Aaron Interviewed on the Conquer Cast! – DT434

Summary

Dirt Talk by BuildWitt – Episode DT434

Episode: Aaron Interviewed on the Conquer Cast!
Date: April 16, 2026
Feature Guest: Aaron Witt, Founder of BuildWitt
Host (Conquer Cast): Trevor (Mountain Ops)

---

Episode Overview

In this special edition of Dirt Talk, the tables are turned: Aaron Witt, usually the interviewer, is himself interviewed by Trevor of Mountain Ops for the Conquer Cast podcast. The conversation is an in-depth exploration of Aaron's journey, BuildWitt’s mission to inspire and empower the next generation in the "dirt world" (construction, mining, and infrastructure), challenges facing these industries, business philosophy, leadership, culture, personal branding, and Aaron’s personal growth—touching on faith, wellbeing, and the power of daily consistency.

---

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Defining the "Dirt World" and Its Importance

• Dirt World Explained:
  • Encompasses all critical infrastructure: building, paving, mining, utilities—essentially “the foundation of society.”
  • “Food, water, shelter... none of those happen without infrastructure.” (Aaron, 02:08)
• Societal Contribution vs. Public Perception:
  • While central to daily life, these industries struggle to attract new talent.
  • "As critical as these industries are, they're struggling to attract the next generation... the whole economy has shifted to knowledge work." (Aaron, 04:05)

2. Workforce Crisis in Construction & Infrastructure

• Statistics:
  • The US needs half a million new construction workers immediately; mostly entry-level roles. (Aaron, 13:02)
• Changing Demographics:
  • Aging workforce, fewer people exposed to traditional skilled trades.
  • "The next generation…got caught up in higher education, corporate America, knowledge work."
• Migration & Demand:
  • Post-COVID migration has created unusual demand spikes in certain states, supercharging housing and infrastructure needs. (Aaron, 13:10)
• Infrastructure Pressures:
  • Aging systems with limited design lifespan, compounded by new demands (e.g., data centers).
  • "Some states can't build more data centers—not because of money, but lack of water and power." (Aaron, 15:51)

3. Aaron's Journey: From Bulldozer Enthusiast to Industry Leader

• Early Fascination:
  • Childhood obsession with heavy equipment—despite growing up in a very white-collar family.
  • "I don't think that's uncommon—there's a lot of young boys that dig out in the dirt." (Aaron, 06:19)
• First Job & Education:
  • Cold-called a local construction company, landed a job as a laborer at 18 (09:08)
  • Engineering school: “straight Cs, failed a few classes…as long as you graduate.” (Aaron, 12:52)
• Broad Experience:
  • Worked at 5 companies in 4 states: pipelines, railroads, bridges, blasting, etc.

4. Advice for Young People Entering Construction

• Tips for Success:
  • "Show up on time, keep your mouth shut, do what you're told, be curious, ask questions, be consistent." (Aaron, 16:43, 17:43)
  • "If you become a better leader and communicator…now you become among the most valuable people in the industry." (Aaron, 18:20)
• Opportunity Message:
  • “There's never been more opportunity in this world... It’s a perfect time to get into it.” (Aaron, 16:43)

5. From Personal Brand to BuildWitt

• Motivation:
  • Miserable railroad job led to podcast listening and lessons about personal branding.
  • “Wait a minute, if I build a personal brand, I'll have more career options.” (Aaron, 19:58)
• How the Brand Grew:
  • Started sharing his own photos of job sites and machinery.
  • Purchased a heavy equipment Instagram page to broaden reach (24:40)
  • International exposure—went to China, then started BuildWitt in 2018.
• Business Evolution:
  • Started with photography and social media management for companies.
  • Evolved into brand strategy, websites, video, and finally software.

6. Marketing Challenges & Industry Trends

• Resistance to Modernization:
  • Industry lagging in branding, digital presence.
  • "Multi-billion dollar company with a website from 2008" (Aaron, 21:27)
• Generational Change:
  • Modernizing brands for multi-generational businesses.
  • “Some of these companies were 100 years old that we rebranded.” (Aaron, 27:48)

7. Building & Scaling BuildWitt

• Pivot to Training & Development:
  • Sold the marketing company to focus on scalable solutions: skills-based video microlearning.
• Software for the Dirt World:
  • “The goal is not to just make workers, it's to make well rounded individuals.” (Aaron, 37:39)
  • "Construction is more dangerous than the military per capita." (Aaron, 38:42)
• Addressing Health & Culture:
  • Videos on equipment but also mental health, leadership, financial literacy.
  • “Suicide rate in construction is four to five times on-the-job fatalities…accidental overdose 11 times.” (Aaron, 38:42)

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Infrastructure:

  • "AI doesn't happen without infrastructure. That's what people don't understand... It still all depends upon atoms." (Aaron, 03:44)

• On Entry into Construction:

  • "If you just show up and do what you're told, you're ahead of 90% of people." (Aaron, 17:43)

• On Leadership & Employee Wellbeing:

  • "If it's not my job to teach them as an employer, then I can't be upset that they don't understand [finances].” (Aaron, 44:04)
  • “If you want to be world class at something, you have to go all in on something.” (Aaron, 51:31)

• On Consistency:

  • "I've posted on social media every day since I started in 2017." (Aaron, 46:57)
  • "That's all I have is consistency…The secret is just doing the work every day, every week, every month, every year for decades." (Aaron, 81:17, 81:45)

• On Mental Health:

  • “It was like someone was sitting on my chest 24 hours a day and I could not get rid of it. I would have paid you everything I had in my bank account to get rid of this feeling.” (Aaron, 75:37)

• On Faith:

  • "Just understand you don't need anyone else involved. It's just you and God." (Aaron, 71:12)

---

Key Segments & Timestamps

• Aaron Introduces the Episode & BuildWitt Mission: [00:00–02:08]
• Defining the "Dirt World" & Workforce Challenges: [02:08–05:30]
• Aaron’s Origin Story (Enthusiasm, First Job, Early Influences): [05:51–12:52]
• Construction Industry Trends, Demographic Changes, & Opportunities: [13:02–18:20]
• Advice for Young Entrants, Developing as a Leader: [16:43–18:20]
• Building a Personal Brand, Going International, Launching BuildWitt: [19:06–27:17]
• Business Evolution & Marketing Role in Construction: [27:17–32:20]
• Moving into Training, Wellbeing, and Company Culture: [32:20–44:01]
• Discussion of Social Media, Brand-Building Tactics, and Storytelling: [46:34–54:09]
• YouTube and Podcasting Strategies: [53:23–56:20]
• Summit Leadership Event & Building Industry Culture: [63:20–67:17]
• Personal Growth: Faith, Consistency, Fitness, and Dealing with Anxiety: [68:33–80:30]
• Aaron's Overarching Philosophy: Consistency as the Key to Success: [81:17–82:19]

---

Additional Highlights

• Summit Event for Industry Leadership (Dirt World Summit):
  • Focused on cultivating the next generation of leaders; includes high-profile speakers and interactive discussions. (63:28–67:17)
• Aaron’s Routine for Personal Health:
  • Daily exercise (“every day since 2019”), journaling, and now daily Bible reading. (71:48–72:11, 76:46)
• Travel & Content Creation:
  • Recent/forthcoming adventure to a Canadian diamond mine; ongoing international storytelling. (58:09–60:28)
• Mental & Physical Health as a Core Focus:
  • Direct link between construction culture, workforce retention, and employee mental/physical wellbeing.

---

Takeaways for Listeners

• Infrastructure is vital yet underappreciated; it needs new champions.
• For young people seeking purpose and opportunity, the dirt world is “the final frontier of the American dream.”
• Building a personal and business brand requires relentless consistency and authenticity.
• Companies in traditional industries need to modernize, prioritize employee wellbeing, and develop leadership at every level.
• Success, in business and life, flows from daily positive habits and surrendering outcomes to a higher purpose.

---

Closing Quote

“The secret is just doing the work every day, every week, every month, every year for decades.”
— Aaron Witt (81:45)

---

For further inspiration, check out Aaron’s social media, BuildWitt’s videos, and consider attending the Dirt World Summit or exploring Mountain Ops.

Transcript

[A]

This is a special episode of the Dirt Talk podcast because technically it's not the Dirt Talk podcast, but I am a significant part of it. Trevor from Mountain Ops, he reached out a few weeks ago thanks to our friends at Ralph Smith in Utah. He was here for an event he put out on social media. A question to the people he knew. Hey, if anybody in Nashville's worth to talking to having on the podcast, let me know. And my name came up and 1, 2, 6. Trevor was in the office. We had a fantastic conversation for his podcast, the Conquercast podcast, which I highly recommend. But we asked him since we filmed it here in the studio, if we could publish it on the Dirt Chalk channel as well. And he said absolutely. So I really hope you enjoy this conversation with me and Trevor. I highly recommend the Conquercast. It's a phenomenal program. I highly recommend checking out Mountain Ops. I haven't really, or before this I hadn't really tried some of their products, but Trevor brought a bunch of products. I've been loving them. They've got all kinds of nutrition type products for primarily those that spend a lot of time outdoors. Love the focus. I think it overlaps really nicely with the dirt world, so check them out. And with that, here is the episode.

