← Digital Social Hour
Digital Social Hour
Naveen Jain: Your DNA Isn’t the Problem… Your Lifestyle Is | DSH #1823
00:49:42
In this wide-ranging conversation, entrepreneur and Viome founder Naveen Jain breaks down why most chronic disease isn’t caused by your DNA — but by your daily choices. After losing his father to stage 4 pancreatic cancer, Naveen shifted his focus from space and fusion energy to transforming healthcare through AI and gene expression testing. He explains why “healthy food” isn’t universal, why blindly taking supplements can backfire, and how your microbiome may be controlling inflammation, brain health, and immune function. The discussion expands beyond health into purpose, longevity, consciousness, brain-to-brain communication, and whether technology will eventually allow humans to upload skills — or even merge minds through AI. This is a big-picture conversation about health, personal responsibility, and the future of humanity. 🎯 What You’ll Learn • 🧬 Why 95% of chronic disease is driven by lifestyle — not genetics • 🦠 How your microbiome influences inflammation and overal...
Loading summary
Transcript145 lines
- [00:00]
A
One day we might be able to figure out how to transfer it, it seems like.
- [00:02]
B
Absolutely. My point is today we are able to read the brain waves and I think, I don't know if you've seen or not. They're able to now even actually read the brain waves. So someone can actually on the other side can do the action.
- [00:14]
A
What is that with neuralink or.
- [00:16]
B
No, totally different. They were able to simply put the cap that reads the brain waves and it thinks what you want to do and someone else took the action. So imagine I am thinking of someone and someone else pulls the trigger. Who is.
- [00:36]
A
Okay guys, we got Naveen Jain here today in Las Vegas. He just spoke at the health conference. He's killing it with his company Viome. Got my test here, can't wait to take it. Thanks for coming on, man.
- [00:45]
B
Well, Sean, first of all, really looking forward to it and just congratulations on being getting married.
- [00:50]
A
Thank you.
- [00:50]
B
And boy, that's a great journey for you.
- [00:52]
A
Yeah. You're the first guest I've had on since the wedding. So I'm back at. It took three weeks off, which for me is a lot of time.
- [00:58]
B
I've now taken three weeks off in my life. 66.
- [01:02]
A
I was itching to work the whole time. You know, it's tough. We just have. I know with you. You're trying to like fix the whole healthcare industry, right? So you got a big mission and you can't afford to take time off.
- [01:11]
B
Well, really, if you find something that you love so much that you're willing to die for it, it's never a work. It is something you jump out of the bed every day in the morning wanting to do that. And that is something that everyone who's listening to it really focus on what are you willing to die for and then live for it every day when you wake up. And if you're not jumping out of the bed every day, then you should quit what you're doing. Because when you find your purpose in life, there's no way you're lying in bed, you're itching to go out and do it. And once you find that, you will find a tremendous success in life. Because your success can never be defined by how much money you have in the bank. It is always defined by how many lives you actually improved. And your self worth can never come from what you own. Your self worth comes from what you create. And if you own a lot because you inherited a lot and if you haven't done anything, you're still a parasite on society. So just don't be a parasite.
- [02:14]
A
Wow, I love that. And we were speaking about your kids earlier. Now, they could have inherited a lot, but they're building their own billion dollar companies. So.
- [02:20]
B
Yeah, I mean, honestly, you know, raising children, especially in an affluent family, is. It is just a really interesting way because they know they don't have to work for a living. But how do you make them so hungry that they always want to go out and solve the biggest problems? And the only way to do that is to create intellectual curiosity in your children. Right? It's giving them that thirst. It's not about taking them to the water and making them drink, it's about making them thirsty. And the way you make someone thirsty is to make them intellectual, to be curious. Because once they become curious, they constantly learn and they constantly find the problem. They question why and they solve all those audacious challenges.
- [03:07]
A
I love that.
- [03:08]
B
And that's how you build a great company. Right? So most people who want to be successful, they all say, I want to make money. You know, making money is simply a byproduct of doing things that improve people's life. So find something that will improve a billion people's lives. You can create a $100 billion, but you should never wake up in the morning that what should I do to create a hundred billion dollar company? You focus on doing good for the fellow humans and you will become successful. You will make a lot of money. Making money is like having an orgasm. If you focus on it, you're never going to get it right. You just have to enjoy the process. And that is people who focus on money always stay poor. And people who tend to do good always end up making a lot of money.
- [03:57]
A
Such powerful advice. Because there's a lot of people, I think because of social media, they get influenced to make money, right?
- [04:02]
B
Yes. And there are people who, you know on social media and there are people we're not going to name names. They talked about how much wealth they have and how many cars they have and next thing you know, they're committing frauds. Right, but let's run names here. But that's really what happens is that this social media is teaching us somehow the success is overnight. These people are somehow became successful. No one ever becomes successful overnight. I mean, Sean, you are a great hero to lot of young people. You have been doing it for long time. And even though you just started the podcast maybe three years ago, and people look at you say, my God, this kid, what does he do? What does he do? Works 18 hour days, 7 days a week, Putting his heart out there to make every audience smarter, do the things for them. You don't go do these things because it makes you happier. You do them because you know every single guest you have is going to give them the wisdom that your audience is going to be better. And the more you do for them, the better you become. And that is something most people don't realize. You don't focus on yourself. You focus on making other people's life better.
