The Science Behind Wasabi Method: Heal Smarter, Not Harder | Adam Gavine DSH #1321

Summary

Digital Social Hour: The Science Behind Wasabi Method with Dr. Adam Gavine

Episode: "The Science Behind Wasabi Method: Heal Smarter, Not Harder | Adam Gavine DSH #1321"
Release Date: April 13, 2025
Host: Sean Kelly
Guest: Dr. Adam Gavine

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Introduction

In this enlightening episode of Digital Social Hour, host Sean Kelly engages in a deep dive with Dr. Adam Gavine, a seasoned chiropractor and co-founder of Wasabi Method. The discussion centers around the innovative shockwave therapy developed by Wasabi Method, exploring its scientific foundations, applications, and the transformative impact it has on musculoskeletal health.

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Background of Dr. Adam Gavine

Dr. Adam Gavine brings over 14 years of experience in chiropractic care, specializing in shockwave therapy. His extensive background includes international training and teaching roles across countries such as China, Indonesia, Korea, Malaysia, and Australia. Currently pursuing a Master’s of Research at the University of Sydney, Dr. Gavine emphasizes evidence-based practices and continuous learning.

Notable Quote:
"I'm all about the research because I'm actually doing my Masters of research at the University of Sydney. I'm happy to share them." [11:50]

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Understanding the Wasabi Method

Wasabi Method is more than just a shockwave therapy device; it's a comprehensive approach to healing that integrates biomechanical, physiological, and pathological knowledge. The method employs radial pressure waves to stimulate the body's natural healing processes, promoting tissue repair and regeneration.

Notable Quote:
"We’re causing all these growth factors. So I’m telling your body to make new veins and new lymphatics." [26:44]

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How Shockwave Therapy Works

Shockwave therapy utilizes acoustic sound waves to treat various musculoskeletal issues. Dr. Gavine explains the different energy levels used in shockwave treatments:

• High Energy: Used in lithotripsy to break down kidney stones, requiring general anesthesia due to pain intensity.
• Medium to Low Energy: Facilitates tissue healing and repair without the need for anesthesia.

Wasabi Method’s device operates within a therapeutic window, delivering radial pressure waves that are slightly lower in energy than traditional shockwaves but sufficient to induce physiological changes.

Notable Quote:
"When you use medium or low energy sound waves, they cause tissues to heal and repair." [02:09]

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Physiological Benefits and Effects

Dr. Gavine highlights 19 physiological effects of shockwave therapy, with significant emphasis on:

1. Angiogenesis: Promotion of new blood vessel formation through the release of Vascular Endothelial Growth Factor (VEGF), enhancing blood flow and oxygenation to treated areas.

   Quote:
   "It tells your body to grow new blood vessels in that area and that's a permanent change." [13:30]

2. Fibroblast Proliferation: Stimulates the production of fibroblasts, cells responsible for cleaning and repairing tissues, akin to having more "repairmen" within the body.

   Quote:
   "It's more that I'm stimulating the body to create more of these repairmen, the fibroblasts." [16:20]

3. Neovascularization: Encourages the growth of new veins and lymphatic vessels, addressing conditions like lymphedema and improving overall tissue health.

   Quote:
   "It's called neovascularization. I'll link some studies that show that." [26:44]

4. Inflammation Reduction: Decreases neurogenic inflammation by downregulating inflammatory pathways, providing relief from pain and swelling.

   Quote:
   "It causes the nociceptors to release substance P, which decreases neurogenic inflammation." [28:11]

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Applications in Various Conditions

Wasabi Method’s shockwave therapy is versatile, addressing a wide range of musculoskeletal issues:

• Tendon Problems: High success rates (80-85%) in treating tendons, such as tennis elbow and rotator cuff injuries.

  Quote:
  "Tendon problems are notoriously bad at getting better or they come back often. We're trying to fix the problem, not just treat the symptoms." [27:44]

• Skin Health: Enhances collagen production, aiding in the treatment of cellulite and skin rejuvenation.

• Wound Healing: Effective for diabetic ulcers and pressure wounds by promoting tissue regeneration.

• Lymphedema: Improves lymphatic function by encouraging new lymphatic vessels to bypass damaged areas.

