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Digital Social Hour
Matt Bowyer: How a $40M Gambling Addiction Changed Everything | DSH #1517
01:03:36
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- [00:00]
A
Guys in the office who were making tons of extra money. Fu money, let's call it that. They're willing to blow. And I said I was a family guy, I had a baby, and I didn't do drugs or chase girls. So here we go. I'll just. I'll just run with this. I'll take my gambling addiction and make it something even positive for me, because I always gamble. That. That's the one thing I've always done.
- [00:26]
B
Foreign guys got Matt Boyer on Today. Crazy story. He's gonna reveal his side of the story because we've seen a lot of articles on it. Thanks for coming on today, man.
- [00:37]
A
Thanks for having me. Really appreciate it.
- [00:38]
B
Yeah. So obviously you got portrayed in a certain light. I'd love to hear from you. What exactly happened?
- [00:44]
A
Yeah, the problem with the media is the. To sell and to, you know, get eyes on them. They. They try to make you look as bad as possible. So, you know, the truth of the matter is most of the stuff they put out is, I'd say, 80 accurate. It's the part that you have no defense. Right. I haven't been able to speak about it or tell my side of the story, which is great. You're giving me that today. So I really appreciate it.
- [01:05]
B
Absolutely. So 80 was accurate. What was the 20 that you had an issue with?
- [01:09]
A
It's just the sensationalized sensationalism of what really happened. You know, leaving out tidbits or explaining a side of a story that maybe occurred, but yet not explaining really why or the back end of the story. So as an example, you know, they portrayed as if I knew, going to the Shohei Otani part, that I knew all along that he was stealing money. That's kind of the way that they portray me. I had no idea that he was stealing money from Shohei Otani. Truthfully, the real story is I don't even know to this day who was actually gambling on the account. The FBI, the government did all their homework and research.
- [01:49]
B
Yeah.
- [01:50]
A
And they're the ones who put out what they believe happened. Even to this day, the only two people that really know what occurred on that betting account is Shohei Ohtani and Ippei Mizuhara.
- [01:59]
B
Wow. Was that. Were they betting online or in person at the casino?
- [02:03]
A
All online. My website, which was in Costa Rica, I. My job was to provide a service. Right. So the service that I provided was really simple. I give you an account, you tell me the credit line you want. It's all credit based. You would start betting with me, we would settle up based on that either every week or on a subtle account or settle amount I should say. So as an example, this account that we're referring to started with 1000 per game. $8000 credit line which is normal, very small, very, you know, really a normal account. And what turned out to be 1,000 8,000 turned out to be $40 million.
- [02:39]
B
Wow.
- [02:39]
A
And a. About a 16 month period.
- [02:42]
B
Holy crap. Yeah, they bet 40 mil.
- [02:44]
A
Well, he bet $326 million through my website.
- [02:47]
B
Holy crap.
- [02:48]
A
In 16 months. And the, the amount of bets he made was over 19000 wagers. Which is almost a full time job in itself. I mean literally you have to be on a phone or computer logging in. You put an account number, you put in the bet, you gotta confirm the bet. You got to pick the bet to the sport. I mean it's very timec consuming. So clearly he had a. A very big gambling addiction. And I had no idea to the extent of how bad it was until over a period of time. And he never showed any sign of, you know, destray or you know, he would make fun of himself during our, you know, relationship to the point where he laughed about it.
- [03:25]
B
Wow.
- [03:25]
A
And, and, and never showed me a sign of oh my God, this is a problem. I mean I knew it was a problem. He was gambling way more than. But I also gambled at that level so I have my own vice, you know. So it's like I understood where he was coming from but I just had no idea that he was actually stealing money, you know, from Chauvin.
- [03:40]
B
Right. Did he make money on it or did he lose money?
- [03:43]
A
He won 140 plus million betting through me and then he lost 180 plus million. So the net was $40 million in losses.
- [03:50]
B
Damn, what a crazy swing.
- [03:51]
A
Yeah, it was wild. I mean it started off a thousand dollar bets and ended up being the max he was ever betting was $100,000 a game.
- [03:58]
B
That is so nuts. You make money either way, right? Even if he wins or loses.
- [04:02]
A
Well no, cuz had he lost because I'm the house, I was the casino. So had he lost, I would had to pay him. I only paid him a couple times in our relationship because he was such a bad gambler. But the truth of the matter is he had a couple big weeks. He won four and a half million dollars in one week. That was probably his biggest week I think he ever had betting with me. But overall it was clearly a win for me and I, I got paid $16 million. Other 24 million. He bounced on because he's now going to prison, which is, you know, very sad to see, but the 24 million is very un, obviously uncollectible.
- [04:35]
B
Wow. Did he get sentenced yet?
- [04:37]
A
Yeah, he got sentenced to 57 months in prison.
- [04:39]
B
Holy crap.
- [04:40]
A
You know, he committed a crime. He stole a lot of money. And you know, at the end of the day, you steal $17 million from your employer, I have a feeling you're going to do a pretty big sentence. So.
- [04:52]
B
So he had access to show sh's money.
- [04:55]
A
You know, I didn't know that till afterwards, but yeah, he, he was acting. Apparently there's the actually bank phone calls of him portraying to be sh.
- [05:02]
B
No way. Yeah, it's that easy. You could just say you're him because.
- [05:05]
A
He was an interpreter. So the fact that there was a language barrier and the fact that he actually was basically his personal assistant at all facets of life allowed him that access to the bank. And because of that, I think, you know, he had something that other people don't have access to.
- [05:19]
B
That's nuts.
- [05:20]
A
Yeah.
- [05:20]
B
And then Ohtani found out, but much later.
- [05:23]
A
Huh? You know, this is the part that's in question. Right. So let me ask you a question, Sean. If you had $16 million taken from your bank account, how long do you think it would take for you to actually see that?
- [05:36]
B
I would notice quick because that's more than I even have. You know, like I'd be negative.
- [05:40]
A
Okay. So that's really my point. Like, even though he's a very wealthy guy, it's just ironic that over 16 month period, he, he didn't notice $16 million, you know, out of his account. There's some stories out there that, you know, he was so focused on baseball and making so much money on his endorsements, and he had several bank accounts, which I, I'm sure, but it's just really weird. I mean, even wealthy people would notice that kind of money. Even wealthy people check their bank account periodically.
- [06:06]
B
Yeah.
- [06:06]
A
So over 16 months you would see a 500,000 or a million dollar wire transfer out of your account and you would start researching that, asking questions. So that's the part that everyone's really in question. And I don't even have that answer because, you know, we didn't have a open relationship. I didn't know that all this was transpiring until the end. And to be honest with you, I. The whole world wants to know that, including myself. I was the closest to it besides those two guys. And I still don't know that true answer of was Sh. Oh, Itani, you know, really betting on the account? I don't believe so because you know, he was on the mound pitching sometimes when I was taking bets. So you can't throw a hundred mile fastball and put bets in on a website. But the part of that's really in question, the part that I'm addressing now that I have it in public is do I believe Shohei Otani knew that there was some, you know, money being transferred out his account? Did he allow the interpreter The Tri light from Therasol.
- [07:02]
B
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- [07:30]
A
Borrow some of it. That's the part that I believe is a little bit in question.
- [07:33]
B
You think that'll ever come out?
- [07:35]
A
Well, that's funny. You. ESPN was at my home recently and the reporter that was at my home was the reporter that got to Ippe Mizahara and had a direct one hour, hour and a half interview before the Dodgers pulled him aside and said, I can't say what they said because I don't know verbatim, but clearly said, what are you doing? You know, shut your mouth. And that hour and a half hour interview, there was a lot that was transpired and said, but it was retracted. So it's funny how, you know, it's easy to make him look like a liar because at the end of the day he just stole 16, $17 million. But did he really steal the money? You know, that's, that's the part that I question. But I don't have the facts to accuse anybody of anything. But it just to me it's still a big question mark.
- [08:19]
B
Yeah. So they put the fall on you basically for taking the bets for this?
