The Secret to Exploding Your Twitter Engagement | Elf DSH #1316

Summary

Digital Social Hour: Episode Summary - "The Secret to Exploding Your Twitter Engagement | Elf DSH #1316"

Release Date: April 11, 2025

Host: Sean Kelly
Guest: Elf
Podcast: Digital Social Hour

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1. Introduction to the Episode

In this episode of Digital Social Hour, host Sean Kelly engages in an in-depth conversation with Elf, a prominent figure in the sports betting and social media space. The discussion delves into Elf's journey on Twitter, his strategies for growing engagement, his upcoming boxing match, and the challenges he's faced, including legal threats and conflicts within the sports betting community.

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2. Boxing Fight with Sean Perry

Elf reveals his plans to participate in his first boxing match against Sean Perry, scheduled in a month's time. The origins of their feud trace back to interactions on Elf's Twitter show, where differing personalities and competitive tensions culminated in a physical confrontation.

• Elf (00:50): "Fight camp. Fight camp. I'm fighting Sean Perry in a month. It's my first boxing fight."

• Discussion Highlights:

  • Initial cordial relationship through collaborative shows.
  • Escalation after a significant fight event between Mozzie and DEZ Bryant.
  • Elf's attempts to mediate between Sean Perry and other figures, leading to strained relations.
  • Challenges in organizing the fight, including disagreements over contracts and money.

• Notable Quote:

  • Elf (02:52): "He's probably not going to make weight because he's, like, fat now. He's, like, really fat, out of shape."

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3. Growth and Strategy of Elf's Twitter Show

Elf discusses the explosive growth of his Twitter account, emphasizing consistency and niche content as key factors. His show, which features multiple speakers and fosters drama, has become a central tool in building his follower base.

• Elf (10:08): "I quit my job. And I had a good job. So I was an actuary... once I started making more from content was when I started."

• Growth Strategies:

  • Consistent posting and niche focus on advantage gambling and live arbitrage.
  • Hosting interactive shows that attract high engagement and loyalty.
  • Leveraging conflicts and controversies to drive viewer interest.

• Notable Quote:

  • Elf (11:26): "I have like 17k followers. I can't tweet and not get like 50k views."

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4. Dealing with Defamation and Legal Threats

Elf shares his experiences with defamation threats from various individuals, including Sean Perry and Cash Out King. These incidents highlight the volatile nature of the sports betting community and the legal risks involved in streaming and broadcasting live interactions.

• Defamation Cases:

  • Sean Perry: Threatened to sue Elf after a falling out on a live show.
  • Cash Out King: Threatened multiple times for exposing his scamming activities.
  • Other Incidents: Involvement of unnamed individuals and additional threats.

• Notable Quote:

  • Elf (16:15): "Sean is texting me. He's like, if you do the show tonight, I'm suing the fuck out of you."

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5. Strategies in Advantage Sports Betting

Elf provides an insider's perspective on advantage sports betting, focusing on arbitrage and identifying edges within live betting markets. He explains how sportsbooks detect and limit sharp bettors through volume tracking and behavior analysis.

• Key Strategies:

  • Live arbitrage betting and quick line movements.
  • Identifying mispriced bets and leveraging them before lines adjust.
  • Maintaining multiple accounts and relationships with various sportsbooks to manage limitations.

• Notable Quote:

  • Elf (24:20): "Like if you're taking a math test and you got an Asian next to you who's like 4.0 GPA, and you're like a B student... You're just gonna copy the Asian guy and you're gonna make a ton of money."

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6. Notable Betting Stories

Elf recounts several significant betting experiences that underscore both his successes and the operational risks within the industry.

• FanDuel Arbitrage Success (March):

  • Generated $70,000 in one month through a substitution edge involving NBA player props.
  • Collaborated with a group in an Airbnb, maximizing bets on player substitutions.
  • Faced account limitations but managed to recover funds through legal demands.

• Push-Up Bet Controversy:

  • Orchestrated a unique player prop bet on performing push-ups.
  • Exploited arbitrage by betting both sides, making a profit without publicizing insider information.

• Notable Quotes:

  • Elf (32:19): "It was like a war, right? With them so they can use their terms of service to, like, bully you."
  • Elf (50:49): "I could have bet like 20,000 on my under and just gone under."

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7. Interactions with Sportsbooks and Limitations

Elf delves into the cat-and-mouse dynamic between sharp bettors and sportsbooks. He explains how sportsbooks monitor betting patterns to identify and limit or ban advantage bettors, reducing their long-term profitability.

• Challenges Faced:

  • Constant account limitations and bans from multiple sportsbooks.
  • Need to constantly move between books to sustain betting activities.
  • The futility of suing sportsbooks due to their legal protections and resources.

• Notable Quote:

  • Elf (26:09): "He's banned from the limited. Limited, like heavily limited."

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8. Conclusion and Where to Follow Elf

As the episode wraps up, Elf promotes his social media presence, encouraging listeners to follow him on Twitter and Instagram for exclusive content and updates on his upcoming boxing match.

• Promotion:

  • Twitter Handle: @yelff_underscore
  • Instagram: @Yelff__underscore

• Final Remarks:

  • Elf expresses optimism about the future of his show and upcoming events.
  • Emphasizes the importance of building relationships with sportsbooks through driving substantial traffic and engagement.

• Notable Quote:

  • Elf (61:53): "Hopefully they stop banning you because of your audience now."

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Key Takeaways

• Consistency and Niche Focus: Elf's methodical approach to content creation and targeting a specific niche (advantage gambling) has significantly boosted his Twitter engagement.

• Leveraging Drama: By fostering and hosting conflicts within his show, Elf maintains high viewer interest and participation, crucial for sustained engagement.

• Navigating Legal Challenges: The volatile nature of streaming live sports betting content comes with legal risks, including defamation threats, which Elf manages through legal counsel and strategic content management.

• Advantage Betting Strategies: Understanding and exploiting live arbitrage opportunities requires quick decision-making and managing relationships with multiple sportsbooks to mitigate limitations.

• Sustainability Issues: The ongoing cycle of account limitations and the need to continuously find new betting edges highlight the precarious balance sharp bettors must maintain to remain profitable.

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Notable Quotes with Timestamps

• Elf (00:00): "I got a lot of hate early on in my career when I first came to Twitter because I was leaking edges."

• Elf (02:52): "He's probably not going to make weight because he's, like, fat now."

• Elf (10:08): "I grew my Twitter just by grinding the app, posting good content stuff that I know my followers will engage with and doing a show."

• Elf (16:15): "Sean is texting me. He's like, if you do the show tonight, I'm suing the fuck out of you."

• Elf (24:20): "You're just gonna copy the Asian guy and you're gonna make a ton of money."

• Elf (32:19): "It was like a war, right? With them so they can use their terms of service to, like, bully you."

• Elf (61:53): "Hopefully they stop banning you because of your audience now."

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This episode provides a candid look into the high-stakes world of sports betting on social media, the complexities of managing a growing online presence, and the personal challenges faced by influencers like Elf. Listeners gain valuable insights into effective engagement strategies, the intricacies of advantage betting, and the importance of navigating legal and interpersonal conflicts within the industry.

Transcript

[Elf]

Is like that. So that's. I got a lot of hate early on in my career when I first came to Twitter because I was leaking edges. Like, I was like, streaming live, Arbitrage, calling in an infinite money glitch on Twitter. And all these pros are like, what the fuck are you doing, dude?

[Sean]

That's their livelihood.

[Elf]

That's their livelihood. And I didn't. I had a full time job. I was just loving life, you know? So it is what it is, right?

[Sean]

All right, we got elf in the building.

[Elf]

What's up? How we doing?

[Sean]

We played some basketball last night.

[Elf]

We did, yeah. I'm not a big baller, but I did pretty well in the gym.

[Sean]

You had a couple nice layups.

[Elf]

I did, yeah. Until I got hurt. Rolled the ankle a little bit.

[Sean]

Your boy was sniping too.

[Elf]

He was, yeah.

[Sean]

We had a good squad.

[Elf]

Yeah, we did troll the first. We lost the first game, but we came back and won the second one. So all good there?

[Sean]

Absolutely. Out here in Vegas for a month now, right?

[Elf]

Yeah, out here for a month. Fight camp. Fight camp. I'm fighting Sean Perry in a month. It's my first boxing fight. And, yeah, I'm ready to go. I mean, I can't stand that guy. He's like the one person on earth that I actually have beef with that I don't, like, enjoy speaking with. I'm a nice kid, but Sean Perry just. I can't stand him at all. So he's like the one person I'll fight.

[Sean]

And at first you guys were cordial, right? He used to spaces and you were chill.

[Elf]

Yeah, he used to hop on the spaces. You know, I didn't realize that, like, no one really likes him here in Vegas until people started complaining about him being on the show all the time. And initially. So we were friends because he would come on the show and we would talk. Right. I have a Twitter show.

[Sean]

Yeah.

[Elf]

And he was beefing with this with a famous gambler named Mozzie. And DEZ Bryant was on this space, and they were talking shit to each other, as most people do on my show, and then they're like, fuck it. Let's just fight each other. Like, why are we. Why are we talking? Like, let's just fight. So we all booked a flight the next day to Vegas. Well, they live in Vegas. I booked a flight from Boston. Des Bryant booked a flight. We went to this gym and watched them fight. So I was in Vegas. That was the first time I ever went to Vegas was like, that was March 18th. So pretty recent. And we watched them fight, and it was like my. It was one of my biggest shows ever. It has, like 600,000 views on my page, my Twitter page. So it was big. It was a big show for me. And, yeah, it was awesome. It was great content. Was the first, like, fight from gambling. Twitter to occur. And, yeah, it was a big event.