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Safety and Efficacy

Dr. Gavine emphasizes the safety and minimal side effects of shockwave therapy. A notable study discussed included nearly 2,000 patients with zero severe side effects, highlighting the therapy’s exceptional safety profile.

Notable Quote:
"We had zero side effects, which is unheard of." [22:13]

Common minor side effects include temporary redness, soreness, or inflammation, typically resolving within 24-48 hours.

Quote:
"The benefits just seem to outweigh the risk tremendously." [22:52]

---

Business Story and Origin of Wasabi Method

The inception of Wasabi Method is rooted in Dr. Gavine’s extensive experience and his collaboration with Dave Asprey, a prominent figure in the biohacking community. Initially facing challenges in partnering with major shockwave device companies due to influencer associations and lack of sales experience, Dr. Gavine and Asprey pivoted to collaborate with a more receptive company, granting them autonomy over branding and operations.

Notable Quote:
"We picked the name Wasabi because it's catchy and memorable. Our tagline is 'spicy, but it's good.'" [09:26]

This autonomy allowed Wasabi Method to develop comprehensive educational modules covering various body systems and advanced treatment techniques, distinguishing them from competitors who offer limited training.

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Future Directions and Upcoming Events

Wasabi Method is actively expanding its reach and impact. Upcoming plans include participation in biohacking conferences, where they will offer free treatments to introduce more practitioners and the public to their innovative methods. Dr. Gavine also highlights the ongoing development of advanced treatment protocols and educational resources to support practitioners in delivering optimal care.

Notable Quote:
"We’re going to be offering free treatments at the biohacking conference to let people try Wasabi Method out." [20:33]

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Conclusion

This episode of Digital Social Hour provides a comprehensive overview of the Wasabi Method and its groundbreaking approach to musculoskeletal health through shockwave therapy. Dr. Adam Gavine’s expertise and passion for evidence-based treatments underscore the transformative potential of this therapy in promoting long-term healing and overall well-being.

For more information on Wasabi Method and to explore their services, visit wasabimethod.com or follow them on Instagram @Wasabi_Method.

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Highlighted Quotes with Timestamps:

• "It tells your body to grow new blood vessels in that area and that's a permanent change." — Dr. Adam Gavine [13:30]
• "We have about a 80 to 85 success rate on most tendons." — Dr. Gavine [27:00]
• "We had zero side effects, which is unheard of." — Dr. Gavine [22:13]
• "We’re going to be offering free treatments at the biohacking conference." — Dr. Gavine [20:33]

---

This summary encapsulates the key discussions and insights from the podcast, providing a detailed and structured overview for those who haven’t listened to the episode.

Transcript

[A]

Started getting them to exercise, like, say, doing push ups. If they started doing push ups every day, would they get stronger?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Does it matter that they're 90?

[B]

No.

[A]

No. Your physiology will respond as long as your heart's still beating. You got pulse? The physiology still responds. Maybe not as quickly as when you were 20, but it's still there.

[B]

All right, guys, Dr. Adam Gavin here today in Las Vegas from Australia.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Let's go down under.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

Long flight.

[A]

Now I'm up above, I guess.

[B]

Yeah. Long flight. So appreciate you coming out.

[A]

Yeah, not a problem. I'm glad to be here.

[B]

Yeah. What's been the latest for you? You just adjusted me and I feel amazing.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah. Well, we just. We noticed a few things when you sat down that your posture kind of wasn't ideal. You've been working most of the day, so.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

With a bit of slouching and, and sitting and stuff like that. You just are a body adapts to these postures. And then I just need to kind of reset you to get everything right again. You can do a lot of exercises and stuff to help with that. So that's what I recommend to patients, clients and stuff. So if they're at the desk all day, we call them taking like micro breaks. So just doing little things to help reset the musculoskelet, little system so that you don't end up like this at the end of the day.

[B]

Yeah. They say every hour you're sitting, you should do like a little five minute.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Walk around, Right?

[A]

Yeah. It doesn't take much.

[B]

Yeah. That's my problem because I gotta. I get glued to my screen.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Then four hours goes by, Next thing you know, my back's in pain.

[A]

Yeah, exactly. Yeah. And then have to pay someone like me to sort you out.

[B]

Yeah. Or a chiropractor. Right?

[A]

Yeah. Well, I'm a chiropractor.