- [08:23]
A
Yeah, I mean, well, Ippei took some of the fall, 57 months of prison. But the reality is I was running an illegal business in California. They don't allow sports betting here. And because of that I don't have a license. So I've never been in trouble with a law. I've never been arrested. But now, you know, I was. And more importantly, I Have to definitely take some accountability for my actions, which I am. I mean, I'm facing my sentence guidelines Right now is one year house arrest, three years probation, or up to 37 months in prison. And when I face the judge here in basically 40 days, we're gonna find out what happens.
- [08:59]
B
Yeah, and I know you got rated, what, 16 months ago now you haven't been able to make any money this whole time.
- [09:03]
A
No, it's been tough. I mean, you know, I. I own a jiu jitsu studio called Risk, and it's in Laguna Hills, California. It's a real small studio, but I opened that studio for myself and my daughter and people to train at. I never did it for the money, and so we're now profitable, but I would say I'm making maybe $500 a month.
- [09:22]
B
Dam. So that's a big change from what you used to be, Megan.
- [09:25]
A
Yeah, I. I would say in 2023, on my tax return I filed, I made just over 16 million. Holy crap. So you know you're making over a million dollars a month and now you make 500amonth. It's a. It's a tough change.
- [09:37]
B
That's a big change, dude. But you've made and lost it all before. We were talking earlier.
- [09:41]
A
I have, yeah. I've been through. My book that I wrote is called Recalibrate, and the reason I named it that is. I've been through a lot of ups and downs in my life. And I've always, you know, when you're knocked down, you get up, you know, and a lot of people have struggle with that, but I've recalibrated whatever I've chose to do. So when I was a young boy, I was always a hustler. When my parents were 12, they got divorced. My dad was an alcoholic, drank 40 beers a day, three packs of cigarettes. Geez, great guy, but just really struggle with addiction. And so my mom finally got fed up with it and left. And she tried to keep four. Four boys in a house. Single mom working three jobs. And fast forward the story. She ended up losing the home. She moved to, sadly, a mobile home park in Dana Point. And I moved out, graduated high school. But during that period, from 12 to call it 17, 18 years old, I just hustled. I sold baseball cards, I was a paper boy selling the Orange county register. At 14, I broke the record for sales in Orange county register and all the in the county. And I want a trip from my mom to Hawaii, stuff like that. So I. I've always hustled that that turmoil and that traumatic experience really made me learn to be a hustler and to work hard. So that carried on the rest of my life.
- [10:55]
B
Yeah.
- [10:55]
A
And so recalibrate is the reason I named my book that, because that's what I try to do.
- [10:58]
B
I love that. Did you end up getting a house for your mom after that?
- [11:01]
A
Yeah. It's a great story. When I was 18, I. I had to move back in with my mom into a two, two bedroom double wide mobile home in Dana Point, California. And my little brother lived there. So my ex wife and I were sleeping on the couch while she, she was pregnant.
- [11:19]
B
Wow.
- [11:19]
A
I was 18 years old.
- [11:20]
B
That's crazy.
- [11:21]
A
So I had this moment of like clarity, of like, okay, I'm 18, I don't even know how to take care of myself, I don't even have a job. And now I'm living on a couch in a mobile home. And how do I not only learn to become a man, but grow up and be, be a father? So that whole turmoil taught me to just really dig deep. And I went out and got a job. So I got a job at a restaurant and it was a brand new restaurant called Chevy's in Dana Point, California. And when I went into interview, the GM told me, I can't hire you as a waiter. You have zero experience, you're 18 year old kid. I can give you a job as a busboy. And I laughed. I said, a bus, a bus boy, like you know, they don't make any money is my thought pattern. I said, but I'll take it. I need a job. So I started as a busboy and about three months in I was making more as a busboy than the waiter was.
- [12:11]
B
Wow.
- [12:11]
A
Because I was just, I had personality, I was working hard. I mean, obviously bringing chips and water and salsa is a very basic job. But when you actually start talking to people when they're, you know, coming in the restaurant and you get to know people and actually the waiter is being kind of bypassed because you have more personality than them. And I was getting side tips from the customers. So I built relationships. So fast forward about three months into the working there, I had a couple who kept coming in and asking to sit in my section, which is really funny because I was a busboy. Yeah, I don't have a section. And so they just said they wanted to be with Matt. So long story short, the guy gave me, well actually his wife did offered me a job. It was a commodity brokerage firm. So I said, I don't care what it is I don't even know what that is, but I'll take it. It's better than serving chips and salsa. So he gave me an opportunity to work at this amazing brokerage firm in Irvine, California. And I went in for the interview. It was about a two hour interview. You would have thought that I was like applying at Wall Street.
- [13:07]
B
Yeah, that's nuts.
- [13:08]
A
He made me feel like I was a two dollar hooker. I mean, literally belittled me every which way. Why didn't you go to college? Why, why are you living in a mobile home? Why are you driving a $400 piece of shit car? And it was actually, it was great because the more he belittled me in a good way, he was testing me, the more I stood up for myself. And then at the end of the interview, I said, you know, listen, you can't judge me by what you see here. You can judge me by what's in here. So if you give me an opportunity, I'll prove myself. And end up giving me a job in the mailroom. I'll never Forget, it was 60 hours a week at 1200amonth, which back then I was 18, I was obviously 32 years ago. I was like, that was a big raise to me. And you know, what is that, $2 an hour? It felt like it. No, it's probably at the time, oh, maybe it was, I mean, let's do 120.
- [13:57]
B
Or wait, 1200.
- [13:58]
A
You said $1200 a month. That was my, my salary. I was working literally 60 hours a week. And so whatever that is, it's peanuts, you know, but for me it was a race because I'm not serving chips and salsa minimum wage with a little bit of tips. So anyway. But I had a future too, right? So I worked my way there for a little while and know, I, I learned what these guys were doing. I mean, they're 25 to 40, roughly that age group, making a million dollars a year, which back then is like making 3 or 4 million now or even more maybe. So I couldn't believe it. They're all driving Ferraris and living this exotic life, you know, chasing girls, doing drugs. I mean, but they were business guys too. They all went to USC or these great, you know, schools, and they had the life that I wanted. So in that process, I, I, my job was to transfer incoming phone calls to the brokers. And so we had headsets. And when I would transfer the call, I would stay on the line and I would just listen and be a sponge. And in that process, I learned exactly how they were selling, what they were doing. I didn't still understand the business per se, but I just learned.
- [15:01]
B
I hope you guys are enjoying the show. Please don't forget to like and subscribe. It helps the show a lot with the algorithm. Thank you.
- [15:07]
A
Learn the basics of selling. I already had a hustle in me, so. So I studied the Series 3 exam on my own and just took some books from people that are actually taking the test. Studied it on my own on my off hours. So about six months into the job, I went to the owner and I said, listen, I want to take the series re exam. I said, you're not even a assistant broker. You don't even know what you're talking about. And I said, well, if I don't pass it, you can fire me. And he said, that's pretty ballsy. I said, well, I'll prove it. That's when he said to me, it costs 450 for our firm to, you know, make you or have you take the test. And we don't waste money on stuff like that. And number two, you're not ready. You don't even know what you're talking about. So I hand him a stack of flashcards. I said, ask me any question on the exam. So he looked at him, he asked me like three or four questions and I knew the answers. Okay, so I'll give you a shot. Kid went in, I passed barely. It's a two part test. I got like a 73. You have to get 70 or higher in both ends and like 80 something. And that was one of the best days of my life. So here I am, 19 years old, having a child now. I basically just passed the series three exam which is, you know, it's seventh hardest test in the nation at the time. Yeah, it's, I mean the bar is higher and being a doctor, whatever, but so I went to him, I said, all right, here you go. And he said, all right, I'm going to promote you. So instead of promoting me to an average broker, I work for the top broker. And took me about a year, I worked my way up there. We were number one for almost every month. And then I got promoted to basically my own licensed broker. And so at 21 years old, I bought the house that my family lost back in my old neighborhood. It was 560, 000 roughly five something and you know, 21 years old to go buy the house you grew up in and actually, you know, make, make it all back so to speak, and get to a level you never Thought you would be. It was really a great moment for me.
- [17:00]
B
Lala trailer parked a millionaire in two, three years. That's really impressive.