[Sean]

Who do you think won that fight?

[Elf]

I mean, Perry won for sure. I mean, Mozzie. There are some memes of him, like, stuck in between the ring and the wall. I've never seen anything like it. I'll give Perry his flowers. He won that fight. He's not going to beat me. There's no chance. And he's also probably not going to make weight because he's, like, fat now. He's, like, really fat, out of shape. He doesn't take his health seriously at all. So he's going to make weight. So he's probably going to not. He's probably going to forfeit the purse. So my. My backers might get free rolled, but he won the fight against Mozzie.

[Sean]

So, yeah, his shirtless videos are wild.

[Elf]

Yeah, the shirtless. I don't know why he posts shirtless videos. And my least favorite ones are the one in his spandex where you could see his camel toe. But to see one more camel toe photo of Sean Perry, I think I'm going to kill myself. I can't do it. Yeah.

[Sean]

When did the actual beef start? Was after the Mozzie fight.

[Elf]

It was. Yeah, it was after the Mozzie fight. I mean, we were cool. Uh, you know, he was putting me up in the. In the Rio. He sponsored one of my shows for $10,000, gave me cash. We gambled it on a show, and I made 1.5K with the 10K. You know, he was fine. We were cool. And I'm trying to. They're trying to rematch, right, for 500K. And Perry wants him to, like, sign a contract and do all this, like, stuff official. Mozzie doesn't want to do any of that. He wants to bring 500k to the gym. So they're kind of, like, both avoiding each other. Perry's like, sign the contract. Mazzy's like, bring the cash. And I'm the host of the show, right? And it's all going down on my show. So I'm trying to mediate this. This mess. And Perry keeps talking over everyone. He's talking over DEZ Bryant, he's talking over Mozzy, and no one else can get a word in. So I Kicked him from the space temporarily. And then once I did that, he just crashed out on me on Twitter he's like this little boy elf is a clown. Like I made him. Which is just not true at all. He's like delusional. He thinks he makes everyone he interacts with. My show was fine before him. He called. Yeah, he's just so disrespectful. Me on Twitter and he's just talking shit and I start firing back and he doesn't know how to. He doesn't know how to like be. It's with him it's either you're his friend or you're his enemy. So once I was his friend and then I kicked him from the space just so other people can speak. Now I'm his enemy. And then and we called on the phone and there's like videos being leaked of him and stuff like that. He's like, do you know anything about these? I was like, no, I don't. And then we started fighting on the phone for like an hour and I'm like, I was like, fuck you dude. Let's just fight. Like, let's just hop in the ring, you know what I mean? You and Mazi did it, let's do it. And he said he's down. So. So I'm training now. I'm training with the number 14 fighter in the U.S. angel Barrientes. For the bantamweight, he's training me. I got some good training, I got a good work ethic. If we fought tomorrow, Sean would kill me. But we're fighting in a month, so he's fucked.

[Sean]

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[Elf]

Yeah.

[Sean]

Yeah, because he's got weight on you, right?

[Elf]

He's got weight on me. He's got experience on me. He's got more training than me at the moment. But in a month, all that won't matter because I'm more athletic than him, so I'll be. I'll be good.

[Sean]

Were you athletic growing up?

[Elf]

Yeah, I was. Yeah. I played academy soccer on a. On, like, the top New York. New York team called New York Soccer Club. So a few of my teammates are now professional players, like the Sands Twins. I played with them. Dante Pavaro plays in Europe. These are my teammates. You had good cardio, great cardio. Yeah. And boxing's all cardio. But it's a different type of cardio than soccer, right? Very, very different, you know, because, you know, you get hit in the face, your cardio drops, like, half. You know what I mean? You're like, oh, I got a, like, minor concussion now, you know? So I've been sparring people, and they just been kicking my ass for, like, three rounds, and I'm like, wow, like, that hurt. You know what I mean? But it's all part of the game, you know? Like, I was talking to my coach, and he's like. It's like touching a hot stove. You know, if you touch the hot stove once, you're not going to do it again, right? So that's the idea. You get hit, you learn. Rinse and repeat.

[Sean]

Everyone calling him out now, I wonder. He'll fight you and fight others. I don't know what the deal is.

[Elf]

Everyone wants to fight him. No one likes this guy. Like, literally everyone's fighting, but they got to wait their turn after me, you know what I mean?

[Sean]

So you're up first for sure.

[Elf]

I'm. I'm next. Yeah. Unless Mozzie wants to fight, like, before our fight. Then he. He's got all rain. But they want to do it for 500k. And like I said, they're not going to. Sean's not going to bring half a million liquid to a gym in Vegas.

[Sean]

You know, just not smart.

[Elf]

It's not smart. It's not only smart because he's saying, like, Mozzie might rob him, but someone else in Vegas might rob him. Like, if you're. If you have a million liquid in a gym in Vegas, who's to stop? Like, some, like, gang to roll up, just run the place, leave with a mill and just take their chances? Like, why not? People would do that. People do that for less.

[Sean]

Way less.

[Elf]

Way less.

[Sean]

Probably 100k. People would do that.

[Elf]

Yeah. So, I mean, unless you're going to hire a ton of security, then. Then you don't do that. And I was like to Sean, you know, I have connections, every single sportsbook and casino and in the. In the U.S. like, that's. That's how I do things. Because you have a show, people want to sponsor it. They want that exposure. So I have good relationships, a lot of casinos. So I was like, okay, if you want, we could do. I'm just bouncing ideas. I'm like, if you want, we can bring the 500k to circa or something like that, put it in the booth, and the winner can walk away with it. You know what I mean? Like, get Benson involved. They just didn't want to do any of that. They. They're not even open negotiation. It's either contract through a lawyer or cash. Both aren't going to happen. So you're in a standstill. And then for me, Perry's like, I'll fight you for 100k, right? I said, okay, I don't. I don't have 100k liquid to fight you, but I'll put up. I'll put up 10k on myself, and then I'll get some backers, right? So I'm like, okay, I'll sign the contract tomorrow. You know, send the contract. He hasn't sent the contract. He keeps texting me that he's down. He says his rib hurts. All right, whatever, bro. But he said he's 100 down to fight. So, yeah, and I'll. I'll put up 100k. I'll get a backers easily.

[Sean]

So where are you guys doing it?

[Elf]

Probably pound for pound. Pound for pound in Vegas.

[Sean]

Is that where the mozzie one was?

[Elf]

That was where the mozzie one was, yeah. They'll be completely set up so that they have a whole streaming setup. Like, the only person streaming the mods one was me on my phone. Twitter spaces. So that's like, the beauty of. The beauty of Twitter spaces is there's so many speakers. So if you hop on my show and you're speaking and people like you, you know, they'll click on your page and they'll look at it like what you do and stuff like that. So it incentivizes other people to speak.

[Sean]

Yeah.

[Elf]

And, like, larger accounts will hop in, they'll speak, they'll get a clip, and then they'll leave. Right? So. And I encourage that. You know what I mean? So I was streaming the whole fight and there's 10 speakers. We have like full commentary almost and a stream of the fight without just on my phone, you know what I mean? So I was the only one streaming it. And then there was stuff on YouTube, Tik Tok afterwards. But live, I was the only person streaming it for my fight. There'll be like a live stream, like a proper one. I'm getting commentators.

[Sean]

Yeah. Like, there should get kick or rumble involved or something.

[Elf]

Yeah, I'm down. I mean, we'll see what we can do with the sponsors. I mean, you have good connects, but they. I'm getting Jeff Nadu to commentate, like, former barstool guy. There's this guy, the beak who comes on my show all the time. He's got like a funny voice. He's going to commentate. So we're going to make it a spectacle. That'll be cool, it'll be fun. But I'm taking this very serious.

[Sean]

Yeah. Now, how do you grow your Twitter? Because you quit your job two months ago. Yeah, I quit my job.

[Elf]

Yeah. And I had a good job. So I was an actuary. I was making good money, like working at a large insurance company. Like, very cozy job. So it was definitely difficult quitting. But it was, it was once that I started making more from content was when I started, was when I quit my job. That's. That was the key. So, yeah, I mean, I grew my Twitter. Twitter loves just, like, consistency. So if you post a lot on Twitter and you kind of find your niche. So, like, my niche was advantage gambling at first, and now I've branched down to this Twitter show, and that's when my page, I guess, like, exploded. Like, the algorithm loves me. Like, I can't. Like, I have like 17k followers. I can't tweet and not get like 50k views. You know what I mean? So the algorithm loves me, but Twitter just rewards consistency. They'll put you in a niche and, like, you know, based on how people react to your content, they'll keep pushing it out. So the way I really grew my Twitter was from these shows, right? And I have, like, I could just, if I wanted to, just like spam giveaways like, follow, retweet. But, like, those aren't real organic followers. Like, a real organic following is worth way more than just like a large number on a screen. So I grew it just by grinding the app, posting good content stuff that I know my followers will engage with and doing a show. And people love the show. Like the engagement on the show is, like, through the roof. So that's. That's the real way I grew.

[Sean]

It was, yeah, I'll hop in sometimes, and you'll have a thousand live people. That's insane.

[Elf]

Yeah, it's nuts.

[Sean]

That's more than celebrities get on Instagram live.

[Elf]

Yeah, it's insane. And there's like a running joke where, like, I'm always like, oh, go follow the elfie Instagram. But no one wants to leave Twitter. They just love the Twitter show. So, yeah, I mean, the show is great because it's not just me. Like. Like, we're doing a podcast.