[B]

That's how you started. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And you kind of developed shockwave therapy from there, right?

[A]

Yeah, yeah.

[B]

Can you explain what that is?

[A]

Yeah. So my company, Wasabi Method, we. We sell a device it's. It's part of. So I'll have to define a couple of things first. So we have shockwave therapy, which are basically acoustic sound waves, and we use them to treat musculoskeletal problems. Actually, the original treatment was for breaking up kidney stones.

[B]

Mmm.

[A]

It's called lithotripsy. And so there's kind of three different levels of shockwave therapy. So there's like high energy, which is like the lithotripsy. And you have to be put under a general anesthetic to get that because there's no way you could tolerate that amount of pain. So when the energy is high, it breaks down things. But when you, when you use medium or low energy sound waves, they cause tissues to heal and repair. And so that's what we use is, it's. We call ours a radial pressure wave, which is just a bit lower than a shockwave by definition, because shock waves have a specific kind of definite. It has to be faster than the speed of sound and has to. It has to meet a pressure gradient of 100 millipascals of pressure. So my device doesn't get to that level, but it still gets in this therapeutic window that causes the physiological changes in the body. So that's really what matters.

[B]

Yeah. And I've used that device. It's amazing.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. You've had it.

[B]

I've had it twice. I will say it hurts, but afterwards I feel amazing.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. And so with, with the pain, if we're going to talk, talk about the pain, it's. It should be tolerable. And we can, we can set the settings so that it can be obviously higher or lower. So I'm always checking in with, with patients to see what you can tolerate. I don't usually like to an exceed about a 7 out of 10 on someone's pain scale.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, that makes sense. I think for me, I'm optimistic. So. Yeah, I just want to fix my problems and deal with it.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But it works, man.

[A]

Yeah. And the cool thing is it's almost instantaneous. Like it's not like the next day you'll feel better. It's like when people hop off the table, they're like, holy crap. That. That really made a difference.

[B]

Yeah, no, because I was coming off, I think a muscle sprain. And then I ran into you guys at a 4M. Yeah, yeah. And I just felt way better after.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. We had, we have you on our Instagram talking about your experience.

[B]

Yeah, I think it was in my left shoulder. I like sprained it the week before. Yeah, you guys, you guys did whatever you do and stopped hurting the next day.

[A]

Yeah. Awesome. And did, did it last?

[B]

Yeah, lasted. And I was trying all sorts of weird stuff. I think when I came to you guys, I had a patch on. Yeah, like a nicotine patch or something.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, no, I remember. I remember the video we had. You're just smiling, going, holy crap.

[B]

No, I couldn't believe it. And I think I grew an inch too.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. Well, we had that today, too, when we worked on you. You're like, oh, my God. Like, everyone was saying you look taller. Yeah.

[B]

I'm sure when you guys first met Dave Asprey, similar experience with him.

[A]

Yeah. Well, do you want me to go through the history? So Dave is a co founder with me on Wasabi Method, and I used to be part of his online group, the Upgrade Collective. And living in Australia, it was, it was painful because he would do the, the Zoom calls at 3 in the morning for me. So I'd have to get up at, you know, just before three, and I'd be super tired on a weekday. And that's when people sleep. Yeah, exactly. I wouldn't go every week because some weeks I'm like, no, I can't. I can't be smashed tomorrow. But I would get up and, and listen to the podcasts. And then one day they were talking about Shockwave and I, you know, I put up my hand and said, you know, I work for one of the biggest Shockwave companies in the world, and I'm one of their lead instructors. So they would send me all around the world to, to teach doctors and, and practitioners how to use this device. So I've been to China, I've been to Indonesia, I've been to Korea, I've been to Malaysia, and I've taught throughout Australia for the past. I worked for them for about 14 years, so I learned a ton about this device. And so with Dave, he was interested because company I was working with was just getting FDA approval for their radial Shockwave device here in the States, because before, about six years ago, they can only use Shockwave on plantar fascia problems. And I think it was tennis elbow. So you'd had this $25,000 device that you could only use for two conditions. So a lot of the practitioners are like, well, I'm not going to spend that kind of money. Like, unless you had a con, like a practice that that's all you were doing, which is pretty rare. So it was really restrictive. So they, they found basically a way around it. So now It's a Class 1 device. So it's kind of considered almost like a massage device.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So I told him that they have a new device and it's going to have FDA approval and we can sell it to anyone. Whereas the devices before, you had to be a practitioner. So this new device, because it's a Class one, we could sell to anyone. So that was the really cool thing about it. So he was really excited about that. We came up with, like, a business plan for this. This company. I told them, you know, we were going to be selling probably about $2 million worth. And we had a few meetings with them, and I wasn't hearing back from them. I'm like, that's kind of weird. You know, you think like, Dave Astri's a. Dave Asprey is a big deal. So finally they got back to me and they're like, yeah, we don't want to partner with you guys. And I'm going, you don't want $2 million extra revenue a year? Like, you don't have to do anything. I'm going to do all the work. And they were. And I remember what. What the. The top guy said. He goes, I can't remember if I've told Dave this, but he'll find out now. They go, we don't want to be associated with a violet volatile influencer. So he's. He was too much of a rebel for them.

