Why Only 21 Million Bitcoin Matters So Much... | George Mekhail | DSH #1916

Summary

Digital Social Hour Episode Summary

Episode: Why Only 21 Million Bitcoin Matters So Much…
Guest: George Mekhail
Host: Sean Kelly
Date: April 14, 2026
Episode Number: DSH #1916

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Episode Overview

This episode of Digital Social Hour features George Mekhail, a seasoned Bitcoin advocate and founder of "Bitcoin for Corporations," returning for a timely conversation ahead of the upcoming Bitcoin conference. Host Sean Kelly and George dive deep into what makes Bitcoin’s 21 million hard cap so significant, how global events are shaping Bitcoin adoption, and the evolving perception of crypto from “risk asset” to global financial tool. The discussion spans institutional investment, macroeconomic trends, decentralization, the next generation’s challenges, and how Bitcoin’s design uniquely positions it in an uncertain world.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Bitcoin’s Four-Year Cycle, Institutional Adoption, and Geopolitics

• Current Cycle Dynamics:
  • The recent cycle is not following historical trends; 50% drawdowns are now considered "normal," diverging from the older 80% corrections ([01:00-01:10]).
  • Major corporate and institutional adoption informs this shift—companies are now buying more bitcoin than is mined daily ([01:15]).
• Geopolitical Developments:
  • Groundbreaking news: Iran is now demanding ships pay in Bitcoin to pass the Strait of Hormuz (up to $2 million per ship). This is seen as the first “real world test” for Bitcoin’s functionality on a sovereign level ([01:41-03:10]).
  • Historical context: Reference to WikiLeaks’ embrace of Bitcoin in 2011 as an early precedent for censorship resistance ([01:49-02:41]).
• Quote:

  “WikiLeaks got cut off from the banking system...and Satoshi, he disappeared, he’s like, this is too early. We’re not ready for this. And so he dipped. That was the actual test—now what we’re seeing in Iran is institutional asset use.”
  — George Mekhail (02:00)

2. Bitcoin as Hard Money and Inflation Hedge

• Scarcity and Value Over Time:
  • Emphasis on the hard-coded 21 million bitcoin cap as Bitcoin's most important property ([04:26-05:13]).
  • Mekhail argues people focus too much on the USD value of Bitcoin rather than accumulating more bitcoin itself, comparing the mindset to the gold rush ([03:30-04:26]).
• Inflation Context:
  • US dollar has lost about 98-99% of its purchasing power over the last century due to key events (creation of the Fed, leaving the gold standard, 2008 crisis, COVID stimulus) ([04:27-04:41]).

  “At the end of the day, you want that number to go up: the number of bitcoin in your wallet.”
  — George Mekhail (03:40)

3. Institutions, Corporations, and “Whale” Accumulation

• Is Big Adoption Bad?
  • Mekhail addresses concerns about corporations and VCs dominating Bitcoin holdings.
  • Largest corporate holder (Saylor’s company) owns just over 3% of the supply—Mekhail argues mass adoption is a net positive, driving price and awareness ([05:20-06:51]).
• Game Theory & Decentralization:
  • If a company or government tries to own too much, it undermines the network’s value and decentralization ([06:51-07:35]).

  “If they [an institution] found 90% of it, well, it’s still probably not going to be worth that much...the demand isn’t there and you’re robbing it of some of its key principles.”
  — George Mekhail (06:52)

• Corporate Accountability:
  • Companies will soon have a fiduciary imperative to buy Bitcoin; not doing so may be seen as negligence ([08:17]).

4. Regulation, CBDCs, and the Future of National Currencies

• Regulatory Shifts:
  • Banks have largely gone from banning crypto users (e.g., Chase) to embracing crypto products—debit/credit cards, mortgage qualification with BTC reserves ([08:32-10:01]).
• CBDC (Central Bank Digital Currency) Skepticism:
  • Mekhail is strongly opposed to the digital dollar/CBDC idea, seeing it as a potential surveillance tool threatening privacy and freedom ([26:13-27:17]).

  “CBDC to me is pretty terrifying... it represents massive government surveillance, massive government control.”
  — George Mekhail (26:13)

• BRICS and Global De-Dollarization:
  • More nations seek alternatives to the U.S. dollar—Bitcoin is increasingly attractive, especially among countries beset by sanctions ([27:18-27:44]).

5. Bitcoin, Institutional Influence, and the Quantum Threat

• Institutional Power vs. True Control:
  • Institutions will have influence, not actual control, and their incentives (asset preservation) align with smaller holders ([18:42-20:10]).
  • Quantum computing FUD: The main risk is old, dormant wallets (like Satoshi’s) potentially being hacked; the ecosystem can adapt with software upgrades ([20:10-22:26]).

  “I’m not worried about Michael Saylor’s wallet. I’m not worried about the people who are active—we’re all going to upgrade...Bitcoin’s already quantum resistant in that sense.”
  — George Mekhail (21:39)

• Market Resilience:
  • Even massive “whale” selloffs are quickly absorbed by the market; community is resilient ([22:27-23:01]).

6. Culture Wars, Generational Shifts, and Education

• Crypto Bro Stereotypes & Culture War:
  • Institutional adoption continues despite mainstream skepticism; Bitcoin’s foundational role as censorship-resistant money is being overshadowed by speculation and “crypto bro” FUD ([11:46-12:59]).
• Parental and Generational Challenges:
  • Mekhail shares insights from his parenting book, "I’m Not Your Bruh: 21 Keys to Sound Parenting"; discusses generational softness, importance of boundaries, and present parenting ([33:42–41:05]).
  • Homeschooling as a means of reclaiming agency over children’s education and values ([36:41-38:33]).

  “If someone’s going to indoctrinate my kids, it’s going to be me. I’m not going to delegate that to somebody else and pay for it.”
  — George Mekhail (37:41)

• Social Media and Tech Boundaries:
  • Discussed the challenge of raising children in a smartphone age; their family’s approach to technology, openness, and rules around “using words you know” ([45:37-46:45]).

7. Memorable Moments, Quotes, and Banter

• Memorable Quotes:

  “Cash is just trash.”
  — Sean Kelly (10:08) “Set it and forget it, man...Set the autopay. Every time you get paid, just, you know, put a little bit aside and stop paying attention to the US dollar value.”
  — George Mekhail (14:34)

• Funny Betting Markets Discussion:
  • The hosts joke about polymarket bets like “Will Jesus return before GTA 6 comes out” ([15:41-15:52]).
• PolyMarket, Insider Betting, and Morality:
  • Mekhail and Kelly candidly discuss insider knowledge in prediction markets and its gray moral/ethical area ([16:00-18:13]).
• Streaking at the Super Bowl as a PolyMarket Bet:
  • Wild story: a guest previously on DSH made $500,000 by orchestrating a streak at the Super Bowl ([33:02-33:15]).

8. AI, Digital Identity, and the Near Future

• AI Clones and the Black Mirror Reality:
  • Lively discussion on AI agents, digital resurrection, and how social/technological advances might further blur reality ([28:01-29:33]).
• AI’s Impact on Jobs and Society:
  • Kelly uses 8 AI agents for various business tasks; both reflect on how AI is reshaping (not always eliminating) work ([29:01-30:33]).
• TikTok as Info Warfare, Social Media IQ, and Censorship:
  • Discussion on social media platform cultures, generational splits, and downside of algorithm-driven content, including TikTok’s influence on American society ([31:41-49:00]).

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Notable Timestamps

• [01:41] – Iran requires ships to pay in Bitcoin at Strait of Hormuz
• [04:26] – US dollar’s purchasing power and Bitcoin’s hard cap significance
• [05:20] – Largest corporate Bitcoin holders; Michael Saylor example
• [08:28] – Banks’ changing stance on crypto
• [10:13] – Cash losing 99% of its value in a lifetime
• [12:59] – Bitcoin’s foundational purpose & the digital gold rush
• [14:34] – “Set it and forget it” mindset for Bitcoin investing
• [16:00] – PolyMarket, insider info, and ethics of betting
• [21:39] – Quantum risk to dormant wallets (Satoshi’s)
• [26:13] – Dangers of CBDC and surveillance state
• [33:42] – “I’m Not Your Bruh” parenting philosophy
• [36:41] – Homeschooling’s benefits and rationale
• [45:37] – Raising kids in the smartphone age
• [50:01] – “Who knows what’s real anymore?” – AI, media, and warping reality
• [51:01] – AfroMan’s story, free speech, and the Bitcoin conference

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Tone & Takeaways

The conversation is bold, energetic, and often unfiltered, with both practical insights and cultural observations. George Mekhail brings a perspective grounded in both monetary history and the lived Bitcoin experience, balancing systemic critique with optimism about Bitcoin’s “digital gold rush” moment. The discussion fluidly spans from macroeconomics and policy to daily life, generational change, ethics, and the near future of tech.