- [17:04]
A
It was great. And it was legal. The problem was I had this addiction on the side that I love to gamble. And all the hustling I did during my whole turmoil of hustling at 12 to 18 years old, running poker games at my house, baseball cars, any hustle I could do, I was doing. And so at 21, I now have this great job, but I still have this hustle in me. So I, I was always booking bets on the side, like small. But now I had a lot of money, especially for a 21 year old kid. So instead of just being a broker, I decided to open websites and you know, all that stuff were still not really around but open my own shop, I'll call it, where I was taking bets through a phone, you know, writing them down, recording people, really backdoor stuff like old day bookie stuff. And that business started growing and to the point where I had all these guys in the office who were making tons of extra money, Fu money, let's call it that they're willing to blow. And I said I was a family guy, I had a baby and I didn't do drugs or chase girls. So here we go. I'll just, I'll just run with this. I'll, I'll take my gambling addiction and make it something even positive for me because I always gamble. That's the one thing I've always done. I've gambled since I was 12. You know, in sports, it doesn't matter, poker, anything moving I gambled on. So at 21 I built this little business and it just started really developing and developing and by 25 I went to Costa Rica, set up my own website and it really then I can make it scalable. And that's when things really changed.
- [18:40]
B
Why'd you choose Costa Rica?
- [18:41]
A
Because everything's legal there and they love U.S. citizens. They love, you know, even to this day they, they all bookmakers almost. I would say 90 of illegal bookmakers use Costa Rica for their websites because it's legal. If they ever get in trouble, all the servers and everything are there, nothing's going to get touched or torched and they can continue to either move their business or do what they got to do. Whereas if it's here and you know the FBI raid you, they're going to take everything, shut it all down. Yeah, yeah.
- [19:08]
B
Plus it's beautiful over there.
- [19:09]
A
It is, it's great. I, I actually love the country a lot.
- [19:13]
B
Yeah, my buddies go there for stem cells.
- [19:15]
A
Yeah, it's. And Panama is great for that too.
- [19:17]
B
Yeah.
- [19:17]
A
Yeah.
- [19:18]
B
I want to talk about one Costa Rica story where you flew back to get that 1.6 mil back.
- [19:23]
A
Yeah, that was exciting. I. I had a situation where I was running a bit my business, and I got a little too big for my britches. I started taking bets I couldn't afford to, and I had these billionaires betting with me, and they were brothers, so they would pile on. On specific games, you know, bet like 200,000 each. So all three of them would bet. New England Patriots is all I remember, because that's where they just crushed me when Tom Brady had just never lost. And so they bet like 600,000 every Sunday on the Patriots. Well, that particular year, patriots won literally 14 and 2. But they didn't only win. They covered the spread and went over. They just blew them out. And I'll never forget it because I love Tom Brady's amazing player, but I really hate him because he's cost me multi millions of dollars. You know, it's just one of those players that, as a bookmaker, you. You always have a team or something that you remember that was really bad for you. And it was Tom Brady, he was my nemesis. But now you understand why all he did was win, right? And everybody bet on him. So that being said, I. I just took too many bets I couldn't afford. So I. I got beat for 5.7 million. And I took every dollar out of my home. I took every dollar I had. I borrowed money, I did everything I could, and I was 440,000 or short of paying these guys. So my next move was to call another bookmaker and say, hey, if you loan me for 40, I can cut you into my business. And they said, we'll do it on one condition. You have to move your entire package to us. We'll go 5050 on a split, we'll give you the 440, and then you'll have that as a makeup, they call it. And once the business makes 880, the 440 will be cleaned up, and then we'll give you 50%. And as much as I didn't want to do that, I had no choice because nobody wants to give away half their business. I don't have to. Yeah. So I did it. I had to pay my tab, be honorable, took care of it. And then I'm sitting there and like a week goes by and I'm like miserable because the package would let's say I don't remember the amount, but say it wins 300,000. I'm only getting 150 now. The greedy side of me is like, fuck, I'm giving up, you know, 150,000 bucks here just to borrow. 440 was my thinking. I was like, this doesn't make sense. So the next move I did was the wrong move. It worked out, but it's the wrong move. I basically took advantage of a situation, Open an account, told them that it was these billionaire bettors, and I started firing bets. 100,000 a game, and one a little heater, which is rare because when you're desperate, winning is the hardest thing to do. Right. So I caught a heater. I won 1, 1.6 million and the net of everything after the week, if you subtract the 440, they would be 980 something thousand. I'll call it a million dollars. So I get a call on Sunday night when all the bets are over, and they say, hey, we need you to get back out to Costa Rica. And I said, this isn't good. I knew that was a problem right away. Yeah, I mean, why do I need to go back? Number one. Number two, they don't want to talk about anything on the phone. So what do I do? I book a flight, talk airlines, get out there, and I get picked up at the airport. I go to their sports book in Costa Rica. It wasn't in the city. It's weird. It was. Most of them are in the city. Theirs was kind of in the country. And they were a very big operation. They had guys with guns, guards when you walk in, because, you know, us guy. In fact, one of the bookmakers was killed over there.
- [22:38]
B
Holy crap.
- [22:38]
A
About four years ago.
- [22:39]
B
Damn.
- [22:40]
A
Yeah. The locals knew he had money and they just robbed them and killed him and held him for ransom for bitcoin. So sad.
- [22:48]
B
Like he had a bunch of bitcoin.
- [22:49]
A
Yeah, they. They got. I don't even know how much. It was a lot. Holy crap. It was owner of five dimes. Really sad story. If you Google it, you can see it. But anyway, he died and his wife was holding the bitcoin and she sent it. And. And I'm telling you the story because I don't know all the, you know, intricacies, but that's the bottom line. So these guys have protection, of course, and they have, you know, people with them all at all times. I don't blame them. So when I got there, I was very, you know, on edge because I knew it wasn't good. They sat me down in a room and, and grilled me and made me feel, you know, wanted to see if I cracked.
- [23:23]
B
Yeah.
- [23:24]
A
And I just completely lied to their face, of course. And I told them, I said, these bets aren't for me. And they said, well, the IP address is from California and these guys supposedly live in Vegas. We could see from your website that all the bets are this IP address in Vegas. This is your IP address. How do you explain that? And it caught me off guard, but I had to be ready. I said, well, they called me, they were golfing and they need me to put some bets in. I mean, if they lost, they would have paid, which is complete, because it was really me. Yeah. And that was the answer I had for that. It was only I can think of at the moment, but the bottom line is they knew I was full of shit. But I told them, I said, you have three choices. You could take me out in the field and just kill me. You could not pay me and I'll go back home and I'll ruin your reputation and tell everybody this. You guys stiff everyone. Or you could pay me. Those are the three choices. I'm not going to sit here and argue. There's three, three partners, and they're literally arguing with each other. One's just say, pay the kid. The other one's like, you know what? I'm not paying this guy. I said, I'm done with this shit. Like, you're not going to sit here and try to strong arm me. So those are your three choices you make up. Long story short, they drove me back to the airport. They said, when you land, give us a call. So I didn't know what that meant. Right. Six hours later, I land la call this number that they gave me. The guy says, on me off Hawthorne Boulevard in 18 minutes. Okay? So I pull in the parking lot, next thing you know, this guy pulls up, throws a bag just under a million dollars, says, we're done with you. Move all your customers, we want nothing to do with you. Which I don't blame them. And I had a million dollars to start my business back up.
- [24:58]
B
Wow.
- [24:59]
A
Yeah. So I never look back. And so from that day forward, I've never, I. I'm not going to say I haven't booked bets. I shouldn't have, but I've never put myself in that predicament where, you know, I could put myself where I can't afford to pay people.
- [25:12]
B
Yeah, not over leveraging yourself. Right. Because that's easy to do in Your space.
- [25:15]
A
Well, I've over leveraged myself many times in a different way. My own betting, casinos, betting with other bookies that have. I'm guilty of. I've done that too many times.
- [25:25]
B
Yeah.
- [25:26]
A
The problem is, is I always separated my business and I treated as a business and the other stuff, I treated as a hobby because it was. And it was a bad hobby. But that's why when I was flying, you know, throughout Vegas, if you look at, you know, some of the stories and some of the parts of my investigation, they're going after the casino, Resorts World. And that's because I was. I lost $9 million in 2023 at Resorts World. Damn. Yeah.