- [05:21]
A
Absolutely. And that's why I love having on health experts, because the messages I get after are like, honestly, life changing. There's been some lives saved, I think, because of guests of my podcast talking about certain topics.
- [05:32]
B
I mean, how so? Let me ask you, Sean, I mean, what's your advice? You have talked to lots and lots of people.
- [05:38]
A
Yeah.
- [05:39]
B
What is one advice, if you were to give people who are listening to this about health? And how do you pick the guest? I mean, how did you find me?
- [05:49]
A
I found you because I told you off camera. I saw you speak eight years ago, and you changed my life. You spoke at Grant Cardone's event, and I didn't know how I would get to you one day, but it ended up being the podcast. But I always had you in the back of my head when I started the show and made how did you change your life?
- [06:02]
B
How did it change your life?
- [06:03]
A
When I heard the story about losing your father, I was like, even though I was only, I think, 20 at the time, I was like, I need to take my health seriously and I need to, like, make sure my parents are healthy. You know what I mean? Because we were not the healthiest. You know, I was working all day, every day. I was super stressed. And when you're young, you get away with it.
- [06:20]
B
I think, yes, you can.
- [06:21]
A
But now that I'm getting older.
- [06:22]
B
But honestly, you never get away with it. Your body is so resilient. You're constantly assaulting it and you think you're not damaging it. But by the time you turn 40, there is plenty damage that has been done.
- [06:35]
A
Right.
- [06:36]
B
And that is really the key is when we are young, people sacrifice their health for wealth. And as they get older, they sacrifice their wealth for health. Right. And that's just really sad that you're not happy when you're young because you're focused on making money. And when you get older, you are so unhealthy that you can enjoy life, and all you want to do is give up all your money just to be healthy. And that's really interesting that, as you know, Sean, people who are sick only have one wish in their life, just to be healthy. And people who are healthy have many wishes. So if you want to have your dreams and you really want to pursue your dreams, focus on your health. Because if you don't have health, you can't do anything.
- [07:19]
A
No, you can't. That's why when I see people that are wealthy financially, but they're fat, I don't respect it as much, you know.
- [07:26]
B
Well, it's not. I mean, honestly, just because you're thin doesn't mean you are healthy either. And that really is, people who are thin on the outside may actually be very sick inside.
- [07:37]
A
That happened to me actually.
- [07:38]
B
And that really something we have to be, you know, not, you know, give people who are thin somehow they are healthy. Because then we are essentially giving the wrong message to a lot of young people that you people stop eating. People start to have a terrible relationship with food and they or they go on these fad diets that are completely kill their body. So people go on keto diet to look healthier, look thinner, and actually absolutely F up their body.
- [08:08]
A
Dang.
- [08:09]
B
Right.
- [08:09]
A
Yeah.
- [08:09]
B
People go on this intermittent fasting. And there's so many studies that have come out that people who actually do intermittent fasting, they die sooner.
- [08:17]
A
What?
- [08:18]
B
Yes. So there are studies that have in fact come out, some very large studies, 100,000 people plus observational studied that people who were on a keto diet and skip breakfast, they all had the higher chances of having developing the heart disease and dying sooner. Wow. Same thing is true, by the way, for people that go on a keto diet, they absolutely have lot of brain issues. In fact, when you go on a keto diet, carbs is something your body needs and you completely avoid carbs. I've had people destroy their brains, their memory, their cognitive thinking just from eating too many carbs. No, not eating enough carbs.
- [08:56]
A
Oh, enough carbs.
- [08:56]
B
Yeah. Because keto diet is no carb diet.
- [08:58]
A
Okay.
- [08:59]
B
Right. And it's completely destroyed. So what we learned, Sean. So as you know, I started Wyoming eight years ago. And it was a journey that started from a said event. And I think as you and I talked about here, I was mining the moon for Helium 3 to actually build fusion reactors. And I thought we could solve all of the humanity's problem if we can come up with a clean energy solution that could completely change the way people live their lives. And then my dad was diagnosed with stage four pancreatic cancer. I didn't even know he was sick, let alone he had stage Four cancer. And I lost him in three months.
- [09:41]
A
Jeez.
- [09:42]
B
And the thing that surprised me is not just that he died from cancer. I took it for granted that as he was getting older, of course he has diabetes, of course he's taking his blood pressure medicine, of course he need his heart disease, the statins. And you know, he got all of these things and he's just taking these medicine.