[B]

Dave was.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

So it wasn't me because I'm like, I've worked for you for 14 years. You're. You're happy to send me around the world to teach the smartest people around about your device, but you don't want to partner with me when I'm going to sell your device. And it was. It was because of Dave. So I was like, okay. So we went to their competitor, the next biggest company, and they were like, oh, yeah, you guys sound. Sound legit. You know, we would like to do this, but you have no sales, like, no sales experience. So we can't make you a distributor because you have no sales experience. And we're like, well, how about you trial us for, like, six months? We get some sale experience, and then we go. We move from there. And they're like, no, can't be done. And I was like, oh, shit. So. So then I'm. I don't know what to do now because. Because basically the two biggest companies in the world that I wanted to be with are saying no to us.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So one of. One of my friends, Raheel, told me about this. This other company, and we. We approached them and he was like, hell, yeah, I'll partner up with you. And so we partnered up with them and the kind of. The rest is history. But it's worked out so much better.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

Because we have autonomy now. We can do what we want. Like, we pick the colors, we pick the name, and that's. You know, I think that the name Wasabi is pretty catchy. You know, not too Many people forget it. Our name when we're at conferences.

[B]

Yeah. What was the origin story with the name? Is it because wasabi is such a powerful substance?

[A]

Yeah. Well, it was Dave. Dave came up with it. And I remember at the time when he mentioned it to me, I think we were called. We were going to call it like American Shock Wave or something. Something pretty standard. And he came up with this. And I remember going, oh, my God. I don't, I don't. I'm like, I don't like that. And I sat with it. You know, he, he studied at Wharton.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So in my head I'm going, I have to trust this guy. You know, he's got eight or nine successful businesses. He went to Wharton. He knows what he's doing, you know, So I was like, okay, let's do it. And I'm so glad that we did.

[B]

Because it's a good name, man.

[A]

Yeah. Because everybody, everybody likes it. But I kind of. We're looking for a tagline, but usually what we say, it's spicy, but it's good. Like wasabi.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You get the spice from it, but it's enjoyable.

[B]

I love it.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And the service is so good that I feel like you don't have to do much marketing.

[A]

No, it's.

[B]

Your customers will just tell other people.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. Cuz when you, when you experience it at one of our booths or if you go to one, like a. One of our practitioners that use our device, it's. I don't have to tell you, I just have to show you. Like, once you experience it, like you have, you get it. Right. I don't have to sit there and talk to you. You're like, I get it.

[B]

You know, it's too hard to explain.

[A]

Yes. It's almost like ineffable.

[B]

Yeah. It's better just to start doing it on someone because you won't be able to tell them.

[A]

Yeah. Because some people are just like, they're like, tell me what it does, how it works. I'm like, do you really want me to go into all the physics and physiology, or do you want me to just do it and then you'll experience it? And they're like, okay, just do it. Yeah. And then they always leave smiling.

[B]

Yeah, absolutely. There are a lot of benefits to it though, right?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Other than pain.

[A]

Oh, yeah. So in terms of physiology, it has about 19 physiological effects on the body, and some of them are really fascinating. When I went on Dave's podcast last year, I talked a lot about all the physiological changes that occur. And what I did when after we posted the podcast is I put peer reviewed journals that validated everything I had because I knew people would be writing in whatever. And I was like, okay, so everything I said I had, I had studies. And we could probably do the same here because I know people probably do the same thing.

