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Digital Social Hour
Surviving the Beer Mile: My Record-Breaking Experience | Nick Symmonds DSH #810
00:36:57
Join us on the Digital Social Hour with Sean Kelly as we dive into an epic tale of endurance, nostalgia, and adventure with Olympian Nick Symmonds! From his nostalgic reflections on the '08 and '12 Olympics to his jaw-dropping Beer Mile experience, Nick
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- [00:00]
A
I always look at 08 really, like, with huge nostalgia because it was my first games. That's the moment that makes you an Olympian, which in track and Field, then 12, I knew what I was doing. Like, I wasn't as nervous. I was prepared. I'm so proud because it was like the pinnacle of my career. Like, I. I ran the fastest I ever ran at the highest level in sport. I really proved who I was as an athlete in that moment.
- [00:26]
B
Wherever you guys are watching this show, I would truly appreciate it if you follow or subscribe. It helps a lot with the algorithm. It helps us get bigger and better guests and it helps us grow the team. Truly means a lot. Thank you guys for supporting. And here's the episode. Ladies and gentlemen, Nick Simmons, AKA the bison in the building. Man, what's coming off a break on YouTube.
- [00:45]
A
Yeah, I'm in the middle of a six month break.
- [00:46]
B
Okay, so you set that time frame?
- [00:49]
A
Yeah, I guess publicly I said, I don't know how long this is going to be, but in the back of my mind, I had this big event that was six months away and I was like, be pretty cool if I just took a six month break. I feel that I needed it. And three, four months in, and it is exactly what I needed.
- [01:04]
B
Nice. So you had some burnout.
- [01:06]
A
I keep going back in my mind, like, do I want to use the term burnout? And I don't, I don't think it's what I had. I've been burnt out before as a, as a pro runner, and I ran Pro for 12 years. I know burnout real well. This was boredom. Boredom, which I think there's a. There's a part of burnout that can be boredom. This was just pure boredom. I just made a video every week for seven years and for six and a half, I just loved it. I think I told you. I was on other podcasts and I'm like, I would do this for free. I love this so much. And then it got to a point where I just wasn't. I wasn't like, laying in bed. I used to lay in bed and I would just dream about video ideas. Like, I couldn't shut my mind off. I was so excited about the next video. And then I made all the videos that I wanted to make. And then I was laying in bed, like, oh, gosh, I have to think of another video idea. So I just kind of got. I just kind of got bored with it. Like, I'd made all the stuff I wanted to make. Yeah, I still love the idea. Of YouTube and I still have some huge concepts that I want to make, but like the, the niche we were in, I did that and I like put a bow on it and then I needed to just take a break before I could come back and start creating again.
- [02:12]
B
I feel that there's only so much running you could do. Right.
- [02:15]
A
It was running and it was lifting and it was challenges and it was so much fun. But like I did it.
- [02:21]
B
Yeah.
- [02:22]
A
You know, and I've always been this way. Once I feel like I've accomplished what I set out to accomplish, then I'm over it and I can't be bothered to continue with it. Doesn't say it doesn't mean I don't want to make YouTube videos anymore. Just I don't want to make that kind of YouTube video.
- [02:34]
B
So that six month break is just a mental reset. Do you have a plan when you come back?
- [02:38]
A
Yeah, and I'm already working on it. I just announced on YouTube in the community feature, I was like, guys, I'm not just slacking off. I'm working really hard. Next video drops July 1st. And. And in some ways this is a video I've been working on for 10 years.
- [02:50]
B
Wow.
- [02:50]
A
Yeah. It's a project I've been working on for 10 full years and it all culminates in June. So I'll be filming it and dropping it July 1st.
- [02:58]
B
Is it running related?
- [02:59]
A
No, it's mountaineering. So we talked a little bit about that. When I retired from running, I knew I had to throw myself into something else physical. Like I couldn't just stop. And so I set out two, two kind of simultaneous projects. One to climb to the top of all 50 states and another to climb to the top of all continents. It's called the seven Summits. And I've got two of the seven. And there's this kind of like interlapping, interlapping point on Denali, the tallest mountain in Alaska that happens to be, you know, the end of the 50 state high points challenge, but also one of the seven summits. So that's what I've been training for.
- [03:31]
B
Bang out both of them.
- [03:32]
A
I'm gonna bang out both, you know, tick off two different lists. And I don't know if I can climb this thing. I mean, it's a big mountain.
- [03:39]
B
That one sounds tough. Just because it's in Alaska too.
- [03:41]
A
Yeah. And those super weather dependent, like half the time you get to like 14,000 or 17,000ft and a storm rolls in and you just sit in a tent for seven days and then you got to pack yourself out.
- [03:50]
B
Seven days.
- [03:51]
A
Yeah. Or longer.
- [03:52]
B
Wow.
- [03:52]
A
It'll be three weeks on the mountain, and it's a long time. I've just always wanted to climb it. And I, I, I, you know, just turned 40 and I had this moment. It's like 39 and a half. And I'm like, I, I'm getting kind.
- [04:05]
B
Of old, midlife crisis.
- [04:06]
A
I, I think it was more a realization of the are so many things that I want to do in my life.
- [04:12]
B
Yeah.
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A
And some are going to be harder than others as I get older.
- [04:16]
B
Right.
- [04:16]
A
You know, like, I can make money when I'm 50, 60, 70, but I can only climb some of these mountains, like now.
- [04:23]
B
True.
- [04:23]
A
It's going to get. I, I could climb Denali at 50, but it's going to be harder than climbing it at 40 because you're at.
- [04:28]
B
The tail end of your athletic peak. Right.
- [04:30]
A
I think I, I think I'm on the back end of that curve. Yeah. I'm telling you, I have a lot of tre of tread worn on these tires. You have so many miles that I think, I think I've peaked and now just hanging on for dear life.
- [04:42]
B
Yeah. You said you don't even run anymore.
- [04:43]
A
I can't, man, I would, I would give anything to go out and just hammer an hour.
- [04:46]
B
So you physically can't do it?
- [04:48]
A
No. Well, I could, but I wouldn't be able to walk for a week. My ankles and knees are so shot from 20 years of pro running. 20 years of competitive running, 12 as a pro.