- [10:00]
A
We talk a lot on this show about, about taking risks and trying to get ahead. But let's be real, the world feels shaky right now. AI is changing jobs, markets are all over the place. Nothing feels guaranteed. And at some point you realize no one's coming to save you. You've got to protect yourself. And one thing people forget about is life insurance. If you're new to it, you're not alone. That's why I checked out Select Quote. They've been around for over 40 years and helped more than 2 million Americans find coverage that actually fits their life and budget. They compare policies, policies from top rated insurance companies and do the work for you for free. You can even get same day coverage up to $2 million with no medical exam. Life insurance is never cheaper than it is today. Get the right life insurance for you for less and save more than 50@SelectQuote.comDSH save more than 50 on term life insurance@SelectQuote.comDSH today to get started@SelectQuote.comDSH.
- [10:57]
B
And then I stop. What is it in the human body that causes us to develop these diseases? What if we can actually understand what is it that is changing in the human biology at a biochemical level? Because at the end of the day, our body is simply biochemical, electrical. And if we can understand every biochemical reaction in our body, we will be able to prevent the diseases from happening, diagnose them early, and God forbid, outright reverse them. And I realized coming from the tech side, what if we can actually get 10 million people to do a test, understand everything that's happening in their biology, and then tell them exactly what food to eat, what food not to eat, what supplement they should take, what supplement they should not take. We could actually change their biochemistry. So it started the journey eight years ago. What we do is we analyze everything in your body. Now there's a couple of things I wanted to just clarify because this is where people get so confused because there's so many influencers out there trying to sell them things without realizing each person thinking, oh my God, this will change my life. Look at who's talking about it right Right. And I think the health is something you have to learn about and not follow some influencer's advice. So what I realized was there were two types of things people were doing. People were saying, if I understood my genes, if I know my DNA, I can solve my problem. And what, I come from a completely different background. My first question is, does your DNA change if you become diabetic? Does your DNA change when you become obese? And if it doesn't, then how can you blame your genes for something that doesn't even change? Right? So first thing was, does DNA matter? And the answer is no. Because if you were to do my DNA testing today, and I gained 200 pounds and you do my DNA testing again, same DNA, I now become diabetic, you my DNA test, same DNA. I have heart disease, do my DNA test, same DNA, and then I die. 100 years after I die, you exhume my body and you do the DNA test, same DNA. We look at the DNA of dinosaurs, same DNA, right? If DNA can't even tell you you're dead or alive, how will it ever tell you you're healthier or sicker? What is constantly changing in your body is not your gene, but your gene expression. We call that rna. So your RNA is what's changing in your body. That's what tells you what is going on inside your body. So your DNA is like an Alphabet. RNA is a story you're writing. You can take the same Alphabet, you can write a thriller or you can write a poetry, depending on what's the story you're writing with your. Your gene expression is controlled by you, by your lifestyle. And I'm going to tell you more about how you control your gene expression. So stop blaming your ancestors, your DNA, for your issues. Blame the choices you make every single day. That is changing your gene expression that's making you sick. So it's not your ancestors that gave you the bad genes, even if you have bad genes, unless you have a rare genetic disease. And my heart breaks for people who have rare genetic disease, but they call rare genetic diseases because they are rare.
- [14:33]
A
Right?
- [14:35]
B
Every other chronic disease, which is where we spend 90% of our healthcare dollars, diabetes, heart disease, depression, anxiety, cancer, Alzheimer, Parkinson's. Less than 5% of the impact is from your genes and 95% comes from your lifestyle. Wow. Think about that for a second.
- [14:56]
A
That's crazy.
- [14:57]
B
Like, for example, I have a genetic mutation called APOE4 that I'm supposed to get Alzheimer.
- [15:05]
A
I have that one too.
- [15:06]
B
Interestingly, I am now 66 years old. I do my brain MRI every year, just in the last 12 months. Size of my hippocampus, which is the memory center, increased by 8%. My gray matter increased by 6%. So I am not getting Alzheimer's. In fact, my brain is growing, my memory center is growing because of the lifestyle and the choices I am making every single day. So the reason I mentioned that is never ever feel hopeless. Because the minute you feel hopeless and helpless, there is someone who will take advantage of you. Right? So coming back. So at Wyoming, what we do is we understand your RNA. The second part is 99% of all the genes in your body don't come from your mom and dad, Sean. They come from these microbes that live inside our gut, in our mouth and all over us. 100 trillion microbes that live in our gut, in our mouth. These microbiome is in symbiotic relationship with us. We feed them and they feed us. When we feed them the wrong thing, they feed us the wrong thing. So if you don't eat right, they release the molecules that cause inflammation. When we feed them the good stuff like fiber, they actually create short chain fatty acids that is good for our body, it reduces the inflammation, right? So what we do is, you see the test here called full body intelligence. We take a spit of your saliva that is top of your digestive tube, and then we take a touch of your stool, which is bottom of your digestive tube. And then we take a finger prick blood. Four drops of your finger prick blood. Guess what? Now analyzing all of your oral microbiome and their activity, their gum lining. I'm looking at your gut microbiome and all of your gut lining in your blood. I am looking at all of your mitochondria and I'm looking at all of your immune system and we are analyzing 100 million biomarkers. Think about that for a second. 