[Sean]

Yeah.

[Elf]

My show, there'll be probably 20 to 30 unique speakers during one show. And everyone knows, like, my lower loyal listeners, they know all these characters that come in and speak, right? Like, there'll be people that come in, and these, they're like, oh, this guy's a conspiracy theorist. Like, I know he's about to, like, stir up some drama or something like that, and he'll say something ridiculous. And then I'll bring on people who I know hate this guy, and then they'll start beefing with him. And, like, the way I really grew my show from, like, bottom up was if there was somebody talking about somebody on my show in a negative way, I would be on the side DMing that person. I would send them a link to my space and be like, bro, this guy just said, you're a scammer. Like, he just said, you stole a thousand dollars from this dude. So. And then that would bait that person in, right? And then imagine, like, someone's talking shit about this person, and I'm like, oh, no, here he is. Let's bring him up. So I bring him up, and then the viewers like, oh, no, here we go. Like, it's about to be a war. And then there is war that happened.

[Sean]

With Sean Perry and Mickey Mace. Right?

[Elf]

That was Sean Perry. Mickey Mace. Yeah. They. They were going at it. I could tell the full story if you want.

[Sean]

Yeah.

[Elf]

So Sean Perry was crashing out on Twitter about Mickey Mace because he wanted to do a podcast with Mickey Mace, and Mickey Mace wanted to charge him. That was it. That was the only reason. So then Sean took that and said, okay, I'm allowed to slander your name, slander your casino, slander all your, like, sponsors and stuff like that. So. And by the way, I was smaller account at the time, right? So Sean reaches. I reach out to Sean and booked a show. And then someone on my team reached out to Mickey and we're like, listen, Mickey, like, this guy's going to come on the show and say things about you. Like if you want, we want you to come on and defend your name, right? Like we don't want to just have one sided an argument, right? If someone, like I said, if someone's talking about someone, they deserve a right to speak on it. So we reach out to Mickey and Mickey was like, okay, I'll do your show, Elf, on one condition. The one condition is that Sean Perry can never come on your show ever again, right? So I'm like, all right, deal. Like, and this guy. And Perry was like leaking my text on Twitter. He leaked my phone number on Twitter.

[Sean]

Geez.

[Elf]

I'm like, what is going on? I have people texting and calling me like, yo, Elf, your number got leaked. I'm like, all right, this guy, we're doing the Mickey Mace show. You know what I mean? So. And I'm not on good terms with Sean Perry at this time. So this is not the first time I've beef with him. Now Mickey Mace comes on the show. Great show, electric. The guy's like amazing to listen to, telling crazy stories about like peeing in girls mouths. Like my viewers loved it. And then he leaves and we're still live, right? And I had 1500 people live for on that show. Book it with Trent's on the show. Jack Mack from Barstool's on the show. Jeff Nadu's there and we have like a few sharps as well because you know, I'm a sharp gambler. And book it with Trent with 300,000 followers. Gets a call from Perry and he's like, I'm on the phone with a red hot Sean Perry. We need to bring him on the show. And I'm like, no, I can't. Like I gave Mickey my word, you know what I mean? And there's 1500 people watching my show, like my loyal listeners. And Trent goes, okay, if you don't do the show, I'm gonna do the show with Perry. And I'm like. And he's like, I want to borrow Jack Mac Nadu and man in the vague. And all of them said they're down. So I'm like, oh my God, like do I literally risk losing my whole show right now or do I break my word to Mickey Mace, you know what I mean? Then this. And keep in mind, Mickey was so respectful, so nice, gave me an opportunity and came on my show. He's much bigger than me. So I, I let Perry on and I, I like literally I like left the room. I wasn't even involved with it. I just let them all go at it. I was, like, ashamed of myself, almost, like, for letting him on. But it was like, in my. I'm not justifying it, because I did break my word to Mickey, but it was, like, in my opinion, it was, like, survival of the show versus, like, my word. So I was, like, backed into a corner. Like, you're risking losing your entire cast. You can't do that. So that was the only time I broke my word, and that was I kind of. The Mickey May story. How. You know, we're not on good terms at the moment.

[Sean]

So, yeah, kind of when the grape allegation started to.

[Elf]

That is when the grape allegation started with Sean. And. Yeah, the next. The next day, Mickey came back and made Sean address those grape allegations, and he said he wasn't even aware of any of them and took a lie detector test about it. And. Yeah, that's all I'll say about that. It's. It's. Yeah, there's nothing else for me to say, really.

[Sean]

That was the first defamation case you got hit with?

[Elf]

No, that was the second. So I was threatened to be sued for defamation if I was going for slander. Defamation by Sean. If I released the episode with this girl, I was gonna bring the girl on Mickey Mace back on. And I called my lawyer, and I was like, am I allowed to do this episode because she doesn't have a police report? She doesn't have. There's no, like, factual basis to her. Whether the claim is true or not, it doesn't matter. Like, she can come on and tell the complete truth if she doesn't have a police report, unfortunately, like, I'll get sued. So that's what my attorney said. And Sean is texting me. He's like, if you do the show tonight, I'm suing the fuck out of you. And I'm. And he's serious. Like, he has the money to do it. Like, he'll. I don't have the money to compete with him in a lawsuit.

[Sean]

Yeah.

[Elf]

So my attorney's like. I was like, can I get sued for this? Like, I'm not even the one saying anything. He's like, it's not a matter of can you get sued? He's like, you will get sued. And he's like, where do you live? And I was like, boston. And he's like, oh, you're not even in the state. Like, they won't even like that. You know what I mean? So you'll be, like, an underdog, and I'm like, oh, I can't do this. So I pulled the plug. And then Mickey was messaging me like, oh, you're a for that. Like, your lawyer's an idiot. Like, you should have done the show, you know? And Jeff Nadeu is making the point of, like, in content. Sometimes it's better to be getting sued for something like this because it's like, content.

[Sean]

Yeah.

[Elf]

And I'm like, yeah, but I can't afford it. You know what I mean? So I didn't do it. And yet. So that was like the second time Mickey Mason his eyes. Views that I burned him. Right? But in my opinion, I protected all of us because now there's no ammunition for a lawsuit if you. If son tried. So, yeah, that was. That was like. I think that was the second defamation case I was threatened with. The first one was this guy, Cash Out King. He's like the biggest scammer on the Internet. He was booking bets back like three, four years ago on the Lakers playoff series. Imagine like a team is like -600 to win the series. I think they were up 3 to 1. And he's like, I'll book it at +100 bitcoin only. So everyone starts sending him a ton of money. This is a huge story. Everyone starts sending him a ton of money, right? And he just ran away with all the money. There was a guy he stole $150,000 from, and he came back to Twitter. He bought this guy Mises account. He came back to Twitter and people are like, yo, elf. He's back on Twitter. Like, get him on the show. Like, I'm going to get him on the show. So I get him on the show, and he admitted to like, six different federal crimes on the show that he wasn't charged with. And I'm like, what is going on here? Like, what? This guy admitted to illegal bookmaking, scamming, wire fraud, like, all on my show, recorded spaces. You know what I mean? And I brought on the guy who he scammed. $150,000.

[Sean]

Wow.

[Elf]

And there's like, proof of it. And do you know what this Cash Out King guy said?

[Sean]

What?

[Elf]

He said, If I had $10 million to my name, I wouldn't pay you back a cent.

[Sean]

Damn.

[Elf]

I was like, what? That's insane. Like, this guy did nothing to you. He got scammed by you, and you're going to. You're going to do him dirty like that. And yeah, this Cash Out King guy is just existing on Twitter. He's still scamming people. I'll Get a DM every other week. Like, oh, this guy tried to scam me. Or he did scam me for, like, 3K.

[Sean]

He's got to get caught up one of these days.

[Elf]

You would think so, but I mean, like, it would have happened by now. Like, he lives in a nice gated neighborhood. Like, no one's. No one's pulling up on him or nothing. Yeah. But apparently people did go to his house after he ran off with all the money.

[Sean]

He booked and he moved.

[Elf]

No, he still lives there.

[Sean]

He's crazy to me.

[Elf]

Yeah. The only thing he's been charged with is wire fraud. So he, like, legally owes someone like 100,000. But now he said on the show he just keeps nothing in his name anymore. Like, if he makes money, it's on his mom's name.

[Sean]

That's what a lot of scammers do.

[Elf]

Yeah.

[Sean]

If you go to sue them, you can't collect. You can't collect even if you win.

[Elf]

So this guy legally owes people, like, hundreds of thousands of dollars, and he's never going to pay them a cent back because his name has no money.

[Sean]

And he threatened you with defamation?

[Elf]

Yeah, so he told me. He threatened me with defamation many times because I would tweet about him. And I've like, You know, I'm like, this guy's a scammer. And he's like, I'm suing you for defamation. I'm like, do it. I'm like, I needed some new toilet paper, so. So send me the lawsuit. Like, it'd be my. That one I would take.

[Sean]

You know, he's actually scamming, so he's actually criminal.

[Elf]

No, I didn't say anything defamatory. Right. Everything I said was true and factual, so there's no defamation. But with the whole thing with Sean, was that this. You know, unfortunately, it's a bad situation. But she doesn't have a police report.

[Sean]

Yeah.

[Elf]

So it's. It's. I'm not saying it like anything. I'm just saying she doesn't have police report. That's all I'll say. Because it's a sensitive topic.

[Sean]

So there's been two more after Sean.