- [04:56]
B
And have you looked into stem cells or anything weird like that? No.
- [04:59]
A
I'm like, I won't even take Tylenol.
- [05:01]
B
Really?
- [05:01]
A
I won't even take a multivitamin. I hate medicine.
- [05:03]
B
No supplements, nothing. What?
- [05:06]
A
Yeah.
- [05:06]
B
Because there's got to be a ton of athletes on supplements.
- [05:08]
A
Yeah. I mean, I was, I was taking supplements when I was a pro. I took, you know, caffeine is the best performance enhancing drug.
- [05:13]
B
Is it for running?
- [05:14]
A
For anything?
- [05:15]
B
Oh, I didn't know that.
- [05:16]
A
Yeah. For, for weightlifting, for maybe not for target shooting. They don't touch caffeine. But like, for explosive or endurance athletics, caffeine's a phenomenally effective performance enhancing drug, and it happens to be one of the ones that's legal. But as far as supplements goes, I took a multivitamin, I took some vitamin D, protein, you know, carbohydrates, that kind of stuff, but nothing beyond that.
- [05:39]
B
Interesting.
- [05:39]
A
But I've always been really opposed to, like, medicine. Not opposed to it. Like, I believe in Western medicine.
- [05:47]
B
Yeah.
- [05:47]
A
I just think we overdo it. So I'm always really like, do I really need to be taking that? And I almost. I mean, I don't take any medicine, don't have any prescriptions, don't take any supplements.
- [05:56]
B
Wow. But something in your case, I don't know if that can heal naturally. Right.
- [06:00]
A
I think that there will need to be a surgery on my left ankle at some point, and I probably have to get my knees done at some point.
- [06:06]
B
Damn. Have you had surgeries before?
- [06:07]
A
Yeah, I had double knee surgery in college to fix some plykectomies, and.
- [06:11]
B
Geez.
- [06:11]
A
I shot my left ankle full of PRP in 2016 trying to get ready for the games, but I wasn't able to. It was just.
- [06:18]
B
Oh, that was a trial. As you didn't qualify for.
- [06:20]
A
That was the. I was qualified for the trials, but I pulled out at the trials because this left ankle wouldn't. It was just done.
- [06:26]
B
And you were fast enough to make it, so that must have been really disappointing, right?
- [06:29]
A
Yeah. I mean, I. You know, I was always good about calling things as I saw it. I'm like, hey, guys, I'm just not in shape for this one. Or I'd say, guys, I have no reason not to win this race. I'm in great shape.
- [06:39]
B
Yeah.
- [06:40]
A
I was in such good shape in 2016, and. And then this ankle just gave out on me, like, two days before you.
- [06:45]
B
Killed it in 12.
- [06:46]
A
I know, man. I was bummed.
- [06:47]
B
You could have meddled in 16, probably, right?
- [06:50]
A
Who knows? You know? Like, it's track and field. I could just as easily have gotten tripped up and not even made it, but. So I. I was working pretty closely with a therapist at the time, and I'm like, how am I gonna get past this? And he's like, how incredible that your body gave you two O games. He's like, yeah, you didn't get the third, but your body held up for 12 freaking years.
- [07:08]
B
Wow.
- [07:09]
A
You needed it to hold up for 12 years and two more months, but for 12 years, it allowed you to do what you wanted to do and made you, you know, it possible for me to see the world and. And race in 34 different countries. So, you know, as. As today's theme seems to be gratitude. I was just like, gratitude. I'm so grateful for everything this body gave me and everything else that I'll be able to do with it. But, no, Rio is not in the cards, apparently.
- [07:31]
B
Yeah. That's a good mindset to have. Yeah. Because some don't even get to one Olympics. So the fact you got two and almost a third is.
- [07:36]
A
Yeah, I was. I was lucky.
- [07:37]
B
Pretty good spot. Yeah.
- [07:38]
A
I was durable. That was my special gift. I wasn't the fastest by any means. Not the genetically most gifted. I mean, people looked at me and they're like, how in the world is this kid running that fast? But I was super durable, so I could bang out 10 miles a day every day, and I did so for 20 years.
- [07:52]
B
Dude, your races were so fun to watch. I still remember the first time I saw you, and I was like, who is that guy? You just come the last.
- [07:58]
A
Everybody always thought that because I was always in dead last, and then I'd turn it on in the last. Last 200 meters. It made it exciting for people, I guess.
- [08:04]
B
That fifth place finish at the 12 Olympics, you were in last, right?
- [08:06]
A
For the entire race? For the last 100 meters.
- [08:09]
B
By a good amount, too. It wasn't even like you were right on them.
- [08:11]
A
No, I was like, this is incredible. I can't believe I'm here. I hope I can not finish dead last. I just wanted to pick off one person the last 100 meters, and I pick off a couple. The race plan was to ultimately do a Dave Waddle like he did in 72, and pick off everybody. But, you know, in the world record race, no one was going to beat David.
- [08:28]
B
Risha, was that the race you set it in?
- [08:29]
A
Yeah.
- [08:30]
B
Oh, wow.
- [08:30]
A
So to be part of that race, you know, again, being grateful. Yeah. I didn't get a medal, but I got to be part of the world record race.
- [08:36]
B
Yeah.
- [08:36]
A
Pretty. Pretty big honor.
- [08:37]
B
Insane. You think 140 will ever be broken in 800? Yeah.
- [08:40]
A
At this point, I don't ever question anything. Like, humans and technology and everything are just coming so far. Like, someone will break 140 in my lifetime. 100% sure.
- [08:50]
B
I thought David was going to do it. I thought so, too, but he's done now. Yeah.
- [08:53]
A
I mean, time gets us all right.
- [08:55]
B
A lot of time. Yeah.
- [08:56]
A
Can't beat him.
- [08:57]
B
Yeah. Did you like the 08 Olympics better or 12th?
- [09:00]
A
It's a great question. I think I'll always. I'll always look at 08 really, like, with huge nostalgia because it was my first Games and, like, that's the moment that makes you an Olympian, which in track and fields, like, you're either an Olympian or no one's ever heard of you.
- [09:14]
B
Right.