[B]

We'll link it in the video.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. So I, I'm all about the, the research because I'm actually doing my Masters of research at the University of Sydney.

[B]

Oh, nice.

[A]

In Australia. So I'm all about the research and like I read studies almost daily and yeah, I'm happy to share them. So, so, so we, because I want people not to just take me at my word. I'm like, yeah, I want you to fact check me.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You know, because maybe I missed something or maybe I misinterpreted something or maybe I didn't use the proper terms to, to describe it.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And apologize if I, if I do that. But like anyone, I'm, I'm not infallible. And you know, we're always learning and, and growing.

[B]

No, that's respect. Because a lot of the biohacking space, I love the biohacking space, but a lot of it's, that doesn't have the research yet. Some of the modalities.

[A]

Yeah. And instead of admitting that they almost try and cover it up, they're like, oh, well, there was one study that showed this and it's like, yeah, that's like the cool thing with this because it's been around for like 35 years. There's loads and loads of peer reviewed journals and you can access, you just go on, you can do a Google Scholar search or a PubMed search and you can, you can find how it works on so many things. So going back to your original question, one of the really cool things that it does is it causes angiogenesis. And what that is, it's the new formation of blood vessels. So it releases, it causes the body to release a growth factor called vegf, which stands for vascular endothelial growth factor. When you release that in the body, it tells the body. On this spot you worked on, so say I worked on your elbow, it tells your body to grow new blood vessels in that area and that's, that's a permanent change.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

So once your body grows these new capillaries and stuff, that's, that's there forever, right?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So a lot of musculoskeletal problems that people have, a lot of it's due to hypoxia, which is lack of oxygen, which is due to lack of blood flow. So if we're changing the blood flow in your elbow, that's going to continue to. To be a thing for you for essentially the rest of your life.

[B]

That's important because as you get older, you have blood flow issues, right?

[A]

Yes.

[B]

It takes longer to recover from injuries.

[A]

Yeah. A lot of people do. And, and Dave always tells me to, to, you know, remind people it's. Even if you don't have a problem per se, like you don't have pain or dysfunction that you're aware of, you're still going to have areas of your body that aren't getting adequate blood flow, or at least maybe not as good as it was when you were younger.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Because when we're young, we, we heal so well. Like I told some of my patients, like, if they bring their kids that are under, you know, 14 or whatever, I'm like, your kid will heal in twice. Twice as fast as you will with the same injury.

[B]

Right.

[A]

You know, it's incredible. You watch these kids and they just. And we're all kind of designed to heal that way.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But as we age, the blood flow becomes a bit of a problem to some of these areas. Also, we have. We keep building up toxins. We were talking earlier about all the toxins and everything nowadays, so that every, every trip around the sun, as we get older, you accumulate more and more and more, and then that affects our, our systems, our detox systems, and then our bodies. Instead of just being able to heal the injury you have is also. It's fighting all these battles on different fronts. So.

[B]

Right.

[A]

It's fighting off all these toxins, it's fighting off all these viruses and bacteria and parasites and all this stuff. And then it also has to fix your elbow. So it has to allocate resources to all these things.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But if you were super healthy and you didn't have all these toxins in your body and you're. You weren't exposed to all these, these diseases and, and bacteria and viruses and stuff, your body would be able to allocate much. A lot more resources and time. Time to. To healing your elbow, and it would get much better, much faster.

[B]

Yeah. Because you see certain athletes have the same injury, but some recover way quicker.

[A]

Yes. Yeah. It's all about recovery nowadays.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So. So, so that's one of the big ones. Another one is it causes the proliferation of what are called fibroblasts. So there's. They're cells that they kind of go around the body and Clean things things up. So think of them almost like repair men in your body. So. So a lot of people are like, oh, you break up scar tissue with. With the radio waves or shock waves. It's not really what's happening. It's more that I'm stimulating the body to create more of these repairmen, the fibroblasts. And then the fibroblasts clean up the mess. Yeah. So it's. Imagine me telling your body, make more carpenters and plumbers and electricians come in here and renovate this area.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And the cool thing with that as well is it doesn't just work on the day I treat you. It works the next day, the day after, a week later, a month later. Which is really cool because they showed one study that they did one treatment, and they had physiological changes that were measurable up to three months later. Damn. So it's like, you know when you put fertilizer on your lawn?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You know, it doesn't work just that day. It works the next day and the next month kind of thing.