100 million biomarkers, right? And there are not today everyone out there saying, oh my God. There are companies who are doing the blood test. They send you to Quest. You give 24 tubes of blood and they're going to give you 100 biomarkers. These are the same hundred biomarkers that has been around for 30 years. Richest people have done all these tests and you know who are the sickest people? The richest people. So these hundred biomarkers could solve your problem and keep you healthy. This problem would have been solved long time ago. So what you need to do is to look underneath what is going on. So with these 100 million biomarkers, Sean, what we do is now use massive amount of AI. We have now analyzed 1.5 million tests. We have analyzed 150 quadrillion biological data points using AI. Based on that, I can tell you your cognitive health, your heart health, your oral health, your gut health, your immune health, your biological age, and all the nerdy stuff you ever want to know. Then we tell you you shouldn't eat avocado, even though everyone tells you is healthy for you, Sean, it is causing problem, and you may end up developing gout because your uric acid production is too high. Or don't eat broccoli and cabbage right now because your sulfide production is too high and these foods are very high in sulfate, causing you inflammation. Or don't eat spinach or almonds despite Popeye telling you spinach is good for everyone. Popeye was not a scientist. I'm telling you these foods are very high in oxalates. Your oxalates are not being degraded, and you're going to end up getting a kidney stone. So we can tell you every food, whether to eat it, why you should eat it, and a science paper for it, what food you should not eat, why, and a science paper for it. And then we walk you through every nutrient your body is lacking. So we say, you know, Sean, having looked at 100 million biomarkers, you should take 22 milligrams of elderberry every day. Make sure you take 26 milligrams of lycopene every day. Take 89 milligrams of amylase every day. We walk you through every vitamin, mineral, herbs, digestive enzyme, amino acid, food extract. If you need 40 ingredients or 60 ingredients, we custom formulate just for you every single month. We custom formulate for you the probiotics, prebiotics, or postbiotics that you need for your gut. We make the oral lozenges for you to adjust your oral microbiome. And we make the personalized toothpaste separate for morning and separate for evening to fix your oral microbiome, which is responsible for diabetes, heart disease, your sexual health, Alzheimer, and many cancers, right? So you want to fix all of that in the body with personalized foods and personalized supplements. What we found is, Sean, that there is no such thing as universal healthy food. If food can be good for you or bad for you, depending on what's going on in your body, even the foods that are bad for you, six months later, if you change your diet and your microbiome gets fixed, that food is okay to eat now. So it's not just Personalized that it's bad for you forever. Even the foods that are good for you or bad for you, they change as your body is changing. So people say, well, how often do I have to test? It's like asking how often do I have to exercise? I exercise three years ago. Do I have to still exercise again? The answer is it's the lifestyle. You have to choose to know what's happening inside your body and constantly adapt and change as your body is adapting and changing. So there are five things that you have to do if you want to live healthier longer. Number one is nutrition. And unless you fix the nutrition, nothing else matters. It's like having a Ferrari, but you put a wrong fuel in there, right? When you eat right, your body is at peak at that point. And that's the number one thing you have to do is to understand what foods you should be eating, what supplements you should be taking, and more importantly, what supplements you should not be taking. Just like the food that not all supplements are good for you. So this idea that everyone should take nad, guess what? NAD can be good for you because it can increase the energy factory in you. But if you have a cancer, it can increase the progression of cancer. Cancer, if you have high cellular senescence, increases more inflammation in your body, right? So NAD can be good or bad depending on what's happening in your body. Some people sell like Akkermansia as probiotic. It can be good for some people or it can cause you multiple sclerosis, it can cause you Ms. Depending on what's happening in your body. So anytime you hear that, some everyone should take this supplement. Unless your name is everyone, don't do it. And that's a simple philosophy. That test, don't guess. And that's number one. So that's nutrition. Number two, brother. Number two thing is stress reduction when you are under stress, which many of us are always stressed, guess what used to happen as we evolved, the only time we were stressed, when we were living in the savannas of Africa, when we were chased by a tiger. What does your body think when you're stressed? Oh my God, I'm being chased by a tiger. I don't need to worry about digesting my food right now because I'm going to be lunch for someone else right now, right? So it shuts down the digestive system. It says don't worry about immune system getting infection here because you're being chased by a tiger. So it shuts down your immune system. And that's the reason people who are stressed, they Always get sick.
- [23:53]
A
Wow.