- [09:14]
A
And you don't get paid anything then 12, I knew what I was doing. Like, I had already been through the Games. Like, I wasn't as nervous. I was prepared. And I'm proud. I'm so proud. Cause it was like the pinnacle of my career. Like, I. I ran the fastest I ever ran at the highest level in sport. You know, like, I really proved who I was as an athlete in that moment to myself. Yeah. But they both, you know, mean. Mean different things to me, I guess. You know, one. One I stamped myself as Olympian, and the other one, I proved to myself who I can be as an athlete. Yeah.
- [09:46]
B
You peaked at the perfect time.
- [09:48]
A
What was Your best event?
- [09:49]
B
800.
- [09:49]
A
Yeah.
- [09:49]
B
But not. They say it the hardest race. Do you agree with that?
- [09:54]
A
Yes. Maybe not physically, although it is incredibly challenging physically. But, like, strategically, it's the fastest event that breaks from lanes, you know, so the. The way that you're pushing and shoving and jostling and positioning, it is a chess match. And it's why veterans tend to do better because they. They've seen so much. It's why I bombed out of the semifinals in Beijing and, you know, made it to the finals and finished fifth in London. It just takes time to learn how to run that race.
- [10:22]
B
It is a physical race. So what are the. The legal things you could do? Can you elbow people?
- [10:25]
A
Oh, yeah. Oh, you can. The only thing you can do is, like, grab someone's jersey or shove them.
- [10:30]
B
Okay.
- [10:31]
A
But I be elbowing people. The Kenyans used to hate it because they, you know, I was a big guy. Like, as far as runners, the Bison. I was a 165 pounds out there. While my competitors were running at, like, 120, 30 wigs. I just shove them all over the place. If I. If I was boxed in, I need to move. I just give somebody a big shove.
- [10:47]
B
Wow.
- [10:48]
A
And they'd move, and I'd make room. If you go back and watch the 2008 Olympic trial.
- [10:52]
B
Yeah.
- [10:52]
A
That's how I got free, was just giving elbow and people elbow. Yeah. But, like, I was a soccer player, I was a hockey player.
- [10:57]
B
Yeah.
- [10:58]
A
If I need to get somewhere, I'm gonna bump you and just be ready for that.
- [11:01]
B
People say track is a physical sport.
- [11:03]
A
Man, but the 800, especially. Here you are because you're just eight guys moving around the track. And, you know, you. You remember, you never got boxed in because you're 6 foot 5, but if you're 5 foot 9, 5 foot 10, you're tucked into the rail. I got guys like you that are like, there's no way I'm gonna get around you unless I kind of, like, make space for myself.
- [11:20]
B
Yeah. Damn.
- [11:21]
A
You ever Watch Andrew Weeding. He's 6 foot 5.
- [11:23]
B
Yeah. He's a tall runner.
- [11:24]
A
He had to run the entire race in lane two.
- [11:25]
B
I saw that because he, he's so.
- [11:27]
A
Big he can't tuck into the rail. Like there's no rain, there's no room for him. You know, get boxed in and tripped up.
- [11:33]
B
And how much time do you think that adds if you ran it in lane two?
- [11:35]
A
It adds two meters per lap.
- [11:38]
B
Two meters per lap.
- [11:39]
A
So times two laps, that be four, four meters, quarter of a second.
- [11:43]
B
Okay.
- [11:44]
A
Which doesn't sound like a lot, but.
- [11:45]
B
In an 800 would have got me.
- [11:46]
A
A medal if I found that quarter a second.
- [11:48]
B
Yeah, that's true, man. Yeah. Did you think you were going to medal at any point in either Olympics?
- [11:53]
A
Not Beijing.
- [11:54]
B
Okay.
- [11:55]
A
Beijing. I was just like, I remember I was so nervous. I was talking to my, my sports psychologist and I'm like, how am I going to walk into the Bird's Nest and like look up and there's 100,000 people in the stadium and I know there's 1.5 billion people at home watching. He said, just put your head down, look at the track and remember that that track's 400 meters around, made of rubber. Like every track you've ever run on and that's your home.
- [12:18]
B
Right.
- [12:18]
A
And then I was like, yeah, I'm just, I'm home. Like I'm just doing what I do every single day.
- [12:22]
B
Good advice.
- [12:23]
A
Yeah, it was really a good way of just reminding myself that like I had earned the right to be there.
- [12:29]
B
Right.
- [12:29]
A
And that this was my home and that I'm comfortable on a 400 meter flat track.
- [12:33]
B
Yeah.
- [12:33]
A
No matter what, no matter all the other stuff that doesn't matter, like just put it out of your head. Just do what you do. Go to your office. So that helped a lot, but I really thought I would. I was going to medal in London. Right before the race, my coach came up to me and he's this kind of like straight shooting British guy, Mark Roland. And he said, fella, you're not going to win the gold medal today. He said, no one is going to beat David. David is going to be not only the gold medalist, but he's also going to run the world record. So just get that out of your head. But you're going to be the silver medalist and let me tell you how you're going to do it. And so we kind of walked through the race and how everyone was going to go out too hard chasing David.
- [13:11]
B
Everyone.
- [13:12]
A
And then they would, you know, Blow up in the last lap and I would run my race perfect plus two second differential and reel in everybody on that last 200 meters.
- [13:19]
B
Right.
- [13:19]
A
But nobody died. I got only two people died. So I was only able to go from 8th to 5th instead of 8th to 2nd.
- [13:24]
B
The adrenaline for people must have been the noise.
- [13:27]
A
And that's why, you know, superhuman things are done in the Olympic Games. The amount of money that's on the line, the noise, the pressure. Like people who have shown that they rise to the occasion, I mean, they're the ones standing on the line. There's eight guys that have all shown that they can rise to the occasion, right? And the adrenaline just pumping through your veins causes you to do crazy things.
- [13:47]
B
You said money on the line. So how much millions is on the line when you win?
- [13:50]
A
Millions.
- [13:51]
B
Really?
- [13:51]
A
Oh yeah. When you consider what your federation is going to pay you. Because I mean, America doesn't get paid. I think they get like 25 grand for a gold medal. But some federations pay out a million dollars for your sponsors, I'll bet you Nike. I mean, I can't speak to their contracts, but I know some metals are worth million. A million dollars, Holy crap. In track and field. And then you're talking about potential sponsorship on the back end, right? You're talking about the appearance fees that you're gonna get, right. I mean, some of these athletes are getting 25, 50, $100,000 appearance fees to show up to Zurich Diamond League after the Olympics.
