Michael Macdonald: Why Most Entrepreneurs Fail Before They Even Start | DSH #1679

Summary

Digital Social Hour: Michael Macdonald – Why Most Entrepreneurs Fail Before They Even Start | DSH #1679

Host: Sean Kelly
Guest: Michael Macdonald (Co-Founder of Earn Your Leisure)
Date: December 12, 2025

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Episode Overview

This episode features an in-depth, high-energy conversation between Sean Kelly and Michael Macdonald, co-founder of the acclaimed platform and event Earn Your Leisure. The central theme is why most entrepreneurs fail before they even start, drawing from Michael’s personal journey, business methodology, and his philosophy of legacy, leadership, and community. The dialogue dives deep into the realities behind successful entrepreneurship, the importance of mindset and foundation, the strategic use of platforms, the evolving event and podcast space, and the personal sacrifices behind notable success stories.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Vision, Manifestation, and Tangibility of Goals

• Manifesting Success: Both Michael and Sean agree on the power of writing down and verbalizing goals as a method of manifestation.
  • Michael: “It’s not real unless you write it down. All my goals, I write down...now I have something tangible that I can look at every single day until I complete that mission.” (00:13, 04:13)
• Practical Manifestation: Acting on goals means translating vision into actionable, visible steps.

2. The Power of Community and Staying Grounded

• Family & Loyalty: Michael emphasizes bringing his family and childhood friends into his journey and business.
  • “The only way, the people that you grew up with, your family, your friends. Gotta stay true to who you are.” (00:47)
• Leadership Philosophy: True leadership is inspiring others to believe in themselves, not just in the leader.
  • “A true leader will get people to believe that they could be a part of the vision...I have to get them to believe in themselves.” (16:15)
• Friendship & Business: Business can expose real friendships, and putting friends in the right roles is pivotal.
  • “Your friendship—the business is going to expose that friendship.” (18:13)

3. Building Earn Your Leisure – The Event & Content Game

• Evolution of Invest Fest: Earn Your Leisure’s event grew to 25,000 attendees with minimal ad spend, focusing on organic growth and serving the community.
  • “We probably spent $9,000 on ads. That’s it...the way we do business is different and that’s why we’ve been able to be so successful.” (07:08)
• Being Hands-On: Unlike large brands, Michael and his partners are intimately involved in all operations, optimizing costs and steering impact.
• Financial Literacy as a Core: EYL and Invest Fest challenge the status quo, making financial education mainstream within their community.

4. Longevity over Trends & Sustainability in Content

• Against ‘Momentary’ Models: Michael critiques the trendy “challenge” model in business, preferring the grind of regular, value-driven engagement.
  • “...we have a live show every single week, right. We’re building moments, right. We’re building momentum...it’s an everlasting moment.” (07:23)
• Consistency is King: Sean and Michael both stress that most people quit when results don’t materialize quickly, leading to high failure rates in podcasts and business.

5. Metrics, Ownership, and Data

• Understanding the Game: They break down what makes a podcast #1 (active subscriber growth, not just listens).
  • “People just think it’s the listeners…no, it’s the podcast that get the most subscribers from Wednesday to Tuesday. Simple as that.” (10:35)
• Owning the Platform & Data: Real power lies in owning your own brand/platform and direct data access, reducing risk of getting ‘canceled’ or de-platformed.

6. Risk, Sacrifice, and the Dark Side of Entrepreneurship

• Personal Sacrifice: Both admit to losing sleep, friends, relationships, and even health to grow their businesses.
  • “Success comes with sacrifice. And it might be sacrifice friendships because I don’t spend enough time with you...I’m 80% of my vision and 20% of anything else.” (20:24)
• Foundations Matter: Many entrepreneurs fail from the outset by building on a flawed foundation or business model.

7. Money, Motivation, and Generational Wealth

• More Than Money: Michael distinguishes chasing fulfillment and legacy over pure financial motivation.
  • “Money is their motive. I already have money. It’s fulfillment for me now. It’s my legacy.” (41:57)
• Generational Responsibility: The conversation challenges the notion of what’s truly “life-changing” wealth, emphasizing long-term impact and preparing the next generation.

8. Using Adversity and Mindset for Advantage

• Adaptation and Perspective: Stories of losing and regaining wealth, leveraging adversity for growth, and the power of perspective.
  • “You said that like that was a bad thing. Most people…never had $30,000 in their life. It’s all perspective, right?” (38:58)

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Memorable Quotes & Moments (with Timestamps)

• On Manifestation:
  • Michael: “It’s not real unless you write it down...when I say it and then I write it down, I could see it. It’s something real.” (00:13, 04:13)
• On Leadership:
  • Michael: “A leader, they think that you got to get people to believe in your vision. Right? But a true leader will get people to believe that you could be a part of the vision, and that’s a real leader.” (16:15)
  • “My job is to get him to believe in himself.” (15:05)
• On Entrepreneurship Sacrifice:
  • Michael: “Success comes with sacrifice...I sacrificed a lot. That’s what comes with success.” (20:24)
  • Sean: “That’s the dark side of entrepreneurship that…I guess isn’t sexy to talk about.” (22:20)
• On Motivation Shifting:
  • Michael: “Money is their motive. I already have money. It’s fulfillment for me now. It’s my legacy…I’m doing this because it’s a passion of mine now.” (41:57)
• On Consistency:
  • Sean: “The show makes about 150 grand a month and I don’t run any ads. It’s all the platform I built.” (08:21)
• On Failure Rates in Podcasting:
  • Michael: “A lot of people do. That’s why when people say the podcast space is oversaturated, it’s not. Because…It’s gonna be a lot of podcasts that come and go…” (09:15)
• On Perspective:
  • Michael: “You said that like that was a bad thing. Most people…never had 30,000 in their life.” (38:58)
• On “Word Vomit” & AI:
  • Michael: “We came up with something called word vomit…record all your thoughts…take the transcript and tell ChatGPT to organize these thoughts and put them in a way that is understandable and digestible.” (43:40)
• On Content Creation:
  • “How can you make the right content if you’re not the content? You have to become the content to make the right content.” (30:27)
• On Dreaming Big:
  • Michael: “Don’t dream too small. I love that my dreams were too small there.” (51:14)
• On Building Your Own Stage:
  • “How do I get on a stage? Build your own. Simple. Build your own.” (53:29)

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Notable and Practical Takeaways

• Write Goals, Say Them Out Loud, Make Them Tangible:
  Manifestation is action, not just wishful thinking.
• True leaders empower others:
  The real legacy is getting others to believe in and realize their potential.
• Organic Growth > Trend Chasing:
  Consistency and authenticity attract stronger, loyal communities.
• Foundation First:
  Build solid business models and systems; most failures happen due to weak foundations.
• Own Your Platform:
  Control your data and brand to reduce risk and increase value — “You can’t cancel someone who owns themselves.”
• Sacrifice is Unavoidable:
  There is personal and financial sacrifice behind every meaningful entrepreneurial journey.
• Perspective Makes the Difference:
  Success and setbacks are both relative — leverage adversity for lessons.
• Content Success Requires Authenticity and Strategy:
  “Become the content” and use data/AI (like ChatGPT) to amplify and organize creative output (“word vomit”).
• It’s a Marathon, Not a Sprint:
  Real wealth and impactful businesses are built for longevity, not momentary trends.

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Important Segments & Timestamps

• [00:00–04:39] — Manifesting success; writing down goals; introduction to Michael and EYL
• [05:01–08:44] — The rise of Earn Your Leisure, building businesses with community, and the event model
• [10:14–12:57] — Understanding podcast success metrics; why so many fail; true ownership
• [14:03–17:44] — Staying grounded, family/friendship in business, authentic leadership
• [18:13–22:31] — Friendship vs. business, losing relationships, and the honest cost of pursuing vision
• [23:39–26:40] — Event space struggles, why popular businesses fail, emotion vs. logic in business choices
• [27:29–36:17] — Platform ownership, canceled culture, building from humble beginnings, generational wealth
• [41:57–46:09] — Fulfillment vs. financial motivation, leveraging ‘word vomit’ and AI for organizing ideas
• [48:27–53:00] — Memorable branding/hooking, dreaming bigger, and mastering the stage

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Episode Finale: Special Offer

Giveaway: Michael offers his "Business Engine" course (normally $1,000) for free to DS Hour listeners.