- [23:54]
B
Right? Your food is no longer digested, so you're no longer getting the nutrition in the body. So number one, number two things after nutrition is find what's causing you stress. If your work is causing you stress, quit your damn work. If your spouse is causing you stress, do what you need. Now same. The point is, when you are in fight or flight response, our body no longer is functioning. So some of us do the tricky stuff before we eat. Let's do the prayer, let's do the gratitude. Why do we do that? So your body moves away from sympathetic mode to parasympathetic mode. Because when you're doing gratitude, you're no longer stressed. Wow. Right. So that's why people say let's do the prayer, let's do the gratitude before we eat. I love that. And we made that a part of the culture so we can move away from stress. So your body can now digest the food. Number three is exercise. Now once you've done the stress reduction, you don't need to be a gym rat. You just have to move. So make sure you're moving four, five miles. Getting the enough of the body movement. Fast walking is really really good. And as you start to age, just start incorporating some of the body weight. Do some push up, do some squats, do some lunges and that starts to build the muscles for you, right? If you can go do the weights, go do the weights. But you don't need to be a gym rat. Just doing the right type of exercise and keep the body moving. And fast walking is one of the best exercise you can do. Number four is sleep. It's not the quantity of sleep. Like many good things in life, the quality matters. So measure your sleep. You need to get about hour and half to two hours of REM sleep, an hour and 15 minutes to hour and 30 minutes of deep sleep. If you can get that in four hours, great. If you need five, take five. If you need seven, take seven. If you need eight, take eight. But make sure you're getting enough REM sleep, enough deep sleep because that what cleans out your brain now. I am such a nutty case. I have an aura ring, I have an ultra human ring. I wear my apple watch. I have eight sleep mattress because I want to know am I sleeping? And I've now noticed that I anytime I eat late, I don't get a good REM sleep or good deep sleep. So what I've learned is don't eat three hours before you sleep. I go to sleep at 9am I get up at 4am, 9pm, I get up at 4am, I stop eating at 6pm wow, right? If I eat at 7, I don't go to sleep until 10. But what happens is late sleep, while body is still digesting, it is metabolically active no longer you can fall asleep because your circadian rhythm is off. So similarly, I noticed that even if I drink half a glass of wine, my deep sleep is out the window. I stop drinking, completely stop drinking. I take still water and when I absolutely need to splurge, I take sparkling water.
- [27:06]
A
That's your cheetah.
- [27:07]
B
So point I'm going to make is that you have to make this a part of your lifestyle because good sleep matters. The number five, after you've done the nutrition and getting the personalized nutrition in your body, reduce the stress, done the exercise, gotten a good sleep. The number five is purpose and community. People who live a life of purpose tend to live 10 to 15 years longer and healthier than people who have no purpose. Think about that for a second. If you can find something that you're willing to die for, then live for it every minute of your life. Do things that are your North Star, your purpose. And when you do that, you tend to live healthier and longer.
- [27:51]
A
That's why when people retire, they pass away shortly after on exactly what happens.
- [27:55]
B
Because they lose the purpose, they lose the motivation, they start to die. I read four to five books every month because I want to constantly learning and I learn about different subject. I'm reading probably done dozen books on quantum theory. Not that I'm applying the quantum theory, but that's how you increase your brain. Your brain needs to constantly build new connections, the new neural connections by learning something new. I'm reading about that, I'm reading about simulation theory, I read about aging, I'm reading about all the different subjects because that's how you're able to connect the dots in the world.
- [28:36]
A
I love that. So do you believe we're in a simulation?
- [28:38]
B
Well, interesting thing is there is no way to prove that we are not living in a simulation that we're not living in one. Right? And so here's the interesting thing is today the video games are becoming so rich that sometime when you put the the Metaverse glasses, your brain starts to think you are actually living that life, right? And as the technology is getting better and better, we won't know the difference whether you are actually in that life or you are actually outside that life. What makes us think if technology can do that, that someone has not already created that world, we are simply the two things could happen.
- [29:23]
A
It's possible.
- [29:24]
B
Either we are the character, there is someone else playing the game. Yeah. Or we are simply the npc.
- [29:33]
A
Yeah. That's scary to think about, right?
- [29:35]
B
Either we are playing character or we are non playing character.
- [29:38]
A
Yeah. Who knows? I don't think we'll never know. Right?
- [29:42]
B
It doesn't matter. The point is, that's all great, but every day, even we are living in a simulation. Never forget our purpose. The same Homo sapiens, our fellow humans. What are we doing every day to make their life better? If you wake up every day and saying, what can I do today to make other people's life better? The more you do that, the better business you have. I don't care what you do. If you're every day making people's life better, they become your customers and next thing you know, you have an amazingly successful business.
- [30:22]
A
I love it. You found purpose. Would you say you found at a pretty young age because you built some big companies prior to this?
- [30:28]
B
Everything. You know, people think you need to find your purpose of life. I really think what we need to do is to find the purpose in life. That means everything you do find the purpose, why you're doing it. You have to have your why. Even if you are a janitor. Don't think I have the lowliest job on earth. I'm, you know, think of yourself as a healthcare worker who is bringing the hygiene to the world. And you start thinking it's for me that everyone that I serve, their life is healthier because of me or they would be sick. Right. I am the person who is making other people's life better and more. You do become the best janitor. You have a chance of becoming the best at anything. So it doesn't matter what you do. Take pride in that work and do it so well that people say, I want you to do this and this. Wow.
- [31:30]
A
I love that. That's inspiring because there's a lot of people with ordinary nine to five jobs.
- [31:34]
B
You know, take pride in that and be the best at it.