Serious themes—decentralization, privacy, the risks of surveillance, AI’s growing influence, and generational legacy—are explored with humor and directness, making the episode approachable to both Bitcoin newcomers and veterans.

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Summary Table

| Segment | Key Topics & Quotes | Timecode | |----------------------------------------|---------------------------------------------------------|---------| | Bitcoin Cycle & Iran Development | Iran using Bitcoin, 4-year cycles disrupted | 01:41 | | Scarcity, Inflation, Dollar Decline | 21 million hard cap, USD’s loss of value | 04:26 | | Institutional Accumulation | Saylor’s 3% holding, game theory prevents hoarding | 05:20 | | Regulations & Banking | Banks’ acceptance, crypto in financial products | 08:28 | | Cultural & Generational Wars | “Crypto bro” image, value systems in flux | 12:59 | | Parenting & Education | “Not your bruh,” homeschooling, critical thinking | 33:42 | | AI & Surveillance & Social Media | Clones, agents, digital dystopias, TikTok’s impact | 28:01 | | Free Speech & AfroMan Story | Law, music, and Bitcoin’s activist roots | 51:01 |

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Standout Quotes

• “The best thing that can happen for Bitcoin is that the value goes up. That’s what makes people interested.”
  — George Mekhail ([05:00])
• “If someone’s going to indoctrinate my kids, it’s going to be me.”
  — George Mekhail ([37:41])
• “CBDC to me is pretty terrifying… government surveillance, massive government control.”
  — George Mekhail ([26:13])
• “Set it and forget it, man…Stop paying attention to the US dollar value.”
  — George Mekhail ([14:34])
• “It [Bitcoin] is already quantum resistant in that sense.”
  — George Mekhail ([21:39])

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Closing

The episode concludes with an invitation to the Bitcoin conference and a testament to the vibrancy and diversity of the Bitcoin community, with George emphasizing the uniquely grounded, future-facing values of those involved.

Links and references for the conference and George's parenting book are shared at the end.

Transcript

[A]

Bitcoin is still kind of being treated as a risk on asset. The criticisms of corporations buying too much bitcoin are like, they often sound like, oh, they're going to leave enough for the little guy or whatever. But the counterargument to that is the more adoption, the better. The best thing that can happen for bitcoin is that the value goes up. That's what makes people interested.

[B]

Okay guys, got George back on the show here getting ready for bitcoin conference this month, man. Good to see you.

[A]

Yeah, good to see you as well. Nice for having me again.

[B]

Believe it's been a year already.

[A]

Yeah, it's crazy.

[B]

Time flies.

[A]

Yeah, it really has.

[B]

What was bitcoin at last year? Oh, I think it was at over 100, right?

[A]

I think it was, yeah. And we, yeah, we had just crossed it.

[B]

Yeah. Everyone was feeling nice at that conference. The energy was high, man.

[A]

Yeah, little.

[B]

It's like whatever.

[A]

But a little different this time around, but still a lot to be excited about. I mean, you know, we're, we haven't even seen the 80% drawdowns that you know, are typical bare markets. So 50%, it's like, eh, it's whatever. Yeah. Give me, give me a real dip.

[B]

For people that have been here for a while, that's like.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

A normal year, right?

[A]

Pretty much, yeah.

[B]

Just still think the four year cycle is happening or do you think it's going to be a new cycle?

[A]

You know, I think last time we talked about this and I was saying this time is different and now that we're 50% draw down, I think it, it's still, still a little bit different. It's not an 80% draw down. But I do think that this cycle is, the, the structure of it is very different. There's a lot, there's a lot happening in the world around bitcoin that it's changed kind of how we look at 60 or 70k bitcoin versus last year. Yeah. You know, you got corporate adoption, you got institutions buying up more bitcoin than is being mined every single day. You got the Iran war. And just this week we're seeing the, the Strait of Hormuz being. They're, they're requiring payment in bitcoin for these, these ships to, to pass through.

[B]

I didn't know that.

[A]

Oh man, it's. Wow.

[B]

I ran governments requiring bitcoin.

[A]

Yeah. To. So in order to pass through the straight, you have to pay in bitcoin up to $2 million per ship. Right. And so it's the first time actually, I think on a global scale that bitcoin's being really tested. And actually I wouldn't even call it a test. I think, I mean really, if you look back at the history of Bitcoin 2011, when Satoshi disappeared, it was over the WikiLeaks thing, remember? So WikiLeaks got cut off from the banking system. All their credit cards got shut down, they couldn't accept donations. And bitcoin was like brand new, it was a couple years old. And WikiLeaks is like, all right, well we're just going to start accepting bitcoin then. It's censorship resistant. We don't have bank accounts. And this is what actually freaked Satoshi out. And this is ultimately why he disappeared. He's like, this is too early. We're not ready for this. And, and so he dipped. And so that was the actual test. Now what we're seeing in Iran is this is an institutional asset. It's already been tested, it's already been proven. And when you're a sanctioned country like Iran, they're, they're basically saying, well, we're not going to accept dollars, right. We're at war with the country that controls the US dollar, so we're going to accept bitcoin instead. And they can now do that with, you know, no, no tracking of the assets that they're bringing in and no one can, can take that money away from them. Right. So it's, it's fascinating. I mean really, regardless of where you're at politically, you have to examine this and be like, why, you know, why is this happening and how is this different? So I think that's going to change kind of the shape of the four year cycle.

[B]

That's really interesting. I thought with this war that crypto would go up. Honestly, like heavy metals have been going up. Gold and silver.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

People are worrying about the dollar. Right. And I wonder if that will eventually happen as the war goes on.

[A]

Yeah, the, the, the metals have been trading like crazy. I mean it's crazy. It's been so volatile and so, so

[B]

they've never outperformed crypto.

[A]

Right. And, and you know, bitcoin is still kind of being treated as a risk on asset. Right. But the long term thesis is that, yeah, war or instability or people looking at the dollar being destabilized or inflated away from should in theory make bitcoin go up. We haven't quite gotten there yet. I think that's going to be when we do actually break out. But I mean, it could happen at Any moment. Which is why I think there's a lot of conversations around the fact that bitcoin only has 21 million. It is a gold rush, Right. It's an accumulation game. People pay. I think too much attention to the price of bitcoin, the US dollar price of bitcoin, rather than paying attention to how much bitcoin you actually have. At the end of the day, you want that number to go up, the number of bitcoin in your wallet. Because if it's a scarce asset, like that's, that's really the name of the game, the, the US Dollar equivalent. I mean, what are we talking about with the US dollar equivalent? I mean think, think about how much you've lost in purchasing power with your, your dollars over the last hundred years.

[B]

98, right?

[A]

Yeah, 98. 99. And, and I mean, you can really trace it back to, to really significant events that have happened from, you know, Covid, when they basically doubled the money supply. Before that, the 2008 financial crisis. You had 9, 11.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You had 1971 when we, when we moved off the gold standard. 1913, you had the creation of the Fed. So in, in that span of time, you know, you're, you're not able to buy nearly as much as, you know, you were able to because the money supply has exploded. And so the thesis with bitcoin is that 21 million, that's the hard cap. To me, it's the most important property of bitcoin that a lot of people don't really understand, but is, is kind of the most important thing to understand. It's what sets it apart from gold. It's what sets it apart from other cryptos. It's definitely what sets it apart from Fiat.

[B]

Yeah. Do you worry about VCs getting involved, big companies taking a mark share of bitcoin, or do you?

[A]

I don't. No. I think it's a good. I mean this, this is my day job. So I run an organization called Bitcoin for Corporations. So we help institutions with their corporate bitcoin strategy. And so we partnered with strategy, the company that is run by Michael Saylor that owns about 800,000 bitcoin and almost. How much office supply is that?

[B]

A percentage?

[A]

Just over 3%.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

So they are the largest corporate holder of bitcoin. They almost own as much bitcoin as what's estimated to be in satoshi's wallets.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

I think it's a good thing. Criticisms of corporations buying too much bitcoin are like, they often sound like, oh, there's, they're not going to leave enough for the little guy or whatever. But the counter argument to that is the more adoption, the better. Right. Like, the best thing that can happen for Bitcoin is that the value goes up. It's pretty, sounds pretty like, simplistic to say, but if you really think about it, like that's what we need to happen in order, that's what makes people interested. Right. We don't have. Because it's a fully decentralized asset, we don't have a marketing team that can sort of. Right. Run a campaign and encourage you to, to buy Bitcoin or even educate you about bitcoin. That's why bitcoin education isn't great. It's because there's no, no one that's really directly incentivized to take the lead on spearheading education. So, yeah, I don't worry about it. The, the other thing is when you have a fixed asset, a fixed supply asset, you know, Sailor and team know that if they buy, you know, if they start accumulating more than, let's say, 10%, they're going to start eroding the value of their own asset.

