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And you can be rivals on the racetrack, but then when you get back and you're like, oh, our kids are hanging out.

[B]

It's like this is friendly competition.

[A]

Yes. But it's still everyone for themselves and everyone's still really selfish as they should be.

[B]

Right. Yeah. Cuz that, that was a problem, like labeling you as a dirty driver. Right.

[A]

Yeah. I mean, I think that I kind of got that because I got into run ins with some of the more popular drivers in nascar. One of the more, you know, the fanfare guys, you know, the, you know, maybe their dad raced and then, you know, they, their fan base went over to them and then when I come in there and maybe I roughed them up, probably did, you know, they don't like me and so that's fine. And I've kind of taken on that heel, the villain role within NASCAR over the last few years.

[B]

You can monetize that. You know, Jake Paul did it.

[A]

I have found that it's not hurt me in any kind of way.

[B]

Attention is attention, right?

[A]

Yes, absolutely. You know, it comes down to, you know, who, who on social media is, is, you know, getting the most views. Not, not. Yeah, not only views, but kind of engagement. You know, there's some that, that are Top of our sport, performance wise. But they just don't move the needle in the social landscape. And so, yeah, there's a balance there to be had. No doubt.

[B]

Yeah. No, that's a good point, though. In every sport, you see, the top athletes are a little scared to speak.

[A]

Out sometimes, and it's even more so in our sport because they got a brand they're representing on their chest, Right. And so when you have that, they don't want you to be too far one, way too far the other. They want you to be right in the middle of the road. Right. And so they never really say anything controversial, which, you know, to each his own. But I just. I'm at the point of my career where it's like, I just. I don't care.

[B]

Have you lost sponsors because of what you said before?

[A]

No, I definitely haven't.

[B]

That's good.

[A]

I had the best sponsor for the longest time. FedEx was my sponsor for 20 years. Is the first year that they're not on the car. They were really at the mercy in NASCAR of the chief marketing officers of these big companies.

[B]

Right.

[A]

All it takes is for them to say, well, we want to take our media spend. We want to spend more money in Europe. We need to get bigger in Europe, so we're going to spend our money there. Right? And so that's the tough part about the NASCAR business model, is that U.S. teams are, you know, we're essentially professional fundraisers.

[B]

Right?

[A]

We got to find people to fund this. This thing that we're doing. Right? Because. And it's, you know, it's kind of what we're fighting with. With NASCAR right now is that, you know, can we get proper sharing to make it to where we're not so sponsorship dependent? Because I think NASCAR has a star problem, but it's because these guys are afraid to speak out because they. They know if they lose this, they're out. It doesn't matter how good they are.

[B]

That's such a good point, though, because the UFC fighters are not scared to speak out because Dana White will let them say whatever.

[A]

I think that's really helped them in the star power. I think so, too. I mean, it's really. The sport's great anyway. But I think that the fact that they let their. Their athletes be themselves, say what they want, I mean, I just think that people resonate with that.

[B]

Yeah. Because I'm not gonna lie. When I was a kid, I remember hearing about NASCAR daily, like on ESPN and everything, and I would know the drivers, but these days, I feel Like, I don't hear about the drivers as much.

[A]

Right. You know, it's, it's become so commercialized. It really has. It's just, it is a different sport now. It's still, it's still thriving. I mean, any, any given weekend, it's the first or second most watched sport every single weekend.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

It has a core fan base that follows every single week. But yeah, it's. It. You know, we're definitely in a turning point where we've got to get this thing better for everyone and get this thing growing.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Bigger. And I think globally is what's going to happen next.

[B]

I think so. I'd love to see more of you guys on podcasts and long form media. I don't see too many of them speaking out, like you said.

[A]

Yeah. I think it's. It's been something they have been apprehensive to do. You know, I started my podcast just a few years ago. Action is detrimental. And ever since then, you know, the core fan base has followed us, you know, because I was the first one to really do it. And now you're starting to see others go on podcasts, at least no one, you know, not many are really starting one. But again, I think everyone's very, very worried about saying something that's sensitive and then getting in trouble.

