B (1:59)

I repent.

A (2:00)

I'm so sorry. I'll go back to Islam. I'll go back to my Muslim wife, a girl who was lined up for me to be a Muslim wife, My father's business, my community of doctors and lawyers and mentors. It was my whole life, and I walked away from it, and I just repented and wanted to go back. That same night, Christ just slammed me in a dream, man.

B (2:16)

Wow.

A (2:17)

And I heard the words, you have been healed. Now get up and go. When the only reason I recognize that it was Christ was because I had been discipled in the Bible and I knew the words. Trying to make arguments of, you know, the Gospel of John, But I was like, allah would never speak like that, but Christ did. And so I just. In 2022, this was when that happened. I just decided to take a full swing at Christianity. I said, you know, I don't know everything. I tried to defend my faith against people, and I got crushed every time. Being a Christian, like, slaughtered, bro. My whole Muslim community was like, dude, you don't know what you're doing. And everyone in my life was telling me not to do it, but I just had this conviction. I think it was from the Lord. And I got super into apologetics, just trying to, like, save my family and, like, bring all my friends and everyone I knew was Muslim and just rip them out of it. And that's just turned into me learning so much about Islam, how to deconstruct it, the truths behind it. And now I run one of the largest Christian evangelism ministries where we actually focus just on Islam. We're in over a hundred countries. I teach over 6,000 people. Muslim evangelism.

B (3:15)

Wow.

A (3:15)

How to encounter devout Muslims, but in a way that's not disrespectful. Like, in a way that you don't see online, where people like slaughtering Muhammad or coming from moral arguments or political arguments. I have not seen a single devout Muslim get saved because of that stuff. You have to sincerely understand Islam and charitably and do it with, like, a loving heart, like, like a man would, and encounter Muslims and disciple them to lead them out of it. That's the only way through. And the Western church right now is not doing a good job of that at all. We have these debates that don't lead anywhere that are just Jesus versus Muhammad. And it's like no one's getting saved. There's no real traction. And I actually stand completely against that. So that's kind of the story of a really fast story of where I was and who I am today.

B (3:56)

And what caused you to kind of leave Islam? Was it a specific moment or conversation you had?

A (4:00)

It was trying to defend it with all my heart. And there's so many loose threads in Islam. When you pull on one, there's 100 more. So I actually have a system because I think back to that conversion moment when I left Islam and it's. It was very powerful. And I'm like, how do I replicate this? So there's the five pillars of Islam. Right. But I call these the real five pillars of Islam, the five beliefs that any Muslim needs to have to actually stand as a Muslim. And if any of these five pillars really fall, Islam isn't true. Okay. Those five pillars, the first one is that the Bible is corrupted, specifically the Torah. And people try to go like New Testament versus Islam all the time. Horrible strategy. The injeel in the Quran is not the New Testament. The injeel as a Muslim is a revelation given to Jesus. It's in his lifetime, in his language, written down or not. It's not. The disciples teachings like Matthew, Mark, Luke and John in Islamic perspective have no business being in scripture. They're not prophets. They're not sinless prophets. And so when I see Muslims talking with Christians about the angel, they love doing that because it's so easy to talk about the four gospels. There's actually like 40 gospels. It was Barnabas and Thomas and Mary. And so the truth is we only use the Old Testament to deconstruct Islam. And that's where the foundation comes from. A lot of people think that Islam is a heretical offshoot of Christianity. It's actually a heretical offshoot of rabbinical Judaism. Wow. And nobody's talking about this. So Islam comes from Judaism, from primarily rabbinical Judaism. Yes. And there's stats behind this. Jesus is the seventh most mentioned prophet in the Quran. Maybe sixth or eighth something in there. When you look at the verses of the New Testament in the Quran, there's maybe like a hundred. Yeah, there's over a thousand in just the Torah alone, the first five books of the Bible. And so we have all these Christians just focused on the New Testament trying to deconstruct Islam. And they're losing debates. And the Muslim communities are getting stronger. And when I was a Muslim using, trying to debate Christians, I would shred the New Testament. There was nothing nothing could stand.

B (5:47)

Wow.

A (5:48)

And the truth is, as Christians, we only believe in a Messiah because we follow the Jewish Torah. The Jewish Torah is where original sin happens. That's where Adam falls. That's where blood atonement in Leviticus 17 happens, where there is a payment for sin and we can be covered by the blood of an animal. And God actually does come down. God wrestles with Jacob, he talks to Abraham and he's with, you know, the angel of the Lord, the burning bush, all these things God actually manifests on earth all the time. And so him coming down as a Messiah on those three principles alone just come from Genesis.

B (6:20)

Right.