[B]

How so?

[A]

Well, because if you, if it. Let's, let's say they owned all the bitcoin, well, then it's not, it's not going to be worth anything.

[B]

Right?

[A]

Right. So then you just kind of play that back. The game theory of that if they found 90% of it, well, it's still probably not going to be worth that much because they're controlling so much of it. Who's going to want to own the other. Right. The demand isn't there and it's, you know, you're, you're robbing it of, of some of its key principles of, of it being fully decentralized, no one controlling the, you know, the supply. If they're, if they have that 90% and they're like maybe slowly releasing it back, then it's just not, it's not that attractive to that 10%. So I think they know that better than anyone probably, that they don't. You know, they can, they can aggressively accumulate and they're going to probably continue to do that. But I mean, I would say once they get up to, if they get up to 5, 6%, they'll probably chill.

[B]

Okay. I've seen him on other interviews talk about the United States government, how he wants them to, he wants the government to own like 10 to 20%.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, and I can see that. I mean, it could come down to three or four big players. You know, whether it's nation states, corporations owning, you know, large swaths of it. I think that's probably inevitable once, you know, you start looking at, like, Apple or some of these companies that have just massive cash reserves. Once the tipping. There's going to be a tipping point when it's like, no, it's no longer a question of, should I put Bitcoin on my balance sheet? It's. We're almost at a point where if you're a cfo, if you're. If you're a corporate treasurer, you're going to be held sort of to fiduciary obligation and responsibility, when your board is going to be like, hey, why were you sleeping on this?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

What happened? Like, all these companies were making all this money and you didn't even tell us about it because, you know, for the longest time it's been. It's been career suicide, really, to. To bring it up in a corporate setting of. Yeah.

[B]

Because banks hated it for so long. They have to embrace it.

[A]

I think so. I think we're.

[B]

I think we're banned from Chase.

[A]

Did you really.

[B]

For just being involved in crypto and that's a common thing, I heard.

[A]

Wow. Yeah. I mean, it's happening more and more, people getting censored and so.

[B]

Well, that was years ago. I think now they're kind of embracing it now. There's banks doing crypto credit cards.

[A]

That's right. I heard so far turned on just the ability to just buy Bitco Coin directly on there. Yeah.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

That was crazy.

[B]

Yeah. I know a bank starts with an eye, but you can deposit crypto and they give you a debit card.

[A]

Really?

[B]

Yeah. I wonder which ones are changing.

[A]

Yeah, man, there's. There's a few of those. I mean, Fold has a. Has a credit card that's coming out. Gemini just released one.

[B]

I have Gemini's.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Coinbase.

[A]

Coinbase. Yeah. Coinbase. Is American Express. American Express a good partner?

[B]

Yeah, I might get that one.

[A]

Yeah. So times are changing, man. I think. I think that is what's different about. Even last year, but. But certainly over the last. The cycles is that it's never been sort of less risky. Right. Because there's so much institutional adoption and we've been sort of validated by the mainstream, like the traditional banking system, regulators, it's, you know, they can't. They've realized they can't shut it down. Yeah. And so now it's like, okay, how do we essentially cope? Like, how do we Navigate this in a way where it's less. Least disruptive to kind of the legacy system.

[B]

Yeah. Could use it to buy anything now too.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Just bought a $5 million house of crypto.

[A]

Oh, really?

[B]

Yeah, he took a loan out against his portfolio. Oh, wow. Isn't that crazy?

[A]

That is crazy.

[B]

Like 10 years ago, you couldn't do that.

[A]

Not even. I mean, and. And I saw Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac are starting to embrace it, so that if you have bitcoin on your. You know, if you have bitcoin, you can use it as a. As part of your reserves to qualify for a mortgage that's brand new.

[B]

Wow. I needed that when I was getting my. Because I'm pretty crypto heavy.

[A]

Yeah, man. Well, see, good for you. You're ahead of your time.

[B]

Well, dude, cash is just trash.

[A]

It really is.

[B]

In 100 years, which is about a lifetime and a half.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You lost 99% of your money.

[A]

Yeah. And I think, you know, we talk a lot about how things are getting more expensive and it's, you know, it's harder and harder to afford stuff, but we don't really talk about why. Like, why is that happening and is this normal? And a lot of people forget that, you know, for. Throughout human history, it's not. It wasn't normal for your money to inflate by 2%. 2% is the number they tell us. Right. CPI is the 2% target. It's actually in reality, in purchasing power. It's a lot more depending on what you're talking about. Yeah. It could be 20%, 30%, 50%. And so that's not a normal thing. Right. You. Where does money come from? What is money?

[B]

You.

[A]

You expend your energy, your labor in order to earn this. This thing that represents. Hey, I worked. Right. That we all sort of agree. Yep. Okay. That's the same thing that I did over here to work. And you exchange that for goods and services. That's really. That's really all it is. Historically, you've been able to put that money away and save it so that, you know, over time, it actually appreciates. That's. That's actually how people deal. Lived savings used to be a value. You know, even. Even 30 years ago, it was like, you save some money. People don't save money anymore because they intuit that it's losing so much value. And it hasn't always been that way. So that's why we can't afford houses. That's why we can't save. Save money for a down payment. I Mean, the idea of a down payment is even relatively new. It used to be you just worked for a year and you could afford a house all cash.

[B]

Yeah, our grandparents could do that.

[A]

Right.

[B]

So crazy how, how much it's shifted, honestly. No, now you're struggling to afford a down payment. People are taking out a loan just for a down payment.

[A]

That's right. And, and I think when we talk about bitcoin, we talk about crypto. It, it's, you know, the, I think we've lost the culture. We're losing the culture war in a lot of ways. Right. You know, know, bitcoiners like to try to make the. Go out of their way to make the distinction between bitcoin and every other crypto because there are a lot of differences and those distinctions should be made. But in the meantime, we've kind of lost the culture war. We're still considered crypto bros. Or whatever. It's all about like, you know, speculative this and that. NFTs and, and then what gets lost is what's actually going on kind of beneath the surface. Right. Not to say nothing of like the digital gold rush. Right. Where institutions have already become wise to this and they're, they're rapidly accumulating as much as they can. Yeah. But, but more so the things like that, what's happening in Iran is like, that's what bitcoin was designed for, is to be censorship resistant and to, to be this, this, this thing that could actually, if you look at even just Iran, it could actually be the thing that stops the war or at least slows it down. Right. Because they have, they have brand new leverage that they've never had before. And so again, regardless of what you think politically, if you're, if you're, if you're an anti war person, let's say you should be excited about this because this is like, okay, how else were they going to defend themselves against a nuclear superpower, Right. Other than to, you know, the choke point being being the money.

[B]

So get creative. Yeah, that's nuts. I didn't know they were doing that.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So they're making millions a day right now.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Each ship's paying 2 million, you said?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Holy crap. That is nuts. Yeah. That's a money printer.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Because before they weren't charging anything, right?

[A]

Well, yeah, I think they couldn't. That's why they shut it down. Right. Because, because, because they're a sanctioned country. So it's like, like I don't even know how they would have or I don't even Know how that works. I just know that they're accepting bitcoin and it's going to be interesting to see how it plays out.

[B]

Yeah, it's not. As I've gotten older, I'm taking less risks. I like bitcoin and Ethereum the most right now. I used to be heavy in altcoins and stuff like that when I was

[A]

younger, but yeah, taking less risks.

[B]

Yeah, I used to be a degenerate. NFTs, like meme coins, all that stuff. I think when you're younger you could play around as you get older and you got family.

[A]

Yeah. Well, it's funny that you, you say that, you know, you have, you have bitcoin and you consider that less risky. A lot of people would say, isn't that more risky? What made you come to the conclusion that, you know, you could, you could store some of your wealth in bitcoin over time?

[B]

Because people say it's more risky when they're trading shortterm.

[A]

Exactly.

[B]

But look at the yearly graphs. I mean, it's not even like I personally don't consider that risky if you're playing in five, ten year periods.

[A]

That's right.

[B]

You know what I mean?

[A]

Exactly. Yeah. That's a, that's never, you've never lost money over that. If you've held for at least four years there, there's no, there's no entry point where you would.

[B]

That's a crazy stuff. So people just realize that. But instead they freak out. Like, I got my mom in into crypto for a little bit and she'll be watching this, but she like looks at her portfolio every five, 10 minutes. I'm like, what are you doing? Yeah. So she ended up selling at a loss.