- [14:25]
B
Wow.
- [14:26]
A
You know, so all said and done, a gold medal is worth, I mean, conservatively, a million dollars.
- [14:32]
B
I didn't know that. Because the Olympics themselves don't pay anything, right?
- [14:35]
A
They, I, it's a really good question. I never want to live in medal. I think they do, I think they do have some money, money associated with them. Okay. But you know, you just add it up, especially over the course of a lifetime, you know, especially if you get that medal while you're young. It could be worth millions and millions during the course of your career.
- [14:50]
B
Interesting. But you didn't do track for, for money, right? That wasn't the main.
- [14:54]
A
Yes and no. I didn't do it up until about the age of 30. And I always said this. I would do this job for free just because I want to see how fast I can get. Right. But then there came a point where I kind of like reached my peak. 28, 29, I really peaked. Ran my fastest time in the mile, ran my fastest time in the 800. And then I could see each season just getting A little bit slower. And. And at that point I was kind of over it. You know, I talked about putting a bow on it and I'm like, yeah, I saw what I could do. And then after that it was a job.
- [15:24]
B
I feel that.
- [15:25]
A
But because in, in track and field especially, you get paid on like, you know, your resume on your portfolio.
- [15:32]
B
Yeah.
- [15:32]
A
Like I was cashing checks at the age of 31, 32, that were 10 times what I cashed at 22 or 23. Even though I was running faster at 22 or 23, I had built up this resume and. And you know, was getting much bigger appearance fees. And so I felt I owed it to my younger self for having done the work, having come through the process to finally cash those checks.
- [15:55]
B
Yeah.
- [15:55]
A
And. And so I still trained hard. I mean, I really wanted to make it a real team, but it was a job at that point more than like something I would have done.
- [16:03]
B
So. Sounds similar to tennis where only the top like 1% actually make good.
- [16:07]
A
Very similar. It's exponential. You could be the fastest guy in the world and you're making millions. You could be the 8th fastest guy and you're living below the poverty line.
- [16:14]
B
Damn.
- [16:15]
A
Yeah.
- [16:15]
B
That's crazy to me. Yeah. Because other sports you get like a minimum guaranteed contract.
- [16:19]
A
Nothing like that in track.
- [16:20]
B
Wow. And it's so individualized. It's not like you have anyone to hold you accountable.
- [16:23]
A
Right. And the events are different. So if you're the number one, you could be the number 20, fastest guy in the hundred and still making good money. And you could be the number one women's hammer thrower and living below the poverty line. So like there's. There's events that get paid really well and there's events that don't get paid as well.
- [16:39]
B
Which ones get paid the most, you think?
- [16:41]
A
100 mile marathon. That's where the money marathon. Yeah, that's where the big money is.
- [16:46]
B
Okay.
- [16:46]
A
There's still money in the 400 and the 800, the 5k, but the big, big money is in 100 mile marathon.
- [16:52]
B
Interesting. I wonder.
- [16:53]
A
I wasn't good at any of those.
- [16:54]
B
I guess the marathon has a lot.
- [16:55]
A
Of sponsors because you can only run like two a year. Really? Maybe three.
- [17:00]
B
Okay.
- [17:00]
A
And so they're training really hard and they're going for the appearance fees. Right. So like, if you're one of the best marathoners in the world, you're getting a quarter million dollars just to show up.
- [17:10]
B
Damn. Just to show up.
- [17:11]
A
Just to show up. I don't even have to finish Sometimes.
- [17:16]
B
New York Marathon, if you're watching this. Yeah. Come in.
- [17:19]
A
Exactly.
- [17:20]
B
Any races you still think about to this day that haunt you?
- [17:23]
A
No, I'm, like, content you've come. I'm content. There were, when I retired, races that haunt me, and I still couldn't go back and watch some races.
- [17:29]
B
Damn.
- [17:30]
A
I was like, I can't watch that.
- [17:31]
B
Race just because of tactical error or.
- [17:33]
A
Just like, like the, the 12 games. Like, what could have been. I know I did everything possible. I. Everything possible.
- [17:40]
B
Did you felt like you had energy left?
- [17:42]
A
No, nothing. I gave everything I had in that race, and I was a personal best by almost a full second. Like, everything I had.
- [17:48]
B
Yeah.
- [17:48]
A
So I, I was at least at peace with that. But it still hurt to watch. No, I, I mean, I look back on it, I'm just like, what a great chapter in my life, you know, Like, I got to see the world. I made some money, I made some friends. I just had such an incredible time doing again, how, how lucky for anyone out there, no matter what you're doing, whether it's sport or building a business or, you know, even your career, whatever it may be, to wake up and say, like, I look forward to my job on Monday or I would do this for free. I love it so much. If you can find that it's the holy grail in life to get paid to do something you would do for free. It's like getting struck by lightning. And I feel like I've been struck twice now, once with running and then again with YouTubing. Nice. So I just, I feel very, very lucky.
- [18:34]
B
I love that. So you even like the training aspect of, like the long 10 mile, 20 mile days?
- [18:38]
A
It's an acquired taste, you know, like, as you probably remember, like, it's an acquired taste I. I hated in high school.
- [18:44]
B
Yes.
- [18:45]
A
I'm like this suc. Bad. Like, why am I doing this? I did it because I was good at it, but I hated the training. Then in college, it got a little bit better. It's like, okay, I've been in class for eight hours. It's nice to go blow off some steam with the guys. You know, running through Oregon was beautiful. And then as a pro, when I had nothing else to do, it was amazing. It's like, wait a minute. You mean that in today's waking day, from 8am to whenever I go to bed, all I have to do is get my workout in and you're going to pay me to do it? Like, it was incredible.
- [19:12]
B
I feel that. And your first couple years, you were Talking earlier, you. You only made 25,000 a year.
- [19:16]
A
My first contract with Nike was right around there.
- [19:19]
B
Wow. You were stoked.