• How to get it:
  • Follow Michael on Instagram (@michaeljmacdonald)
  • DM him the word “Sean”
• Offer includes: Four pillars of building a successful business (systems, business model, marketing, sales)

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Closing Thought

This episode is a masterclass in real entrepreneurship: mindset, community, resilience, and authenticity are the foundation for not just starting—but surviving and thriving. Both Michael and Sean bring hard-earned wisdom, honest takes, and actionable strategies for anyone looking to launch or level up their own journey.

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To Connect:
Michael Macdonald: @michaeljmacdonald

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“Don’t dream too small.” — Michael Macdonald (51:14)

Transcript

[A]

Believe in yourself. What you want to do. You have to envision it. You have to write it down, and you have to say it out loud. If you do it enough and believe in it enough, you can be on investor, state, manifestation.

[B]

Right?

[A]

Yep. It's very important.

[B]

I'm huge on that self. Talk positively by yourself.

[A]

Yeah. Everything I do, like I always say, it's not real unless you write it down. All my goals, I write down. So if I say it, I'm going to do it. It's cool. But it's not tangible. I can't touch it, I can't see it. But when I say it and then I write it down, I could see it. It's something real. Now I have something tangible that I can look at every single day until I complete that mission.

[B]

Okay, guys, we got Michael Jay McDonald here, co founder of Earn your Leisure. Brought the squad today, man.

[A]

Yo, you know, you gotta. You gotta try with your family, you know?

[B]

Yeah. I've never seen someone roll the feet. You got some good people around you, huh?

[A]

The only way, the people that you grew up with, your family, your friends. Gotta stay true to who you are.

[B]

You always travel that way?

[A]

Most of the time.

[B]

I like that, man. Yeah. I'm a solo traveler. But it's. It's cool to see you got a group of guys around you like this.

[A]

Well, I grew up, you know, I have a big family. I got five kids or five siblings, so four siblings, so I was used to being around a lot of people.

[B]

You in town for the fight tomorrow?

[A]

I'm very excited. I can't wait to. I can't wait to go.

[B]

Who you got winning? You putting some money on it?

[A]

Crawford all the way.

[B]

All the way.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Canelo's favorite, though, right?

[A]

I don't know, but Crawford. Crawford's gonna kill. He's gonna demolish him.

[B]

Okay. Have you interviewed him before?

[A]

We have.

[B]

I still hope.

[A]

I want to hear he's cool. We've interviewed him. And then right after the interview, we had a. It's called Dyckman basketball. And Dykman, right after the interview, he came with us to Dyckman to watch the. Watch our team.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

Play.

[B]

Wait, so you got a team, too?

[A]

Yeah, we got a team in Dyckman. You ever heard of Dyckman League? No. It's a major street ball league in New York City.

[B]

Oh, shit. They play, like, Rucker park and stuff.

[A]

Well, Rucker is not. It doesn't exist, but that kind of took the. The. The. The. You know, the realm of the street ball.

[B]

So you're a Hooper too?

[A]

No, I'm not. I mean, I'm not Hooper, but we own a team. Earning Leisure owns a team in the league.

[B]

Nice. Congrats on Invest Fest, man. You guys.

[A]

Oh, man, we killed it. It was the best year ever.

[B]

I couldn't believe some of those photos. That might have been the biggest business turnout for an event. I've seen 25,000 people.

[A]

Well, when you say it was a business, it was the biggest impact that we've ever had. Because the one thing about business and doing anything right, you have to learn from experience. Right? So we have four years to learn the correct way to do the event at the highest capacity. And what we noticed, year after year, we added things, we took away things. And our fifth year was the fruits of our labor. Like, it was the lessons we learned. It showed 99 success rate where people just enjoyed the event. It was. It was truly amazing.

[B]

And you, you got up on stage, right? First time in a while.

[A]

First time got on stage? Well, first time I got on stage and spoke, so, you know, I got on stage, it was. It was a. It was a memorable moment because, like, I was nervous, I was scared. I was praying with my wife, praying with my family, but I was just. It was just. It was scary. Right. And then the moment that I stepped on that stage, everything changed. It's like I got. I had a high that I couldn't even explain. It was like I felt it and I just. It was the most fulfilled moment, like one of the most fulfilled moments that I felt. And it showed me that that's my call and that was my purpose, to be on that stage.

[B]

Wow. Yeah. To start on a stage like that is pretty insane. 25,000 people.

[A]

Yeah, it was. And the crazy thing is I didn't even see anybody. I didn't see anybody or hear anything.

[B]

The lights were so bright.

[A]

No, I just. It was just. I was in a high. I was in a zone.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

It was just. It was. It was just God just guiding me through. It was just. It was just amazing.

[B]

And what was the core message you were trying to get across?

[A]

Believe in yourself, right? What you want to do, you have to envision it. You have to write it down and you have to say it out loud. And if you do it enough and believe in it enough, you can be on investor stage.

[B]

Manifestation, right?

[A]

Yep. It's very important.

[B]

I'm huge on that self talk. Talk positively about yourself.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. I mean, I mean, everything I do, like I always say, it's not real unless you write it down. Right. And all my goals, I write down. Right. So if. If I say it, I'm gonna do it. It's cool. But it's not tangible. I can't touch it. I can't. I can't see it. But when I say it and then I write it down, I could see it. It's something real.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And now I have something tangible that I can look at every single day until I complete that mission.

[B]

Yeah. That handwriting is important. That's why I handwrite on every episode, because I learn something from each guest. People ask me why I'm writing during episodes.

[A]

That's dope.

[B]

Yeah. I'm writing this down, and then I'm typing it when I get home.

[A]

Oh, that's nice. Yeah. You want you to send me it?

[B]

I might.

[A]

All right.

[B]

What you've built is really impressive. I want to give you your flowers, earn your leisure is one of a kind. I mean, how old is the company now?

[A]

2019. So January 19, 2019, we started that was the first episode.

[B]

Feels like you guys have been around longer, honestly.

[A]

I mean, because. Because we're in it. We don't realize the amount of impact that we've been. That we've done so thus far. But I will say. I mean, sometimes I do stop and think, like, how is this possible? How do. How do we have one of the big. The. The biggest financial. A literacy event, the biggest financial literacy podcast, you know, the biggest educational community, Right? Like we've been building. Like everything we've been building has. Has had a tremendous impact for our community, and we've changed the landscape of how people do business from our culture. Right now you see a lot of people starting investment. Investment shows. Now you see a lot of people starting communities. You know, the event space, that's a hard space to conquer. You know, I mean, look at Coach. Not Coachella. Clickfunnels.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I think they canceled their event.

[B]

10X canceled.

[A]

10X canceled. All these events are canceled. You know why? Because they don't make money.

[B]

They're not profitable.

[A]

They're not profitable. How do we make them profitable? Because we listen to our people. We don't. We understand the bottom line, and we're in. We don't have just a lot of these big corporations. What they do is they hire a bunch of people to handle the business. Meanwhile, the co founders. You got me, Troy, Rashad, Matt, we're in the business. We're on calls every single week. I'm handling a bunch of different tasks. Troy's handling a bunch of different tasks. You know, we're in the business. Right. And that definitely cuts down costs. Understanding, you know, why are we paying $10 for this paper when we can get it for $3? We understand costs, right. So we're really inside the business. Unlike a lot of these big corporations where they're just paying people and they don. Understand the numbers. And then it's spending millions and millions of dollars on ads. It takes away. We probably spent $9,000 on ads. That's it. That's it.

[B]

Holy crap. That's impressive.

[A]

Organic. Yeah.

[B]

Because you built the platform.