[B]

Everyone, welcome back to another episode of the Conquercast. Super stoked to be here with Aaron Witt. Today. We're actually in Nashville, we're at his headquarters, built Witt, and we've never really taken this on the road until the last couple days. And so it's been fun to be in some different studios. You've got your own podcast, Dirt Talk, and we've got the signage behind you here. Just learned a little bit more about Aaron's business and, and him and what he's doing to build the next generation of dirt movers. Is that kind of what you're up to or kind of give us a little bit of a snapshot of your life and what you've been doing?

[A]

Yeah, we call it the dirt world, but we made up the term. It's just a fun term to describe. I think the people keeping the world moving, it's all critical infrastructure, it's natural resources. So dirt moving is a part of it, but it's, it's paving roads, it's laying pipe, it's producing power, it's. It's the foundation of society. When I speak, I pull up Abraham Maslow's hierarchy of needs. And at the bottom is physiological. That's food, water and shelter. And food doesn't happen without infrastructure. And Resources, water doesn't happen without, without infrastructure, resources, shelter doesn't happen. So if those things don't happen, modern day doesn't happen, society doesn't happen. And the problem we're addressing right now is as critical as these industries are, they're struggling to attract the next generation. So there's this previous generation that's carried the industry to where it is today, that's built the infrastructure that we rely on every day currently, but they're increasingly aging out and there's not necessarily that new generation flooding in. And right now in construction alone, we need half a million people to meet the existing demand right now, right now within the United States of America. And so we're building a business around that problem to solve that problem. Because I think if there is to be a future of the United States of America and a future in general, there has to be infrastructure and it has to be world class. And you can't automate it, you can't outsource it. You need hardworking people to make it happen.

[B]

AI is not going to do that for us. Right.

[A]

And AI doesn't happen without infrastructure. That's what people don't understand understand is, is everybody's talking about technology and it's all bits, but it still all depends upon atoms. You can't feed it, it doesn't.

[B]

Is that where the next generation's getting caught up is in all the technology and AI and they're not moving into kind of these, some of these areas of, of the dirt world or what's going on.

[A]

I think the next generation has just got caught up in the giant system that is higher education, that is corporate America, that is knowledge work. Like I think our whole economy has dramatically shifted over the past 50 years to finance, to tech, to real estate, to health care, pharma, like all of those are the biggest industries in America when 100 years ago the biggest industries were resources, were manufacturing. We post World War II went and put all that stuff elsewhere and we've become more of a knowledge economy, which has potentially in some ways created more wealth than ever, but in other ways has degraded society, I think, because people are now more removed than ever from how the world works. And so I think we have the people we need to make it happen. We just need to educate them, get them in the door and then train and develop them. And that's, that's our whole business model is, is reach them where they are, which is probably their phones, which is why we do so much on social media, bring them in the door, train and develop them. And that's where our training software, Bill Whit and Prove comes into play. And then you've got to keep them. That's when leadership really starts to become important. And that's where our area at Dirt World Summit is key, is that's developing the future leadership in the industry as well.

[B]

Yeah, I want to talk about each of those things, but I want to start kind of way back when this became important to you. And just honestly, thank you for letting us be here in your studio. Thanks for the tour. It was interesting. I posted on social media a couple of weeks ago that I'd be out in Tennessee and a mutual friend, Randy Smith Trucking.

[A]

Is that Ralph Smith?

[B]

Ralph Smith Trucking. His daughter reached out. I guess she went to elementary school with my wife and said, hey, while you're out there, you got to meet with Aaron. They're in the trucking world and I guess use your software or a client or something or some connection there. And so appreciate you giving us some of your time. But digging into it a little bit, it looks like from an early age you were interested in this kind of stuff. Where did that, where did this all become important to you?

[A]

Yeah, I don't think like I've, I've always loved bulldozers and heavy equipment and earth moving, but I don't think that's uncommon. There's a lot of young boys that

[B]

like boys that dig out in the

[A]

dirt, that dig out in the dirt and have trucks and this and that. I was no different. The, the funny thing with, in the world I grew up in though, was that that wasn't the norm because I came up. My dad was a, a tax lawyer and he retired as a director at Deloitte. Like the most white collar, black and white job and company in the United States of America. Like second only to like a big bank. You know, it's, it's anything but blue collar work. But fortunately I, my parents just let me do what I, whatever I wanted to do. So when I got to high school, it was like I just had a blank canvas, which is a blessing and a curse because it's confusing.

[B]

If you're willing to do something with a blank canvas, that can be a huge blessing. But not everyone knows how to or is exactly takes the initiative or has the ambition to do something with a blank canvas.

[A]

Well, and, and yeah. And you're not provided the tools to do like schools not helping you out. Teachers aren't helping you out. Guidance counselors not helping you out. College isn't helping you out. So it's really, it's on you. And that's where some dumb luck played, played a role was that there was a giant construction project that started to happen in my neighborhood. And I'd never seen anything like it. I'd never been on a construction site before.

[B]

This wasn't Nashville. This was Phoenix. Phoenix. Okay.

[A]

Yeah. So like two minutes from high school, giant construction project starts to happen. And, and everybody's all pissed off about it because it's, you know, two more minutes to get to Starbucks in the morning and it's like they got some dirt on my lawn, so on and so forth. But it was a drainage project, so it doesn't rain all that much in Phoenix Point. It does really rains.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And so this was a, a whole new drainage infrastructure underground to collect water and get it out of the neighborhood. And I would after high school, just watch the work happening. I thought it was, it was just like, I was like a moth to a flame. It was just, I couldn't not.

[B]

What, what was it about it that drew you in?

[A]

Every, Everything. But they, I mean the, the, the real thing was they had the biggest excavator I'd ever seen in the city. It's a Caterpillar 385, which is a, it's not a machine you see in a neighborhood.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

It's more on like a mine or something. Yeah.

[B]

Kennecott or is it one of them?

[A]

Not that big. Yeah, but, but, yeah, not that big. But, but it was, it was the biggest machine I'd ever seen at that time. And it was sitting there right in the neighborhood and, and all the trucks going in and out said Pearson Construction Corporation on the side. So I, I, I googled their, the company. I found the, the phone number for the office. I found out who owned it. Rich Pearson, because it's on the website. And I asked to meet with Rich Pearson after high school one day and he said sure. So I go down there one day.

[B]

Are you just curious this way? And inquisitive, like have the courage to do that? Because most high schoolers aren't like, oh, I'm going to go meet with the president of this company.

[A]

Like it was like.

[B]

Were you nervous?

[A]

Yeah, kind of. But it was like meeting with a friend's dad. Because all my friends dads were business people.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Like all like world class business people. So I could go cold, call the CEO of a company. No, no problem. Could I talk to a girl?

[B]

No. Still working on that one.

[A]

That one is still eluded me. Yeah. Yeah, Real shame. But maybe one day. So, so, yeah, it was, it was. Again, I just, I'd been raised that way, so, yeah, I didn't know anything else but to just ask. And so I, I, I, I met him. I, I asked what he studied in college. He said engineering. So I signed up for engineering school.

[B]

Cool.

[A]

And then I asked him for a job, and he started me as a laborer on a construction crew right out of high school. And so it was like 18 years old. A week after graduating high school, there I was on a construction crew on that project in my neighborhood.

[B]

Serious.

[A]

Me and a bunch of Mexican guys.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And I'd never been on a construction site in my life, and I was as green as could be, but that was the beginning of it all.

[B]

What was your job then? Just clean up.

[A]

It was just do anything to be helpful. I don't think they needed somebody. But, yeah, I was making $13 an hour, and, you know, but I didn't, I didn't know anything. But my, my, really, my, my. The role that I created for myself was just try to help the guys around me, like, if they need a shovel, be handing them a shovel before they ask for the shovel. Like, if I can do that, I'm good to go. So I just, I just tried to make life a little easier for those around me, like, if, if. And it was pipeline. So it's pretty repetitive. So once you start to get like, okay, at this point, they probably need this. At this point, they need that. And that's kind of what I did for. Yeah. For the summer.

[B]

That's really cool. Yeah. And then started your engineering program and

[A]

went to engineering school and worked in construction all the way through college.

[B]

Worked for Pearson or.

[A]

No. His, his advice was go work for all different companies.

[B]

Okay. Learn something new at each of them. Yeah.

[A]

Because he was like, you don't know what. You don't know. You're. You're 18 years old, and this is. Construction is a big world. You can be a lawyer in construction, you can be an accountant in construction. You can build houses, you can build skyscrapers, you can build pipelines, and all of them are completely different. So his point was, go try a bunch of stuff and just see what sticks. And so every year, I worked at a different company, and by the time I graduated, I went to work in road construction. I'd worked for five companies in four states on anything from, like, simple waterline work to railroad bridges to blasting for giant rocks up in Washington. So it was, it was super cool.

[B]

What'd you enjoy most in that journey. Was there an area of the business where you're like, oh, if I was to do this for the rest of my life, this is what I do? Or was it. No, I just want to learn all the aspects.

[A]

I knew that like dirt, machines, all that was my kind of thing. So I didn't have to, I didn't have to explore that far. And I never went into residential or buildings because I, I appreciate it, but it's just not my thing. So I stayed squarely. It's called civil construction and I just, I, but I, I tried a bunch of companies out. I just loved the field. Engineering school is miserable. I was straight Cs, failed a few classes, had to retake a few classes. But as long as you graduate.

[B]

How long does that take to graduate from engineering school?

[A]

Four years.

[B]

Four years. Yeah. And then where is the, the 500, you said 500,000 jobs that are needed

[A]

right now in the construction industry.

[B]

What, what areas of construction is that mainly coming from every area of construction? Everything.