[A]

Oh no.

[B]

But if she just held, man.

[A]

Yeah. To set it and forget it, man. This is. Set the auto pay. Every time you get paid, just, you know, put a little bit aside.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And stop paying attention to the US dollar value. Like if you think about the actual gold rush, right. In San Francisco, they didn't have the, they didn't have the phones that they could pull out and be like, oh, what's the gold that I'm, you know, I'm digging out of the ground? What's it worth today? They just knew the shit's valuable.

[B]

Right.

[A]

I should get as much of it as possible. That's exactly what is happening now. You know, it, it, it doesn't really. They weren't thinking about like, how am I going to take this to the coffee shop and exchange this little nugget For a coffee. They're just thinking about, okay, this is obviously scarce. This, there's obviously a lot of people here that are rushing to get it and I need to get my hands on as much of it as possible. Like that's the name of the game right now.

[B]

Yeah. People just want quick results, but.

[A]

Right. Well, because their money is melting. Right. They're desperate. It's actually the whole meme coin, the whole like, you know, poly market, all the D gen stuff that we're seeing is, is I think, a symptom of fiat currency and people just like, desperate for a way to get out of like the, the grind.

[B]

Yeah, yeah. Polymark and culture blowing on.

[A]

Dude, it's nuts.

[B]

Insane.

[A]

You can bet on anything. The dumbest stuff there's.

[B]

Yeah, literally the dumbest stuff.

[A]

I don't even.

[B]

Yeah, there's one. I don't know if you saw this one. Will Jesus return before GTA 6 comes out.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And people are betting on that.

[A]

Oh, it's like a 2%.

[B]

That's a lock. I mean, that's an easy one. How would you not make money off that one? Yeah, but there's like, there's, it's not considered insider trading, which is a crazy thing right now. Well, they're not securities.

[A]

And not only that, but what I've seen is they're, they're trying to make the argument that insider trading should be encouraged with these markets because you're giving, by letting insiders essentially, you know, bet on these, these, these markets, you're giving the outsiders a peek behind the curtain, so to speak. So if the market moves really big, that's, that's just another data point of like, oh, maybe an insider bet on this. I should bet on this. Yeah. So it's just fascinating just how they're, the, the conversation is completely shifting. Yeah.

[B]

It's a gray area. I mean, if crypto is not a security, I don't think they're going to be able to get those betting markets labeled as securities as well. Yeah, you know.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. I mean, I think one thing that's nice about Bitcoin is it's already been labeled a commodity and both the SEC and the CFTC have already, you know, made that decision. So everything else is kind of just duking it out to see how they're going to be classified. Yeah. And yeah, I think betting markets will be.

[B]

Dude, there were some, like, bets where I, I, I could have made money, honestly.

[A]

Really, you know, by being an insider.

[B]

Yeah, yeah. Because I, I know a lot of people, you know, so do you. And there was a lot of political ones where I knew the answers to. Yeah, but morally, I just didn't feel right about it, really. Because you have access to information. It's not a fair exchange.

[A]

Yeah. So I was like, it's definitely, it's definitely a struggle because I've been in those situations too. Well, first of all, Polymarket, Polymarket specifically, you're not technically allowed to bet on them. And if you're in the U.S. oh,

[B]

yeah, but should have said that.

[A]

No, you were talking about Cal. Yeah, I mean, it's like there's Robinhood now there's Coinbase, just Polymarket, for whatever reason. I think it's because they only have crypto rails, they don't have US dollar rail. So I think that might be why. But, but I mean, when you have the insiders basically saying like, no, this is, this is. It's all about insider trading, it kind of reframes the conversation, I think even from a moral standpoint of like, okay, interesting, but, but I understand the struggle. And you know, but what's funny though too is just because you have inside information, it's not always 100 lock. I mean, yeah, if you have like real, real inside information, like some of, some of these bets that you see, like, will the US strike Iran today? And it's like someone puts like a, you know, million dollar bet, it's like, okay, you probably knew something, otherwise you wouldn't yolo at a million dollars. But sometimes you have like insider information. That's like maybe 95 true.

[B]

That's probably most of it, honestly.

[A]

Right. And then, you know, so, so I don't know.

[B]

I remember when Trump was picking his cabinet, there was like, will this guy get in? Will that guy get in? And I knew some of those, but I didn't act on it.

[A]

Now you can, you can bet on like the price of bitcoin.

[B]

I saw over 100k by the end of the year.

[A]

Yeah, stuff like that. Yeah. So there's like, it's like betting on top of betting. It's like derivatives on top of derivatives.

[B]

So that's why I asked you about the vcs, because do you think they'll get powerful enough to control the price of bitcoin eventually?

[A]

Not VCs. Institutions are going to have a lot of influence, I think over. They already do. But what's great is bitcoin is all about incentives. Right. And so as long as the incentives are there to do what's best for the asset that you have, then I don't mind them having influence because their influence is going to be in my best interest as a bitcoin holder.

[B]

True. They're trying to make money too.

[A]

Exactly. They're trying to not only make money, but now they have an even stronger incentive to preserve all the money that they've, that they've accumulated. Right. So Saylor, for instance, recently launched a, an organization that's going to tackle sort of the, the whole quantum fud.

[B]

Oh, yeah, I want to ask you about that.

[A]

Yeah. So it's like, that's. To me, that's great. That's good news. He's going to reinvest some of the money that he made off of bitcoin in order to protect bitcoin as a bitcoiner. I'm like, sweet, great. So we talk about like, oh, no, they're going to have so much power. Well, they're not going to have. I think we have some PTSD from, from fiat currency and like, what it means for actual control over a currency. Like, and specifically the money printer. Right. Again, what is money? It's money. When we work, we earn money. Why is it fair for someone to be able to print that? You know, no effort, print that. Same thing that me and you are working for. Right. That can't happen with bitcoin. And so I'm not worried about an institution's control. They're not. It's not control, it's influence. Right. And it's very, the two very different things. And so I want the people who are incentivized to, to, to have certain influence to protect bitcoin. To do that. Yeah, that's good for us. Right.

[B]

The quantum stuff. So I want to talk about that. The fud. So, like there are people saying quantum hacking, Right. They're going to be able to hack your keys in certain amount of years.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

What do you think about all that, like groups in North Korea you hear that are hacking in the wallets?

[A]

So, so bitcoin has not been hacked yet. I think the, the latest article that Google put out says we have, what, five years, three to five years or something, which is a much faster timeline than, you know, the quantum FUD that we've been hearing for, for years. That Google paper, by the way, is put out by someone who was one of the early Ethereum holders. So, you know, you got to kind of go back to the source and see just, you know, how accurate it is. Regardless, I think quantum is coming. I think bitcoin, just like every other technology, is potentially vulnerable. What it really comes down to though, when you're talking about a decentralized asset is like, what can you really attack? And the answer to that is you can attack wallets. Right. So that means that bitcoin needs to create upgrades so that people who are bitcoin holders upgrade their, their wallets to be quantum proof. So the real risk with all of quantum, the one that I would say is maybe the most concerning is that Satoshi's wallets get hacked. Because Satoshi's wallet's been dormant for 10 years.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So let's assume Satoshi is gone, no longer around. Those wallets don't get upgraded to be quantum resistant, then they're, they're vulnerable.

[B]

And 3% of the supply, that's yeah,

[A]

3, a little bit over 3%, I think. And so like I'm not worried about, you know, Michael Saylor's wallet. I'm not worried about the people who are active. We're all going to upgrade.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And we'll be fine. But because there's no central point to attack with quantum, Bitcoin's actually better, is already quantum resistant in that sense. Right. Yeah, we talk about quantum. There's a lot, it's like, it's like Y2K all over again. Right. There's everything, everything touches some computer, some Internet system. So like airplanes potentially could be falling out of the sky. Right. Like major infrastructure could be attacked. There's going to be a lot bigger problems that we're going to have than, you know, whether or not bitcoin's going to be hacked. But I do want to take the FUD somewhat seriously and be like, here's, here's something that is a reasonable person could conclude. If I was a quantum hacker, that's probably what I would do. I'd go after Satoshi's wallets and assume that they're not going to be upgraded and try to extract those coins. You know, that money then being dumped on the supply would be pretty, the price catastrophic for the price.

[B]

Probably buy it up, I'd imagine.

[A]

Yeah, I mean we've been getting better and better at absorbing, you know, large sell offs. There's been, there's been a lot of whales that have, that have sold this cycle and you know, it's, I've seen that. Right. So like, I think it'll be like a FTX type unwind Satoshi's coins get released back into the supply. But it's not detrimental, it's not going to like kill bitcoin. It's just going to be a setback, potentially if that happens.