[A]

So there's another. The way we do business is different and that's why we've been able to be so successful. A lot of people, they, and I'm not against what they do because it does work in, in some type of capacity.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But when you build, so. So say people that do challenges, right? Which again, a lot of my friends do it. They do challenges. But it's, it's a moment. It's a trend, right? So you got these people that have these challenges that it's a trend for, for, for a small period of time. They do like a five day challenge, right. And then they don't do a challenge for months. Months on. Right. Where on your leisure. We have a live show every single week, right. We're building moments, right. We're building momentum, right? So we have that moment and it's a last over and over and over. It's an everlasting moment, right? So when we want to promote something, we build up that moment at that time, but we have your attention every single week.

[B]

That makes sense. Yeah. You guys are, you're consistent, you're.

[A]

No one's doing that. No one's understanding how valuable your platform is, right? So we built a platform that we don't need to go Facebook ads, millions of dollars. Does that make sense?

[B]

No. It does. I'm in the same boat. The show makes about 150 grand a month and I don't run any ads. It's all the platform I built.

[A]

It's important.

[B]

And I was losing a ton of money at first, but I saw the long term vision of like, let me build this audience, let me invest in studio equipment and all this stuff.

[A]

Let me ask you this. What is the number one, the number one revenue profit coming from the show?

[B]

It's paid guests.

[A]

Paid guests?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

People paying to come on. And then it's sponsors and then events. I have events too.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

So I could fill up a room in any major city 500 people, no ads.

[A]

That's dope.

[B]

You know, because.

[A]

Yeah, because of the, because your platform. You're doing the business the right way.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And I don't understand. We've been doing this and we've been explaining to people every single day, but. Well, you want to build something for the moment or you want to build something for a lifetime?

[B]

I'm with you. I'm 100% with you. But I'm not going to lie, it was hard. Like, I almost called it quits a few times.

[A]

A lot of people do. That's why when people say the podcast space is oversaturated, it's not. You know why? Because they're gonna, it's gonna be a lot of podcasts that come and go, come and go. You know, and if you look at Joe, Fat Joe. Joe. What is it called? Joe and Jada.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

That's a brand new podcast. Right. And now obviously some people say, like, they're celebrities, that's why. But they're the number one podcast in that space.

[B]

Now, just because you're celebr doesn't mean you can have a good show too.

[A]

Correct. It's a lot of celebrities that fail.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Right. How is the, how is the podcast space oversaturated when they just came three months ago and they took the number one spot in their, in their, in their industry, in their genre?

[B]

Yeah, I don't like that excuse because any industry, when you look at the failure rates, it's going to be high. Podcast is no exception to that. And I started pretty late too. I started two years ago. So I never use that as a.

[A]

And I just seen you, one of your posts, you was like, what, like number one or something? Number one in your space.

[B]

We've hit number one in education. Right now we're number four. We're anywhere from two to five.

[A]

Congratulations.

[B]

Thank you.

[A]

That's hard to do. And a lot of people don't understand. See, and that's another thing. We understand the, the, the, the, the logic behind, like, how do you know how you get number one? Do you know what, what's the metrics becoming number one?

[B]

You need downloads and follows on Apple.

[A]

It goes by subscribers. Right. And it's from Tuesday. It's from Tuesday to Tuesday. People don't know that.

[B]

Right.

[A]

So people just think it's the listeners. Right. I'm getting all these listeners and I'm gonna get number one. No, it's the, it's the, the podcast that get the most subscribers from Wednesday to Tuesday. Simple as that.

[B]

Interesting.

[A]

And, and that's why it's hard for the top shows to stay on the top. So when you have like, who's the.

[B]

Number one guy on Apple or on.

[A]

I'm talking about Apple, I think it's.

[B]

Right now it's Charlie Kirk show because he just passed away. But it's usually like crime junkie or some true crime.

[A]

I'm talking about the guy who got, you know, original guy. He's Rogan Rogan. He's doing some amazing stuff because he stays on them top charts because he's. He's getting a new. He's getting a such a massive following every single week that he's able to stay on the top. And that's how you. That's how you see some new shows get on the top really fast.

[B]

Right.

[A]

Because they're getting all those subscribers really fast. So people don't understand the metrics behind what they're doing. They're just doing it because it's cool.

[B]

You gotta, you gotta know your numbers, man. I look at my Instagram analytics every day, seeing what videos are popping off, what, what topics are trending. You know what I mean?

[A]

And it's important.

[B]

Yeah. It's free information. Why not take advantage of data?

[A]

And that's one thing we do. We focus on our data. The fact that we're able to understand our data, we can make adjustments on the fly.

[B]

Yep.

[A]

And the fact that we own our data and we own our platforms, we can do what we want. And that's important too. You know, like a lot of people are even on platforms that they don't even own. Right. But they're the face of it.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So they can't do what they want.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So that kind of stuff, that's like putting handcuffs on you.

[B]

Yeah. So this was the fourth event you guys just had.

[A]

It's the fifth year.

[B]

Fifth year.

[A]

Fifth year. But we've done one year. We did it in Europe.

[B]

Got it. Okay. And when did it become profitable? Was it from the first one or was it.

[A]

It's never not been profitable. Wow. Yeah. So our first year, we put up 1.3 million out of our pocket. And we had six weeks. We had six weeks in the middle of COVID to do it. And we, we took a chance and we got 4,000 people, but again, with no ads, just, you know, minimal cost.

[B]

Yeah, that's impressive.

[A]

We got a great deal that year because it was Covid, so the place wasn't being booked, so we took advantage of that. So we got a great, A great deal on everything av. The venue, everything. So we were able to, you know, come up. We made our 1.1.3 back. That's awesome.

[B]

That's. People don't know how hard that is, by the way.

[A]

And we, We've. We didn't. We've never had a major sponsor. That's crazy today.

[B]

That's how.

[A]

No sponsors.

[B]

The first year sponsors. Most events rely on those.

[A]

Yeah. And we just rely on ourselves.

[B]

You don't have any sponsors still?

[A]

No, no, no. We have sponsors, but no major sponsors. Like, we'll have, like, our biggest sponsor, like, this year was probably Fidelity Q.

[B]

That's pretty big.

[A]

Yeah. They didn't come in. They didn't come in. We didn't have a headline sponsor. Okay. You know, and a lot of these events, especially, like, white events, they get, you know, they get all these major sponsors and title sponsors, like, it's nothing. Where we got over 50 million people in three impressions. Right? Over three days. 50 million impressions and 25,000 people, 75,000 people over three, three days. And we can't. We. It's. It's difficult. They tell us we have to prove ourselves, man. All right, we'll keep. We'll keep doing what we're doing.

[B]

Wow. So you still got a chip on your shoulder.

[A]

I mean, I, I was, I was raised in the projects, Right. So, you know, in a single family home, so I've always had a chip on my shoulder. I always knew. I always started from behind, so I always knew that, you know, I gotta be better than the next person.

[B]

Yeah, that's. That's what got you to where you're at, though, right?

[A]

It's my makeup. That's why my family's here. You know, I'm a. It's a close knit. It's a close knit family. A close knit community. Almost everybody here is from Greenberg.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

You know, so. So, so we. We stay true to. We stay true to our fabric.

[B]

Yeah. Community is super important to me, too.

[A]

It's. It's. It's all we got is our people.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I mean, and a lot of people, they get to the level of success, they get the fame, they get the money, and they forget where they come from.

[B]

Yeah. Were you kind of aware of that as you kept leveling up? Like, let me kind of stay grounded.

[A]

Well, you know, I'm. I'm cut from a different cloth. I'm a different type of person. My, My mother raised me, like, a lot of. A lot of. Even my brother's friends. I'm not going to say my friends, but I know My brother's friends, they kind of envied the relationship that we had with my brothers, right? And me thinking, I'm like, that's normal, right? Like, why wouldn't you be your best friends? I'm raising two boys. I'm like, they better be their best. Each other's best friend, right? So we've been very close, but that just extended to my. My friends. Like, I have friends that I've known since I was three months old. Geez. You know what I'm saying? And we're still friends. We talk every single day. So a lot. A lot of people just, you know, it's a lot of fakeness going on.