[Elf]

Yeah. I mean, Cash Out Kings threatened me with two. I've had one where someone. I don't want to name this person because it's like, someone I'm close with, and they're big in the industry. They. They by accidentally admitted to a crime that they did. So they wanted me to delete the show. I said, no, I'm not deleting the show. I'm not going to do that. And then they threatened me with defamation. I'm like, there's no defamation. It's just you admitting to a crime. Yeah, that's not defamation.

[Sean]

So you didn't say anything?

[Elf]

Yeah, I didn't say anything. And yeah, so I'm like, no, I'm not deleting the show. Like, imagine someone, you did a podcast with someone and then they told you to delete the podcast. What are you going to tell them?

[Sean]

I actually haven't ever done that.

[Elf]

Well, I mean, if they do tell you that, you should tell them to.

[Sean]

Off a couple people have or like, certain parts for legal reasons, I'll do it. But other than that, I won't.

[Elf]

Okay, if there is legal reason, then you would do it. But if there's no legal reason, you're not going to do it.

[Sean]

Because if you said it, I mean, it's fair game.

[Elf]

Yeah, they said it. You know, nothing like is a recorded spaces, like, the odds something actually happens are so low. You know what I mean? So the person's fine. But yeah, that. Those are the four. So Cash Out King threatened me twice. Sean Perry, and then one person that I won't name, but they admitted to, like, a crime. They told me to delete it. I said no. Damn. Then there's the threat.

[Sean]

And then impressive, because you're only a.

[Elf]

Year in and you're not even a year, three months in. I mean, if you watch my show and you see how much beef there is on the show, you'd kind of understand, like, why I'm always in some heat. You know what I mean?

[Sean]

So you're getting one a month?

[Elf]

Yeah, yeah, one. One a month, pretty much.

[Sean]

So do you have anxiety? Like, how are you dealing with all that?

[Elf]

I don't know. I'm a pretty calm person, I would say.

[Sean]

Really?

[Elf]

But I do get heated sometimes on my show. Yeah, sometimes. No, the first time I got threatened with the lawsuit was Cash Out King. And there was no basis to it at all. Right. Like, literally none. Like, this guy just admitted to crimes and said he was going to sue me. I was nervous. I was like, wow, this is like.

[Sean]

Yeah, the first lawsuit's the worst.

[Elf]

Yeah. I was like, this is real now. You know what I mean? And, like, I got to, like, it's crazy to say, I have, like, a big platform now. I can, like, influence a lot if I'm pushing an agenda.

[Sean]

Yeah.

[Elf]

So I got to be careful with these things. But that was the first time. And then luckily I got people in my corner so they were telling me, like, you're fine, like, we'll take it, you know, if anything happened, like, it'll be okay. Right? So that calmed me down and I was like talking it over on my show. So, like, to Jeff Nadeu's point of like, oh, it's content. We spent an episode talking about, like, if this guy could sue me for like what he said on the last episode.

[Sean]

Bro, my first lawsuit. I couldn't leave my room for two months. Really, Like, I was shitting myself.

[Elf]

Yeah, it's scary. And I didn't even have a lawsuit. I've had threats of lawsuits, you know, I'm sure one will come and I'm not looking forward to it, but yeah, I'm trying to avoid it.

[Sean]

Well, as long as you stay neutral, I think you'll be good.

[Elf]

Yeah, okay, that's, that's the idea. That's my goal as the host is to stay neutral, but stir up the pot between the characters, right? Like get other people to beef. But then you can't avoid it if you're the host. So, like, they'll blame you. They'll blame you. You know, I'm always like the heel of everything. Like if, you know, if the show wasn't great or something, it's elves fall or like, you know, I bring on a lot of scammers, right? But to get them on the show, I'm like, yeah, I'll be neutral. You know, I mean, I'm going to let you tell your story, right? And then my viewers are like, why aren't you, you know, why aren't you calling him out? And I'm like, it's not my job to call them out as the host. It's the viewer's job to like, listen, call them one. It's their job to call them out and to also, like, get all the facts of the story so that they can understand it. It's not like otherwise I have a, a five second show. Yeah, bring on a scammer, call him a scammer, he leaves the show and then what? You have no content. You know what I mean?

[Sean]

Dude, there's so many scammers in your space, it's crazy.

[Elf]

Yeah, so many scammers. And like there's people selling picks with no edge. Like that's like a scam by definition, right? Because you're giving, you're just guessing, right? You're guessing. You're betting into heavily vigged markets. Like right before game time. Like, you know, right before, right before the game starts is when the market is the most efficient in sports? I rarely bet. No, I pretty much never bet right before game time. Yeah, never. I'm usually betting openers, like, right when the line opens.

[Sean]

Wow.

[Elf]

If there's an injury news, like, I'm fast to it, right. Like, I'm sitting at my PC all day sniping stuff. Right. Like, I'm the first one to it.

[Sean]

Yeah.

[Elf]

And then once I bet it, they're gonna move the line so that no one else can bet it. So you gotta be super quick. You can't just like. Like, selling picks into the market is like. It's like a unicorn. You know what I mean? Like, there are very. There's probably like, of like a hundred. If you take a sample size of a hundred people selling picks, like right before game time, probably one person is beating the market. And it could just be variants.

[Sean]

Crazy.

[Elf]

It's so hard to beat because these books have so much information. Their information is not within their trading team. It's with money coming in, sharp money. That's how they move the line and shape the market. And a lot of the US Books just copy the offshore ones that have high limits.

[Sean]

Right.

[Elf]

So if Pinnacle moves their line. Pinnacle is an offshore sportsbook with the highest limits. If Pinnacle will move the line, they're just copy Pinnacle. So they'll just get that information for free. Pinnacle had to pay someone to get that information and expect the value by taking that large bet. And all the US Books just copy it. There are books. I know for a fact there are books. They'll just look at Pinnacle or bookmaker and just go right in between so that they're like. They just. They just don't look like anything on an hot screen. Like, they can sit there and say, all right, we're well priced. They didn't price it. They just copied. You know what I mean? It's like. It's like if you're taking a math test and you got an Asian next to you who's like 4.0 GPA, aces every test, and you're like a B student. You know, you got decent traders just gonna cut. But you can copy the Asian guy for free. What are you gonna do? Yeah, you're gonna copy the Asian guy and you're gonna make a ton of money. You're gonna print. And then anyone sharp you deem, you know, you think they have a pulse, you can just limit them. So I'm limited or banned from every single sports book in Massachusetts besides FanDuel. That's the only one. And they have me at 10%. And I'm very grateful for that. So. Yeah.

[Sean]

Holy crap. Yeah. When you get banned, is it all at once or do they kind of spread it out?

[Elf]

No, it's. It's all spread out. So none of these books communicate with each other. So, like, if you get limited on MGM, you're not going to be limited on DraftKings. It happens one at a time. Like, if you. If you're, like, really cooking mgm, or you could even be losing to mgm, but you're beating the closing line consistently, they'll limit you. Like, I was limited on Caesars down $9,000.

[Sean]

Wow.

[Elf]

They limited me. I was like, what's going on here? It was. It was a crazy point in my life. It was like January of last year, I just started live arbitrage sports betting. And I was betting. I was arbitraging Caesar's lines to ESPN bets lines. And this is on espn first launched. They were awful at their. Their livelines were terrible. And there was, like, no limit. So I was betting, like, $1,000 live during the NBA, like, and the college basketball games, just nuking it. And I was de risking on Caesars, so that's why I was dying down 9,000 to them. But they. They probably picked up that I was betting so much volume that it wasn't, like, real, like, wagering. It was like someone arb. Ing. But even then, they should know that I'm de risking to them, just paying them to offload my position from ESPN debt. And they're just printing money off me because I don't want to have that risk of, like, you know, 30,000 in action on, like, random college basketball totals. You know what I mean?

[Sean]

So they must have an algorithm that detects stuff like that.

[Elf]

Yeah. So I think every book is different, but I think the way they tell with the live stuff now is, like, volume. So if you're making like five bets in an hour, like random stuff, like small market games, they'll know something's going on. If you bet on a game twice, like, if. If. If you're. I don't know, like the championship game. Right. If you hit the total once and then you hit it again and again, they're like, why is this guy hitting it three times? He already bet it once. Like what? Like a normal person, they make one bet and they sweat that bet. Right, Right. But if a model is mispriced on a game, they're going to be off all game, usually on that price. So you could probably get it a few times. So you know that's one other way they do it. And. Yeah, because if you're. If you're on a limited account on DraftKings, you literally can't make the same bet twice on a game. Like if you wanted to bet, like if the Chiefs are playing and DraftKings is off on the Chiefs, like off market. If you bet they're spread once like in the first quarter, if you try to bet it again in the fourth quarter on like a, like a first tier limited account on DraftKings, they won't let you bet it again. I'll say duplicate that. But like anyone else could. But like, if you're limited, you can't.

[Sean]

Yeah.

[Elf]

And then there's the death limits on DraftKings, 1% limits, which is what they have me on now.

[Sean]

Cheese.

[Elf]

You can't bet anything.

[Sean]

How does that happen?

[Elf]

I don't know. It just happens from winning. You beat them and then they limit you.

[Sean]

How much were you up when they.

[Elf]

Not that much. Like 30,000 maybe for them.

[Sean]

That's a lot though, right?

[Elf]

Not really DraftKings, you know, not a lot at all.

[Sean]

Well, they're used to everyone losing, I'd imagine. So if you're 30k, they're like, what's going on here?

[Elf]

Right. 30k with a very large sample size of bets, I think is the key thing. So they know like, okay, this guy, like, you can't beat this guy. And like he's. I was just grinding out like $100 bets, right? Just like I made like 30,000 bets last year.