[B]

So this lasts for three months?

[A]

Yeah. One treatment.

[B]

Holy.

[A]

So when you're. You're adding. It's an additive effect. So it's not just today. When you get treated in two days time, it. It's keeps. It's accumulating.

[B]

That's impressive, man.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Yeah. A lot of athletes and just ordinary people could definitely benefit from doing this once every three months, I'd imagine.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah. Just even like what we're saying, you don't need to have pain or a condition. It's. It's preventative. Like most people, I say, especially men, I get all these men, they. They're like, off, it ain't broken kind of thing. Don't fix it.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And I'm like, do you take your car to the mechanic? And they're like, yeah. I'm like, why do you do that? Is your car broken when you do that? And they're like, no, I do it so my car doesn't break down on the way to work. And I'm like, okay, so you do that with your car. Why wouldn't you do that with your body?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Okay. At least with a car, like, if your car breaks down, you could actually buy a new one. You can't buy a new body.

[B]

Right.

[A]

So you really got to take care of the one that you have. And even the cool thing is we're made up of living tissues. And so I can make the next level of tissues or the next generation of tissues in your body healthier stronger, more resilient than the previous one.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

Even if you're 90 years old?

[B]

Really?

[A]

Right. Well, think of it. If you, if you, if I took a 90 year old and I started, who wasn't exercising at all and I started getting them to exercise or like said, say, doing push ups, if they started doing push ups every day, would they get stronger?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Does it matter that they're 90?

[B]

No.

[A]

No. Your physiology will respond. As long as your heart's still beating and you got a pulse, the physiology still responds. Maybe not as quickly as when you were 20, but it's still there. And so I, A lot of people, they almost give up on themselves. They're like, oh, I'm broken, I'm too damaged, I've had too many injuries, I have too many illnesses. I'm like, you can always improve on things. You don't have to be stuck with pain and dysfunction and a shitty life because you can't do what you, what you want to do. You can always go better, but the key is having someone guide you that knows how the systems work. Like, like myself, a lot of patients, they'll go and want to exercise and they go too hard. They're like, go from being couch potatoes to like, I'm going to work out five days a week.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

That doesn't work. Your body can't adapt that quickly and you will end up with an overuse injury. So it helps to have, find someone that you know, knows their stuff and work with them and then they'll design a program that will do the steps. You know, you gotta walk and then you can run and then you can sprint.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Can't just go straight into sprinting because you're gonna, you're gonna end up with problems.

[B]

Oh, yeah. New Year's at the gym.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You see a lot of people that day.

[A]

I get to patience. Yeah, they all come in. Oh, I, I went too hard at the gym or I went too often and then they can't go the next week because they went too hard the first week.

[B]

Yeah, it's, it's a mental game too, man. I, I noticed when I lift with friends, it's way easier and by myself.

[A]

Why do you think that is?

[B]

I think in your. It's easy to make excuses when you're by yourself, dude. You have no one to hold you accountable, you know?

[A]

Yeah. 100.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But, but do you find it's also kind of the camaraderie thing, you know, like when you're suffering with others, it's not so like a Bond.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, no, that too. Plus I'm competitive.

[A]

Oh, yeah.

[B]

I'm lifting with someone. I try to match them or do better, you know?

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. It makes, it makes it fun.

[B]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, Absolutely, man. Well, what's next for you guys? You're going to be at Dave's event next month.

[A]

Yeah. So we have the, the biohacking conference coming up at the end of May. We have a big double booth there this year.

[B]

Nice.

[A]

So we're going to be offering free treatments. If people want to come and try wasabi method out, we'll explain it. Well, it's, it's. There's a few contraindications, so you have to make sure that you don't have any of the contraindications. So some of them are like pregnancy if you're under 18 years old, if you're on blood thinners, or if you have, like, hemophilia, which is basically a blood clotting problem. Things like dvts, if you've had a cortisone injection. But even with that, like, say you had the left shoulder done, I could still work on the right shoulder else. And then with that, after six weeks, I can work on that area. Other things, like if you have a, like a tumor. So say, say you had a thyroid tumor.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I can work in other spots. Like, I can work on your foot.