[B]

Well, yeah, because you got fined for it, right?

[A]

I did, I did. I've definitely gotten fined for things I've said on my podcast. But it's like, so I can see.

[B]

Why they're scared, you know?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

That was a big fine, too. That wasn't like a little.

[A]

No, it's, you know, most of it was just admitting that I crashed into somebody on purpose.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

He was getting on my nerves. He had gotten into me many times and I was like, all right, screw.

[B]

It, I'm going down. I'm taking that.

[A]

I'm taking you with me. Right. And so, you know, finally NASCAR is like, oh, that's probably pushing it.

[B]

Yeah. Do they bring deals to the teams or are you like in charge of bringing every single deal?

[A]

Oh, that's, That's a good one. I haven't been aware of. I can only speak for 2311 racing.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But I don't think NASCAR has brought us any sponsorship. It's on us to, to go out and find these deals, which, which, you know, that's what makes it very difficult. And it's essentially what our team is fighting for. Right. Is that we believe that there's enough money to, for everyone to be healthy. But since you Know, NASCAR is owned by, you know, private family. You know, they get to dictate the terms or, you know, or they have dictated the terms. And we finally are pushing back on that because we have to do, we have to raise. So, you know, to run a race car, NASCAR car is $18 million a year. That's kind of a, that's per car. That's insane. And you know, we have three cars that we run, so we have to come up with a dramatic amount of sponsorship just to break even every year. And again, it's, it's like we're just paddling water every single year hoping that these companies can continue to see value, which they have. We've got some great long term partners that have seen value in the program. And so I think NASCAR maybe has brought some other teams, some deals or not. What? Not. But not. Not ours. They're not, not that I'm aware of.

[B]

Yeah, they're not obligated to do that, right?

[A]

No, they're not obligated to. And really it's tough because nas, if NASCAR signs someone, say like their fuel partner or their tire partner, you can't go and get a competitor of theirs to sponsor your car. They lock you out of that category. And so when it comes to the most important things, when it has to deal with cars is fuel and tires, we can't, we can't go sponsorship running through tires.

[B]

Right?

[A]

Yeah, I mean, we, we, I think we probably pay about $700,000 a year in tires.

[B]

Yeah, that's so crazy, man. And you're not allowed to get a sponsor for it because they have one.

[A]

Yeah, I mean, Goodyear is the official provider of NASCAR tires, but we have to purchase them. They're not given to us. We have to purchase them. But that's an agreement that they have with NASCAR itself. And again, it's a category where we couldn't go get a Michelin to sponsor our car.

[B]

You think the cars are going to shift towards electric over the next few years?

[A]

I think the NASCAR fans will be very apprehensive to embrace that. I think that NASCAR fans are the ones that have been around for a very long time and even the new ones, and I think even consumers themselves in streetcars like to hear sound 100%. I think that we've seen even in American culture itself that, man, there was a big push for electric and it's starting to come back a little bit because, you know, for whatever reason, maybe they're seeing that it's not saving them as much money as they Thought. But I just think generally when people like to drive, they like to hear noise.

[B]

Yeah. Plus the refueling. That'd be hard if it takes so long to charge them. I don't know how that would work.

[A]

Yeah, it certainly you would think that it would shorten our races. Right. And I think that NASCAR has always been very big on, you know, hitting this three hour, three and a half hour window.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I mean, can you make a car make ample amount of energy, you know, a thousand horsepower for three and a half hours? I don't think so.

[B]

Not right now.

[A]

No.

[B]

My Tesla takes an hour to charge at the supercharger.

[A]

Yeah. So it. It just would take. I think it would. I think there's a place for it. But is it an exhibition series or something like that? But I think there's going to be a hard time convincing our race fans that, you know, you see cars going fast, but you don't hear them going fast. That's going to be a challenge.