[B]

Yeah, I've seen some big wells dump and then there'll be a lot of fud about it on Twitter.

[A]

Yeah. Every time. Every time.

[B]

Like, this guy didn't touch his wallet for 10 years. He just sold $4 billion of Bitcoin.

[A]

Yeah. And the market scooped it right up. So.

[B]

And. And they're like, this is the last cycle ever. Yeah, right.

[A]

Who. Yeah. The last cycle before the super cycle. Yeah, yeah, yeah. We've been saying. We've been saying that one, too. I think, again, it's like. It's like you're telling your mom. It's like, don't, you know, don't just. Just accumulate. Just accumulate and just don't think about it. Don't look at the price. And then we'll see. We'll see what happens. I don't think anyone expected us to hit 120 last year. Maybe some people did. I don't think people thought the adoption cycle would look like this. I think for me, I thought. I thought it was going to be nation states that were. That were going to really start following after you saw El Salvador adoption, after you saw Trump get elected. But really it's been institutions that have been taking the lead and buying up way more than is being mined.

[B]

Yeah. I'm surprised more governments haven't gotten involved after El Salvador turned their whole country around.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

From one of the worst.

[A]

Exactly.

[B]

Dangerous countries to offspring.

[A]

Now, bitcoin's been a big part of that story, but. But that's why Iran will be really interesting to see. I mean, they're going to. If they keep this up, in a matter of a couple of weeks, they'll have more bitcoin. They'll have more bitcoin than. Than El Salvador.

[B]

That's nuts, man.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

Yeah. Yeah, I know. Trump. Didn't he start a bitcoin company or something, too?

[A]

His sons. Yeah, his sons did. They started a mining company and a bitcoin treasury company and I think their top. Top five.

[B]

Speaking again at the conference.

[A]

Yeah, I saw that.

[B]

Awesome.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Have you dealt with any of that team?

[A]

Not directly, but. But yeah, we work with them pretty close on the team and it'll be good to have Eric back and. Yeah, I think, you know, being in an election cycle or, you know, midterm election year, I think that. I think that politicians are starting to realize that we had a lot to do with getting them elected. And, yeah, they haven't really fulfilled a lot of their promises. And so hopefully they'll show up and answer some of these Questions?

[B]

Yeah, I know they had a bitcoin ball or something.

[A]

We did, yeah.

[B]

Oh, you were part of that?

[A]

Yeah, yeah. The crypto ball is at the, the, the inauguration event for, for Trump.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

That was crazy.

[B]

And what were they, what were the promises that they said?

[A]

Well, the ball was more just a party. So there was, there wasn't like any, like Snoop Dogg performed. It was just like a ball, like it was an actual ball. But leading up to it, I. The bitcoin strategic reserve. So la. Last, last conference we had JD Vance. The conference before that, though, that was, that was the election year. That was when Trump showed up in Nashville.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

And that's when he. Yeah, he said that we're going to, we're going to be the, the, the leader in crypto. We don't want to give this up to China. We're going to pass regulatory laws for, for more clarity. We're going to free Ross, which he did do. So good on him.

[B]

Nice. But Ross is speaking this year too, right?

[A]

Yeah, I think so. He spoke last year, so. Be good to have him.

[B]

At least he did some of the stuff he'd said.

[A]

Yeah, yeah, we're, we're, we're.

[B]

Would be nice. Has he made any progress on that or.

[A]

No, they've made a little bit of progress, but I think the big hold up right now is the Clarity Act. So what's the Clarity act basically is just giving regulator regulators more direction on, you know, what you can actually do with this. So like, so banks will be able to have bitcoin rails integrated within their infrastructure. You know, there's, there's a lot in there about stable coins. It's mostly a stablecoin act, but it'll also provide. I think it'll unlock a lot of liquidity that right now doesn't have access to, to buy bitcoin. So I think it'll be good.

[B]

Speaking of stable coins, are you in favor of a digital dollar? Because I know people have mixed opinions on this.

[A]

Oh, man, I'm not. In fact, I mean, CBDC to me is pretty terrifying. It's, it's one of those things that's starting to feel like, you know, it may be, I don't want to say inevitable, but like, it seems like that if you're the government and you're like losing control because of this, this asset that is fully decentralized, you know, the, the going down the CBDC route seems to be like the, the answer. So I think there's motivation to, to create the cbdc. But yeah, I Mean, as a, as a, just a person, it's kind of terrifying.

[B]

Keep tracking your every purchase.

[A]

Every purchase. Like there's, you know, imagine just like a cashless society. Like that's kind of scary. Yeah, you can't go to a garage sale without, without being taxed on, you know, a purchase.

[B]

Crazy.

[A]

And then they'll be like, well, the benefit is you no longer have to file taxes because we, we know all of your transactions and we can just, we can just do everything automatically.

[B]

It's even worse. Then you can't do write offs.

[A]

Yeah, right. Well, the. So we'll see, we'll see how that all plays out. But, but yeah, I don't, I don't think that anyone should be excited about a cbdc. I think it's, it's, it represents like government, like massive government surveillance. Massive government control.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So this is why, this is why we bitcoin.

[B]

It does seem like it's heading that way. I mean, bricks is getting a lot of traction lately. People, big countries are leaving the US dollar.

[A]

Right? Yeah. Yeah. And, and again, I mean, if you're a sanctioned country, what are you going to? Where are you going to turn to? How else are you going to transact? So with the government, with, with the US becoming kind of more aggressive and unpredictable. Yeah, I think we're going to see more governments turn to bitcoin as an alternative to the US dollar.

[B]

We're living in Black Mirror.

[A]

We really are. Black Mirror, 1984. Like all the dystopians bundled into one.

[B]

They, they predict this stuff, man.

[A]

I know.

[B]

It's kind of one years ago, they predicted something where if you had someone pass away, you could make an AI version of them.

[A]

Oh yeah, I saw a Blackmaker episode.

[B]

Yeah, that's already happening now, dude.

[A]

Is it?

[B]

And soon, I think. Yeah, not like a physical vessel yet, but they're like recreating their, you know, consciousness. Yeah, consciousness, I guess virtually. You input videos and they recreate them.

[A]

I like that.

[B]

But soon they'll be able to take that into a physical body in a few years.

[A]

Terrifying.

[B]

Isn't that crazy?

[A]

So they'll be able to keep you alive? Essentially, yeah.

[B]

Technically. I guess they're going to transfer your consciousness because they're going to import, say you have 2,000 videos, podcast episodes. They'll be able to clone you. You know what I mean?

[A]

Dude, it's over for you. Yeah, there's a lot of content.

[B]

Clone. I asked. I get a lot of comments saying some of my guests have been cloned.

[A]

Really? Yeah.

[B]

Conspiracy theories.

[A]

Like, actually cloned.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

It's possible with dogs.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I mean, I know someone that did it.

[A]

Dude. The.

[B]

Just.

[A]

Even the way they're releasing these AI models and how quickly things are progressing makes you wonder, like, how much technology they're actually holding back, you know, 100%. And. And so who. Who knows about, like, cloning and all, all this stuff that could be really advanced, that they're just. It's just not public.

[B]

Dude, I have eight AI agents working for me right now.

[A]

Oh, yeah. Openclaw.

[B]

So on Manus. But Claude, I heard is good. Claw, I heard is good. Every AI is going to have AI agents soon.

[A]

What. So what do they do for you?

[B]

I have one that monitors my email because I get, like, thousands of emails, so it, like, filters out the spam and marks important one that just reviews my books. P and L. I have one that does podcast research on guests.

[A]

Nice.

[B]

I have one looking for sponsors.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

Yeah, it's badass. It's cool. But at the same time, scary.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Like, a lot of people are going to be out of jobs.

[A]

Yeah, that's. That's. I think the. The biggest talking point is, like, people, like, AI is coming for jobs. What I've noticed so far is that it's just making jobs kind of more intense. Right. Usually, like, when. When Chad GPT first came out, it was like, people would use it and then they'd be kind of, like, ashamed to be like, oh, yeah, I used, you know, Chad GPT for this, and now it's like, everything is AI.

[B]

Yeah. Now you didn't use it.

[A]

Yeah. What are you doing? Why are you wasting so much time?

[B]

Yeah. Why are you using your brain without AI? So I agree, though. I think it's both ways.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I think blue claw, blue collar is going to be fine.

[A]

Well, what about, like, humanoids, though? Aren't humanoid robots eventually gonna be able to do blue collar work?

[B]

Eventually, yeah, but not for a while. I think Elon's launching his. Yeah, but that's going to be doing the dishes and maybe some cleaning.

[A]

I want one of those.

[B]

Probably. Yeah. It'll probably be a little better than the Roomba robots.