- [31:38]
A
Yeah. That's powerful. So you think we're going to see someone live to 150 in our lifetime?
- [31:43]
B
Well, it's not about living to be 150. In fact, no one wants to be living to 150 if they have to spend the last 75 years in the ICU. Nobody wants to be living and saying, I got a plastic tube on my nose and someone is feeding me and I can't even remember the name of the person who's feeding me anymore. Right. So point is, you want to increase the health span, not just the lifespan. You want people to be living to be the healthiest until the last day of their life. And I think there is nothing in the human body that says we cannot live to be 200 years, 400 years. So there are whales that live to be 200 years, the Greenland sharks that live to be 400 years. So there's no reason we couldn't. The question really is, could we live healthier? And every one of us should want to be able to die on top of the Mount Everest. That means you were able to climb the Mount Everest on the last day of your life and then died there. So point really is, my belief is in the next two decades, we will be able to live as long as we want and live healthy until the last day. Because at the end of the day, as I said, this body is simply biochemical activities. We can completely change the biochemical activity. We are able to rejuvenate the organs. We'll be able to use the stem cells to make our heart new. We'll be able to recreate your even outside 3D. Print your own liver. Even if you drank a lot when you were young, there is a new liver waiting for you. Right. You'll be able to take your own stem cell, print your own liver and install it, or use the stem cells in your body to be able to rejuvenate. So there is nothing. And again, you could even argue what makes us who we are. And let's just go slightly tangent. So think about it. What makes Sean a shaun? Let's assume you need to get your knee replaced. Are you still Sean?
- [33:51]
A
If I need to get what?
- [33:52]
B
Knee replaced.
- [33:53]
A
Oh, my knee replaced? I would say yeah.
- [33:55]
B
If you get your shoulder replaced.
- [33:56]
A
Yeah. Okay.
- [33:57]
B
Now if you get your kidney replaced. Yeah. Heart replaced. Yeah. Liver replaced. Yeah. So what is it in your body? What makes you who you are then?
- [34:11]
A
I would say the brain or the soul, the spirit, depending on your spiritual belief.
- [34:15]
B
Very good. So it's either your memories and experiences makes you who you are. And let's call that something unique soul that you are. That means if you are able to implant your memory experience in soul in some non biological body, would you still call that Sean?
- [34:33]
A
Wow. Like an AI? Like a robot, Humanoid robot, Right?
- [34:37]
B
Yeah. I mean, you have same memories, same experiences, same soul. Would you call that Sean?
- [34:42]
A
Yeah.
- [34:43]
B
Good. Now if there are multiples of them and they are constantly syncing.
- [34:49]
A
Would it still be Sean?
- [34:51]
B
Yeah. Multiple sons?
- [34:52]
A
I Guess. Yeah. Right.
- [34:54]
B
Now start thinking about today. All of our sensors are all attached to our body. Our eyes, our ears, my touch, everything is attached to my body. Just like a wild line fall. What if your eyes are in Chicago, your hearing is in Chicago, your nose is in Chicago and your brain is getting the signal. It is smelling the same thing, it is hearing the same sound, it is seeing the same thing. Are you in Chicago? Answer. Your brain thinks you're in Chicago. Right. And my point is, as you start to happen, you could be in multiple places at the same time because your brain does not know the difference. It's simply getting the electrical signals. And you can create those electrical signals any way you want. So point I'm trying to make is that who is that that wants to live forever?
- [35:48]
A
Brian Johnson.
- [35:49]
B
No, no, no. Who is that in your body who is asking that question? I want to live that what I meant to say, who is that I that asking the question? I want to live forever. What is that I. It's not your body because your body from the time you were a baby is constantly changing. It's not the same baby, Sean, that today and 20 years from now, it's not going to be the same body. So your body is not Sean. Right.
- [36:16]
A
Wow, that's a mind twister right there. Yeah. You're attacking me, right?
- [36:19]
B
Though cells in our body are constantly dying and new cells are being born, they're not Sean. So my point I'm trying to make is that when people say I, what is that I? An I has to be that spiritually, that soul or your memories and experiences is what you want to carry. If it is simply your DNA, then you're already living forever. You have a kid and you have a sim. So point is that we, when we seek, how long would we live in the future, ask ourselves, who is that we?
- [36:56]
A
Yeah. Consciousness. Right.
- [36:58]
B
Consciousness. Right.
- [36:59]
A
One day we might be able to figure out how to transfer it, it seems like.
- [37:02]
B
Absolutely. My point is today we are able to read the brain waves and I think, I don't know if you've seen or not. They're able to now even actually read the brainwave. So someone can actually on the other side can do the action. What? Yes.
- [37:16]
A
Is that with neuralink or is that something else?
- [37:18]
B
No, totally different. They were able to simply put the cap that reads the brain waves and it thinks what you want to do and someone else took the action. Wow. So they actually did the video game over the Internet. One person was thinking to do something and the other person was taking the Action. So imagine I am thinking of shooting someone and someone else pulls the trigger. Who is the murderer?