[A]

Yeah, but it's a lot of entry level positions and that, that, that's based like existing demand. And so right now, construction in the United States, it's a really interesting time because post Covid, you had a lot of people migrating in really weird ways around the United States. So for example, you had a lot of people going from Illinois, leaving Illinois and going to Indiana. And so Indiana, then residential construction blows up. Or Tennessee, a lot of people came into Tennessee or Texas. Utah was another one, Idaho, Arizona, North Carolina, South Carolina, Florida. And so a lot of these markets have been really hot and there's been a big demand for just housing. Yeah, US infrastructure is old, is pretty old. And so you have to be replacing infrastructure nonstop. You have to not just be repaving roads, you know, fixing potholes, but you've got to be expanding roads, you've got to be replacing bridges, you've got to be upgrading water and wastewater treatment plants. So when you know another hundred thousand people show up, that's. Another hundred thousand people. Yeah. That you have to support from a water and power and gas perspective. So now you're straining the existing infrastructure and you've got to upgrade that infrastructure. And then infrastructure just has a design life of like 50 to 70 ish years. And a lot of infrastructure is well past that design life. And what happens? Well, it can fail, but when it fails, there's big problems. And then, and then there's, over the past five years, there's been more federal spending than in U.S. history. And it was first like a boom in E Commerce with, with COVID everybody staying home. So warehouses got really hot. Then they overbuilt on that. Then the federal money started to come out in infrastructure and with manufacturing. So these chip plants, these battery plants, the biggest projects the United States has ever seen. From a private investment, public investment perspective. The jury's still out on most of them, but they moved the dirt for them at least. And then now is the data center thing and they're going off everywhere. But already you've had, you know, like five or six states now say we can't no more. Like New York being the most recent one. We can't do data centers anymore. Not because we don't want them, not because these companies won't spend 10, $15 billion apiece on them. It's because we don't have the water. It's because we don't have the power.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

And no one has a good answer to that right now. Yeah.

[B]

That is crazy. So opportunity there, I mean, I think of like I've got a 16 year old son, he's been testing out different jobs and he's done some customer service phone jobs, then he's done some cleanup crew on construction side. He's doing, he's, he's pushing snow. We haven't got a lot of snow this, this year in Utah.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But he's like, dad, I do not want to sit at a desk. I do not want to answer phone calls. He's like, I just do better when I'm out moving and getting stuff done. So where, I mean, I love this conversation because I can tell that he's one that just, he wants to be actively involved in something, you know, in construction, probably something he looks at. He loves building and that type of thing. So what would, what advice would you give someone like that? I know a lot of our audience too have, have sons or they're, they're younger guys that are looking for opportunities and growth. What, where would you tell them to start to look?

[A]

I just tell anybody, any, anybody young like that, that half million person figure and that demand for infrastructure, future state, that's their opportunity. There's never been more opportunity in this world. It's the perfect time to get into it. And it's, it's, it's a great, great environment for the right kind of person. It's not for everybody, but you get to work hard, which in itself is rare in today's world and creates a huge sense of satisfaction that's missing with a lot of people. You can make a really good living. You're working hard alongside other people. You're not on a computer all day. You're not staring at others on a computer screen. You get to do really cool stuff. You get to do really meaningful stuff. You know, you're not just grinding away for the sake of grinding away. You're building a road that 100,000 people use every day to get to and from work and get their kids to school and that ambulances drive to get people to the hospital, so on and so forth. Now, all of that to say there are some pretty serious issues because. And that's what I talk a lot about now is like, if we were doing all the right things, we wouldn't have this problem. Yeah, we'd have the workforce we need. People would be flocking to this world. So we're not just the victim here. I think construction companies have a lot of work to do to make the environment better, which is again, why we have a business in the first place. But for anybody that, that appeals to. If you get into construction, it's super straightforward. You just have to show up on time every day. If you're just consistent, you're already ahead of like 90% of people. And then you just have to keep your mouth shut, do what you're told, prove yourself. And then you've just got to be curious and ask questions. And if people don't want to answer your questions, just watch people. But that's all you really have to do. And, and then as you learn and as you grow, if you can become a better leader, a better communicator and start developing other people and start helping these companies with this challenge that is workforce. Now you become among the most valuable people in the industry. And that's exactly what I. That's the tree I'd be barking up if I were to do it again.

[B]

Did you. Is that kind of the path you took before you started to develop your own products and software systems and marketing tools and such or.

[A]

Yeah, I. Well, no, it was more self serving.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

I. I was listening to podcasts when I was. The job on the railroad was just miserable. It was like.

[B]

What was the job on the railroad? What were you doing?

[A]

It was. We were replacing bridges. But the railroad doesn't stop. It's 24 7, 365 days.

[B]

So you gotta keep the tracks available and moving.

[A]

Yeah. And you work on their schedule.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

And so it was seven days a week, you know, and I was in college and so all my friends were back home screwing off.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And I was in the middle of the desert, 120 degrees every day, fixing a bridge. Yeah. You know, working at least 80 hours a week, if not more. I was making a lot of money. But you're living out of a hotel in Yuma, Arizona. And it's just. It wasn't. But it was great. It was, it was, it was, it was character building to say at least.

[B]

Yeah, for sure.

[A]

And so I was listening to podcasts to just consume some time and there was, there was a few talking about personal brand and it didn't really register at the time. But then when I was a senior in college, it started to click. Like, wait a minute, if I build a personal brand, I'll have more career options. And I was all about maximizing potential opportunity. So I was looking at my life like what's the unique story that I have to offer? That's that. That is kind of a gap right now. And I first looked at like nature and hiking and this and that, but there were already millions of people doing it.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Super, super. Well, so it's like, okay, maybe I could do it better, but probably not. But then I looked at earth moving and construction was like, no one's really here and I'm here and I have all these pictures on my phone. So I just started sharing them.

[B]

Cuz you had been taking just pictures of the machinery and the job sites and such as.

[A]

Everybody's taking pictures. Yeah. When something cool's happening.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You whip out your phone. Everybody in construction has a whole camera roll of photos and videos that are pretty sweet. Yeah. They just don't use them oftentimes they're not allowed to.

[B]

Okay. Yeah.

[A]

There's, there's a lot of, I think very outdated policies.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

But it's just. And it's, it's an older school world. So like companies are still coming around to the whole social media thing in construction. I mean you have multibillion dollar company with a website from like 2008.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

In this world. No kidding. Like it's, it's still, it's still that way in a lot of cases that.

[B]

Cuz it's just like kind of the good old boys club. It's like they bite. Done by a handshake or is it. I mean obviously lots of contracts and such, but just everyone's well connected and knows how we do business. You don't have to present it super well online or correct.

[A]

Well, it's a lot of. It is public bid. Okay. So you just, they come out with, we want you to Build this bridge.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

And you say, I can build that bridge for $3.3 million.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And if the next guy is 3.5 and the next guy's 3.8, you won the contract for $3.3 million. There you go. So I don't like a lot of companies, historically, they don't even have their brand on pickup trucks, on anything. They just build stuff, and we just bid public work. Interesting. We don't need to put our name on anything. But now it's like, well, no, you do. Because again, you don't have people just knocking on the door anymore. Just showing up in the parking lot asking for a job. That's not how the world works anymore.

[B]

That's interesting. So you started to. How did you get around with people having a lot of photos and everything, them not being able to post? You started to post them. Right. You started to build a. I just did it. You just did it. Why not just do it?

[A]

At the time, it's like, I'm 22 years old.

[B]

Did anyone say, what are you gonna do with these?

[A]

No, no.

[B]

It's just people just maybe thought they couldn't or were scared to do it.

[A]

And the company I was working for at the time I made a case to their leadership was like, let me run the company, social media. And they said no. So it's like, I tried.

[B]

Did they have a social media.

[A]

No.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

And so that was.

[B]

Because at some point, even though there's a. There's a need and demand for people, I'm assuming there's still a lot of competition and that when these bids come across, there's gotta be. Is it just all based off of the number, or is it based off of, like, a trust that this. This company's built a brand that we can trust and we've.

[A]

On. On the private side of things, it is okay. But public work, and there's different ways of going about it, but traditionally, it's no. If you're the low bid, that's. You get the contract.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

That's interesting.

[A]

Yeah, it's amazing, huh? That's how most public infrastructure works.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

But, yeah, I just started sharing pictures, and then I kind of ran out of pictures. So I was like, well, I need more construction pictures. So I would. Then I bought a camera that I would take to work on slow days because I was working in road construction. And then I bought a little drone that I would fly over construction sites around town and take some pictures here or there and put them on the Internet. It's gray Area. It's like, it's not their airspace. I wouldn't do it now.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But that's how I got access. When I couldn't get access was I used a drone.

[B]

That's cool.

[A]

And then I built this brand. And it was still pretty early on, but as I was building the brand, I made friends with the other guys that were running some bigger, like, heavy equipment pages. They would share photos. This was 2017, and I wanted my account to grow, so I made friends with them for them to share my photos, to grow. It was a different game back then. And one of them messaged me. He's like, hey, it was the biggest account at the time. And he was like, hey, just so you know, I'm. Someone offered me money to buy the account, so I'm going to sell it.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

And I was like, how much? He's like, 3, $500. So that day I was like, I'll give you $4,000 for it.

[B]

How big was this page at the time?