- [25:50]
B
Holy crap. Just sports betting.
- [25:51]
A
Just sports, but no, no, casino too. Mostly casino, actually sports betting. I probably only lost a million or two, but in the casino I lost nine. And it's all factual. It's all the.
- [26:01]
B
You just love gambling.
- [26:03]
A
I do, man. I do. It's. It's been. It's been good to me, but bad to me.
- [26:07]
B
Yeah.
- [26:07]
A
You know, you say overall, you're up.
- [26:09]
B
Or down on it.
- [26:09]
A
Definitely down. No question. Anyone who tells you they're winning gambling is 1% of the world that could even beat it, actually.
- [26:16]
B
These guys have like a. Like an end somehow.
- [26:18]
A
You know, the truth is the professional sports betters, they have algorithms. They're. They're running a system. They don't have any emotions to it. Half of them don't even know any of the players. Don't even care. Didn't even play sports themselves.
- [26:28]
B
Right.
- [26:28]
A
They're just smart individuals that are running algorithm systems. And they know how to make money Beating a system, it's almost like trading stocks to them. You know, they're. They're investing, they're doing all the homework.
- [26:38]
B
Yeah.
- [26:38]
A
They have it down to the weather, the umpires, the. Just everything. Whereas a normal degenerate gambler is just what's on tv. Who do they think is a great player? Who did they watch last week? There's really. The logic is much less.
- [26:51]
B
They got no chance because they're betting on emotion.
- [26:54]
A
Emotion. And also they're fighting the right. They're laying 110 for every $100 over time. That's going to kill you. And that's why a bookmaker and all these casinos make money over time. And even if you are a professional, you end up getting cut out. I mean, I'm barred from Cosmo, I'm barred from Wynn. Well, now actually, I'm barred from every casino in the country. Before I was four, when I started winning, but now I'm barred because of my situation.
- [27:17]
B
Damn, that sucks. Yeah, you pretty much had to give it up then at this point.
- [27:20]
A
Every. Every which way. And one of my plea deals is that I cannot gamble $1. Obviously, I close my business, but I cannot put one bet in whatsoever on anything. I can't even set foot in a casino. If I do, I'm arrested.
- [27:32]
B
Geez. Yeah, they got facial recognition out in Vegas.
- [27:34]
A
Oh, they. Especially me.
- [27:36]
B
Yeah, you're probably super recognizable.
- [27:38]
A
I mean, Vegas policy talks about me almost every day on his Instagram.
- [27:41]
B
From Resorts World, too.
- [27:42]
A
He is. He hates them.
- [27:43]
B
Yeah, he just came on last week and he said as soon as he walks in there, he gets arrested.
- [27:46]
A
I saw the video. He just got on there, and they. They came and escorted him off the property.
- [27:50]
B
That's crazy.
- [27:51]
A
Yeah.
- [27:51]
B
I mean, it makes you wonder, like, how much information they have on you when you walk in there.
- [27:55]
A
You'd be surprised. Vegas is very smart. They. They do their homework. They're there to win, and they're a corporation. That is not going to give you any chance if you have an edge.
- [28:06]
B
Yeah.
- [28:07]
A
Period. Counting cards in blackjack, I've been backed off of five casinos.
- [28:11]
B
That one's pretty easy to catch because if you're just like adjusting your bets and winning.
- [28:15]
A
You're right, because they actually have a system on the camera system now. It's runs. It runs you down. Oh, really? Yeah. So like, if your betting pattern, it's really simple. If you're in the plus count on blackjack and your bet patterns are always max bets if it's high plus count and low if it's negative.
- [28:30]
B
Right.
- [28:30]
A
That just tells it in itself. So computer AI can tell them this guy's card counting.
- [28:35]
B
That's crazy.
- [28:35]
A
I mean, obviously back in the old days, they would take pros, put them up on the cameras and watch. That's.
- [28:40]
B
Those days are long gone. Human error.
- [28:42]
A
Yeah. AI takes over everything, you know?
- [28:44]
B
Yeah.
- [28:45]
A
I mean, nuts.
- [28:46]
B
Wow. That is crazy. Dude, there's a lot to dive in there, but, dude.
- [28:51]
A
Yeah.
- [28:52]
B
I want to hear some of. Some of your crazy gambling stories.
- [28:54]
A
Well, I can tell you the. The biggest bet I've ever made in My life is 2023 Super Bowl Kansas City Chiefs against the Eagles. I was in the Bahamas, So I bet 4.2 million.
- [29:05]
B
Holy crap.
- [29:06]
A
On the Chiefs. And then at halftime, they were down at halftime by. I think it was 14 or 10. The Mahomes. Looked like he hurt his ankle. Yeah, he hobbled in. I thought I was dead. Everyone thought Chad Henning was coming in. Eagles look like a much better team. But something in me just told me, you're a degenerate if, you know, if you bet Eagles now and they come back, I can't bet 5 million at halftime. So I just bet 400,000 more second half on the Chiefs, just hoping. Purely just hoping to get lucky. And I did. I mean, the Chiefs came back at one by three.
- [29:40]
B
Wow.
- [29:40]
A
Yeah, it was a wild game. It was the biggest bet I've ever made. So 4.6 million, which is really a $9.2 million swing because in this case, I put the money up, or most of it. I bet a lot through bookies, too, but I put the money through the casino, so that money's gone. So when you really make that type of wager, people don't realize if you bet 4 million, you're really betting it's 8 million dollar swing if you win or lose, because you're either out to four or you're getting eight back. Right. So in this case, it was 9.2 million. And that's the biggest bet I've ever made that. That's something I could talk about successfully. There's been many million, million, two million dollar losses and, you know, games that I've lost. Super Bowls, especially, because I always bet bigger on Super Bowls.
- [30:18]
B
That's got to be a record, right, for super bowl bets.
- [30:21]
A
For me, there's people that bet more.
- [30:22]
B
Really? Yeah.
- [30:23]
A
You'd be surprised.
- [30:23]
B
Okay, so I remember Sean Perry bet a million. That was like a huge deal a few years ago. I've never heard of 4 million.
- [30:28]
A
I actually have the tickets on my phone to prove it.
- [30:31]
B
Wow. We'll throw it up on the video.
- [30:33]
A
That's cool. Yeah, I do. I have the tickets.
- [30:34]
B
Crazy dude.
- [30:35]
A
Yeah, so the tickets I. I have on my phone because I bet so much, they had to separate them per ticket. So instead of it saying 1 million, you'll see it says 250,000. 250,000 several times. But you will see that there are different bets, different numbers and everything. So it's not like I duplicated the same ticket.
- [30:50]
B
That's crazy.
- [30:51]
A
So I bet one point. I think it's 1.5 million in the Bahamas at Atlantis Casino. And they wouldn't take anymore, so the rest I had to offload to other bookmakers. Yeah.
- [31:00]
B
Was NFL your best sport to bet on?
- [31:03]
A
The worst sport to bet on.
- [31:04]
B
Like your best?
- [31:05]
A
No, worst. Oh, was your worst. Yeah. But most fun. Best sport that I was good at was baseball. I would say the football is the hardest sport in the world to bet on, but it's the best for bookmakers because everyone bets it. It's the most unpredictable sport. I, I don't care. Yes, you'll see, like, you know, whatever. Team's the best this year. Eagles. Right. Yeah. They. They won, what, 16 games out of the 18 that they played or whatever it is. But they didn't cover the spread on all of them. In fact, they were probably 500. So you, you can bet on the Cleveland Browns, one of the worst teams, let's say, and, and you might win money. So it's like you can't. It's not as easy as you think. Right. People don't wager. The truth is the NFL has the most parody.
- [31:47]
B
Yeah.
- [31:47]
A
That's why it's hard.
- [31:48]
B
Well, I've had a few sports betters on, and all of them have said they believe the NFL is free.