[B]

Yeah. I think people leave behind their. Their friends sometimes. I don't know if it's, like, intentional. They're just trying to, like, expand, you know?

[A]

Well, the thing. This is the thing, right? I'm Get a little personal, right? Like a leader, right? See, they mix it up, right? This is what I think. A leader. They think that you got to get people to believe in your vision. Right? But a true leader will get people to believe that you could be a part of the vision, and that's a real leader. And like my brother, right, Vincent, I think he believes in me a lot. He believes in me, but my job is to get him to believe in himself that he can do this. He can. He can get everything that he deserves. Right? That's my job. Even my other brother, Richard, like, he. I got it. I got to get him to believe, like, he's somebody that. I don't want to get too personal, but he's somebody. He's been through a lot, Right. He's like the. He's always fought for all of us. He's did, you know, but, you know, I got to get him to believe that he could do what he. He does. Right. He's great at what he does.

[B]

Yeah. You bring the best out of people.

[A]

That's my job. That's a true leader. Not to get people to believe in me. Right? Because I got to believe in myself, and my actions is going to dictate everyone else's actions, but I have to get them to believe in themselves that they can do it. And that's the problem with bringing people with you. They say they don't got it, but you're putting people in the wrong positions anyway. So how could they have something if they're in the. And you're setting them up for failure, and then when they fail, you just let you leave them behind.

[B]

Right.

[A]

Unfortunate.

[B]

So you're basically saying you didn't give them the right opportunity.

[A]

Well, a lot of people don't, but, like Rich. Right. For instance, Richard, my brother Richard, I learned Photoshop on his computer when I was 14, so he's been doing this longer than me. It's just, I stay with it. Right. I seen it and it became a passion of mine where he. He's a drawer. He's. He had a bunch of different passions, but that, that became my livelihood.

[B]

Yeah, right.

[A]

But I knew he did it. So what do you think he does for earning? Leisure. He does everything that I do, everything that I learned on his computer. Right. I'm putting him in a position to win.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Right. My brother, he's. He has a. He has a bachelor's in marketing. He runs the merch. He did the post office for 20 years. What you think is going to happen when he's in merch? It's all about putting people in the right place.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You know, and, and getting them to believe that they could do it.

[B]

That's really cool you brought all your. Your friends into the business because I hear some people say not to mix friendship in business, but you're like, nah, let me figure it out.

[A]

I got a quote for that, too. I mean, the, the thing is, is that if you. So do you have any of your.

[B]

Friends in your business in this podcast? No, but I've, I've worked with friends in the past.

[A]

What was your experience?

[B]

I've lost friends, to be honest. But now I'm much better mentally. I think if I were to go into business with a friend, we would lay the groundwork first and it wouldn't happen again.

[A]

Well, this is the thing what happens, right. Your friendship, the business is going to expose that friendship. Can you, can you see what I'm saying? Yeah.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So it's like if you had a good friendship, then it's gonna, it's gonna, you know.

[B]

Well, until money gets involved, I think.

[A]

Well, that's the point. That's going to be. So was. Were we really friends or were we not?

[B]

You see people's true colors.

[A]

So that's why it's going to expose the friendship is the fame. Oh, now you're famous. So now you're not. You don't want to be my friend. You don't want to hang out with me. I'm not cool enough with you.

[B]

Right.

[A]

Oh, then we were really not friends. So the business is going to. And the business ultimately outweighs the friendship. Why? Because if, if, if we're doing business together, and you're my friend and you, you know, you holler at one of my girlfriend and my girlfriend. We might not be friends, but we still gonna be business partners. But if you steal from me, we not business partners nor friends. Does that make sense? So the business part, the business relationship become outweighs everything.

[B]

Right.

[A]

Once you get into business. But my main thing is it will show. The business relationship will show how true your friendship is.

[B]

Oh, yeah. You get to know someone.

[A]

Correct.

[B]

Yeah. When you get into business with someone, they say it's like your second marriage, right?

[A]

Yeah. I mean, maybe at first. Yeah. Yeah.

[B]

Did you put business before you're. You're like dating and like women? Like, did you give up that part of your life to pursue business?

[A]

In my, My own story, I had. I was so immersed with my vision of how I seen earning leisure that I lost clients, I lost sleep. Relationship. I mean, I. I was in a. I was in and out of relationships, but because I couldn't give the time that was needed because I was building the foundation. And we know how hard, like a lot of businesses start on the wrong foundation. We've built our foundation so strong that we're able to succeed and excel every single year. Right. And that's even one of the things I teach with the business engine is the foundation. Your. Your business model. What is your model? What is your business model? And a lot of times that they don't even have the right model. They're selling. They're selling products and they're losing money from start.

[B]

Right.

[A]

Right. So we lost. I lost a lot. I sacrificed a lot. Right. And that's what comes with success. Success comes with sacrifice. And it might be sacrifice friendships because I don't spend enough time with you like I'm. Because I'm building my vision. I'm built. I'm. I'm 80% like you said. 80, 20. Right. I'm 80% of my vision and 20% of anything else. That's it. Nothing else matters because I know where I want to be. I have a vision. I see myself where I want to be. I write down where I want to be. That has to. It's tangible. I touched it. Once you see it, you can't unsee it.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And that's what I was able to do. And. And would I say I lost relationships or like in a room.

[B]

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[A]

Probably. But the people that are here, I ain't lose them because they knew what I was building. They seen it. They watched me.

[B]

Yeah, I sacrificed a lot too, man. That's the dark side of entrepreneurship that I guess isn't. Isn't sexy to talk about. But, man, my personal health was shit. My mental health was awful. Lost friendships, relationships, even family.

[A]

Are you in a relationship now?

[B]

Yeah, I'm getting married next month now.

[A]

Oh, congratulations. Well, let me put the ring. I'm gonna put the rings up in there. You know what I'm saying?

[B]

Yeah, that's a business.

[A]

You know that, right?

[B]

Ye. Yeah, she's been my rock. Yeah. Very.

[A]

How long you been with her?

[B]

Eight years.

[A]

Oh, you. Oh, you had us. You had some time. So she's seen everything.

[B]

I was broke when we met.

[A]

Oh, that. Oh, man, she's a keeper.

[B]

Yeah, she's a keeper.

[A]

That's dope, man. Congratulations.

[B]

It's. It's hard to find these days.

[A]

Where you get married?

[B]

We met in Jersey, where we grew up.

[A]

No, I'm saying. I'm saying you get married in Jersey, too.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Oh, like Jersey champs.

[B]

Yeah. Oh, you did your homework on me. You did your homework on me. Yeah, that was my first or second business. First one failed.

[A]

Listen, it didn't fail. It was a lesson.

[B]

It was a lesson.

[A]

It was a lesson. I tried doing those lessons like we did with Vest Fest and applied them to the next business. And the next business was success.

[B]

Yeah. Yeah, man. I tried doing concerts, believe it or not. Tough business.

[A]

Any. Any event space. Like a lot of my. Like a lot of people from. From our culture. We have these businesses where we want to start, like restaurants or Clubs. And it's the hardest and most risky businesses to ever start.

[B]

I'll never do a restaurant again. I invested 50k in one, lost it all.

[A]

Yep. It's normal.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You. You won't be the first and you won't be the last.

[B]

The margins are awful.

[A]

It's like 10. Less than 10.

[B]

And now with tariffs, it's less. Yeah.

[A]

Yeah. So, I mean, it's unfortunate. It's unfortunate that, you know, we don't. We don't apply the. The nest, like the. The information in front of us. The most success, like, even investing the most. The most successful businesses, you know, profitable businesses, we stay away from.

[B]

I put.

[A]

We want the fashion, the fashionable business.

[B]

We want the cool stuff. I put emotion before logic with that one. The food was great and I invested.

[A]

Anytime you put emotion to any decision, it's 99. Gonna be a bad decision.

[B]

Yup.

[A]

It's just the truth of every single time in anything in your life. Emotion. Putting emotion into. You have to be emotionless when you make decisions.

[B]

Damn. You think so?