[A]

It was like, I might have had maybe 10,000 followers. And it had like, 180,000 followers for 3,500 bucks, which was crazy. Four grand. Four grand. Outbid the other party. Yeah. Yeah. And so I. I don't know this guy, but he gives me the account. I send him. Like, I. I think I maxed out my Venmo at like 2500 bucks. So I had my brother, Venmo, the other 1500.

[B]

I love this.

[A]

To get this account. And as he give me the account, he was like, hey, by the way, there was this company out of China that reached out and offered me a trip to China. It's your thing.

[B]

Why is he selling this?

[A]

I think he needed money, and maybe he was burnt out. I don't know.

[B]

Have you kept in contact with him at all? Seen what you've done?

[A]

No, no, no.

[B]

Did you take the trip? Did you get that trip to China?

[A]

Well, so I get on the phone with the Chinese, and it seems legit. So I'm like, I guess I'll go to China. And so I go that. Later that year, they send me a ticket and I go to China by myself. It's the first time I'd ever been overseas by myself and tour heavy equipment factories. And it was like, the first major opportunity to see this whole other world that I had never seen before and was like, this is incredible. I want to go do more of this. And at that time, a software company, construction software company, found me to help them with their program called I Build America to build the next generation. And I did that for a few months, but I wanted to do it my way, not their way. And. And so I only made it there a few months before quitting and starting BuildWit. So I went to China and then maybe a month or two after that I quit my job to then start Build Wit. Cause it was just like the world's a big place.

[B]

2017, this.

[A]

Yeah. Beginning of 2018 was when I started the company.

[B]

Wow. Yeah. And BuildWit initially was what, just a brand to influence and inspire?

[A]

No, BuildWit initially was whatever I needed to do to make money.

[B]

Okay. Within construction or within.

[A]

Yeah, within construction. It was more disciplined than that, but it was, what it really was was me taking pictures for construction companies.

[B]

They were paying you to do this?

[A]

Paying me.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

And then me running their social media pages initially. Very so. And I broke my lease, I moved back in with my parents, so I didn't have any expenses or anything like that. And I didn't have to pay myself for the first few years because I'd saved up a lot of money working in construction.

[B]

That's awesome.

[A]

To then it grew from me taking pictures, doing social media to then we eventually started doing websites, video projects, rebranding companies, all for the sake of developing their workforce, developing their employer brand, helping them solve this problem.

[B]

And were these newer construction companies or were some of the old boys, like having you like, were they wanting now to have a fresher, cleaner look on their, their website? It was starting to become a thing now.

[A]

Yeah. Some of These companies were 100 years old.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

That we, that we helped to rebrand.

[B]

Yeah. That they didn't care so much before to have the nicest website or the branding or whatnot, but now it's become important to them.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Well.

[A]

And they saw what we were doing with companies online.

[B]

Okay. And so on a piece of that.

[A]

Yeah. We kind of naturally attracted all the open minded early adopters.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

And. And really worked with all of the early adopters in the industry, which was pretty sweet. And. And in civil construction too, it's oftentimes multi generational. And so some of these businesses, it's not uncommon for them to be third, fourth generation. So when you have Gen 3, leave the old man, so to speak, and then the son typically take over.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

The son might be 34, you know, 37, 41. Yeah, maybe. And. And so they at least understand they're a little closer to the next generation and they, they see the value in it. So sometimes it would be that generational shift or Sometimes it's these newer companies that just get the importance of it and are growing really fast and want to do more. So that's cool.

[B]

I just was. I spoke on a panel this last week up at Sundance in Utah and that was on the panel. It was just me and one other guy and it was. He has a software. It's called Job Job Nimbus and it's for roofers. But it's, it's all to create a generational company that can be passed down from one generation to the next. That it's in a. In a position with a brand and culture and everything that the son and the grandson wants to take over. Because a lot of them had been left with like, well, I don't want to take that over. It's kind of a mess. And I've watched the hard work you've done and the grind and you know. But it's. His whole system is to. To kind of create that next generation of roofers. But yeah.

[A]

So, yeah, and constructions. I think it's one of the final frontiers when it comes to the American dream. Like, I can't really go start a phone company right now. I can't start a bank. I can't really start a car company. Like most every other industry is so consolidated and dominated by these monster operations, whereas construction still so fragmented. All I need is a contractor's license and I'm ready to go.

[B]

That's awesome.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

So as you're out taking these pictures, where. Where did all this take you? Like around the world. And where's some of the adventures you've loved most as you built the social media for others or for yourself? And yeah. What machineries were most fascinating, like in

[A]

the earlier years, one of the next opportunities I got was I went to Saudi Arabia which was. I've been there three times now.

[B]

Really.

[A]

Middle east four. Yeah. And that was again so eye opening to go. It's just been, it's been so interesting doing this as I've been developing as a man as well, like in my 20s.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Especially going to these places where you have a lot of preconceived notions of like, well, the Middle east is this.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And you go there and you see it for yourself and you're like, wait a minute.

[B]

Huh?

[A]

This is a totally different tune. And, and maybe I'm not seeing everything, but like I've seen a lot of Saudi Arabia at this point and it's like, this is a pretty incredible place to, to me. And it's an incredible culture and it's an incredible people and the work they're doing is incredible. Like, I think it's unbelievable.

[B]

That's awesome.

[A]

And so I've. In the early years it was mostly traveling around America. We've gone to 48 states doing this now. I still need Alaska and South Dakota.

[B]

That's it.

[A]

Yeah. I think this is my year for those two though. But I would also have some of those periodic opportunities like Saudi Arabia, like Europe, like Australia went down to South America and.

[B]

And now rocks out here from Germany.

[A]

Yeah, we've gone to Germany quite a few times now. I think four, maybe five times. But yeah, the marketing company started to grow. The problem with the marketing company though was that it was service based. And we've always like, our goal is always to make the dirt world a better place to build this next generation. If we build the dirt world's next gener, the dirt world's next generation will build the next generation of America. Infrastructure is the limiting factor. It is. And so it's a really big deal. And we then have to scale our influence within the industry. Marketing was, was. It only had so much reach. So that's when we got into software.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Training and development. And we sold, like I mentioned to you earlier, we sold the marketing company a year ago to go all in on training and development. And I'm not particularly. I'm not passionate about marketing.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I'm not passionate about video.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

I'm not. I couldn't tell you how to edit a video. I couldn't tell you how to code a website. I'm not necessarily passionate about software. I'm not a tech guy. I'm. I'm dead serious though about the problem we're solving.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And marketing was a great tool to get us here. And we've passed that business along to a great team that we sold it to an employee who's. Who's leading it to a whole new world. But I've never been attached to a specific approach or business. I've been attached to a problem. And that's why software has become so appealing is because it's so scalable. We can work with every construction company and every individual in the industry if we do it right. And that now has put me on a different trajectory. That is we have a CEO running the company and an executive team, super capable. And then a team just across the board that's super capable to do that, to create the business while I focus on the brand, which has now allowed me to go travel all over the place.

[B]

Awesome.

[A]

Like last year we had we went to Indonesia, which was extraordinary. Like very rural Sumatra and very rural Borneo to coal mines out there, which was just remarkable. We did another tour, my third tour, all over Australia. You know, fly in, fly out.

[B]

You're.

[A]

The mines are so remote, they fly the whole workforce in every week.

[B]

And are these minds that you're going to using your software or you there doing more content and.

[A]

No, now it's all grow the brand first and foremost, grow awareness for this world.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Because this world, it's so underappreciated and yet no one can do a single thing in life without it.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So it's just, just, just provide awareness for how important this world is and awareness for the people doing it. Like I want to take care of the people doing it first and foremost. And if they're cared for, the workforce problem will solve itself in a way. But then just grow awareness for the industry as a whole and then grow awareness for build wit, which then grows the business.

[B]

Awesome. So, and what is the software that

[A]

you, that you offer to all training and development. So it's, it's skills based.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

So you can go get a job running one of those machines out there on the wall with no formal training whatsoever. You need more training to run a forklift in a warehouse.

[B]

Really?

[A]

Yes. There's a legitimate certification for that.

[B]

Seriously?

[A]

Yes. There's no certification for heavy equipment.

[B]

Serious.

[A]

Yeah. All you need to do is pass a drug test.

[B]

How does that work? I mean this, these will kill people. Right?

[A]

That's a great, that's a great point. Yeah. And there is some training and development, but historically it's been, historically the existing generation, they came up in the industry as a kid, most likely.

[B]

So insurance companies are just trusting that like these kids know what they're doing or. Well, is there.

[A]

So, but here's the problem. If you're working the construction industry now, your dad probably did it, your grandfather did it, your uncle probably did it, your family was involved in some capacity. Your, your family had a company, whatever it was you grew up around or your dad worked on the car on the weekends, like you grew up around it a little bit. So by the time you go into the industry formally, you already have a background skill set. And so, and then back in the day you could make mistakes. So on the job training, you could do it.

[B]

That was your learning was because.

[A]

Yeah. If you, if you talk to anybody in their 40s, 50s, especially 60s, how'd you learn how to run equipment? Tell me a story. Yeah, they'll tell you some stories.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And it's crazy stuff. Like they did some western stuff back in the day which is, I think it's really cool. But nowadays you can't do that because of insurance requirements and lawyers and safety. And it's gotten better. Like hey, we can't kill as many people. Yeah, that's a pretty good thing to do. It breaks down though because now it's this whole generation that grew up in suburbia, me that did not grow up working, that did not grow up around tools or anything of the sort that's showing up on the job site with no training whatsoever. But then there's no training program to help me out. It's just on the job training. But I can't make a mistake anymore.