[B]

Got it.

[A]

As long as I'm. Because with, with some of the physiology, it increases these growth factors. So if I went on your tumor, I don't want to make it grow more.

[B]

Oh, my God.

[A]

Okay, so. So that's why it's contraindicated. But it, I can still work on other bits, so that's cool. Yeah. As long as you don't have any of those contraindications. It's. It's fun. It's super safe.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

As I said, when I go through these studies, it's one of the safest things out there. Like, I, I do seminars and stuff, and there's. There's one study that I bring up, and it was a meta analysis, which is a form of a systematic review. So it looks at randomized controlled trials. So this, this one particularly was on the, the knee, looking at knee osteoarthritis. It had included 19 randomized controlled trials and almost 2,000 patients. And there was zero side effects.

[B]

Damn.

[A]

Which is unheard of. Like I asked at a talk I gave the other day, I said, have you ever seen a medical study with almost 2,000 patients where there was zero side effects and everyone's like, no, it's unheard of. I almost expect people to get up and do a standing ovation when. When I say that, because I'm like, is no one like, yeah.

[B]

Getting this medical study and side effect?

[A]

Yeah. Yeah. Like, the worst thing usually that occurs is you might be a little red, you might be a little sore, and might have a little inflammation. Those are really it. And then that tends to go away in 24, 48 hours for most people.

[B]

That's crazy.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

The benefits just seem to outweigh the risk tremendously.

[A]

Oh, yeah. It's not. It's not even close. Yeah, it's not even close.

[B]

And I'm all about that. That's why I usually don't take pills, because. Yeah, usually it's the opposite. Like, the risk outweighs the benefit.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah. And then there's the cost as well. You know, nothing's for free. And the same with my device. It's. It's. It's not free, but compared to a lot of other treatments, it's. It's really cost effective.

[B]

I bet these days, man, when I go to the spot, I got a massage now, it's like 150 bucks.

[A]

Yeah. And that's just them raising their hands.

[B]

Yeah. No, it's crazy.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Yeah. Inflation.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah, exactly.

[B]

Where could people get this? Is it in almost every state at this point?

[A]

Yeah. So you can get it anywhere in the United States where we will ship it directly to you. And again, one of the things I didn't mention was the reason we call it Wasabi method is because it's a. There's a whole method behind it. A lot of our competitors, they'll just send you, sell you the device. Like, when I got my device, I had a salesperson show me how to use it. So he had no steeping in biomechanics, physiology, pathology, anatomy. He was like, this is how you turn it on. That's how you use it. That's how you clean it. This is how you turn it off. He's like, good luck. And again, this was one of the biggest companies in the world.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

And they've been doing this for when. Even when I got it 16 years ago. They'd been doing it since the early 90s, you know, and so I, you know, I kept thinking this should be done better, you know, it should be someone with knowledge that's used it, that has knowledge of anatomy, biomechanics, physiology, pathology, all the. All these things. And so that's what I've done. So I've Developed education modules that we sell with our device that pretty much none of the other com. Our competitors do.

[B]

Smart.

[A]

So we have. So I've done upper body. So I, I go through all the muscles, tendons, ligaments, joints in the upper body. Well, pretty much most of them. And then we do lower body. And then we have a men's sexual health module. We have a women's sexual health module, and then we have advanced techniques. So that's like. You can actually treat things like wounds. So if someone has like a diabetic ulcer or a pressure wound from lying in bed for too long, you can treat that. There are certain protocols you have to follow to. To treat that. You can treat burn victims. So it really helps with the skin after. After they've been burnt. Things like. Things like cellulite. Helps with cellulite. It helps with. Because, like I said, helps with collagen. So you can actually treat, like, your face, really, to help with skin. Stuff like that. What else am I missing? Lymphedema, which is a condition where the. The lymphatic system doesn't work very well and people's legs really swell up.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And it's really difficult to treat. So with this different from. So the main way of treating that is they put like these, you know, those compression boots that they put on people that you lie down, you pull up these long things.

[B]

Yeah, yeah. The sleeves, right.