- [19:20]
A
I was so happy. That's crazy, because coming out of college, I was like, you know, how am I going to pay my bills? I really want to train. And I kind of made this decision, like, I am going to train for the Olympic Games, even if I have to work at McDonald's to pay my bills. But I had a great senior season. And coming out of college, Nike picked me up on a small contract. And I was so ecstatic because I was like, I can train full time now. I started to live very simply. It was a very small contract, but I didn't care about money. All I cared was that I could put every ounce of my energy into trying to make the team.
- [19:50]
B
Yeah. Sigma Chi fraternity.
- [19:51]
A
Yeah.
- [19:52]
B
How'd you balance that with running?
- [19:53]
A
Not well. That was actually due to an injury, so I'd never thought about joining a fraternity. But my sophomore year, I had to have double knee surgery. Cost me my cross country season. Cost me, like, six months of training.
- [20:04]
B
Damn.
- [20:05]
A
And I realized that year that all the friends that I had made were just runners.
- [20:09]
B
Yeah. Are you interested in coming on the Digital Social Hour podcast as a guest will? Click the application link below in the description of this video. We are always looking for cool stories, cool entrepreneurs to talk to you about business and life. Click the application link below. And here's the episode, guys.
- [20:24]
A
And I didn't want to hang out with them right then because I was, you know, going through it real low and didn't want to even talk running. And someone was like, well, you know, join. Join a fraternity. Like, you'll have. Have a bunch of instant friends, and you can just like, not think about running. So I did that. It was a blast. I had fun with it again my junior year. But you could kind of tell it was, like, getting in the way of my recovery physically. You know, I mean, shoot, I'd put £20 on just drinking beer and lifting weights, Right?
- [20:49]
B
Crazy.
- [20:49]
A
So I had to lose all that weight. And then going from my junior to senior year was when I was like, okay, I got nine months to figure out how I'm going to make a living. And. And, you know, I'd like it to be pro running. I'm gonna have to go all in on this idea. So the summer between my junior and senior year, I moved to Central Mexico, trained for three months with a bunch of Kenyans. Wow. Pro Kenyans at altitude. Learned everything about pro running. Came down 20 pounds lighter. And just every. Every time I touched the track. New pr.
- [21:18]
B
New pr.
- [21:19]
A
New pr. And that's when Nike picked me up.
- [21:21]
B
Wow. So training at altitude, you'd credit that to helping you a lot, right?
- [21:25]
A
Still to this day, like, altitude, I just. Weight will melt off me. Like, if I ever have a problem with my weight, I'll just go live at altitude for two or three months and melts off.
- [21:35]
B
I didn't know that. Yeah.
- [21:36]
A
So I train at like 1:68 during the year, but then I'd go to Flagstaff, Arizona every April for four weeks, and I'd come down 10 pounds lighter.
- [21:46]
B
Holy crap. That makes sense. When NBA teams go to Denver to play, they're out of breath.
- [21:50]
A
Oh, yeah. And that's only 5, 000ft, right? I mean, we were training at Flagstaff at 7, and I would. I would train at Toluca at 9.
- [21:59]
B
Holy.
- [21:59]
A
You know, like, the higher the better for me.
- [22:01]
B
That's insane.
- [22:01]
A
And it's hard. I mean, you feel like you're out of breath the whole time and your time suck. But, yeah, you're building red blood cells. The weight's melting off you. You come down to sea level and you can almost, like, taste the air. It's like. It's like breathing syrup. You're like. There's so many oxygen molecules. It's incredible. And then you just crush workouts.
- [22:19]
B
I feel that when I go to Jersey. It feels like so different, the air out there. Because out here in the desert, there's no trees.
- [22:24]
A
Yeah. And it's thinner.
- [22:25]
B
It's definitely thinner. You mentioned beers. In college, you ran the beer mile. Yeah. Yeah.
- [22:31]
A
So for those that don't know what the beer mile is, you drink a beer from an unmodified 12 ounce can or bottle. Then you run a lap, and you gotta do that four times. So four beers, four laps. My best. I did it like two weeks after the Olympic Games in 12, and I ran 519.
- [22:46]
B
Crazy.
- [22:46]
A
Which at the time was an American record. What's gone and been destroyed since then?
- [22:52]
B
Someone beat it.
- [22:52]
A
Oh, yeah. There are people doing like 4, 34, 20 miles now. Beer miles.
- [22:56]
B
Oh, my gosh. Did you throw up?
- [22:58]
A
I didn't. You get disqualified if you throw up and you're just wasting good beer. It's a fun buzz. Because not recommending that anyone do this.
- [23:05]
B
Yeah.
- [23:06]
A
But as the adrenaline wears off, the alcohol in your system goes up. And so, like, you have this, like.
- [23:11]
B
Yeah. Did you feel drunk by the third lap?
- [23:13]
A
No. You don't feel it at all?
- [23:14]
B
Oh, really?
- [23:15]
A
Yeah. Because it's not enough time, you know? And you're just full of adrenaline.
- [23:17]
B
Okay.
- [23:18]
A
Don't feel the alcohol at all. Even when you finish, you're like, oh, man, that's crazy.
- [23:22]
B
You don't feel it after.
- [23:23]
A
Don't feel the alcohol, what, 10 minutes after you're spinning. Oh, just spinning.
- [23:27]
B
Four beers.
- [23:28]
A
Yeah.
- [23:28]
B
In 10 minutes? Is in under 10 minutes.
- [23:30]
A
Yeah. I haven't done it since. I don't know when the last one was. I don't know, a few years back. They're not fun. They're miserable. Don't do them.
- [23:36]
B
Yeah, it sounds fun. On paper, you're like, oh, let's do this, guys. But then you do it. And I did it in high school with my track team, and we all threw up.
- [23:43]
A
And you're, like, burping and, like, foam everywhere.
- [23:46]
B
Yeah.
- [23:46]
A
It's nasty.
- [23:47]
B
Are you drinking when you hike? When you hike?
- [23:49]
A
No.
- [23:49]
B
Mountains?