- [31:53]
A
I don't believe that. I, I do believe that there could be moments where a referee could maybe even have some involvement of his own betting action and throw a flag unnecessarily or something. That's possible. I don't believe that these, these players, even though there's a lot coming out right now. Right. Of people gambling and stuff, I think they're too, they're paid too much. They're. They're like. For them to like, go to that level to rig or fix a game and tarnish their career and the amount of money they're making is just not worth it.
- [32:24]
B
The risk to reward doesn't seem worth it if you're already making millions.
- [32:27]
A
Correct.
- [32:28]
B
Why would you risk that?
- [32:29]
A
Correct. Now, again, going back to like a referee. Different. Different conversation.
- [32:33]
B
Yeah. I don't know how much refs make, but probably not more than a million, I'd imagine.
- [32:36]
A
And here's the thing. Like, the problem is that even if a referee is in on a game, let's just say he's out to fix a game. In football, it's very hard for him. He can make a big drastic change, but somehow that team could still win. I mean, if he throws a pass interference flag, that's B.S. yeah. That's going to change drastically the outcome of that. That possible. Let's say that touchdown or whatever, but throughout the whole game, he's not controlling. One ref can't control the whole game. So.
- [33:05]
B
Not in football. Basketball, though.
- [33:06]
A
Basketball is different.
- [33:07]
B
Yeah. Lakers, Kings, 100%.
- [33:08]
A
Yeah.
- [33:09]
B
Yeah. That was rigged.
- [33:10]
A
I. Basketball is different. Especially college. I mean, you have the Arizona State scandal. You have so many things where These guys aren't maybe ever going to make it pro. Don't blame them. I mean, I'm not saying to do that, but I can understand their philosophy a little different now with the. The way these college kids are getting money. But if you go back, you know, five years old, a friend, ball game. Yeah.
- [33:30]
B
You bet a lot of college back in the day?
- [33:31]
A
I bet everything moving.
- [33:32]
B
Oh, yeah.
- [33:33]
A
There's nothing I didn't.
- [33:34]
B
Ping pong tennis.
- [33:35]
A
I actually had ping pong during. During COVID because there was nothing else to bet.
- [33:38]
B
Yeah.
- [33:39]
A
And that's. That's. I would say ping pong for about six months was the only thing really available.
- [33:46]
B
Wow.
- [33:46]
A
And people were betting it like crazy.
- [33:47]
B
That's nuts.
- [33:48]
A
Yeah.
- [33:49]
B
It was a crazy sport.
- [33:51]
A
No, but I mean, I couldn't even tell you one thing about the player. I mean, I know how to play ping pong. Yeah, but how do you know this guy's better than this guy? I mean, I.
- [33:58]
B
If they're Asian, usually.
- [33:59]
A
Right. Well, the Russians were good at it.
- [34:01]
B
Oh, really?
- [34:01]
A
Yeah. The Russian. Russian ping pong was huge during COVID Yeah, I know.
- [34:05]
B
China always wins it, though, right? In the Olympics.
- [34:06]
A
That's all they do.
- [34:07]
B
Can you bet on the Olympics?
- [34:08]
A
Yeah, you bet. You can bet almost everything in the Olympics.
- [34:11]
B
Wow.
- [34:11]
A
Yeah.
- [34:11]
B
Did you hit the Michael Phelps wave.
- [34:13]
A
When he was, you know, back then it wasn't as big, but the odds were so big on him, you know, so high because he's so amazing. You know, you have to lay 20 to 1 sometimes on a him to win a swim. Swim meet.
- [34:24]
B
And that's too safe for your standards.
- [34:27]
A
It's just too much risk. Like, meaning you're risking too much money to make too little of.
- [34:32]
B
Oh, it's too risky. Alcohol.
- [34:33]
A
Yeah. Because if you're laying 20 to make one, you know, even if you win, okay, that's great. But the one time you lose, you're losing 20 wagers. So that's what I mean by that. As far as risk, there's almost no risk I wasn't willing to take. That's the problem.
- [34:46]
B
Yeah. Wow.
- [34:47]
A
Yeah.
- [34:47]
B
Your lifestyle must have been very up and down.
- [34:49]
A
It was. It was wild. I. I got off on it, though. You know, that's the problem. Like, the dopamine rush that I had in my life and all the ups and downs were traumatic. You know, we were on a private jet almost every two weeks with $2 million flying to different countries. Even my wife and I went to Andrea Bocelli. They flew in Dominican, Hard rock. They flew 18 of my family members to Andrea Bocelli. We had front row seats. And, you know, I flew out there with 2 million and I won 2.5 million. Flew home with that in cash, on the, on the plane privately, all the way from, you know, here to Dominican. And that, those experiences and the red carpet they roll out for me was, it's, it's just really enticing. I mean, the room that we had at Resorts World, we had a backyard with a pool. It's 10,000 square feet, four bedrooms, glass all the way around it.
- [35:39]
B
Is this the one in Vegas or.
- [35:40]
A
A different one in Vegas?
- [35:41]
B
Oh, wow. I didn't know they had.
- [35:43]
A
It's, they had the best. In my opinion, they have the best rooms, the best villas that I've ever seen.
- [35:48]
B
Really?
- [35:48]
A
Yeah, truly. And I've stayed in all of them. Palazzo Winds is probably right. Win is good. Win is good. The only reason, though, the resort world might be better. The, the, I don't even like the property, but the villas, it's. It's new. It's brand new. So, like, it's glass all the way around with this amazing backyard. Literally, the backyard is bigger than a house backyard. And the pool is amazing. You have. You have a full barbecue, it's got a spa. I mean, it's truly amazing.
- [36:13]
B
Holy crap. Do you think you'll ever get unbanned or you think it's permanent?
- [36:16]
A
Great question. I'll be honest. I'm. I'm the most taboo gambler in all of Las Vegas in the history now. So I've been told that once I pay my restitution, which I'm paying right now, 1.6 million that I owe the government. And once my charges are cleared, I'm off probation. That certain casinos will allow me to come back as long as I have legal money. And I could show that it's legal. But I believe that it's going to be only a few.
- [36:42]
B
Okay.
- [36:43]
A
Yeah.
- [36:43]
B
I mean, you're a casino's dream customer because you're losing tons of money.
- [36:47]
A
That's. That's why. That's why this occurred. I mean, Resorts World was definitely looking the other way, you know, like they knew I was a book.
- [36:54]
B
Well, they, they're actually hurting, so they probably loved you.
- [36:57]
A
Well, think about it. Why are they hurting? I did 12 of the revenue in 2023. Damn me and my, my staff. I call it my staff. The players I brought in because my wife was my casino host. Yeah, we got her hired as the rep. It's the only, only, the only gambler that's ever done this?
- [37:11]
B
Oh, wow. I never heard about.
- [37:12]
A
Yeah, first person to do it.
- [37:14]
B
Why do you go that route?
- [37:16]
A
Because she was able to earn on every trip that we would bring me and my gamblers rather than just some random host. And so the host earns off their gamblers.
- [37:26]
B
Is that how it works?
- [37:26]
A
So it depends. A regular host that works for the actual casino, they're paid a salary, and they really get a bonus based on the losses. Yeah, Basically, they call it Theo a nice way. They don't want to say losses. They don't want to hurt the player's feelings. But theoretical is a number that spits out based on what the player will lose. So the higher the Theo for the host, the more their bonuses. Now, when it comes to independent reps, which is what my wife was, she doesn't work directly for the casino. She works for multiple casinos. And every time she brings a customer, she gets a. Also a paid on Theo. Whether they win or lose, that's what's great.
- [38:01]
B
I need to start doing that myself.
- [38:03]
A
You. You have the contacts too?
- [38:04]
B
Yeah. I got so many high rollers that come on the pod and get.
- [38:07]
A
And the only. The only thing you have to do is negotiate the trip for the customer, though, so as a host. So my wife would negotiate. Okay. When I would fly in, most of the time, I would bring in a million or 2 million, and they would give us 5% or 3% in promo chips. So if it's 5% on 2 million, it's $100,000 of chips up front. Just free chips.
- [38:27]
B
I didn't know you could do that.
- [38:28]
A
Yeah, you. Well, it's all you got to know how to, you know, negotiate the best. And truly, that's what I think. I did better than almost all these people because you. You learn through trial and error. And I grinded these casinos as much as I possibly could because at the end of the day, it's. It's a war. Me against them, and they want your business.