[A]

100%. Wow. No emotion involved when you make a decision.

[B]

That's an interesting take. I do think emotions are important. I don't want to discount them, but it depends on.

[A]

It depends on what we're talking about. But when you're making a decision, you should never make a decision. And this is no. No thing on women. But why hasn't it been a women president?

[B]

They've tried.

[A]

Because more women are more emotional than men. Right. Statistically, yeah.

[B]

That's not debatable.

[A]

Yeah. So you can't have someone in emotional. Like, imagine Kanye west is the president.

[B]

He ran, he had.

[A]

He can't. He can't control his motions. Right. He. He might make an emotional decision and it could destroy the world.

[B]

Right.

[A]

I mean, we got Trump. He's emotionally unstable.

[B]

Yeah. Can't deny that.

[A]

And you see, you know, madness. He's made some really crazy decisions. Thank God we're still here. But, you know, and not that I'm against Trump or for Trump, you know, but I don't. I do. I don't want to talk about politics. Never talk about politics, religion, or.

[B]

I mean, it's a scary, scary time these days to talk about politics, especially what happened to Charlie. Rest in peace to Charlie Kirk.

[A]

Did you know him?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You interviewed him?

[B]

He's been on the show. I film at all his events. I'm starting to film at conferences and, you know, film content. And his event was the first one I ever filmed out in person.

[A]

Oh, wow.

[B]

Yeah. So he Opened my eyes to a whole new world. And now look how many events are incorporating podcasts.

[A]

Yeah, it's.

[B]

It's crazy.

[A]

I mean, it's the new wave. It's the. It's the new me. It's the new media format that can, you know, even. Like Marcus, right? Marcus Yrogia, he just said he'll rather do a podcast than do. Than do to get on a stage. And this is a man that speaks for a living.

[B]

Holy crap.

[A]

Why does he say that? Because you. You. So this episode is going to live forever. That moment on stage is only going to live for that moment on stage. So you only touching the people in that room.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Right? Yeah. This podcast doesn't just touch the people in this room.

[B]

It's evergreen.

[A]

It touches the world.

[B]

I think both are important. I do in person events. I think stage is still important because something about that.

[A]

This is a stage too. Everything's a stage. I like. That's what I teach. Like, your podcast is a stage. Your webinars are stage. You're being on stage is a stage. Your events are staged. They're all stages. But what's the most valuable stage? I think podcast is the most valuable stage.

[B]

It's hard to beat.

[A]

I'm sorry, you got.

[B]

No, it's hard to be right now. If you just look at the numbers and who's making the money right now, it's podcasters and streamers. Live streamers.

[A]

Streamers are killing it.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Are you gonna start a streaming company?

[B]

I'm gonna start live streaming, yeah.

[A]

Not a company. You hear so much.

[B]

I mean, I know I'm here like six hours.

[A]

I don't know if you guys know, but he lives here. He says he does 8800 episodes a year. If you're in podcasting, you know how hard that is? 8,800 episodes a year.

[B]

Yeah. 15 a week for two years straight. Been super consistent with it.

[A]

That's amazing, man. That. That.

[B]

Thank you.

[A]

I'll give you a clap for that. Yeah.

[B]

You can recognize the. The grind into that.

[A]

I love your studio. Anybody know this is. This is called an LED wall. If anyone doesn't know. And it's not cheap, just to let you know. So he has an LED wall. He has millions of TVs all around. I can see myself on every angle. So just know he. He's got a real situation up in here. All the sponsors. Wow, you gotta. You got a lot of sponsors.

[B]

Means a lot coming from someone like you in the space.

[A]

Nah, this is. This is a really great, great space. And a great, great, you know, gave us water. Great host. Hosting. Yeah. Amazing man.

[B]

How to take care of you guys.

[A]

It's definitely like, I wish people understood, like, see, I don't know how long it took you to get to this level.

[B]

Two and a half years.

[A]

Two and a half years to get to. Well, I'm saying. Did you have your own studio for. Forever.

[B]

I used to rent at the Wynn Hotel. I've been all over. Yeah.

[A]

So that journey, I. I would bet that, that journey that you. That you had to go through to get to this point, it was probably so fulfilling because, you know, we used to run around. We went to Nigeria with equipment. We went to all over the world with equipment. Right. Interviewing people. You know, we used to stay in. Stay in houses for a month so we could interview a bunch of people in that. In that area. It was just those journeys, those memories, that grind. You can't, like, you can't take that back. That's like. That was the. That was when it was fun.

[B]

That's the best part of that, was.

[A]

When it was fun.

[B]

It's the journey, right? Not the destination.

[A]

That's it.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

When I sold my company, I come from the crypto industry. That's how I made my money. It was the most depressed I've ever been.

[A]

Do you. Are you still in the crypto?

[B]

I still have a lot of crypto, yeah.

[A]

You do?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

What's the number one? When you have.

[B]

Right now, it's either a theorem or. Yeah. Ethereum and then Bitcoin and Salon.

[A]

Clem, he's into crypto. He says, solana.

[B]

I have Solana. Yeah, that's.

[A]

That's a good one.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

He told me to put up. Put it all in there.

[B]

Well, right now it's 200 bucks. I got in at 20.

[A]

What?

[B]

Yeah, so I'm up 10x. So I'm chilling. Wow. I mean, it could. Could 5x. We'll see. I hate giving financial advice, but.

[A]

Well, let me. Yeah, me neither. Because, you know, very risky. And you live in Vegas, so you must be risky. Let me ask you this one question on it. So, like, in stocks, you can borrow against your stocks?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Do they have something like that with crypto? Yeah, they do.

[B]

Yeah. I did that when I bought my house.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Yeah, I bought my house in crypto.

[A]

You bought it in crypto?

[B]

Well, you take. It's a crypto loan. So, like, say you have a million in bitcoin, you could borrow a certain percentage of that in cash.

[A]

Oh, wow. For the escrow, I hope you all hearing this? This is good, good advice.

[B]

You never got in the crypto wave, though.

[A]

I mean, I went in and out, dipping out. Yeah, I would only buy bitcoin these days.

[B]

I'm. I'm much more safe. Yeah, I used to mess around with the alts a lot.

[A]

Yeah, I lost. I lost a ton of money, believe me. You know, in 2017, it was just, you know, it was hot. I seen the most money in my account. I was like, I'm. I'm rich. And then I woke up the.

[B]

It doesn't feel real when you see it on your app.

[A]

Well, one thing about investing, and I always like to say this, don't invest money that you can't afford to lose. Once you understand that concept, the game becomes so much easier. And I think a lot of times, even in business, we make it complicated. We make things like, if it's hard, we put it in our mind and it's hard. It's gonna be hard. Like, I could have came on this podcast, right, and said, it's gonna be a tough interview. He's got a big stage, like. But if I go in there, like, you know, I got this. I convinced my mind that it's not. It's not hard. It's easy. This is what this is. You. Like, I have this saying, right? When, you know, I come from the content space, right? And a lot of people get so caught up with making content right, and they're trying to make the right content, but how can you not. How can you make the right content if you're not the content? So you have to become the content to make the right content. You got to be so immersed with the content that it becomes you. You are the content. Does that make sense?

[B]

You got to live and breathe it. Right? People can sense if you're not being authentic these days.

[A]

Correct. You know, and when people. When people can stop worrying about posting every day and post quality over quantity, and it'll get to a point like Ashton hall, he posts high quality content every single day.

[B]

No.

[A]

Right? And I'm not talking about just the visual aspect. I'm talking about the. The context of the content, what's in the content. And we were not a visual based and we still not are the best visual. But context. Educational, inspirational. Educational and inspirational will take you so far. Sometimes we got. Now we got blackout, we got. We got a little entertainment. But we. Our context of our content is so valuable that it outweighs a lot of this effects. Like people worry about putting effects on the things and worrying about having the best cameras. And it doesn't do nothing if the message ain't there.

[B]

You need both. Yeah. I used to film on iPhone eights. My first hundred episodes.

[A]

Shout out. That's us, too.