- [23:50]
A
Never. Yeah, I. I mean, I'm 40 years old. Like, I enjoy whiskey. Enjoy a gin and tonic here and there. I still drink beer when I'm on a mountain. Am, like, in a different zone. And some of these are. These aren't, like, you know, afternoon hikes, which I do. I love those too. And I. I might have a beer on one of those. But when you're climbing one of these big mountains, it's. It's not just, like. It's not just out hiking. You're surviving. So on Denali. When I go to Denali Denali, a plane will fly me into the glacier, and I'll have three or four weeks worth of supplies that are in my backpack and on a sled behind. Damn. And that pilot's not coming back for three or four weeks.
- [24:26]
B
So you're alone?
- [24:27]
A
No, I'll be with. I'll be with a crew.
- [24:28]
B
Okay.
- [24:28]
A
I'm gonna climb with. With a guide and a couple other climbers. But the plane's not coming back to get you for three or four weeks. So you gotta survive.
- [24:35]
B
So you can't even back out.
- [24:37]
A
There's no way. There's not like a please, like, come pick me up. There's no, like, come.
- [24:41]
B
There's no service.
- [24:41]
A
There's no service. There's not, like, come get me. We carry sat phones with us. So, like, if something went really bad, they'd helicopter in and get you.
- [24:47]
B
Wow.
- [24:48]
A
But, yeah, for the most part, you're on your own out there, dude.
- [24:50]
B
That's.
- [24:51]
A
You know, and so it's. You really think about more is, like, survival than you're thinking about. Like, out having a good time.
- [24:56]
B
So you're a little adrenaline junkie.
- [24:59]
A
Yeah, it's like, I don't. I suppose someone would. Someone would call it that.
- [25:02]
B
Yeah.
- [25:02]
A
I'm an. I'm an adventure junkie.
- [25:04]
B
Feel that, my friend.
- [25:05]
A
I'm hopelessly addicted to like adventurous big and small.
- [25:08]
B
Love it.
- [25:09]
A
Yeah.
- [25:09]
B
My friend Mike Posner, he's a musician.
- [25:11]
A
Yeah, I know Mike. Oh, you know Mike climbed Everest.
- [25:12]
B
Yeah, Yeah.
- [25:13]
A
I went on a retreat with him to pull in Poland to see Wim Hof about three or four years ago.
- [25:16]
B
Sick. Yeah. He said it for two months, I think.
- [25:18]
A
Yeah. I was like, holy Everest takes for next year. If I do it, it'll be two months door to door. It's like April 1st to June one.
- [25:24]
B
Yeah. And he said there was an avalanche one day and he was. He almost died.
- [25:27]
A
Yeah.
- [25:28]
B
Crazy. Yeah.
- [25:28]
A
He's incredible, man.
- [25:30]
B
What a story. And he walked across the country.
- [25:32]
A
Yeah. That's what kind of got him into mountaineering a little.
- [25:34]
B
Yeah.
- [25:35]
A
He's like, I just love walking.
- [25:36]
B
I actually want to climb a mountain. Now you're inspired.
- [25:38]
A
What do you want to climb?
- [25:39]
B
I gotta start small.
- [25:40]
A
So for Those listening, this 50 state high point thing is the, is the most incredible way to dip your toes in. Because everyone in America at least lives next to one. Because there's 50 states and you live in one of those states and that state has a high point. And you could go to Florida right now and just drive to it. You could go to Mount Sunflower I think. Was that Kansas? And just drive to it. So a lot of these you can just drive up. But that's an adventure in and of itself.
- [26:04]
B
Just driving, just.
- [26:05]
A
Just driving and seeing the country. And then if you wanted to like branch out a little bit, you know, like Mount Rogers I think is Virginia. That's a great hike. Mount Marcy up in New York is a great hike. Wow. And then if you really want to push yourself, Mount Hood, Mount Whitney, Boundary Peak here in Nevada, Rainier. I mean, Rainier is a three day, like glaciated mountain. That's very, very tough.
- [26:25]
B
Which one was the hardest for you so far?
- [26:29]
A
Hood took three tries.
- [26:30]
B
Which state is that?
- [26:31]
A
That's Oregon.
- [26:32]
B
Oregon.
- [26:32]
A
Hood took three tries because I was really a novice and I was like, I'll just go hiking. You can't hike, Hood. You gotta like know what you're doing.
- [26:38]
B
It's super steep, super steep.
- [26:40]
A
And like you can only climb it for like a couple months out of the year. And I was off season, like these rocks were raining down I'm like, I'm gonna freaking die here. So I had to, like, actually start learning about the mountains and researching them and best practices. And I took a mountaineering course. And so, like, as you get better and better, you, like, kind of know how to predict mountains. Montana was Granite Peak. That was brutal.
- [27:07]
B
Montana.
- [27:07]
A
Sometimes I make them more difficult than they need to be. Like, I did Rainier in 24 hours. No one should ever do that. You should, like, take time.
- [27:13]
B
So these take days.
- [27:14]
A
Some of them.
- [27:15]
B
Okay.
- [27:15]
A
I did Whitney in 24 hours, too. That was horrible.
- [27:17]
B
Just straight. No sleep.
- [27:19]
A
Yeah. Just.
- [27:19]
B
Wow. You're an animal.
- [27:20]
A
Well, that. That was how I used to be. Now I'm like, slow and steady wins this race. Yeah, you should climb, though. I mean, if you want. If you wanted to, like, just go out and climb Boundary peaks not far from you. That's a nice one. That's Nevada's highest.
- [27:32]
B
I'll try it out. Man. I've been to Red Rock.
- [27:33]
A
Red Rocks? Yeah, I ran. I ran around there.
- [27:36]
B
Oh, yeah? Jesus.
- [27:38]
A
Well, when you're a pro runner and the coach gives you a run, like, you got to get it done even if you're in Vegas.
- [27:42]
B
Yeah.
- [27:43]
A
You got to go out.
- [27:43]
B
Any crazy running stories? Because I. I've got a couple, actually.
- [27:46]
A
I want to hear yours.
- [27:47]
B
I mean, not as crazy as yours, but I rolled my ankle so bad once, and I was seven miles out, so I had to limp seven miles back to my high school training facility.
- [27:55]
A
Brutal.
- [27:56]
B
Crazy.
- [27:56]
A
No cell phone.
- [27:57]
B
No cell phone. Any stories like that for you?