- [38:46]
B
And there's so much casino competition in Vegas.
- [38:48]
A
Right.
- [38:48]
B
Leverage each other.
- [38:49]
A
That's what I would do. And I would go. I'll give an example. I went to the Super bowl of 22. Yeah, 22 Super Bowl. I went to Palazzo. I won a million two. I was there, and it was Sunday, and I was like, I don't want to gamble anymore, because if I go gamble, I won't get a discount if I lose the sunny back that I just won. And I've already reached all my comps. We were there for three days. Did Everything possible. Got the gift cards, they would give. They give my wife and I sometimes 20,000 in gift cards. They give us the promo chips, they'd give us a bottle of Louie, a bottle of Screaming Eagle, whatever I requested. Right. And at that point, there's no value in me continue to gamble other than just winning. But if I lose, I want a discount. So I checked out. We went to Resorts World. That was my first trip there. I brought a million dollars. I lost 850,000 and we gambled there. And on that 850 I got 16% back.
- [39:41]
B
Wow.
- [39:42]
A
Because now it's a new trip and it's a new spot. So we negotiate those deals. And of course I got promo chips walking in and all that all over again. So that even though I lost 8, 8 50, that sucked. But if I gambled and lost 850 back at Palazzo, I would have got zero.
- [39:58]
B
Smart.
- [39:58]
A
Yeah.
- [39:58]
B
You were very strategic with.
- [40:00]
A
I tried to be. It's hard when you're a degenerate too. But yeah, I mean, I try to cut the edges back in my favor as much as I can.
- [40:06]
B
Yeah. So with five kids, do you ever think about like, damn, can I keep this out my whole life?
- [40:10]
A
I've been doing it since I was 21.
- [40:12]
B
Wow.
- [40:12]
A
And truly, until I'll be 50 and you know, literally 40 days.
- [40:16]
B
Not a lot of gamblers make it that long.
- [40:17]
A
Not a lot of people make it in Vegas. Like I. I'm truly. You know, listen, let's be real. I had a business feeding it though. So you know that.
- [40:26]
B
That's the difference.
- [40:26]
A
Right. There it is.
- [40:27]
B
Other people, they don't have that fallback.
- [40:29]
A
They don't. Maybe even if you're a doctor, you own a business, whatever, you make good money, but you're not going to be able to go to Vegas every two, three weeks with a million, $2 million.
- [40:37]
B
Right.
- [40:38]
A
And also I negotiated such great deals to give me a little bit more of an edge. I'm not saying I didn't had an edge over them, but I knocked their edge down drastically.
- [40:46]
B
Right.
- [40:46]
A
So I could survive. And I'll give you an example. When I started gambling at the MGM Mirage Corporations, I was 21. I first went there. I'll never forget it. I won 25,000 my first trip. That's what sucked me in. Right. It's all in my book. And then at that point, they gave me the big suite and, you know, it just sucked me in. And I went home and I said, man, I love this. So I started going back like every three weeks.
- [41:10]
B
Yeah.
- [41:10]
A
And I would bring like 50k, a hundred k, because I was 21, didn't have that kind of money, and I would lose. I lost over the next, I'm gonna call it eight years. I lost $3 million.
- [41:20]
B
Holy crap.
- [41:20]
A
But that's over a long period of going like every three weeks. Right. And it was affordable for me because it was over three, you know, eight years, $3 million. And then I finally started counting cards and learning how to play blackjack and just started making more of an edge for myself. So I want it all back, all 3 million. And then I get a letter, I don't know, six months later, says, you're no longer, you're barred from our casinos. You're not welcome on our properties. So I call my host and he didn't even know about it. He's like, let me find out what's going on. So he calls me back, says, yeah, I'm sorry, man, you're what they call a non profitable guest. I said, well, I know what that means. I, I know what non profitable means, but really explain that in depth to me. Why, why am I, I haven't won. He said, well, you actually have won $8,000 over your eight or nine year playing here. I said, well, 8,000. He goes, yeah, the problem is you have $2 million in comps. So basically, I've milked $2 million in trips at their, you know, their steakhouse, the nightclubs, everything, you know, bottles of wine, whatever I can get, I have milked for over the last eight or nine years, I've cost them $2 million. That's how they viewed me. So they said, we're done with you. So to this day, well, I'm not, I'm not welcome anywhere. But as of the last 10 years, I couldn't gamble there.
- [42:33]
B
Wow, that's a good point though, because even if you break, even if you take advantage of the cops, you can make a ton of money.
- [42:38]
A
Yeah. And it's free vacations. I mean, especially the way we're living. You're flying on a private jet. They pick me up at, you know, literally 10 minutes from my house. You know, you get on the plane, there's lobster, caviar, you bring all your friends, all your kids. You have obviously a, you know, chauffeur when you're waiting. It's a, you know, Bentley or whatever car you want. Rolls Royce. You, you go to the casino, you don't wait in line. You walk in, you already have your credit card on file. You walk into this villa. It's 10,000 square feet with a pool in it as pool table. A bowling alley. I've had in my room. I've had a basketball court.
- [43:08]
B
Damn.
- [43:08]
A
At the Palm Palms. Right. I had that. At the Hugh Hefner Villa. I've had every room in Las Vegas. I stated all the Westgates. All three of the top floors are. Those are 16, 000 square feet. They're very old. Beautiful though. There's no villa I haven't stayed in. And all of lost mansions. I stayed at MGM 100 times. So you experience these things that suck you in so much. I mean they're giving you everything and you feel like a king. So it's really hard to not go back. And especially if you have a gambling addiction. So you, you temper those two together and it's like every one of your buddies say, hey, you want to go to Vegas? I mean the answer is always yes. So I would, I would just got accustomed to doing that almost every two or three weeks.
- [43:48]
B
Yeah. So you love the luxury lifestyle.
- [43:50]
A
Yeah. I mean, who doesn't, right? I mean it's hard not to enjoy these perks. But at what cost is it? You know, I mean there's a lot of cost involved and I'm dealing with those costs today.
- [43:59]
B
Yeah. What do you think the average edge is at these casinos? Well, percentage wise, I guess I would.
- [44:05]
A
Say clearly slots, we used to be their, their main focus of money and it's really changed. Las Vegas in the last five years has gone from. Gambling is not their main source of revenue like it used to be. It's actually all the other stuff, the restaurants, the nightclubs and all these things that they don't really talk about as much. Meaning before the old days was all gambling.
- [44:25]
B
Right.
- [44:25]
A
That's all they cared about. And it's really shifted because people aren't gambling as much. Everyone's gambling. They're not gambling as much like true gambling. Like five, 10, 10 years ago, it was more. They made all their money on slots and tables and of course they still make money on that. It's. It's really the core. But the. Where they really are making money now is all the other stuff because you know, expense, you live there, you know how expensive it is to go out to a STK dropping 500. Yeah. At least. And if you go to a nightclub, you're. If you get a table, it's 20 grand.
- [44:54]
B
Yeah.
- [44:54]
A
I mean if you want to reason on the day.
- [44:55]
B
Yeah.
- [44:56]
A
Right. And who the DJ is or whatever. Yeah. And we've stated all of them. We were front row for Pitbull Resorts World New Year's Eve. I've been to every Calvin Harris, any marshmallow fiesta, Marshall, all of them. I mean we've been at the pools doing, you know, bottle service, 25,000, the cabanas. I mean I've done all of that a hundred thousand times. So you get a point where you kind of just get, you know, over it. You know, for me I was over that part.
- [45:20]
B
I'm over the club scene to be honest.
- [45:22]
A
Yeah, it's, it's old.
- [45:24]
B
As you get older it's like.
- [45:25]
A
Well, it's actually changing. Even your age demographic has kind of changed from clubs down to lounges or just more, you know.
- [45:31]
B
I'd much rather hit a lounge.
- [45:32]
A
Me too easily.
- [45:33]
B
Yeah.
- [45:34]
A
Oh, you can actually have a conversation.
- [45:35]
B
Yeah, I can't hear in the club and you feel like terrible the next day.