- [37:46]
A
Wow, that is crazy.
- [37:48]
B
Right now these are all possible now, right? Because someday these things are going to become real where we are going to be able to actually read each other's thoughts. You're too young to remember. We used to communicate using modems, right?
- [38:05]
A
Heard of it.
- [38:05]
B
You dial into the Internet and you will go out. And really low bandwidth. Then we have now broadband, right? The way we communicate today is through speech. Very low bandwidth. We're thinking so much faster than we can speak, right? What if the brain can now connect to each other and we can read each other's thoughts?
- [38:27]
A
Holy crap.
- [38:28]
B
What if we can upload each other's brains? So I go and say, Sean, I think you're such an expert in how you can take a content and make it go viral. Can I just upload your skills? Can I subscribe to your brain and I'll pay you. So as you are learning something new, I'll pay you to constantly upload that thing into my brain.
- [38:52]
A
Wow.
- [38:52]
B
And I am really good at this. And you can subscribe to my brain of how to be a good entrepreneur. And we can now, if two brains are better than one. Now imagine all 8 billion of us, all of our ideas can all combine, sitting in a cloud where we are all cooperating and learning from each other and everyone. One person is great at math, one is great at physics. Is there any problem that we can solve?
- [39:20]
A
Could probably solve everything.
- [39:21]
B
Right now our neocortex, which is our brain, is simply limited by the physiology of how babies are born. It has to go through the birth canal. That means the amount of brain size of the brain is limited. Now what we are doing is constantly increasing our size of the brain by actually connecting to cloud. So in my days I used to remember phone numbers because that's what he had to do. Now we have a device called iPhone. We connect to it and it connects to the cloud and gives us the information we no longer need to remember. When the Abraham Lincoln was born, we go to the Internet through a device and it gives me the information. So we are now using all the memories. We just simply have to remember the keyword. The memory just stored somewhere else. Now our brain is already expanded outside. We used to think, we make decisions and that is human. We are starting to let go of that. So if you use Google Map and it tells you you're going to your destination, make a left turn and you say, what a stupid AI. I know the Shortcut is right turn. I go there, I get stuck in the traffic. What happens next time when Google says make a left turn, you make a left turn. Right. Now we've given up our decision making power. Go to the restaurant. Your AI knows more about the new restaurant that opened up, whether Sean is going to like it or not because it knows everything about your liking. So suddenly your personal Jarvis, your personal AI agent will know more about you and will start to make decision. Well, I think Sean should be eating this for dinner. I've already got the instacart and I'm ordering that stuff for him. Right. So now your human brain is now expanded with all of the things you can offshore. And now you can start to put the new things, new learnings, new things in there. Wow.
- [41:20]
A
So you actually think it's good then for the brain?
- [41:22]
B
I really do.
- [41:23]
A
To be reliant on AI?
- [41:24]
B
Well, it is a tool. AI is simply a tool. Is saying, is cell phone good for you? Well, it depends what you do with it. Is hammer good for you? Depends what you do with it. If you build a home, it's good. If you take a hammer and kill someone, no good. If you take a car, go out there and serve someone, that's good. You take a car and kill someone, no good. So it's really what you do with the technology that makes it good or bad, not the technology in itself.
- [41:52]
A
That is so interesting. Yeah. Because there's studies now I don't know if you've seen on the AI usage linked to the brain. Have you seen those?
- [42:00]
B
Well, there are a lot of the things. In fact there's some people who are using AI as a tool. It is amazing. When you become dependent on AI and no longer using your own thinking, then it's bad.
- [42:13]
A
Right.
- [42:14]
B
Because then you're becoming slave to the technology. You want the AI to be a tool in your tool chest, not your boss who tells you do this.
- [42:22]
A
Right, Right. Yeah. Because with viome you couldn't do this. Without AI, we couldn't.
- [42:26]
B
And that's the point is AI is not that fairy does that. You sprinkle AI in something, everything becomes magical. Right. AI is good when you have massive amount of data that human brain cannot process. That's where you need AI for. But if you're simply looking at 100 biomarkers, you don't need AI for that. Any human can read that.
- [42:47]
A
Yeah. What's next for Viome? Anything planned.
- [42:50]
B
So what Viome is going to do, continue to do is analyze more and more things in your body. So we can be more and more precise. It's becoming more and more adaptive. So for example, you did the test, I told you what to do. Now, every month since we are making supplement for you, I look at your wearables and say, you know what, Sean, in the last couple of weeks I noticed you're not sleeping well. So I'm going to change and increase more ashwagandha and magnesium in your supplement and I'm giving you a new diet that will help you sleep better. Or Sean, you have been really working out a lot and we notice you're doing a lot of strength training right now. You know what I'm going to do? I'm going to add the creatine. I'm going to add, since you're a vegetarian, I'm going to add some branch chain amino acid because you're not getting enough leucine in the body. I'm going to add that for you and I'm going to change your diet to include more protein there. Or you're doing a lot of aerobics right now, you're running marathon. You know what, I'm going to give you more calories by changing your diet and I'm going to change your supplements. Right? So it's constantly changing and adapting as it is. Seeing watching you do and what's happening in your body. You're at a restaurant, you take a picture of the menu, you say, sean, order the item number three that fits best with your wild.