[B]

Is there regulatory like that? They have to have training but there's just not any. No, no. Okay.

[A]

No. Which is why there's, there's no training. And I don't, I'm not blaming anybody for this. It's just kind of how the world is operated. But again the system now doesn't work going forward. And so our software, it's not a magic potion, it's not the solution to their problems but it's video based microlearning, daily learning, training their people on. We've got over 2000 videos now like

[B]

of specific machinery on.

[A]

Yeah. How to the basics of a dozer, the basics of an excavator, the basics of a truck, whatever it is. And then most importantly it also has a ton of training on mental health, on physical health, on leadership, on communication, on financial literacy. All kinds of things to make. Like the goal is not to just make workers, it's to make well rounded individuals. Yeah. Which will make everybody better off as a result. And, and that's the dark side of construction is we're not nearly as healthy as we should be. Sue. So, so there's 5,000, about 5,000 people killed in construction every year. The military, there's about a thousand every year. And the military has at least a few months of training. Construction has none. So it's, it's, it's more dangerous in the military. And I need to do the math per capita. But that's just the math. On the fatalities. The suicide rate in construction is between four to five times the annual on the job fatality. Right.

[B]

Really.

[A]

And then the accidental drug overdose rate is 11 times the total on the job fatality rate. And so there are some huge problems when it comes to mental and physical well being that are not being addressed right now that have to be addressed

[B]

is that because the, the workplace and the cultures need some improvement.

[A]

That I think it's partially that. I think it's largely though people are just unhealthy and a lot of that is driven.

[B]

Physically unhealthy. They're just focused, they're just working too much and not have, there's no balance in their life.

[A]

Yeah. When you're, when you're working 60 hours a week, you know, even 60 hours, that's still. And you're driving, you know, construction too, your job moves. And so sometimes if you're lucky, it's 30 minutes from your house. Other times it's an hour and 15 from your house. So even if you're working a 10 hour day. Yeah, it's 12, 13 hour day.

[B]

True.

[A]

And then you're doing six days a week.

[B]

There's no time for anything else.

[A]

Where do you meal prep? You know, where, like when do you build the relationship with your spouse? When do you take care of your kids? It starts to be really hard and you can do that when you're young. But then again, you know, the bigger your family grows and the more responsibilities mount and the older your body becomes, starts to break down. It starts to become really problematic.

[B]

Yeah, you're addressing some really important issues then with this. How, how are you doing that? With its videos and literature. Are you doing training on there yourself or.

[A]

It's. We have worked with top notch construction companies. So it's. We're producing the content, but they're providing that. They're the subject matter experts. Yeah. And it's on the jobs. It's real equipment, it's real people doing this that have been doing it for decades.

[B]

And are those, when you go into a company like that, that's. They've got the real people talking about it and this and that, are they actually implementing it well into their business? So you're using an example of a construction company in the industry who's focused on the mental health, the well being of their team and they can kind of speak to it and act as an example.

[A]

Most of the time.

[B]

Most of the time.

[A]

Some, some of it is just purely skills based.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

And then some of like the mental health stuff, it's for example, like Vincelli, who is a president of an asphalt company, big company, who has gone through his own issues and has gotten a PhD on this subject now and uses his experiences to teach. Or we have Rich Jones who, he was an addict and it's like, listen, I was an addict and here's how I overcame it. And now this is all I do is work with people that are addicted. And here's what I've learned along the way. And leadership. We sat down with Jocko for six hours and talked to him about leadership principles. So it's not me saying, yeah, here's how to be a better leader on a job site. I don't lead on a job site. You know, what's, what's my opinion worth and I now I get to see more job sites than just about anybody in the world. Which is really unique. But we're trying to lean on experts to facilitate this. And then the cool thing is as well, it's not just the video. It's the way construction works is you show up to the job site and you typically have what's called a toolbox talk, which is a morning meeting, maybe a 10 minute, 15 minute meeting on typically it's the same safety related stuff. Stay off your phones, wear your seatbelt, wear your gloves, wear your eye protection, wear your hard hat, you know, stay off that road, whatever it is. And it's the basics. And then everybody gets in their equipment and goes to work.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And then you don't really talk the

[B]

rest of the day.

[A]

Whereas if you have everybody in one place and have a three minute video on a very simple communication principle and then you can have that crew leader facilitate even a brief discussion about it and just get that crew talking a little bit more. Now you're getting more knowledge transfer. You're getting some ideally some of the more experienced people to talk about some of their lessons learned, share some stories. You can hopefully along the way as you build trust, get the younger guys to start asking questions a little bit more and then you're facilitating relationship building that wouldn't normally be there. So that hopefully that's carrying into the rest of the day. So it's really, it's a catalyst and again it's, it's not, it's not a magic potion.

[B]

Right.

[A]

But there's nothing really that exists otherwise in this space.

[B]

That's amazing. Yeah. Wow. I'm impressed, man. I had no idea that it went into that. I thought it was more just the a software to do some training on like equipment stuff. So I didn't know you have to

[A]

there, you have to do that.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And it's a need and that that gets a company to buy.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But they need the leadership far more. They need the communication far more. If you went out and pulled like even not even on a job site but on the street. Tell me how a mortgage works.

[B]

Yeah. People don't know, huh?

[A]

Not a clue.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

How does a health savings account actually work?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Let's explain to me the Mechanics of a 401k.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Not a clue. But it's not their fault. We can sit here and say, well, they're just dumb, but. Or we could ask, well, where would they have.

[B]

Yeah. Where's the resource? Yeah.

[A]

How a 401k did they learn in school?

[B]

No.

[A]

Did they learn it from their previous employers?

[B]

No.

[A]

Did they learn from their parents?

[B]

No.

[A]

And so if it's not my job to teach them as an employer, like, then I can't be upset that they don't understand it. And, and it should be in my best interest to ensure that our people are financially healthy.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Because if they're financially stressed, they're not going to be as productive, they're not going to be as content. They're probably going to be fighting with their spouse, potentially getting a divorce, you know, worrying about their, their mortgage payments.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Then that's a, that's a terrible place to be.

[B]

Yeah. I just imagine there's such a huge opportunity for employers to re. To build culture, to retain. If there's a demand of 500,000 people, I mean, you don't want to, you want to be retaining and acquiring people. Right. And so I figure if you're, if you're offering these types of tools, it's going to attract more people to their business, especially if the leaders in that business are adopting these leadership principles and implementing them. And from the top down, really building culture. That's. We're huge on that at Mountain Ops is building a culture that people want to stay with for a long time. They feel like they're contributing and they're growing. Their development is, is, you know, is an opportunity that they wouldn't find elsewhere. And if they decide to go somewhere else, we want them to leave feeling like, hey, I was just equipped to go do more, you know, because I was at Mountain Ops. But I would, I would think this tool would be a huge retention piece to their business as well. What, I mean, building a personal brand. So you started, did you say 2017? You kind of started taking the photos and, and building up the personal brand, but also doing social media for others. What can you tell us about that process of building your brand? You've got a massive following for both your company and your personal name on social media. You've got a huge subscriber base on YouTube. That's not easy. And I'm asking that Mountain Ops has done a really good Job of building social media wise. But I am in a situation similar to you, where you hired a. Sounds like you hired a CEO to run the operations and you're focused on brand. And I did the same thing about a year and a half ago. And my whole focus as being more founder forward is to go out and build content that points people to mountain Ops and the benefits of mountain Ops and bring more awareness to it. But it's a difficult competitive space to go and build in. How do you do that? I know you mentioned consistency, but what advice would you give me or others that are trying to do a similar thing?

[A]

It's like I half joked with you before. This is like, I don't know what

[B]

I'm doing and maybe there's. Maybe part of. It's not knowing and it's just an exploration journey. I don't know.

[A]

You know, I think that's part of it. Part of it is consistency. So I've posted on social media every day since I started.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

In 2017. And so when people are like, how, you know, how do you, how do you build a following like this? Or how do you get on these projects now? Like the project we're going out to this week.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

The company reached out to us, which is insane.

[B]

Just.

[A]

Yeah. I was with the United States. I was hosted by the United States Army Corps last week. Like, wow. But that happens because it's like, well, I've been doing this every single day since 2017. It's 2026, so almost a decade now. If you do anything every single day and you do it to the best of your abilities, you're going to get better at whatever it is. And communication, storytelling, brand. All it is, is a skill. It's just a skill. So the more you practice, the better you get. So consistency is, is a superpower. I'm a huge believer in consistency. The second thing is you. You have to do what you like to do.

[B]

Yeah. Has to come from.

[A]

Yeah. So I've been really careful to not go emulate anyone else and to find my thing. And, and, and part of my thing has always been photographing equipment.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But when people in the early days would be like, can you do video? No, because it's not my thing. I don't like video.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I like photography.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And I just want to photograph what I want to photograph.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And when you're photographing what you want to photograph and what is exciting to you, like, that's what people are like, wow. Your photos just stand out. It's like, yes, Because I am so fired up about what I'm taking photos of. I don't photograph something. I'm not excited.

[B]

And those photos are mainly for social media, right? Not. Not for YouTube or would you put

[A]

them on mostly social media? Yeah. Instagram.

[B]

Are you. Are you a writer as well?

[A]

And then I've learned how to write. Yeah. Yeah. Paired.

[B]

How important is the pairing of a. Of the caption with your incredible photographs?

[A]

I think stories are the way to. The best way to communicate. And I'm only at like level two of 99 of storytelling. Like there's. So storytelling is such a.