- [45:39]
A
It's, it's. I hate the clubs. I used to do them all the time because that was kind of the thing in my genre. But honestly I, I haven't been in a club in two years, maybe three years.
- [45:47]
B
Yeah, LA just got voted worst clubs in the country. Actually, I'm not just go there and go on their phones. Yeah, right.
- [45:54]
A
That's why people go to lounges. You know, I could actually have a nice conversation. Some good drinks or some maybe back music that's you know, tempered. You know, it's the, the club scene is dying.
- [46:04]
B
So you had a near death experience. You had a gun pointed what, out of your head once.
- [46:08]
A
That's an exaggeration. I, it wasn't in my head, but it was definitely in my body. And you know, this, this particular guy was betting with me. He won first week he, he played with me, he won $88,000. He drove from Fresno to my house to pick it up, which was a red flag number one on a Monday morning. So he even counted the money at my house, which I thought was really funny. You hand a guy a bag of $88,000, he's really going to count it down. What if it's $200 short? Just call me, I'll give me 200, you know. So he counts the money, drives home. The next week he loses a hundred. And I think it was 114,000. And I call him up and it's no answer, no answer day after day after day. And I'm like, what the, you know, why is this guy ghosting me? And it came to a point after about a week or two weeks of just continue to call this guy. I realized he's not paying me, right? So my friend owned a bail bonds company. So I asked him, I said, hey, I need this guy's address. Can you run it through the system? So I got two addresses in Fresno. So I drove this long drive to Fresno, Not a place I want to go. And I get there, and the first house I went to was kind of not dumpy, but just not nothing special. And he didn't live there anymore. So then I drive to another second address, another neighbor. It was really nice, Brand new neighborhood. And I was surprised. And I get to the guy's door, and his kid answers the phone, right? Or answers the door. He's like 15 years old. And I said, hey, is your dad here? He says, yeah. So the guy comes to the door, and he's only met me once. So, you know, when it's dark out, you know, you turn on the. The porch light and you kind of look. If you don't know someone, you're kind of looking to see who they are. And I said, his name is Robert. I said, what's up, Robert? And he looks at me and he's like. I said, it's Matt. You know why I'm here? And he goes, hold on a second. So his kid was like, you know, five feet behind him. So I realized, you know, he's probably gonna put his kid away or whatever. So he closed the door, and I'm waiting. He comes back out. He goes, hey, you want to come in? I said, no, no, I'll pass on that. We can talk out here, you know, because I don't know what his plans are. So we walk out of his driveway, and now we're standing there, and he looks at me and says, I don't pay bookmakers. I said, well, it's funny. Two weeks ago, when you set up the account, you sure seem to act like you do. And so you just completely just took a shot to me. And he's like, yeah. I said, okay. He goes, there's a way we can fix this, though. And I said, how's that? He said, you can give me accounts with other bookies, and I'll do the same thing and I'll pay you back. I said, are you out of your mind? Like, what's wrong with you? And then in this process, I see, like, a bulge in his pants. I looked down, I said, what's that for? He pulls it out, and literally, you could see he's, like, shaking as he's holding it. So that made me a little Bit I was already my pants because I have a gun point at me. But of course I'm not going to show that, right? So I just told him, I said, you better shoot me the because you're either going to pay this or we're gonna have a big problem. And so as he's shaking I could, I could see in my mind, of course I don't know what he's thinking but I could feel that he was really nervous. So I said put the gun down. So he puts the gun back in his, his pants. And I said, look it, I'm going to give you an option. You have a 15 year old boy in there. I'm going to go home, I'm going to let you sleep on this because this is really, really bad decision you're making here. You have an opportunity to wire me the money tomorrow. If you don't, it won't be me coming back here. It's going to be somebody else and they're not going to be so nice. So you make that decision, I'll leave it up to you. He's like, is that a threat? I said, no, I'm just, just telling you your options. So I drove home the next day. He called me, he said, are you sure you won't just set up an account? I said, I'm not doing that. He said, well, how about we settle? I said, I'm not settling. You just took 88 grand for me. He said all right, I'll pay you the 88 grand. I said, fine, just pay that and we'll be done. So you wired the 88,000. So there was a zero dollar exchange net. But that was probably the dumbest decision I made or one of them because at the end of the day is 88 grand really where worth risking my life? But I had no idea that was going to happen. But I also don't want to be known as a guy when I was in the business as a guy who was like, you can just take a shot and it's no big deal. You have to have some presence, right? And for me I was known, they called me Tattoo Matt. I was just known as a guy that's not going to take some. I'm not saying I'm the baddest around, but yeah, I wasn't taking anyone's.
- [50:35]
B
Well, that's why the mob guys got into this because you can't screw those guys over, right?
- [50:38]
A
100% they're collecting. Those days are kind of over, as you know, because cameras are on every corner and right they just can't, you can't get away with what they were getting away with. But you're right, that presence left, especially in California, it really wasn't really here ever, really. It was all back east.
- [50:53]
B
But Vegas had a little run with it.
- [50:55]
A
They did. You're right. Especially when the casinos were run by the mob, right?
- [50:58]
B
Yeah.
- [50:59]
A
And even for a little while, it's still kind of hung in there.
- [51:01]
B
But now because of DraftKings and FanDuel, there's really no point, right?
- [51:06]
A
No.
- [51:06]
B
Unless you're betting huge amounts.
- [51:07]
A
Even then they, they'll take big amounts, but they'll cut you off, too. You start winning. I mean, they're, they're, they'll cut you quick. Yeah, they're, they're just like a casino. And I get it because I, I, I can't sit here and make fun of them when I was doing the same thing if I had. Yeah, of course. It's a business. Right. So as much as I about it, and I want to say that that's, it's not. They're running a business.
- [51:29]
B
Who was the best sports better you ever met? Like, he just couldn't lose.
- [51:32]
A
I never met Billy Walters personally, but I've been told that he bet through my website back in the day through beards. So he's. There's a couple groups that I know called Sharp Groups that were really, really good, but he would be the best that I know of individually. There are guys that are known to be better now, like groups, but they're groups and they all work as a team and they go out and get accounts through bookies throughout the country and they just chip away at people until they cut them off or stiff them. And they're so good, they don't even care. They just beat the crap out of bookies all day long.
- [52:06]
B
Plus, these groups can alter the lines, Right. Because they're betting so much in volume.
- [52:09]
A
They actually, they're the ones moving the lines.
- [52:11]
B
Wow.
- [52:11]
A
And it's not even volume. Believe it or not, they will have volume. But I'll give you an example. The way I worked it out is I became friendly with these guys because I didn't want them attacking my website anymore.
- [52:24]
B
Right.
- [52:24]
A
I got tired of that. So I, I would always pay them. And then I realized that most bookies weren't paying them. They would say, if your action is sharp, we're just not going to pay you. It was a smart deterrent to get, you know, Sharps to go through their website. The problem is you just don't know who's sharp and who's not. And then you also could ruin your reputation by not paying a guy, even though you understand that's the message you put out. You don't want people spreading that rumor. So it's a really fine line. So the moral of the story is, I would have these guys, after they beat the crap out of me for a few weeks, I cut them off and say, look, I'll make you a deal. I'll get you a couple accounts with some other bookies I don't like. You could beat them up all day, and in return for that, you never attack my website again.
- [53:04]
B
Smart.
- [53:04]
A
Just you and I were code. It's all good. And you go make your money, and eventually I'll partner up with you later or whatever, you know, on some other accounts. And that was our agreement I made with most Sharps. And so they. They knew if you're betting with any action sport, they. My agents would give IT accounts out, and the guy would say, sorry, we can't take that account. We're sharp.
- [53:25]
B
What's considered a win percentage for a Sharp? Is it like above 55 or.
- [53:29]
A
It's right around there. You'd be surprised. Like, people that don't understand numbers look at that, and they're like, that's it. But over a period of time and volume, it's a lot.
- [53:38]
B
Wrecks you.
- [53:38]
A
Right.
- [53:39]
B
If they're winning 100k each one.
- [53:41]
A
100. I mean, over time. And the volume they're getting, because they're betting it like, you know, let's say they have. They're betting $2,000 on just a one account, right. But they have 300 accounts across the country. Those are big numbers, you know, per game. And they're betting 20, 30 games in a day. Yeah, it's volume. It's big.