[B]

That's us, too. Refurbished iPhone 8s.

[A]

That's us.

[B]

Not even new one. Yeah, not even new ones. The whole studio setup was six grand.

[A]

So you got.

[B]

I was renting because I could. I didn't want to, like.

[A]

So you got that Journey. I mean, that was us, our first, like 15, 20 episodes with iPhones.

[B]

That's how you should. I recommend you should start transferring on.

[A]

I don't know if you remember transferring a video from an iPhone. Took days. It took forever.

[B]

It was awful.

[A]

It took forever. But see, no one would understand that.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You know, I'm saying.

[B]

Nah, but why would you put a ton of money if you don't even have the reps yet, you know, because people are so.

[A]

People are like, how. If you follow. If I follow you, I'm only going to go as far as you go. Right, right. If I follow. If I'm following everything you're doing. People see this amazing set, so they think this is what made you you. This isn't what made you you. You were popping when you were doing it without all of this.

[B]

Yeah, right. Yeah. I had to put in the work first.

[A]

You got to put in the work.

[B]

You wouldn't even recognize my first hundred guests. Like, I had to, like, work my way up, you know?

[A]

Those are the best guests. The ones you don't recognize.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Our best episodes are people that you never know.

[B]

Crazy, right?

[A]

Yeah. Because it's like the insight they can. They're more relative to. To the masses.

[B]

They're not scared of, you know, getting canceled, I guess.

[A]

Well, I don't know about that. Well, it might come and hunt you. I mean, you can't. You can't cancel somebody that. That. That owns them. Owns their self, you know?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Like. Like even us. I mean, you can't cancel us.

[B]

They've tried to cancel me.

[A]

How? You own everything, right?

[B]

Pretty much, yeah. I'm 100% owner in the company.

[A]

How can they cancel you?

[B]

Just who I have on. They get mad. You know, I've had on Andrew Tate. I've had on the most controversial people in the world. So I get.

[A]

So you got canceled because you had a guest on.

[B]

Yeah, well, they try to cancel because you.

[A]

Because you. Because you wanted someone else's perspective.

[B]

Yeah. I'm banned on TikTok. I'm shadow banned on a couple of Platforms, it's part of the game.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

You know, but I, I gotta adapt. I can't complain about it.

[A]

That's why you gotta continue to have your own platform, because you can't cancel somebody that has their. Owns it.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You know, it's really important.

[B]

Well, I guess we're somewhat at the mercy with, when it comes to social media platforms, though. You know what I mean?

[A]

Are you.

[B]

I mean, I'm banned.

[A]

I mean, there's, there's platforms now building their own streaming. Streaming. Streaming platforms. It's a lot, it's a lot of ways you can.

[B]

Yeah. Kick now. Shout out to them. A lot of rumble. Shout out to rumble free. Speech.

[A]

Yeah, it's a lot of places now. You don't need to. You don't need. I mean, social media is very good. Facebook is good. LinkedIn is all those. Social media platforms are good. It helps you expand. But, you know, you have the audience now. You have the, the people.

[B]

That's why I do a live event every two months.

[A]

I was just about to say that those events are going to continue to keep you expanding.

[B]

My last one, I had over 2,000 people.

[A]

That's great.

[B]

It was crazy.

[A]

That's amazing.

[B]

Couldn't believe it. I got my first event, dude. Maybe 20, 30 people.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

And now to see 2000, it's just unreal.

[A]

When did you see it? When did you vision?

[B]

When did I vision? Like having big events, it's always been important to me because I'm a huge introvert. I have autism and I was never social growing up. So for me to develop these social skills and then gather people together, like, it was really monumental for my growth.

[A]

Wow. That's amazing.

[B]

Yeah. I was super shy growing up.

[A]

What do you see in the next six months?

[B]

Keep climbing the charts. We're starting to get offers on the company already, but I'm holding off. I think it's still too early. I want to grow this thing another two, three years maybe.

[A]

Magic Johnson said, don't sell early. That was just one of his messages on stage.

[B]

Yeah, I got off for $30 million and it was really tempting, but I turned it down. And I can't believe, like, that's life changing money, you know, for some. For some you're a little past that stage.

[A]

No, I mean, I'm not saying. I'm just saying, I mean, I don't think it's life changing because it'll change maybe your generation, but it won't change the next generation. You know, when I think about life changing, you gotta change. Everybody in my circle. And you gotta change the circle that I create.

[B]

Respect. Yeah, yeah. 30 if you don't invest it wisely. Yeah, you're right. It'll only last one generation. Maybe, maybe two. They say, michael, money cycles every three generations. I believe.

[A]

Something like that.

[B]

Something like that. So. And that doesn't even matter how much you have, by the way. It could be a billion dollars. It's crazy how that works, right? It's all mindset.

[A]

If you mess up a billion dollars, you don't deserve no money.

[B]

It's all mindset, man. Information.

[A]

I mean, you could put a hundred a billion dollars in the market and make $10 million a month.

[B]

Yeah, but think about it. When you have kids, they won't have the same motivation you had. And then when they have kids, it'll be even less.

[A]

Do you have kids?

[B]

Not yet. I want kids.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

But it just something I'm preparing for. Like my. My kids are going to grow up in a pretty. Like a mansion and, you know, I gotta give them some sort of mental hurdles.

[A]

Yeah. And I'm gonna tell you the hardest thing about that is. And this is what I go through because I grew up in the projects and my kids are growing up in a massive mansion.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And they have the life that I couldn't even dream of, you know, when I was their age. Because my proximity to anything, to my real life today was nowhere close. So the fear is now that you put them into that life, you can't take them out of it. It's unfair. So your grind becomes even more harder.

[B]

Wow. Interesting.

[A]

So that's the one thing I will tell you, you have to make aware of. Make aware.

[B]

Yeah. Can't get complacent for sure.

[A]

Because you putting people, your wife, your kids inside this lifestyle, you're not by yourself no more. You can't go back. Like, there's been times I made money, came down, slept on my brother's couch. Came, went up, came down.

[B]

Yep.

[A]

Sold my car, can't do that no more. So you gotta make very, very strategic moves.

[B]

Gotta move smarter. Yeah. I've made and lost all my money twice so far.

[A]

Me too.

[B]

Knock on. Oh, yeah, me too. Knock on wood. I hope it doesn't happen again.

[A]

But hope, leave hope at the door. It won't happen again.

[B]

It won't happen.

[A]

Mindset is important. You got to have the mindset to say it won't happen again.

[B]

Yeah. When I first moved to Vegas, my credit score was awful and I had $30,000 to my name. And my. I was Renting a house and they.

[A]

Were like $30,000 to your name.

[B]

Yeah. Four years ago.

[A]

You know, that's the difference of proximity, right? That's the difference of exposure. You said that like that was a bad thing. Most people. Most people that I've grown up with never had 30,000 in their life.

[B]

Yeah. It's all perspective, right?

[A]

It's very. It's all perspective. And that's the thing that. Know, we don't really understand, but I get you.

[B]

So let me preface that, because I explained that. Kind of entitled, but I had 30, 000 in my name after becoming a millionaire, so I lost a lot already. And then I had 30, 000 when I moved here from LA. My landlord, because my credit was so bad, wanted six months of rent up front. $30,000.

[A]

Your whole 30,000?

[B]

I invested everything when I moved here.

[A]

And I have six months for 30, 000.

[B]

What is that, 4,500amonth?

[A]

Oh, you got some crazy stuff.

[B]

It was a. It was a good house, I'm not gonna lie. So in that six months, I had to figure out how to make it work, dude.

[A]

And what did you do?

[B]

Got into crypto. Made it work. Hustle, grinded. 12 hours. Working every day, seven days a week.

[A]

Were you minding crypto, too?

[B]

I wasn't mining. I wish I was. Some kid in my high school was mining and everyone made fun of him. That guy's probably a billionaire. Yeah, billionaire right now. But how to make it happen, man?

[A]

Leave your computer.

[B]

We are now.

[A]

Yeah, it's working out. It looks like it's worth the digital social hour. It looks like it's working out.