- [44:05]
A
Wow, that's cool.
- [44:06]
B
It's already. If you're cooking at home, we say, here is a recipe that only uses the food that are good for you and doesn't use any food that's not good.
- [44:15]
A
That's always, that always takes so much time when you're cooking at home, reading through everything.
- [44:18]
B
So if actually now we do the recipes, we integrate with Instacart so you can actually order whatever is here.
- [44:23]
A
Wow.
- [44:24]
B
So all that thing is changing. And then with all of this data that we collected, we are able to now diagnose stage one cancer. So we launched the first test, Stage one oral cancer, stage one throat cancer. We took it to FDA and they gave us a breakthrough device designation for the first time in the human history with the saliva, I can tell you if you have a stage one oral cancer throat cancer. 95% specificity, 90% sensitivity.
- [44:56]
A
Wow.
- [44:57]
B
In next three months, we are launching a stage one pancreatic cancer test. No one has ever done stage one pancreatic cancer. You know, I lost my dad to pancreatic cancer. Imagine if we had a test that could detect his cancer early. We could have saved him. Steve Jobs died because we couldn't detect his cancer early. For the first time, we'll be launching a stage one pancreatic cancer test. We have a test for ibd, Crohn colitis or ibs. And we are validating a test for colon polyps, which is seven years before you develop a colon cancer. The only reason we can do this, Sean, is because we look at gene expression. All other technologies that are doing cancer detection, they're looking for cell free DNA. So your tumor has to be big for it to shed. And that means these tests are really good for stage three and stage four, but not for stage one. But by the time stage three is four, your survival rate is very slim. So if you can detect them at stage one, you can save your life.
- [45:56]
A
That's incredible.
- [45:56]
B
And those are the kind of things, Sean, I'm so proud of. Someone who grew up so poor, that had no food to eat, came to this country with $5 in the pocket, didn't speak the language, and God has been so kind to us that we have everything we could want. I am dedicating my life to giving back to the people who gave me everything I have, given everything I have achieved in my life. Financial success, amazing kids, amazing family. Our kids, every one of them is running a unicorn.
- [46:33]
A
Wow.
- [46:33]
B
My oldest son is 35. He runs a company called Bilt. That company is already worth $11 billion. Right. He's 35 years old. My daughter runs a company called Avi Evvy, a women's health company. And filling the gender gap, as you and I were talking about, women weren't even allowed to be in the clinical trial. That means your wife, your mom, when they take a drug, they're never tested on women and they don't work on women. Women are diagnosed with the same disease seven years later than men. Wow. She decided she's going to solve the gender gap by learning more about women and became the number one women's health company with vaginal microbiome and a company called Abby. My youngest one runs a company called Valen.
- [47:23]
A
Right.
- [47:24]
B
All three of them. You know, my youngest went to Stanford. My daughter went to Stanford. My oldest went to Wharton. Now all these amazing kids that we have, for me, I could do anything I want. I could retire, sit on a warm sun in some private island, and still I work 17 hour days, seven days a week, because I believe it is my obligation, my duty to do the things I can for my fellow humans. Who have given me all this kindness. If I can say God has given us everything. And if I don't do God's work, what right do I have when I die to even ask that I have a place in heaven?
- [48:08]
A
Naveen. That was so beautiful. Almost teared up. Honestly. That was incredible. We're gonna link this below for people to take the test right in the description. Anything else?
- [48:16]
B
It's so cheap, brother. I mean, when we started the company eight years ago to do a test for saliva, blood and stool, it cost $3,000.
- [48:25]
A
Holy crap.
- [48:26]
B
Today, our costs have come down and we sell them all three tests for $399. And I do make about 15% profit on that. But that's all I make. Because that is what allows us to continue to do more good in the world. That's how we are constantly doing it. As our costs come down, we'll drop it down to 299, to 199, to 99 or $49. Or someday give it away. Because the costs have come down enough now. So it is our goal is to do more people to join our mission. If 10 million people instead of one and a half million people did this test, we will have all the data for AI to be able to solve every single problem.
- [49:09]
A
Wow.
- [49:10]
B
We just need enough of humans to care about ourselves and care about humanity. So if we, every person who's listening to it, did the test, we'll get a step closer to solving this problem. So do it for yourself and do it for humanity.
- [49:25]
A
Let's do it, guys. Check the link below. Thanks so much for your time today.
- [49:28]
B
Thank you, brother. What an amazing thank you. You.
- [49:30]
A
Yeah, check them out, guys. Check out Viome. Look on my Instagram. I'm going to take the test later today. Stay tuned. See you next time. I hope you guys are enjoying the show. Please don't forget to like and subscribe. It helps the show a lot with the algorithm. Thank you.