- [53:58]
B
Yeah. That could wreck you.
- [53:59]
A
Yeah.
- [54:00]
B
Sounds like you cared a lot about your reputation while you were doing all this.
- [54:04]
A
It's the only thing you have is a bookmaker. I mean, at the end of the day, if you have a bad reputation, you're. You're toast.
- [54:09]
B
Yeah.
- [54:10]
A
Because, you know, it spreads like wildfire.
- [54:12]
B
Especially these days with social media.
- [54:13]
A
Right?
- [54:13]
B
Yeah.
- [54:14]
A
I mean, they'll blast you on their Facebook or Instagram or whatever, and next thing you know, everyone's talking about you. And then they believe that. Some people believe stuff they hear. Right. So even to this day, the media conversation we had earlier, it's like I have people that have no clue. They don't know me. They don't know nothing about me. But they view me in the media and they see, they believe what they, they read or heard. And it's sad because that isn't who I am per se. I mean, there's parts of it that are true.
- [54:38]
B
Did you know that meat attack was coming or was it kind of?
- [54:40]
A
I did, I did because the government, the FBI leaked it to the world in March.
- [54:48]
B
They leaked it. So they leaked it to the Frost.
- [54:50]
A
Yes. So I got raided in October 5, 2023. I had 29 FBI agents coming down my driveway as I put my 3 year old son in the car.
- [54:58]
B
Did you know that was coming?
- [54:59]
A
I had zero idea. I actually was putting my son in the car. I heard FBI freeze. And I thought it was a joke. I look over and there's eight red dots on me. Jeez. Full tactical gear, battle ram shield, whole nine yards. Like I was literally El Chapo. And so of course I started my pants inside, grab my son. They didn't cuff me because I'm holding a three year old and they pull me to the side and then they say, who's in the house? They're screaming, who's in the house? You know, I said, my wife and a handyman. And they said, and next, you know, those eight guys, you know, they storm, they have like, there's 29 of them there, right? Three women, 26 guys and a dog. So the eight guys and the dog go in and they're going to detain the rest of the house and obviously make sure the perimeter is safe. So next thing you know, I see my handyman come out cuffed and then. Poor handyman, yeah, all he's doing is painting and. And then my wife crying. One of the hardest moments of my life because I'm just looking at her bawling and knowing that our life has just changed drastically. And then putting her through that, you know, all the emotion of like, you know, being unsafe and not being able to protect her. And now I'm holding my son. Of course they separate us, right? I can't even talk to her. The women are over there talking to her. That's why they bring the women, because they're going to frisk her and all that stuff. And so it's very traumatic. And they make you feel like you are just a hard criminal, which technically I was a criminal, right? I did commit a crime, but that's the part that's still up for debate with a lot of people. Right? You know, but back to the raid. I mean, eight hours later, they took every dollar to my house. They took 30 plus purses of Chanel, Louis Vuitton. They took all of my watches, all the bright links and Rolexes and gold coins, all the casino chips I had and all the cash.
- [56:41]
B
Geez, they. Did they ever release how much money that was?
- [56:44]
A
Yeah, it was 270,000 cash, some gold coins. It was only like 20 something thousand in chips. And then the purses value and the watches were pretty high of course, is high end stuff. I estimate everything roughly around a million dollars. But you know, to be honest with you, I got off a plane two days earlier from Resorts World, flew me and all my friends to the Dallas Cowboys game. Yeah. And then I flew back to Resorts World. I was there for the week and then I flew home. And then when I got home, I paid all my customers. So all the cash that I had because I ended up winning a million for that trip, all the cash I had, I. I paid everybody out. So thank God.
- [57:21]
B
Oh thank God.
- [57:22]
A
Because otherwise I would have had all this outstanding debt to people in the streets, you know. So the one they, whatever I had left in my home wasn't what I had two days prior. Yeah, so that was.
- [57:32]
B
Yeah, because you might not ever get that back. My friend James o' Keefe had stuffed seats like five years ago, right. He never got it back. His phone.
- [57:39]
A
Yeah, my phone. I actually I just got my watches, my wife's purses and stuff because I'm paying the federal government, I'm paying my restitution. So they gave us those items back. But you're correct, all the cash, the chips and all that toast. Damn, it's gone.
- [57:54]
B
That is nice.
- [57:54]
A
They even said you're not getting it back.
- [57:56]
B
Wow.
- [57:56]
A
Yeah. Yeah. If they deem it Ill gotten gains.
- [57:59]
B
Then you got no crazy 29 of them. Wow. Is it because the dollar amount was so high that they just.
- [58:04]
A
You know what, it's funny you say that. I wondered the same thing. I was rated 2014 by the FBI. Really? There was 14 agents.
- [58:11]
B
Oh yeah.
- [58:11]
A
So I was already rated once. This was a much different experience in 2014. They released me. Back to the wild I call it. And they took the cash, every dollar in my house again. And I signed a abandonment form. And what that form stated, I have a copy of my phone, it stated that as long as I don't hire an attorney and I don't go after the money, they won't arrest me. So it was a, to me it was a get out of jail free card. Because here I have 14, you know, know Homeland Security in my home and they're not arresting me. They told me that what I was doing was illegal, but sign this form, give up the money, and we'll go. I was like, okay. I mean, I was scared. It was my first time. I didn't know what's going on. This time it was 29, and it was just a different feel. It was very like. I felt like I literally was Al Capone.
- [58:59]
B
Yeah.
- [58:59]
A
Which is funny because I'm. I'm just a bookmaker in California.
- [59:02]
B
Well, I think this time there were some famous people involved, and they had. They wanted to make an example, probably. Right. Whenever there's a celebrity involved, I feel like that's what their mindset is.
- [59:10]
A
That too. And the. Really, the. The key to the ingredient here was the casinos, which right now, as we speak, they're. They're in a big argument and a big settlement between Resorts World and the United States government.
- [59:22]
B
Oh, really?
- [59:22]
A
You are going to see, Sean, in my opinion, the biggest find in the history of Nevada and the next 30 to 40.
- [59:28]
B
Holy crap.
- [59:29]
A
By far.
- [59:30]
B
So they got in big trouble.
- [59:31]
A
Yeah. So that's. This is the part that a lot of people don't really know the details on that I'm giving you that. You'll see. I mean, by the time it comes out, it will be the biggest fine in the history of Nevada. That's my belief. And I. I say that because the wind just had. The biggest one was 130 million.
- [59:47]
B
So this happened to the win earlier.
- [59:49]
A
Too, 10 years ago, but it just settled. Oh, eight months ago. This one, though, is not going to take 10 years.
- [59:58]
B
Timmy, quicker.
- [59:58]
A
You can't prosecute me. I can't. Well, I've already pled guilty, but they can't sentence me until the settlement is done.
- [60:04]
B
Oh, wow.
- [60:05]
A
Yeah.
- [60:06]
B
So they want to expedite that. So they sent it to you quicker.
- [60:08]
A
Yeah, I want them to.
- [60:10]
B
Yeah.
- [60:10]
A
Because otherwise I sit in this limbo, which it's already been almost 17 months.
- [60:14]
B
Of not making money, which for you.
- [60:15]
A
Is not only not making money. Don't know if you're going to prison. Don't know what's going to happen next. Don't know anything, really. You're just sitting here like a dead duck. You get. I'm getting no credit for time. I mean, I'm not in prison, but I feel like I am because, you know, the unknown is almost worse than the known. Right.
- [60:32]
B
I agree.
- [60:32]
A
So sitting here today and just, like, not knowing your fate is probably the most difficult part.
- [60:38]
B
Well, April 4th is a big day for you, man. I hope things go well.
- [60:42]
A
Thank you, man.
- [60:42]
B
Where can people find you in the meantime, Matthew?
- [60:45]
A
Bore5 is my Instagram. I'm pretty much on all social media channels. YouTube, Tik Tok. But you know, my book will be coming out recalibrate right after sentencing. I highly recommend it.
- [60:57]
B
It's a great book. Perfect. Check them out guys. And I'll see you next time.