[B]

That's where you put yourself. Or is there 99 levels to storytelling?

[A]

It's.

[B]

I think you're thinking you're a.

[A]

Well, maybe. But it's. It's such an extraordinary skill and such a complex skill.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But it has to be like. It's that. That's where the AI thing gets me excited.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Is because everybody's starting to lean on it to communicate and to think. And I'm making the bet of. We're leveraging it within our business, of course, to develop faster, to do certain things faster. But I don't have any desire or any curiosity to apply it because it's like that just takes the art and I agree. That takes. That takes like the fun out of it. Like, why would I. I don't even understand why I would do that. Because the process of writing is enjoyable to me and to tell a story and to think of a story and. Well, I could tell it this way or wait a minute. I started to go down this route or make this point, but then I took it. I took a right turn here. I'm going to remove that because that starts to make my point. I'm making a second point. We'll put that over here. I'll go down that path one day. Let's stick to over here. Yeah. And to me it's such a fulfilling. It's like this discovery process.

[B]

I agree. I wrote a book a few years ago and I am so glad I wrote it before I even knew what I was. Just because I probably would have been tempted to dabble too much in allowing that to create my words for me. And it was a five year project of me going down that path of removing this or that or finding the words and struggling with the words until they came and being out on a trail run where all of a sudden I experienced runner's high for the first time. And I wrote a chapter in my head while I'm out there. And it's like, hey, AI didn't and couldn't have done that for me.

[A]

And that's where like a lot of people don't create, so they don't totally understand it. But I think it's for you. It has to be for you first and foremost. And so I'm always creating for me. People are like, well, you should talk about this. It's like, no, you should talk about that. I talk about what I want to talk about. That's why it is what it is. And yes, I'm a one trick pony. I. This is just what I like. Like, I can't make up what I like. I'm sorry. I just, this is my thing.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And I'm going to be world class at this thing. And to be world class at something, you have to go all in on something.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And so I would just say consistency and, and it has to be for you first and foremost. You have to love it. You have to be. It has to be something that gets you excited or it's worthless.

[B]

Yeah. That's awesome. Yeah.

[A]

I don't know if that's helpful.

[B]

No, it's super helpful. What about on the YouTube front? Because you have, you aren't just doing photographs, you're. You've got videos. How has that been if you don't like doing videos?

[A]

Well, I don't like editing.

[B]

Oh, you don't like editing?

[A]

Yes, but I love video. It's a, it's an essential medium.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

But I didn't do video until I could hire somebody to do video.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

I didn't try to do it myself.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And maybe that's flawed logic. I don't know.

[B]

It's same. I'm, I'm doing, I've got right behind the camera here. Spencer's the video king for me. And I, Yeah, for the longest time I struggled. I mean, I could use like cap cut or something and put together a little reel or whatnot. But I love capturing both photo and video assets. But it's all with my phone. I mean, I've got hundreds of thousands of videos and photos in my phone. And sometimes even my kids are like, man, put the phone down. And then later they're like, hey, could you pull that up? And let's watch that again. I'm like, well, I thought you told me to put the phone down. You know, and so I get it. Like, be in the moment a lot, but at the same time, like, I've had, my kids are older now and so often they're like, I am so glad you were capturing that. Sure. Like, we get to relive this because you have the phone out all the time, you know, And I'm not. I don't know. I just do it to bring back the emotion, to relive the moment, and then they can share that with their kids, you know, And I just feel like it's such a valuable asset. But. Yeah. What about building YouTube? Is it the same thing? Is it consistency with what you love and. Or.

[A]

Yeah. I don't act like we have YouTube figured out. That's been.

[B]

But you've got. You've got hundreds of thousands of subscribers on there, don't you?

[A]

Yeah, but I look at it from, like, a potential standpoint, and it's. I just think we're so. We've scratched the surface and we're starting to get really good. Like, we're starting to have the right team.

[B]

Yeah. But do you feel like that's where a lot of the potential is? Yeah, I think that's more so than social.

[A]

No, I think there's potential across the board.

[B]

Across the board.

[A]

Yeah. But there is YouTube. You. You have to respect the game a little bit more.

[B]

You can explain that, because I don't know the game yet.

[A]

Well, like, Instagram is a lot more forgiving.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Podcasting is hard, too, but Instagram's forgiving because it's so quick.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Whereas YouTube, to keep someone's attention for 25 minutes with. How much is there? Yeah, it has to be really good. And there is a certain formula to it, and there is a process to it. And. And I didn't necessarily respect that in the. In the earlier days. And even with thumbnails, like, there's an art to thumbnails. There's an art to titles. It has to have. There has to be a story. And the first five seconds is really important. The first 10 seconds is really important. The first 30 seconds is really important. And your retention. And like, there. There is a lot to it that. That matters beyond just putting what you like out there, I think to compete in the world, but it's still. Ultimately, it's still the same thing. I'm not making videos about something that doesn't get me going.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So it. It has to excite me.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And I have to be happy to be there and curious to be there or else it just doesn't work.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But there. There is. There's more to it than, I think, some of the other platforms.

[B]

And how has the podcast been for you? It's podcasting been its own Dynamic. And in getting that, is it kind of the same thing? You got to catch them in the beginning, catch them 30 seconds or what?

[A]

It's its own art form.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I think you have to appreciate it as its own art form and you have to appreciate it as a skill. And it has to be the same thing. You have to be excited about who you're going to talk to.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

If I'm not excited to have someone on, something's wrong and it's gone in those directions before and it's not, it's not on them. But we've tried to turn it into a business tool and there's a lot of that right now. Businesses trying to make. Well, we need a podcast because every business has a podcast because my marketing person's telling me we need a podcast. And it sucks. It's just terrible because it's, and I think in the early days it will always be terrible because it's a skill that you just have to practice over and over. But if you, if, if, if you want it to be great, you've got to be all in on it. Like anything else, you've got to be so excited about who you're having on and, and so into the conversation or else it just, it's just not worth listening to. Especially with how many good podcasts there are now.

[B]

There are so many. Right. What are some that you listen to?

[A]

Of course I listen to Joe Rogan. I've always lived and listened to MF CEO Andy Frisella, who was. Or now it's really that way for a long time. Cam Haynes.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Like a lot of the usual characters.

[B]

Are there any in your space that are more kind of applicable to, to what you do that you listen to or are you kind of think really.

[A]

No, I. More so read like business books.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

But in construction there's not a lot. Yeah.

[B]

What's your favorite business book that you recommend to?

[A]

Probably how to Win Friends and Influence People. Yeah. By Dale Carnegie. I've read that a lot of times over and I did a Dale Carnegie course last year.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Best training I've ever been a part of. And I've been a part of a lot of training. That's super grateful.

[B]

Was that an in person deal or was that it?

[A]

Yeah, in person, three day course. And you spend the first full day learning people's names.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

And it's just stupid simple.

[B]

Huh.

[A]

But it's like I've never been trained on names. And the principle is there's no more important sound in the human language than Somebody's name.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

And it's the simplest thing you can do to connect with somebody.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Faster than the average person.

[B]

That's cool.

[A]

And that's all leadership is, is connection, relationships. So the better you can get at that, the more effective you're going to be at influencing, which is leadership.

[B]

Huh? Yeah. That's awesome. Yeah. Really cool. I love that book. It's been a while, though, so I need to go. Go read it again. Dust off the book cover. That's incredible. What. What are you. So tonight you're flying out on a pretty incredible adventure. Is that stuff you can talk about, where you're going, what you're doing?

[A]

I haven't, I haven't talked about on social media just because I like it to be a surprise.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And there's a lot of people that follow along now, so I, I like to be a little bit more mindful.

[B]

Okay, that's fine.

[A]

But. No but on and I don't care. Talk about it. We're, we're. We're going up to almost the Arctic Circle up in the Northwest Territories of Canada. We're flying into Yellowknife tonight. Hopefully we'll make it there at about midnight. When we get there, It'll be about minus 40. It's so cold that Celsius and Fahrenheit.

[B]

So what are you packing? Do you pack for that weather?

[A]

Yeah, yeah. I've been to Canada in the winter a few times shooting, so I have all the gear. A decent idea. We'll find out.

[B]

Is there a way to stay warm and negative 40?

[A]

I don't know. We'll find out.

[B]

Do you have like heated, like electric boots and.

[A]

No.

[B]

Just jackets or anything.

[A]

Just layers.

[B]

Just layers? Yeah.

[A]

It's. I don't check a bag when I travel. The only time I do is when I'm going somewhere this cold.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Because I have to bring other clothing I would normally have. But from there, then we drive 12 hours by ice road up to a diamond mine with Rio Tinto. They've mined almost 150 million carats of diamonds out of this one operation. And their last ore is next month, March. So we're seeing some of the final ore coming out of this mine before they start to reclaim it and return it back to what it was when they started digging there in the first place in the early 2000s. And then we get to go underground. We get to see the mining process, we get to see the processing of the. The diamonds and then we get to see the finished product.

[B]

Cool.

[A]

Which I, I am Very excited about.

[B]

That's awesome. And they're flying you out and doing this to get content on it all to tell a story.

[A]

It's a win win. We get world class access and content and they get world class exposure.

[B]

That's so cool.

[A]

And like, like Rio Tinto's had us out in Western Australia for example, before for iron ore. Yeah. And if you Google iron ore or the first video that comes up now, that's, that's awesome. I didn't know that I wanted to rank for iron ore. That wasn't my objective to begin with. But it's like, yeah, I'm number one for iron ore, so kick rocks.