[B]

How often are you engaging with the fans?

[A]

All the time. Yeah, I mean, all the time. I kind of had this rivalry with NASCAR fans where I've kind of leaned into the villain side of things. So, you know, I like to egg them on, especially when I win.

[B]

Yeah. Do they get to you ever, or are you kind of just numb to it?

[A]

No, I love it like when I go around for driver intro. So after they introduce us for our starting position, we get in a truck, we drive around the racetrack, and they kind of parade us in front of the fans.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And I mean, you can. You'll know where I'm at on the racetrack by the. You hear the booze just kind of moving all the way around. And so I just. I love hearing the noise. Like, the worst thing ever for an athlete is when they call your name and people just clap. That's horrible. Nobody ever wants that. And that means you're irrelevant.

[B]

I think that's you internalizing it because some people, if they get booed, it destroys them mentally, Right? Yeah. Like, it really eats at them.

[A]

I just think about how can I go back at them by winning and then saying something snark after the race.

[B]

Yeah. Well, the best success or the best way to, like, prove people wrong is success.

[A]

Absolutely.

[B]

You don't even.

[A]

That's what gets to them the most.

[B]

Yeah. Which One of your 54 wins is your favorite one?

[A]

I've had a lot of good ones, but I would say 2016 Daytona 500. That's my very first Daytona 500 win, and it was in the closest Finish in NASCAR history for that race.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

And so how I won it was just amazing. You know, I fell back to fourth or fifth on the final lap and then found a way to weave through the cars that last lap to win by, you know, probably that much. That was special to me. And then, you know, my team allowed me to keep the car. So, like, I have this kind of my media room or kind of my. My guy's room. And I have my glass. My. My. My garage is all glassed in. I have my Daytona 500 winning cars sitting essentially kind of in my living room.

[B]

That's awesome, dude. That's iconic. What's your favorite stage of the race? Beginning, middle, or end?

[A]

I like the end simply because, like, by the time you get to the end, young drivers, you know, sometimes have messed up. You know, they've taken themselves out.

[B]

Right.

[A]

Like, you see who has managed the race the best by the time we get to the third stage of the race. So always the end, the track changes. I mean, people ask all the time, hey, don't you get bored? You're just going in circles. And I said, the only way I can equate this is that every time I go down the straightaway, I'm trying to figure out how to take this corner faster than I just took the previous. And all the while, the track is getting hotter. It's getting more rubber lay down on it. And I'm having to adjust my line to optimize how my car makes that corner. And when I try a different line, I analyze it going down the X ray while analyze it. Was that better? Was that worse? And I try to approach a different way when I go into the next car. So we just do that over and over and over. And then when you're trying to overtake somebody, it's, you know, okay, now I got to run. They're running the line that I was running the fastest. How can I now make time in a different line to pass them? So it's constantly a chess game.

[B]

Yeah. Because you don't have time to be bored. You're constantly thinking, and no present moment.

[A]

I mean, it goes by really quick in my seat. It just takes a long time when you're watching, right?

[B]

Yeah. 500 laps. Right.

[A]

If the track is small, it's 500 laps. You know, like out here in Vegas, you're. You're looking at probably a 260 lap race because it's a mile and a half track.

[B]

Okay. Wow, that's nice, man. Well, Danny, it's been awesome. What do you got next, where can people find your podcast to keep up with you?

[A]

Yeah, it's on all, you know, platforms. Actions detrimental with Denny Hamlet comes out every Monday afternoon. And what we try to do is get out of the race car and. And if I can go straight in the studio and. And kind of download, that's what I'll do. But otherwise, I'll wake up early Monday morning, kind of talk, talk about the race, how my race went. Kind of analyze what you saw on tv, maybe what you didn't see on TV that I saw from the driver's seat. And we break that all down.

[B]

I love it, man. Check them out. We'll link below. Thanks for coming on. Thanks for watching, guys. See you.

[A]

Appreciate it.