[B]

Yeah. It's been quite a journey talking to the most interesting, the smartest people in the world, learning.

[A]

What was your favorite episode so far?

[B]

Depends which you messed up.

[A]

You're supposed to say me, man.

[B]

You're up there. I like how authentic you are. Andrew Tate's up there.

[A]

He was like, I don't give. I don't care if I'm getting canceled. This is. I'm doing this.

[B]

That one got age restricted.

[A]

Where'd you. What did you do that? Here, right in this chair. Tate sat in this chair. Yeah, I'm on my way.

[B]

I met him at Power Slap. And. And then we filmed the next day.

[A]

When did you do it?

[B]

Six months ago.

[A]

Oh, that was recent. That was after you got out. So. Yeah.

[B]

Played chess with him right after I won.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So he's not as smart as you say.

[B]

He's good at chess. I'm a top I'm top 1% in the world, though, so.

[A]

Really?

[B]

Yeah, I'm top one.

[A]

I bet you 100 grand I could beat you.

[B]

What's your rating?

[A]

I don't know.

[B]

100 grand's a lot of money.

[A]

I bet you 100 grand I could beat you.

[B]

Yeah, but if I don't know your rating, it'd be a silly bet for me.

[A]

What do you mean?

[B]

You could be really good.

[A]

You could be top 1% in the world.

[B]

Yeah. So I know where I'm at.

[A]

That means I only could be 0.9% better than you.

[B]

No, there's a big difference. Okay, so even though I'm top 1%, my rating is 1600.

[A]

1600 in the world?

[B]

No, like the Elo. Okay, it's hard to explain, but, like, the higher the elo, the better you are.

[A]

I'm just messing with you. I probably couldn't beat you.

[B]

You sounded confident, so you made me nervous. But.

[A]

Grant Cardone, that's a mindset shift. I believe in myself so much that I can't lose.

[B]

You got conviction for sure. Grant Cardone was up there. Good interview. Who else? Tai Lopez is smart. Just had Patrick Beverley.

[A]

I was about to say. Have you ever interviewed him? How was that one?

[B]

Yeah. He was so honest. I like getting the athletes after they retire because they're. They can speak. They're not worried about getting fined or whatever. And they're just so authentic.

[A]

Yeah. So it's cool. And some of the people you mentioned, those are the people that are in my lane and that I'm going to surpass. Right. And, you know, I think that's the problem, too. Like, the. One of the things you said, I'm genuine. Right. A lot of these people, they lose themselves. Right. Because they're fulfilled. They're fulfilled with the wrong things. And, you know, money. Money is their motive. I already have money. Right. It's not money. It's fulfillment for me now. It's my legacy. I'm creating. I'm doing this because it's a passion of mine now. This is passion. It's not like, you know, you're not doing 800 episodes because of money. No, it's not happening.

[B]

It used to be money used to be my number one motivator when I was younger.

[A]

Of course, I mean, you don't know anything, but as you grow and you start to see, you know, I'm not sure if you're in a happy place.

[B]

But I would say right now I'm. Yeah, I'm the happiest I've Ever been right now?

[A]

I mean, you're about to get married in a month.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You know, you better be happy.

[B]

I've done a lot of work on myself, and it's important. Yeah.

[A]

Therapy.

[B]

Therapy, you know, microdosing, psychedelics, all sorts of stuff.

[A]

Yeah. And a lot of these. A lot of these people, and you can see they're not generic. They say things just for clickbait. They say things. And, you know, I do want to be, you know, better. And I tell my speaking coach, but he don't be listening to me. I gotta, you know, reword some of the things I say to make them, you know, just. Just not. Not clickbait. But I want you to remember it. Remember it easier, easily when I say it. Yeah, but my brain. My brain goes so fast that sometimes I'll just be saying things in it. But I learned something. I learned something that me and my partner, Denise, we came up with something called word vomit. It changed my life.

[B]

Word vomit.

[A]

Word vomit. It changed my life. I gotta trademark that now because you might trademark it. Oh, man.

[B]

What do you mean by word words?

[A]

Get on the phone. Trademark the word vomit. So you say, you know, you probably, you know, you move fast. Your brain moves fast.

[B]

I have adhd. Yeah.

[A]

Imagine if you could slow your brain down with all your thoughts. How does that look? How do you envision that? Like, you think about this podcast right now, and two seconds later you're thinking about, why is that camera like that? Imagine if you can slow all your thoughts down. And so we came up with this thing where we're going to record. Do a voice recording, right. Of everything I'm saying, right. All my thoughts at the moment. And you have. I know you have it because I have it. Moments where you just start thinking about some great ideas. It just. They're coming, like, left and right, but you forget them, like if. Because you're not putting them down and you don't have time to write them down. So instead of that, you start just turning on your voice memo app and you just start recording all your thoughts. Just keep it on and just start saying it all out loud. Word vomit. Just word vomit. Saying it, saying everything that's coming to your mind because you have those. Those moments that are. Are just so creative, like it's no block and you're flowing all these different, great, great ideas, and it could be all unorganized and disoriented or whatever, but then you take the transcript from that whole entire voice memo, which could be an hour, it could be two hours. It could Just be three hours. It could be whatever. You take the transcript and you tell Chat CBT to organize these thoughts and put them in a way that is understandable and digestible. Something like that. Depending on how you want to do it. And I do my. I do a coaching every week, the business engine. And I do my classes like that. Now I do, you know, I do my journal. You can even do content like, imagine like you're in tech. I can take a help file from one of those cameras. I can drop it into Chat cbt. And because of word vomit, I'm like, wait, I can actually do this as well. I took a help file and I put it into chat. I said, I want you to make me a bet that I want you to analyze this help file and, and take the top five things that no one's talking about of this product and give me five content ideas.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

It's unbelievable what you get.

[B]

I love that.

[A]

It's unbelievable you could do this with everything.

[B]

That's cool.

[A]

Amazing.

[B]

Yeah. I use Chat GBT to summarize videos too.

[A]

It. It just, it just takes. It takes like your, your ideas to a whole new level. So that word vomit, I was able to just say, I journal journal one one day. I journaled my whole entire day. I talked about my whole entire day with word vomit. And I said, can you make me content from this day? I had like, content for days. And people say they can't make content. They've run out of ideas.

[B]

That's mind blowing.

[A]

Every day you breathe, you should have ideas.

[B]

Yeah, I never run out of content ideas. I mean, there's so many guests. We're booked till January. You know, let's.

[A]

Let's see how good you are. Give me one content idea from when I walked in the door to now.

[B]

Content idea like that would go viral.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Damn, put me on the spot.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Listen, I'm good in a podcast clip setting. I'm not so good in the IRL content.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

So I'm not sure, to be honest.

[A]

All right.

[B]

I know how to make clips go viral. There's. There's this formula. I used to think going viral was lucky. It's not.

[A]

It's not.

[B]

It's not. Because I've gotten over 100 million views a month for a year straight. I can confidently, confidently say going viral is not lucky. There's a strategy to it.

[A]

And you mastered it.

[B]

I wouldn't even say I mastered it. I'm still getting better at it, you know, But I've learned some tricks. It's all about the hook. In my opinion, you need to catch people in the first two, three seconds or they're scrolling.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

So you focus on getting good hooks.

[A]

What do you think is more important, the visual or the audio?

[B]

Ooh, facial or the audio? I. I have noticed certain guests go more viral often than. Than others based off their looks, but I still think the audio is more important. The hook. What do you think?

[A]

If I throw this phone at you, you don't think that's gonna go viral where you say me or something?

[B]

They'll go viral. Adam22 does like that all the time, but I don't want to build a brand off that.

[A]

No, no, I'm saying. I'm just. What I'm saying. I'm just saying it's a visual hook.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, it's a visual.

[A]

It's a visual. Not just how you look. I'm saying about, like, people holding those mic. That's a visual hook.

[B]

Right, Right.

[A]

You know, I always say I hate it. I hate it, like, because I'm. I'm a photographer. I'm a videographer. I hate when they holding that mic, but I know why they're doing it. So, you know a lot of things. You know, you can say, I think people understand visually more than they understand audibly or whatever.