[Sean]

Holy.

[Elf]

Yeah, just.

[Sean]

That's like 100 a day. 3,000. Yeah, 100 a day.

[Elf]

And there is. There are some days, like NFL days when there's NFL, NBA and like hockey. Some days I'd have like 700 bets on the day. Just literally on my PC all day, just sniping. It's like the best days ever. Yeah, I love those days.

[Sean]

Holy crap.

[Elf]

So fun. Yeah. Like 700 bets a day. But if you think about it though, if you have an edge, why would you make two bets a day? You wouldn't. Like, like. All right, like, for example, if you're a blackjack card counter, are you going to go into the casino and play one hand and leave? No, you're going to play till they kick you out. It's the same thing with sports. If you had an edge, if you really had an edge, you would grind it out all day. You know what I mean?

[Sean]

Yeah.

[Elf]

So that's what I do.

[Sean]

Has your edge ever got caught? Like, has someone ever patched it yeah.

[Elf]

So I'll tell a crazy story. So FanDuel. In March, I made $70,000 on FanDuel in one month on in March, it was the most ridiculous edge. I didn't find it. A guy named NBA Greens on Twitter, his name is Brett, finds on. He found it and told me about it. It was a substitution angle. And I can say this now because it's dead. So if you try to do it, sorry, it doesn't work anymore. But let's say LeBron is playing, right? And at the end of the first quarter, his line's 23. He gets subbed out. And like the first quarter, he'll get sub back in, like right before the first quarter ends or something. If you take his under 23 and a half while he's on the bench, his line would drop to 20 or even 19. So you would take his over before he came back in. And right when he comes back in, it's going to pop back up to 23. So you would take his under when he gets subbed out, take his over before he got sub back in. And we were getting three four point middles on every single player in the NBA paying minus 110, minus 110 each side. And I was wagering like, like 1.2 K on these bets on every single player. And it was such a low variance strategy. I was just printing money every day on FanDuel. It was like, amazing. Yeah, so I was using like 10% account, you know, just printing money every day. And at the end of the month, we were making so much money. And the main reason why we got caught was because too many people found out about the edge. Everyone was instructed to keep their mouth shut. But you tell one person, that person will tell one friend that they know will keep their mouth shut, and then that one person will tell one per, you know, so. And too many people found out with money. That was the issue. So, like, there was like 12 of us who all had money who were pounding this edge efficiently, right? So FanDuel, every single time a player would get subbed out, would probably take like $20,000 on an under on a player prop. And they're probably like, what the hell's going on? You know what I mean? So it was. And then all these guys were making so much money, they all took a trip to Arizona in an Airbnb and they were doing like 12 different accounts, fandom accounts in the same Airbnb. So. And we're all on a discord call, right? Like talking, okay, this Guy's gonna get subbed out. Like, we're helping each other, stuff like that. And we knew the rotations like the back of our hand. Every single player in the NBA, we knew when they were gonna get subbed out and sub back in.

[Sean]

That's crazy.

[Elf]

Yeah. And we'd be on a Discord call, so we'd all be taking the same. Same action. And it was one by one. I called it. I called it Purge Night. One by one, all of our accounts 1 percented. Locked. Like, you got contact, customer support. You can't log in. I had over $100,000 to my name, locked out of FanDuel.

[Sean]

Jeez.

[Elf]

It was like the. Like you said it was. You were locked in your room for two weeks. I was so stressed. Like, I had, like, my whole betting bankroll locked out on Fandel, and it was awful. They thought I was the one in charge, too, because I was, like, the most popular Twitter account of all my friends at the time. They thought I had bought it, like, seven accounts, because we were all hitting the same lines.

[Sean]

Oh, they hit you up?

[Elf]

No, they didn't hit me up, but I had, like, a friend who worked for Vandal at the time telling me these things, and he was vouching for me. He's like, no, they're not bodying. Like, they just have an edge, right? And this is the edge. And he was telling them. But it takes, like, a lot to patch, like, a live player prop system, which they did in the off season. But till the off season happened, they kind of just kept us locked and, you know, and then when they unlocked us, we were all like, death limited.

[Sean]

Like, how long was it locked?

[Elf]

I was locked out of my fandom account for, like, a week and a half with, like, my whole betting bankroll in there. So I was like. I was so stressed, dude. I sent them a law. I sent them a. I don't know, a letter of demand. Yeah. To unlock my account. They were, like, blowing me off for a full week. Like, oh, like, just wait for them to respond to you. As soon as I sent that letter of demand, like, you're illegally holding my money.

[Sean]

Yeah.

[Elf]

They unlocked my account in two hours.

[Sean]

Wow.

[Elf]

So I'm like, okay. Like, it was a bunch of. You know, they're playing there. It's war, right? With them so they can use their terms of service to, like, bully you. Like, keep your account suspended indefinitely until you do get that letter of demand. And we sent it. So, Yeah, I made 70k off them in one month.

[Sean]

That's a Smart strategy.

[Elf]

It was, like, the craziest month of my life.

[Sean]

You know, did that work at other books or did that FanDuel tell everyone else to.

[Elf]

It only worked on FanDuel because every other book uses, like, like, swish analytics to do their player props. But it worked better if you used, like, fanduel and another book. Like, if you were just taking the best line on sub out and then the best line on sub in. So at the time, I was limited or banned from every single sportsbook in the US besides FanDuel. So I was just doing it with FanDuel.

[Sean]

Wow.

[Elf]

And, yeah, I made 70, so it was crazy. Yeah. So that was my. That was the most I've ever made in one month gambling.

[Sean]

That's more than people make ever in gambling.

[Elf]

Yeah. Yeah, that was my best month. But that was a crazy story.

[Sean]

Yeah.

[Elf]

I mean, can you imagine? Like, you made all this money and you don't even know if you're going to get paid out because they have you locked out of your account. You have to send them, like, a letter of demand. And I'm. Dude, I'm 24. I don't know any of this stuff. You know what I mean? I still had a job.

[Sean]

I was like, dude, you were an actuary.

[Elf]

Yeah. I'm dealing with all this stress. I'm like, what's going on here? You know what I mean? It was insane odds. Yeah.

[Sean]

Did you bet on March Madness this season or no?

[Elf]

No, because I don't have an edge unless I'm at my PC, and I've been running around Vegas for the last month focusing on the content. But March Madness and, like, big events like March Madness are great to gamble on if you're limited because the books will, like, universally raise limits because they feel more confident in these markets because there's more money, more liquidity, more information. So those are the best sport games to bet on. And usually they'll have a lot of, like, exposure to one side. They'll try to offload it live. The Sharps, like, they'll hold, like, a little arb to some book, and then you could ar both sides and you can get off, like, the Super Bowl. I made, like, a lot of money on the Super Bowl. Just. I made, like, with no risk.

[Sean]

Really?

[Elf]

Yeah.

[Sean]

You had the Chiefs losing that?

[Elf]

Yeah, I had, like, very large bias positions on the Eagles, like, because Chiefs were publicly, you know, the. I think the public was heavy on the Chiefs. Right. Like, if the Chiefs won, the books were. And a lot of books were hanging Eagles, like, on A really, really good price, like FanDuel was BET Online was like they were up 24 to zero and BET Online had them at minus a thousand at halftime, whereas every other book was like minus 6,000.

[Sean]

Gee.

[Elf]

So I was like orbing them like over and over and over again and just taking a biased position towards the Eagles because that was the mispriced side. So I made a lot of money on that day. It was great. Yeah, most people watch the Super Bowl. I was just like loving life at my PC. I didn't even watch the super bowl, but I had over $100,000 in play on it.

[Sean]

You didn't miss much.

[Elf]

No, I didn't miss anything.

[Sean]

That game was hard to watch.

[Elf]

No, I loved it. I was having a tough of fun.

[Sean]

So with arbitrage, can you lose money? Like how does that.

[Elf]

You can. Yeah, you can if you mess up. So there's, there'll be times where you're like, you'll bet the same thing. It'll be user error. Or if like a line moves on you, like something that's an orb is going to the market will correct itself. Because mathematically speaking, it's impossible for an arbitrage to occur without something being mispriced. So if something's mispriced, people are going to bet it.

[Sean]

Right?

[Elf]

Right. So you got to be quick to. You got to be the first one to it. So it happens a lot where you'll bet one thing and then the other line. Like if you bet the side that was like, I guess correct first and you didn't bet the mispriced first, the mispriced side will move and then you'll just be riding like a negative 10%.

[Sean]

Oh, right.

[Elf]

So you just be having, you just need your computer. Yes, I need your computer. So that's how you would lose money is like user error. And yeah, like a lot of things can happen. Like you can bet like an under and then live. They usually put you on a timer just to make sure you're not like, you know, court siding, which is like having someone at the game and then they're calling you, telling you what's happening.

[Sean]

Oh shit. People do that?

[Elf]

Oh yeah, people do that. People, my show do that.

[Sean]

So they're at the game. So they have like a five second advantage, I guess.

[Elf]

Yeah. But the thing is though is the books, they'll have like, they have software that knows if you're at the game doing that. So they'll have other people go to the game and call them. No different Location. Yeah. So it's sophisticated. So what they'll do. These guys on my show, I don't want to like spoil it, but they'll go down like 20, 30k on a DraftKings count or something. Get VIP status. Once you're VIP, you can deposit a lot and then courtside it. Try to make it look sneaky, like you got lucky once or twice, you know what I mean? And then just chill.

[Sean]

Wow.