A (6:20)

And Exodus and Leviticus too, honestly. But the Torah. So the truth is we're trying to deconstruct Muslims by giving them like John 3:16, like, so God loved the world that he'll give his only son as your. As your blood atonement. Right. As a former Muslim, that's the most blasphemous thing I've ever heard in my life. Like, Allah doesn't love the whole world. He loves the obedient Muslims. Right. He would never have a son. He's unlike. He's unbegotten, like, unlike anything in this world. And truthfully, man, like, there's no need for blood atonement. Muslims don't believe in that. Adam and Eve were never on earth in the Quran. That's a very big difference. So why would an earthly messiah even be necessary? It's if all you need to do is just repent. So understanding basic Islamic theology, you see that it's not like a New Testament thing. It's actually not about that at all. Yeah, we have a lot of Islamic critiques and stuff about this that we can really dive into. They're pretty in depth though.

B (7:08)

Yeah.

A (7:08)

But I want to lay out just the five pillars of Islam for you and interrupt me if there's anything that you want to talk about, man. But the real five pillars of Islam are that the Torah is corrupted. Specifically that the author of the Bible, whoever wrote the original Torah, original Injeel, is the same author of the Quran, that they're the same God. Basically, it's the same Judeo, Christian God, Abrahamic religion.

B (7:29)

Right.

A (7:30)

The third thing is that Abraham and Ishmael built the Kaaba. If you're engaging Muslims, you have to talk about the Kaaba and then building the Kaaba. The story of that in the Hadith, which is Sahih Bakari 30 64, is completely against the Torah. It totally blasphemes Everything about it. And then of course, Muhammad being related to Abraham, claiming the Abrahamic prophethood, Ishmael was not related to Muhammad, which is a very controversial claim, but I can back it up using the Torah. And then the fifth pillar of Islam is that Muhammad was commissioned as a prophet in the same manner that Moses was. And if you as Christian apologists, if we just focus on those five pillars, Islam will fall. Because the truth is there's an overwhelming evidence for all of those five. But if even just one falls, Islam is false. Wow. And so we can really engage Muslims. And this is why our ministry, we started it six months ago by the grace of God. We've gotten almost 400,000 followers.

B (8:20)

Holy crap.

A (8:21)

100 million views in over 100 different countries. People are like taking my face and like putting in Arabic, which I think is so funny. Dude.

C (8:25)

There's this new technology floating around that people cannot stop talking about. It's called the light system. Before you roll your eyes, it's not some gadget you strap on or supplement that promises the world. Every once in a while I come across something that actually stops me in my tracks. And the light system is one of those things. This isn't a supplement. It's not a biohack. It's a full on energy environment build built to help your mind and body synchronize, recharge and operate at a higher level. It uses light patterns, color frequencies and coherent energy fields. All the stuff that your body naturally responds to to create a coherent, energetic field around you. People are saying they feel more clear, more centered, more aligned in their environment. And honestly, the science behind it is fascinating as I've seen a lot of wellness tech. But the numbers coming out on this new study of the light system are actually insane. Researchers measured human chic cells before and after sitting in front of a system. And get this, a 30 minute session boosted cellular conductivity by 61%. The study even showed increased conductivity in isolated DNA, which is associated with stronger structure and better repair pathways. The result, More clarity, more balance and more alignment. You could save $500 now if you go to thelightsystems.com and use discount code. Sean, how have you grown so quick?

B (9:36)

What do you attribute that to?

A (9:38)

The knowledge, the skill set. What I'm teaching in apologetics is truly not like most apologists out there. It's a new system. And the best thing, man, my goal isn't to slaughter Islam. I love Muslim people. I grew up with them. They're Muslims, make great Christians. I don't want Them becoming atheists. I don't want them becoming.

B (9:57)

That's worse, right?

A (9:58)

Yes. It's Matthew 23:15. Woe to you Pharisees who travel land and sea just to make one convert you make them twice. The son of Satan that you are, Christ is saying. And that's not just for the Pharisees. Christ is coming to us and saying, you travel in and see to convert somebody and you're not discipling them. Right. Muslim, the atheist is just as bad as anything else.

B (10:16)

Right.

A (10:16)

And so it's really important that we understand, like biblically how to do this. And the fact that I'm an ex Muslim just gives me like this, like, weird credential almost you an advantage. Honestly, it's a belief break because you have their perspective. Yeah. And I'm not trying to, like, ruin their, like, critiques. Like, I would never call Muhammad a pedophile. I would never call him a warlord. Double standards everywhere. I don't even call the Quran corrupted. I think the Quran that Muhammad recited, it is what we read today. Yeah. And most Muslims, when they hear that, they're like, I've never heard a Christian say that. Wow.