[B]

You know, that's awesome.

[A]

But yeah, it's just great exposure. And, and the, the typically now when we show up, like people know who we are and they're excited to have us and to, to get them the credit that they deserve is the coolest thing in the world because they're. I've been, I've been all over the world. I've been with very successful wealthy people, so on and so forth. I would take a mine, I would take some, some coal miners or people at a landfill, a steel mill construction project, loggers over anyone else.

[B]

That's awesome.

[A]

I just, I cannot get enough of these people because they're just like, these are the people that keep the world moving. We can talk about all this stuff all day long without these people. Everything stops.

[B]

Everything. I mean it's, it's impressed upon me that like I, we couldn't even have a business without, without the infrastructure. Right. And like our product couldn't move and I like we couldn't get ingredients. It's like I don't think a lot of people, I think we take it so much for granted and we're, we just don't understand what your world provides for all of us. And it just wouldn't exist without it. So.

[A]

Well, and it's, it's relatively new.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Like it's only been around in this, at this scale for a hundred years. So crazy. Like 100 years ago we didn't have most everything we have.

[B]

Yeah. That's crazy.

[A]

Yeah. And so we, I've always had it. You've always had it. Every time I flip the switch, the lights have come on.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But electricity in itself is still a relatively new thing in the grand scheme of things. And to think that it works all the time. Every time I hit the switch, the lights come on. Like just that in itself is a miracle. Or every time I turn the faucet on water comes out of it that I can drink. That's crazy. And that has to happen just in the United States for hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of millions of people, 24 hours a day, seven days a week,

[B]

365 days a year, always moving. Right.

[A]

It has to be perfect.

[B]

Wow. Yeah, that's cool. Thanks for putting that in perspective. And you hold a summit every year to kind of bring this world together. What do you do at that summit? Because I'd love to learn more. Obviously after the show or in the coming days, we can talk. I'd love to see how Mountain Ops can get involved and what you do and how you do it and if there's fitness training or anything like that we can provide nutritionally, we do, you know, we do work in this space quite a bit. I'm assuming that a lot of the guys that show up at your events or a lot of people that follow you are outdoorsmen. They love the outdoors. They love trucks, they love guns, they love, God, they, you know, all these types of things, which is our culture and our people. Which is why I'm really excited to be having this conversation because I just feel like a lot of our listeners live in the world you're speaking of and they cross into the outdoors as well, you know. So what's the summit all about?

[A]

Our target market is trucks, guns. God. Yeah, yeah.

[B]

Same language, man. It's the same people. So it's awesome.

[A]

We started the it's area dirt World Summit. It'll be the fourth time this year. We. There's a lot of industry events out there, but there was none dedicated to leadership and developing the next generation of leaders. And if we don't have like to really change the dirt world and to build the next generation. It starts with individual leaders. It's not about companies, it's not about teams, it's about individual leaders. That's it. Yeah, just one at a time. Like there's, there's no way around it. And there, there was no. And it's a very physical industry. It's built still on handshakes and in person, so on and so forth. But there was no event dedicated specifically to elevating leaders. So we were like, well, why not make an event dedicated to that specifically? And it's been, it's been a grind to get it up and going. It is not an easy thing. I would not recommend starting an event because it's a lot of work. But fortunately we've. We have a world class team internally and some external partners that have helped make it happen. And now this year it started to become an established event, an established name. We're here in February, almost entirely sold out for the event in November.

[B]

Wow.

[A]

And then this year, Phoenix.

[B]

It's back in your hometown. Yeah, Always Phoenix.

[A]

No, we've been in Texas for three years.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

Phoenix this year, Florida next year. Moving it around. But we'll have 12, 50 civil construction leaders and teams from about 500 companies there to learn leadership from some world class people that I've met within the industry and then some just world class people. Like we had Jocko at the first one, Jesse Itzler at the second one. We just had Jesse Cole and Tim Grover and James Clear.

[B]

That's awesome.

[A]

I'm leaving out a lot of other great people that we've had over the years. It's been, it's been.

[B]

And is it kind of that, Is it like speakers up on stage event is there?

[A]

It has been. But we're like, this year is really exciting because the, the first few years is just like, just execute the event.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But now we've proven that we can execute consistently. So now it's like, how do we make this what it needs to be? And how do we make this not just a world class event construction, but a world class event which is then where you start to get into the details. And like last year, one of the most valuable things we did was we had assigned seating for the, I think about 13, 1400 people. And everybody was kind of grumbling about it at first. A lot of, yeah, a lot of these guys, they're a little rough around the edges.

[B]

Yeah. Tough guys.

[A]

Yeah. But, but we, we made everybody, it was assigned seating and then we facilitated a discussion with, you know, the five or ten people at each table. And it was, I think the best thing we did because I tell everybody it's like, yeah, the people on stage are extraordinary. But frankly, anybody can put big time speakers up on a stage if you have enough money, like if you're just willing to write checks.

[B]

True.

[A]

And that, that happens a lot now. There's a lot of those events. We don't need to be another one of those. I think it's valuable. But the greatest value is those that are in the room and facilitating further conversation, further connection that would not otherwise exist. And then getting those attendees linked up with the sponsors that can also help them out in all kinds of ways as well and make their businesses better. So it's all about the value. We're driving for each individual and each business part of that's on stage. Part of that's what the audience. Part of that's after hours in between at lunch. And then part of that is. Is the sponsors that we have.

[B]

Very cool. And the sponsors have booth there so that they can go and connect and is this a multi day event or.

[A]

Yeah, three days.

[B]

Three days. Very cool.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Congrats, man. It's. It's huge to pull off an event like that where you're actually putting it on. We. We participate in a lot of events ourselves where we exhibit and we're a huge anchor, you know piece at like the. The Hunt Expo last week in Salt Lake City at the Salt Palace. And I've got a friend that ran an asphalt event this last summer in Utah was with Staker Parsons and all them and I and they had about a thousand people at that. I spoke at that event. But it was funny to watch them come in because it was our audience. It was a hunter hunter. You know, the big guys with beards and such. And nobody went to the front row at first. They all kind of. And then the last group was like oh, I guess we got to go up there. But it's. It's a. It's a cool world to be a part of. A world that's pretty new to me with all the machinery and stuff. I, you know, as a kid dug around in the sandbox and such, but have only sat in one. One tractor at one point and a yard tractor that I mow my lawn in. It was a lot of fun, but it's starting somewhere but shifting gears just a little bit and, and maybe we'll. I know you've got to get off on a. On a world adventure, but our flight's

[A]

delayed so we can. You're delayed? Yeah, yeah. There.

[B]

There was one of your posts. It was kind of like a. I think it was a two part post. Things you learned in 2025. And do you mind talking about that? There was. It was kind of like a moment in your life where faith in God wasn't a thing. Now. Now it is, if I'm reading into that correctly. Yeah. Tell us like what you. We. We're starting a new year and people are. They're listening, they've set goals. They're probably some of them floundering with those goals right now at this time. And life is important to our listeners. Family is important, God's important. But life ebbs and flows and there's the ups and downs and everything. Tell us what you shared in that and what you learned from 20, 25. But through your life. And how has God become a part or maybe a new part of your life?

[A]

I grew up going to a Methodist church and would go every Sunday, went to Sunday school, then went through confirmation when I was 13. And then my parents about that time, they got divorced a little before that.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

And so at that point, we became just, you know, feral children, and you guys do whatever you want to do. And I just. I grew away from church. I. I'm. If everybody is doing something, I want nothing to do with it. And so if everybody is.

[B]

You don't want to follow the crowd.

[A]

You want to.

[B]

No.

[A]

And I've. I've tried the big church thing, and I just. I have an allergic reaction to it. Like, I. I want nothing to do with it. And even if it's in my best interest and it's the best place in the world.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I don't know what it is, but I'm just like, get me out of here. I cannot do this. And so I grew away from religion, Christianity, because I always associated it with church. And it's. If I want to practice religion and become closer to God, church is the way to do that. And through, you know, business and growing as a man, you're tested in all different, weird ways that you would have never thought you would get tested by, you know? And so I kind of got beaten down through that process over the years. And then I was listening to an interview, and it was with a comedian. And at the very end, I remember exactly where I was. I was running in Australia. I was going out there a lot at the time and.

[B]

To go run in Australia?

[A]

No, I was. I was dating a woman.

[B]

Oh, nice. Okay. He had a good reason to head out there.

[A]

So. So I was. Yeah, I was in Australia a lot. I was running in Australia, listening to his podcast, and he just says, listen, if you don't do anything, Anything else, just. Just understand you don't need anyone else involved. It's just you and God.

[B]

Cool.

[A]

And you can just go to this book called the Bible, and you can yourself grow closer to God and find your way on your own with no one else involved. And at that point, it was just like, oh, I hadn't thought of that before.

[B]

Is just me and God your relationship?

[A]

Yeah. And. And so that happened. And I have. Every day, I have something I call my chores. So it's. I exercise every day. I read at least 10 pages of a book every day.

[B]

Cool.

[A]

And then I. A few other things. I write a page every day.

[B]

That's awesome. And I added writing for a book or just kind of a journaling.

[A]

Yeah. I just write.

[B]

Cool.

[A]

I just. My role, My rule is fill a page.

[B]

That's awesome.

[A]

Whatever I want to write about, I can write about, but every day. And then I started reading the Bible every day. So I read the Bible for the. For the first time in my life in its entirety last year.