[Elf]

So make like a quick 20k, 30k, bet you won and then hang out for a week. Right. Don't do anything. It's like cat and mouse, you know what I mean? Like, you don't want the books to think you're sharp so you lose money and then you'll make some money back. Like, okay, he's hot. And then eventually you want to run it up, but you got to do it in a smart way. Otherwise you're just going to get limited.

[Sean]

There's not many books, right?

[Elf]

Yeah, no, they're not. Not legal in the US or it depends on your state, you know. So like the best states to gamble, if you want to be a professional sports better, is probably Arizona.

[Sean]

You the worst, right?

[Elf]

It's bad. Yeah. There's no Fandel here.

[Sean]

Yeah. Or DraftKings. Right.

[Elf]

I don't know. I mean, I don't live here, so.

[Sean]

Yeah. No, because I think all the casinos rallied against the online betting apps.

[Elf]

Really?

[Sean]

Yeah.

[Elf]

Okay. Yeah. So terrible for this state, but I.

[Sean]

Think the casinos have their own. I'm not sure if they're good, but like the win has won.

[Elf]

Oh, the wind's awful. It's so easy to beat. Yeah.

[Sean]

Really?

[Elf]

Yeah. They were in Mass for a little bit and I was cooking them.

[Sean]

Oh, wow.

[Elf]

If I didn't have a banker all the time.

[Sean]

You got banned from the win.

[Elf]

Yeah, I'm banned from the limited. Limited, like heavily limited.

[Sean]

Same thing at that point.

[Elf]

It's the same thing. Like they would ban you if they could, but they legally can't. So they'll limit you to like $1 bets.

[Sean]

Oh, they legally can't ban.

[Elf]

You know, they legally can't ban you unless you like violate their terms of conditions. Like if you're like multi accounting, like unless they find something in the terms and conditions that they can ban you for, they legally can. They can't ban you for winning. They can't ban you for being in Vantage Player. Right. But like they can limit you. That's what they do. And that's fine. Right. That's the game. Right. It's cat and mouse yeah, Like, I'm actually, like, against regulation because, Reg. Like, regulation will just ruin everything. These regulars don't know anything about the industry. Yeah, they just. They just hear about the. The problem gambling stories and they'll, like. And the casinos will leverage that to, like, pass laws against Sharps. So they'll, like, share information. Like, there was, like, a bill being talked about to be passed of, like, a sharing information bill, but everyone just knew right away that these books would just communicate and tell each other who the Sharps are, and then. No. No Sharps would ever be able to exist under the guise of problem gambling. Like, oh, this guy's a problem gambler. Don't let him play. Don't let him play here. Right. And they're. That was the guys, right? And the legislators, like, oh, it's a great idea. Right. Like, it'll help people lose less money. But in reality, the sports books are like, yeah, we're just gonna. We're just not gonna get rinsed by these sharks, you know? So that's why I'm, like, against regulation, because, like, we understand each other. Like, the Sharps in the books, like, the cat and mouse game that we have to play. So I'd like to just leave. Keep that relationship as is. Yeah, it's working well.

[Sean]

So which Sharp is the go? Like, has someone made crazy money doing something like this?

[Elf]

Yeah, I mean, Spanky is, like, the biggest. He runs the largest syndicate in the US or he'll.

[Sean]

Spanky?

[Elf]

Yeah.

[Sean]

What a name.

[Elf]

He's in my show all the time.

[Sean]

Oh, really?

[Elf]

Yeah, he loves it.

[Sean]

He's made M's off this.

[Elf]

Oh, multiple M's? Yeah. He usually gets, like. Like, I don't even. Probably, like, billions in volume a year at, like, 3% easy.

[Sean]

Crazy.

[Elf]

So he's printing money, but, like, he'll get stiff sometimes. Like, he works with a lot of partners, so he'll get stiff for, like, a lot of money and stuff like that. But, yeah, people run it out. Like, everyone I associate with in gambling, like, they run it up. You know what I mean? Like, they're probably making. Like, it depends on who you are and, like, how risky you are. Yeah, but, like, people I associate with are in that kind of like 200 to like 500,000 a year range. Right. And we. We don't, like. It's very taboo to share edges with each other because, like, if someone were to share an edge with me, they would know I would hammer it. Right. And probably kill it. So they don't, like, share edges like that. So that's I got a lot of hate early on in my career when I first came to Twitter because I was leaking edges. Like, I was like streaming live, arbitrage, calling in an infinite money glitch on Twitter. And all these pros are like, what the fuck are you doing, dude?

[Sean]

That's their livelihood.

[Elf]

That's their livelihood. And I didn't. I had a full time job. I was just loving life, you know. So it is what it is, right?

[Sean]

That's impressive that you found these people because there's so much BS in the space.

[Elf]

Oh, yeah. I mean, it's easy to tell for me. It's easy to tell like, who's a jokester, who's not.

[Sean]

I mean, even yesterday you called out someone in front of me. It was, I knew nothing about it.

[Elf]

But it was in five seconds. I'll tell the story. Yeah, the guy said he's a baccarat player with an edge. I said, okay, like, you know what, what, what do you think you're like, what percent roi do you think you're. No, no, I said, I said, how much do you like, I said, what percent roi do you think your edges. Right. Which is what a normal person would say. And he said, oh, I don't know. I try to make like 500. I mean, he said I make. He didn't say I try to make. He said, I make like 500 to a thousand a day. And I said, okay, like, how much volume do you get? And then he said, like $10,000 a day. He bets. I'm like, okay, so you have a 10 baccarat edge. And he's like, yeah. And then immediately I knew right away this guy didn't know what he was talking about. I mean, maybe like there's just, it just doesn't exist a 10% baccarat edge. Like, there's no 10 edges in table games in a casino. Unless you're like cheating somehow. Yeah, right.

[Sean]

Like Phil Ivy.

[Elf]

Phil Ivy with edge sorting. Like, that was like a. I think like even higher, like 15 to 20% expected value edge.

[Sean]

Yeah.

[Elf]

This guy, this guy at Lifetime Fitness did not have a 10% edge. I guarantee it. But yeah, I could, like, tell him, like, I'll ask him like two questions and I'll know right away.

[Sean]

Yeah, you knew fast.

[Elf]

Yeah, I knew right away. I mean, like I said, like, I'm a mathematician, so I, like, I think about these things in a different way than most people.

[Sean]

Right, right.

[Elf]

Like, I view, like a lot of people view sports. Like, who won, who didn't? Oh, this team won. It was the right side. Right. Like, I view things as like, okay, every single sporting event has a theoretical probability of an outcome. Right. You're trying to make. You're trying to bet on the. On a thing with a better implied probability than the theoretical probability. And that's how you profit long term. That's what the casinos do.

[Sean]

Right.

[Elf]

So you're just. You just want to act as the casino. You want to make good mathematical bets. That's how I view things. Most people view sports as like, this is a lock. Like, this team's gonna win. Right. But like, there's a price in which you bet on that team and it's not profitable to bet on it anymore.

[Sean]

Yeah, most people view betting emotionally, I feel like.

[Elf]

Oh, yeah, absolutely. And that's the worst way to do it. Like, like you'll have a bias towards your hometown team or something like that, but it's actually a good way to like, prep accounts.

[Sean]

Yeah.

[Elf]

Like, if you want the sticker and idiot. Yeah, just. Just keep firing on your hometown team. Hope they get hot like, while you bet on it. Once you got like 20 or 30 bets under your belt, then maybe you start sneaking in some, like some ev. Stuff, like some good stuff.

[Sean]

But there's a formula behind this. You got to act like you're dumb at first.

[Elf]

And, oh, yeah, you gotta, you gotta be able to punt some money at first. Like, make them think you're an idiot. Make some really big parlay bets. Like, you gotta be comfortable. It doesn't even matter if you win the bet or lose the bet. All that matters is that you made a bad bet. You know what I mean? Like, if you, if I came to you and I said, let's flip this coin, if you win, you get $10. If I win, I'll get $5. You're just gonna flip that coin with me all day?

[Sean]

Yeah.

[Elf]

You know what I mean? So it's the same thing with the casinos. You'll just make dumb parlay bats and then. And then you can start firing a little bit, but it's a little more complicated than that.

[Sean]

Yeah. Do you do any parlays or is the odds just terrible?

[Elf]

No, no, I mean, I'll do parlays if there's like a parlay boost, like a token or something like that. You can get like, you can get an edge if they like, if they give you like a, like a parlay token, like no sweatbed or something. But besides that. Now, like, you could parlay, like to expect the value bets together and then it's good. But now I don't do any parlays. I just fire straights all day.

[Sean]

Mathematically it doesn't make sense, right?

[Elf]

No, it makes sense mathematically if the bets within the parlay are mathematically profitable. And then you could parlay them or you can make negative expected value bets with correlation to each other. So like there was a big edge on price picks, which is patch now where people would just take like the quarterbacks overs and the, like the number one and two receivers overs and correlate them. Correlate the parlay and then take the opposing quarterbacks overs. Because if it's a high scoring NFL game, it's going to be a high scoring NFL game. Right. Everyone's going to go over. So there's correlation. But independently, each one of those bets was bad. But when you correlate them, it was good. So it doesn't, it's not. You can't always say parlays are bad. Parlays are good. If you can like correlate them properly, they'll be good. But you know, to most people, parlays are bad. Yeah. If you're just gonna degenerately gamble, just do straights. Yeah. And just find the best price. You know, if you like a side, just like, please just search like two or three books and just get the best price.

[Sean]

Yeah.

[Elf]

You'll lose way less money. Yeah.

[Sean]

Have you ever seen someone have an edge in table games?