[A]

Hopefully.

[B]

A little bit better. Yeah.

[A]

A little bit more advanced. They'll actually have a vacuum. Yeah. They'll be using.

[B]

I mean, replacing a roof. I can't see that for a while. Yeah. You know.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I think they'll be good for some

[A]

of the videos, though. These humanoids are crazy.

[B]

Yeah. The ones in China especially, I feel like they're way ahead of us because they're labor laws. They can work double the amount of hours.

[A]

Yeah, or like the dogs. Have you seen the dog robots?

[B]

Oh, the meal deliveries or.

[A]

No, like the, the military one. Like the cop robots.

[B]

I think I saw one of those.

[A]

They're creepy, man.

[B]

Yeah, the. The AI weapons too.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. They're saying that the Venezuela invasion leveraged some of that new technology.

[B]

They can fly, like, into like an air vent and kill you.

[A]

Oh, like little drones or something.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Yikes.

[B]

Sold by AI Crazy, right? Yeah.

[A]

Yeah. The nature of warfare and how much that's changed just doesn't get. Because I don't think there's a lot of. It's classified. We don't, you know, really talk about it, but it's just crazy to think how, you know, you used to talk about, like, China's probably never going to invade the U.S. right? They're never going to put boots on the ground because you think about classic warfare in that way. But what about, you know, cyber attacks? And what about drones coming in through vents and stuff? Like the, like, technology side of it. They could, they could attack. I'm not trying to, like, paint this, like, dark picture, but, I mean, it could turn into, you know, warfare without any casualties. Without any casualties. So you could just take out people with robots.

[B]

There's people that say, we're already at war with China.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

They're saying basically the whole tick tock thing destroyed our memory or attention span. They use that as a weapon to infiltrate our minds. They also have the, I think, second or third most largest farmland in America.

[A]

Oh, they own the most. Yeah.

[B]

So they control certain water systems and food systems.

[A]

They just been playing the slow game with us.

[B]

They're even saying Iran can shut down our electrical grid. I've seen that.

[A]

Why haven't they would be that one?

[B]

Probably like a last resort, I'd imagine.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Maybe if we send a nuke, they'll do it. Maybe Fico's nuclear. Oh, my God. You got a bunker?

[A]

Not yet. I mean, I need bitcoin to go.

[B]

Taylor has one. Yeah, a lot of billionaires have those.

[A]

I know, that's. That one's been a terrifying trend. It's like, why are they all buying bunkers?

[B]

I mean, I don't. I don't blame them.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

To be honest, if you got millions lying around, might as well get as safe as possible.

[A]

I asked him, I wonder what the poly market odds are of needing a bunker.

[B]

Definitely a poly market on that. Which billionaire buys a bunker next, right? How do you even make questions on There. Can anyone do it?

[A]

You know, I was looking into that, like, recently, and I think. I think that's the most, like, regulated or protected part.

[B]

Oh.

[A]

Because if you, you know, theoretically spit up a market that you're an insider on, bet on it. So I think they play that one pretty close to best. But somebody's doing it. Someone that works there or.

[B]

I mean, I know there's one where it's like, you could streak the Super Bowl. Like, will someone.

[A]

Okay, right, right.

[B]

I know the guy that's done it the first two years. Like, he's been on the show.

[A]

Did it work?

[B]

Yeah, he got paid a ton of money.

[A]

So they don't, like, claw back or anything. If you're the one that.

[B]

No, he kept it. Made $500,000.

[A]

That's brilliant.

[B]

He just bought a front row seat and found the right opportunity to streak.

[A]

And then just years in a row,

[B]

fake disguise the second year because he

[A]

got banned when he just goes to, like, jail overnight or something.

[B]

Yeah. I think you get a fine. Streaking is not the worst thing, I guess. All right.

[A]

It's a good business model.

[B]

If you're a guy, I feel like it's not as bad.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Because you're just.

[A]

You got to go full. Yeah. Yeah.

[B]

If you're a girl, it might be an additional charge.

[A]

Oh, yeah. Indecent exposure after that, Right? Oh, yeah.

[B]

There's kids there.

[A]

All right. Okay. Handy, that.

[B]

Speaking of kids, man, I know you're big on parenting.

[A]

I am, yeah.

[B]

You said you wrote a book on it, right?

[A]

I did, yeah. The book's called I'm not your bruh 21 keys to sound Parenting. And really it's a response to what I think is permission. You know, permission first parenting where. Where we're basically just, like, watered down. You're trying to be the. But your buddy with. With your kids instead of actually being an authority figure. I have two. Two teenage kids. Kingston's 18, brought him here with me and. And Saxon 16. And so the book is really geared towards parents with younger children because, you know, I don't pretend to know how to raise teenagers yet. I'm still.

[B]

Toughest phase.

[A]

It really is. Teenagers are challenging, for sure. Yeah. But. But yeah, I think. I think parenting, taking parenting seriously, being a present parent, are all things that I think in today's day and age have gotten really, like, watered down.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

The name of the book comes from this T shirt. I saw that. It said it says bruh, formerly known as mom. And I saw that, and I was, like, giggled for a Second, I was like, no, wait a minute, you're not, bruh. Like, don't let your kids like, be like, hey, bro, mom, bro, can you make me a sandwich? Or whatever. Like, you, like, you actually have to be the parent. You actually have to be distinct from their friend group. Yeah. Right. And, and you know, parents who are trying to be buddies with like their friend, their kids friends, and like be the cool kid, their cool mom or whatever to me has led to, you know, pretty interesting generation that we're seeing. I think Gen Z has a lot of challenges ahead.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And what they don't need is you abdicating, abdicating all your responsibility to actually parent them and teach them and, and have them develop character. Right.

[B]

So I agree. Gen Z, they, they say they're soft. I, I see them as definitely weaker.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Than millennials and whatever was before that one.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Yeah, I'm a millennial.

[A]

Yeah, same.

[B]

I'm the last year. You're the first year. Right. I think we talked about this.

[A]

Oh, maybe. Yeah, yeah. I'm old, 86, so I'm. But, but Gen Z, man, they also have a lot of challenges, right? They're like, look at the world they're inheriting. Like, they're, they're, it's. How hard is it going to be for them to get a job and like, how hard is it for them to, to find someone and to have a relationship with someone where like, you know, like I met my wife at work. Now everyone works on Zoom, Right. So you're like, it's gonna be a lot harder to meet people out in the real world digitally. Exactly. Yeah. So, you know, I feel for them, I feel for this generation. I worry about, you know, the world that my kids are inheriting. And so I don't think the response to that is to again, just like pull back and as soon as they turn 18, kick them out of the house and good luck. Right. It's, it's like they have to be more active. You know, a big part of this is school. Right. You know, I think, you know, we homeschooled our kids and we did it, but we were homeschooling them before COVID So before it was like popular, cool, and everyone was doing it and it really allowed us to be present in our kids lives and, you know, redeem those, those hours back from them. From, from what? The school system. You delegate, you know, you delegate so much responsibility by shipping your kids off to school. I know everyone can't homeschool their kids and I know that you Know, we're very fortunate that we were able to. But you know, the education system and what they're being taught, not just what they're being taught, but the way they're being taught to me, like, is. Is a travesty. Like, I want to teach my kids what I hope I've instilled in them is, is not just like, hey, learn these facts or memorize these things so you can pass this test and it doesn't matter. It's like, how do you learn? How do you approach the, the process of learning? That's what education actually is. Right. Critical thinking, like being curious and like arriving at your own conclusions rather than just having someone tell you this is the way that this happened and therefore you have to believe it. Right. Like, question everything.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And so that's one of the things I'm most proud of with my kids is that they do that they actually, like, look at the world with curiosity rather than like, oh, I know this happened because I learned it in history class or whatever.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

It's like, no, you learned one version of history that, by the way, is like riddled with propaganda. And so I think for parents, like taking some agency back and actually want, like, if someone's going to indoctrinate my kids, it's going to be me. Right. Like, I'm not going to delegate that to somebody else and pay for it.

[B]

Also taxes. That's the crazy part. Pain for them to be indoctrinated. When you think about it that way, you're like, the hell is going on?

[A]

Right. Yeah. You know, so I think something's got to give. I don't think it's sustainable and I think homeschooling is a big part of it. But I think, I think just present parenting and taking that responsibility seriously. If you're going to bring humans into this world, at least, at least take the, the time and energy to invest in their upbringing. It's really that simple.

[B]

Yeah. I think I'm going to do a hybrid model when I have kids because I'm going to definitely homeschool, but I want them to socialize too, you know?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So I want to find like minded parents, form a little community.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Where we could do meetups once a week or whatever.