[A]

Yeah, they like, Like Balancer Pro. Yeah. So that's one of the main ways of treating it. But again with ours, we're. We're causing all these growth factors. So I'm telling your body to make new veins and new lymphatics. So you're. The ones that are broken are not functioning. Your body will grow new ones to bypass it, and then, then that'll start working. So it's really cool when you're like. Because you're, You're. You're. Instead of just treating the symptom, you're. You're essentially treating. Cause I'm making your physiology. I'm changing your physiology in a permanent way to make it work better so you don't have to go and get the compression boots, you know, or you might not have to go as often.

[B]

Yeah, that's impressive. So you could tell the body to create more veins, basically.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. It's called. It's. It's called neovascularization. I'll link some studies that. That show that.

[B]

Wow. Which area of the body are you seeing the most issues in with your patients?

[A]

Well, I predominantly treat musculoskeletal stuff. So tendons is, is the big one.

[B]

It's.

[A]

So in terms of the literature for tendons, it has about a 80 to 85 success rate on most tendons. And I'll put up some studies for this. But that's, that's huge because tendon problems are notoriously bad at getting better or they come back often. So people that have like tennis elbow, even if their pain goes away, it often comes back like in the vast majority of cases. Again, that's because they're not necessarily fixing the problem. They're, they're treating the symptoms, but they're not changing the blood flow. They're not changing the, the physiology in, in the area. So that's what we're trying to do so that, so that you get a lasting effect.

[B]

That's the one MLB pitchers have, right? Tennis elbow?

[A]

Yeah, well, it's, it's a common. They get a lot of shoulder issues, so they get, they get a lot of rotator cuff issues. So that's, that's the common one. They get.

[B]

Yeah. A lot of wear and tear when you're pitching that fast.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

100 games a year.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah. And the cool thing is like they can get this done straight after and it's gonna, the other cool thing I didn't mention was that it decreases inflammation.

[B]

Really?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

So when I treat an area, it causes, it stimulates the nociceptors, which are pain sensitive nerve endings in the area. They release this chemical called substance P that is a pain sensitive chemical in your body. And the way it works, you ever eat like really spicy food and your mouth kind of burns and then it kind of goes numb after a while. So that's your. The capsaicin is releasing this substance P and that causes a decrease in what's called neurogenic inflammation. So it has a direct effect on this inflammatory pathway. So it downregulates that. And, and the other cool thing is you can use it with other modalities, things like, like say laser or, or photobiomodulation. It works on the Cox 2 pathway, which is a different inflammatory pathway. So you're getting, you're hitting it from two angles and you get a really, really awesome synergistic effect. So we tell people, we don't sit there and go, oh, you, if you buy my device, it's the only thing you need. It will fix everything. I don't have that approach at all because in my clinic I use a bunch of modalities.

[B]

Oh, really?

[A]

Yeah. So like I, I'm a chiropractor. So I'll do. I'll do manipulations or mobilizations. I do some myofascial work. I'll do some. What's called instrument assisted soft tissue. It's like those blades that you see them working on people.

[B]

Oh, yeah. You see acne.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. So things like that. I do kinesio tape, you know, shock wave, obviously. So all these things, I'm hitting it from multiple angles to get the body to respond. It's just think of it as more of a. There's signals I'm putting into the body. The more signals I'm putting into the body, the more the body kind of responds.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

If it's the appropriate one. So that's where you got to know what works and what doesn't work. And everyone's a little bit different. Like, some people will respond really well to. To Wasabi Method, and some people. It'll only make a little difference.

[B]

Really.

[A]

Yeah. But everyone's. It's a spectrum. Right. So though it's like, where are you on the spectrum?

[B]

Yeah, I think I'm really well. For me.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Some people, if they'll respond really well. But also it. It's more about how healthy you are too. You know, if you're at. You know, if you take care of yourself, you'll get a better result because your body, the physiology, just responds.

[B]

That makes sense.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Dr. Adam, it's been a pleasure. Where can people find Wasabi Method and learn more about you as well?

[A]

So we're quite good with Instagram, so we're at Wasabi Method. So Wasabi underscore Method. And we have a website, wasabi method.com. so if anyone wants to contact us through there or just wants to learn more about our device or we'll get back to you, you can email us at info at wasabimethod. Com. And yeah, I welcome any questions or concerns or comments that people have.

[B]

Beautiful. Check them out, guys. It's definitely helped me out. So highly recommend it. See you guys.