[B]

I can see that because some people don't even have their audio on. That's why I have subtitles on my clips too.

[A]

That's why visual hook is the most important.

[B]

You think so?

[A]

I know so. Wow.

[B]

Okay, so we'll disagree on that.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Because. Well, you can agree to this.

[A]

Great.

[B]

For me, when it comes to podcast clips, I guess it'd be harder to do visual hooks.

[A]

Well, yeah. I mean, podcast clips are totally different. You can't do. There's. That's a whole different space. Like, you said, you're good at the podcast clip, so.

[B]

Yeah, but, you know, I. I agree with you then for other stuff. Yeah.

[A]

I mean, it's hard to make. I mean, we're having a conversation, right?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So how can you. How can you consistently make visual hooks in a podcast space? Like, I used to. I used. If you ever follow me, you know, and it was doing well. But I like to just. When people start doing the things I do, I just stopped doing.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Like, I was swinging the mic, and I. I just. That was my visual hook. Yeah, but it was. And you could do this every time on every episode.

[B]

Smart.

[A]

I'm back. You know what I'm saying? So it's all about how you do things. You could always be creative because. And I only got that because the one guy, I forgot his name, but he used to light candles in the beginning. You probably know, you probably interviewed him.

[B]

Like candles.

[A]

He liked candles in every video.

[B]

Interesting.

[A]

And I was like, that's good. I gotta, I gotta think of something that is going to stick with people. And when people used to see me, they'll say, and just to the swing, the mic guy or something like that. Photography. I'm six' six. I'm a six' six guy. And I used to do nightlife photography. You know what I called myself? Mikey. I hate Mikey. But when I went into celebrities, they used to say Mikey. They remember me. Mikey did. Mikey, the tall, big, light skinned or white boy or something. Whatever. Right. And I was so memorable because my name was Mikey. It's catchy. It's a hook. I was hooking before hooking was a thing. Word.

[B]

I love that.

[A]

Damn.

[B]

That's a bar right there, yo.

[A]

Oh, pause, pause. Hooking. Yeah. I wasn't hooking hooking, but I was, I was throwing hooks to people and it was catching them. They was catching them.

[B]

I knew you meant.

[A]

Yeah, it was catching them in the club. Like I would see even, even nightlife photography. Like I just did a post the other day. Like I was in nightlights of photography for like 10 years and I don't know if anyone understands nightlife photography, but I would do three clubs a night. Geez, three clubs a night. But I would run through them. I was so efficient with it because you only got like $75 a club. So I was trying to make the most money.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And in New York City at that time, nightlife was, it was popping, right? It was going, it was, it was booming. Right. So I was in the club every. And now I'm paying for it because my hearing's messed up. I gotta. Yeah. Because I'm. I'm in the club every single night. But I was in the club every single night. And my goal, my golden life like in that and my mindset was to become a getty photographer because they got to access to all the events they got. They made the most money and they were just the coolest people on the thing. I was trying to get to where they are until. Until Invest Fest 2025 where they were taking pictures of me.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

Don't dream too small. Don't dream too small. I love that my dreams are too small there.

[B]

I think everyone can relate to that. Right? We have these dreams like for a lot of people my generation is Become a millionaire. Like, that was like a dream of mine. And then once you get a million dollars, you realize it's not a lot of money. Can't live off that these days. Hell no. I know people will say I'm entitled for saying that, but, like, it's not.

[A]

I mean, you just don't dream too small. I mean, do you have. You have a season, right? And that season was to become a millionaire, and you successfully went through that season, and now it's on to the next season. Don't. Don't limit yourself to one season.

[B]

Right.

[A]

There's four seasons in a year.

[B]

Yeah. Constantly be writing your goals like you said at first, Right?

[A]

Correct.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And, you know, never put limits on yourself for anything. I'll tell you a story. I was in my mastermind. I'm learning to speak, to present, to become public, speaking to a speaker. I'm in the mastermind. And Marcus, I don't mean to throw his name out, but the instructor goes around the room and asks people, what's their number from 1 to 10 of the level they're speaking? And everyone say, 5, 6, 3. I go, 2. He just says, go to the next one. The next person says, 3. The instructor says to the. To the other person, you're not a three. You're at least a five. I'm like, wait, so when I was a two, I'm really a two. But that's how bad I was. Right. And I think I'm a lot better now. I'm about 6, 7. You know what I'm saying? Depending on the day. But it shows you that you can learn how to speak. You can learn any skill, but you have to. You have to vision it. I'm gonna become the best speaker in the world.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Like, I'm gonna become one of the best speakers. I'm gonna make millions of dollars speaking. My pause. My mouth is gonna make millions. Right? Just for me, my brain or my mouth, however you want to say it. I'm gonna make millions doing it. Right. I'm gonna travel the world speaking. It's going to happen, and it's going to happen very soon, because I am. I'm investing everything, all my time into this vision. I wrote it down. I talk about it. I do repetition. And I'm. I'm working on my craft every single day. I created a whole entire stage in my house.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

I got a LED wall. I got a stage, I got lights. I got a whole. I. I'm gonna be on I. They say that. How do you get the number One question is, how do I get on on the stage? Build your own. Simple. Build your own. And that's what I did. I built my own. So I'm on stage every day.

[B]

They'll play this clip five years from now when you're one of the best speakers in the world.

[A]

That's a fact.

[B]

Yeah, I can already see it.

[A]

That's. I can't wait to make a million dollar speaking.

[B]

Oh, you'll be there for sure. I know it.

[A]

And it's all about leveraging too. I do have some leverage because if you can book me the co founder and CEO of Earn your leisure Invest Fest, that brings some authenticity to your event.

[B]

100.

[A]

So it's a lot easier for me. Yes, I will. But you're not gonna book me if I'm gonna be speaking. Crazy, right? I have to come. I have to show up.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And that's what I'm working on. Showing up.

[B]

Absolutely. My man. This has been awesome. Hope you have fun at the fight tomorrow. I hope you enjoyed Vegas. Where can people find you and support you, man?

[A]

Follow me. So what can I give some away? Yeah, so this is, this is a, this is a bar, right? This is like a thousand dollar thing that I'm gonna give away for free because your audience is dope. It's popping and I want to, I always want to help people, right? And follow me on Instagram. That's all you gotta do. Just follow me at Michael JMacDonald. If you put it on the screen, I put it in the description. It's M I C H A E L M M I C H A E L J M A C D O N L D. Got that? D O N A L D. You gonna put it somewhere?

[B]

Yeah, we'll link it.

[A]

Just put it somewhere. Right? Just follow me and message me digital. So social. Message me social. Right. Which words you want me to message?

[B]

I would do social or Sean.

[A]

Message me Sean.

[B]

Sean.

[A]

Message me Sean. Message me Sean. I'm going to give you that thousand. The thing that I sell for a thousand dollars is the business engine. My four pillars to building a successful business. It teaches you systems, it teaches you. It teaches you business model, it teaches you marketing, and it teaches you sales. Literally, it's a. It will change. I don't care what level business. If you're making $10,000 a month, you're making $1,000 a month. Making $100,000 a month, it's going to amplify your business in a way that you couldn't imagine.

[B]

Damn.

[A]

And I'M giving away for free. I'm gonna get that shit message me Sean and I'm gonna give you don't even have to put your email in I'm gonna just. I don't need your email but I'm gonna give you so much value in that the next time you want to more information from me or you want to build partner with me you're going to be more willing to because I've earned your credit credibility I've earned your trust. Right. They get to know you from your they get to know me from your platform and they're going to trust me from when they see what I give them for free.

[B]

Yeah. Thanks for doing that man Means a lot.

[A]

I got you.

[B]

Yeah definitely message him guys. I'm going to even get it like I said so check them out. Enjoy. Enjoy the fight man.

[A]

Let's go.

[B]

I hope you guys are enjoying the show. Please don't forget to like and subscribe. It helps the show a lot with the algorithm. Thank you.