[A]

Yeah, that's a cool, that's a cool model. We, I mean, we had something similar in that we had like different classes that they would go to or, you know, we would use some of the time for. Instead of pe, it's like go to soccer or go to skating or whatever. So there's definitely ways to do it. I know. Like, the. The socialization FUD around homeschooling is prevalent. Like, are you worried your kid's going to be a weirdo? I'm like, no, not really. Because they're hanging out with me still. I don't think I'm a weirdo. Like, if you've met my kids, like, you know that the FUD is ridiculous because they're, you know, they're gonna look you in the eye, they're gonna shake your hand. Like, because I taught them to do that. You know, when they. When we sat down in a restaurant, it's like, you're not on your phones. There's no screens at the table. They're, like, the least weird kids ever. They're gonna look at the. The server in the eye, and they're gonna order their food. I'm not gonna order it for them until they turn 18. Right. Like, I'm teaching them actually how to be a human. I'm preparing them for real life. And so. Yeah. Thank you.

[B]

Yeah. It's a rarity these days.

[A]

I think so, too. That's. That's kind of why I became passionate about and why I wanted to write the book. Because my wife and I, you know, we have a lot of, like, mantras around the house and, like. Like, rules. Like, I don't think we're strict parents necessarily. You might have to ask my kids to see what they think.

[B]

I'll ask them out.

[A]

But. But, you know, we. We do have boundaries. We do. We do have. But. But I think actually having boundaries and having clarity around, like, here's what's acceptable, here's what isn't acceptable is something that's been lost on this generation of parenting. It's just been like, we're just winging it. We're just making things up every day, and that just creates chaos.

[B]

And so 100%, I feel like. So for me, I had one strict parent and one, like, whatever the opposite of that is, just let you do whatever you want. And I feel like both are bad.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You know what I mean?

[A]

For sure.

[B]

You need some boundaries. You don't want to be too strict. Right. Because then that caused rebellion, which is what I was.

[A]

Exactly. You just have to be, you know, reasonable. And. And. And the other thing that people miss is, like, you have to talk to your kids, especially when they get to an age where they can reason and you're trying to encourage them to think critically, then it's on you to actually engage in that. Right. So it's like instead of saying yes or no to a request, it's like, let's have a conversation about it. You know what, you know, tell me why you want to do this. And I found that a lot of times you'll land at the thing that you both, you know, want. The thing that you ultimately wanted to sort of enforce. That would have sounded strict. With enough reasoning, you can have them arrive there on their own.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And that's their idea. And then you're not the. The bad guy who's strict. Right. For sure. So people just, like, don't talk to their kids. They. They. It's like two extremes. Super permit, like you said, super permissive, or I'm the boss, do it my way, do as I say, and I want to do. Or like all the stupid mantras that don't actually work.

[B]

I see that with fathers. They play the bad cop a lot, though. And the mom's a good cop.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But I don't think that works either, because one. The kid will hate one of you.

[A]

Exactly.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And then you'll. Then you'll have conflict in the household, and then the. The parents don't get along. And then the worst thing that can happen is if the parents separate, especially when the kids are at a young age.

[B]

Yeah, that's what happened to me.

[A]

Yeah. So.

[B]

Destroyed me.

[A]

Exactly.

[B]

I didn't know it at the time,

[A]

but, man, I'm sorry.

[B]

Yeah. Childhood trauma from divorce is pretty.

[A]

It's. I think it's probably one of the hardest things that a child could. Could deal with. And so, yeah, if you're constantly. That battle over how you're parenting. So that's. I think it's probably the number one thing that if you're going to get married to somebody, you got to be on the same page about, like, all right, what's the plan? Yeah. Like, how many kids you want, when you want them, how do you want to raise them? What things. What kind of things are going to be okay? You know, having those conversations ahead of time so that you're not for sure you're finding them out on the fly and then creating enough conflict where you don't make it. I think it's important.

[B]

So do you ever argue with the wife in front of the kids or do you keep that private?

[A]

We. We don't argue. Like, we've actually done, I think, a pretty good job of not. You know, it's not like we are fake. Right. Like, if there's conflict, like, our kids will know it, but we don't like hash it out in front of the kids. Yeah, Unless it's relevant to them. Like, we're a very open family. We'll sit down and we'll talk about anything. One of the household rules that we have is don't use words that you don't know the meaning of. Which is a great way to, you know, not to not have to say, like, don't swear. Right. Because then you have to define which words are swear words and which aren't. So we just said, listen, if you don't know the meaning of a word, I don't want to hear you use it. And then if I hear you use the word, I'm going to ask you like, hey, what does that word mean? And then you get the pleasure and sometimes the uncomfortable joy of having your child. You know, explain to you a word that they just said, like the meaning of it. And then very quickly they just again self corrects like, okay, I'm not going to use that word anymore. Because a lot of times what you'll find is they don't even know what the meaning of the word is. And then you tell them, they're like, oh, that's what that means. Sorry about that. And so, but it does lead to some, some really interesting conversations because then it just opens up. Like we had a whole conversation one time at dinner with, with our kids when they were, when they were pretty young, I think, like probably 6 and 8. Just about like all the different euphemisms for penis. And I don't remember how it came up. I think, I think one of my kids said like one of the euphemisms and it was that exchange, but it just led to like the most hilarious, like, fun conversation. Also, like dispelled. Here's all the words that you don't say, right. If you hear this word, this is what it means. And, and so just being open with your kids and again, like getting to know them, right? And having these conversations and not being afraid and not being awkward. Like, you know, don't sit them down and be like, let's talk about the birds and the bees. Like, what is that? Yeah, well, just like, if you, if it comes up naturally to have a conversation about sex, then you should, you should do that if you want to talk about, like, don't tease your daughter about boys. That's the dumbest thing you can do. What you're, what you're communicating to your daughter is that you're not a safe person to have a conversation about relationships with. So when she actually is in A serious conversation. You're the last place she's going to turn to. Right. Just be a real person. Right. Just if it comes up naturally, have a conversation, ask questions. But, but you know, I think a lot of times we just like do the most and, and turn, turn our kids away accidentally. I think a lot of, A lot of it's well intentioned but. But really it just comes down to like genuine curiosity and who this. This human is becoming a gen and a genuine interest in. In their life and their character.

[B]

A lot of parents also live vicariously through their kids.

[A]

Totally.

[B]

Which adds additional pressure. Right, right. Whether it's sports or academics or whatever they didn't fulfill in their life.

[A]

Oh man.

[B]

Put the burden on the kids.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You know, I don't want to do that.

[A]

No, no, that's. And that goes back to just the whole bra thing. It was just like, you're like, you want to live the glory days and so you're trying to be the, you know, hey, fellow kids meme and you know, using. I got to try to stay away from dropping Gen Z language. I'm like, I'm too old for that. Like, it's not for me. You know, an occasionally well placed reference can work as a dad joke. But as long as you have the self awareness that you're not actually like, you know, Gen Z has their own crazy Gen Z language. The whole like podcast episode.

[B]

I feel like it's nuts. Every week there's a new term.

[A]

I.

[B]

Because the streamers just create a term. Looks maxing and then it's everywhere.

[A]

You know, crazy. It's hard to keep up with.

[B]

So I, I can't keep up with it. You know what I mean? And I'm on social media. Get them out. But that's a whole nother thing I'm going to navigate with my kids. Social media usage.

[A]

Oh yeah. Phone usage.

[B]

Some concerning studies on it.

[A]

Oh yeah, that's. That was probably the hardest chapter of the book to write is just like what to do with technology. Because it's the thing that most. You know, that's the number one question that my parents ask is like how do I. How do I limit this? And my, I mean TLDR is, is when Kingston was born, it was the same year the iPhone came out. So we didn't even know what this thing was or what like. Or how it was, how things were going to play out. So in a lot of ways we had to kind of make it up on the fly. Yeah. And there's maybe some things looking back that we would have done differently. But so, so we're in a different context now in terms of like what I, if I had kids today, would I have done it differently? But our kids got, got phones really, really young, honestly. And I would say relative to what I've seen with other kids, they're on their phones. Not that much really. Yeah, they're not as addicted as, you know, me even.

[B]

I think that's just self control then.

[A]

Well, it is, it's that and it's also just like, you know, recognizing that your phone is a tool. It's not, you know, it's not more important than the person that's sitting across from you at the table. If you're in a social environment, like, you know, you really shouldn't be on your phone. Yeah, right. It's just like, it's not a good look and, and it's. You're missing.

[B]

Disrespectful.

[A]

It's disrespectful. And you're, you're missing out on life. Like, you know, it's. To me, when you go to a concert and like, everyone's got their phone up.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And you're just like, we were like missing the moment. Like, what did you come here for? You can watch this on YouTube.