- [27:59]
A
Well, one at Red Rocks.
- [28:00]
B
Yeah.
- [28:00]
A
So I was out here. I can't remember what was for some meeting, but I was still pro runner. And coach was like, hey, you need to get your long run in. And he's like, I want you to do 10. No more. No more than 10. And so someone's like, oh, go to Red Rocks. It's beautiful. So I went out there and, like, I'm kind of like eyeballing it on the map, and I'm like, okay, from here to there is like 10 mile loop.
- [28:19]
B
Yeah.
- [28:20]
A
And so I just turn my GPS watch on, I start running from my car, and I get to 10 miles, and I'm still a long ways away from my car. And I'm like, coach said no more than 10. Like 12 isn't that much more. So I ran another 2 miles and my car's still nowhere to be seen. And I'm like, if I. If I don't. Like, this could end up being an 18 mile run. I could Injure myself. I'm not careful.
- [28:40]
B
Yeah.
- [28:41]
A
And so I just start hitchhiking. I used to hitchhike a lot when I was a kid, so I'm not. I'm, like, kind of used to it, and. But I'm just like. I'm literally just in little shorty shorts. Like, we run in. They don't have a shirt on. I'm just in shorty shorts, freezing off in, like, the Nevada winter out there. And I'm holding my thumb up, and this Prius rolls up, and they're like, are you okay? I'm like, I'm parked just on the other side of the loop. Like, I've already run 12. I don't think I can get to my car. And they're like, hop in. And they start driving me, and they're like, it's really dangerous. You shouldn't be doing this. And I'm like, oh, I used to do it all the time when I was a kid in Idaho. And they're like, idaho, we're from Boise. And turns out that the guy driving the car had worked for my dad. No, it was like, a super small, super small world. Yeah.
- [29:22]
B
What are the odds? And that was in Vegas, Just outside Vegas. Yeah.
- [29:25]
A
They're like, oh, yeah. We just drove down here for the week to, like, to climb a little bit.
- [29:28]
B
Wow.
- [29:29]
A
So they got me my car, and they're like, please don't hitchhike anymore. Don't tell my dad.
- [29:34]
B
That's crazy. You ever get hit by a car running?
- [29:36]
A
No. Thank God. Because I know some people that have. Yeah, that was a cyclist, too.
- [29:39]
B
Oh, yeah.
- [29:40]
A
People just texting and driving and.
- [29:42]
B
Oh, yeah. These days. Yeah. It's got to be.
- [29:43]
A
I think I always say this. They're like, because I'm a pilot and a mountain climber, and they're like, aren't you worried about the risks that you take? I'm like, not even close to the risk that I take when I'm road biking. I think road bike, and I. I'm a super safe road biker. I think road cycling might be the most dangerous thing that I.
- [29:58]
B
Seriously.
- [29:59]
A
Because. Not. Not. Because if I was just doing it on a green belt, that'd be fine. But if you do it on a road with drivers who aren't paying attention, statistically, that is a very, very dangerous thing to do.
- [30:08]
B
Right. My coach always made us run towards the traffic. Traffic. Yes.
- [30:12]
A
You can see him coming, and you can kind of, like, tell if they're.
- [30:15]
B
Yeah, he would get pissed if he ever saw us, like, running with Traffic.
- [30:18]
A
Yeah. You miss it?
- [30:19]
B
I do miss running, but like you said, a lot of damage on the joints.
- [30:22]
A
Yeah.
- [30:23]
B
So I don't know.
- [30:23]
A
Especially your size, man.
- [30:24]
B
Yeah, I got injured all the time running, dude.
- [30:27]
A
You're running Rutgers.
- [30:28]
B
I ran in high school. I could have ran in Rutgers, but I. I liked partying a bit too much.
- [30:32]
A
Yeah. My sister was a state champ in soccer and cross country and track, Dan. And she. Everybody wanted to recruit her, and she's like, nothing. I'm just gonna go enjoy college because she saw how much work I was doing.
- [30:42]
B
Yeah. Yeah.
- [30:43]
A
She's my little sister. And she's like, yeah, I don't know if I want to do that. And I'm like, you're so smart.
- [30:47]
B
So how much of that is genetics versus hard work in your family?
- [30:50]
A
I mean, genetics obviously plays a role. Everyone always asks me, like, can I become an Olympian just with hard work?
- [30:56]
B
I'm like, probably not.
- [30:57]
A
Probably not. You have to have some genetic gift. So.
- [31:00]
B
So your parents were pretty solid.
- [31:02]
A
They were great athletes. Yeah. Not like Olympians, but they. They, you know, good athletes. But then I know a lot of people who were genetically more gifted than me that just wouldn't do the work. So you have to have both parts, right. To reach that upper level. You have to be genetically gifted, and then you have to work off to, as I called it, like, realize the gift.
- [31:21]
B
Yeah.
- [31:22]
A
I used to say I was born with a lottery ticket, but the only way I can cash it in is by running 10 miles every day. Yeah, that's how I viewed it.
- [31:28]
B
So how many days did you do that? Straight 10 miles.
- [31:30]
A
I mean, I averaged 10 miles a day for 15, 20 years.
- [31:34]
B
Holy crap. No days off.
- [31:36]
A
We took two weeks off every year. And, like, I would take out days off occasion. So I say we average 10 miles a day. But, like, you know, sometimes I'd call coach up and be like, coach, I can't. I'm like, I physically can't get out of bed after yesterday's workout. Like, I'm spent.
- [31:47]
B
Yeah.
- [31:48]
A
And he'd be like, okay, go aqua jog for an hour instead.
- [31:50]
B
Good old.
- [31:51]
A
Or sometimes. Sometimes he would say, you can take a day off. But I really don't believe in scheduling days off at that level because what if you feel great? You know, save the days for when you really need them.
- [32:03]
B
Got it.
- [32:04]
A
The only time we'd really schedule time off is at the end of a season. Season would run through mid September. And then if you were trying to, like, get yourself ready for another 50 week cycle, you just take two weeks totally off.
- [32:15]
B
Damn.
- [32:16]
A
And I would just drink beer and go fishing and.
- [32:18]
B
Two weeks.
- [32:19]
A
Then I'd be like, okay, I think I'm ready to drive back to it.