[Elf]

Yeah, of course. Like black. Yeah. Card counters and blackjack and stuff. Like there's no edge in roulette. Like there's no edge in. I mean, Bakra, obviously Phil Ivey, hasn't it like had an edge? Me personally, I don't, I don't like do any table. Like I said, I'm at my PC, like all day, just chilling, you know, I love it. But table game edges are like, hard to find. There's a lot of slot edges. Did you know that?

[Sean]

I did, yeah. Told me about a few of them.

[Elf]

Yeah. Slot hustlers. I. I've never seen it in person, but I get the idea of like people run up a machine.

[Sean]

Yeah. It's a specific machine, right?

[Elf]

Yeah. Specific machines are good. Good and profitable.

[Sean]

But even if you do the math, like I know a guy in Vegas that does it. He walks to every casino every day. He only makes like 500 bucks a day.

[Elf]

Really? I mean, 500 bucks a day is good though.

[Sean]

Yeah, but he's spending all day, bro.

[Elf]

Really?

[Sean]

12 hours.

[Elf]

Really?

[Sean]

Yeah.

[Elf]

Okay.

[Sean]

So like, I feel like the hourly on that's just like 40 bucks an hour. Yeah.

[Elf]

Yeah.

[Sean]

I guess for some people it's whatever.

[Elf]

But I mean it's like for some people, would you rather work a 9 to 5 or grind slots all day? He's probably addicted to the slots. So he like, you know, he's fine with doing it, you know, Cuz slots are addictive. It's very addictive. I know some advantage gamblers who will, who are great sports bettors who will make a lot of money sports betting and then blow it that same night on slots.

[Sean]

Really? Oh, that's stupid.

[Elf]

It's stupid. I feel so bad. It was actually the guy who got me into like, like arving.

[Sean]

Damn. Yeah, he was on the worst odds.

[Elf]

Yeah, but they're just so addictive. It just gets, it just catches you. Really? Yeah, it's like, it's the way they design the slots with the noises and the colors and stuff. It's. They literally design it to be addictive. Like they study brain patterns and stuff like that. I mean for me, like I don't, I just wouldn't get it. Right. Like you say I don't get it.

[Sean]

But you logical, you're too mathematical.

[Elf]

Yeah, I think that's that. Right. But like most people don't. They just fall into that trap. Right. And that's the, that's kind of like the. I don't know, that's the nature of the industry. Right. Like if you are going to be an advantage gambler, then you have to be okay with people losing money. Otherwise you can't win. Which is why I don't educate people anymore or teach anyone.

[Sean]

Yeah, you don't sell your picks.

[Elf]

No, I can't sell my picks because no one would ever be able to get them. The line would move. Yeah, I'll. I'll bet something and two seconds later the line's gone. Damn. Yeah, they move. In a second. They have like fanduel has my account like flagged. Like this is Elf's account. So they'll literally just see it on their chart. Like they will like traders will filter to the Sharps like live during the game or pre match or if you're maxing something. Like if you're only allowed to bet $1,000 on something and you bet $1,000, they're like, okay, so this is wrong. Let's move this. So if you're going to bet something and you're sending it out to like your clients and the line didn't move, then it's a bad sign.

[Sean]

That's crazy.

[Elf]

Probably means it wasn't a good bet.

[Sean]

I didn't know they moved that quick.

[Elf]

Oh, it moves like very fast.

[Sean]

Yeah, yeah. Second, you could copy like Nancy Pelosi's trades and stuff.

[Elf]

Yeah.

[Sean]

But the line doesn't move as fast.

[Elf]

Right.

[Sean]

Because you could actually make money copying insider trading.

[Elf]

Yeah, you can. It's. But that's a way more liquid market. Like you got to think, like each market you're betting on, like if you're betting on a NBA player prop, like there might only be like $10,000 bet on that one, right? And then you're like a thousand dollars of it. Like you're 10 of the market. You know what I mean? So it's like a stock has hundreds, like millions and billions traded on billions. Like it depends on the stock, but like a lot traded on it. So they're so liquid. Like, you know, if you want to throw 10,000 on it, it's not gonna move the price. Right. If you throw 10,000 on a game, it'll move the line. Right. So yeah.

[Sean]

Do you do a lot of DJ side bets and stuff?

[Elf]

No, never. People say I'm like a robot dude.

[Sean]

Really?

[Elf]

Yeah.

[Sean]

It's because I've seen some on your show. Like the push up one.

[Elf]

Oh, yeah. So I. People like DJing sports betting on me. Yeah, I'm the prop. So it was like people were just talking on my show about how many push ups can elf do in a minute. And there's a popular sports better named Amanda Vance. She comes on my show all the time and she was, I was supposed to go to a hockey game with her and she said if you could do 50 push ups in a minute. So she set the line, I'll buy you the hockey ticket. So I was like, all right, bet I'm going to do these 50 push ups, right? And my audience is like, we want to bet on it. So I hit up Profit X. I was like, put up a line for this, right? Like, can I do 50 push ups in a minute? And there was $150,000 wagered on me if I could do 50 pushups in a minute. And obviously I knew if I could or not. Like I didn't tell anyone. Like, it'd be insider information, insider trading. And the line closed at like minus 1 60. So it was a fair market. Like nothing really got leaked. But there was a lot of controversy around it. One because I orbed my own market. So Profit X had it up and bet online had it up. And I was literally just chilling and I was an orb And I bet both sides of myself made like a quick five bucks and I tweeted it. I was like, I was like, yo, just. Or myself like this is hilarious. You know, I'm a player prop, like hahaha. And everyone's like just bet on his own under. Like he's going to throw the competition like saying, because it was a liquid market. So like I could have bet like 20,000 on my under and just gone under.

[Sean]

Yeah, you could have made a lot.

[Elf]

Yeah, I could have, but at the risk of my reputation. Right, so, so it was a bad idea. But I tweeted that and people who didn't understand arbitrage just looked at the one bet and they're like, he bet his own under on bet online. Like this is bad. You know what I mean? So it was a big controversy leading up to it, which really just built more hype for, for the, the competition. So if you went on Profit X that day of the, of the push up competition, the most traded event was like there was one NBA game that day. It was like 500000 wagered on in total. The second was the PGA championship. The third was the elf push up.

[Sean]

That's hilarious.

[Elf]

Yeah. So like there was all these rules that were, that we stuck to. I had to have my chest touch a Coca Cola can. I needed to be shirtless so that they could verify my chest hit the can.

[Sean]

Was it standing up or sideways?

[Elf]

It was standing up because if it was sideways, if my chest hit it the way. Can you imagine if I was doing the push ups and, and there was like 1.1k people in there. Like it was a sponsored episode. The CEO of Profit X was like so worried that this would go wrong and then they would look bad. But I banged out 55 push ups for the boys, no questions.

[Sean]

You were training before?

[Elf]

I was training. I'm in good shape. You know, I, I'm, I love the gym.

[Sean]

That's impressive.

[Elf]

So yeah. And then there was one guy who worked out with me, Brett, and he bet $8,000 on me to go over the first day the market came out and then tweeted it. So there was enough information out there, like public information that people could have like figured out if I was going to go over or not. But the thing is like, if you watch my show, I wear glasses on my, I wear glasses normally I look like a nerd. You know, I'm a math kid. So people just figured I couldn't do the push ups, right. So then there was all this money wagered on the event.

[Sean]

I could see that.

[Elf]

Yeah. And there'll be more money wagered on this Sean Perry fight.

[Sean]

That one might hit a million.

[Elf]

It could. We got to get the lineup, like, quick.

[Sean]

How much was bet on the Mozzie, Sean? One was. Was it six figures?

[Elf]

So it was six figures. And bet online opened the market two hours before the fight.

[Sean]

Damn.

[Elf]

They started off to win $100. So super low limits. And they hit six figures, and they only bumped it up to $500 right before the fight. Wow. And they hit six figures.

[Sean]

So yours will definitely hit a mil.

[Elf]

Oh, I mean, I would like to hit a mill. It would be crazy if it hit a mill, but I'll tell them to whoever puts up the line. Like, you got to make the limits high. Like, I want people to be able to bet, like, 5K. I mean.

[Sean]

Yeah. I wonder why they only did 100 for that one.

[Elf]

They just didn't know, like. Like, you're not going to have a lot of money wager on, like, Sean Perry versus Mossy. Like, they didn't even know who Mossy was. It was funny. I was streaming the fight, right? And I would show things happening, and it would move the line in real time.

[Sean]

That's crazy.

[Elf]

Like, Sean Perry was like. I was hanging out with Sean Perry all day. He's talking to shit. Looking good. Whatever the lines, like, minus 250, Sean Perry. Mozzie comes to the gym in a Lamborghini, gets right in Sean's face, tells him in front of the live that he's going to kill him, and he can't wait to knock him the fuck out. The line moved from minus 230, Sean Perry. And then all of a sudden, Mozzie's the favorite. Just because he's talking shit, there's no reason, right? So then we get in the gym, and people are betting on it. We have Dave Mason on. It's, like, electric. He's talking about people betting what the line moving. And then I show Mozzie warming up, and Mozzie's the favorite, right, to win the fight. And he's punching the bag like this. You can tell he's never thrown a bunch. The line moved from Mozzie, like, minus 200. Mazzy was like, plus 200 after that. Like, so everyone hammered Perry right after I showed Mozzie throwing punches. So it was hilarious. Like, the line was moving in real time with the live stream.

[Sean]

Yeah.

[Elf]

So it was great.

[Sean]

I thought Mozzy, with all that shit talking, was going to win.