[B]

Same with vacations. People want to flex their vacation, right?

[A]

Like take a couple photos. It's fine. Capture the moment, but like, just like be present. Yeah.

[B]

No, people literally livestream their vacations now.

[A]

It's crazy.

[B]

Like them on the beach sipping a Martin. It's crazy to me.

[A]

Well, because they want to flex, right?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Look at me. That's, that's the whole Instagram.

[B]

You got to get out of that mindset. It's dangerous. Super dangerous. It almost got me robbed and who knows what else.

[A]

Really?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Oh, cuz you're like, just like. I was flexing.

[B]

I was flexing some cash on my story. The next day I showed up to my apartment.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So I stopped doing that when I was like 21.

[A]

Yeah. You Rob, you get yourself robbed and you rob yourself of, of the joy of the. The cash is sitting on your table. Like just over cash.

[B]

I mean, nothing's worth your life over selecting some cash.

[A]

Yeah, no doubt.

[B]

But yeah, it's going to be interesting because I make a living off social media, obviously, but I see the good and the bad with it.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I think if you have good discipline and self control, you can use it as a tool like you said. And then I would say 90% of people don't use it. That Way.

[A]

Right.

[B]

And they're actually probably losing value.

[A]

Right.

[B]

When they're just doom. Scrolling.

[A]

Are you doing scrolling, man? That's. That's what I got to get in check sometimes.

[B]

Why Doom Scroll. But I'm also looking for guests. I'm looking for what's going viral. I'm studying the algorithms.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So for me, I think it's more positive.

[A]

Yeah. Well, I mean, it's your full time job, so.

[B]

Because it evolves fast.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You have on a certain guest at the wrong time, it won't go viral. It's very tricky. So you got to constantly be in the know of what's on.

[A]

And every platform is different.

[B]

Every platform is different.

[A]

You're mostly on IG. Yeah.

[B]

IG and YouTube.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Yeah. You know, on Tik Tok, man.

[A]

Oh, you got banned.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Wow.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Are you on Twitter X at all?

[B]

Yeah, but we're not that big there.

[A]

Like 100k is just because you. The algorithm's different or videos don't crush

[B]

on X. X is more text.

[A]

Okay. I mean, that makes sense.

[B]

Videos are like IG, Facebook, and YouTube.

[A]

It's funny how the different platforms, I think, have kind of generational, like, splits.

[B]

Yeah. X is more. I would say the average IQ is higher on X. Okay. I would consider it the most intelligent social media platform.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Like you could get into some nerdy threads on X. Oh, for sure. It's also very negative, though.

[A]

It is.

[B]

There's people that are just all day

[A]

on X. Oh, man.

[B]

Like, smack.

[A]

And ever since Elon bought it, like, there's no. There's way fewer rules. And. Yeah.

[B]

I see people dying on the. On X. Yeah.

[A]

I don't want that video. Oh, dude, when the Charlie Kirk video came out.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I couldn't. Like, it was all over my feet. I'm like, I don't. I don't want to see the video.

[B]

Like, bro, it desensitizes you.

[A]

Yeah. It really does. Yeah.

[B]

When you're seeing people dying, like.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

These kids. Oh, dude, the Charlie video was everywhere.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Rest in peace.

[A]

That's. That's a black. That's a black mirror episode.

[B]

Which one?

[A]

Would you remember the one with the. The military that had the goggles. The goggles, like, made people. They made people look crazy. And so they would just kill him.

[B]

Really.

[A]

But they couldn't take the goggles. You weren't allowed to take the goggles off. But one guy figured out how to do it or something. He took the gauze off and there's like, people, like, cowering in the corner. That's actually what was happening. So the government's telling them, hey, we got to go, like, exterminate these people because they are like. Like trying to kill you or whatever. But that actually wasn't reality.

[B]

So that's such a, like, symbolism of current reality.

[A]

I agree.

[B]

Is people have such different perceptions.

[A]

Totally.

[B]

On everything.

[A]

Right. And who knows what's real anymore, Right? It could be. I like all this. Yeah. Yeah. Is he alive? Is he dead? I don't know. Couldn't tell you.

[B]

One thing's for sure is those videos were AI Really? That's been proven.

[A]

So why would they do that?

[B]

Either to not disclose his current location or he's dead. Who knows?

[A]

Wow.

[B]

I think we'll know in the next few months. Because you can't keep hiding forever.

[A]

No.

[B]

Oh, crazy, man.

[A]

Maybe they clone him. Huh? Maybe they cloned him.

[B]

Maybe. Maybe they cloned his ass. Well, dude, I'm excited for the conference. We'll link below in the video. The link. Afroman speaking. Right.

[A]

Afroman.

[B]

That's a big one.

[A]

Yeah, big one. For freedom of speech. I don't know if you followed the story.

[B]

I didn't.

[A]

No, no. Oh, dude, you gotta. You gotta check it out. It's actually fascinating. You should have.

[B]

Yeah. I want to get him on when I'm there.

[A]

He would be a great guest. So. No, he. He got raided by the county sheriff. There was some warrant out that said he was. He had like, drugs and he had like kidnapping victims or something.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

So they broke down his door, into his house, found nothing. Right. And then in response. So they destroyed his property. Thousands of dollars in damage or whatever. In response, he released a couple songs and he used footage from like, his CCTV cameras of the. Of the raid and, like, made fun of the actual cops.

[B]

That's savage.

[A]

They sued him and they sued him and he won.

[B]

Oh, he won.

[A]

He won. The. Yeah, he, like. He won. Like, it was a really fast case. Actually went to trial. The trial is hilarious.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

Because they had to play these videos of like, the. The cops, like, raiding the house and stuff. But he won. So it was a victory for. For free speech. It's like, no, you're going to raid my. Like, I can. I can make a video about you and make fun of you. Like, you're the one who raided my house and destroyed my property and terrified my children. So, you know, obviously free speech is a big aspect of. And so my business relies on it. Yeah.

[B]

You know, the more censorship that happens, the more it affects everyone.

[A]

Yeah, exactly. Yeah. So I think It's a big win. I love Afro Man.

[B]

Shout out to him, man. Yeah. When you announced that, I was like, what?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You guys always have some great speakers, though. Last year was a really great event.

[A]

Yeah, I think I got a lot

[B]

of good episodes in, like, Ian Carroll was there.

[A]

Nice.

[B]

There were some big dogs out there.

[A]

Yeah. Yeah, it should be. It should be good. Our programming team does a killer job. You know, the entire conference team does. Does an incredible job.

[B]

The best venue in Vegas really should. Next. But Hall.

[A]

All right.

[B]

That's my favorite one.

[A]

Yeah. I mean, it was a beautiful, beautiful venue. Excited to be back, but. Yeah, definitely. Come out. Come out and. And check out the conference. I think, you know, three days of just bitcoin chaos and. And, you know, it is a little bit of a spectacle in a good way. Like, I think there's a lot of events that you can go to and that are. They're gonna be, like, smaller and. And, you know, have, like, curated environments. We have that. Plus we have, like, the big show, and it's just. It's. It's. It's a good time. It's. It's actually, I think one of the best ways to not not only, like, learn about bitcoin itself, but to understand the community and to kind of be exposed to. What does it look like when 20,000 Bitcoiners, you know, descend on one place and, you know, you can come downstairs in the lobby and see them everywhere and get into a conversation and. And just kind of, you know, learn about who these actual people are. I mean, speaking about parenting, I've been bringing my son to bitcoin conferences since he was 13 and Bitcoin meetups. And one of the reasons is because I love bitcoiners. I want my kids to be around people who are, you know, have these good. These values, these shared values that I have. And so in real life, bitcoin environments are kind of one of my favorite things to be a part of. So. Yeah, I'm pumped, man.

[B]

Yeah, I love bitcoiners because they're. You would never know. They're balling.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But they're just so, like, humble and into the. The crypto stuff that, yeah, they're walking around in, like, sweatpants and they're using. They're worth a hundred million dollars.

[A]

Right.

[B]

It's crazy.

[A]

It really is.

[B]

They're just super down to earth, humble people that just want to better society, I feel like.

[A]

Exactly. Yeah. So a lot of people are here for. For the same reasons. And so it's good to when we all get together and can have conversations and have drinks together and share meals and all that. So it's gonna be a good time. Cool.

[B]

We'll link it below, guys. Check them out.

[A]

Good to see you guys. Good to see you, too. Thanks for having me.

[B]

Absolutely. Check them out, guys.

[A]

Peace.

[B]

If you learned anything from this episode or got any value at all, please share this episode with a friend. It helps us grow the channel, it helps us grow the podcast, and it means a lot to us. Thank you so much.