- [32:21]
B
And what minute per mile? What mile per minute pace?
- [32:24]
A
Yeah.
- [32:24]
B
For the 10 miles, were you running out?
- [32:25]
A
If it was a long run, like a progression run might start at like seven minute miles, work your way down to like six minute miles.
- [32:32]
B
Yeah.
- [32:33]
A
But sometimes, you know, like an evening run because I would do doubles a lot run in the morning and the evening. Sometimes in the evenings I do four miles just listening to music at like eight mile pace. Eight minute per mile.
- [32:44]
B
Oh yeah.
- [32:44]
A
Just time on your feet.
- [32:45]
B
That sounds pretty doable.
- [32:46]
A
It's doable. Yeah. So a lot of times I'd invite people. No, I was dating back in my 20s and I'd be like, yeah, let's go for a run. They're like, huh, I'm going to run with you. I'm like, I'm serious. Like, you'll like this. And we would just go out and go for like, you know, 30 minute stroll around Priest Trail at 8 minute pace. It was really easy. And they didn't get invited to like the, the track the next day. But like, yeah, you know, it's. I had a lot of friends that were just casual runners that I'd run with in the evenings.
- [33:10]
B
And did you train alone or do you, did you have somebody to keep up? Okay. Yeah.
- [33:13]
A
I was lucky for eight years with Nike, I had the Oregon Track Club Elite and Eugene. And then I moved to Seattle when I started running for Brooks. And I ran with the Brooks Beasts. And I always felt I didn't mind training on my own. I was one of those people that like, I can train on my own. I just loved having a team around me. So much more energy and more support and it's easier when I go to.
- [33:33]
B
The gym alone and lift. It's. It feels longer.
- [33:35]
A
Yeah.
- [33:35]
B
Same with the sauna.
- [33:36]
A
Yeah.
- [33:36]
B
Like when I have people to talk to, it just goes back.
- [33:38]
A
Yeah. Just have fun, you know? Like, what could be more fun than being outdoors with, with your, with your friends? Like especially as runners on those easy runs, you're running slow enough. We called it conversational pace.
- [33:47]
B
Yeah.
- [33:48]
A
So if you're going to go run for an hour, it'd be more fun to run with the guys and talk about anything you want to talk about. Absolutely.
- [33:54]
B
I want to end off with Run Gun man. You've built quite an empire there.
- [33:57]
A
Yeah, it was great. I was founder and CEO for seven years. Six, seven years. And then I kind of woke up one day and I was like, I don't. I don't want to be the CEO anymore. So I hired my replacement.
- [34:08]
B
Yeah. Yeah.
- [34:09]
A
And he's still the CEO. And I just a silent investor basically.
- [34:13]
B
Nice.
- [34:13]
A
I loved it. Again, kind of like talk about just like laying awake at night like dreaming about things.
- [34:18]
B
Yeah.
- [34:18]
A
There was a time there as my. As my running career was winding down. And I'd just be like, I want to create a business so bad. But after leading it for six years, I just want to go do something else. And that's been really like. The story of my career is like I get really into something and I go all in. And I find. Because I. Because I go all in. I find success and I just love it and hammer it to death until I'm over it. And then I move on to the next thing. And I've kind of done that for 20 years now.
- [34:44]
B
That's how I am. I think it's a new era. I think with our parents. They had the same job their whole lives.
- [34:48]
A
Yeah.
- [34:48]
B
And some of them didn't like it. But they didn't want.
- [34:49]
A
They just grinded.
- [34:50]
B
Yeah. Because of the benefits or whatever. But now we're in an age where you can just do a bunch of different things well.
- [34:54]
A
And you also have to think about living for like 100 years. Right. So like the, the Japanese have this term. I'm going to mess it up. Ikigai. Which is like your, your reason for being. And they don't have the word retirement.
- [35:06]
B
Wow.
- [35:07]
A
Which I love. There shouldn't be. I think we should just get this, this idea of retirement out of our vernacular. Like we shouldn't even use the word. It's like, what are you gonna go to next? You don't have to. Like, you could quit your 9 to 5, but don't retire. Just move into the next thing. It doesn't necessarily have to be making money. It could be volunteering. It could be growing vegetables. I don't know. Like, I don't ever want to retire. I just want to move on to the next thing. So I'm gonna keep making YouTube videos. But when the day comes that I don't want to make a YouTube video, I'll need to move into the next thing. And I just want to keep pursuing my passions until I die.
- [35:40]
B
100 agree.
- [35:41]
A
I'll feel like that was a great life. Right. You're obviously living the same lifestyle.
- [35:44]
B
Dud. Never retire. Cuz this is fun to me. Like just having conversations with the people that are the best at what they.
- [35:49]
A
Got struck by lightning.
- [35:50]
B
Yeah, dude. It's one of the best jobs ever, in my opinion.
- [35:53]
A
Yeah.
- [35:53]
B
Being a content creator, you're a great one. Yeah. Thank you so much, man. Where can people find out what you're up to, man?
- [35:58]
A
You know, I plug things for 20 years. I plug shoes. I plugged run gum. I plugged my YouTube channel. I'm on a break. So, like, you can go check me out on Instagram or nicksimmons.com but you're not gonna see anything for a few months. If you do want to follow along this story of the mountaineering, you know, and trying to climb Denali, that video will drop early July. Right now, we're scheduling it for July 1st.
- [36:20]
B
Nice.
- [36:21]
A
And it'll be. It'll be cinematic. It'll be stunning. And you'll find out if I have what it takes to get to the top of the tallest mountain in North America. I don't think I do. I'm just gonna say that right now. I don't think I have what it takes to get to the top of this mountain. I've struggled at altitude. I'm working my butt off, dude. I'm training seven days a week. Like, I'm. I'm gonna. I'm gonna do everything possible to find success on that mountain.
- [36:41]
B
Wow.
- [36:42]
A
And then, you know, it is there, isn't there?
- [36:44]
B
I think with the cameras on, it adds more pressure to you. So.
- [36:46]
A
Yeah. And I respond well to pressure.
- [36:49]
B
Thanks so much for coming on. Thank you, guys. Yeah. Thanks for watching, guys. See you tomorrow.