[B]

Awesome.

[A]

And it was just a great experience. And I've been talking about it. Not from a. It's like anything else I've done. I try to talk about stuff that's helped me.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

So I talk about exercise because it's like, without exercise, I'd be the worst person world in the.

[B]

The world.

[A]

I'd be miserable. I. I just, Just, Just be a terrible person. And as I've worked through, you know, trauma from the past, like, I. I stopped drinking a few years ago. I've talked through that. I've talked through mental health, anxiety, what I've done to. To work around it. And I just use myself as an example. Hey, here's what I'm going through. Here's what's helped me. If it helps you, great. If not, whatever it is, I'm not here to tell you what to do. I'm just here to say what's worked for me.

[B]

That's awesome.

[A]

And through this process of even just reading the Bible and. And more prayer than ever, it's just brought me this significant sense of peace. And I've. I've just surrendered to the process a lot more. And even last year, it helped me. While we were. Financially was hard last year, really hard. So just brutal. I mean, it was. There were a lot of weeks last year where it's like in our executive meeting. So how much money do we need for next week's payroll? Yeah. A lot of those conversations. Yeah. Not like one. Like, not a handful. Like a lot. And now we're out of it. Thank God. But. But even through that process, like, we raised money a few years ago.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And all the pressure was on me. But through this process was like, all I can do is my best. I can't control the outcome here.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

The outcome is what it is. I don't have control here. I don't have control of what happens. I can in any regard. I just have to do my best. The rest. Whatever happens, happens.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And just that alone has brought so much peace.

[B]

That's awesome.

[A]

And understanding and all kinds of just great, great things. It hasn't made it easier.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But it's. It's like, wait a minute, I'm not in this on my own.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And it's not up to me.

[B]

Yeah. Okay, that's cool. I love the act of turning the controls over to him, knowing that I'm doing all I can and then the, the rest is in your control. Right. And kind of surrender. That word surrender that you share, it's like so powerful. Yeah. And it's, I mean, you gotta, you gotta have some serious faith to do that. But it's the blessings come and they're there. And like you said, it's not always easier. But that piece will help. I think it helps bring a sense and an ability in your mind to make better decisions and to be more clear minded and focused on what you need to do and guided by that additional strength. That's powerful. So thanks for sharing that. You talked a little bit about anxiety and fitness. I want to kind of maybe just wrap up with, with both of those, like, what are you doing to stay physically fit? What kind of things do you do? Because our listeners, they are like, this is the conquer cast. It's equipping people with ways and tools that they can conquer more than life by listening to the perspective and experience of others. And I believe, I love, I love what you're saying about sharing everything that you're going through because you are most powerfully positioned to serve the person you once were. So you're utilizing your own experience to share with others. What, what about, what in anxiety has that been a thing for you? And how have you. It was a good deal with that.

[A]

Well, it was a good lesson. It was like, early on in business, I had a, I had a girlfriend, she broke up with me and it wasn't even that long of a relationship. It was the first time in my life where just I had horrendous anxiety. And so before that I was like, well, if you're anxious, if you told me you were anxious, I'd be like, dude, just chill out. Yeah, just take a deep breath, go for a walk, look at the sun, you're gonna be good to go. And. And then this just walloped me and it was like somebody was sitting on my chest 24 hours a day and I could not get rid of it. I would have paid you everything I had in my bank account to get rid of this feeling. It was, it was horrendous and I just could not shake it. And fortunately, I didn't go to a doctor right away. And if so you need to do that. That's, that's for you. It Just I knew it wasn't for me. I was like, there's something here that I need to work on. I'm gonna at least try that first.

[B]

Cool.

[A]

So that's when I started to go to therapy for the first time consistently. And that's when I started to exercise for the first time consistently. And now that I travel especially, exercise has only become more important. But since then, I've exercised every day.

[B]

That's awesome.

[A]

Since 2019.

[B]

And that's been a big piece of the. Overcoming that anxiety.

[A]

That's a huge, A huge piece. It just, it calm it. Like if you just wake up and go do something, I feel like you just get rid of so much that's pent up in you every day. If I don't, for whatever reason, because travel typically and I do it later in the day. Yeah, I just kind of suck.

[B]

Like.

[A]

Well, you.

[B]

I feel you, man. I, I agree.

[A]

You have to get rid of it.

[B]

I agree. Will you. When you travel on this trip, are you able to, are you able to exercise or. A little more difficult on something like this?

[A]

This is like when it's minus 40, I'm probably doing burpees inside in the hotel. Yeah, I'll run outside till about zero, you know, maybe a little bit less. I did Ohio the other day was like minus 10, minus 15. And I was, my, my eyeballs were kind of freezing. I was like, this isn't all that.

[B]

My eyes aren't supposed to feel this

[A]

way and I've got to like eat it on the ice. So I get it. I'm proving it to myself. But maybe let's go inside and just do some burpees. But, but every day. Yeah, it's something, something rigorous or if I'm injured, It's, you know, 45 minute hour walk. But wherever I am in the world, whatever day I'm exercising, typically it's a run. But that's been really helpful. And then just the process of, of therapy and talking things through for. And reading a lot on my own.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Just trying to unwind, like. So what was this? And I think it. My best theory is that it was like. I think my greatest fear is abandonment passed down in part from my parents. And that's definitely something, especially from my father's side of things that he struggled with as a kid. And, and I certainly have that deep rooted fear as well. So when that happened, it was an abrupt breakup. It, for whatever reason was just like, oh, I'm abandoned. And it brought up all of these emotions and fears that were completely Irrational and now. But it's taken me like six, seven years to figure that out. But now that I figured that out, when it does surface a little bit, for whatever reason, I at least can recognize, like, I have tools now. All right. I'm anxious today.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Let's not run from this. Let's be appreciative of this. It's like this is an opportunity to continue to dig through some things, to learn some things. And then the consistent exercise piece has been essential.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I mean, you just, are you, Are

[B]

you always prepping for an event or is it just like consistency in my. Like, I know you do Ironman. Is that like, is that a something you always have on the schedule or something you're working towards or is it just you have some routines that you do?

[A]

And I always have something scary on the schedule. Like I've qualified and run the Boston Marathon.

[B]

Cool.

[A]

I've done 100 mile runs. I've done full Ironmans, half Ironmans. But I, I need something scary to just keep me sharp. But I'm. People are like, what are you training for? I'm like, I'm training for life. Yeah. And it's just the program I'm on.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I don't know how else to explain it. Yeah.

[B]

That's cool. But.

[A]

But my travel schedule is so brutal now. Like, and just to operate at a higher level as a human being, to have a greater capacity for those around you and business, whatever. Like, that is some of the lowest hanging fruit if you're not treating yourself like an athlete.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

You're leaving so much opportunity on the table. Like, that's, that's how I view it. I'm an athlete. I want to perform at a peak level within my category, which is really weird, you know, is traveling to construction mining sites around the world. But to do that, I've got to be physically and mentally healthy.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And so with that sense of purpose and understanding, it's. It's been a lot easier to do it every day. And I make the argument that it's easier to do it every day because then I don't have to decide. I don't have to wake up and negotiate with myself today. Like, well, it's cold and it sucks. Like, I'm not going to now. Today's not the day. And then it's, you know, the next day, the next day, the next day. There's none of that, like, there's no decision making process, which I would argue makes it easier.

[B]

Huge. So huge. Yeah. That's awesome. Well, when I Consider you and like the stories I've heard today and everything, it, it feels like it's, you've conquered through consistency in, in pretty much all facets of life. Is that like, is that the key to your success and going forward? One, maybe last bit of advice you'd give to our listeners on conquering more in their lives.

[A]

That's all I have is consistency. I, I, if you talk to anybody at the company, they'll say, yeah, if he's one thing, it's consistent because I know that I've just, I've seen enough successful people. That is the secret. There is no secret. The secret is just doing the work every day, every week, every month, every year for decades.

[B]

That's awesome.

[A]

It's a tough pill to swallow, but I am, once you swallow it, it's the coolest thing in the world because then you just, you don't subscribe to all the witchcraft and snake oil. Especially on the Internet nowadays you can just so easily be like, that's the silliest thing ever. Yeah, they're trying to present this hack trick, whatever it is, that's not how it works. You just do the work every day and inputs, outputs, the more you want out, the more you have to put in. It's just a math equation. It's not a whole lot harder than that.

[B]

That's awesome. We're going to wrap up with that. We've been here in Nashville at the SCI Convent mentioned Jim Shockey. He's the godfather of the hunting industry. He's one of our mountain ops influencers and ambassadors. But he once told me, Trevor, you just got to let time do the hard work. Yeah, it's exactly what you're saying. Like, and I love, I love what you said about just, just do it every day. That way you don't have to have any decision making factors involved because when you go out into the world, you're going to face a lot of decisions throughout the day. Remove some of those by just having a daily consistent effort in certain areas of life and that'll allow you to face the future with so much more power and authority and, and op with opportunity. But I love your consistent effort and conquering through consistency and letting time do the hard work. I'm excited to follow along and see where your journey takes you and whatever we can do to support. We're here for you, man. I appreciate the time.

[A]

I really appreciate having me.

[B]

Yeah. All right everyone, thanks for listening. This has been an awesome episode here in Nashville with Aaron Witt and go out and Conquer more.

[A]

Thanks again for listening for watching again. Check out the conquercast linked in this episode's description and Mountain Ops also linked in this episode's description.