[Elf]

Yeah. He was telling he Was going to kill him. He's like, I'm a die in the ring. Like. And he meant it, too. Like, if it was a street fight, Mazi would have won. But since they did boxing with gloves and, you know, because Mazi came out firing and knocked Sean right on his ass immediately. And then he went to swing on him while he's on the ground. Boxers don't do that. You know what I mean?

[Sean]

Yeah.

[Elf]

So if it was a street fight, Mozzie would have won, but, you know, it was a boxing fight. So by round two, Perry was just knocking him down. And it was like a cartoon. You were, like, watching a cartoon. Almost like Mozzie was tired. You would charge at Sean. Sean would throw a jab at him and get hit, and then he would, like, stumble and fall. And then there's like, a photo of Mozzie, like, in the. In the hilarious memes came from that. Yeah. So that was. That was electric. And I think, like, there'll be more money wager on me version. Oh, definitely. Definitely more than. Than the Mazzi. Just because there wasn't enough time at this point.

[Sean]

You might have to start a league for these sports bettors to fight each other.

[Elf]

Yeah, I must. I'll start. There's so much beef on my show. Everyone wants to fight each other.

[Sean]

Yeah. I saw King Cap was beefing.

[Elf]

King Cap was beefing with Sean. He wants to fight, but he's got, like, a little neck injury or something, so he didn't want to. Mozzy wants to fight Sean. Brett wants to fight. Man in the library, the character mpb, who's, like, scammed a bunch of bookies. People hate him. Someone paid me $3,000 in escrow to get NPB to show up to the fight so he can fight him on the undercard. So, like, people just want to fight. You know, they saw this one fight. They want it. They want to fight.

[Sean]

You're having an undercard, too.

[Elf]

Yeah, you're going to be an undercard.

[Sean]

Damn, this thing's legit.

[Elf]

Yeah. If you legit. Streamed rafts, everything. Yeah. Holy crap crowd, it'd be great.

[Sean]

I'm glad you have the refs this time.

[Elf]

Yeah, we're gonna have refs this time. Yeah. That way there's no, you know, there's.

[Sean]

A lot of pushing.

[Elf]

Oh, yeah, a lot of pushing. I mean, it's dirty boxing, right? What are you gonna do? And there's no money on the line. Like, this time, Sean and I are putting up a hundred thousand.

[Sean]

You think he'll put it up Though, we'll see.

[Elf]

The guy's so annoying to deal with. I asked some people to like that he trusts if they wanted to escrow it, and they said, no, they don't want anything to do with him.

[Sean]

So he wants to just. What does he want to do?

[Elf]

Get a lawyer. I said, I'm down. You get the lawyer. And he's like, oh, we have a month. We'll. We'll do it, like, later.

[Sean]

Damn.

[Elf]

I'm like, all right, like, if you want to do this, like, let's do it. You know what I mean? He says he wants to fight, but he just doesn't. He's got this rib injury. He's pushing it off. He's being a little. You know what I mean? So. Damn, he'll fight me.

[Sean]

You got a show tonight? What's next?

[Elf]

Yeah, I got a show tonight.

[Sean]

I got a show coming on tonight.

[Elf]

We don't know. I have a few, like, guests lined up.

[Sean]

Okay.

[Elf]

I'll leak crabs bets from bookit crews coming on tomorrow night. We might get spanky on tonight. I asked a few people, so, I mean, they might have texted me back during the podcast, I don't know. But a lot of the times the guests are spontaneous. Like, if something pops up on Twitter, I'm all over it. I'm like, come on, you're good at that. Yeah. Really good at that. And, like, I'm really good at stirring the pot, like, capturing the moment. That's. That's why I think my show kind of took off.

[Sean]

Yeah.

[Elf]

Was. You know, I know what people like. They like drama. They like beef in this space.

[Sean]

Yeah. Because a bunch of DJs just, you know. Yeah.

[Elf]

Degenerate sports betting. They just. They just want something to bet on. You know what I mean? Like, if it's an elf push up market, if it's a fight between two influencers, they love that stuff.

[Sean]

Yeah.

[Elf]

That's what gets the most action, you know, and it's different. Right. Like, there's professional events every single day. You know, you'll bet on it. But, like, you know, when this kid is fighting, like a sports bet, they see on the Internet all the time with his shirt off. Like, they want to bet on that, you know, so these books want to. And they want to sponsor it, which is great, you know, I love it. So you built. I built a lot of good relationships with the sports books because of that.

[Sean]

Yeah. Hopefully they stop banning you because of your audience now.

[Elf]

Yeah, I hope so. You could.

[Sean]

You could provide them a lot of business, too.

[Elf]

Yeah, absolutely. I bring a ton of. You bring volume to them. That's all they care about. Depositors, you know, they don't, they don't want you to bring sharps on, but if you bring, if you just bring initial depositors and sign ups, that's what they care about. Because like each sign up, like, they'll give you bonus bets to sign up because they know for every user they sign up, it's like, I think it's like $1600 in value.

[Sean]

That's crazy.

[Elf]

Yeah, it's insane.

[Sean]

Like, holy crap.

[Elf]

That's how much the average person loses per year that that signs up.

[Sean]

It's actually nuts. You bring them 100 people, that's 160k.

[Elf]

A year in perpetuity. Right. So it's like it's worth millions of dollars. Million. Yeah. Because like, yeah, the perpetuity. Right. Yeah. And then they know how to keep these guys as customers, right, that they know how to send email. Like if they haven't gambled in a week or something. Send them a bonus bet.

[Sean]

Right.

[Elf]

Get them back, you know.

[Sean]

You know the psychology behind the casinos too. That's smart.

[Elf]

Yeah, exactly, exactly. And you can plan it too. Like if, if you're on an account and it's 10k or something like that, you can like email. Email. I'm like, oh, I'm down so much, like, can I get a bonus pet? Or something? And they'll usually give you one.

[Sean]

No way.

[Elf]

Yeah, you got to play into it, you know?

[Sean]

Wow.

[Elf]

You got to pretend like you're losing, but there's. If you go too far with it and you're like, oh, my wife is like mad. Then they'll. If, if there's certain words you can't say, they'll lock your account for problem gambling.

[Sean]

Really?

[Elf]

Yeah. Cuz the commission.

[Sean]

Alcoholism.

[Elf]

Yeah. Like, oh, I lost my job, something. Stuff like that. Like, if you're trying to play into it too much, they'll, they'll lock you out. They'll. They'll exclude you because like legally they have to.

[Sean]

Right.

[Elf]

But if you say like, oh, like I lost so much this week, like, can I get a bonus bet or something, like they'll usually say, yeah, yeah, you know, so if they see you losing. Yeah.

[Sean]

Have you been IP banned or your house?

[Elf]

I've never been IP banned. Brett did get IP banned from FanDuel after the whole March thing because he used like seven different accounts on all his family members in the same address. So they just IP banned it. I haven't been IP banned, but I've been. I've been limited, like, so many times. Like, more than I can count. It hurts every time.

[Sean]

Yeah.

[Elf]

You know, because you'll have an edge on a book and then you get limited. It's like a dagger.

[Sean]

There goes 90% of your.

[Elf]

There goes. There goes. There's some volume there. And you got to, like, find a new book to bet on. Find.

[Sean]

You ever book on the sketchy crypto ones or.

[Elf]

No, no, never. The. Every single offshore book I use is, like, I make sure they're legit. You know what I mean? So I only use, like, I use bet 105 bet online bookmaker. Like, some of the bet online clones that have the same lines. You can, like, get double the volume, stuff like that. But only, like, reputable ones that, like, the pros use. And, like.

[Sean]

So not Steak or those other.

[Elf]

No, I don't use that because it's. It's. It's not available in the usa. It's like VPN it.

[Sean]

Oh, yeah.

[Elf]

And I haven't figured out how to, like, VPN my PC on, like, one window and not the rest. Because if you have a VPN on, you won't be able to access, like, FanDuel. Like, they're very good.

[Sean]

Oh, really?

[Elf]

Yeah, yeah. They don't want people vpning in.

[Sean]

Damn.

[Elf]

Yeah, they're really good. Like, you won't be able to VPN into vandal from Europe. Not a chance.

[Sean]

Really?

[Elf]

Yeah. No.

[Sean]

Wow.

[Elf]

So you got to be in a legal state. They're on that. Yeah.

[Sean]

Holy crap. I didn't know that.

[Elf]

No.

[Sean]

Yeah, I used to use a VPN NordVPN.

[Elf]

Really?

[Sean]

Yeah.

[Elf]

It'll work for, like, steak and rubed and stuff, because, like, they know that. They want the U.S. clients. Right. But FanDuel, with all the, like, the, like, the U.S. legislation and stuff, like, they'll get hit with a massive lawsuit. It's not worth it for them to allow VPNs, you know? Yeah, they're really good with it.

[Sean]

Well, dude, what's next for you? Where can people find you? And stay tuned to the show?

[Elf]

Yeah. So find. You could find me on Twitter @elf. If you just search elf, I'll come up. But my at is @yelff Underscore. And then if you're into boxing stuff, I'll be posting a lot of, like, exclusive boxing stuff on my Instagram page that I just started. So that is at Yelff. Underscore. Underscore. So there's an extra underscore. Someone had it or something. I don't know how, but how did.

[Sean]

Someone have that one? Yeah, we'll link it below.

[Elf]

Yeah, we'll link it. The ELF IG needs to grow, so we support the ig. Absolutely.

[Sean]

Thanks for coming on, bro. That was fun.

[Elf]

Hey, absolutely. My pleasure, Sean.

[Sean]

See you in the ring.

[Elf]

I'll see you in the ring. Peace, guys.