B (10:42)

Yeah, I've never heard that. Usually they say the Quran is not accurate or.

A (10:45)

Yeah, but we have codexes of the Quran that's called the Codex Masha. I believe that goes back earlier to the date of Muhammad than what most of the New Testament does to Jesus. So we're calling like that corrupted. Like, we're kind of like shooting ourselves.

B (10:56)

I've actually heard them say that the Bible is rewritten as well.

A (11:00)

Yes. And that's what this claim is, is. So when a Muslim says the Bible is corrupted, I refuse to take that as a claim. That is a general, huge, massive claim. We need a where, a when, a who did it. What's the motive? No, it's not. When you look at the stories of the prophets alone in the Old Testament and the Quran, our ministry team has found over 3000 differences. We're actually almost at 5000. We're trying to formalize it. So 3000 is like the soft number. And we still do this every day. This isn't like an unintentional corruption. Like, it wasn't like a scribe who like, had a Hebrew pencil. Right. It's actually a very intentional corruption. If they're claiming that. Because they're claiming the Quran is right. And so that means that there's a Torah that has all those details of the Quran. And the thing is, Muslims, it kind of becomes this conspiracy theory where there's like, every church and synagogue in the world before the time of Muhammad corrupted every single Torah scroll and got the Christians to agree on it. It would be the largest economical, like, church unifying event in all of history if that happened.

B (11:59)

Yeah.

A (11:59)

But that's what they claim happens. And you can see that because Muhammad in the seventh century had a Torah that was somewhat valid. And so when you talk about deconstructing Islam, this is really important stuff, man. And I can get into it for hours.

B (12:13)

Another episode.

A (12:14)

I would love that. It'd be an honor. But the truth is, when I'm evangelizing to Muslims, I get invited into mosques. I don't have this, like, I hate you mentality. Wow. I'm on the streets talking to Muslims. I was at Thanksgiving dinner with my family a couple weeks back, and there's 200 Muslims, and we have them reading a Torah and a Quran side by side. Wow. It's a completely different response. And when you look at how Paul engaged the Pharisees, the false Jews of the time, who rejected the Jewish Messiah, this is what he did. He knew the scriptures. He became one of them to win them over. It's biblical. And the truth is, if you deconstruct using just the scriptures, then you can reconstruct using just the Scriptures and you can lead them to Christ. And that's the most important thing that we're missing as a nation, as a group.

B (12:56)

That's such a unique style, but it seems to be working.

A (12:58)

I mean, yeah, this is what Moses did. This is what Paul did. Yeah.

B (13:02)

Right now, there does seem to be a lot of divide with the two religions.

A (13:05)

It's so sad.

B (13:05)

But you're going about it very differently.

A (13:08)

Yeah. And they make it political. They go like, you know, what country are you supporting? Where do you stand? Yeah. And the truth is what country you support. And especially with, like, the Israel, Palestine stuff is what my position is, if it's not pro kingdom of Christ, we have to condemn it. So if Bibi Netanyahu does a very questionable action, we condemn him. No matter how much love I have for Jewish people, the same way I have love for Muslim people, I love them all individually. We pray for them. If Hamas is launching things off of schools and hospitals to attack people, we have to condemn them too. The whole point is the stance that we should be having is pro kingdom of Christ. And that's my radical worldview these days.

B (13:43)

Yeah. So it's a hot take these days. Well, dude, I can't wait to have you on for a full Episode One of these Days. Where can people find you in the Meantime?

A (13:49)

Yeah, hey. Christunderground.org that's our ministry. We have a free, devout Muslim evangelism course. I actually invite Muslims to take it because I don't care about being Christian. I care about truth. And so we, we invite the largest scholars in the world to actually come and take that course. Christunderground.org My Instagram, realshark Khan. I'm very new in the game, dude. The Lord, like exploded our ministry out of nowhere. But I love talk. I talk to Muslims more than Christians. My goal is to win Muslims. I don't care about Christians. I don't use Christian arguments to get clicks. Like I don't call. You know what we're talking about here.

B (14:22)

Yeah.

A (14:22)

But if you guys are a Muslim, I would love to talk to you. And I'll talk to you for hours. And let's figure out the truth. Because if the truth is, if there's a Medina Torah that does exist out there that matches the Quran, the entire Christian world would stop and look at it. So that's what I'm trying to find.

B (14:37)

I love it, man. Thanks for your time, Jack.

A (14:38)

I love you.

B (14:39)

Thank you for the guys. Peace.

C (14:40)

I hope you guys are enjoying the show. Please don't forget to like and subscribe. It helps the show a lot with the algorithm. Thank you.